What a difference a year makes. The Midwest had the cheapest gas for a better part of a year. Now you got the highest prices. I thought you were all burning E85 to stick it to the oil companies. I think the oil companies must feel sorry for us stuck in San Diego. They have lowered the prices a bit lately.
Now I know heating oil dealers do this - they offer a prebuy contract to its customers for the next year. In Aug. or Sept. you sign a contract with your dealer for a set-price for the next heating season, and they know about how much you're going to use.
Now what if Exxon-Mobil offered people a contract to pre-pay for 500 gal. at today's price (+$0.10/gal). How many of you would bite? Anyone think this will eventually happen? They already have the technology with the Speedpass.
There is a reason why the government broke up Standard Oil all those years ago. It is because monopolies curb innovation by stomping on compitetion. It is funny because every compony strives to be a monopoly, then they get a beatdown session from the Feds for being the best at what they do. **** Except - the Fed doesn't do that anymore. They let them merge and do whatever they want at this point.
Monopolies and predatory behavior are outlawed in the U.S. I'm not talking about competition, but practices that strive to engage in things like price-fixing, selling for under your cost, paying off officials, and so on. The worst of the worst behavior that arises when Capatalism turns into a free-for-all system closer to something you would find in a Feudal society. One where the exploited peasants have no power or say in what they pay for goods and services anymore. Competition is dead, innovation rarely happens, and prices are what the local Lord decides they are.
Some people here really need to read a history book about the apalling things that happened a century ago. There are real reasons we have these laws in place.
Interesting idea - oil producers do this all the time to reduce the risk of price swings to thier bottom line. I'd have to pass, though. I can afford to pay even if prices go up, but I'd sure feel foolish if I bought in at $3.30 and it tanked to $2. Irrational? maybe...
What a difference a year makes. The Midwest had the cheapest gas for a better part of a year. Now you got the highest prices. I thought you were all burning E85 to stick it to the oil companies. I think the oil companies must feel sorry for us stuck in San Diego. They have lowered the prices a bit lately.
Michigan is always high, at least compared to OH, PA, VA, KY, and TN (where I do most of my traveling).
I heard that blurb on the radio today as I was, ahem, driving around. I thought I heard AAA also say that people surveyed would not change their driving habits until the price of regular hit $4.38 (or some such "precise" number).
All the more ironic since AAA has lobbied long and hard against public transit and bike paths in favor of more roads during their entire existence.
I almost filled up today but I try to wait a full calendar month between tanks and my Subaru isn't quite on empty yet. :shades:
plet: I'm not talking about competition, but practices that strive to engage in things like price-fixing, selling for under your cost, paying off officials, and so on.
me: I know for sure 1 of those 3 is not illegal and uncommon - "selling for under your cost". Anytime a company loses money it is selling for under its cost! And companies can sell for under their cost intentionally. One of the biggest examples is - Sony does it, and admits it, with their Playstation 3. In the auto world, manufacturers do it when a model is selling slowly - they add rebates. They'd rather sell existing inventory for a small lose rather than have the vehicles around for many more months.
But the laws are never consistent - it always depends on the industry, product, or state. Was it Wis. that has a minimum price on gas? That seems like an anti-consumer, anti-free-market law to me. Other states of similar size seem to be avoiding chaos without it.
And for price fixing and paying off officials, that's what the justice dept./FBI/SEC/etc. etc. are for. Are there abuses? Certainly. Is there a better system? I'm all ears!
people surveyed would not change their driving habits until the price of regular hit $4.38 (or some such "precise" number).
People will change their driving habits when gas is a dollar more than whatever it happens to be at the moment. (Although change will happen at some point out of economic necessity.)
Gotcha! It'll have to wait for Wednesday when I'm back to work.
Yeah, I know Wisconsin has a law that says you can't sell gas for a loss. Heck, NJ has some sort of minimum over cost. They also won't let you pump your own, won't let you give away anything for filling up or basically have any kind of thing that effectively lowers the price...
2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
Those are good examples of an industry getting bad laws passed - dealers protecting their outlets, that kind of thing. And you can bet the majors weren't behind it - they want minimum costs/maximum volumes at their stations. We have to be careful when we ask for the government to get involved in something - we may not like the result!
