That means you can get the AWD model for around $20k. That may be enough to say Screw you UAW workers I'm getting a Mexican low rider. Would it get keyed in the parking lot at Ford.
interesting comments on GM cars, go to Buick Lucerne topic, posts 1859 and 1860...apparently a 73 year old poster (go, man, go) bought a used Lucerne (dealer demo?) and it had a vibration at 1500 rpm, which he was "gently" escorted off the dealership and they apparently refuse to fix the problem...bottom line, he will never buy GM again...
rocky, like it or not, this is what you are up against...I do not know the truth to the posters comments, but I give it the same chance of truth that we all have here in this topic...if true, this is why the Big 3 are doomed...a fairly new Lucerne, Buick's best, and they cannot or will not fix it...
This is why you don't get it...why the Big 3 may be doomed forever...for all the stuff we read about good cars, there seems to be more about bad cars...you gotta know that he will tell about, oh, 150 people about his experience with GM, maybe more...this is what has been going on for over 20 years, and why the UAW and Big 3 are goners...
Of course, their sales will not go down to zero...but Big 3 have lost this guy forever...and he IS multiplied by millions...
Don't just kiss Detroit goodbye...kiss Michigan and the entire industrial midwest goodbye...they brought it on themselves, they have known about this for over 20 years, and they just do not care...and maybe that is the most infuriating part...the people who design them and certainly the people who assemble them simply do not care, as long as their Blue Cross co-pay is under $5.00, they could care less about their product...
And that is why the idiots are losing jobs and they will go down wondering why...they just don't get it and neither do you...
My opinion is the car was used and sitting on the lot because it had been bought back by the dealer as defective. Maybe it was a lemon. It needs someone to track the history.
I feel it's the dealer who is ripping on the perceived older person who was gullable and bought a used car. Maybe he was told it was driven by the owner's wife as a pesonal car or by GM executives.
My first guess would be a torque converter problem -- something in that area. Occasionally motor mounts have caused vibrations. Wheels and tires are typical. But this became clearly the motor.
The dealer should have bought him back out of the car. Then GM should have bought him back out of the car.
All companies make some cars that develope unexpected problems. I recall Accord buying back Hondas in 03 models for some problems. I recall some Toyotas being bought back by dealer or company in more recent forums. That's as it should be.
That's why I think it's a dealer here who deserves the fault.
The story about the vibration seems pretty hoaky to me. The car would not have passed a quality control inspection so it was never made with the problem. So it had to be a fake story or something that is a one in a million ocurrance happened. When I look at car reviewers comments, I can tell the people who don't actually have the car they are commenting about. This story smells a little of that. I agree that even if it did have a one in a million failure, the dealer is screwing up, not GM. My takaway from the story is that if I buy a GM car new tomorrow, it will develop an annoying vibration in a week that is unfixable by any GM dealer ever. Not.
It is the dealerships that make or break you on whether you would ever purchase that make of car again. People know their car is going to break down sooner or later, but if the dealer treats you bad and doesn't fix it right, then it doesn't take long before you hate that car and what ever make it is. Most of the little 3 dealers have been screwing their customers for years and it's not just the UAW workers quality of work, but the mechanics at the dealerships to.
My FIL worked for GM dealers for years and some of the stories he told us would just make you sick on the things that were done. He finally quit and started his own garage and ran it his way. He had more Gm customers having their cars fixed by him then the dealer did. He would do all the regular maintenance on their cars and very few would need warranty work.
> He would do all the regular maintenance on their cars and very few would need warranty work.
Supports my point that many of the problems for GM and big 3 cars were lack of regular maintenance.
>Most of the little 3 dealers have been screwing their customers for years and it's not just the UAW workers quality of work
Check forums here for people with regular problems in their cars form other than the Big 3. Look at Honda and their transmission odyssey through the years. The Odyssey transmission is hot with lots of failures and Honda is helping them with their failed transmissions but charging thousands of dollars. Some are repeat failures.
