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Comments
-Rocky
-Rocky
So yeah Fintail, some dealers are better than others. Some are out to rip you off while others are fair.
-Rocky
so do not need pay 6.5% duty tax
canadian or mexico manuf cars are not listed:
Acura TL – Marysville, Ohio
BMW X5 – Spartanburg, South Carolina
BMW Z4 – Spartanburg, South Carolina
Honda Accord – Marysville, Ohio
Honda Civic – East Liberty, Ohio
Honda Element – East Liberty, Ohio
Honda Odyssey – Lincoln, Alabama
Honda Pilot – Lincoln, Alabama
Mercedes-Benz M-Class – Vance, Alabama
Mercedes-Benz R-Class – Vance, Alabama
Mazda 6 – Flat Rock, Michigan
Mazda B-Series – Minneapolis, Minnesota
Mazda Tribute – Kansas City, Missouri
Hyundai Sonata – Montgomery, Alabama
Hyundai Santa Fe – Montgomery, Alabama
Infiniti QX56 – Canton, Mississippi
Isuzu Ascender – Moraine, Ohio and Oklahoma City, Oklahoma
Isuzu i-Series Pickup – Shreveport, Louisiana
Mitsubishi Eclipse – Normal, Illinois
Mitsubishi Endeavor – Normal, Illinois
Mitsubishi Galant – Normal, Illinois
Mitsubishi Raider – Warren, Michigan
Nissan Altima – Smyrna, Tennessee and Canton, Mississippi
Nissan Armada – Canton, Mississippi
Nissan Frontier – Smyrna, Tennessee
Nissan Maxima – Smyrna, Tennessee
Nissan Pathfinder – Smyrna, Tennessee
Nissan Quest – Canton, Mississippi
Nissan Titan – Canton, Mississippi
Nissan Xterra – Smyrna, Tennessee
Saab 9-7X – Moraine, Ohio
Subaru Baja – Lafayette, Indiana
Subaru B9 Tribeca – Lafayette, Indiana
Subaru Legacy – Lafayette, Indiana
Subaru Outback – Lafayette, Indiana
Toyota Avalon – Georgetown, Kentucky
Toyota Camry – Georgetown, Kentucky
Toyota Camry Solara – Georgetown, Kentucky
Toyota Corolla – Fremont, California
Toyota Sequoia – Princeton, Indiana
Toyota Sienna – Princeton, Indiana
Toyota Tundra – Princeton, Indiana
Toyota Tacoma – Fremont, California
So you do have a choice of "Made in America" vehicles without worrying about shoddy UAW workmanship.
I have always said he was the lesser of two evils. I wasn't jumping for joy to see Barry, win tlong. I just never thought he would continue the Bush economic doctrine of more globalization. I don 't have any confidence that the republicans will put up anyone worth a hoot thus I can only hope someone respectable will run and be a 3rd party to teach the dems and repubs a lesson!!! :mad:
The thing about the UAW is that they HATE competition. They protect the incompetent and lazy among them. And they don't want any other car makers or countries to be better than us at something.
That is not true. Do you think they wouldn't love to organize every transplant in this country??? You are kidding yourself. The american people have drunk the import Kool-Aid, and if they could get them organized they have enough profitability to get the workers some decent benefits.
When the US was king and we out competed and were better than everybody else that was just fine. But now that others are catching up, capitalism sucks and how dare those companies be scheming to destroy a US industry!
I never thought that was fine. I as I said believe competition is good. The problem is that some are competing and winning because of unfair advantages that pertain to currency, trade, healthcare. That is when I have a problem with the current capitalistic scheme we have in place!!! :mad:
The UAW would like the shoddy GM/C/F products to be ok and patriots just keep buying. Put up a big fence against imports so that we can buy our own crappy cars while the rest of the world gets better stuff. There's another example of that - Castro in Cuba. They still drive US cars from the '60's down there. That's a great model for this country.
