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-Rocky
P.S. I do not shop at Wal~Mart, and it's not my union buddy's that are buying their shoddy toxic crap !!! That would be your pseudo-capitalist, free marketeer, buddy's. :mad:
Wrong "o" big time Rocky. The amount I have invested into Social Security should pay me way more than that check I get each month. If I had just put the money in a savings account I would reap a way bigger monthly benefit without ever touching the principle. You can thank your idol JFK for robbing the SS fund and dumping it into the general fund. Then Congress acts like they are doing the recipients a big favor each month. Social Security is a joke as a retirement fund. Those of US that worked all our adult lives paying into that black hole are being cheated by the US Government. You will be cheated even worse if you work 45 years and expect to collect. I am thankful for having a good Union retirement that pays over twice as much per month as SS.
And as far as the National debt. FDR ran up a bigger percentage of our GDP as debt than any Presidents since. So I inherited a big National debt just as you are and our children and Grandchildren will. The ONLY President to pay back ONE penny of the National debt was Ike. So those Presidents that like to claim a balanced budget did nothing to lower our debt.
Thanks, lemko !!!
Shoot, if all the merchandise sold at Sears, Sports Authority, Circuit City and others was made here, virtually NO AMERICANS who wanted to work would be out of a job. There would be a lot less social ills like poverty, crime, drug abuse, alcoholism, child abuse, etc. as well. Come to Philadelphia which was once called "The Workshop of the World!" Postindustrial Philly is now refered to as "Killadelphia." I'm sure there would be a lot less thugs shooting people if they had viable jobs like there once were at Disston Saw, Dodge Steel, Botany 500, Stetson Hat, Baldwin Locomotive, The Budd Company, Philco, Merck, General Electric, Breyer's Ice Cream, Whitman Chocolate, etc.
EXACTLY !!! Replace the drugs, and guns, with a good paying industrial/factory job !!!
-Rocky
Some can rah-rah-rah-rah and rip ol' Rocky, about his age and so-called lack of living it. I remember it as I was their marching along side my IUE rep grandmother on strikes, organizing campaigns, labor day marches, union meetings, I lived in politics in the 80's. So yeah, my take of seeing working people take the Reagan, bullet view is much different than yours. My grandmother, whom I probably love, and respect, more than any one person on this earth helped raise me. I was spoiled rotten by her getting to swim in the hotel pools, while she was off negotiating contracts, and handling other union business that I couldn't attend. I as a child thought it was a huge treat to go "out to eat". I as a youngster, got to meet alot of powerful people through her. I didn't at that age "grasp" just how powerful some of these folks were but I do remember many of the conversations like the patriot missile deal, GM Strike, Rowe Strike, Organizing Campaigns, labor marches, and sat many hours in the IUE District 8 union hall here in Grand Rapids. I can still remember Grandma's office piled with stacks of paperwork and the smell of coffee.
My grandmother also went to Washington D.C. on behalf of the IUE to fight Reagan, on making the Patriot Missle outside of the U.S. :mad: Raytheon, was going to set up shop in China, to assemble this missile because they could do it a lot cheaper. Reagan, as senial as he was or should I say Nancy (whom was in control the last 2-3 years) thought this was a great idea !!!! :mad:
So I don't want to hear how great Reagan, was and how JFK, robbed the SS fund because Reagan, H.W. Bush, W. Bush, blew billions of S.S. money on "big military" and wars we started. :mad: Each one of them were anti-union, anti-worker, anti-american, with their domestic policies. :mad:
Grandma, has to have triple bypass surgery tomorrow at 7:00 a.m. in the morning in Florida, so if I'm a little more fired up than normal this evening she is on my mind.
-Rocky
Now that's almost funny. With that I statement I honestly believe you don't shop at Walmart to see who it is that is shopping there.
Funny thing is, when my FIL was a United Steel Workers of America worker, the union gave the workers Sam's Club memberships.
You could "BUY AMERICAN" at Wal~Mart, at one time because Sam, had sense in his head !!!
-Rocky
I pray your grandmother comes through the surgery with flying colors.
lemko...I am not defending WalMart or the Chinese goods they sell...Walmart is a magnificently-run company, and many other companies could learn from their efficiencies...thay have cut overhead to the bone in order to lower prices...