Yep. Any time I talk with my brother the lawyer it's about protecting the mom and pop places from the corporation. He thinks it's a good idea! I think we might as well protect the buggy makers against these new fangled horseless carriages.
2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
Still, a total lack of regulation at all just leads to us being peasants. The manufacturers would pollute, fail to pay, intimidate, bribe, and whatever else they can think of getting away with if the laws weren't in place. And, yes "dumping" isn't legal in most countries.(though again, lately the govt doesn't care or there are numerous ways they now can get it reclassified as something else.)
I've heard there's a similar law in Maryland that you can't sell gasoline for less than you paid for it, UNLESS it's to match a competitor's price. So, if someplace down the street got their gasoline for less than you got yours for, and is charging less, then you can match his price, even if you're selling at a loss.
I wonder if one reason that some people won't change their driving habits unless gasoline hits some ridiculously high figure is because they already changed their habits back when gasoline shot up to around $2.00 per gallon...back when we thought THAT was expensive?
I'm sure these types of people are in the minority, but I pretty much cut out a lot of unnecessary driving and went easier on the throttle a couple years ago. So there's really not much more I can do, short of buying a more efficient vehicle, and with the relatively few miles I drive per year, that's probably not going to happen anytime soon. It'll happen if and when one of the vehicles wears out and needs to be replaced, but it's not going to happen just for the sole purpose of improving fuel economy.
I'm with you. I started combining trips and going easier on the throttle a couple of years ago. I'm averaging about 11k per year on my car and at least 7k of that is commuting.
The biggest change that I could make would be to start carpooling. However, I really don't want to lose the flexibility of coming in and leaving on my schedule as opposed to when the carpool is scheduled.
At least I'm averaging 24-25MPG so the gas isn't too painful.
That $4.38 figure was probably just the average response of the people surveyed. Some people probably said $3.50 and others said $5.00.
But the thing to remember is that if there is excess demand over supply right now it is only by a few percent. That is determined by how fast the inventory is changing compared to the usage. So if all we need do is reduce usage say 2%, you only need the people who change their behavior around the $3.50 - $3.60 area to reduce their driving some.
So it is an incorrect conclusion to assume (as I initially did when I heard the report) that there will be no decrease in consumer-demand until $4.38. I'm sure some people who were finacially strapped have made cuts already.
I wish I was averaging that kind of mileage! My main source of transportation for the past year has been a 1985 Chevy Silverado with a 305-4bbl, that gets maybe 11-12 in local driving, and if I really baby it, I might, MIGHT break 16 on the highway! But I just checked my mileage log, and over the past year it's only gone about 4900 miles.
I also live about 3 1/2 miles from work, and that's a real killer on fuel economy, because in cooler weather, the vehicle's often not even fully warmed up by the time I get to the job!
I tried to talk them into letting me telecommute a day or two per week, but they wouldn't hear of it. I even tried to argue that most of what I do, can be done remotely on the computer, and if they really needed to meet me, face-to-face, I could be there in 10-15 minutes. Unfortunately, it didn't fly with them.
Crony capitalist perhaps? Or maybe some inheritance?
Admire it or not, Les Schwaub was not alone in his productive years. He started out as an orphan and look what he accomplished without capitalist cronies or any inheritance.
Col. Sanders did very well on his own as have many others.
Yep, there have been many fortunes built by self-made men. And even more built through other means. You seem like a wealthy individual, or at least an elitist attitude, and that usually isn't had by the self-made man. Let's see the economic consequences of diverting so much money from other recipients into corporate-welfare-guzzling big oil. We're on thin ice as it is.
I see Les Schwab died...pretty old, but still...my family often patronized his company, and I remember his ads from when I was a kid.
Don't tell me about Dr. Pepper...and not to get back on topic, but one reason most folks don't change at $3 is because it's not 'high' in the overall scheme of things. No economic analysis besides that survey and the continued high volume of gas sales needed - $3 doesn't hurt 'enough' to make people change.
You sound like a possible candidate for a Segway......
Is there sidewalk between your home and your work?
For that 3.5 miles, a Segway would be great for commuting.