The competition helps make better products at cheaper prices for consumers. I am a strong believer in our Anti-Trust laws. It is a fact that having a level playing field free-market will yield the best results. However having just a few players as in a monopoly like we see in the software business has closed down better idea's. Just like the oil companies have squashed better technology for years because they posed a threat. :sick:
-Rocky
Mazda6
Volkswagen Routan
Suzuki XL7
Mitsubishi Endeavor
Mazda B-Series
Toyota Tacoma*
Toyota Corolla*
Mitsubishi Eclipse
Mitsubishi Eclipse Spyder
Mitsubishi Galant
http://www.uaw.org/uawmade/auto/2009/index.cfm
-Rocky
-Rocky
I want to say welcome to our forum and want to say thank-you pal for your post.
It really is nice seeing someone new "get" what a few of us have been saying regarding just how important organized labor is to the balance of power in this country. I don't think unions are perfect in every way but having many relatives that were members along with myself in the past I have been blessed to see what really goes on in the real world. Some of our fellow posters I'd like to call friends think the UAW, is a evil spirited organization despite all the "good" they have done that is well documented. I again want to thank-you and look forward to many more contributions by you to this forum.
-Rocky
-Rocky
So Toyota makes cars on US soil, with >80% US sourced parts, with US labor. They live by the same laws as GM, F, and C for those US cars. They cover their workers under the same healthcare system as GM, F, and C. Their cars are better, they (until very recently) were highly profitable. That looks like a level playing field to me. Meanwhile GM and C are dying from a financial perspective. What is the difference? The legacy of UAW benefits that have bankrupted 2 of 3 US automakers.
Tell me what the value is of the UAW when the US nameplates are dying and the quality of work is no better than the workers making Toyotas, BMWs, Hyundais, Hondas, etc. That is the competition you say you are in favor of.
-Rocky
-Rocky
History can repeat itself. If you push people to the edge of desperation they will do whatever it takes to survive. I would like to think we've learned from history's mistakes but perhaps I'm just to naive.
-Rocky
-Rocky
-Rocky
Verizon is still paying my mom's and FIL's health care costs, along with both spouses. They are in their mid-80's now, and the Verizon plan has been very generous to them. They were both, I believe, CWA, and my FIL was heavily involved in the union, even up until just a couple of years ago when his reduced mobility forced him to drop out.
I have no idea what Verizon's agreement with it's retirees says. Could be like my company's which states that the plan can be changed or terminated at any time at the convenience of the company.
Yeah, that's my mom and FIL.
NO, I did not say I felt sorry for the UAW. I said I feel sorry for the workers both UAW and Non-Union in the auto industry. They are being used as pawns by the UAW as well as a corrupt government. UAW workers are over paid sheep. They just follow their leaders down the garden path. I also hold GM management in contempt for allowing the UAW to destroy the US auto industry. Decades of bending over for the UAW has created the mess they are now dealing with. Blaming it on the banks is lame. Selling 17 million vehicles I would blame on the loose banking. GM having to sell so many cars and still lose money is a combination of corporate ignorance, think Wagoner, and UAW GREED....
Company A from Michigan competes against Company B from Georgia. The best company gets the customer. I'm all for that tlong. I'm for competition!
You should be happy then. The UAW claims they are paying the same as the Imports, $48 per hour. I think you have glossed over the intent of the persons comment. He was saying within the D3 workforce that UAW does NOT believe in competition. That means lug nut assembler A is doing a better job than lug nut assembler B, the better man should get more compensation. THE UNIONS, and the UAW in particular discourage individuals from excelling. I posted a good example and you ignored the facts as usual. THE UAW is not helping the D3 be competitve even when the playing field is level.
Ah, Rocky you were out campaigning for the guy. You thought he would buy you a new house, car and pay your utilities like all the other sheep. You will know the true intent when he sets up FEMA trailers in Michigan for all the out of work in the auto industry and hands out a portion of rice each day. You will have to catch your own snakes.
You posted many times that BO would CREATE jobs in Michigan. What jobs has the $800B stimulus plan created for Michigan? Where are all the highway jobs that was used to push the Stimulus package through without anyone getting to read it.
You’ve heard it here, there and everywhere in the news media – the time is now for a big-government economic stimulus package, not only to revive the economy, but to salvage America’s crumbling infrastructure.
That’s one of the selling points used over and over again by pundits, as they are paraded out repeatedly on broadcast and cable network news programs – that so-called “shovel-ready” projects will challenge economic woes by revitalizing something we need to do anyway. But only 3 percent of the Obama stimulus plan is slated for such projects.
