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good horsepower for highway driving - yes
good horsepower for highway driving with hills involved - NO
You won't win any races in it unless they are off road races.
Also, don't confuse Full-size Montero and Montero Sport models. Two different vehicles.
I have 45,000 miles on 2001 full-size with about 1000 miles off road, no problems other than recalls which were handled without problems. 2002+ models should not have the same recalls.
4-Runner is a good choice too, but not enough headroom or leg room for me. Now a Land Cruiser, that is comparable to a full-size Montero for about $20,000 more.
I would suggest you test drive the Montero and Land Cruiser and compare.
To compare, a couple pages past, a Lexus LX470 was tested with the 4.7 litre V-8. It did 0-60 in 9.5 seconds, quarter mile at 17.07 @ 79.8.
Hmmmm. Maybe the Montero has finally got a little extra grunt. Said most noticeable in the low and high end of the rpm range.
Gotta go try it when my local dealership gets one.
I would like to see 2001-2002 data only on the Montero.
See this link
Why the person posted this without looking at the new vehicles is beyond me. If you want to see a particular vehicle the data is there at that site.
http://www.iihs.org/vehicle_ratings/ce/html/00022.htm
You will notice that there are NO poor ratings.
#1795 of 1809 New Montero by brillmtb Oct 01, 2002 (09:54 am)
Sounds like this might be a mixed bag
More HP/torque...good
Less Ground clearence....bad
Stability and traction control...it depends on how they designed it, if it ends up like the Sequoia system that will be real bad. If they make it so it can be completely turned off in 4wd situations other than snow/ice it might be a good thing. Has anyone been able to get their Montero stuck yet. I sure havent.
I look forward to what Mitsubishi has come up with. Anything that makes it easier for my wife to drive in harsh environments will be welcome.
The 4-Runner, IMO, is also in another class, similar to the Nissan. The 4-Runner is certainly well built as most Toyota products are but it is just too small inside.
The comment I hear from people getting into my Montero for the first time is how nice it looks, feels and the visability out the windows. As the weather or situation gets worse I find your vision seems to narrow and the larger widows are really nice.
Perhaps the extra HP on the 03 will make up for one of the few needs the Montero has.
Before you do anything else test drive a 60k Landcruiser, then the Monty. I personnally haven't done the test, but I hear that they are a real close comparison. After the test, ask yourself if the difference is worth 25k and remember that the LC gets best rating in the Luxury Full-size suv category. 0% interest and a Monty with more power, yummy.
The boring looks of the Pilot, paying sticker, no deals on financing, too many quality issues on first model year, cocky sales reps, and did I mention how boring it looks. The MDX was just a bit out of the price range we wanted. The financing deals even the US trucks was too good to pass up. If you are worried about reliability, get an extended warranty. FYI, The drive train has a longer warranty.
1. Updated, although sometimes controversial, style
2. Same quality ride, better gas mileage, essentially same interior room and good visability looking out but for much less.
I was very concerned about the quality at first and I am honestly still keeping my fingers crossed but this is probably all paranoia. This is why I say that.
1. The Montero (new style) beat out the LC in Austrailian head to head last year
2. Austrailian company I spoke with in getting taller springs stated their engineer drives the new Montero and cant find anything wrong with the suspension other than personal preferences such as stiffness, ride height, etc. They also followed that by, "that Montero is built like a tank". Very good quality and you should have no problems with it.
3. Quality was again confirmed when I had suspension shop put in the taller springs. Unprompted I again heard the comment that "man that Montero is really over built".
4. I have had no problems with my 02. I did do the product updates (3 of them I think) that were recommended.
The 03 with more torque (not so much an hp issue) will only make this thing better.
Dont get it if you consider serious towing in your future. I have a 3300 trailer and I tow it perhaps in 100-150 mile distances from my house fine but would not want to push it beyond that due to the lack of torque.
As far as comparison testing the Montero has had some very nice things stated about it. I think that the reviews here have been less favorable and I dont know why they dont jive with others.
Also, I dont think that most of the Car Mags, etc really pit like vehicles together when doing their reviews. They might have an Accura MDX compared to a Montero when a better comparison in my mind is the LC, Land Rover and Montero. Stiff competition and much higher priced but the Acura just cant keep pace (other than the street) with the others. Then they come out and say the Acura is the SUV of the year...all biased based on how you compare.
I took the catagories and vehicles I considered apples to apples and made my own comparison. Nothing even came close to the Montero in 02 in my mind.
Anyway, could go on for pages and the moderator would kick me off. Good luck.
It appears to me it wouldn't be too hard to remove the hangy-down solid plastic mud flaps (or whatever they are), front and rear and still keep most of the front and rear side door protection cladding (to which paint doesn't seem to adhere very well anyway).
Any thoughts, discussions with body shops, or experiences on what it actually takes to remove it?
The long piece that is located in front of the rear tire is held on by a few screws and a strip of padded adhesive. The mud flap behind the front tire is held on by a few screws, pop rivets, and padded adhesive.
