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Comments
rocky, like it or not, this is what you are up against...I do not know the truth to the posters comments, but I give it the same chance of truth that we all have here in this topic...if true, this is why the Big 3 are doomed...a fairly new Lucerne, Buick's best, and they cannot or will not fix it...
This is why you don't get it...why the Big 3 may be doomed forever...for all the stuff we read about good cars, there seems to be more about bad cars...you gotta know that he will tell about, oh, 150 people about his experience with GM, maybe more...this is what has been going on for over 20 years, and why the UAW and Big 3 are goners...
Of course, their sales will not go down to zero...but Big 3 have lost this guy forever...and he IS multiplied by millions...
Don't just kiss Detroit goodbye...kiss Michigan and the entire industrial midwest goodbye...they brought it on themselves, they have known about this for over 20 years, and they just do not care...and maybe that is the most infuriating part...the people who design them and certainly the people who assemble them simply do not care, as long as their Blue Cross co-pay is under $5.00, they could care less about their product...
And that is why the idiots are losing jobs and they will go down wondering why...they just don't get it and neither do you...
is the post to which Bob refers here.
My opinion is the car was used and sitting on the lot because it had been bought back by the dealer as defective. Maybe it was a lemon. It needs someone to track the history.
I feel it's the dealer who is ripping on the perceived older person who was gullable and bought a used car. Maybe he was told it was driven by the owner's wife as a pesonal car or by GM executives.
My first guess would be a torque converter problem -- something in that area. Occasionally motor mounts have caused vibrations. Wheels and tires are typical. But this became clearly the motor.
The dealer should have bought him back out of the car. Then GM should have bought him back out of the car.
All companies make some cars that develope unexpected problems. I recall Accord buying back Hondas in 03 models for some problems. I recall some Toyotas being bought back by dealer or company in more recent forums. That's as it should be.
That's why I think it's a dealer here who deserves the fault.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
My FIL worked for GM dealers for years and some of the stories he told us would just make you sick on the things that were done. He finally quit and started his own garage and ran it his way. He had more Gm customers having their cars fixed by him then the dealer did. He would do all the regular maintenance on their cars and very few would need warranty work.
Supports my point that many of the problems for GM and big 3 cars were lack of regular maintenance.
>Most of the little 3 dealers have been screwing their customers for years and it's not just the UAW workers quality of work
Check forums here for people with regular problems in their cars form other than the Big 3. Look at Honda and their transmission odyssey through the years. The Odyssey transmission is hot with lots of failures and Honda is helping them with their failed transmissions but charging thousands of dollars. Some are repeat failures.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
"Let's say you stayed up late watching a championship game one night and decided the next day to call in sick," Hinrichs said. "You always knew you could get paid for that day just by cashing in one of your vacation days later. Not any more."
UAW Vice President Bob King said the membership had no problem backing the changes. Ford had been introducing different plans to fight absenteeism at different plants for the past couple of years. Now it's one plan for everyone."
Ford Wringing More Costs From Co By Controlling Absenteeism (CNN Money)
I see no reason to support mediocrity, be it fellow Americans or not. And now that I'm assigned at a foreign branch I don't have to listen to Middlefinger's rants as much as usual :P
LOL, that reminds me. I once visited a Toyota car plant here where I'm currently assigned. It's a smaller plant producing about 50,000 cars per year, and the whole painting line is automatic. Yes, an automated painting system in a plant located in a 3rd world country.
So much for American superiority..... :sick:
However I agree that Saturn's failure is the result of long term neglect. Why bother creating the company if they're not willing to raise it???
"You can't half-[non-permissible content removed] it and expect miracles. It is a good idea for GM to dump brands that they aren't fully committed too."
Agree, that's why Pontiac's gone now. :shades: Hope Saab and Buick are next. Oh scratch that, GMC first.
The last time I heard they cherry pick only the best of UAW to work on CTS and Corvette. Now we have evidence that THERE ARE quality workers in UAW, hey, noone ever said vice versa. However like I always say those golden eggs are burried deep in the sea of rotten eggs, so it's no wonder few or no people can spot them easily. I wonder who's making 0 sense here......
