"They added that “we do not take your patience for granted, and GM should know not to take the patience of your bargaining committee for granted either”. The negotiations cover about 80,000 workers and 432,000 retirees.
there is a strike there is still a strike. I learned that during my Boeing days. If you're a union member, even if you disagree with a strike decision, you go on strike.
And they're feeling like this is OK even with their sorry state of affairs as they are?
I thought GM was trying to control costs. Apparently that doesn't apply to the rank and file of GM, just management. Sounds like a strike situation, huh? :surprise:
brentwood: I agree with you. I don't see anyone supporting the union on this one. I guess they don't realize how bad the situation is for GM. If they are not willing to make concessions, GM will have to file for bankruptcy. GM cannot continue with a $2500 deficit per car and successfully compete against Toyota.
The annual car sales are dropping each year so you can't count on years like 2000 or 2001 anymore. Couple that with GM declining market share both consumer driven and GM driven (reduce sales to fleet and rentals). GM does not have a competitive fuel efficient car to battle the Civic and Corolla that they can sell to individuals so they must discount their cars to move them whhich in turn eliminates profits on these cars. Fewer people buying pickups and SUVs means less profit from these mainstays. I can come up with a few more that spells doomsdays for GM if this strike continues. The good news is their market share in China is increasing.
Maybe the UAW can start giving their constituents Chinese lessons since that is where their jobs will be going.
I didn't think either side would be so reckless and self-destructive as to allow this to happen. Maybe their acronyms should stand for something other than GM and UAW.
Most of you have absolutely no clue or idea of what went on in the negotiating room and are making absurd accusations based off of your local yellow belly new journalist with the hot lead story on this otherwise boring monday. :confuse:
I knew if the UAW, went on strike just what this forum would look like. It's laughable. Some of the same people that laugh at me for my pie in the sky car predictions from GM, are being as foolish as me. Well almost !
I will say I support the strike and yes I did hear Ron Gettelfinger speak not through second hand accounts but live. I will give you the oppertunity to hear it from the horses mouth via our local news.....
I am a strong Union advocate. I cannot see anything they have to gain by striking. We have gone over a year without a contract and did not strike. Eventually we would work out a deal. They could end up like the 85,000 grocery clerks in So CAL. Out on the street for months, only to take what the company offered in the end. If we start to see cargo ships full of GM vehicles coming in from China don't be surprised. Mexico and Canada already make a lot of the trucks and SUVs.
We have gone over a year without a contract and did not strike.
They also didn't make the money or had the job security you had either. It wasn't like your company could outsource or move your oil to a foreign country.
Likewise. I love GM cars with the white-hot passion of a thousand suns and I most definately care about the Americans who build them, but can't see what either side has to gain from a strike. However, there is a LOT to lose.
GM could choose to build all its cars in China which will instantly lose me and many others as customers.
UAW workers will find themselves out of a job.
GM might use this strike as an opportunity to bust the union once and for all.
Import fanboys will use this strike as yet another reason to bash GM and the UAW.
The media will use this strike as yet another reason to bash GM and the UAW.
The problems facing GM and others go way beyond just Labor vs. Management. The United States government, American business and the American people MUST do something to reel in the psychopathic rise in health care costs.
Until we as a nation go on "strike" against the greed and corruption that surrounds this capitalist society we will continue to fall in decline. The average working middle class slob is making less than he did in year 2000 today.
Until this nation fights against unfair trade, currency manipulation, health care costs, energy prices, etc, I'm afraid their is no hope until we hit rock bottom. We can't compete with the Chinese, in the manufactoring of low cost goods. Manufactoring still accounts for 26% of the jobs and once we take that away we are sure going to have a lot of really poor folks and every town and city will be like Killadelphia, I'm afraid
In 1985 our manager pulled a quick one on us that cost about $20k per year in wages. We were in the middle of a 3 year contract and had a no strike clause. Sometimes you have to take a cut if the money is not there. If GM can move overseas and just bite the bullet on paying retirees what is required by law, they may do it. GM needs to make money to keep factories in the USA. The UAW has to accept that. If these strikes are wildcat strikes not authorized by the UAW president, I would lock the doors and move the operation. In my experience, wildcat strikes were usually perpetrated by deadbeat Union members looking to protect their featherbedding operations.
