I haven't quite figured this commuting concept out yet....
Since the late 70's I haven't lived and worked in the same state at any time. Commutes ranged from 45 min to 3+ hrs each way depending on traffic and weather. Now it's an easy 150 mi RT over 3 hours.
Instead of driving into NY to get the Shuttle to Boston or DC I'd drive the 6 hours.
Unfortunately I passed along this brain block to my oldest. When he commutes into NYC it's 160 mi each way... but it's all train.
How can you justify losing that much time each day. Not to mention the waste of fuel. Are there no homes close to where you work. I hated it back in 1962 when I had a 19 mile commute and it was all Freeway and not crowded like it is today. Thankfully that only lasted a year and I got transferred to an office 5 miles from home. Not counting flying 3000 miles every 3 weeks to work, that 19 mile trip to the office was my longest over a 46 year career.
PS I forgot. In 1978 I worked 3 weeks in St Cloud MN and had to drive 75 miles each way from the farm. That was when I had the 1979 Honda Accord. That was so stressful I called my old boss in Alaska and got my job back the next week.
Depending on where you live, and/or the hours you work, it often makes more sense to measure commuting in time, rather than in distance; I live in NYC, and one of my offices in Manhattan was 14 miles door to door from my house - during the morning rush it could take anywhere from 45 - 90 minutes to drive in. Fortunately I had the option of going to my NJ office - 35 miles away, and get there in less time, with an easier, all turnpike drive, reserved FREE parking etc.
had to drive 75 miles each way from the farm. That was when I had the 1979 Honda Accord. That was so stressful I called my old boss in Alaska and got my job back the next week.
So which was more stressful...the long commute or the tiny car you had to make it in? :P
A friend of mine back in college had a 1980 Accord hatchback. I drove it a few times. Actually, it wasn't a bad little car for 1 or 2 people. Acceleration was really slow, but once it got moving it seemed pretty quiet and stable for such a small car.
Depending on where you live, and/or the hours you work, it often makes more sense to measure commuting in time, rather than in distance
That's certainly true. I don't mind a longer drive, just as long as I'm moving. I hate sitting still in congested traffic...seems to make the time drag out. I'd rather have a job 60 miles away that I could get to in an hour, rather than one 10 miles away that still takes an hour to get to.
I've gotten spoiled though, with my commute. It's never been more than 14 miles, and maybe 35 minutes on a bad day. Actually, I take that back. For about 5 months, when I was working a second evening job, when I finally got off it was about 21 miles home. But that was also around 10:00 at night, mostly highway, and I was often home in 20-25 mins.
My current commute is about 3.5 miles each way, and it's very rare that it takes me more than 10 minutes. If I suddenly had to go back to a more "typical" commute, it would probably be a shock to me. I'd get used to it though, in time.
I commute 10 miles each way to work, and it's 90% highway. On a bad day, I hit two traffic lights along the way.
I work with a guy who commutes 80 miles each way, and has to deal with Dallas traffic on I-35 every day. Pure insanity!
So, for two years, I've been trying to convince him to sell his house and buy a new one closer to work. I told him that the amount of money he spends on gasoline could go toward improving his quality of life now, or securing a comfy retirement in the future.
I told him how, since we both perform the same job, I'm getting paid significantly more because I don't have to spend an extra $25/day on gas like he does.
I told him that he's spending 22 days per year just on his commute -- the equivalent of three weeks vacation.
He's starting to talk about moving ..... so I think I'm getting through to him. .
Actually the Accord was better to drive long distances than the 1976 Datsun PU it replaced. It was the time wasted sitting in a vehicle for an hour and a half going to work and coming home from work that had me stressed out. Remember that was during the WORST time for the USA in my lifetime. The Carter administration. I had to work the farm and a carpenter job in the city to pay my bills. I just picked the wrong time to become a farmer.
"This house, he and Dawn explain, is not a McMansion they cannot afford. Quite simply, it represents what they always believed: The next generation deserves a better life."