Besides, how about the other 40 or so models that are genuinely crap? I don't think 2-3 superior models are enough to cover for them. :P
Of course it feels solid...they're learning to make all that hard plastic pretty thick these days! (Andre1969)
LOL so true...
Interesting point, I believe the UAW deserves the blame for
1. the build quality of the cars produced
2. the ridiculous overpricing of GM cars
3. wanting more and more pay for less work
While the management is responsible for:
1. designing those crappy cars nobody wants
2. messing the whole company's finances to the point it's too out of balance to fix.
3. grubbing as much cash as they can while slowly choking the company.
:shades:
Uh, Buick is atop all.... well, I disagree, but hey, you're free to believe that.
Well, each has his/her own preference. GM and Chrysler may be on the way to improvement, but IMO, it's too late, as they should've done it years ago. Too late.... way too late....
That's why I won't bother supporting them, I highly doubt they'll ever catch up soon enough. Malibu or Fusion? Hmm, if I have to choose: Fusion since it's superior, I don;t really care where it's built. However with such broad choices the market has today, I'd pick Mazda6 first, Fusion and Nissan Altima next.
Like I said, to each of his/her own.
m4d_cow,
Mazda and Ford share a great deal of interest. Evidenced in the small P/U trucks, and the Tribute/Escape SUVs. Possibly the 2.3 engine used in some Fords and Mazda 3.
What about the Mazda6 and the Fusion? Is there much connection there?
Thanks,
Kip
Plus it's no secret that while Ford owns the majority share of Mazda, they have an agreement in which Ford is not allowed to take all Mazda's technology into it's own cars, the same between Ford and Volvo. That's why you don;t see too many Mazda or Volvo parts make it into their domestic lineup. It's not the cost or anything, Ford's just not allowed to under that agreement.
A great example, imo, is mazda CX7 vs Ford Edge, based on the same design but turn out into 2 extremely different vehicles.
Actually I'm not surprised. Back in those days, Ford really was trying hard to improve the quality of their cars. At least, from a workmanship/fit and finish perspective. GM was sort of fat and lazy and depending too much on their past successes, while Chrysler, the little guy, was still having to cut corners here and there.
I have a 1985 Consumer Guide auto book, and in the workmanship/fit and finish area, they tended to give very high marks to the Ford products. At least, the more high-end stuff like the Mark VII, Continental sedan, Grand Marquis, Crown Vic, and T-bird. They tended to get lots of "5" ratings, which was the highest. Now they also tested a Mustang and a Topaz, and those were rated pretty low for workmanship. And a small LTD, which scored decently, but nothing to crow about.
Of course, that workmanship rating has no bearing on the V-6 engines blowing head gaskets, the 4-speed automatic transmissions chewing up, or other evils that would pop up a few years down the road. :sick:
Me too.
Also maybe it's the differences in the maintenance at the dealership in preventative mode. I just read about an owner having the oil pressure-carrying tubes for the VV engine changed just because they seem to have a problem with developing leaks. So he changed them at $290 on his extended warranty--just in case they might also have developed leaks.
I'll bet a year from now he'll be telling how his car never has had problems. A design with oil tubes that can leak outside the motor causing catastrophic loss of oil--well...
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I wonder if the "not allowed" stuff is just an urban legend and if the real reason is that it's too expensive to share more parts. For global companies these guys sure seem stuck on building country specific cars.
Back to the topic:
"It must be a coincidence that the United Auto Workers has handed $25.4 million to federal politicians over the last two decades, with 99 percent of that cash going to Democrats. And that Mr. Obama's final campaign stop on Election Day was a UAW phone bank.
If those politicians thought about this a bit more, they'd probably realize their mistake. Creditors didn't force Chrysler's management to head to the capital markets and beg for funds: It was poor management, uncompetitive wages, and a union that opposed pay cuts"
Chrysler Bankruptcy Exposes Dirty Politics (CBS)
LOL, no, no, the President armada has been retired long ago. It's now an upgraded version of Nissan Fuga (Infiniti M in our speak), only with more luxurious interior (combining leather with japanese silk, not sure how they managed to do so), side and rear curtains, etc.