Nah, unfortunately my short commute to and from work isn't very bicycle/pedestrian/Segway friendly. The first half-mile is on my home street, but then I make a right turn onto a 4-lane divided road with a 45 mph speed limit, lots of cross streets, and plenty of traffic. I'm on that road for about 2 1/2 miles, and then turn into my job. Also, that 4-lane road goes through a couple of rough neighborhoods. Two apartment complexes full of crack and other drugs. A comercial zone that's mostly empty because of said apartment complexes. And a Shell station and a little plaza with a 7-Eleven that get robbed on a regular basis. It's actually not so bad during the daytime, but there are a lot of times when I have to pull some last-minute OT that sometimes means I'm coming home after dark.
So, if the psycho drivers didn't get me during regular hours, the bullets just might after dark! :surprise:
Seriously, if I thought it were safe to do so, I'd ride my bike to work on nice days. There are a few people at my job that do. Unfortunately, somebody who works at my job (different project, so I didn't know her) got hit on their bike last year by an SUV, and was killed.
I could probably walk it in about an hour. Probably safer than biking it, as, IMO at least, it's easier to dodge a car on foot than on a bike. Dunno about the stray bullets though. :shades:
the last time I rode a bike. I think it was back before they started this newfangled safety kick about unheard-of things like helmets and stuff! :P
Actually, it wasn't THAT long ago...but probably 3-4 years, at least. There's a trail near my house, that was built on an old electric commuter rail right-of-way that ran between DC and Baltimore. I've walked it a few times, and ridden on it once or twice. And, I have to admit, driven on it a few times.
Unfortunately though, it doesn't actually GO anywhere useful. Going towards DC, it just ends at a 6-lane divided road that takes over the old right-of-way. And going towards Baltimore, it ends at the Patuxent River, where you can stop, look across the river, and still see the old bridge abutments from the defunct railroad. So it's basically 5.9 miles of nothing. Cool thing about it though, is that it's not really that accessible by the public, as it doesn't go by any parking lots, etc. So it's great for us locals to ride on or whatever, but it never gets all that crowded.
I'll have to ride it from end to end sometime, and see how long it takes me. My roommate, on his days off, will ride it sometimes, and he usually does the whole thing (plus the distance from the house, which is maybe 1/4 mile) in about an hour. So I figure he's averaging about 12.3 mph.
150 mi daily RT all at about 60 mph. Thus after Katrina I bought a Prius ( 48 mpg average after 18 mo's and 45000 mi ). The difference between $2 Gas and $3 gas is $12 per week. It's significant but not a major obstacle.
Over the last 30 yrs I've never lived and worked in the same state at the same time. Somehow I don't think I got this home/commute/work relationship correct. 3 mi from work? Ridiculous concept.
I'd like to know exactly what I am getting for transportation when I buy a car, in terms of mpg. Usually they say "They sticker says 21mpg in city, but in reality you will get anywhere between 15 and 23, depending on your driving style, load and wind conditions, etc". Here's a proposal:
We fill up the tank, take the car out on a fixed route (10mi or so) for test drive on a sunny and windless day, and refill to measure the mpg. We could use some other machine to measure it, too. Lets say the negotiated price is $20,000. The cost becomes $100 more for every additional 0.1 mpg, or $100 less for every every 0.1 mpg less than 21. So, if the tested mpg is 18, we deduct (21-18)*10*100 = $3000 from the price. If it is 22, we add (22-21)*10*100 = $1000 to the price. Is this doable, in your opinion?
One of my pet peeves in car buying is that the auto maker will not tell you what the mpg of a particular vehicle is, under standard (whatever they define as standard) driving conditions, and put their money where their mouth is. This info would help me a lot in decision making and budgeting how much I want to spend. This is more important as the gas prices go up.
This is how electronic components are "binned". From the same line, a CPU getting 2.5GHz might sell for $900, and one with 2.2GHz for $700. The ones operating at 1.5GHz ends up in somebody's key chain. Why can't the auto makers do the same thing with mpg of individual cars? Is mpg, a major factor in determining the operating cost of a vehicle, so difficult or expensive to measure?
It's not getting up to 15 that's the problem. It's maintaining it for a number of miles that's the problem. I'm talking re the poster that stated he was out of shape,obese, and had no recent riding.
Over the last 30 yrs I've never lived and worked in the same state at the same time. Somehow I don't think I got this home/commute/work relationship correct. 3 mi from work? Ridiculous concept.
I live five blocks from work :P . I still drive it because I'm too lazy to get up in time to walk it; but if gas gets up to $4.00, I just might get up early enough.