"Ford Motor Co. (F) may wring a few more millions in costs from its annual operations by controlling what has been a chronic money waster for the U.S. auto makers - absenteeism.
"Let's say you stayed up late watching a championship game one night and decided the next day to call in sick," Hinrichs said. "You always knew you could get paid for that day just by cashing in one of your vacation days later. Not any more."
UAW Vice President Bob King said the membership had no problem backing the changes. Ford had been introducing different plans to fight absenteeism at different plants for the past couple of years. Now it's one plan for everyone."
Totally agree with you, greatlakesjr. The questions I posted are for those who feel or at least think that we have to support UAW to be patrotic, or at least think we have to be "patriotic". I do think that UAW, while not the only culprit, is also responsible for killing US auto business.
I see no reason to support mediocrity, be it fellow Americans or not. And now that I'm assigned at a foreign branch I don't have to listen to Middlefinger's rants as much as usual :P
First of all, I remember seeing pictures of guys with spray guns in a booth with the cars going down the line. If those poor guys lived past 60, they were lucky what with all the fumes. Automated painting should ensure an even coat of paint - no runs or thin spots.
LOL, that reminds me. I once visited a Toyota car plant here where I'm currently assigned. It's a smaller plant producing about 50,000 cars per year, and the whole painting line is automatic. Yes, an automated painting system in a plant located in a 3rd world country.
GM treating Saturn and Saab like unwanted children = Toyota with Scion???? How is it possible when Scions are rebadged Asian market Toyotas? :confuse:
However I agree that Saturn's failure is the result of long term neglect. Why bother creating the company if they're not willing to raise it???
"You can't half-[non-permissible content removed] it and expect miracles. It is a good idea for GM to dump brands that they aren't fully committed too."
Agree, that's why Pontiac's gone now. :shades: Hope Saab and Buick are next. Oh scratch that, GMC first.
Yeah it's those worthless UAW workers that build crap cars yet the same types build elite cars like the CTS.
The last time I heard they cherry pick only the best of UAW to work on CTS and Corvette. Now we have evidence that THERE ARE quality workers in UAW, hey, noone ever said vice versa. However like I always say those golden eggs are burried deep in the sea of rotten eggs, so it's no wonder few or no people can spot them easily. I wonder who's making 0 sense here......
Besides, how about the other 40 or so models that are genuinely crap? I don't think 2-3 superior models are enough to cover for them. :P
Of course it feels solid...they're learning to make all that hard plastic pretty thick these days! (Andre1969)
You can blame the UAW for making GM cars cost more than they should, but you can blame only management for making GM cars so unappealing that many of us wouldn't buy them at half the price.
Interesting point, I believe the UAW deserves the blame for 1. the build quality of the cars produced 2. the ridiculous overpricing of GM cars 3. wanting more and more pay for less work
While the management is responsible for: 1. designing those crappy cars nobody wants 2. messing the whole company's finances to the point it's too out of balance to fix. 3. grubbing as much cash as they can while slowly choking the company.
I wont deny it. Honda and Toyota quality is sinking, well, taht explains how Nissan is now the most respected carmaker in Japan.... it's even the choice of Japan's riyal family.
suzuki brought up the rear in latest quality survey...i just hope GM and dodge can survive, they really arent that far away from being very good overall....if anyone wants to help us working stiffs, look at the % of components that are north american and choose accordingly when buying a new vehicle...i would buy a malibu over a fusion just because it is assembled in KC
my buddy is borrowing a mint 1987 mark v11....the car is in great shape with 95k..doors shut perfect..it has always been in garaged in conn, i guess that is only good lincoln ever made by uaw
Well, each has his/her own preference. GM and Chrysler may be on the way to improvement, but IMO, it's too late, as they should've done it years ago. Too late.... way too late....