But all I am saying is that Walmart does not control the American public, the public controls Walmart...if we stopped buying the Chinese goods, they would gather dust on the shelves...and, one thing W-M will NOT tolerate is merchandise that gathers dust and will not sell...that is my point...whereas an average company might take a year to realize that a product does not sell, W-M will know it in 30 days because their computers and sales tracking ARE so efficient, light years ahead of anyone else...
If they see products not selling, and folks take a minute to walk up to the store manager and say "I like shopping here, but I will not buy Chinese made goods"...if s/he hears this 500 or 5000 times in a month, and they start to see that Chinese goods gather dust, and multiply that by 1000 (how many stores are there?) or 5000 stores, you could see China go into a depression in 90 days, because no company will buy their products if consumers will not buy them at retail...
Then, do that at Sports Authority for their sweatshirts and high-end sneakers, Old Navy for all their cotton goods, etc....the American consumer could turnaround the entire retail market in about 3-6 months...but that means that the average person must say NO to their plasma TV, cell phone, shirts, pants, shoes, etc...
Can we do it???...for many consumer goods, we really can read labels and talk to management, but we must hang on...if we capitualte in 30 days, China is back on top...
But it is a 2 edged sword...if the manufacturing comes back, can we pay $30 an hour to someone who folds shirts???...probably not...should they be allowed to unionize???...well, if the union is like others where the workers slow the line down to 60% of its normal capacity, something has to give, and it means no unions...we will need maximum productivity if the plants are to come back here, plain and simple...
Let's face it...for someone to take the risk of moving back here, they must know that there will not be any work rules that stifle quality and production, like the UAW has done for 40 years...those days are gone...
If one take the financial risk to set up shop here, then maximum productivity must be assured, or any employee can be instantly fired, no grievance process...all that ever did was keep lousy workers making the cars, and we cannot allow that anymore...
We must become competitive with the Chinese cost, or come close to it, or else no one will take the financial risk, even if we stop buying Chinese goods...boycotting Chinese goods is only half the equation, we need financial incentive to build the plants here, and if employees can unionize and slow production as unions are designed to do, there will be NO plants built here, because no one wants to replicate the half century of crap we lived with from the UAW...those days are over, forever...
You want manufacturing jobs back here???...agree to those work rules above, and someone just might take the risk...anything else is a guaranteed NO, as the financial risk would be impossible to overcome if labor is the problem, and if unions exist, then labor is the problem...period...
rocky: prayers for your grandmother...
Gonna have to watch that one and see how the guy did survive out in the wild for so long.
What's wrong with buying Asian goods? I agree, if they are toys and contain lead paint then there's a problem. It's a free-market society. My dollar goes to what will buy me the most for less. Simply put. If my dollar is earned honestly then I have the right to spend it how I wish.
I don't agree with cheating, in any form. Cheating on taxes is wrong. How many of you will plan on cheating on your Fed. and state income taxes.
rocky...that is one thing that American people are very good at. Cheating. That drives up prices for all of us. I don't want to hear that I have to buy American or Union-made products. It is a capitalistic, free-market economy. I'll buy Kia, Mitsubishi...I may even take a Ford Verve test drive in about 5 years...if it's an all-electric vehicle.
The PATCO dorks were just that--dorks exemplified. Selfish, stupid, short-sighted dorks. Dishonest and selfish. That they are union people is...well...proving my point on this forum, eh? A big 'ol Canadian eh for ya.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
-Rocky
Because they are so greedy, they will go to no length to make sure all the ma and pa shops are out of business. That's not efficiency Marsha7, it's just plain insane. How does Wal~Mart, benefit a city ???? They displace more workers than they create and they pay crap wages, offer zero benefits, (unless your middle management) and think they can use Eminent Domain, at their discretion. They fought the city of Canyon, Tx on their right to build there for most of my time in Tx. :mad:
But all I am saying is that Walmart does not control the American public, the public controls Walmart...if we stopped buying the Chinese goods, they would gather dust on the shelves...and, one thing W-M will NOT tolerate is merchandise that gathers dust and will not sell...that is my point...whereas an average company might take a year to realize that a product does not sell, W-M will know it in 30 days because their computers and sales tracking ARE so efficient, light years ahead of anyone else...