Removing the front mud flap removes part of the side cladding and fender flare, which doesn't look too good.
Another option would be to cut the front mud flap along the line of the body. Then remove the long strip between the front and rear tires. Get some custom rock sliders made to protect your rig from those nasty boulders and You are good to go. The sliders should cover the area from which you removed/cut the cladding.
Check out this link, someone did something similar. http://motorcare.com.au/demonstrator2.htm
• Has Mitsu addressed the rollover issue, that CR reported (other than denying that there is a problem)? I see it now has an electronic anti-skid feature. Is that their response to what CR reported?
• Does the new 3.8L engine have timing belt or a timing chain?
• Is the engine an "interference" design, or is it a "non-interference" design?
Bob
I stopped by a CarMax/Mitsubishi dealer in Laurel, MD and they had a good selection. A base XLS, with the optional "touring package" (huge moonroof, upgraded interior & audio) was discounted to $32.8K, which is about 2K below MSRP.
All models also now have standard, an electronic anti-skid devise that can be turned off by the driver. Towing is 5000 braked, and 1500 unbraked. It's definitely on my short list to replace my Explorer, when that day comes!
Bob
Bob
Bob
After two years and 60,000 miles, I still don't know the right answer. The Dealer Sales people of course say just use Regular it's fine. The Sticker inside the Fuel Door says Premium Only and the Manuel... well actually it's been so long since I read it, I don't even remember anymore.
I just put the middle grade in and keep my fingers crossed that it's sufficient. I don't hear any Pinging noises so I guess it's okay. Of course, I wouldn't hear Pinging noises since there are still lots of squeek's and Squeals coming from the engine that no one can seem to hear when it's in for service. I can replicate the noise sometimes at the dealer but it never happens when it goes into the service department for actual work. I did the 60K service for a Small fortune.. and every belt replaced to no avail. Oh well, it's been running without incident at least so far.
drew
The brochure and website are useless. It seems Mitsu is not advertising stability control system too much...they seem to be hiding it instead! I don't understand.
Also, why did Mitsu designed a great approach angle, yet it has only 18 degrees for departure angle?? And the spare tire is on the door, not underneath!
Thanks.
No problems.
From what I can determine, 87 [(motor octane + research octane)/2] octane in the U.S. of A. is equivalent to "Premium" in some countries where the Montero (Pajero) is sold and "Regular" gas in these countries is of a lower simularly calculated octane number, or else "octane" is calculated differently.
I use premium most of the time but do not feel it is needed. I have used mid grade and even regular with no change in milage. At altitude regular is probably fine.
My milage ranges from 9mpg towing to 21 mpg with no wind and taking it fairly easy at 65-75mph. Generally about 18-19 around town unless I push it too much then down to 16-17
Currently I think the traction control/skid control is only good for ice. In off roading, in mud for instance, I would be very uncomfortable even chancing it unless I had a winch or a buddy that could pull me out. The system in the Sequoia will power down under low traction conditions and you will lose momentum. I dont know if Mitsu will make the same mistake or at least let you turn it off.
When off, one would hope you would still have the rear limited slip. I dont know that the Sequoia does when it is turned off.
Would love to hear more about the 03 as it becomes available.
I'm also curious if Mitsu addressed any of the rollover issues that CR noted?
Bob
As far as roll over, the highest roll over rates I was told are the corvettes. Not that they have the highest potential but that the driver has a lot to do with this.
Also, the engineer at Old Man Emu suspension has the 02 style Montero and loves it. Doesnt think there is a real issue here.
I can get a jeep to roll over way before my Montero.
Great SUV. I own this car for already 2 years. If I had an opportunity to buy a new SUV, I would go with the same car. Great for long travels, I drove already 30K miles. Great for climbing a mountain with no road, great for driving at the beach, at snow and ice. SUV looks great, like no other car on the road. Great handling on the freeway. The only thing I did is changed tires to Michelin Cross Terrain - feels like a completely different car in terms of handling, cornering, ride quality - I strongly recommend"
I think the Yoks are good tires but with this sized tire on this weight SUV I also wonder when I change to stiffer side walled tires if additional handling improvements will be noticed
Might as well face it, sounds like the 2003 Montero, at least as sold in the U.S., has become just another "snow car" for dirt parking lots, not for semi-serious off-roading.
Since more serious 4wding is improved by going from LSD to full locker, going away from LSD to AWD would be a step backwards in 4wding ability IMO.
It is my understanding that a simple air locker set up can be placed on the US LSD. There was an article someone pointed out that seemed to show the rear ends being very similar and only requiring a air pump and some simple work. You would then have the ability to have full locker in the rear.
There have been claims that LSD rears wear out fast. I could not find any credible person in the business that would tell me that these rear ends wear out fast. If Mitsu went away from LSD then it was in an effort to save money as with Toyota.
