Wipe the slate clean, and you get rid of the people who are an asset to your company, along with the rifraff. That may do more harm than good.
That's why a company becomes "Too Big NOT to FAIL". The individual's effort and creativity is snuffed out by the insidious levels of management that proliferate seeking only numbers on a piece of paper. :sick:
".....Your assumption is based on IF everybody's in the union."
No, my assuption is everything being made here. Most companies are too small for unionization. Even at that, with modernization, even this country is becoming "too small" with states competing against one another. We talk about Florida not having any income tax, and that being an advantage over other states. Fla. has this advantage because of Mickey Mouse and good weather. No other reason. Now, I can blame the state of RI all I want for not "luring" Mickey here, but the weather is beyond our control. yet, we up here lose jobs to Fla. because of the taxes. All everybody says is too bad, but I can't say too bad to my insurance company that loses billions in Fla. to all the hurricanes they get, yet expect me to pay for it.
Just looked at the inventory for that Dodge dealer that won't let Honda owners work for him. He has for sale on his lot a Lexus, a Mitsubishi, 3 Nissnas and a Toyota.
Must just be a Honda thing.
2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
I'm sure the overwhelming majority of the workers were and are decent people.
I'm not sure what being decent has to do with overpaying someone for the level of skill they bring to the company. I have a friend that is a decent person and a janitor. He never complains that he is getting $12 per hour. He is thankful he does not have to flip burgers for $8 per hour. That is the real issue with the UAW. In 1998 when they were the top paid unskilled workers in the USA they went on strike for more money. Same in 2005, 2007 and 2008. Made no difference to those ignorant workers that they could be replaced in a heartbeat for half or less. Now it is likely they will all lose their jobs. And decent or not they were over paid and killed the company.
I am back home in Michigan pal. I know the email I sent you probably made you go wow pal. I did not get to see my kids and what happened to me in Texas, might be a national news topic before it's over as I and my family plan to put togeather a a letter and tell the world just how corrupt Texas really is. They threw my [non-permissible content removed] in jail for 6 "hot checks" I didn't write and I cleared my good name via hand writing analysis in one county and the other county is still pending. I had court on last Monday at 9:00 a.m. and was there until 10:30 a.m. clearing my name via handwriting analysis and waiting for court to start. The court administraor said both of us would have to be present to have a divorce thus we were told it would be continued. So I left with my father in-law to go clear my name in Potter county on these hot checks. The Moore County Attorney said all charges would be dropped against me and I got an apology.
So about 12:45 when we came back through to find out if we were having court I was told they had divorced me without me being present. :mad: It is a Kangaroo court in Texas and you are guilty until proven innocent with criminal charges and divorce. I did find out that my spouse was arrested a 3rd time while in jail and the corrections officers said my wife was a psychopath. The corrupt Judge signed the decree and it was final. Neither I or my now ex wife signed it. She still doesn't have a drivers license. I also discovered she had a impersonator who said he was me and took responsibility for these hot checks. At 6:45 p.m. on Friday I was suppose to meet my wife at a pizza place in Dalhart, TX to see my two little kids. Instead Rocky who has held two national security clearances and protected our nations nuclear weapon stockpile was treated like a common criminal and was cuffed and stuffed. I spent 2 1/2 days in jail and was the most truamatic thing that has ever happened to me. I have no real visitation rights to my kids and my spouse can dictate when, how long, where, I can visit my kids. I also am not allowed to take the kids out of the county she resides in. The day after the divorce since she knew I was there obviously thus she changed her address to Weatherford, TX 6 1/2 hours away. I would be on a wild goose chase. This story I'm certain will be told in the media and you guys will see me on TV before it's over. :sick:
When I was sitting in jail for crimes I didn't do I will admit I thought about each of you and now many of you might understand why I have such hate for Texas and the south. I would have more rights as father in [non-permissible content removed] Germany and I honestly mean that. :sick:
When I get some free time as I'm very busy as you all can imagine I would love to rejoin this topic. You guys keep the debate alive as it is an important topic. God bless each of you and I appreciate all of your support.
But I'm sure Texas doesn't have UAW in their auto plants so it must be a good place to live and have right-to-work!!! :P
Sounds like the courts operate like Pelosi/Reed's congress these days. If she's a psycho, how does she still have possession of the kids? Has anyone contacted Judge Judy? She'll set it all straight; she's always telling the audience how omniscient she (Judge Judy) is about what's really happened in people's backgrounds and about their motives. Only trouble is she doesn't seem to like men. She's harder on them. Well, that sounds like TX.
You worried me with that jail stuff in your email.
hang in there, man. Your now ex sounds like a real case. :sick:
I have let all the others bash the UAW in your absence. Nothing else to be said, really, and no one's changing their minds at all on the topic. It remains the hottest 'News and Views' topic, though.
rock, I wish you the best and keep your chin up. You've now been to the Big 'D' and I don't mean Dallas. :sick: Sorry, I couldn't resist.