If you could con a Toyota dealer into that with a Prius you would probably get it for free. It would be lucky to get 30 MPG on a short trip. And it is rated at 55 MPG combined. That would be a $25,000 discount.
Not to get this whole thing going again. They EPA sets the criteria for the Automaker. So the test is flawed and the automakers love it because it usually looks better on paper than on the road.
So... the conclusion is that it is not possible to define a test condition and test/publish mileage for individual vehicles with any accuracy? And we send rovers to roam the Mars!
You are right, there will be statistical variation from car to car. All I am saying is that the car with higher mpg should fetch more money to the manufacturer, compared to the one sitting next to it on the lot.
So... the conclusion is that it is not possible to define a test condition and test/publish mileage for individual vehicles with any accuracy?
Not unless you can define a standard driver. Some people hot dog the gas pedal all day long, while others like to egg-foot it and get notably better mileage doing so.
just figured today that my gas at $3.50 a gallon is $235 a month for going to work only. The car I drive is paid for and done depreciating and is the biggest 2 door coupe that can be had, weighing 3650 lbs empty. When I took the job so far away 3+ years ago, It was $115 a month for gas. On the other hand, I just checked and found a new Civic to be $21500 with tax and that is about $475 a month for 48 month loan and it would still be almost $200 a month just for gas for it, and my excise taxes would go up by $300 a year and my insurance would go up another couple hundred a year. $4 gas won't change things by much, being a 12% increase. The best answer is to move closer to work. That could reduce miles driven by 70%.
Harlan was a private born in Indiana but he lived (and died) in Kentucky. You have to be careful what you say about him, lest you bear the Curse of the Colonel.
I saw him in a parade in St. Pete back in 1968, when gas was around 35.9.
Not unless you can define a standard driver. Some people hot dog the gas pedal all day long, while others like to egg-foot it and get notably better mileage doing so.
Why is this mileage estimate so important? The numbers should be used as a reference when comparing vehicles. A car rated at 35 mpg will get better mileage than one rated at 25 mpg regardless of who is driving it.
However, I've got to believe that the highway estimates are at least pretty close. I mean if you drive at a constant 70 mph how much variation can there be from one driver to the next. I've been able to achieve or slightly excede the highway rating for every car that I've owned and I typically drive 9 mph above whatever limit is posted. Consumer Reports performs a fairly controlled test for determining a mileage estimate. They seem to typically achieve the highway rating but come up short in city driving. That was the case for the Prius.
The Prius is a good example of what is wrong with having EPA ratings on a car. It is very misleading. Let the manufacturers rate them according to some preset real world formula. Then when the customers cannot achieve the posted ratings they can go after the manufacturer. All the EPA does is protect big business from being accountable. If the government is going to certify a rating the least they should do is test a production model or hire a third party to test these models. There is little verification by the EPA when they put their stamp of approval on these ratings.
If $4 gas becomes reality, these ratings will become more significant. I want to see the responsibility dumped on the manufacturer. No more hiding behind the government skirts.
The leeway given should cover all drivers. Yet I drive like a grandpa and can barely get the 15 MPG considered the lowest city rating. If I drove like the average driver around me on the highway I would be lucky to get 12 MPG. The best highway tank I have gotten is 18.83 MPG.
Comments
Now what if Exxon-Mobil offered people a contract to pre-pay for 500 gal. at today's price (+$0.10/gal). How many of you would bite? Anyone think this will eventually happen? They already have the technology with the Speedpass.
****
Except - the Fed doesn't do that anymore. They let them merge and do whatever they want at this point.
Monopolies and predatory behavior are outlawed in the U.S. I'm not talking about competition, but practices that strive to engage in things like price-fixing, selling for under your cost, paying off officials, and so on. The worst of the worst behavior that arises when Capatalism turns into a free-for-all system closer to something you would find in a Feudal society. One where the exploited peasants have no power or say in what they pay for goods and services anymore. Competition is dead, innovation rarely happens, and prices are what the local Lord decides they are.
Some people here really need to read a history book about the apalling things that happened a century ago. There are real reasons we have these laws in place.
Michigan is always high, at least compared to OH, PA, VA, KY, and TN (where I do most of my traveling).
