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Jeep Wrangler



  • ottowrkrottowrkr Posts: 778
    Well lets see .First you have to ask yourself,do you want a TJ(97) or YJ(95)? The 95 was the last year of the YJ ,so its an old design.The 97 was the first year of the TJ (no 96 models were built)so you have an all new vehicle design. The TJ is much improved over the YJ. Suspension on a TJ is amazing with the coil springs,the YJ has a very hard ride with its leaf springs.I think the TJ sounds better ,also the YJ has a modified suspension and if this not done correctly it could cause you problems down the road. Also one is a dealer selling it and the other is private seller.With the dealer you can always go back to him if you have a problem ,as the private guy if he will warranty this Jeep, probably not.If you are new to Jeeps buying from a dealer is the way to go . Less of a chance of getting a LEMON. Hope this helps
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    Hi Otto!

    You brought up some good points about the potential disadvantages of ordering a vehicle from the factory. I was planning on really checking out the Jeep before taking delivery. They can't expect me to accept a vehicle with defects, at least I hope not. If they locate one for me and bring it in from some other dealer, I would also expect to have the right to inspect it and accept it only if it meets my approval.

    What kind of vehicles do you build at your plant?

    Also, I have a question about quality problems on brand new vehicles. Don't almost all problems people have with their new vehicles relate to design problems or to your suppliers and sub-suppliers delivering poor quality parts? In other words, don't you guys on the line put the vehicles together right about 99.99% of the time?

    I am assuming you work on the line, but maybe you don't. If you don't mind telling us, what is your job?


  • In just talking to a friend, he told me that 4 cyl. Wranglers are more prone to transmission problems. He said that with anyone he heard that had a 4 cyl. Wrangler, they had to change transmissions every couple of years. He said that those who had 6 cyl., the Sports, and the Saharas, they did not have this problem. Is this info. accurate? Is this 4 cyl. problem only seen in YJ's and has been fixed with the new TJ model in '97? I need to know, as I'm probably going to buy either the '95 YJ, or the '97 TJ that I described in my previous entry.

    Thanks for any help....
  • Greetings All,

    I am in the process of negotiating with a dealer on a 2000 Wrangler Sport. Excited about it although I cannot stand some of the stock components. I am definitely going to lift/modify as soon as possible.

    The first question I have is regarding wheels and tires. I really like the "all business" black steel wheels but cannot find an on-line retailer other than American Racing, and I just don't like the way theirs look (the emblem and all). I am going to go with a 2 inch body lift for now (to preserve warranty) in order to provide room for the 32 inch tires. Which brings me to my next question: I am probably going with the BFG All Terrains. How wide should I get them? I don't want them too out of control but wide enough to perform off-road and look good as well. Suggestions? What's the most popular width and/or tire measurements for 32" tires?

    Well, that should do it for now. Any other recommendations on reliable retailers/web sites for components would be appreciated.

    Thanks in advance,
  • If you are only going to lift the body, you will have to make suspension modifications to allow any tires wider than stock to fit. I know someone with a 2001 Sport who put 31x10.50's on it and they rub. You should talk to your dealer about the warranty. Our dealer said they will honor the warranty on the motor even if a suspension lift is installed.

    I am personally looking to put a 4" suspension lift and 33x12.50's on my 2001 very soon.
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    I intended to include this in my previous post.

    Don't be discouraged if the first dealer or two you go to will not make you a reasonable offer. That almost happened to me. I came close to giving up on the idea of getting a new Jeep. I sure wasn't going to pay any $9000 to $10,000 difference.

    I was beginning to think that there was something wrong with my research, since the first couple of offers were so far from what I was expecting.

    I'm sure glad I checked at least one more place! I do think I would have just given up if that last dealer hadn't shot me such a good deal. I shouldn't have, though, cause there's lots of dealers out there.

    Also, it's a buyers market right now on the Jeeps. They are taking an unscheduled shut down at the Jeep plant, because there are too many unsold Jeeps right now. The pipeline is full, and Jeeps are not selling well. It should be a great time to buy one.

  • Thanks for your response 2001.

    Actually, I know someone who has a 2000 Wrangler with a 2" body lift and 32" tires and there's plenty of clearance (even off roading). A custom Jeep shop actually recommended the lift with the 32" tires. I was told that any type of suspension lift would void Jeep's standard 3 year 36,000 mile warranty. I am talking drive train and all other components. Perhaps the "engine" warranty will remain intact but not the other parts. That's a potential concern for me. I will start with the 2" body and then do a 2" suspension later. Thoughts?

    Anyway, what's a pretty decent width for 32" tires? 12.00"?