Huh ??? Do/Did you work for them or did you read about this somewhere ??? The last time I was in one which was in Texas, their shelves didn't look to "organized" to me. Hell the dept. clerk didn't know if he had what I was looking for or carried it.
If they see products not selling, and folks take a minute to walk up to the store manager and say "I like shopping here, but I will not buy Chinese made goods"...if s/he hears this 500 or 5000 times in a month, and they start to see that Chinese goods gather dust, and multiply that by 1000 (how many stores are there?) or 5000 stores, you could see China go into a depression in 90 days, because no company will buy their products if consumers will not buy them at retail...
It's going to take more than us "Buy American" union folks to accomplish this. It's going to take "others" to assist us but the problem is you have people like "iluv" that don't give two hoots where it's made as long as it meets their needs and is at the right price.
Then, do that at Sports Authority for their sweatshirts and high-end sneakers, Old Navy for all their cotton goods, etc....the American consumer could turnaround the entire retail market in about 3-6 months...but that means that the average person must say NO to their plasma TV, cell phone, shirts, pants, shoes, etc...
Agree.... Some of the stuff you mentioned like sneakers you can buy american. Certain shoes like some New Balance, Boots like Wolverine, Union Label Jeans, King Louie and some Nemises, shirts are made here. Go to the "How to Buy American" website and you will find links on "how to buy american" :shades:
Can we do it???...for many consumer goods, we really can read labels and talk to management, but we must hang on...if we capitualte in 30 days, China is back on top...
No, because your generation has taught my generation pseudo-capitalism, is okay and if you have any nationalism thinking your are a socialist commie !!!
But it is a 2 edged sword...if the manufacturing comes back, can we pay $30 an hour to someone who folds shirts???...probably not...should they be allowed to unionize???...well, if the union is like others where the workers slow the line down to 60% of its normal capacity, something has to give, and it means no unions...we will need maximum productivity if the plants are to come back here, plain and simple...
Rah-Rah-Rah-Rah !!!! Bull crappy again marsha7 !!!! I'll offer my rebutal Mr. Marsha7 !!!
http://www.howtobuyamerican.com/content/ba-links.shtml
How do all these places make a profit using american labor many of which is union made. Ooooh that darn cat has got your tongue again !!!! :P
Let's face it...for someone to take the risk of moving back here, they must know that there will not be any work rules that stifle quality and production, like the UAW has done for 40 years...those days are gone...
That paragraph says it all !!!! Like the UAW, has done for 40 years. I as I said before and I'll say it again that people like my father can tear a machine a part and put it back togeather again. Some non-union worker like at Honda, has to shut down the line for 3 hours while 6 illegal alien maintainence dudes, and 4 vietnamese engineers try to figure out the problem when they could of hired 1 former UAW worker with common sense and he'd have it fixed and product would be out the door.
I know I exaggerated the illegal alien part but this is more/less what I witnessed in the non-union shops I worked in.
If one take the financial risk to set up shop here, then maximum productivity must be assured, or any employee can be instantly fired, no grievance process...all that ever did was keep lousy workers making the cars, and we cannot allow that anymore...
So you want managament to be allowed to run their plants like sweat shops/dictatorships. Do you want to take off the guards on the machines while your at it so you can speed up the process even more. If the worker cuts off his arm fire him. If he's killed, send his family a fruit cake, right ? :sick:
We must become competitive with the Chinese cost, or come close to it, or else no one will take the financial risk, even if we stop buying Chinese goods...boycotting Chinese goods is only half the equation, we need financial incentive to build the plants here, and if employees can unionize and slow production as unions are designed to do, there will be NO plants built here, because no one wants to replicate the half century of crap we lived with from the UAW...those days are over, forever...
Well many will argue the stuff made in the 50's and 60's by union labor was some of the best stuff ever !!! GM, refridgerators lasted forever. The cars were top notch in the world !!!! Who doesn't want to drive a 58' vette ? :shades The shoddy crap made today might be more energy efficient and high-tech but it's designed to fail. :mad:
You want manufacturing jobs back here???...agree to those work rules above, and someone just might take the risk...anything else is a guaranteed NO, as the financial risk would be impossible to overcome if labor is the problem, and if unions exist, then labor is the problem...period...