I feel for the working guy that is willing wait out the negotiations to a reasonable settlement. Wildcatters will get little sympathy from the American public.
We, as the nation's workers, should go on one massive general strike, but I'm afraid that'll never happen. Too many idiots are too busy discussing what the Eagles did this weekend or are worried about what hack will go onto the next round on "American Idol" to worry about the things about which they should be concerned.
Please.. put that bottle of Kool-Aid down, someone put something in it.
Tell me one thing that the UAW or GM stand to gain from a strike? The last time that America's most foolish Union pulled off a big strike, guess what happened?
It cost them thousands of jobs in the long run.
The UAW just loves to shoot itself in the foot, don't they? Let's say they go on strike for a month.. or even 2 weeks.. and cost GM billions of dollars. "Woo-Hoo, power to the workers, we showed GM, Yay!"
Yeah, yay all right. Now they want job guarantees? After they cost the company the equivalent of the development budget of a new model? I can't comprehend stupidity of this magnitude.. I just can't.
Whoever called the UAW a cancer that was killing its' host was right.
Until we as a nation go on "strike" against the greed and corruption that surrounds this capitalist society
It is not going to happen. Most people are happy with the economy. Health care is a big issue. It will not go away just because we get someone in office that thinks the government knows something about health care. Just look at the fraud in the Medicare system to see what would happen if Uncle Sam took over.
Hopefully the UAW will not push the wrong button and put another 73k workers out on the street. It is their call to strike or negotiate. Once they walk out the door it becomes managements call. Who do you want in control of the situation?
the goofy decision make by the rank and file SPEEA union members to turn down the 2nd offer to the members from the Company.
They continued on strike and took the next offer(after another 18 days of striking!)and humm...funny thing...it offered less overall dollars when you factored in health care costs and some other costs.
And what's more the rank and file actually deluded theirselves in to thinking they did right by themselves by staying out. Bunch a dorks, man.
This will hurt GM as much or more than the rank and file UAW members. Yikes. Can't believe they made this move.
Tell me one thing that the UAW or GM stand to gain from a strike?
Eventually "Job Security" for the UAW. GM, obviously thinks they will gain more concessions and can right now use up a month supply of vehicles to sell without paying workers. So it's actually a small win for GM, at this point.
...diabolical enough to hire scab workers after a month's worth of inventory has been sold? Maybe I better buy my GM car now before they're slapped together by unskilled workers or months later by disgruntled UAW workers. I'm sure the union workers at Ford and Chrysler are keeping a good eye on what's happening.
Do they have fresh Foghat to listen to whilst striking? I sure hope so!
Fire up the old burn barrels! It's heading towards fall and the weather'll be turning before long!
Crank it up, order some pizza's and Vault soda's..this one sounds like it might take a while to settle. Although it does slam up against all logic they actually voted to walk out. Eeekers!
Tell me they did hold a good 'ole democratic vote before they subjected every member to this?
You will not see scabs slapping vehicles togeather at GM, pal. I'm sure the UAW, workers rigged the machines where only they know how to get em' to work again to prevent that from happening.
Speaking from personal experience of striking I think the union holds the keys once they are out.
You need to talk to some of the 80k grocery store clerks that made that mistake. Management locked them out and started hiring non-union people paying them more per hour than the Union people. The stores lost some customers such as myself. But in the long haul they got rid of job security and stretched out the wage scale. I have friends that lost retirement benefits and wages on that stupid strike. Once you walk management is free to do as they please. With all the people that lost jobs in the Midwest don't you think they could find workers that are experienced willing to come back without the Union?
That is my prediction now that the UAW made the first move.
Funny you should mention that. I listened to a radio show survey where they asked for names. One Democrat & Republican candidate for President and an American Idol winner. No one got a Republican candidate. One person knew about Hillary. and several got winners from American Idol.