    TSJAY -
    Negotiate what you'll pay for the Jeep FIRST and then SECOND, start playing with your trade in. That keeps the dealer from squeezing other areas.
    Don't even tell them you will be trading until you negotiate a suitable deal on the Jeep.
  • Thanks for your response 2001.

    Actually, I know someone who has a 2000 Wrangler with a 2" body lift and 32" tires and there's plenty of clearance (even off roading). A custom Jeep shop actually recommended the lift with the 32" tires. I was told that any type of suspension lift would void Jeep's standard 3 year 36,000 mile warranty. I am talking drive train and all other components. Perhaps the "engine" warranty will remain intact but not the other parts. That's a potential concern for me. I will start with the 2" body and then do a 2" suspension later. Thoughts?

    Anyway, what's a pretty decent width for 32" tires? 12.00"?

    TSJAY -
    Negotiate what you'll pay for the Jeep FIRST and then SECOND, start playing with your trade in. That keeps the dealer from squeezing other areas.
    Don't even tell them you will be trading until you negotiate a suitable deal on the Jeep.
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591

    Although I forgot to mention it in my post, that's exactly the way I go about trading. I first ask for the best no-trade deal on the new vehicle, and only after hearing their offer do I mention a trade-in.

    You are right about not really knowing what they are doing to you, if you let them know what you will be trading in. They will make it sound like they are coming off the new vehicle more than they really are, or they will make you think they are giving you more for your trade-in than they really are. You just don't know what kind of a deal you are getting that way.

    I forgot to do that at the first dealer, so maybe that's why they thought they could rape me.

  • Haha - I hear you. Just started my negotiations (via e-mail). I don't like it one bit. I am getting use to seeing a vehicle I really like and then not making too big a deal of it if it doesn't work out. Although it's tough because it occupies your thoughts (new tires, lift kit, etc.) - and then I get disappointed if the deal doesn't work out! It's only happened once so I am trying to be open-minded.

    I started my workings with a private seller but he didn't even have the courtesy of calling me back after my initial offer. Regardless if it was too low, he should have still let me know. I was willing to play ball. His loss I guess.
    I swore I wouldn't set foot on a dealer's lot because after all, they are there to make money as the middle man. Looks like a good deal though. We'll see if they come down.

    Let me know how things work out.

  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    I HAVE traded. Scroll up a few posts (417 I think) and you will see that I traded for $6560.00. ( I was thinking I ought to be able to trade for around $7000.00, and I actually did a little better than that. ).

    I ordered from the factory, so I don't have my Jeep yet.

  • ttt6ttt6 Posts: 11
    tsjay - I'm not sure about your 'buyers market' comment on the TJ. When I started my research I notice DC does ABSOULTELY NOTHING to move TJs ie no low APRs, cash backs, enticing leases, incentives nada zilch. (they gave a no charge Auto which is a 3 speed, yes we're in 2001 and they're pushing 3 speed autos which they been making since 1945 (trying to be funny) AND it cost them NOTHING to put in the TJ)

    I anticipated sales during the holidays ie Labor Day / End of Summer gimmicks etc yet NOTHING on the TJ why?...

    Basically DC has the monolopy on the fun small 4WD market. THERES no competition SO they can stick it to the loyal Jeepers. $22,000 buys LOTS of car yet the Jeep is rather spartan. The TJ uses simple basic engineering principles for assembly HECK I can slap one of these together in my garage (again trying to be funny BUT I'm not laughing) - Dealer says they sell themselves and YES you can buy close to invoice. BUT I can't shake the feeling that DC is sticking it to us. DAMN DC!

    Like you I am in lust, my fantasy is a yellow Sport with all the fix'ins, black hard top, 30" canyon casts BUT for this price I expect darn near perfection because WHERE does the money GO??? engineering? rare exotic parts? NOT. I am anticipating that after paying $20,000+ my TJ will give me problems and thats not acceptable.
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    I know that DC isn't giving any incentives, but the dealers ought to be glad to move some Jeeps and get their money into some other vehicle that will sell faster. This should mean that you can find a dealer willing to give you a decent trade-in allowance and sell the Jeep very close to invoice. That's what I found after shopping around a little ($200.00 over invoice on the Wrangler and $1000.00 over "average trade-in" on my Grand Prix).

    There can be no question that the Jeeps are grossly over-priced. The Jeep I have ordered is sticker priced within $350.00 of the sticker price of my Grand Prix GT. There's a world of difference in what you get with the Grand Prix vs. the Jeep. Crap, I got leather interior and an OVERDRIVE automatic transmission (not the three speed that Jeep offers). My Jeep will be a 5-speed.