If unions are the only problem then why in the hell did all these non-union/union free shops leave the U.S. ??? Oh the cat got your tongue factor again !!!!
rocky: prayers for your grandmother...
I do appreciate it.
-Rocky
Gonna have to watch that one and see how the guy did survive out in the wild for so long.
Fantasy Land ???
What's wrong with buying Asian goods? I agree, if they are toys and contain lead paint then there's a problem. It's a free-market society. My dollar goes to what will buy me the most for less. Simply put. If my dollar is earned honestly then I have the right to spend it how I wish.
I like the crap out of you iluv, but their is a lot wrong with it. Not so much the Japanese, part of it but you are one who would buy a Geely, Chery, Brickland, and not feel a bit of remorse or find anything wrong with it.
I don't agree with cheating, in any form. Cheating on taxes is wrong. How many of you will plan on cheating on your Fed. and state income taxes.
Agree......
rocky...that is one thing that American people are very good at. Cheating. That drives up prices for all of us. I don't want to hear that I have to buy American or Union-made products. It is a capitalistic, free-market economy. I'll buy Kia, Mitsubishi...I may even take a Ford Verve test drive in about 5 years...if it's an all-electric vehicle.
You are right you don't have to buy as it is a free society. However, when you or a future generation loved one can't find a good job perhaps that thinking won't look so great after the fact ?
The PATCO dorks were just that--dorks exemplified. Selfish, stupid, short-sighted dorks. Dishonest and selfish. That they are union people is...well...proving my point on this forum, eh? A big 'ol Canadian eh for ya.
Well I respect each and every one of them for taking a stand against that senial worthless dictator. I know one of those PATCO dorks as iluv, calls them personally and he is a great man and friend of mine. All because a alztheimer, brain dead, fool tells you to get back to work or else.... My buddy "Neutron" Jack Welch, needs to import more Malaysian made goods.
-Rocky
Joe Smith started the day early having set his alarm
> clock (MADE IN JAPAN ) for 6am. While his coffeepot
> ( MADE IN CHINA ) was perking, he shaved with his
> electric razor ( MADE IN HONG KONG ). He put on a
> dress shirt ( MADE IN SRI LANKA ), designer jeans (
> MADE IN SINGAPORE ) and tennis shoes ( MADE IN KOREA
> ). After cooking his breakfast in his new electric
> skillet (MADE IN INDIA ) he sat down with his
> calculator ( MADE IN MEXICO ) to see how much he
> could spend today. After setting his watch ( MADE IN
> TAIWAN ) to the radio ( MADE IN INDIA ) he got in
> his car ( MADE IN GE! RMANY ) filled it with GAS
> from Saudi Arabia and continued his search for a
> good paying AMERICAN J OB At the end of yet another
> discouraging and fruitless day checking his Computer
> (Made In Malaysia ), Joe decided to relax for a
> while. He put on his sandals ( MADE IN BRAZIL )
> poured himself a glass of wine (MADE IN FRANCE ) and
> turned on his TV ( MADE IN INDONESIA ), and then
> wondered why he can't find a good paying job in
> AMERICA ...
Chester, PA - a huge pocket of poverty in one of Pennsylvania's wealthiest counties, once thrived as places like Sun Ship and Ford called it home. Chester's slogan once was "What Chester Makes Makes Chester!" Well, nothing is made in Chester these days so I guess Chester is nothing.
I have immense respect for factory workers as my Dad was one and he raised us three kids well. Dad was a very responsible parent who worked hard and raised us right, and yes, he was a union member!
As for Reagan, I sure didn't mourn him. I felt sorrier for Gerald Ford who at least seemed like a nice guy who got stuck with a job he really didn't want. Reagan was a doddering old fool who forgot his own union roots as he was once president of the Screen Actors' Guild.
A few years ago stories were published about how social security recipients received all that they had paid into the program in a short couple of years after they started collecting it. From then on they were living on the dole. This was published at a time when the recipients were saying how much more they should be getting because they had "paid in a whole lot of money."