I guess that can be taken two ways, but the way the author combined it in with the house comment, makes it sound like they feel they deserve to have a bigger house and nicer material things. If they mean it as quality of life and happiness, the author did them a dis-service by making it sound material.
If it is a material thing, that seems an all too common way of thinking. People think they deserve one thing or another when there is no such thing. Life is about choices. What job you have (and how far it is from home). How much education you choose to pursue. Where you live (city, state, etc). What kind of car you buy. How big of a family you choose to have and support. Where you spend your money. All of those things shape your life and "standard of living". Even standard of living is in the eye of the beholder. There are a lot of people that make due with much less and are way happier than someone in a big house, new car, a big screen TV.
Above and beyond the basics of survival, standard of living is more of a mindset than anything that can be defined by material things. "Success" being another of those words that can only be defined from within. Advertising is always working it's magic, though, and making us feel inadequate if we don't have the latest and greatest [fill in the item here], just like your neighbors, family, or friends.
And I don't get the entitlement thing. Even a fair number of kids graduating from college seem to have this thought of entitlement. Immediately after graduation, they think they should be able to afford a nice, brand new house and car since that is what they were used to when they lived with their parents. Well, most of those parents worked a loooong time to be able to work up to a nice house. When you first start out, if you can rent any form of shelter, even if you have to share with room mates, your doing just fine.
With the peak summer driving season still to come and crude oil prices rising too, gas may reach the retail price of $4 a gallon that the Energy Department has been forecasting.
That no commute thing must be nice! Although I can't complain about my 3.5 mile commute to work. I filled up my Intrepid last Wednesday, and I've only gone about 58 miles since then.
Local Shell station is up to $3.379 for 87, and I think the Citgo is $3.339.
Well, I haven't hit the $100 fill-up yet but getting close. We just got back from a camping trip and when I filled the Suburban up on Friday night I put in 27 gallons @ 3.39 which totaled $91.53. Our destination was 440 miles away and towing nearly 6,000 lbs camper yielded an avg of 9.5mpg (which I was happy with), so it cost about $300 in gas for our trip (plus another $50 in gas driving around), and $140 for the campsite. Still a cheap vacation for a family of 4 plus a Dalmatian. Lots of RVs on the road, people may not travel as far, but they still traveling.
It takes my wife about 30 minutes to get to work (8 miles more or less). 20 minutes in the summer when school isn't in session. Sometimes I commute from my desktop to the hammock hanging under the grapevines, dragging my laptop with me. :shades:
$3.35 for regular most places here in Boise now. Diesel is almost a buck more.
I think my '67 Catalina has a 26 gallon tank. I usually feed it premium fuel, which is over $3.50 per gallon in my area now. So if I let it run bone dry, that's a bit over $90 right there.
I remember whining about a fillup back in 2004 that broke the $60 barrier! Nowadays I could almost hit that with my Intrepid and its 17 gallon tank, using 87 octane.
$100? Jeez, I've never even paid $50 for a fill up. Closest I came to to that was about a year ago when I borrowed my dad's S-10 and filled it up for him: about $40. $35 of premium will fill the S2000 and the SE-R, though I know I'll blow past $50 when it comes time to fill up the GMC.
How big is the gas tank in your GMC? My '85 Silverado used to have two 16 gallon saddle tanks, but both of them went bad, and I only paid to have one replaced.
That limits my cruising range, but at least helps with the sticker shock when it's time to fill up!
IIRC the tank behind the seat is about 20 gallons. Mine once had a pair of 15-gallon saddle tanks under the bed and I did consider putting them back on, but I wouldn't drive it often enough to use up 50 gallons of gas soon enough so I'll just have to be content to top it off every 150 miles.
midgrade and premium are now over $4/gallon at the nearest station to my house. Gas stations here have started discounting the regular unleaded so that it won't cross that $4 mark (psychological barrier to shoppers that it is), and as a result the regular unleaded at that station is still only $3.86.
I usually shop at a different station by the freeway which is about a dime cheaper, but they are both up a dime since this time last week. Memorial Day is still 6 weeks away...