That says a lot about our country...
Rocky is going to have to strike on his own. I ain't striking for the losers I see walking our streets.
Well they might find skilled workers but be prepared for a violent demostration like unseen in this nation since the 1930's. If these group of workers are anything like those my father worked with they rigged the machines and the skilled trades rigged the plant in preperation of a strike to further aide job security. The electricians, I know were really good at rigging the plant to where they only knew how to reconnect everything once they got back. So what I'm saying is if you want to see violence then go cross the picket line.
I ain't striking for the losers I see walking our streets.
Perhaps you have a point gagrice. I hate talking bad about another american but facts well are facts. My generation X & Y have no loyalty and are all about pleasing "ME" :mad:
If I were in charge of GM I'd let them strike and start me some job fairs.
I can't see how you think that this will improve job security, costing a troubled corporation billions of dollars is generally not an intelligent way to ensure job security.
Perhaps you have a point gagrice. I hate talking bad about another american but facts well are facts. My generation X & Y have no loyalty and are all about pleasing "ME" :mad:
This whole mess was created long before Gen X & Gen Y were even conceived.
Hey, no doubt everyone wants a good paying secure job. What I don't understand is the sense of entitlement. It doesn't take a genuis to figure out that if an employer can't make money, they can't support jobs. GM's market share has been declining for decades. Selling less vehicles means you don't need as many employees period.
We can argue the pro/cons of open markets, free trade, who is cheating/who is not. The bottom line is GM needs to be flexible and productive.
No doubt I wouldn't want to be the president of the UAW. He's in an awful tough spot. The answers and solutions are certainly complicated.
We don't need everyone to strike, we need people to demand more U.S. made products. Hmm, lets look at the avg. UAW household and see how much they support US made goods. I'm sure many shop just like everyone else. Go to Wal-Mart/Sams club for groceries instead of their local grocery store that most likely is union, etc.
Talk before a strike is always tough. What you will do to keep a scab from taking your place. Bottom line, it is very unlikely, as it would be very easy to determine who sabotaged the equipment. Everyone thinks they will be vital to getting the company back up and running after the strike. They will get a big raise and the Union will be stronger. I think the UAW is making a big miscalculation on this strike.
Rocky, I truly respect your position but the reality is thisis not 1950, it's 2007 and we are in a global market. GM can no longer count on blind loyalty to sell cars. There is too much competition. The UAW wants job security....here's something for them..how will they feel when there is no GM to employ them?
Let's see. Declining sales, declining market share, plant closures, and the UAW wants to dictate that GM will guarantee their jobs and invest (foolishly) in plants. I can give another definition for UAW but I'm sure the folks at Edmunds won't approve.
Turns out this is all a ploy to trim GM's bloated inventories.
Other tidbits from the pundits (from the WSJ):
The UAW struck to soften its members to accept fewer benefits in a few weeks.
A 54 day strike (the length of the last one) would burn through 8 billion of GM's cash.
UAW's lead negotiator supposedly said " job-security issues led to the impasse between union and GM bargainers."
Obama offered his support to the UAW.
The CAW is separate from the UAW, but the CAW won't build cars in Canada with non-UAW parts intended to replace UAW made ones. The Canadian facility in Oshawa is slated to close tomorrow because of this stand.
I think Gettlefinger's hands are tied to a great extent. There needs to be concessions, but getting the union to vote on it in support of what the union leadership negotiates is a very difficult task. I think the strike is a reminder to the auto-workers what is at stake, and that you have to be careful what you ask for, if you're calling for a strike.
However, it's playing with dynamite - once the strike starts, as it has now, it can take on a life of its own.
workers do not have any RIGHT to a job, it is a privilege
"You will not see scabs slapping vehicles togeather at GM, pal. I'm sure the UAW, workers rigged the machines where only they know how to get em' to work again to prevent that from happening." Sorry, this is childish behavior, but I basically see the union workers as children, led by union bosses like the Pied Piper...