That's why I won't bother supporting them, I highly doubt they'll ever catch up soon enough. Malibu or Fusion? Hmm, if I have to choose: Fusion since it's superior, I don;t really care where it's built. However with such broad choices the market has today, I'd pick Mazda6 first, Fusion and Nissan Altima next.
>" I'd pick Mazda6 first, Fusion and Nissan Altima next"
m4d_cow,
Mazda and Ford share a great deal of interest. Evidenced in the small P/U trucks, and the Tribute/Escape SUVs. Possibly the 2.3 engine used in some Fords and Mazda 3.
What about the Mazda6 and the Fusion? Is there much connection there?
Good point. Yes a lot of Ford cars are based on Mazda designs. However the Fusion is based on the mazda6, which, as far as I see have better interior materials and better (to my eyes) styling. Plus it's no secret that while Ford owns the majority share of Mazda, they have an agreement in which Ford is not allowed to take all Mazda's technology into it's own cars, the same between Ford and Volvo. That's why you don;t see too many Mazda or Volvo parts make it into their domestic lineup. It's not the cost or anything, Ford's just not allowed to under that agreement. A great example, imo, is mazda CX7 vs Ford Edge, based on the same design but turn out into 2 extremely different vehicles.
Funny how I keep drawing all those golden eggs out of that sea of rotten ones! You guys keep convincing me I should be a professional gambler with all the awesome luck I must have. Why should I work? I should simply get up in the morning, walk to the store, and buy lottery tickets 'cause every one's sure to be a winner!
my buddy is borrowing a mint 1987 mark v11....the car is in great shape with 95k..doors shut perfect..it has always been in garaged in conn, i guess that is only good lincoln ever made by uaw
Actually I'm not surprised. Back in those days, Ford really was trying hard to improve the quality of their cars. At least, from a workmanship/fit and finish perspective. GM was sort of fat and lazy and depending too much on their past successes, while Chrysler, the little guy, was still having to cut corners here and there.
I have a 1985 Consumer Guide auto book, and in the workmanship/fit and finish area, they tended to give very high marks to the Ford products. At least, the more high-end stuff like the Mark VII, Continental sedan, Grand Marquis, Crown Vic, and T-bird. They tended to get lots of "5" ratings, which was the highest. Now they also tested a Mustang and a Topaz, and those were rated pretty low for workmanship. And a small LTD, which scored decently, but nothing to crow about.
Of course, that workmanship rating has no bearing on the V-6 engines blowing head gaskets, the 4-speed automatic transmissions chewing up, or other evils that would pop up a few years down the road. :sick:
>Funny how I keep drawing all those golden eggs out of that sea of rotten ones!
Me too.
Also maybe it's the differences in the maintenance at the dealership in preventative mode. I just read about an owner having the oil pressure-carrying tubes for the VV engine changed just because they seem to have a problem with developing leaks. So he changed them at $290 on his extended warranty--just in case they might also have developed leaks.
I'll bet a year from now he'll be telling how his car never has had problems. A design with oil tubes that can leak outside the motor causing catastrophic loss of oil--well...
Oh, not to mention the risk of fires, but we'll never hear about it in the mainstream media. Oh, if this was a GM car, a dried-up 25 year-old valve cover gasket on a 1984 Buick will allow oil seepage which will result in a great conflagration that'll make the Great Chicago Fire look like your uncle's barbecue in comparison.
Ford sold their 33 percent controlling stake of Mazda last November and now hold about 13% of the company. They are still partners and doing platform sharing stuff. Mazda had a big hand in the Fiesta redesign. link
I wonder if the "not allowed" stuff is just an urban legend and if the real reason is that it's too expensive to share more parts. For global companies these guys sure seem stuck on building country specific cars.
Back to the topic:
"It must be a coincidence that the United Auto Workers has handed $25.4 million to federal politicians over the last two decades, with 99 percent of that cash going to Democrats. And that Mr. Obama's final campaign stop on Election Day was a UAW phone bank.