Even if the employers' contribution and a moderate, safe investment, rate of interested were applied, the typical recipient then received all the money in about 4.5 years if I recall the number. In exchange for potential larger returns that were safe from the multimillion dollar executives grasp of companies the workers voted for their congresspeople who promised them more and more social security return.
It started as a subsidy; it is not supposed to be a retirement plan. But the subsidy-sized payments, in the minds of gimme-voters, are supposed to give luxury retirement checks for the rest of their long lives. And this is from many people who didn't save for their own retirement and lived mre extravagantly than they should have done. Then they expect taxes of others to subsidize their retirement.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
That's very true. A big share of large companies had retirement plans by the 1940s when SS started to kick in. Retirement plans started to be pilfered when the big conglomerates started buying up the smaller companies. That retirement fund was like a big nest egg to be filched. Now company paid retirements are mostly matching funds into 401K accounts. Which people should take advantage of.
My gripe is with the robbing of the Social Security fund in 1960s to fund the Vietnam war. If a person is going to pay in all his working years. He should get back at least what he pays in. I will have to live way past the national average to get just what I paid in. No interest on that money. I paid the maximum amount every year from 1966 until I retired in 2006. That is a lot more than was put into my Union retirement account. And as I have already mentioned the Union retirement is well over double Social Security.
The key word being Social. Or Socialized retirement. Where you rob me to pay some deadbeat that works a few years then expects a fat check from out of my pocket. We have a close friend that works in SSI. She is a case worker. She sees people everyday that have worked a very short time and are going on the Social Security roles. Most are parents of immigrants that are brought over just before they reach retirement age.
Rocky that is the reason the system will be broke when you get around to collecting. And you can thank your Democrat brothers and sisters for spreading the wealth to people that do NOT deserve to receive that money. I don't even think that FDR had that in mind when he pushed for SS in the beginning. It is pure and simple buying votes.
I agree, and it is especially true about vehicles. They are designed for a lot of miles and not many years. They crumple in the most minor of accidents and are not worth repairing.
On the Chinese front. Do not eat the Chinese dumplings.
TOKYO — At least eight Japanese were sickened, including a child who remains in a coma, after eating Chinese-made dumplings contaminated with an insecticide, police and health officials said Wednesday..
Looks like Japan is buying Chinese stuff also.
That is a great description of "reality" and thanks for posting it.
Rocky
-Rocky
-Rocky
-Rocky
-Rocky
Politics
Presidential Primaries and Election
Uphill Battle
Yep, we're open again for talk about the unions and the automakers. If we stray too far from the UAW, we'll go into hibernation again. So please try to keep it topical. Thanks.
Thursday, Moraine truck plant not affected yet
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
The Delphi workers are UAW, I believe, and despite lump sum payments may still get rebate checks from the economy stimulation package.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Detroit’s King of Delusion.
By Peter M. De Lorenzo
Detroit. What year is it again? 1968? 1978? How about 1988? No, actually, as most of us know, it’s 2008. But remarkably, there is one entity headquartered in this town that refuses to acknowledge reality, history, the writing on the wall, or anything even remotely resembling rational thought for that matter. The United Auto Workers union, that staunch bastion of head-in-the-sand, wrong-headed thinking – at least when what masquerades as their woefully skewed version of “thinking” rears its ugly head – launched a strike against American Axle & Manufacturing Holdings Inc. late Monday after negotiations broke down on a new labor deal.
What’s involved? 3,650 American Axle workers in Michigan and New York walked off the job and hit the picket lines, jeopardizing all truck production at GM, American Axle’s largest customer by far.
What part of this action seemed even remotely like a good idea? The domestic automobile industry – aka “Detroit” – has been in freefall for the better part of 25 years. This inexorable downward spiral has been punctuated by alarming annual losses in market share to the Asian and German manufacturers, as what was once formerly known as the “Big Three” saw their fortunes plummet. Detroit witnessed in horror as an entire generation of buyers, tired of mediocre products with average to dismal quality, abandoned the domestic manufacturers for imported brands in droves – never to return.
