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I am glad I got my 08 TL when I did, that car is just the prefect size in every dimension! I mean the new TL is just as long as the RL and I think actually the TL is bigger than the RL in width
For me the TL (I have an '05) is still too big. I really liked the previous TSX but they bloated that one up, too.
My prediction is that the next Accord will get a bit smaller. With gas higher and the economy weak, they are making those decisions now.
The only Hondas I still find attractive are the Civic and the CRV.
My Mazda store is next to a Hyundai store, and on Saturday I had 2 people walk over after driving the new Sonata and were unimpressed. They said it drove very sloppy. The really funny thing is they both ended up buying a new Mazda6.
I was very shocked at their impressions of the new Sonata, especially after what I have read about it.
Bow down? Not so fast...
Trust me, the Mazda 6 and Altima ride and handle much better than the Sonata does in regards to better feedback and control! It all depends on what your looking for in a car! For some, the Sonata will fit the bill fine who are looking for a nice capable car but don't want that sporty nature or flare to it!
It may drive nice, but the problem is how do get it to stop.
the Fusion and Altima to the best job in the segment of finding just the right balance between a comfortable ride that gives you a little feedback, but not too much, while at the same time having a competent cornering and handling ability and response! the Mazda 6 has similar if not slightly better handling than the Fusion and Altima but the 6, at least I feel has too much of a firm/harsh ride compared to the Fusion and Altima! so all in all the Fusion and Altima do the best in regards to having the perfect ride/handling balance of their competition!
I would rank the mid-size category as follows for having the best and worst ride/handling balance!
Ride/Handling Balance
1) Fusion/Altima (the best balance)
2) Mazda 6 (less comfortable ride, great handling)
3) Sonata (in the middle of the pack in avg ride/handling)
4) Accord ( good ride, so-so handling at times)
5) Camry (best ride, lousy handling)
6) Malibu (so so ride, depending on model and not that great in handling)
If I decide to buy I'll take my chances. But thanks for the feedback.
1) Mazda6 - With the 2nd-gen's bigger size, it lost the BMW-crisp handling and responses, but IMO still the best in terms of overall handling. The ride can be harsh, but it's quite tolerable to me for a daily driver.
2) (tie)Fusion/Milan and Legacy - The best in terms of the delicate balance between ride and handling. Rides well, but doesn't fall over itself in the twisties.
3) Passat - Handling is very good except when really pushed, ride not as smooth as the Fusion.
4) Accord - used to be the best in terms of ride/handling, but the current-gen is porky, and while the ride is still very smooth, the handling just isn't as inspired as in models past.
5) Altima - my Jekyll & Hyde choice of the segment. The previous SE (and now SR) versions have excellent handling and a decent ride, but the S and SL sacrifices almost all it's handling for a smoother ride.
6) (tie)'10 Sonata and Malibu - "Just right" for the typical midsize driver, but too soft in overall handling to put a smile on my face.
7) Camry - Best replacement for Ambien or Lunesta that's on 4 wheels today. Used to be as bad as a Buick, but with the expected new Regal, even Buick could surpass it in handling/ride.
I'm assuming this is meant as as a very postive comment.
You have to be kidding? Buying a 2010 Toyota is definitely putting your life and those possibly around you on the road, at risk.
According to Consumer Reports? That sure isn't saying much. :confuse:
It's clear that Hyundai is leaving no stone unturned in its quest to dominate the segment in every category, both objective and subjective. When it comes to size, dynamics, fuel economy, power, equipment and price, Hyundai has brought a howitzer to a gunfight.
2. Fusion
3. Accord
4. Altima
5. Camry/Malibu
...which proves nothing.
I rather take impressions from my own eyes and ears, and be able to test one out for myself instead of relying on somebody else to tell me whats the "best".
Besides, what's a "benchmark" for one "expert" is a near-miss to another one, and a failure to a third. Again, proving nothing.
I'll call it a "benchmark" when I take one out for a test-drive... Oh, wait. No V6? Oh...
2011 Hyundai Sonata(that's me crossing it off my list)While the acceleration thing isn't good, it amazes me how crazy everyone is going about this, but look at how people drive anyways and how many accidents, injuries, and deaths are caused by bad & stupid driving vs the acceleration thing, and it makes you wonder about people in general... So anyways, look at the wacked out drivers you and your family are exposed to every time you get on the road (and maybe how we drive ourselves sometimes, for those not afraid to look in the 'mirror'), you're taking your life into your hands already.
I own a Toyota, Nissan, and Mazda, and I would not hesitate buying a car from any of these companies again. For those of you who are "afraid to death" to drive your Toyota and are not happy with the current Toyota solution, please trade your Toyota in for another different brand.
Thank goodness for the Japanese car companies to provide competition against GM/Ford/Chrysler back in the 80's, if not we would still be driving [non-permissible content removed] American cars now. I would still be driving cars like my POS 1980 Pontiac Sunbird coupe that I have to bring to my mechanic at least every other month for repairs.
genesis v8 17/25
just sayin.
anyway, mazda is too sporty and it's ride is bit harsh to be a true contender in this segment. and mazda's real problem is the MPG rating.
after all hyundai wants to take over the world with sonata. i'm sure they could have sacrificed mpg like mazda and build a super sporty midsize sedan,but instead hyundai built a well balanced camry & accord beater.
again, when you want to be the top dawg, you gotta beat the top dawg which is camry and accord. . mazda6 is an after thought. it's like suzuki kizashi. i bet kizashi handles better than mazda6. but hyundai didn't even bother to include them in the press.
anyway 9 out of 10 camry buyers don't care about handling. handing is an after thought in the midsize battle field.