If those politicians thought about this a bit more, they'd probably realize their mistake. Creditors didn't force Chrysler's management to head to the capital markets and beg for funds: It was poor management, uncompetitive wages, and a union that opposed pay cuts"
Really, what kind of car do the Japanese Royals drive? Is it a Nissan President?
LOL, no, no, the President armada has been retired long ago. It's now an upgraded version of Nissan Fuga (Infiniti M in our speak), only with more luxurious interior (combining leather with japanese silk, not sure how they managed to do so), side and rear curtains, etc.
Of course, I heard the empreror himself rides around in a rolls or Bentley, unpatriotic for someone at his level.
Whoops, didn't know that. But the content limitations were there, the same way Ford oddly does between its NA division and Euro division. There aren't too many content sharing even between Ford's own divisions. If you've seen and driven the European Focus you'll know what I'm saying.
"If those politicians thought about this a bit more, they'd probably realize their mistake. Creditors didn't force Chrysler's management to head to the capital markets and beg for funds: It was poor management, uncompetitive wages, and a union that opposed pay cuts"
The Lucerne, Aura, LaCrosse, 2010 Equinox that you can now order. The new Camaro is a great car. The CTS, Malibu, VUE, Outlook, Traverse, Acadia, Encalve, Sierra, Silverado, Saab 9-3 convertible/sedan, Cadillac SRX, Escalade and EXT, Avalanche, Tahoe, Yukon & Yukon XL, Impala, G6, G8, Suburban, Astra, H2 & H3 Hummers are nice. These are all excellent automobiles. You have the Cruze, 2010 LaCrosse, Volt, Spark, coming. The bottom line is every car manufacturer is losing money in this bad economy. Last quarter Toyota lost more percentage points than GM which suprised me. If you want to keep your head in the sand and pretend todays products are the same as the 1980's that is your choice. GM has a lot more than just 2 good choices.
Well the UAW isn't some small independent local like branch of a major union like yours was with the Teamsters. Your parent company had a unlimited piggy bank most of your working career thus you don't know what hard times really are. The UAW workers only wished they would have to make a modest sacrifice like you did. Your paycheck came from the most corrupt companies the oil cartel where they have a monopoly on the market. If you truly believe that the UAW workers intentionally sabatoge cars then you will believe the moon is made out of green cheese also. GM's quality has improved with each passing year and while some of you don't want to forgive them (GM & UAW) for the 1980's doesn't make there cars junk today.
Just because marsha7 says all UAW workers are retarded, lazy, no good human beings doesn't make it so. :sick:
They're definately doing something right in Poletown! I recall there used to be a Dodge plant there years ago and the GM plant is built on the same site.
Assuming we're talking good, not great: I agree with CTS, Camaro, G8, Tahoe and Traverse. I still think Yukon and Escalade are basically the same as Tahoe, so I count it as one, the same goes to Traverse-Acadia-etc. Astra is good, just way overpriced.
Great: CTS and Corvette - the only GM cars to deserve a world class title.
The rest are either so-so (ex: Malibu), simply questionable, or downright crap (Impala, G6 for instance). Either that or "no comment until I've seen it myself". I havent seen volt myself, but I think it's a no good with only 40 mile range on battery. Add the bleak looks and I lost my interest completely. Have you even seen Spark? It's not a new model and it's all over Asia already, not good enough to challenge Fit or even Versa.
To each of his/her own, Rock. GM's improved since the 80s, but the progress is too slow and imports have left it behind, so far GM has a whole lot to catch up to. Unfortunately there's no way you can change my mind, the only one who can is GM when they finally live up to my minimum standard, assuming they ever can.
"Just because marsha7 says all UAW workers are retarded, lazy, no good human beings doesn't make it so"...are you REALLY sure of that???...didn't you forget severely unskilled, underworked and overpaid???