Pummeled by a $1500 per vehicle cost disadvantage brought on by absurdly expensive, union-driven healthcare costs – the most expensive and comprehensive programs of their kind in the nation - and crushing pension funding expenses, Detroit reeled as it tried to regain footing in the market, only to find that its way back was blocked by an uncooperative UAW and compounded by the fact that government-sanctioned currency manipulation was giving their Asian competitors a $1500 minimum advantage on every car and truck sold in this market – on top of the built-in cost disadvantages the Detroit automakers started out with.
But Detroit, determined to fight back, started to blow-up their obsolete processes and – paced by GM - rediscovered the fundamental law of this business that they had wandered away from so cavalierly in the past. And that is that The Product is and always will be King.
And hope emerged as GM rediscovered its product mojo and signs of life started to appear in the other Detroit manufacturers as well after years of being lost in the desert. And the UAW even got it together – or so it seemed anyway - agreeing to a series of what appeared to be landmark labor agreements last fall that would allow Detroit to at least approach being on a level playing field with their Asian and German rivals in terms of cost.
But I never bought into the words “groundbreaking” and “historic” – the terms bandied about last fall by the media in reference to the UAW - because I knew that deep down this labor organization was and is fundamentally flawed. That the UAW’s “M.O.” is not one of enlightened cooperation, but one of irrational, unflinching, relentless entitlement. That the words “we’ll get what we deserve” resonate far more through its depleted ranks than “we’ll have to do what’s best in order to see these companies remain competitive.”
The UAW only acquiesced to those agreements last fall because they had no other choice. Detroit was shrinking at a horrific pace and its market share couldn’t support anything but a dramatic consolidation, which meant that jobs would have to be cut and wages and benefits would have to be seriously reduced – or else. And at that point, the halcyon days of the UAW were indeed over.
While too many in the media back then were quick to canonize Ron Gettelfinger, the UAW President, and prematurely hail him as being some sort of “visionary” labor leader after those negotiations, I didn’t. Because I never thought the moniker “statesmanlike” should be used in reference to this intransigent, misguided, narrow-minded and maliciously inflexible individual who at any moment could and would choose to derail crucial agreements with the auto manufacturers or their suppliers, just because he could.
And as if right on cue, he demonstrated his true colors last fall when in the midst of those so-called “historic” agreements he authorized utterly futile and worthless work stoppages against the Detroit automakers in a pathetic, grandstanding gesture.
And now, here we go again.
In the face of massive layoffs in the automobile business as the Detroit manufacturers literally fight for their very survival, and with the state of Michigan mired in a monumental recession – one directly attributable to the dire straits the automakers find themselves in - the likes of which has never been seen before, and with foreclosures and unemployment at record levels, and with the mood grim and full of despair as desperation sets in for countless citizens in this region, this miserable excuse for a leader does the most un-statesmanlike thing he could possibly do by calling for a strike against American Axle that absolutely no one can afford, least of all the workers involved.
It’s no wonder that Steve Miller, the blunt, no-nonsense, straight-talking Delphi CEO, reserves particular ire for Gettelfinger in his new autobiography, "The Turnaround Kid: What I learned Rescuing America's Most Troubled Companies," published by Harper Collins (see “On the Table” – ed.). Miller summed-up the UAW front man this way: "Gettelfinger was a big disappointment. An industry in crisis needs leaders who can rise above the tactics of intimidation that may have worked decades earlier."
Uh, no kidding.
Ron Gettelfinger is quite simply Detroit’s King of Delusion, a Neanderthal figure operating in a hermitically-sealed time warp that prevents even a shred of reality or rational thinking to enter into his – or the UAW’s – atmosphere. As a matter of fact, he and his counterpart at the Canadian Auto Workers union - the equally thick-headed and wildly irrelevant Buzz Hargrove - are industry anachronisms who have become blatantly and painfully obsolete.
Even if this strike action were to end today, there’s no hiding the fact that Ron Gettelfinger is a small-minded irritant, a man who relishes being an obstinate obstacle to progress and a petty grandstander at every turn, just because he can.
And his so-called “act” grew tiresome years ago.
Thanks for listening, see you next Wednesday.
But it won't happen...Axle will sign some agreement and start slowly shipping jobs overseas, and the workers will complain that bad management took their jobs away...