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I was driving to work this morning and saw gasoline prices jumped by four cents overnight! Sunoco Ultra is $3.45 and regular is $3.19! Good thing I filled up the Park Ave a few nights ago.
I topped off my Intrepid with 87 octane. It's up to $3.359 per gallon now. The previous time I had filled up, the pump seemed to have shut off prematurely, because there's no way it would only take 3.8 gallons to fill that car up after driving 121 miles, in mostly local travel! So this time, it all evened out, and I figure I'm averaging about 19.1 mpg. :sick:
I guess all things considered, that's not TOO bad, considering my short commute. With just 3.5 miles to travel, the car probably spends most of that trip warming up, and doesn't get to full operating temperature until I'm at my destination and about to turn it off. As the weather continues to get warmer, hopefully that figure will improve.
And in a couple weeks, I'll be driving it up to PA when I go for the Spring Carlisle, so I'll be curious to see what kind of economy it gets on that trip.
I'm really curious to see the next round of Pickup redesigns subsequent to $4 gas. They will certainly have to be lighter and smaller than these monsters they now produce. We will be seeing diesel powerplants and I think multiple unibody pickups. Just my .02. Meantime,I drive my car carefully,less,and plan and link all errands. Plan is to make my car last till I can get a more efficient diesel.
Good thing I filled up the Park Ave a few nights ago.
Tell us what you're going to do with that $0.80 you saved! You must really get excited when a new bank offers a duffle-bag for opening an account. Or you find someone has left a coupon on the store shelf.
You'd be surprised how far that change goes. I save all my change for the year, exchange the coins for bills and have my Xmas-shopping money by December!
You'd be surprised how far that change goes. I save all my change for the year, exchange the coins for bills and have my Xmas-shopping money by December!
One of my roommates worked as a waiter for about a year and a half, and would throw his change into a big plastic container. And any other change that happened to end up lying around the house would end up in there.
Last fall, I started going through that container and rolling coins up. It ended up coming out to something like $120! I dunno if I can get excited anymore over saving 80 cents, but it does add up.
I'm really curious to see the next round of Pickup redesigns subsequent to $4 gas. They will certainly have to be lighter and smaller than these monsters they now produce. We will be seeing diesel powerplants and I think multiple unibody pickups
Well as long as they don't lose the capability to haul and tow heavy loads. Ford has new F150 coming and smaller, lighter, and less powerful it's not.
Those who don't own/want trucks don't understand why people want them. Look at current sales levels. Small trucks don't sell as well as big trucks or get much better fuel economy. I saw a v6 Ford Ranger in a dealer the other day and its fuel economy rating was barely better than a v8 Expedition.
A smaller, lighter, unibody truck will not SAFELY tow my 6000 lb camper along with hauling associated gear and my family. A current 1/2 truck/ SUV is a minimum. So my Suburban gets 13-16 mpg as a daily driver. It's paid for and costs me $330/mo in gas. Not a big deal when you consider a sedan getting twice the mileage would only save me at most $150/mo. Not enough to justify a 3rd more fuel efficient vehicle or make me give up the camper or boat.
I could see a new class of truck under the 1/2 ton class that offers some utility and fuel economy. But the heavy duty trucks aren't going anywhere anytime soon as long enough people demand them. Still a lot of people needing/wanting the capabilities of a truck.
These days a "half-ton" is basically what a 3/4 ton was 20 years ago, and the "not-so-compact" pickups do what 1/2-tons did back then.
True. Current trucks are way more capable. But as these trucks have gotten bigger and heavier, so have things they tow. The avg. boat today is a lot bigger than 20 years ago. Same with many travel trailers. Some of these fifth wheels getting pulled around are over 15000lbs. No way you'd tow these huge RVs with a 1 ton truck from the late 70's or early 80's.
True. Current trucks are way more capable. But as these trucks have gotten bigger and heavier, so have things they tow.
Funny thing though, my stepdad made a comment awhile back that would seem to be contrary. In 2002, they bought an F-150 with the 4.6 V-8, and sold me the '85 Silverado with the 5.0 V-8, which I still have. My stepdad says that the F-150 isn't half the truck the Silverado was when it came to towing or load-carrying.