    But, I want a Jeep and I'm willing to pay the price. I'm hoping that driving a Jeep will be the most fun I've ever had with my clothes on. It better be for that kind of money.

    As far as quality, I am expecting a good vehicle. I don't think buying a Jeep necessarily means you have to settle for poor quality. There doesn't seem to be an abundance of dissatisfied owners in this group. I'm sure we would hear from people if they were unhappy.

    You just have to decide for yourself if having a Jeep is worth the price. The vehicle itself sure isn't worth what they charge for them.

  • tsjay-
    I am a quality engineer for an automotive supplier and I have no concerns at all with my TJ. I look at many body panels regularly in our plant as well as in many assembly plants and I think my TJ is very well made. The paint job is very good and the gap/flushness of all the body panels is excellent.
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    That makes me feel good!

    I didn't think there was anything wrong with the quality of the Wrangler, and hearing from you makes me feel even better.

    I wouldn't have ordered one if I thought I was going to get a piece of crap.

  • Where can I buy my spouse a wheel cover that has the Jeep logo and a Jeep key chain?

  • TSJAY:

    What is going on with the closing of the Jeep factory? I thought they were closing for 2 weeks between Christmas and New Years. At this rate my Jeep will never get built. I ordered it the last weekend of Oct. I called the Jeep number with my VON and they told me it would be built the 2nd week of December. I think its those damn Germans putting the screws to us. Didn't we beat them in a war a few years ago.. How do they end up running the show???( that was suppose to be funny) I am going to have a hard time waiting any longer.....
  • Well although I haven't posted much I gotta tell you folks that everything about this topic has been educational and a big help. I wish I had a digital camera so I could show you what I got:)
    I got a completely redone from ground up CJ-7
    the only original Jeep parts are the body.
    It's got a high performance 327 bored to a 383
    with lockers a nine bolt main in back and a dana 40 up front custom solid axles custom drive shafts 3" lift dual quad holley manifold and carb. bump shift automatic headers glass packs and dual exhaust. I know these specs don't mean much to some but you rock climbers are having trouble not dribbling on your keyboards about now. When I go from Park to drive you best have a foot on the brake cause those 300 horses will roll rubber off the 32-12.5's before you even touch the gas. Well I know I'm in for some nasty surprises because I didn't build it I bought it but You really gotta here this thing pulling 40% grades over 2-foot rock steps to appreciate the power of a V8 under the hood. Well I think I'm gonna go drive this thing around while I still have money for gas cause the mileage ain't pretty.
  • Wheel cover & key chain...that should be no problem to find.

    look up "jeep essentials" in any search engine and you will be able to buy online or order a catalog.

  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    The plant shutdown is for this week. Apparently it is due to slow sales and too many Jeeps in inventories around the country.

    They will still take the two week shutdown at Christmas as far as I know (unless they make it even longer due to low sales).

    According to my dealer, who supposedly gets better information than we do when we call the 800 number, my Jeep was supposed to be made tomorrow originally, but will now be made a week from tomorrow. That makes sense, since the shut down is one week long.

    So, I still ought to beat the Christmas shutdown. My Jeep should be shipped the 5th of December and arrive within a week or two after that. My dealer just checked the status of my Jeep today.

    It looks like the shutdown simply delayed things for me by one week.

  • vubsvubs Posts: 14
    i was looking at a '01 white/tan sahara and guess what... i saw underlying rust at weld joints on the door. that was my 2nd choice but now it's out (at least you won't see rust clearly on a sienna).

    question about invoice $. i know what kbb, edmunds and others list (20748 w/dest), but how come the dealers always have a higher number claiming theirs is current? several here have mentioned getting deals for $200 over invoice but $200 over what? just curious. has anyone out there gotten a jeep from CarMax (good/bad)?
  • Well its official! My Jeep is in route! It will arrive here December 2nd. I cant believe it was built so quickly. Jeep told me it wasn't scheduled to be built till the 2nd week of December. I'll keep you posted on the arrival of the vehicle...
  • Well all my Jeep was assembled on Thanksgiving Day. I hope the people assembling my Jeep were thankfull for their triple time pay and put my Jeep together properly... I had a question but I cant seem to remember it right now....Oh well maybe after I get back from School.....
  • The dealer will have the latest numbers for an invoice. They are the first ones to get any changes. I would print out a copy of the invoice from here or a bank/credit union and then get a copy of the invoice from the dealer and compare them. Then you can see where the changes are.
    The invoice numbers should not change that often but they do change.
    When someone says 200 over invoice they mean 200 over 20748 (the invoice price you have listed).
    So 20948 + tax, title & license
    Hope that helps
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    My baby is supposed to be built one week from today! I hope there are no complications or delays of any kind.