Am I allow to mention the overpaid $35/hour floorsweeper, or do I have to admit they don't exist anymore, according to rocky, anyway... :P
BTW, rocky, where are you in the job search???...how come no word on Beth, lately???...she seems to sell cars like she could sell ice to an Eskimo....and UAW-made, which is, well, shocking!!!
NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- Struggling automaker General Motors reported a $6 billion loss during the first three months of the year Thursday, and said it will need more government loans soon as it tries to come up with a plan to stay out of bankruptcy.
***** Most of the cash GM burned in the quarter came from the $9.4 billion in government loans it got during the first three months of the year. GM has received $15.4 billion in federal assistance since the end of last year. ***** The company did not give any specific guidance about how much more cash it would burn during the rest of the year. But chief financial officer Ray Young suggested during a conference call Thursday morning that it will need to spend more money than previously forecast due to plans to significantly cut North American production and buy out dealerships. ***** Young said the company will need about $2.6 billion in additional federal loans this month as it tries to come up with a plan to stay out of bankruptcy. It will also need about $9 billion more through the rest of the year even if it stays out of bankruptcy. If approved, that would bring total government support for the company to $27 billion.
This is it, the demonic circle of doom. GM needs more money, more, more and more. "otherwise we can;t keep the workers" is an old and tired threat. Go for it Barry, shoot em dead.
Survival chance = close to 0 :P Time to prepare ourselves and say bye-bye to GM, and perhaps UAW.... you shall be missed... or not..... :P
If you would of read further you would see that the UAW one some rights last contract on that they have a say so on new product launches there members build so people like you, Marsha7, gagrice, can't say the UAW workers build junk anymore.
rocky, like it or not, this is what you are up against...I do not know the truth to the posters comments, but I give it the same chance of truth that we all have here in this topic...if true, this is why the Big 3 are doomed...a fairly new Lucerne, Buick's best, and they cannot or will not fix it...
Who over drove this demo could of jumped snow banks with it. That isn't the fault of the UAW worker as the car was a demo or aka lightly used. We have no facts on the history of the vehicle and how it was driven do we??? The dealer should fix the car if they want to keep a customer. The dealerships can ruin a customers perception of an entire brand or company and they need to be held accountable also.
I guess that guy should go buy a Toyota since they are such elite cars right??? I can go to many forums and find import owners that are pissed off that there engine sludged up or transmission works like an Atari joystick.
I thought Toyota only builds in the U.S. ???? Just ask some of there owners and they'll tell you that Toyota cares about americans and gives them jobs because they are as american as baseball, hotdogs, burgers, an apple pie.
Check forums here for people with regular problems in their cars form other than the Big 3. Look at Honda and their transmission odyssey through the years. The Odyssey transmission is hot with lots of failures and Honda is helping them with their failed transmissions but charging thousands of dollars. Some are repeat failures.
The last time I heard they cherry pick only the best of UAW to work on CTS and Corvette. Now we have evidence that THERE ARE quality workers in UAW, hey, noone ever said vice versa. However like I always say those golden eggs are burried deep in the sea of rotten eggs, so it's no wonder few or no people can spot them easily. I wonder who's making 0 sense here......
Evidence??? I got some ocean front property in Nebraska to sell you also. :confuse: Unbelievable with the whoppers some of you come up with. Plant transfers go by seniority and thus cherry picking for those jobs is nothing more than something made up in someones head to sound intelligent. :confuse:
Comments
rocky, like it or not, this is what you are up against...I do not know the truth to the posters comments, but I give it the same chance of truth that we all have here in this topic...if true, this is why the Big 3 are doomed...a fairly new Lucerne, Buick's best, and they cannot or will not fix it...
This is why you don't get it...why the Big 3 may be doomed forever...for all the stuff we read about good cars, there seems to be more about bad cars...you gotta know that he will tell about, oh, 150 people about his experience with GM, maybe more...this is what has been going on for over 20 years, and why the UAW and Big 3 are goners...