Just curious, what WOULD be the "threshold of pain" for you? $450/mo in gas? How about $550? If I have the math right, even $550/mo for you would only require a fuel price of around $5.50/gallon, a very plausible figure to see in perhaps 3-4 years' time.
The curious thing about the $550 figure is that would be reaching the point where the monthly gas payment was as much as the BRAND NEW truck payment. Yikes. I think that would make a lot of people think twice about what they really need their trucks for, and whether it could perhaps be relegated to "third car" duty.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
The curious thing about the $550 figure is that would be reaching the point where the monthly gas payment was as much as the BRAND NEW truck payment. Yikes. I think that would make a lot of people think twice about what they really need their trucks for, and whether it could perhaps be relegated to "third car" duty.
I guess one way to look at it, and soften the blow somewhat, is that whatever the fuel bill for the Suburban is, a car's fuel bill would still be about half of that. At least, going from where he said going from the Suburban to the car would reduce his $330 bill by about $150. That's actually not quite half, but let's say half, for kicks and giggles.
So at $550 per month in fuel for the Suburban, the car would still cost $275. So the true savings is "only" $275 per month. That's no small chunk of change, but once you factor in purchasing the newer car, plus extra insurance, and extra maintenance, etc, it begins to look less and less promising.
Plus, if you really need what a big truck offers, it's still going to get driven pretty regularly, while the more economical car will just be under-utilized.
Still, I'm sure with these jacked up gas prices, a lot of people will think twice about whether they really need a truck.
The GMC gets a bit under 3 miles per dollar at current prices, while the Hyundai gets about 11 and the smart should be in the 13-14 range. The economically sensible approach is to buy a depreciated truck and drive it as little as possible, while driving the new(er) high-mileage vehicle as often as possible.
But the heavy duty trucks aren't going anywhere anytime soon as long enough people demand them. Still a lot of people needing/wanting the capabilities of a truck.
No the large trucks are not going to disappear off the face of the earth because there is a real basic need for a certain number of them. But the 'image buyers' will no longer buy just because 'I gotta have a truck'. What is equally likely IMO is that those that have a real but limited need for a truck will keep the current one for purely truck duties and purchase something more efficient as a daily driver. There will no auto-re-upping from truck to truck to truck.
The net result will be one less truck sale for the 6 main truck makers. Repeat 100,000 times until that hardcore nugget of truck-only buyers is reached. It's like peeling away and peeling away the fruit off a peach until the hard center is found.
There will still be people buying full sized trucks and SUVs that actually need the utility. There will be fewer people buying these vehicles for reasons like, "they enjoy the feeling of being above the other motorists".
Funny thing though, my stepdad made a comment awhile back that would seem to be contrary. In 2002, they bought an F-150 with the 4.6 V-8, and sold me the '85 Silverado with the 5.0 V-8
Well a 4.6 powered f-150 probably is far from the most capable pickup. The power to weight ratio of that truck is probably close to that of your Silverado. I don't think a 4.6 powered F150 is rated to tow much more than 5,000-6,000lbs, probably inline with your '85 Silverado.
Toyota sold about 200,000 Tundras last year. What did that do to the F150 sales? I don't think GM was down that much last year. As you have pointed out there are a lot of small contractors that are not getting the work and do not need a new truck. Many times a small business person will buy a new vehicle just because it is advantageous tax wise.
I'd say gas would have to hit $6-7 today for me to consider a different or additional fuel efficient vehicle. We do a pretty good job of living below our means, so energy prices have had very little effect on our finances. We're fortunate that my wife has a company car, so we don't have to pay for her gas for her commute and her personal use fees are minimal.