E85 -- Iowa and Minnesota
All the more ironic since AAA has lobbied long and hard against public transit and bike paths in favor of more roads during their entire existence.
I almost filled up today but I try to wait a full calendar month between tanks and my Subaru isn't quite on empty yet. :shades:
me: I know for sure 1 of those 3 is not illegal and uncommon - "selling for under your cost". Anytime a company loses money it is selling for under its cost!
But the laws are never consistent - it always depends on the industry, product, or state. Was it Wis. that has a minimum price on gas? That seems like an anti-consumer, anti-free-market law to me. Other states of similar size seem to be avoiding chaos without it.
People will change their driving habits when gas is a dollar more than whatever it happens to be at the moment. (Although change will happen at some point out of economic necessity.)
Wish I had those leg muscles though.
I do wear a helmet however, and I have a rear view mirror.
MrShiftright
Just Visiting
Yeah, I know Wisconsin has a law that says you can't sell gas for a loss. Heck, NJ has some sort of minimum over cost. They also won't let you pump your own, won't let you give away anything for filling up or basically have any kind of thing that effectively lowers the price...
I'm sure these types of people are in the minority, but I pretty much cut out a lot of unnecessary driving and went easier on the throttle a couple years ago. So there's really not much more I can do, short of buying a more efficient vehicle, and with the relatively few miles I drive per year, that's probably not going to happen anytime soon. It'll happen if and when one of the vehicles wears out and needs to be replaced, but it's not going to happen just for the sole purpose of improving fuel economy.
The biggest change that I could make would be to start carpooling. However, I really don't want to lose the flexibility of coming in and leaving on my schedule as opposed to when the carpool is scheduled.
At least I'm averaging 24-25MPG so the gas isn't too painful.
But the thing to remember is that if there is excess demand over supply right now it is only by a few percent. That is determined by how fast the inventory is changing compared to the usage. So if all we need do is reduce usage say 2%, you only need the people who change their behavior around the $3.50 - $3.60 area to reduce their driving some.
So it is an incorrect conclusion to assume (as I initially did when I heard the report) that there will be no decrease in consumer-demand until $4.38. I'm sure some people who were finacially strapped have made cuts already.
I also live about 3 1/2 miles from work, and that's a real killer on fuel economy, because in cooler weather, the vehicle's often not even fully warmed up by the time I get to the job!
I tried to talk them into letting me telecommute a day or two per week, but they wouldn't hear of it. I even tried to argue that most of what I do, can be done remotely on the computer, and if they really needed to meet me, face-to-face, I could be there in 10-15 minutes. Unfortunately, it didn't fly with them.
Admire it or not, Les Schwaub was not alone in his productive years. He started out as an orphan and look what he accomplished without capitalist cronies or any inheritance.
Col. Sanders did very well on his own as have many others.
I see Les Schwab died...pretty old, but still...my family often patronized his company, and I remember his ads from when I was a kid.
Is there sidewalk between your home and your work?
For that 3.5 miles, a Segway would be great for commuting.
Is there sidewalk between your home and your work?
For that 3.5 miles, a Segway would be great for commuting.
Nah, unfortunately my short commute to and from work isn't very bicycle/pedestrian/Segway friendly. The first half-mile is on my home street, but then I make a right turn onto a 4-lane divided road with a 45 mph speed limit, lots of cross streets, and plenty of traffic. I'm on that road for about 2 1/2 miles, and then turn into my job. Also, that 4-lane road goes through a couple of rough neighborhoods. Two apartment complexes full of crack and other drugs. A comercial zone that's mostly empty because of said apartment complexes. And a Shell station and a little plaza with a 7-Eleven that get robbed on a regular basis. It's actually not so bad during the daytime, but there are a lot of times when I have to pull some last-minute OT that sometimes means I'm coming home after dark.
So, if the psycho drivers didn't get me during regular hours, the bullets just might after dark! :surprise:
Seriously, if I thought it were safe to do so, I'd ride my bike to work on nice days. There are a few people at my job that do. Unfortunately, somebody who works at my job (different project, so I didn't know her) got hit on their bike last year by an SUV, and was killed.