Of course, their sales will not go down to zero...but Big 3 have lost this guy forever...and he IS multiplied by millions...
Don't just kiss Detroit goodbye...kiss Michigan and the entire industrial midwest goodbye...they brought it on themselves, they have known about this for over 20 years, and they just do not care...and maybe that is the most infuriating part...the people who design them and certainly the people who assemble them simply do not care, as long as their Blue Cross co-pay is under $5.00, they could care less about their product...
And that is why the idiots are losing jobs and they will go down wondering why...they just don't get it and neither do you...
is the post to which Bob refers here.
My opinion is the car was used and sitting on the lot because it had been bought back by the dealer as defective. Maybe it was a lemon. It needs someone to track the history.
I feel it's the dealer who is ripping on the perceived older person who was gullable and bought a used car. Maybe he was told it was driven by the owner's wife as a pesonal car or by GM executives.
My first guess would be a torque converter problem -- something in that area. Occasionally motor mounts have caused vibrations. Wheels and tires are typical. But this became clearly the motor.
The dealer should have bought him back out of the car. Then GM should have bought him back out of the car.
All companies make some cars that develope unexpected problems. I recall Accord buying back Hondas in 03 models for some problems. I recall some Toyotas being bought back by dealer or company in more recent forums. That's as it should be.
That's why I think it's a dealer here who deserves the fault.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
My FIL worked for GM dealers for years and some of the stories he told us would just make you sick on the things that were done. He finally quit and started his own garage and ran it his way. He had more Gm customers having their cars fixed by him then the dealer did. He would do all the regular maintenance on their cars and very few would need warranty work.
Supports my point that many of the problems for GM and big 3 cars were lack of regular maintenance.
>Most of the little 3 dealers have been screwing their customers for years and it's not just the UAW workers quality of work
Check forums here for people with regular problems in their cars form other than the Big 3. Look at Honda and their transmission odyssey through the years. The Odyssey transmission is hot with lots of failures and Honda is helping them with their failed transmissions but charging thousands of dollars. Some are repeat failures.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
"Let's say you stayed up late watching a championship game one night and decided the next day to call in sick," Hinrichs said. "You always knew you could get paid for that day just by cashing in one of your vacation days later. Not any more."
UAW Vice President Bob King said the membership had no problem backing the changes. Ford had been introducing different plans to fight absenteeism at different plants for the past couple of years. Now it's one plan for everyone."
Ford Wringing More Costs From Co By Controlling Absenteeism (CNN Money)
I see no reason to support mediocrity, be it fellow Americans or not. And now that I'm assigned at a foreign branch I don't have to listen to Middlefinger's rants as much as usual :P
LOL, that reminds me. I once visited a Toyota car plant here where I'm currently assigned. It's a smaller plant producing about 50,000 cars per year, and the whole painting line is automatic. Yes, an automated painting system in a plant located in a 3rd world country.
So much for American superiority..... :sick:
However I agree that Saturn's failure is the result of long term neglect. Why bother creating the company if they're not willing to raise it???
"You can't half-[non-permissible content removed] it and expect miracles. It is a good idea for GM to dump brands that they aren't fully committed too."
Agree, that's why Pontiac's gone now. :shades: Hope Saab and Buick are next. Oh scratch that, GMC first.
The last time I heard they cherry pick only the best of UAW to work on CTS and Corvette. Now we have evidence that THERE ARE quality workers in UAW, hey, noone ever said vice versa. However like I always say those golden eggs are burried deep in the sea of rotten eggs, so it's no wonder few or no people can spot them easily. I wonder who's making 0 sense here......
Besides, how about the other 40 or so models that are genuinely crap? I don't think 2-3 superior models are enough to cover for them. :P
Of course it feels solid...they're learning to make all that hard plastic pretty thick these days! (Andre1969)
LOL so true...