Welcome back Rocky. Look at the bright side. You are free to date without the stigma of being married. If it is any consolation I dated a girl in the 1990s that had a very similar situation to yours in Nebraska. She was thrashed by the judge that just happened to be her husbands uncle. All states have good and bad judges. Also remember this, Marriage is the leading cause of Divorce.
Also the UAW has not done any better since you left. I think they managed to push GM closer to Bankruptcy.
Actually, not. (Taxes, yes.) We are the 1st or 2nd most populous state in the country. There are plenty of poor living here, though we do have plenty of towns that have become "bedroom communities" for Boston and western Ct.
Sorry about your divorce fiasco...from what I know, that simply does not happen here in GA, so go ahead and hate Texas, but please do not lump all Southern states in with that (LA, AL, GA, NC, TN. KY, SC, MS)...we ain't all as bad asTexas...
Of course, maybe I ought to move to Texas and do divorce law...it apparently "pays" to represent the wife in the proceedings...
Sorry about your kids, but at least now you are single, so all those "friends" you write about you can now pursue...
Do you have to pay any child support or alimony???
Well I'm glad that [non-permissible content removed] dealership is going down. To penalize an employee for receiving a car as a GIFT is beyond stupidity.
I'm getting ready to hit the hay but will answer your question real quick. I as you know am unemployed. I lost out on one car sales job because I changed my flight plans so I could stay longer in Texas and even considered living there once again for about 2 whole days until my wife decided to move to Dallas. I get $660 a month unemployment. My Child Support is set at $642.21 a month. I was paying in the temporary orders $700.00 a month thus I am now $4300 in arrears because I could no longer afford to pay that and a good portion of my 401K went into paying that. I have no idea why or how they came to those numbers. I got stuck with all the bills that she forged in my name on and will have to file BK here soon. I lost a truck that she forged my name on to sell to cover her traffic violations and got stuck with the Impala that she forged my name on also thus in total debt between bills and 401K and back child support I am sitting around $60-70K in debt. Where I will come up with the money for that I have no idea. They gave her $32,500 of my 401K which was based off half the gross of $65K and not the net. My net 401K was $45K net after taxes thus if she were to get any of it it should be half of that despite her stealing $75K out of our accounts and the final year and a half I had my own bank account because she claimed identity theft but helped herself too anyways. I am obligated to pay her a $100 a month arrears and $40 a month for medical support thus my total child support obligation is $782.21 and that means paying nothing on the 401k that I'm ordered to pay her now. :sick: The 401K is a 6% compound interest annually on $32,500 and the back child support of $4300 is set at 6% simple interest. I was not married long enough for her to get alimony. This has been the last week from hell. I have to go see our friend of the court tomorrow and am working on putting a letter togeather to mail Dr. Phil, Oprah, Senators, Congressman, local and national media to explain how this yankee didn't just get beat with a hose but am scared for life. I need to tell the world how a bunch of toothless, imbred, hair lipped, redneck hillbilly's from Texas, put the screws to a good law abiding citizen while a criminal with a history a mile long gets to roam the streets to steal more from the innocent and raise my two kids.
I will close by saying a bunch of car dealerships around here and in Texas have or are closing. It's been really sad to watch. Beth whom I saw last nite only has 2 cars out for the month thus she is bumming pretty hard. My family is scared to death on what lies ahead with these GM contracts and the state of the economy. I am single like you said and I have a couple of good job prospects left. You guys have a good one and perhaps in a week or two I will be able to get some of the work I need to get done and I can get back on here regularly once again.
-Rocky
P.S. Thanks for all your support. Keep this topic alive with good debate. I want to return to a topic where Bob and Gagrice are still trying to tell me that UAW workers aren't worth $0.35 cents an hour and cooterbfd, fintail, lemko, are saying the neocons are running working class folks into the ground. I will also note that a lot of money folks went BK in the past couple of years in the Texas Panhandle which suprised me. I drove by building that were half started and the people ran out of money. It was real sad to see no matter what my personal feelings are about that part of the country.
Welcome back, Rocky! Sure missed you with all these rabid anti-domestic auto and anti-UAW folks about! Fighting them off is like Hercules battling the Hydra!
Sorry to hear of your family situation. Witnessing what's happened to you and other guys I've known go through similar situations is what keeps me forever single. I can see why some otherwise law-abiding guys lose it and commit the ultimate crime.
But look on the bright side - this too shall pass. Hey, maybe we can make that trip to Norway to meet some of those beautiful Scandinavian women when times get better?
OMG, sorry to hear your situation. Your ex seems like a true phsycopath, forging your sgnature all over the place. And unfortunately with things gone this far, your only salvation would be to hire a very expensive attorney that can unravel everything and drag her [non-permissible content removed] in front of a judge. Being unemployed and arrears on child support also really hurts your case as the courts will just treat you like a dead beat dad.
But luckily there is no alimony so that is a BIG item in your favor. I work with a guy who hired a crappy divorce lawyer and has to pay his ex LIFETIME alimony. And her BF (who was his gardner) is now living in the house that he's also paying the mortgage on. Now THAT would put goofy thoughts in my mind.