The stimulus was not a PORK bill. It was Filet Mignon for the wealthy. Rocky if you are one of the lucky few that get a job operating a shovel, you will benefit from the stimulus. BO is on his World conquering tour. He would like to bring US into the Global family. All for one, One for all. Pass the rice if there is any left in the bowl.
This is what Unionization has done for America. It has made US a lazy bunch of workers. I include myself in that group. I just happen to be one of the lucky ones. The millions following me will not be so fortunate, including my children.
What percent of the models assembled in the USA are made of USA parts or North American parts--not just the window sticker number, but the real percentage. Don't include major parts assembled at a supplier set up by the company in the US to service them or parts just assembled of imported parts.
>about shoddy UAW workmanship.
I think we need to include shoddy parts and engineering and design there. I have sat in a few Camrys and Avalons that must have been built on Mondays after a long moonshine weekend if that's the assembler's fault.
The problem isn't shoddy UAW workmanship through the years, it's the excessively high overpayment for _some_ and company-destroying negotiations tactics, i.e., striking the Malibu assembly plant!!! But they showed GM (and the others) that they get what they want.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
The problem isn't shoddy UAW workmanship through the years, it's the excessively high overpayment for _some_ and company-destroying negotiations tactics, i.e., striking the Malibu assembly plant!!! But they showed GM (and the others) that they get what they want.
I am in agreement with you. I was not really planning on buying the Sequoia. If it did not have mostly US content and made in the USA I would have probably passed. I really don't like the looks of it. It is just a better vehicle than the 2005 GMC PU truck I sold and replaced. Both built in Indiana by I assume the same labor pool.
I don't blame the UAW workers for the cheapening of parts. I blame GM management and the UAW leadership for their decades of bleeding the life out of GM. It is a shell of its former self. With enough blame to go around.
I know many have blamed the imports. There is a 6.5% tariff on imports that I was not aware of. On a $20,000 Honda that is $1300 right into the US treasury. That should give GM enough of an edge to compete. Yet they cannot come up with a decent Civic or Fit fighter to compete.
I'm with you Gagrice. When shopping for new/used vehicles I shop domestic first and it I don't find what I like from them, I go elsewhere.
So Far, my 07 Expedition has been great. I've owned it 9 mos. and have already added over 20k miles w/o any issues. (did have a reflash for the transmission that fixed some minor shifting issues when I first bought it). I really like how it rides, drives, and tows our boat and camper. In comparison, my Suburban never went 10k miles w/o requiring serious repairs, so I'm happy so far. Granted the Expe is made in the good 'ole USA and Sub was made south of the border.
You posted many times that BO would CREATE jobs in Michigan. What jobs has the $800B stimulus plan created for Michigan? Where are all the highway jobs that was used to push the Stimulus package through without anyone getting to read it.
I do remember Rock posting about that. LOL
Unfortunately, the state is projected to lose another 200,000 jobs in 2009 alone as a result of restructuring in the manufacturing sector, she said.
Hence, the bottom line – like 12% unemployment in February – will continue to be grim.
But there are lots of stimulus-related opportunities, Granholm said -- at least 100 separately funded programs. She outlined the top 10 for the audience at the Cristo Rey Center, including:
• Tax cuts and tax breaks for parents and first-time home buyers.
• Extension of unemployment benefits to 72 weeks.
• Tax credits and grants for education and training.
• Assistance of up to $6,500 per household for home weatherization and energy saving.
• $2.2 billion statewide for schools and special education.
http://www.freep.com/article/20090326/NEWS06/90326092/
http://www.uaw.org/solidarity/09/0409/feature05.php
Regards,
OW
'21 Dark Blue/Black Audi A7 PHEV (mine); '22 White/Beige BMW X3 (hers); '20 Estoril Blue/Oyster BMW M240xi 'Vert (Ours, read: hers in 'vert weather; mine during Nor'easters...)
-Rocky
While Barry, isn't doing as good of a job as I'd like he was and still was the lesser of the two evils and I have no regrets campaigning for him as it kept McSame, out of the White House!!!