So, since they may lose their disagreement, they sabotage the plant...if this is what you call acceptable behavior, then I have as much respect for you as I do for the union worker, which is approaching whale dung on the bottom of the ocean...
The UAW lives in a bubble or a vacuum, take your pick...they know market share is decreasing, they know that every other US worker with health insurance pays deductibles and copays, often up to $1000, and they scream and yell because of some measly $50 or 100 deductible...as tho they claim divine right to everything for free...this is not the 1980s, but they act like it is...they are truly exhibiting the behavior and intelligence of a spoiled brat child...
I am rooting for GM to take the strike and bust the union, and then on to the Teamsters...to destroy the plant via sabotage is disgraceful...it all comes down to the attitude of entitlement, and the UAW is simply a bunch of welfare recipients in their mental attitude, "if I can't have it nobody will have it"...
This may cause even more people to look at imports because when you know the vehicle was made by disgruntled workers, the odds of a poorly made vehicle rise from only Mon and Fri to Mon thru Friday...
Even after they (assumedly) settle, one might be foolish to buy a union made vehicle for a year or two, simply because of how they work...
Nobody has a right to their job, everyone is expendable, and they need to see the light, or the competition will do it for them...
"I'm sure the UAW, workers rigged the machines where only they know how to get em' to work again to prevent that from happening."
That statement is enough for me never to purchase a GM car, or support a UAW employee again!
These folks don't have any understanding what kind of a job, and benefits, they currently have, as compared to the average, or above average for that matter, worker out there in "non-union" land. If they truly do such things, they all deserve to lose their jobs, and go make $6.00 an hour at some fast food restaurant.
Remember PATCO?? The Air Traffic Controllers union never thought the Reagan administration would fire them - they did, and the rest is history. Perhaps GM should do the same.
You will not see scabs slapping vehicles togeather at GM, pal. I'm sure the UAW, workers rigged the machines where only they know how to get em' to work again to prevent that from happening.
Very nice, Rocky. Damn those western superstictions, like property rights, rule of law, or just simple decency - lets just do whatever we feel like, as long it supports our agenda. Communists did that all the time - they called it "historical justice". Of course it had similar relationship to justice as electric chair to regular one. If anything goes, how about GM hiring thugs and start threatening workers and negotiations, like those old good times?
You really understand nothing from this world. I just really hope that you are unique and do not represent prevailing union attitude. If not, God help us all. Statement like this is enough for me to call for National Guard and never buy anything union-built again .
The Last Onslaught from Detroit began today at precisely 11:00 when the UAW walked out the door. I am not privy to the offers that Mr. Gettlefinger received from GM, and last I read some of what was on the table was pretty good. Many members of my family retired from "Mother Motors" and live comfortably on their early retirements. Gettlefinger wants at leas that for those who work at GM now. GM still has to take care of four workers for every one that is on the line and leaves GM with a minimum $1,539 cost per vehicle rolling off the lines.
GM at least has one advantage, its production volumes are holding steady and increasing in some markets to offset losses in others. It is not like Studebaker-Packard fighting a game on losing ground. However the reality is that only 22% if buyers give domestic labels a first crack and chance at a "buy", the remainder consider them second if at all. And the tide has shifted with Ford falling behind Toyota, and a renascent Chrysler fighting to gain shares and maintain its place.
I could never have ever beleived that half the market would fall to foreign labels when I was a kid in 1966 riding around in a VW Beetle to school during the week, and pushing my parents' friends MG's on the week-end! The first Toyota I ever rode in had comfortable seats but was a crude automobile otheriwse, sort of something I thought was made in Russia.
Now it's no joke. American plants close with domestic labels on them, while American plants open elsewhere with foreign brands upon them. Clearly, this is the beginning of the "Last Hurrah" from Detroit. A sad moment for America and Americans.
I never thought Plymouth and Oldsmobile would become merely residents of junk-yards. I could never imagine that in 1972-73 when Oldsmobile sold 1 Million cars that year...friends and relatives owned various 98's and Cutlasses. God knows I "ratted" around in a '65 Cutlass with a cousin in Dearborn...now only John Rock had the keys to the last Oldsmobile. Billy Durant and Alfred Sloan are spinning in their graves along with Henry Ford II---as he watches his nephew run Ford Motor into the blues forever.