I am fully of the opinion that in order to join the UAW, one must have an IQ certified below moron, and to become an officer you must be certified below comatose...
The news report I heard on Fox news said it was expected that a settlement would be reached w/in a few days. Do you think anybody in the negotiating room was blindsided by this?? This will prove to be nothing. I'll bet w/in a week they are back to work and this blog will be "read only" again.
>"The total cost of wages and benefits is more than $70 an hour, Dauch says, while competitors such as Dana Corp. are paying $20 to $30 an hour in total wages and benefits."
"American Axle did post a profit of $37 million last year, but the earnings were an anemic 1 percent of sales."
>"What was once the model (GM) spin-off is now the highest-cost supplier in North America," Sean McAlinden, chief economist at the Center for Automotive Research in Ann Arbor said Wednesday. "It's sad to see. It's not a good signal for Michigan once again."
>DETROIT -- American Axle & Manufacturing Inc., long considered the most successful of former General Motors Corp. parts operations, now is mired in an ugly labor dispute while the market for its products is shrinking."
Is it any wonder that the jobs are leaving the country?
$28 per hour is over $58K a year wages, plus OT and bennefits. $70 per hour, including wages and bennefits, is roughly $145.600 annually that a self employed worker would have to earn to have near equivalent health coverage and retirement income. Actually he would have to earn a bit more than that because he would not have as good of rates on the health insurance. Might not even be able to get it, if he has pre existing problems. Those having to purchase health insurance and build private retirement income know this very well.
Imagine working for ourselves and walking into a "Machine Shop" that offered no health care or bennefits, but needed help. How successful would we be, if we said,
"I will work for you for $70 per hour and re negotiate more pay every year or so"!
In a shrinking industry, due to the competition having lower labor cost among other things, the UAW needs to understand, the 1% earnings of American Axle places them on the ragged edge of going under.
The UAW workers need to get on their knees every day and thank God Almighty that they are still working. Then they need to elect a real leader with some degree of understanding of economics. If they don't do just that, American Axle will surely close it's doors. GM, in order to survive, will be forced to go elsewhere for those equivalent or better parts. Or they are going to have to close their doors. Those, out of work, UAW workers will then be able to go to that "Machine Shop" and negotiate.
We are now living in a competitive world. The Big 3 and Detroit no longer have a captive audience as in the past. They need to wake up. UAW workers have had a good run for many years. Just as many companies have had to down size to survive, and find more economical ways to survive, so may their workers. Just doesn't make sense to kill the goose that is laying the golden eggs!
While it is possible that American Axle is trying to cut "ALL" workers pay in half, it is doubtful.
Flame resistant suit is in place!
Kip
Does anyone know about the executives at American Axle? Pay? Benefits? Number of them? Pay cuts they've taken--Halvsies?
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Salary.com
But, of course, the CEO has NO COMPETITION, so he can name his own price.
I'll bet he also has the unmitigated BALLS to tell his employees that he has to pay for his own healthcare, so they should pony up some for theirs.
Now, if the TOP 5 EXECS took the same 57.1% (?? 4/7 ths??) compensation cut that alone would be about $30 million (imagine that, the cost savings from just 5 EXECS is 11% of 3650 WORKERS).
I find it hard to believe that ANY company would ask for a 57% compensation cut and have their employees roll over and say Oh,OK boss, gee thanks.
I'm NOT saying that there isn't room for negotiating some more profitability to allow for more competitiveness, and I assume you start by saying all new hires get a lower wage tier, if pensions are involved, a VEBA, and so forth. But to demand that people who have been living at a certain standard take THAT BIG of a compensation cut is ludicrous.
Which reminds me...
Car Stock Exchange kicks off tomorrow for real (for real prizes that is).
To put another way: If his plan were enacted today, by my math by the end of the year the companies profit would go up another $292 million. This would probably blow away any forecast Wall St has, possibly causing my stock to skyrocket. This would cause his option to be worth more than it is now, meaning his compensation would go even higher than $35 million.
Yup, it's really sinful the way those people on the workline get $70 per hour.
The financial officer only gets $792 per hour.
One thing that really rings true with a democrat presidential candidate is when he/she says in their ad that some executives make in 10 minutes what working people make in a year.