Of course, I heard the empreror himself rides around in a rolls or Bentley, unpatriotic for someone at his level.
"If those politicians thought about this a bit more, they'd probably realize their mistake. Creditors didn't force Chrysler's management to head to the capital markets and beg for funds: It was poor management, uncompetitive wages, and a union that opposed pay cuts"
Totally 100% agree. So true, so sad. :P
-Rocky
Just because marsha7 says all UAW workers are retarded, lazy, no good human beings doesn't make it so. :sick:
-Rocky
-Rocky
Hamtramck, Michigan pal. The Lucerne is built there also.
-Rocky
-Rocky
I agree with CTS, Camaro, G8, Tahoe and Traverse. I still think Yukon and Escalade are basically the same as Tahoe, so I count it as one, the same goes to Traverse-Acadia-etc. Astra is good, just way overpriced.
Great: CTS and Corvette - the only GM cars to deserve a world class title.
The rest are either so-so (ex: Malibu), simply questionable, or downright crap (Impala, G6 for instance). Either that or "no comment until I've seen it myself". I havent seen volt myself, but I think it's a no good with only 40 mile range on battery. Add the bleak looks and I lost my interest completely. Have you even seen Spark? It's not a new model and it's all over Asia already, not good enough to challenge Fit or even Versa.
To each of his/her own, Rock. GM's improved since the 80s, but the progress is too slow and imports have left it behind, so far GM has a whole lot to catch up to. Unfortunately there's no way you can change my mind, the only one who can is GM when they finally live up to my minimum standard, assuming they ever can.
P.S: you forgot Corvette.
Am I allow to mention the overpaid $35/hour floorsweeper, or do I have to admit they don't exist anymore, according to rocky, anyway...
BTW, rocky, where are you in the job search???...how come no word on Beth, lately???...she seems to sell cars like she could sell ice to an Eskimo....and UAW-made, which is, well, shocking!!!
*****
Most of the cash GM burned in the quarter came from the $9.4 billion in government loans it got during the first three months of the year. GM has received $15.4 billion in federal assistance since the end of last year.
*****
The company did not give any specific guidance about how much more cash it would burn during the rest of the year. But chief financial officer Ray Young suggested during a conference call Thursday morning that it will need to spend more money than previously forecast due to plans to significantly cut North American production and buy out dealerships.
*****
Young said the company will need about $2.6 billion in additional federal loans this month as it tries to come up with a plan to stay out of bankruptcy. It will also need about $9 billion more through the rest of the year even if it stays out of bankruptcy. If approved, that would bring total government support for the company to $27 billion.
This is it, the demonic circle of doom. GM needs more money, more, more and more. "otherwise we can;t keep the workers" is an old and tired threat. Go for it Barry, shoot em dead.
Survival chance = close to 0 :P Time to prepare ourselves and say bye-bye to GM, and perhaps UAW.... you shall be missed... or not..... :P
-Rocky
-Rocky
Who over drove this demo could of jumped snow banks with it. That isn't the fault of the UAW worker as the car was a demo or aka lightly used. We have no facts on the history of the vehicle and how it was driven do we??? The dealer should fix the car if they want to keep a customer. The dealerships can ruin a customers perception of an entire brand or company and they need to be held accountable also.
I guess that guy should go buy a Toyota since they are such elite cars right??? I can go to many forums and find import owners that are pissed off that there engine sludged up or transmission works like an Atari joystick.
-Rocky
-Rocky
-Rocky
-Rocky
What the heck does that suppose to mean? Excuse me but I don't get it :P
If Toyota only builds in US it's doomed for eternity with crappy poorly assembled Camrys.
So much for superiority,eh?
-Rocky
Evidence??? I got some ocean front property in Nebraska to sell you also. :confuse: Unbelievable with the whoppers some of you come up with. Plant transfers go by seniority and thus cherry picking for those jobs is nothing more than something made up in someones head to sound intelligent. :confuse:
-Rocky