But wait...The Dupont Family bailed out GM and appointed Sloan to save the company. Henry Ford II brought in the Whiz Kids with Tex Thorton and Robert McNamara to save Ford Motor. After the "Palace Revolution" Lee Iaccoca ralleyed a bankrupt and bereft Chrysler back to health.
So the game is now not over. But despite sanguine comments by Mr. Mulally, and strident raiding by Mr. Nardelli, and a long sleepless night ahead for Mr. Wagoner and Lutz, this truly is the begining of The last Onlaught From Detroit, as what happens on the bargaining table for GM will set the tone for the whole domestic industry. The competition will be eagerly awaiting the outcome.
offer to the UAW? Is there a supposed 14-day "cooling off period" as the lawyereeze would have it be said to kind of ease in to this nonsense? Then entertain another GM offer? Dunno. Do know that this strike is absolutely incredible and it does show the UAW's lack of awareness of the global market economy at work. Pass me over another cold one and turn up that Jason Isbell song, would you?
I do not know what the current cream of the crop UAW, workers did or didn't do. I was making an assumption. I do know in years past these types of things did happen since this country is the only 1st world country where striking workers don't have any rights protecting them from scabs and you gotta do what ya gotta do. :mad:
Ronald Reagan, yes broke up the air traffic controller strike and perhaps that is one reason why I disliked him so much ???? :mad: Trust me I wasn't crying the day he passed away.
Our attitude torwards working people in this country is at a all-time low. The rest of the worlds standard of living is going up while ours is in steady decline. The rich like GM executives are still getting richer via their outrageous salary and bonuses while many of us turn a blind eye to that and ask their fellow union man to not go out on strike and fight, but join them in being poorer. Our grandparents and great grandparents would be spinning in their graves if they could see how weak, brainwashed, and stupid, this country has become. Yes it makes me sick. :sick:
Comments
Our Moraine Plant has hard-working union people of the IUE/CAW.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
CAW=Canadian Auto Workers
I think we all knew what you meant to say.
My grandma was a big wig in the IUE.
-Rocky
--from FT.com
Each worker's output is covering retirement pay, healthcare, and other unlisted benefits for 5+ retirees.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
-Rocky
edit - TheStreet.com has a couple of paragraphs up. "Thus far, there were no other reports of work stoppages."
WLJY
Is it still a strike if no one knows for sure what is going on?
And they're feeling like this is OK even with their sorry state of affairs as they are?
I thought GM was trying to control costs. Apparently that doesn't apply to the rank and file of GM, just management. Sounds like a strike situation, huh? :surprise:
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
If GM plays this right they might just have a chance to bust the Union once and for all.
If you disagree with the decision, do you go on strike then picket the union hall?
The annual car sales are dropping each year so you can't count on years like 2000 or 2001 anymore. Couple that with GM declining market share both consumer driven and GM driven (reduce sales to fleet and rentals). GM does not have a competitive fuel efficient car to battle the Civic and Corolla that they can sell to individuals so they must discount their cars to move them whhich in turn eliminates profits on these cars. Fewer people buying pickups and SUVs means less profit from these mainstays. I can come up with a few more that spells doomsdays for GM if this strike continues. The good news is their market share in China is increasing.
Maybe the UAW can start giving their constituents Chinese lessons since that is where their jobs will be going.
GM = Gross Mismanagement
GM = Got Mine
GM = Good-bye Motown
UAW = Unemployed Auto Workers
UAW = Upcoming Associates of Wal~Mart
UAW = Unemployed Accepting Welfare
UAW = Usurping America's Workforce
I knew if the UAW, went on strike just what this forum would look like. It's laughable. Some of the same people that laugh at me for my pie in the sky car predictions from GM, are being as foolish as me. Well almost !