The stimulus was not a PORK bill. It was Filet Mignon for the wealthy. Rocky if you are one of the lucky few that get a job operating a shovel, you will benefit from the stimulus. BO is on his World conquering tour. He would like to bring US into the Global family. All for one, One for all. Pass the rice if there is any left in the bowl.
If you don't think McSame, was the same neocon globalist that Bush was gagrice, you are fooling yourself. We'd have the Korean Free Trade Agreement already signed to go along with a South American Free Trade Agreement. :mad:
Some of those shovel ready projects have hit the local news. If they hire in my area you can bet I will be applying for those jobs. Hopefully tomorrow I will know one way or another if I get sales job.
-Rocky
I know you might not understand this but the "Currency Manipulation" affect is $3-$12K thus let's just use a $20K Honda for example purposes. The 6.5% tariff which I recall was only 2.5% for cars. But let's just you your numbers. So There is $1300 tariff on this Honda. The "Currency Manipulation" of $3000 (probably more than that) advantage wipes out that $1300 tariff and leaves Honda a staggering $1700 in profitabilty advantage even with your 6.5% tariff. :sick:
Please read about the impact below!!!! :sick:
http://www.autotradecouncil.org/Upload/ATPC%20CURRENCY%20FINAL.pdf
-Rocky
I still stand by that claim of BO will deliver jobs to Michigan!!!
-Rocky
You think were in this mess because of people buying non D3 vehicles! Yep, that explains the housing bubble and crash, the banking crisis in the US and around the world all because U.S. consumers shunned D3 cars. Last I checked many people have stopped buying cars period. I'm not aware of any car manufacturers that are selling enough cars to earn a profit and it's all because we import over 50% of our cars.
-Rocky
Henderson vows to take 'tough' necessary actions to 'reinvent' GM
http://www.detnews.com/article/20090405/BIZ/904050329/1001/Henderson+vows+to+tak- e++tough++necessary+actions+to++reinvent++GM
-Rocky
-Rocky
I don't know. Last data I saw was their profits were down big with their qtr reported in Jan. 09. From what I've read if it wasn't for the won's devaluing they would probably have lost money. So they maybe profitable, but not buy much and I'd guess they are probably the only one making money. The Japanese manufacturers are getting hammered by lower sales and with the yen's value increase vs. the dollar. Haven't seen anything on Honda in a while. Late 08 their profits were down huge, but I don't know for sure if they've actually swung to a net loss yet.
The data in that article is nearly 5 years old and irrelevant. The dollar has strengthened 30% vs. the yen since then. Toyota is currently getting killed partially because of the currency exchange rate.
As far as auto imports. We imported nearly $150billion worth of cars in 2007 while exporting $50 billion. This is chump change in terms of our total exports of 1.8 trillion and imports of 2.52 trillion as of 08 (these are rough estimates as I don't know auto imports/exports for 08). So it wouldn't make any sense to base our trade policies solely on that of the auto industry when it's not even 10% of our imports or exports. We certainly have industries that are more important to protect. We actually have a trade surplus in capital goods, food, and services. Our trade deficits are in consumer goods and energy.
People who claim that the US doesn't make anything anymore are misinformed. We happen to make more with less people, and it's not many of the things we buy at a store.
lemko: stop whining about Philly...when I lived in NY in the 60s and 70s, Philly was known as Killadelphia, and all the unions were there, and Honda and Toyota were unknown to anyone...it has always been a pit, just like Detroit after the riots and burnings...
rocky: sadly, you did strike one accurate point...GA public schools are not that good, Mich are probably better...oddly, though, our colleges are excellent...Emory University, Georgia Tech (academics, not football), Univ of GA and GA State Univ are very good schools...but most of our women have all their teeth (only Waffle House seeks women for the graveyard shift with no teeth...:):)...)...
Since many college grads from out of state often remain in the South, we are not the toothless hicks you think...altho, we DO have our trailer parks and rednecks, aka "good ol boys"...
But don't worry...I saw enough folks in Detroit in my decade to know that you have the same toothless ignorant hicks, you just don't call them good ol boys or rednecks, you call them UAW members...
Please do NOT try and convince me how intelligent they are...I met many of them in my 10 years, and they ain't no smarter than any ignorant hick down here...they certainly earned more money, because only in the UAW can an illiterate floor sweeper make over $50K a year for a job that is overpaid at minimum wage of the 80s ($3.50/hour)...