I bought the Suburban used with fairly low mileage, put 1/2 down and paid it off in less than 3 years. When I buy another, I'll buy it used too. No way will I give Ford or GM $50k of my money. I'll find a one or two year old model used for 1/2 that amount and pay cash or find a low interest loan for a few years. That way I can have a solid tow vehicle and still comfortably afford our summer hobbies of camping and boating.
it often makes more sense to measure commuting in time, rather than in distance;
I believe I said from walking out my front door in the morning to walking back in in the evening was 9 hours. Its a little less than an half hour round trip.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
It is a bit disconcerting, when you start adding up the costs of every little trip and errand here and there. As of the last fill-up, my Intrepid came out to about 17.3 cents per mile. Or 5.78 miles per dollar, using your calculation.
I just came back from running errands. First to the bank, which is about 4 miles away, and then to the AAA office, which is about 7 miles away, but in the opposite direction. Total trip was 22.5 miles, which cost me $3.89 just in fuel.
I could've renewed my AAA membership online, saving 14 miles. However, I had a $50 rebate voucher that I could only use if I went to the office.
I could probably coax 12 mpg out of my '85 Silverado on that same run. However, it has a preference for high octane, and would come out to about 30 cents per mile. Or about 3.3 miles per dollar. That same errand would've cost about $6.75 if I used the truck!
Now I know these dollar amounts are fairly petty in the overall scheme of things. But they do add up. I remember back in the days before I bought my Intrepid, when paying more than $1.25 per gallon was rare, running around in something like my '68 Dart only came out to 9-10 cents per mile. Back in those days, it just didn't seem like all that much money, even accounting for inflation.
Hmm, "those days". This was just back in the 90's! I must be getting old...
It costs me about $8 to drive to Costco from my new place. I have to think if I am saving enough to justify the drive. We do consolidate our trips more. Driving to downtown San Diego would be $16. The only thing we go down there for is to visit the Zoo. Maybe 3 times a year now. We used to go about twice that much just for a nice walk around the place.
It's weird you should say that, as a similar thought was occurring to me last night. A friend asked me to give him a ride up to Sacramento, a drive I make without giving it a second thought if there's a need.
But as I was driving home from dropping him off, I started thinking: it's about 150 miles round trip, so at the price I am paying now, even in my car, the favor cost me about $15!
We don't think about that kind of stuff usually, or at least I don't, because it's not money coming out of our wallet at the moment we are doing it. But the thinking of five years ago, that driving is a cheap activity that is automatic rather than one that requires weighing need against cost, needs to go out the window because trips lke this cost real money now.
Not that $15 is some killer cost that is going to throw my whole budget off, but just a few trips like this one would add up to 25-50% of my car payment!
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Would that trip to Sacramento and back be mostly highway for you, Nippon? If so, that really drives home the point of how expensive gasoline has gotten in just a few short years. Nowadays you have to get one of the most economical cars out there to get it down to 10 cents per mile, whereas back when when I drove my '68 Dart, 1992-1997, it averaged 9-10 cents per mile in mostly local driving. Heck, for about a year I used that thing to deliver pizzas, until I more or less replaced it with a '79 Newport that I picked up from the junkyard for $250.
I think at one point, I actually got the Intrepid down to about 5 cents per mile, when I took it on a trip back in the early '00's. I guess those days are gone forever!
Yup, that drive is all highway, 70 mph. The Matrix will pull about 37, 38 mpg on that type of trip, so it's almost exactly 4 gallons. And yes, that means it is right on a dime a mile just for the gas nowadays in that car.
The Echo does a lot better (46+ on highway trips), which is why I usually take that car for the longer trips when I'm not carrying a bunch of stuff or extra people.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Comments
Since the late 70's I haven't lived and worked in the same state at any time. Commutes ranged from 45 min to 3+ hrs each way depending on traffic and weather. Now it's an easy 150 mi RT over 3 hours.
Instead of driving into NY to get the Shuttle to Boston or DC I'd drive the 6 hours.
Unfortunately I passed along this brain block to my oldest. When he commutes into NYC it's 160 mi each way... but it's all train.
PS
I forgot. In 1978 I worked 3 weeks in St Cloud MN and had to drive 75 miles each way from the farm. That was when I had the 1979 Honda Accord. That was so stressful I called my old boss in Alaska and got my job back the next week.