"Keep this topic alive with good debate. I want to return to a topic where Bob and Gagrice are still trying to tell me that UAW workers aren't worth $0.35 cents an hour"...did you say 35 CENTS and hour???...when was that kind of unskilled labor ever worth even THAT much???...I say, drop 'em to a dime... :P :shades:
rocky, I agree with mikefm, but, as always, it takes $$$ to hire one of us...but, if that much forgery can be proven, she would serve time here in GA, or, if not, she could lose primary custody of the kids...I realize you are telling what happened to you, but I simply find it hard to believe that the system is that biased against you, when your only problem is a lack of employment, obviously shared by many people at this time...
I do not comprehend a judge that would ignore all that theft and forgery and rule against you...only if YOU had a criminal record, and with your previous jobs and training, I get the impression that you had SOME level of security clearance along with your gun-totin' skills...
Well, despite our differences, sorry to hear that man. Hope things get better soon, especially with the kids. I got no kids of my own but I can imagine how my dad would feel if he's in your situation.
Just toss everything that links you with your ex to the dumpster, it feels good, really. (But keep everything, and I mean everything, that can be used against her in the future)
I realize you are telling what happened to you, but I simply find it hard to believe that the system is that biased against you, when your only problem is a lack of employment
I have a sneaky suspicion that the lack of employment and being behind in child support is the primary reason the judge came down hard on him. Some judges do not do things logically. There was a local judge here in Florida (Seminole county), who threw a bunch of people in jail for traffic citations, simply because they failed to appear in court because a court administrator accidentally directed them to the wrong court room. The judge went to lunch and refused to listen to his colleagues. These people were strip searched when they were sent to jail as part of standard procedure. The arrogant judge was eventually forced off the bench.
Child support is based on your previous two years of tax returns. Losing a job or taking a lessor job is not considered an excuse by most courts. Rocky was just outsmarted by his now ex-wife. The cards were stacked against him from the start with the high paying job in TX that his child support is based on. Has little to do with what is fair. I can tell you for a fact after 4 divorces. Thankfully I remarried my first wife and all is well again.
PS I would look for a lot of out of work UAW father's getting tossed in jail for not paying child support. May be the best time for Rocky to find his roots in Norway.
Lack of employement can spell disaster in front of some judges. When it comes to things like kids some judges tend to be reeallllyyy biased, and lack of employement rings their bells easiest......
It's not about the tax return in this case IMO, both the opposite side's lawyer and the judge may attack you by simply asking "what are you gonna do without a job?"
It's happened to a good friend once, but luckily she quickly found a new job within a month or so and got her son back...
"Ford sponsors American Idol and uses UAW labor... "...just thought of something,,,if Chrysler and GM can hopefully tell the UAW where to go in their bankruptcies, what is Ford to do???...in the past, the UAW would use "pattern bargaining" to strike (no pun) a deal with one automaker, then move on to the other 2...if GM/Chrysler have major concessions, can Ford "reverse-pattern-bargain" and possibly allow all 3 to kill of the world's worst disease, the UAW???
If not, will Ford be stuck paying floorsweepers $35/hour???
I see that there is great resentment for unions. If people like working for less in "RIGHT TO WORK FOR LESS STATES" that's your choice to do so. Each person has the right to sell him or her self for whatever they feel they are worth. Personally I have worked for several unions. The FireFighters Union, Teamsters, Carpenters Local 1089 in Phoenix , AZ. In every case non-union people begged to be allowed to join. My experience is Unions bring up the standard of living for workers and their families. My best earnings over my working life were while I was in a union.
Now for those of you who don't like unions, don't join. You have a perfect right to work where you please and to set the value you are willing to sell your lives and time for, what ever it is you believe you deserve. $28.00 an hour sure beats $12.00 and hour.
Our country is based on freedom of choice, and unions are not for everyone. Not everyone is suited for self employment either. These stupid notes against unions is un-Anerican. I have spent the last 40 years of my life carring the scars and pain serving our country, so we could protect our right to work as we want. Instead of downgrading and fault finding, encourage those who are making poor wages to get education and better their income and give themselves and their families a better living. If a union would help that's our free choice, or as some feel it just does not fit them. Would you non-union folks like to control our freedom as well?
That is the problem. The UAW folks that would like to keep their job are tied to the apron strings of the UAW leadership. They cannot say I would rather work for $20 per hour than to lose my unskilled labor job. I know I cannot go anywhere else in the World and make $30 an hour sticking fenders on cars. Right to Work is a balance between goon mentality in SOME Unions and keeping industry in the state. I have also been in the CWA, Carpenters and 37 years a Teamster. I spent many of those years as a shop steward, and lamented the fact that management was too stupid to document and get rid of the losers. I blame the downfall of GM on poor management and a very greedy UNION. The UAW did very little to bring those around them up to their level of wages and benefits. It was either you are with US or you get dumped in the river. If the UAW represented skilled people it would be a different story. These are people barely able to sign their names and read a safety poster according to Lee Ioccoca. They have used thug tactics to get what they have and are now about to lose it all.