You have Michigan State and U of M, we have Tech, Emory and UGA...as a proud graduate of Emory, I can assert to you that our football team is UNDEFEATED in the last 100 years...yes, they NEVER lost a game...NEVER...
Oh, Emory has no football team, BUT WE ARE STILL UNDEFEATED...
FYI...Emory students/grads are called "Emeroids"...I'll let you play with that for awhile... :P
I am not that great at math. But how is $18,000,000 going to preserve or create anything? That figures out to $165 each for 109,000 workers. Not even one weeks unemployment pay.
Let's look at the things she lays out:
Tax Cuts are history. Tossed out by Congress. It was to be paid by Cap n Trade which is dead for now.
Tax credit of $8k is good for first timers that pay a lot of taxes. Most first time home buyers do not pay $8k in Federal Income tax.
Unemployment only makes it worse. So many articles about people enjoying their time off with fat Unemployment Benefits. It is also very bad for the states that accept it.
I'll give them the weatherization as good. Where do I sign up. Or is it only for friends of Oprah or some such thing? Is this another tax credit?
I can only imagine how much waste will be involved with $2.2B for education. They are debating why they have to set up a separate agency in CA to disperse the funds for education.
"We started out with $2.2B and the overhead was $2.1B" so we decided it was a waste to mail each school a check for $30. We will set it aside for a party. :shades:
Got a Job? Heavy machinery? Road construction?
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Hey, how 'bout that! Two of my kids graduated from Emory. One's now at the Mayo Clinic, and the other is finishing up law school. So, I guess graduates from those dumb hick southern schools do OK.
Sorry Steve, couldn't resist the plug.
I will leave on this final paragraph: If the current trade policies are so damn great dieselone, then why in the hell is our real unemployment rate around 18% and our workers are making less than they did in year 2000??? Why is company after company closing it's doors??? Why are pension funds drying up while healthcare costs continue to rise if the fundmentals of this economy are indeed strong??? :confuse: I've watched good people lose there good paying jobs with only McJobs that will hire them. They lose there homes, cars, dignity, in life and can only dream better days are coming. I'm sorry I can't find the good numbers in that trade deficit report. Sure there will always be a small segment of good news but the big picture is terrible. We are doomed. Like a good stock portfolio a country also needs diversity. Our way of life will not survive without a manufacturing base IMHO!!!
-Rocky
I guess you didn't read Steve's GM post by Greta from Fixed News??? Take some time and read it. Since I know you swallow the Fixed News reporting hook, line and sinker well it should be credible to you.
-Rocky
P.S. I've been to Georgia and new many people from there and while some smart people live in that state there is a good number of redneck hicks both with and without teeth. It's a scary state indeed and the people are A LOT different culturally than what I'm used too. :surprise:
I never said that. I was only making a point that we do have good manufacturers that were making money prior to the recession/depression we're currently in. We do export more than most people believe in a variety of industries.
I don't know what the real unemployment numbers are. But I don't personally know one person that is currently out of work that doesn't want to be and I know people all over the country including Michigan. The county we live in has a current unemployment rate listed around 6.5% so the economy has been pretty stable here in central Illinois. I know a few that have gotten the axe, but all have found new jobs that paid them the same or more. But they all have a good education from reputable universities and are good at their professions.
The only person I know had to take a pay cut this year lives in Michigan. Go figure. Everyone else I'm good friends with in a variety of professions have gotten raises in the range of 3-5% this year. Our personal net wages are over double what they were in 2000 including increases in medical insurance. No, I don't buy the BS we are all doomed. No doubt things are tough, but we will get through it.
We did some traveling last week for spring break. Went to Kansas City to visit friends and relatives, then to Branson, Mo to visit old college friends that live there. Every where was packed. The indoor water park we stayed at for several days was nearly full. My Expedition was lost in a sea of Escalade's and Denali's in the waterpark parking lot. Hope my Expe didn't catch a cold parked next to those POSs
I lived in many states and the hillbilly type crowd are everywhere.
-Rocky
I know that but it's extra fun getting marsha7's goat!!! :P
-Rocky