On my '02 4Runner, you can check this link out on how it works:
http://www.toyota-4runner.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=12
In 4wd Low Range in the Sequoia it seems that the center diff is locked so 50/50 dist of power...that is like the Montero so far. Where they diverge (to my limited understanding) is that there is no mechanical limited slip, just electronic control of power diversion so that if one wheel slips it is braked with the intention to shift the torque and send power to other wheels seaching for traction. If that does not work then the motor depowers in an effort to slow all the wheels being powered in hopes this will regain traction.
In the Montero, the rear slipping wheel engages the other and both either slip or gain traction but never are slowed down or depowered.
This is very different and may keep you from getting stuck in deep snow, mud, sand. There are already reports of this "theory" actually being confirmed by Sequoia owners.
But lets move on to the Montero as this is the Montero site.............
No, this is the Edmunds site! You are in Edmunds Town Hall and this is the Mitsubishi Montero Message Board in Edmunds Town Hall! :-)
Let's move on to discussing the Montero - HERE - at edmunds.com!
tidester, host
Guess what?! My other brother Land Rover Disco (using the same system) can do the same.
Your Mitsu LSD system is no better than Toyota/Land Rover/Hummer's system. LSD too has many limitations...is the Mitsu system clutch-based (likely) or gear-based?? Mitsu LSD is useless if one wheel is completely airborne.
Now, a REAL locker (Detroit) is a different story. A locker is superior to LSD or Toyota system in very very severe terrain (DEEP deep mud, etc.).
I think that any system that does not allow for rear lock up, whether LSD or full locker, and depowers wheels, will be less capable off road. I threw away my old 4wd mags in my recent move but there were two articles that looked at the newer system in the Sequoia in comparison reviews and several of the testers stated the same. ONe reviewer went to the point of stating he wished he had wire cutters to cut the systems on the Sequoia because they were, in effect, interfering with good off road abilities under CERTAIN conditions.
If Mitsu has gone to this system I wont be too happy and you will also see me stand by my word, this is not a Mitsu vs Toyota discussion.
FYI, my favorite 4wd is the LandCruiser but for some 25K more I really didnt think it was worth it but this was my personal "gold standard" to compare others to. Now I understand they may have gone to a different 4wd setup so my view may change.
Correct me if Im wrong but the older and newer 4 runners have different systems. The older ones more like a traditional LSD, low and high range system. There was a report of the newer system if left in 2wd, could not be put into 4wd and VSC or traction control turned off from park condition. This left the 4runner owner stuck in snow and he had to be towed out. It seems the snow came while he was parked. Apparently the wheel slippage was so bad and because the system could not be turned off he needed a tow. He mentioned this on the 4runner link here I believe. So, as we move forward in techology, we dont always do this perfectly. I predict that Toyota will work out these bugs. They are an outstanding company and I dont think thier quality is in doubt.
You can also see by the post below that other people are developing even more complex systems, unfortunately not aways in a rugged 4wd model for off roading. SO.....I guess we all will have to be happy with what we have for now and understand our repective limitations hoping that one day we can get a great off road SUV that does it all.
"... I discovered that he was applying the brakes in the corner. This effectively disables the VSC (lateral skid control). By applying the brakes, you override this part of the system."
This is _exactly_ why the electronic stability control system in Toyotas (VSC) is not as good as the Mercedes-Benz ESP, BMW DSC, and Audi ESP systems. Toyota's VSC (and Acura's VSA) are not full-range stability control systems. With VSC, if you apply the brakes, you lose skid control capability.
Whereas MB ESP, BMW DSC, and Audi ESP systems are full-range, so that even if you're applying the brakes, the sensors are still looking for potential skids, and will selectively brake individual wheels even harder to attempt to stop the skid.
I don't know if Subaru's stability control system is full-range, but if anyone knows, I'd really like to hear from them.
Now, I think having VSC in Toyotas is a good thing. But it's only half of a good stability control system.
This is something that is lost in the marketing quest to say you have a stability control system. NHTSA cites the benefits of those systems, but they don't mention the difference between a full-range system and one that is not full-range. Stability control systems are not created equal.
History of the Montero/Pajero Link
http://www.mitsubishi-Motors.co.jp/docs6/history/html/pajero.htm
Good review for discussion of LSD rear end in Montero and how to simply convert what appears to be a hybrid LSD in the Limited to a full locker very easily.
http://www.outdoorwire.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=69;t=006418
Rear Lockers easy it seems for the hybrid LSD in the Limited.
http://www.4x4wire.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=69;t=007945
Link to Review of OME Suspension upgrade. I did this on
my Montero and would agree with thier assessment.
http://www.4x4wire.com/mitsubishi/reviews/ome/
OK, I am definitely not an expert on these systems but this statement does not seem to be accurate.
The Montero is a hybrid LSD I believe and has consistently demonstrated superior off road performance and testers have commented that even when extreme limits of articulation are reached and the wheels are off the ground this rig just keeps on going.
Here is a link desribing the hybrid a little and specifically stating it works with one wheel off the ground.
http://www.mitsubishi-motors.co.jp/inter/products/GDI_PAJERO/european/pajero/TEXT/perlsd.html