I will say I support the strike and yes I did hear Ron Gettelfinger speak not through second hand accounts but live. I will give you the oppertunity to hear it from the horses mouth via our local news.....
http://www.woodtv.com/Global/story.asp?S=7108810
-Rocky
They also didn't make the money or had the job security you had either. It wasn't like your company could outsource or move your oil to a foreign country.
-Rocky
GM could choose to build all its cars in China which will instantly lose me and many others as customers.
UAW workers will find themselves out of a job.
GM might use this strike as an opportunity to bust the union once and for all.
Import fanboys will use this strike as yet another reason to bash GM and the UAW.
The media will use this strike as yet another reason to bash GM and the UAW.
The problems facing GM and others go way beyond just Labor vs. Management. The United States government, American business and the American people MUST do something to reel in the psychopathic rise in health care costs.
Until we as a nation go on "strike" against the greed and corruption that surrounds this capitalist society we will continue to fall in decline. The average working middle class slob is making less than he did in year 2000 today.
Until this nation fights against unfair trade, currency manipulation, health care costs, energy prices, etc, I'm afraid their is no hope until we hit rock bottom. We can't compete with the Chinese, in the manufactoring of low cost goods. Manufactoring still accounts for 26% of the jobs and once we take that away we are sure going to have a lot of really poor folks and every town and city will be like Killadelphia, I'm afraid
-Rocky
I feel for the working guy that is willing wait out the negotiations to a reasonable settlement. Wildcatters will get little sympathy from the American public.
Please.. put that bottle of Kool-Aid down, someone put something in it.
Tell me one thing that the UAW or GM stand to gain from a strike? The last time that America's most foolish Union pulled off a big strike, guess what happened?
It cost them thousands of jobs in the long run.
The UAW just loves to shoot itself in the foot, don't they? Let's say they go on strike for a month.. or even 2 weeks.. and cost GM billions of dollars. "Woo-Hoo, power to the workers, we showed GM, Yay!"
Yeah, yay all right. Now they want job guarantees? After they cost the company the equivalent of the development budget of a new model? I can't comprehend stupidity of this magnitude.. I just can't.
Whoever called the UAW a cancer that was killing its' host was right.
It is not going to happen. Most people are happy with the economy. Health care is a big issue. It will not go away just because we get someone in office that thinks the government knows something about health care. Just look at the fraud in the Medicare system to see what would happen if Uncle Sam took over.
Hopefully the UAW will not push the wrong button and put another 73k workers out on the street. It is their call to strike or negotiate. Once they walk out the door it becomes managements call. Who do you want in control of the situation?
They continued on strike and took the next offer(after another 18 days of striking!)and humm...funny thing...it offered less overall dollars when you factored in health care costs and some other costs.
And what's more the rank and file actually deluded theirselves in to thinking they did right by themselves by staying out. Bunch a dorks, man.
This will hurt GM as much or more than the rank and file UAW members. Yikes. Can't believe they made this move.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
Eventually "Job Security" for the UAW. GM, obviously thinks they will gain more concessions and can right now use up a month supply of vehicles to sell without paying workers. So it's actually a small win for GM, at this point.
-Rocky
-Rocky
How do you figure ? :confuse:
Speaking from personal experience of striking I think the union holds the keys once they are out.
-Rocky
Do they have fresh Foghat to listen to whilst striking? I sure hope so!
Fire up the old burn barrels! It's heading towards fall and the weather'll be turning before long!
Crank it up, order some pizza's and Vault soda's..this one sounds like it might take a while to settle. Although it does slam up against all logic they actually voted to walk out. Eeekers!
Tell me they did hold a good 'ole democratic vote before they subjected every member to this?
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
You will not see scabs slapping vehicles togeather at GM, pal.
-Rocky
You need to talk to some of the 80k grocery store clerks that made that mistake. Management locked them out and started hiring non-union people paying them more per hour than the Union people. The stores lost some customers such as myself. But in the long haul they got rid of job security and stretched out the wage scale. I have friends that lost retirement benefits and wages on that stupid strike. Once you walk management is free to do as they please. With all the people that lost jobs in the Midwest don't you think they could find workers that are experienced willing to come back without the Union?