Interesting point, I believe the UAW deserves the blame for
1. the build quality of the cars produced
2. the ridiculous overpricing of GM cars
3. wanting more and more pay for less work
While the management is responsible for:
1. designing those crappy cars nobody wants
2. messing the whole company's finances to the point it's too out of balance to fix.
3. grubbing as much cash as they can while slowly choking the company.
:shades:
Uh, Buick is atop all.... well, I disagree, but hey, you're free to believe that.
Well, each has his/her own preference. GM and Chrysler may be on the way to improvement, but IMO, it's too late, as they should've done it years ago. Too late.... way too late....
That's why I won't bother supporting them, I highly doubt they'll ever catch up soon enough. Malibu or Fusion? Hmm, if I have to choose: Fusion since it's superior, I don;t really care where it's built. However with such broad choices the market has today, I'd pick Mazda6 first, Fusion and Nissan Altima next.
Like I said, to each of his/her own.
m4d_cow,
Mazda and Ford share a great deal of interest. Evidenced in the small P/U trucks, and the Tribute/Escape SUVs. Possibly the 2.3 engine used in some Fords and Mazda 3.
What about the Mazda6 and the Fusion? Is there much connection there?
Thanks,
Kip
Plus it's no secret that while Ford owns the majority share of Mazda, they have an agreement in which Ford is not allowed to take all Mazda's technology into it's own cars, the same between Ford and Volvo. That's why you don;t see too many Mazda or Volvo parts make it into their domestic lineup. It's not the cost or anything, Ford's just not allowed to under that agreement.
A great example, imo, is mazda CX7 vs Ford Edge, based on the same design but turn out into 2 extremely different vehicles.
Actually I'm not surprised. Back in those days, Ford really was trying hard to improve the quality of their cars. At least, from a workmanship/fit and finish perspective. GM was sort of fat and lazy and depending too much on their past successes, while Chrysler, the little guy, was still having to cut corners here and there.
I have a 1985 Consumer Guide auto book, and in the workmanship/fit and finish area, they tended to give very high marks to the Ford products. At least, the more high-end stuff like the Mark VII, Continental sedan, Grand Marquis, Crown Vic, and T-bird. They tended to get lots of "5" ratings, which was the highest. Now they also tested a Mustang and a Topaz, and those were rated pretty low for workmanship. And a small LTD, which scored decently, but nothing to crow about.
Of course, that workmanship rating has no bearing on the V-6 engines blowing head gaskets, the 4-speed automatic transmissions chewing up, or other evils that would pop up a few years down the road. :sick:
Me too.
Also maybe it's the differences in the maintenance at the dealership in preventative mode. I just read about an owner having the oil pressure-carrying tubes for the VV engine changed just because they seem to have a problem with developing leaks. So he changed them at $290 on his extended warranty--just in case they might also have developed leaks.
I'll bet a year from now he'll be telling how his car never has had problems. A design with oil tubes that can leak outside the motor causing catastrophic loss of oil--well...
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I wonder if the "not allowed" stuff is just an urban legend and if the real reason is that it's too expensive to share more parts. For global companies these guys sure seem stuck on building country specific cars.
Back to the topic:
"It must be a coincidence that the United Auto Workers has handed $25.4 million to federal politicians over the last two decades, with 99 percent of that cash going to Democrats. And that Mr. Obama's final campaign stop on Election Day was a UAW phone bank.
If those politicians thought about this a bit more, they'd probably realize their mistake. Creditors didn't force Chrysler's management to head to the capital markets and beg for funds: It was poor management, uncompetitive wages, and a union that opposed pay cuts"
Chrysler Bankruptcy Exposes Dirty Politics (CBS)
LOL, no, no, the President armada has been retired long ago. It's now an upgraded version of Nissan Fuga (Infiniti M in our speak), only with more luxurious interior (combining leather with japanese silk, not sure how they managed to do so), side and rear curtains, etc.