If non union people were begging to get into the Union it was your responsibility to get them cards to sign and push for an NLRB election. I was involved in several over my time in the Teamsters. The Teamsters gained 80,000+ members last year. While the UAW has lost. The difference is working with the company so all will make money. The UAW does not have the brain power to do that.
Actually I see more resentment towards non-union people from you. We're against UAW, and yes some of us do resent UAW, not all unions!!!
We don;t wish to control union poeple's freedom, it's the union people that wish to control the freedom of non-union people. We don't force unions to die, but unions keep trying to force all states to be unionized. How's that???
We despise UAW for helping our country heading towards it's doom. Can you actually blame us for that? We don't think UAW workers are worth what they're paid, and I believe we're free to think so. Apparently the employers think so too as UAW workers keep getting paycuts.
Here's the vital part. I believe almost none of us anti-UAWs have a problem with UAW or even care about it UNTIL they go to the government asking for taxpayers' money. Who are they, and what good have they done for us that they even dare ask for our help?
I don;t think any of us have problems with teachers' union or firefighters union or such. It's UAW we have issues with.
Before you respond, please don't refer to deeds unions (including UAW!!!) did in the past, like 50-100 years ago, their value is already expired. If you wish to respond, try giving us examples of deeds UAW has done for us these days.
>We despise UAW for helping our country heading towards it's doom.
While the higher costs of UAW assembly than the fresh new plants and nonunion, right-to-work assembly folk of the foreign brands at the plants where they assemble here have cost some jobs moving to other countries, the real problem is managements of companies moving jobs that are NOT union out of the country that is causing the failure of the US business structure. If you accept that it's more important for a company to have high profits to pay a lot of highly paid management folk than it is to have lots of workers producing, then the UAW is minor.
Look at all the Walmart suppliers they have moved to China.
I'm still waiting for the Messiah to do away with NAFTA as promised in hope and change campaign. That also will help jobs here.
Which is it that has caused the US to fall? UAW and the assembly jobs moved away or the companies in search of higher profits on those NIKE shoes?
the real problem is managements of companies moving jobs that are NOT union out of the country that is causing the failure of the US business structure.
On one hand the Unionistas like to say that the UAW created the middle class and raised American wages for everyone.....
On the other hand, you say that the nonunion wages (that the UAW raised according to you) are too high and that's what caused the move overseas.
You can't have it both ways.
By the way, as others have stated, I don't have a problem with unionization in general. Done right, a good union can work with management to make the workplace better. There are bad and stupid managers, and if the union helps senior management find out they're doing something bad or stupid, the problem manager can be fixed or fired before the problems become damaging to the workers and the company.
I've had that relationship with my Union Presidents. If they called with a problem it was a real problem and they knew I'd have it fixed. If I investigated and it was a misperception, I could explain that and the issue would drop. If an employee was bad, they'd let us take the right action. THAT's the way it should work.
The UAW (generally speaking) hasn't worked that way for at least a couple of generations now. Their only goal has been "More for less". This is not to say that GM management is blameless... they're actually the ones who destroyed the company. However, the UAW didn't give a damn what management did, as long as the workers got more money and more breaktime.
the companies in search of higher profits on those NIKE shoes?
Let's not forgot all the high tech computer jobs IBM is shipping to India. These are non-union jobs where the employee had at least a bachelor's degree in computer science. I know this is fact cuz I used to work for IBM and still keep in touch with folks that work there. Why are they doing that? Simply because the labor is cheaper and helps their bottom line.
"If the UAW represented skilled people it would be a different story. These are people barely able to sign their names and read a safety poster according to Lee Ioccoca."...I can also attest from personal experience that when handed a one-page form to fill out, many of them needed 15-20 minutes just to fill in their name and address, and it looked like they barely knew what the letters were...whoever thinks these are an educated work force, like rocky thinks, think again...they border on total illiteracy, which suits them fine, I guess, because the work they do, what few times they work, only needs a few hours of training, so attracting the illiterate seems to be a good match...
The union sent an e-mail to members Sunday night asking them to call or e-mail President Barack Obama to protest the imports and factory closures. The company has not identified which factories it will shutter or whether the 16 plants targeted include previously announced closures. GM says it is negotiating the details with the union.
"The UAW strongly objects to GM's plan to close 16 manufacturing facilities in the United States, while at the same time dramatically increasing the number of vehicles it will be importing from Mexico, Korea, Japan and China for sale in this country," the e-mail said.
Gee, the union wants:
1 - protest imports (!) 2 - don't outsource jobs 3 - don't cut their benefits
How do they really expect a company to be competitive and yet meet all three of the above?
I don't think they're ever going to get it. They will go down all the way, just like at Eastern. "If the company doesn't give us what we want, we will take it down". And they have.
1 - protest imports (!) 2 - don't outsource jobs 3 - don't cut their benefits
This is a few years late for the union to start caring. I note they don't suggest alternatives on their part to help the ailing company; they only suggest what they don't like in the way of 4-year old listing their wants.
So, tell me what I do not understand...how can anyone consider themselves sane and support this union in what it wants to do and the way it thinks...and for anyone who DOES support this UAW, explain to me with a straight face how this union is good for ANYBODY...the compnay, the workers, the nation, anybody???