That is my prediction now that the UAW made the first move.
That says a lot about our country...
Rocky is going to have to strike on his own. I ain't striking for the losers I see walking our streets.
-Rocky
Perhaps you have a point gagrice. I hate talking bad about another american but facts well are facts. My generation X & Y have no loyalty and are all about pleasing "ME" :mad:
-Rocky
If I were in charge of GM I'd let them strike and start me some job fairs.
I can't see how you think that this will improve job security, costing a troubled corporation billions of dollars is generally not an intelligent way to ensure job security.
When I worked for UPS the only people that knew the equipment better then me were my boss and our flow control tech who were all management.
This whole mess was created long before Gen X & Gen Y were even conceived.
Hey, no doubt everyone wants a good paying secure job. What I don't understand is the sense of entitlement. It doesn't take a genuis to figure out that if an employer can't make money, they can't support jobs. GM's market share has been declining for decades. Selling less vehicles means you don't need as many employees period.
We can argue the pro/cons of open markets, free trade, who is cheating/who is not. The bottom line is GM needs to be flexible and productive.
No doubt I wouldn't want to be the president of the UAW. He's in an awful tough spot. The answers and solutions are certainly complicated.
We don't need everyone to strike, we need people to demand more U.S. made products. Hmm, lets look at the avg. UAW household and see how much they support US made goods. I'm sure many shop just like everyone else. Go to Wal-Mart/Sams club for groceries instead of their local grocery store that most likely is union, etc.
Let's see. Declining sales, declining market share, plant closures, and the UAW wants to dictate that GM will guarantee their jobs and invest (foolishly) in plants. I can give another definition for UAW but I'm sure the folks at Edmunds won't approve.
Other tidbits from the pundits (from the WSJ):
The UAW struck to soften its members to accept fewer benefits in a few weeks.
A 54 day strike (the length of the last one) would burn through 8 billion of GM's cash.
UAW's lead negotiator supposedly said " job-security issues led to the impasse between union and GM bargainers."
Obama offered his support to the UAW.
The CAW is separate from the UAW, but the CAW won't build cars in Canada with non-UAW parts intended to replace UAW made ones. The Canadian facility in Oshawa is slated to close tomorrow because of this stand.
However, it's playing with dynamite - once the strike starts, as it has now, it can take on a life of its own.
Hoping it settles soon.
No links this time?
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
"You will not see scabs slapping vehicles togeather at GM, pal. I'm sure the UAW, workers rigged the machines where only they know how to get em' to work again to prevent that from happening." Sorry, this is childish behavior, but I basically see the union workers as children, led by union bosses like the Pied Piper...
So, since they may lose their disagreement, they sabotage the plant...if this is what you call acceptable behavior, then I have as much respect for you as I do for the union worker, which is approaching whale dung on the bottom of the ocean...
The UAW lives in a bubble or a vacuum, take your pick...they know market share is decreasing, they know that every other US worker with health insurance pays deductibles and copays, often up to $1000, and they scream and yell because of some measly $50 or 100 deductible...as tho they claim divine right to everything for free...this is not the 1980s, but they act like it is...they are truly exhibiting the behavior and intelligence of a spoiled brat child...
I am rooting for GM to take the strike and bust the union, and then on to the Teamsters...to destroy the plant via sabotage is disgraceful...it all comes down to the attitude of entitlement, and the UAW is simply a bunch of welfare recipients in their mental attitude, "if I can't have it nobody will have it"...
This may cause even more people to look at imports because when you know the vehicle was made by disgruntled workers, the odds of a poorly made vehicle rise from only Mon and Fri to Mon thru Friday...
Even after they (assumedly) settle, one might be foolish to buy a union made vehicle for a year or two, simply because of how they work...
Nobody has a right to their job, everyone is expendable, and they need to see the light, or the competition will do it for them...
That statement is enough for me never to purchase a GM car, or support a UAW employee again!