Of course, I heard the empreror himself rides around in a rolls or Bentley, unpatriotic for someone at his level.
"If those politicians thought about this a bit more, they'd probably realize their mistake. Creditors didn't force Chrysler's management to head to the capital markets and beg for funds: It was poor management, uncompetitive wages, and a union that opposed pay cuts"
Totally 100% agree. So true, so sad. :P
-Rocky
Just because marsha7 says all UAW workers are retarded, lazy, no good human beings doesn't make it so. :sick:
-Rocky
-Rocky
Hamtramck, Michigan pal. The Lucerne is built there also.
-Rocky
-Rocky
I agree with CTS, Camaro, G8, Tahoe and Traverse. I still think Yukon and Escalade are basically the same as Tahoe, so I count it as one, the same goes to Traverse-Acadia-etc. Astra is good, just way overpriced.
Great: CTS and Corvette - the only GM cars to deserve a world class title.
The rest are either so-so (ex: Malibu), simply questionable, or downright crap (Impala, G6 for instance). Either that or "no comment until I've seen it myself". I havent seen volt myself, but I think it's a no good with only 40 mile range on battery. Add the bleak looks and I lost my interest completely. Have you even seen Spark? It's not a new model and it's all over Asia already, not good enough to challenge Fit or even Versa.
To each of his/her own, Rock. GM's improved since the 80s, but the progress is too slow and imports have left it behind, so far GM has a whole lot to catch up to. Unfortunately there's no way you can change my mind, the only one who can is GM when they finally live up to my minimum standard, assuming they ever can.
P.S: you forgot Corvette.
Am I allow to mention the overpaid $35/hour floorsweeper, or do I have to admit they don't exist anymore, according to rocky, anyway...
BTW, rocky, where are you in the job search???...how come no word on Beth, lately???...she seems to sell cars like she could sell ice to an Eskimo....and UAW-made, which is, well, shocking!!!
*****
Most of the cash GM burned in the quarter came from the $9.4 billion in government loans it got during the first three months of the year. GM has received $15.4 billion in federal assistance since the end of last year.
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The company did not give any specific guidance about how much more cash it would burn during the rest of the year. But chief financial officer Ray Young suggested during a conference call Thursday morning that it will need to spend more money than previously forecast due to plans to significantly cut North American production and buy out dealerships.
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Young said the company will need about $2.6 billion in additional federal loans this month as it tries to come up with a plan to stay out of bankruptcy. It will also need about $9 billion more through the rest of the year even if it stays out of bankruptcy. If approved, that would bring total government support for the company to $27 billion.
This is it, the demonic circle of doom. GM needs more money, more, more and more. "otherwise we can;t keep the workers" is an old and tired threat. Go for it Barry, shoot em dead.
Survival chance = close to 0 :P Time to prepare ourselves and say bye-bye to GM, and perhaps UAW.... you shall be missed... or not..... :P
-Rocky
-Rocky
Who over drove this demo could of jumped snow banks with it. That isn't the fault of the UAW worker as the car was a demo or aka lightly used. We have no facts on the history of the vehicle and how it was driven do we??? The dealer should fix the car if they want to keep a customer. The dealerships can ruin a customers perception of an entire brand or company and they need to be held accountable also.
I guess that guy should go buy a Toyota since they are such elite cars right??? I can go to many forums and find import owners that are pissed off that there engine sludged up or transmission works like an Atari joystick.
-Rocky
-Rocky
-Rocky
-Rocky
What the heck does that suppose to mean? Excuse me but I don't get it :P
If Toyota only builds in US it's doomed for eternity with crappy poorly assembled Camrys.
So much for superiority,eh?
-Rocky
Evidence??? I got some ocean front property in Nebraska to sell you also. :confuse: Unbelievable with the whoppers some of you come up with. Plant transfers go by seniority and thus cherry picking for those jobs is nothing more than something made up in someones head to sound intelligent. :confuse:
-Rocky