So, tell me what I do not understand...how can anyone consider themselves sane and support this union in what it wants to do and the way it thinks...and for anyone who DOES support this UAW, explain to me with a straight face how this union is good for ANYBODY...the company, the workers, the nation, anybody???
Bob, you obviously don't understand. We should protest the imports for competing with our companies. Then we should throw up huge tariffs against those imports (even the ones made/assembled in this country. After all, a union job is more important than a non-union job from a southerner. Then the D3 will be restored to their days of glory, and the consumer will just have no choice but to buy what they make.
If I want a BMW 3-series, well then I need to buy a G8 or a CTS. If I want a Honda Odyssey then I just need to buy a Dodge Caravan. And if I want a Mazda 3 then I'll just need to have my Cobalt or Focus instead. After all, it's not about choice or being the best, it's about preserving union jobs. :P If not enough D3 cars sell, then that's ok because their will be the jobs bank and the American car customers will just need to suck it up and pay a few grand more per car to preserve those great jobs with living wages and jobs banks. And don't forget the retirees!
And all those new tariffs won't affect our economy or trade relationships in other ways - why we will just drill for more oil ourselves! Perhaps those southerners out of work from assembling those foreign nameplate cars can work for the oil companies. I can see it really helping our economy.
Because they long for the heady days of the past lined with greed and dysfunction. Those days are all history now. The new negotiation is to even HAVE a job. Intersting to see how that works for them now that they will be part owners.
When the government gets involved and you can see any improvement, then you know there was huge excess that now is snapping back to sanity.
is part owner, or possibly majority owner, and cars do not sell (I wonder if the American people may perform the final backlash and simply ignore the Big 3, now that the curtain is removed from the wizard), will the UAW finally understand the need to lay off even more of their own???
Can't they see the handwriting on the wall, ot is all this happening because they DO see the writing on the wall???
How long did it take Eastern Airline mechanics before they finally figured out the golden goose was dead???...and now the UAW???
>"I don;t think any of us have problems with teachers' union or firefighters union or such. It's UAW we have issues with."
I have problems with any union that makes it near impossible to get rid of someone not doing their job!
I have problems with any union where pay raises and better jobs are geared to seniority rather than merit. If the senior person is doing the expected job, then longevity should be the tie breaker, but not "just because" they have seniority.
I have problems when layoffs affect the newest workers first, if they are doing a better job than those with more seniority.
If the senior worker is doing the best they can, showing up sober for work every day, and so forth, but just can't do a job any longer due to age or physical problems; Then management should have the ability and obligation to find a position that person can do. I believe they are "Entitled" to that, because they are loyal and care about what they are doing.
Now that our Pres. has just bought GM. and then will force them to make china crap. WOW! Let's see now! American workers go to work for the big three. The big three treats the workers like crap. the workers join the union. for a fee of course. The union takes a stand against the big three with negotiations for more money and benefits for the workers. Now, Let's not forget that the UNION supports the Democrats with your money. weather, you like the democrats or not. The big three close the doors and tell the workers to take a hike. and, tell the workers, we can't afford to give you all that you want in cash and benefits. The union has all the workers money that they could use right now. Now that they are all out of work. The BIG three executives fly the fancy lear jets to Washington to get some free money. Payed for by "WE THE PEOPLE" the union is still in the picture and riding along side the executives of the BIG three to Washington, for the money of course. Because they have friends in high places. Washington elected officials and friends of the BIG three give the money to the big three. Fire the top man and put their own friend in place to look over the Auto Company's then Sell out to China and make big profits? Now Remember! China runs their auto company's and our elected just put them right into our country. Remember China is our enemy. And,They do wish us harm. And no one is questioning all this. or it seems. Top executives get a bonus. Unions get some money for nothing. And, elected officials i'm sure get a little chunk of kick back money. under the table of course. all are happy! Shake Hands have a cold one around the bar have a nice dinner and some dancing to sell-a-brate the occasion. WOW! What a deal. And the American auto workers have been talking smack about the Japanese auto makers. Just remember one thing. The Japanese Hate's China and China Hate's Japan. Japan is our friend and has been for some time now. We will all need the support from Japan soon i would bet. CHINA :lemon:'s coming to a town near you.
American car customers will just need to suck it up and pay a few grand more per car to preserve those great jobs with living wages and jobs banks. And don't forget the retirees!
I am getting a mixed message with the rhetoric surrounding Obama's mandates. If GM (Government Motors) is to stay in business it has to focus on small fuel efficient cars, trucks and SUVs. The old GM was NEVER able to build a fuel efficient car (30+MPG) with UAW labor. It sounds like the new GM CEO Obama has NO problem importing small cars from China. What does he plan to do with all his buddies in the UAW? Will he offer them jobs in the Chinese factories? With a free ride to Beijing on a return from delivering a load of Buicks?
Obama has NO problem importing small cars from China.
I would never touch anything that isn't assembled here in the USofA and a majority of the contents are also made here, Honda, Toyota, Ford, GM, Chrysler, or Nissan, doesn't matter as long it's put together HERE with parts made HERE.