Depending on where you live, and/or the hours you work, it often makes more sense to measure commuting in time, rather than in distance; I live in NYC, and one of my offices in Manhattan was 14 miles door to door from my house - during the morning rush it could take anywhere from 45 - 90 minutes to drive in. Fortunately I had the option of going to my NJ office - 35 miles away, and get there in less time, with an easier, all turnpike drive, reserved FREE parking etc.
So which was more stressful...the long commute or the tiny car you had to make it in? :P
A friend of mine back in college had a 1980 Accord hatchback. I drove it a few times. Actually, it wasn't a bad little car for 1 or 2 people. Acceleration was really slow, but once it got moving it seemed pretty quiet and stable for such a small car.
That's certainly true. I don't mind a longer drive, just as long as I'm moving. I hate sitting still in congested traffic...seems to make the time drag out. I'd rather have a job 60 miles away that I could get to in an hour, rather than one 10 miles away that still takes an hour to get to.
I've gotten spoiled though, with my commute. It's never been more than 14 miles, and maybe 35 minutes on a bad day. Actually, I take that back. For about 5 months, when I was working a second evening job, when I finally got off it was about 21 miles home. But that was also around 10:00 at night, mostly highway, and I was often home in 20-25 mins.
My current commute is about 3.5 miles each way, and it's very rare that it takes me more than 10 minutes. If I suddenly had to go back to a more "typical" commute, it would probably be a shock to me. I'd get used to it though, in time.
I work with a guy who commutes 80 miles each way, and has to deal with Dallas traffic on I-35 every day. Pure insanity!
So, for two years, I've been trying to convince him to sell his house and buy a new one closer to work. I told him that the amount of money he spends on gasoline could go toward improving his quality of life now, or securing a comfy retirement in the future.
I told him how, since we both perform the same job, I'm getting paid significantly more because I don't have to spend an extra $25/day on gas like he does.
I told him that he's spending 22 days per year just on his commute -- the equivalent of three weeks vacation.
He's starting to talk about moving ..... so I think I'm getting through to him.
.
"This house, he and Dawn explain, is not a McMansion they cannot afford. Quite simply, it represents what they always believed: The next generation deserves a better life."
I guess that can be taken two ways, but the way the author combined it in with the house comment, makes it sound like they feel they deserve to have a bigger house and nicer material things. If they mean it as quality of life and happiness, the author did them a dis-service by making it sound material.
If it is a material thing, that seems an all too common way of thinking. People think they deserve one thing or another when there is no such thing. Life is about choices. What job you have (and how far it is from home). How much education you choose to pursue. Where you live (city, state, etc). What kind of car you buy. How big of a family you choose to have and support. Where you spend your money. All of those things shape your life and "standard of living". Even standard of living is in the eye of the beholder. There are a lot of people that make due with much less and are way happier than someone in a big house, new car, a big screen TV.
Above and beyond the basics of survival, standard of living is more of a mindset than anything that can be defined by material things. "Success" being another of those words that can only be defined from within. Advertising is always working it's magic, though, and making us feel inadequate if we don't have the latest and greatest [fill in the item here], just like your neighbors, family, or friends.
And I don't get the entitlement thing. Even a fair number of kids graduating from college seem to have this thought of entitlement. Immediately after graduation, they think they should be able to afford a nice, brand new house and car since that is what they were used to when they lived with their parents. Well, most of those parents worked a loooong time to be able to work up to a nice house. When you first start out, if you can rent any form of shelter, even if you have to share with room mates, your doing just fine.
Duh!
Regards,
OW
Local Shell station is up to $3.379 for 87, and I think the Citgo is $3.339.
Highest Recorded Price:
Regular Unl. $3.357 4/10/2008
DSL. $4.045 4/10/2008
I'd think the high will go to $3.40 by next week considering the inventory went down and crude price rose.