It's not a "standard", it's an OPINION.
anyway 9 out of 10 camry buyers don't care about handling. handing is an after thought in the midsize battle field.
Actually, I'll bet it's more like 8 out of 10, and I'm proud to be that one or two that do. Especially when it's a DD and I can't afford/want a sports car that's great for weekends but impractical the other 5 days of the week.
News flash: A turbocharged 4-cylinder will NOT get 35 MPG, especially when you're trying to keep up with the V6 crowd. You'll probably be paying another 30 cents/gallon for premium fuel as well, when the V6 "fatties" from Ford, Mazda, Chevy, Honda, Toyota, etc. do not.
Sorry, but as far as I'm concerned (read:opinion), I'll take the V6.
I wonder how many know that V8 engines in the early 50s had less HP than the modern I4s.The flat head ford V8 had only about 110 HP, and even the more advanced Rocket Olds engine was around 160.That pulling an Olds 98 Convertible that weighed 5200 lbs.Sorry....I digress.Just some early morning musings by an old man.No offense intended.
To me, I like to have a little fun when I'm driving, even a 4-door sedan. If I want to take an onramp with a little more speed, I'd like to know that the car I'm driving will help me out. As for V6, it's purely a preference. I haven't heard/felt a 4-cylinder that's smoother than a V6, and the extra acceleration when passing on a two-lane or merging with 80-MPH traffic is nice.
I can understand the fuel economy argument, but with me, it's a wash. I average 24-26 MPG with my Mazda6 V6, with highway drives hitting 30 MPG. My previous car was a Grand Am with a 4-cylinder, and I averaged the same mileage. Yup, the same. Even when driving my wife's Altima 2.5S, I average about 27 MPG.
I understand the argument from some saying that it's "only" a 4-door family sedan, but what's the problem of having your cake and eating it too?
Well stated, and absolutely true in my case.
Correct, and I'd like to add my snowblower has more hp than some of the early 19th century V12s, and is more fun to drive. :shades
When you switch cars it is very noticeable. That vagueness was very annoying to me when I had an Optima for a week long rental...it was like "am I turning , yet?". Then when I got home and got in my Mazda6 I had to be careful driving home, even in changing lanes on the freeway, as I had gotten used to that vagueness and had to remember to not "oversteer".
I learned my lesson and on our next trip, turned down the free "upgrade" to a midsize Kia and took a Mazda3.
Something seems fishy about their EPA estimates to me. 22 mpg in the city? That's 13 mpg less than the highway rating (they only list the NA I4 on the Hyundai site, no turbo which I agree is bound to be rated much lower). I suspect that the tranny is geared pretty high for highway cruising thus resulting in a much higher hwy rating. If that's the case owners better drive these things on some really flat highways or they won't see anything close to 35 mpg because the tranny will be shifting all over the place to climb hills or grades. The GMC Terrain and Chevy Equinox have exhibited the same behavior from their I4 models too.
I don't know about the vague steering on the Camry for the model I drove. While it wasn't BMW tight, it wasn't vague either.
I don't make 1.0g lateral turns either. But I do like to feel in control of the vehicle. Our Mazda handles better even than my Acura TL, which is wallowy in turns. Don't get me going about our minivan. Tight, precise steering and a planted car inspire confidence. Sort of like the difference between a good ball point pen and a cheap Bic. They both write. Some people probably don't care, just like in cars.
I think the TL handles decently, well you have an 05 I think and I have a 08 and I don't know if the steering what changed but except for extremely tight curves, where the TL I do agree slips a little bit, I think it handles pretty good, high subjective I know
mazda6 is rated at 17/25. same as genesis v8.
and hyundai is aiming for 35mpg for sonata turbo, but even if it comes little short, it would probably more economical than your mazda.
but i have a family, and i would rather sacrifice on handling so i can have a bigger, more luxurious, more economical ride over zoom-zoom. that's just me. sonata turbo will have a plenty of power and good MPG rating and most likely it will be my next car.
if you want all arounder, you can't go wrong with Sonata, Fusion, Accord, and Altima.
take a test drive and buy the one you like. my 2 cents.
Don't assume that because it has a turbo that you need premium gas, and it will get fewer MPG, that isn't true anymore with today's technology. I own an Flex SEL Ecoboost, I am getting over 19 MPG in it and I don't even have 1000 miles on it yet. It is getting better MPG than the Veracruz that didn't have a turbo and 100 less HP! 10 years ago an engine like this would be lucky to get 12 MPG on the highway, yet today they can get 24. Isn't technology great!!
What is today's technology? An engine doesn't magically know the fuel octane rating. If it knocks and the knock sensors pick it up it adjusts the timing. If the engine is designed for regular fuel, premium is a waste. If it's designed for premium, and the knock sensors detect knock, the ecu adjusts the timing changes which effects performance and fuel economy.
For an I4 turbo to get 35 mpg on the highway there will be some tradeoffs in performance, what they are I'm sure will be made known as the car gets tested.
There is no magic bullet for engine design, it's either designed for premium and run on regular, or not designed for premium in which case premium is a waste. If there are knock sensors, it's designed for premium.