Comments
That's why a company becomes "Too Big NOT to FAIL". The individual's effort and creativity is snuffed out by the insidious levels of management that proliferate seeking only numbers on a piece of paper. :sick:
Regards,
OW
No, my assuption is everything being made here. Most companies are too small for unionization. Even at that, with modernization, even this country is becoming "too small" with states competing against one another. We talk about Florida not having any income tax, and that being an advantage over other states. Fla. has this advantage because of Mickey Mouse and good weather. No other reason. Now, I can blame the state of RI all I want for not "luring" Mickey here, but the weather is beyond our control. yet, we up here lose jobs to Fla. because of the taxes. All everybody says is too bad, but I can't say too bad to my insurance company that loses billions in Fla. to all the hurricanes they get, yet expect me to pay for it.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Must just be a Honda thing.
Regards,
OW
I'm not sure what being decent has to do with overpaying someone for the level of skill they bring to the company. I have a friend that is a decent person and a janitor. He never complains that he is getting $12 per hour. He is thankful he does not have to flip burgers for $8 per hour. That is the real issue with the UAW. In 1998 when they were the top paid unskilled workers in the USA they went on strike for more money. Same in 2005, 2007 and 2008. Made no difference to those ignorant workers that they could be replaced in a heartbeat for half or less. Now it is likely they will all lose their jobs. And decent or not they were over paid and killed the company.
So about 12:45 when we came back through to find out if we were having court I was told they had divorced me without me being present. :mad: It is a Kangaroo court in Texas and you are guilty until proven innocent with criminal charges and divorce. I did find out that my spouse was arrested a 3rd time while in jail and the corrections officers said my wife was a psychopath. The corrupt Judge signed the decree and it was final. Neither I or my now ex wife signed it. She still doesn't have a drivers license. I also discovered she had a impersonator who said he was me and took responsibility for these hot checks. At 6:45 p.m. on Friday I was suppose to meet my wife at a pizza place in Dalhart, TX to see my two little kids. Instead Rocky who has held two national security clearances and protected our nations nuclear weapon stockpile was treated like a common criminal and was cuffed and stuffed. I spent 2 1/2 days in jail and was the most truamatic thing that has ever happened to me. I have no real visitation rights to my kids and my spouse can dictate when, how long, where, I can visit my kids. I also am not allowed to take the kids out of the county she resides in. The day after the divorce since she knew I was there obviously thus she changed her address to Weatherford, TX 6 1/2 hours away. I would be on a wild goose chase. This story I'm certain will be told in the media and you guys will see me on TV before it's over. :sick:
When I was sitting in jail for crimes I didn't do I will admit I thought about each of you and now many of you might understand why I have such hate for Texas and the south. I would have more rights as father in [non-permissible content removed] Germany and I honestly mean that. :sick:
When I get some free time as I'm very busy as you all can imagine I would love to rejoin this topic.
-Rocky aka rockylee
But I'm sure Texas doesn't have UAW in their auto plants so it must be a good place to live and have right-to-work!!! :P
Sounds like the courts operate like Pelosi/Reed's congress these days. If she's a psycho, how does she still have possession of the kids? Has anyone contacted Judge Judy? She'll set it all straight; she's always telling the audience how omniscient she (Judge Judy) is about what's really happened in people's backgrounds and about their motives. Only trouble is she doesn't seem to like men. She's harder on them. Well, that sounds like TX.
You worried me with that jail stuff in your email.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I have let all the others bash the UAW in your absence. Nothing else to be said, really, and no one's changing their minds at all on the topic. It remains the hottest 'News and Views' topic, though.
rock, I wish you the best and keep your chin up. You've now been to the Big 'D' and I don't mean Dallas. :sick: Sorry, I couldn't resist.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
I believe they were elected by the 92-99 types. Probably appointees for good campaign contributions.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Also the UAW has not done any better since you left. I think they managed to push GM closer to Bankruptcy.
It doesn't. My point was that replacing the "300,000 employees" in Bob's example is only simple on paper.
Of course, maybe I ought to move to Texas and do divorce law...it apparently "pays" to represent the wife in the proceedings...
Sorry about your kids, but at least now you are single, so all those "friends" you write about you can now pursue...
Do you have to pay any child support or alimony???
We almost lost him on a recent ride up from AC doing 95 m.p.h. when his state trooper lost it! Wouldn't have changed the tax structure much, however!
Regards,
OW
I will close by saying a bunch of car dealerships around here and in Texas have or are closing. It's been really sad to watch. Beth whom I saw last nite only has 2 cars out for the month thus she is bumming pretty hard.
-Rocky
P.S. Thanks for all your support. Keep this topic alive with good debate. I want to return to a topic where Bob and Gagrice are still trying to tell me that UAW workers aren't worth $0.35 cents an hour and cooterbfd, fintail, lemko, are saying the neocons are running working class folks into the ground. I will also note that a lot of money folks went BK in the past couple of years in the Texas Panhandle which suprised me. I drove by building that were half started and the people ran out of money. It was real sad to see no matter what my personal feelings are about that part of the country.