Regards,
OW
$3.35 for regular most places here in Boise now. Diesel is almost a buck more.
steve_, "Report Your Local Gas Prices Here" #7576, 10 Apr 2008 8:36 am
$3.419 x 25 gallons = $85.475 (Sunoco Ultra)
For the others:
1988 Buick Park Avenue and 2005 Buick LaCrosse:
$3.149 x 18 gallons = $56.682 (Sunoco Regular)
2007 Cadillac DTS Performance:
$3.419 x 18 gallons = $61.542 (Sunoco Ultra)
I remember whining about a fillup back in 2004 that broke the $60 barrier! Nowadays I could almost hit that with my Intrepid and its 17 gallon tank, using 87 octane.
That limits my cruising range, but at least helps with the sticker shock when it's time to fill up!
I usually shop at a different station by the freeway which is about a dime cheaper, but they are both up a dime since this time last week. Memorial Day is still 6 weeks away...
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I guess all things considered, that's not TOO bad, considering my short commute. With just 3.5 miles to travel, the car probably spends most of that trip warming up, and doesn't get to full operating temperature until I'm at my destination and about to turn it off. As the weather continues to get warmer, hopefully that figure will improve.
And in a couple weeks, I'll be driving it up to PA when I go for the Spring Carlisle, so I'll be curious to see what kind of economy it gets on that trip.
Tell us what you're going to do with that $0.80 you saved! You must really get excited when a new bank offers a duffle-bag for opening an account. Or you find someone has left a coupon on the store shelf.
One of my roommates worked as a waiter for about a year and a half, and would throw his change into a big plastic container. And any other change that happened to end up lying around the house would end up in there.
Last fall, I started going through that container and rolling coins up. It ended up coming out to something like $120! I dunno if I can get excited anymore over saving 80 cents, but it does add up.
Well as long as they don't lose the capability to haul and tow heavy loads. Ford has new F150 coming and smaller, lighter, and less powerful it's not.
Those who don't own/want trucks don't understand why people want them. Look at current sales levels. Small trucks don't sell as well as big trucks or get much better fuel economy. I saw a v6 Ford Ranger in a dealer the other day and its fuel economy rating was barely better than a v8 Expedition.
A smaller, lighter, unibody truck will not SAFELY tow my 6000 lb camper along with hauling associated gear and my family. A current 1/2 truck/ SUV is a minimum. So my Suburban gets 13-16 mpg as a daily driver. It's paid for and costs me $330/mo in gas. Not a big deal when you consider a sedan getting twice the mileage would only save me at most $150/mo. Not enough to justify a 3rd more fuel efficient vehicle or make me give up the camper or boat.
I could see a new class of truck under the 1/2 ton class that offers some utility and fuel economy. But the heavy duty trucks aren't going anywhere anytime soon as long enough people demand them. Still a lot of people needing/wanting the capabilities of a truck.
True. Current trucks are way more capable. But as these trucks have gotten bigger and heavier, so have things they tow. The avg. boat today is a lot bigger than 20 years ago. Same with many travel trailers. Some of these fifth wheels getting pulled around are over 15000lbs. No way you'd tow these huge RVs with a 1 ton truck from the late 70's or early 80's.
Funny thing though, my stepdad made a comment awhile back that would seem to be contrary. In 2002, they bought an F-150 with the 4.6 V-8, and sold me the '85 Silverado with the 5.0 V-8, which I still have. My stepdad says that the F-150 isn't half the truck the Silverado was when it came to towing or load-carrying.
Is that just because it's a Furd? :shades:
The curious thing about the $550 figure is that would be reaching the point where the monthly gas payment was as much as the BRAND NEW truck payment. Yikes. I think that would make a lot of people think twice about what they really need their trucks for, and whether it could perhaps be relegated to "third car" duty.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I guess one way to look at it, and soften the blow somewhat, is that whatever the fuel bill for the Suburban is, a car's fuel bill would still be about half of that. At least, going from where he said going from the Suburban to the car would reduce his $330 bill by about $150. That's actually not quite half, but let's say half, for kicks and giggles.
So at $550 per month in fuel for the Suburban, the car would still cost $275. So the true savings is "only" $275 per month. That's no small chunk of change, but once you factor in purchasing the newer car, plus extra insurance, and extra maintenance, etc, it begins to look less and less promising.