These folks don't have any understanding what kind of a job, and benefits, they currently have, as compared to the average, or above average for that matter, worker out there in "non-union" land. If they truly do such things, they all deserve to lose their jobs, and go make $6.00 an hour at some fast food restaurant.
Remember PATCO?? The Air Traffic Controllers union never thought the Reagan administration would fire them - they did, and the rest is history. Perhaps GM should do the same.
You will not see scabs slapping vehicles togeather at GM, pal. I'm sure the UAW, workers rigged the machines where only they know how to get em' to work again to prevent that from happening.
Very nice, Rocky. Damn those western superstictions, like property rights, rule of law, or just simple decency - lets just do whatever we feel like, as long it supports our agenda. Communists did that all the time - they called it "historical justice". Of course it had similar relationship to justice as electric chair to regular one. If anything goes, how about GM hiring thugs and start threatening workers and negotiations, like those old good times?
You really understand nothing from this world. I just really hope that you are unique and do not represent prevailing union attitude. If not, God help us all. Statement like this is enough for me to call for National Guard and never buy anything union-built again
2018 430i Gran Coupe
Sure, but I don't think Murdock has made them all free yet. :shades:
Strike Notebook (Wall St. Journal)
GM at least has one advantage, its production volumes are holding steady and increasing in some markets to offset losses in others. It is not like Studebaker-Packard fighting a game on losing ground. However the reality is that only 22% if buyers give domestic labels a first crack and chance at a "buy", the remainder consider them second if at all. And the tide has shifted with Ford falling behind Toyota, and a renascent Chrysler fighting to gain shares and maintain its place.
I could never have ever beleived that half the market would fall to foreign labels when I was a kid in 1966 riding around in a VW Beetle to school during the week, and pushing my parents' friends MG's on the week-end! The first Toyota I ever rode in had comfortable seats but was a crude automobile otheriwse, sort of something I thought was made in Russia.
Now it's no joke. American plants close with domestic labels on them, while American plants open elsewhere with foreign brands upon them. Clearly, this is the beginning of the "Last Hurrah" from Detroit. A sad moment for America and Americans.
I never thought Plymouth and Oldsmobile would become merely residents of junk-yards. I could never imagine that in 1972-73 when Oldsmobile sold 1 Million cars that year...friends and relatives owned various 98's and Cutlasses. God knows I "ratted" around in a '65 Cutlass with a cousin in Dearborn...now only John Rock had the keys to the last Oldsmobile. Billy Durant and Alfred Sloan are spinning in their graves along with Henry Ford II---as he watches his nephew run Ford Motor into the blues forever.
But wait...The Dupont Family bailed out GM and appointed Sloan to save the company. Henry Ford II brought in the Whiz Kids with Tex Thorton and Robert McNamara to save Ford Motor. After the "Palace Revolution" Lee Iaccoca ralleyed a bankrupt and bereft Chrysler back to health.
So the game is now not over. But despite sanguine comments by Mr. Mulally, and strident raiding by Mr. Nardelli, and a long sleepless night ahead for Mr. Wagoner and Lutz, this truly is the begining of The last Onlaught From Detroit, as what happens on the bargaining table for GM will set the tone for the whole domestic industry. The competition will be eagerly awaiting the outcome.
DouglasR
(sources: WSJ, FT)
Dunno. Do know that this strike is absolutely incredible and it does show the UAW's lack of awareness of the global market economy at work. Pass me over another cold one and turn up that Jason Isbell song, would you?
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
Ronald Reagan, yes broke up the air traffic controller strike and perhaps that is one reason why I disliked him so much ???? :mad: Trust me I wasn't crying the day he passed away.
Our attitude torwards working people in this country is at a all-time low. The rest of the worlds standard of living is going up while ours is in steady decline. The rich like GM executives are still getting richer via their outrageous salary and bonuses while many of us turn a blind eye to that and ask their fellow union man to not go out on strike and fight, but join them in being poorer. Our grandparents and great grandparents would be spinning in their graves if they could see how weak, brainwashed, and stupid, this country has become. Yes it makes me sick. :sick:
-Rocky
Butting Heads