Sorry to hear of your family situation. Witnessing what's happened to you and other guys I've known go through similar situations is what keeps me forever single. I can see why some otherwise law-abiding guys lose it and commit the ultimate crime.
But look on the bright side - this too shall pass. Hey, maybe we can make that trip to Norway to meet some of those beautiful Scandinavian women when times get better?
But luckily there is no alimony so that is a BIG item in your favor. I work with a guy who hired a crappy divorce lawyer and has to pay his ex LIFETIME alimony. And her BF (who was his gardner) is now living in the house that he's also paying the mortgage on. Now THAT would put goofy thoughts in my mind.
rocky, I agree with mikefm, but, as always, it takes $$$ to hire one of us...but, if that much forgery can be proven, she would serve time here in GA, or, if not, she could lose primary custody of the kids...I realize you are telling what happened to you, but I simply find it hard to believe that the system is that biased against you, when your only problem is a lack of employment, obviously shared by many people at this time...
I do not comprehend a judge that would ignore all that theft and forgery and rule against you...only if YOU had a criminal record, and with your previous jobs and training, I get the impression that you had SOME level of security clearance along with your gun-totin' skills...
Well, despite our differences, sorry to hear that man. Hope things get better soon, especially with the kids. I got no kids of my own but I can imagine how my dad would feel if he's in your situation.
Just toss everything that links you with your ex to the dumpster, it feels good, really. (But keep everything, and I mean everything, that can be used against her in the future)
goodluck.
I have a sneaky suspicion that the lack of employment and being behind in child support is the primary reason the judge came down hard on him. Some judges do not do things logically. There was a local judge here in Florida (Seminole county), who threw a bunch of people in jail for traffic citations, simply because they failed to appear in court because a court administrator accidentally directed them to the wrong court room. The judge went to lunch and refused to listen to his colleagues. These people were strip searched when they were sent to jail as part of standard procedure. The arrogant judge was eventually forced off the bench.
PS
I would look for a lot of out of work UAW father's getting tossed in jail for not paying child support. May be the best time for Rocky to find his roots in Norway.
It's not about the tax return in this case IMO, both the opposite side's lawyer and the judge may attack you by simply asking "what are you gonna do without a job?"
It's happened to a good friend once, but luckily she quickly found a new job within a month or so and got her son back...
Regards,
OW
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
Makes America Idol look sad, especially this Tuesday night's likely winner...
On topic--Ford sponsors American Idol and uses UAW labor...
ALEXANDER RYBAK FAIRYTALE
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
If not, will Ford be stuck paying floorsweepers $35/hour???
Now for those of you who don't like unions, don't join. You have a perfect right to work where you please and to set the value you are willing to sell your lives and time for, what ever it is you believe you deserve. $28.00 an hour sure beats $12.00 and hour.
Our country is based on freedom of choice, and unions are not for everyone. Not everyone is suited for self employment either. These stupid notes against unions is un-Anerican. I have spent the last 40 years of my life carring the scars and pain serving our country, so we could protect our right to work as we want. Instead of downgrading and fault finding, encourage those who are making poor wages to get education and better their income and give themselves and their families a better living. If a union would help that's our free choice, or as some feel it just does not fit them. Would you non-union folks like to control our freedom as well?
farout
If non union people were begging to get into the Union it was your responsibility to get them cards to sign and push for an NLRB election. I was involved in several over my time in the Teamsters. The Teamsters gained 80,000+ members last year. While the UAW has lost. The difference is working with the company so all will make money. The UAW does not have the brain power to do that.
We don;t wish to control union poeple's freedom, it's the union people that wish to control the freedom of non-union people. We don't force unions to die, but unions keep trying to force all states to be unionized. How's that???
We despise UAW for helping our country heading towards it's doom. Can you actually blame us for that? We don't think UAW workers are worth what they're paid, and I believe we're free to think so. Apparently the employers think so too as UAW workers keep getting paycuts.
Here's the vital part. I believe almost none of us anti-UAWs have a problem with UAW or even care about it UNTIL they go to the government asking for taxpayers' money. Who are they, and what good have they done for us that they even dare ask for our help?
I don;t think any of us have problems with teachers' union or firefighters union or such. It's UAW we have issues with.
Before you respond, please don't refer to deeds unions (including UAW!!!) did in the past, like 50-100 years ago, their value is already expired. If you wish to respond, try giving us examples of deeds UAW has done for us these days.
While the higher costs of UAW assembly than the fresh new plants and nonunion, right-to-work assembly folk of the foreign brands at the plants where they assemble here have cost some jobs moving to other countries, the real problem is managements of companies moving jobs that are NOT union out of the country that is causing the failure of the US business structure. If you accept that it's more important for a company to have high profits to pay a lot of highly paid management folk than it is to have lots of workers producing, then the UAW is minor.
Look at all the Walmart suppliers they have moved to China.
I'm still waiting for the Messiah to do away with NAFTA as promised in hope and change campaign. That also will help jobs here.
Which is it that has caused the US to fall? UAW and the assembly jobs moved away or the companies in search of higher profits on those NIKE shoes?