Plus, if you really need what a big truck offers, it's still going to get driven pretty regularly, while the more economical car will just be under-utilized.
Still, I'm sure with these jacked up gas prices, a lot of people will think twice about whether they really need a truck.
No the large trucks are not going to disappear off the face of the earth because there is a real basic need for a certain number of them. But the 'image buyers' will no longer buy just because 'I gotta have a truck'. What is equally likely IMO is that those that have a real but limited need for a truck will keep the current one for purely truck duties and purchase something more efficient as a daily driver. There will no auto-re-upping from truck to truck to truck.
The net result will be one less truck sale for the 6 main truck makers. Repeat 100,000 times until that hardcore nugget of truck-only buyers is reached. It's like peeling away and peeling away the fruit off a peach until the hard center is found.
Well a 4.6 powered f-150 probably is far from the most capable pickup. The power to weight ratio of that truck is probably close to that of your Silverado. I don't think a 4.6 powered F150 is rated to tow much more than 5,000-6,000lbs, probably inline with your '85 Silverado.
You'd have to look at the whole market. Lots of reasons truck sales are down, fuel prices is just one reason. The housing slow down etc, is another.
I bought the Suburban used with fairly low mileage, put 1/2 down and paid it off in less than 3 years. When I buy another, I'll buy it used too. No way will I give Ford or GM $50k of my money. I'll find a one or two year old model used for 1/2 that amount and pay cash or find a low interest loan for a few years. That way I can have a solid tow vehicle and still comfortably afford our summer hobbies of camping and boating.
I believe I said from walking out my front door in the morning to walking back in in the evening was 9 hours. Its a little less than an half hour round trip.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I just came back from running errands. First to the bank, which is about 4 miles away, and then to the AAA office, which is about 7 miles away, but in the opposite direction. Total trip was 22.5 miles, which cost me $3.89 just in fuel.
I could've renewed my AAA membership online, saving 14 miles. However, I had a $50 rebate voucher that I could only use if I went to the office.
I could probably coax 12 mpg out of my '85 Silverado on that same run. However, it has a preference for high octane, and would come out to about 30 cents per mile. Or about 3.3 miles per dollar. That same errand would've cost about $6.75 if I used the truck!
Now I know these dollar amounts are fairly petty in the overall scheme of things. But they do add up. I remember back in the days before I bought my Intrepid, when paying more than $1.25 per gallon was rare, running around in something like my '68 Dart only came out to 9-10 cents per mile. Back in those days, it just didn't seem like all that much money, even accounting for inflation.
Hmm, "those days". This was just back in the 90's! I must be getting old...
My last trip to the ski hill this season was yesterday. I drove up 35 times, and it's 50 miles round trip. My Subie gets about 22 mpg overall.
So...1750 miles, ~80 gallons used, call it $3 a gallon for the last 3 months - that's $240 in gas for snowboarding this season. Or about $7 a trip.
For perspective, a day ticket is $46. But a season pass only costs $199.
Last year the Subie used 308 gallons or ~$926 in gas.
So far this year I've burned 107 gallons of gas in the Subaru or $323.
I don't want to update those numbers with the actual cost of gas - using $3 a gallon is bad enough. :P
But as I was driving home from dropping him off, I started thinking: it's about 150 miles round trip, so at the price I am paying now, even in my car, the favor cost me about $15!
We don't think about that kind of stuff usually, or at least I don't, because it's not money coming out of our wallet at the moment we are doing it. But the thinking of five years ago, that driving is a cheap activity that is automatic rather than one that requires weighing need against cost, needs to go out the window because trips lke this cost real money now.
Not that $15 is some killer cost that is going to throw my whole budget off, but just a few trips like this one would add up to 25-50% of my car payment!
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I think at one point, I actually got the Intrepid down to about 5 cents per mile, when I took it on a trip back in the early '00's. I guess those days are gone forever!
The Echo does a lot better (46+ on highway trips), which is why I usually take that car for the longer trips when I'm not carrying a bunch of stuff or extra people.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)