    Still looking for suggestions for a new user name to go along with my new Jeep. Help me, brothers and sisters.

  • Please give me the ideal Jeep '01 Sport setup.

    -Dual tops
    -Dana 44
    -Full metal doors
    -deep tint
    -best stereo combo
    -canyon wheels...

    anything else? How much should I be paying for this thing? Seattle area........thanks.
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    One thing that Goducks1 says is a good option for ice and snow is the "trac lok." Since you are already getting the Dana 44 3.73 rear end, it only costs $285.00 to add the trac lok feature.

    I was too late in getting this info and had already ordered my Jeep, so I won't be getting it. I could have changed my order, but it would have delayed my Jeep in being built, so I decided to live without it.

    Also, I hope you are not expecting much out of that stereo. You have to get the "best" sound system in a Jeep just to have a very mediocre sound system (and that's being kind).

    What color are you getting?

    I LOVE your choice of wheels! Those canyons are beautiful. My baby is going to have them.

    I paid $200.00 over invoice for my Jeep, and that's as good as I have heard anyone do in this group. You can try for a better deal, though, cause the Jeeps aren't selling well. They even shut the plant down for a week due to low sales.

  • My wife and I are the owners of a 1999 SE and 2000 Sport Wrangler. We bought the 99 new 1.5 years ago. It has been in the shop several times and is about to go back in. The Jeep has never been off road and has been babied. The problems it has had are, 1.) Weather strips torn, 2.) Water coming from floor 3.) Window washer leaked on hood all the time 4.) Front end came from factory out of balance 5.) Warped front rotors and now 5.) Leaks anti-freeze from the radiator and is leaking power steering fluid. This is all from a bone stock never abused street driven Jeep Wrangler.
    The 2000 we have had for 4 months. It's problems include 1.) Torn weather stripping,2.) Lights did not work. 3.0 3.) 5spd transmission is noisy and very hard to shift 4.) 5.) Has recently not wanted to start in the mornings, sometimes takes up to 2 minutes.
    I just would like you to know that I have driven Jeeps most of my life, I have 2 Willys's Jeeps and used to have a 1985 CJ7 Laredo. I am a fan of the Jeep, but this is changing. If I were looking at buying a Jeep Wrangler, I would look at it very closely, drive it at least 24 hours before buying it and then think some more. These vehicles are noisy, rough riding, squirrly handling, water leaking, and lately mechanically flawed vehicles, but that is what makes them Jeep Wranglers. If you are buying one thinking that this is going to be comfortable on long road trips, mileage will be good, and it will never give you a problem, DO NOT BUY ONE. If you are looking for something to haul the family around in and is easy to pick things up from the store in, DO NOT BUT ONE. If you are looking for a fun little vehicle, that will need to be worked on, can become a convertible, can go darn near everywhere and can be modified to your hearts content, then by all means BUY ONE.
    The point is, these are like no other car on the road today. They are from another era and that is why most Jeep owners have them. We are able to overlook the problems because we enjoy them for the good and bad. But, do not expect it to be quiet , dry, smooth, roomy and userfriendly, because they are not in the least. I would have it no other way, I love my 2 pieces of junk and would not trade them for anything.
    It's a Jeep thing, if you have to ask, you wouldn't understand.
  • goducks1goducks1 Posts: 432
    back home again after a week in SoCal..didn't have my Jeep, but the girlfriend has a convertible Mustang, so I got lots of sun.

    Kudos to the previous post on pointing out the drawbacks of Wrangler/CJ ownership. I think that people considering a new Wrangler need to be aware that although the new TJs are a great improvement, there are a lot of things to put up with as an owner, esp if this is your primary set of wheels. I haven't had the mechanical problems on my '98 Sport though-only one thing that needed to be fixed under warranty (the gauge thing, scroll back a bit on this post to see).

    benjaminchoi: Trak-lok is a good option, but make sure you get A/C, even if you live in the Northwest (I do too). You will need it sometimes, trust me.

    My Jeep is at the 4x4 shop today, I'm adding front and rear tow hooks and black Smittbilt tubular side-steps (aka nerf bars). Will be getting new tires next week (30" BFG All-terrains). Whoo-ho! Mebbe I'll post some pictures.
  • ttt6ttt6 Posts: 11
    Excellent post. If I go the Jeep route, I go with a stripped SE 5 speed. This way if I get buyers remorse or a lemon, I won't be in too deep. The TJ will be a second car, for quickie errands, joyriding, and light off-roading.

    goducks1 HAHA I'm in the same situation (sort of) my other car is a Stang convertible. I hope the TJ will compliment my Ford.
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