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
UAW is one of them, though not the only reason.
Which is it that has caused the US to fall? UAW and the assembly jobs moved away or the companies in search of higher profits on those NIKE shoes?
That's a dumb question, the answer is: Both.
On one hand the Unionistas like to say that the UAW created the middle class and raised American wages for everyone.....
On the other hand, you say that the nonunion wages (that the UAW raised according to you) are too high and that's what caused the move overseas.
You can't have it both ways.
By the way, as others have stated, I don't have a problem with unionization in general. Done right, a good union can work with management to make the workplace better. There are bad and stupid managers, and if the union helps senior management find out they're doing something bad or stupid, the problem manager can be fixed or fired before the problems become damaging to the workers and the company.
I've had that relationship with my Union Presidents. If they called with a problem it was a real problem and they knew I'd have it fixed. If I investigated and it was a misperception, I could explain that and the issue would drop. If an employee was bad, they'd let us take the right action. THAT's the way it should work.
The UAW (generally speaking) hasn't worked that way for at least a couple of generations now. Their only goal has been "More for less". This is not to say that GM management is blameless... they're actually the ones who destroyed the company. However, the UAW didn't give a damn what management did, as long as the workers got more money and more breaktime.
Let's not forgot all the high tech computer jobs IBM is shipping to India. These are non-union jobs where the employee had at least a bachelor's degree in computer science. I know this is fact cuz I used to work for IBM and still keep in touch with folks that work there. Why are they doing that? Simply because the labor is cheaper and helps their bottom line.
"The UAW strongly objects to GM's plan to close 16 manufacturing facilities in the United States, while at the same time dramatically increasing the number of vehicles it will be importing from Mexico, Korea, Japan and China for sale in this country," the e-mail said.
Gee, the union wants:
1 - protest imports (!)
2 - don't outsource jobs
3 - don't cut their benefits
How do they really expect a company to be competitive and yet meet all three of the above?
I don't think they're ever going to get it. They will go down all the way, just like at Eastern. "If the company doesn't give us what we want, we will take it down". And they have.
GM deserved better than this.
1 - protest imports (!)
2 - don't outsource jobs
3 - don't cut their benefits
This is a few years late for the union to start caring. I note they don't suggest alternatives on their part to help the ailing company; they only suggest what they don't like in the way of 4-year old listing their wants.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I think the Popsicle-or at least the stick-will prove more valuable long term...
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-2021 Sahara 4xe-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Bob, you obviously don't understand. We should protest the imports for competing with our companies. Then we should throw up huge tariffs against those imports (even the ones made/assembled in this country. After all, a union job is more important than a non-union job from a southerner. Then the D3 will be restored to their days of glory, and the consumer will just have no choice but to buy what they make.
If I want a BMW 3-series, well then I need to buy a G8 or a CTS. If I want a Honda Odyssey then I just need to buy a Dodge Caravan. And if I want a Mazda 3 then I'll just need to have my Cobalt or Focus instead. After all, it's not about choice or being the best, it's about preserving union jobs. :P If not enough D3 cars sell, then that's ok because their will be the jobs bank and the American car customers will just need to suck it up and pay a few grand more per car to preserve those great jobs with living wages and jobs banks. And don't forget the retirees!
And all those new tariffs won't affect our economy or trade relationships in other ways - why we will just drill for more oil ourselves! Perhaps those southerners out of work from assembling those foreign nameplate cars can work for the oil companies. I can see it really helping our economy.
When the government gets involved and you can see any improvement, then you know there was huge excess that now is snapping back to sanity.
Regards,
OW
Can't they see the handwriting on the wall, ot is all this happening because they DO see the writing on the wall???
How long did it take Eastern Airline mechanics before they finally figured out the golden goose was dead???...and now the UAW???
I have problems with any union that makes it near impossible to get rid of someone not doing their job!
I have problems with any union where pay raises and better jobs are geared to seniority rather than merit. If the senior person is doing the expected job, then longevity should be the tie breaker, but not "just because" they have seniority.
I have problems when layoffs affect the newest workers first, if they are doing a better job than those with more seniority.
If the senior worker is doing the best they can, showing up sober for work every day, and so forth, but just can't do a job any longer due to age or physical problems; Then management should have the ability and obligation to find a position that person can do. I believe they are "Entitled" to that, because they are loyal and care about what they are doing.
Kip
I am getting a mixed message with the rhetoric surrounding Obama's mandates. If GM (Government Motors) is to stay in business it has to focus on small fuel efficient cars, trucks and SUVs. The old GM was NEVER able to build a fuel efficient car (30+MPG) with UAW labor. It sounds like the new GM CEO Obama has NO problem importing small cars from China. What does he plan to do with all his buddies in the UAW? Will he offer them jobs in the Chinese factories? With a free ride to Beijing on a return from delivering a load of Buicks?
I would never touch anything that isn't assembled here in the USofA and a majority of the contents are also made here, Honda, Toyota, Ford, GM, Chrysler, or Nissan, doesn't matter as long it's put together HERE with parts made HERE.