I could probably walk it in about an hour. Probably safer than biking it, as, IMO at least, it's easier to dodge a car on foot than on a bike. Dunno about the stray bullets though. :shades:
Actually, it wasn't THAT long ago...but probably 3-4 years, at least. There's a trail near my house, that was built on an old electric commuter rail right-of-way that ran between DC and Baltimore. I've walked it a few times, and ridden on it once or twice. And, I have to admit, driven on it a few times.
Unfortunately though, it doesn't actually GO anywhere useful. Going towards DC, it just ends at a 6-lane divided road that takes over the old right-of-way. And going towards Baltimore, it ends at the Patuxent River, where you can stop, look across the river, and still see the old bridge abutments from the defunct railroad. So it's basically 5.9 miles of nothing. Cool thing about it though, is that it's not really that accessible by the public, as it doesn't go by any parking lots, etc. So it's great for us locals to ride on or whatever, but it never gets all that crowded.
I'll have to ride it from end to end sometime, and see how long it takes me. My roommate, on his days off, will ride it sometimes, and he usually does the whole thing (plus the distance from the house, which is maybe 1/4 mile) in about an hour. So I figure he's averaging about 12.3 mph.
Over the last 30 yrs I've never lived and worked in the same state at the same time. Somehow I don't think I got this home/commute/work relationship correct. 3 mi from work? Ridiculous concept.
We fill up the tank, take the car out on a fixed route (10mi or so) for test drive on a sunny and windless day, and refill to measure the mpg. We could use some other machine to measure it, too. Lets say the negotiated price is $20,000. The cost becomes $100 more for every additional 0.1 mpg, or $100 less for every every 0.1 mpg less than 21. So, if the tested mpg is 18, we deduct (21-18)*10*100 = $3000 from the price. If it is 22, we add (22-21)*10*100 = $1000 to the price. Is this doable, in your opinion?
One of my pet peeves in car buying is that the auto maker will not tell you what the mpg of a particular vehicle is, under standard (whatever they define as standard) driving conditions, and put their money where their mouth is. This info would help me a lot in decision making and budgeting how much I want to spend. This is more important as the gas prices go up.
This is how electronic components are "binned". From the same line, a CPU getting 2.5GHz might sell for $900, and one with 2.2GHz for $700. The ones operating at 1.5GHz ends up in somebody's key chain. Why can't the auto makers do the same thing with mpg of individual cars? Is mpg, a major factor in determining the operating cost of a vehicle, so difficult or expensive to measure?
Best wishes, - MS.
I don't think 15 mph would be that hard on a bike.
MrShiftright
Visiting Host
I live five blocks from work :P . I still drive it because I'm too lazy to get up in time to walk it; but if gas gets up to $4.00, I just might get up early enough.
Not to get this whole thing going again. They EPA sets the criteria for the Automaker. So the test is flawed and the automakers love it because it usually looks better on paper than on the road.
You are right, there will be statistical variation from car to car. All I am saying is that the car with higher mpg should fetch more money to the manufacturer, compared to the one sitting next to it on the lot.
Not unless you can define a standard driver. Some people hot dog the gas pedal all day long, while others like to egg-foot it and get notably better mileage doing so.
People spending seventy eighty or a hundred grand don't care about gas mileage. Believe me I know.
Can't say if he was originally from Kentucky or not but he was indeed a Kentucky Colonel.
http://sos.ky.gov/executive/kentuckycolonels.htm
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I saw him in a parade in St. Pete back in 1968, when gas was around 35.9.
Why is this mileage estimate so important? The numbers should be used as a reference when comparing vehicles. A car rated at 35 mpg will get better mileage than one rated at 25 mpg regardless of who is driving it.
However, I've got to believe that the highway estimates are at least pretty close. I mean if you drive at a constant 70 mph how much variation can there be from one driver to the next. I've been able to achieve or slightly excede the highway rating for every car that I've owned and I typically drive 9 mph above whatever limit is posted. Consumer Reports performs a fairly controlled test for determining a mileage estimate. They seem to typically achieve the highway rating but come up short in city driving. That was the case for the Prius.
If $4 gas becomes reality, these ratings will become more significant. I want to see the responsibility dumped on the manufacturer. No more hiding behind the government skirts.
The leeway given should cover all drivers. Yet I drive like a grandpa and can barely get the 15 MPG considered the lowest city rating. If I drove like the average driver around me on the highway I would be lucky to get 12 MPG. The best highway tank I have gotten is 18.83 MPG.