Soooo, let's cut executive compensation to Japanese/Korean/Indian levels and then have them take a further cut to show their dedication to the future of this company in the US.
Then the dirty workers can talk about cutting down that $70 per hour total which I'm sure includes the social security ponzie scheme that company pays along with toilet paper cost, pencils, etc., to raise it as high as possible. I agree the $70 per hour is much too high.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I would venture a guess that their compensation will remain the same or even increase. :sick:
Those guys make entirely too much, but they have iron clad contracts written by very expensive tax attorneys. When they eventually leave, they take a bundle with them in stock options and move on to something else that pays way too much. In a nut shell, they live on the sweat of others.
If you look at it from their point of view; why should a $35 million dollar executive take a $17 million dollar cut, when all he is asking of his employees is that they take a mere $29K cut? :confuse:
Of course I'm being sarcastic, but unfortunately that is the way it is in the real world. Maybe the UAW could negotiate they would be willing to take the same percentage of cut as the executives do, and see if that would work.
Kip
Now, while I am pro union, I can certainly appreciate giving some so the company, which SEEMS to be HEALTHY, (unlike Delphi), can better compete. But those CEO compensation figures are DISGUSTING!!!!
My biggest bone of contention is the 57.1% decrease in standard of living they expect the employees to take. Think about it. You may have an employee w/ say 25 yrs service. Let's say he has it set up now where his mortgage will be paid off in 7 years, but his oldest enters college in 4, and youngest in 6. He will have saved up at his current pace enough to put them through state college until the mortgage is paid off, the he can pay their tuition w/ his salary thereafter. Cutting his compensation by that much may cause him to have to dip into that or even refinance the mortgage.
I'm not talking about silly stuff like them now having to work (God forbid) until they are 65 instead of 55 because of cuts, i'm talking about more serious stuff, like that above, or maybe a couple having to sell their modest ranch and rent an apartment.
It is very difficult when forced to have less usable income. We live on what we make. Easy to adjust when income rises. Not so easy the other way.
Do you know anything, other than what we have been reading here, about the American Axle situation?
I find it very difficult to believe AA would cut the pay of their senior workers by 1/2 with the swoop of a pen. Work quality would drop drastically from the disgruntled employees.
There are better alternatives that wouldn't be so devastating. Freezing wages until the rest of the industry catches up, would be one. While that might seem harsh and offer a bleak future, it has some merit. Same income we are used to living on, and enough time to adjust toward the future. Time for more education, other souses of income, and so forth.
The person that just started at $20, or so, is still probably making a good income compared to the market place of comparable jobs. He is still making his $20 and has learned to live on that. If it isn't enough, he can look at the market place for something better, go into a different type work, or get more education or training.
New hires start at $10. Those that work best get better jobs and have earned more pay. Not just because they are "next".
As attrition takes place, consider whether or not they really need to be replaced.
Please don't misunderstand. If a given job requires exceptional skills, it is worth more pay. That is the type of thing a CEO worth his salt is supposed to deal with or contract outside "Experts" that can deal with it.
Pay the CEO no more than 20X the salary of the highest paid wage earner, plus bonuses. Bonus to be based on his salary plus the % of increased profit the company did. Example: The highest paid wage earner gets $28 hourly, so pay the CEO $560. That would be $1,164,800 yearly plus bonus. If the company made 10% profit, he picks up an additional $116, 480 at Christmas. No profit = no bonus ! No profit for a while = no job!
While we are at it, pay the same percentage of bonus to the wage earners. That $20 guy would get $416 at Christmas, if the profits were 10%.
Have a suggestion program for wage earners that pays 10% of company savings or extra profits over a 2 year period, with no cap. Example: A suggestion saves the company $1,000,000 over 2 years. That "suggestor" picks up a check for $100,000 and the company is better off by $900,000 for that 2 year period and potentially another half million each year for years to come. Win Win!. Any suggestion that is adopted pays something. Have a minimum suggestion award of say $50 even if the suggestion doesn't save any money, but improves working conditions or safety. That way every employee has a "DOG IN THE FIGHT" ! Seem fair ?
Of course, than isn't likely to happen!
Kip
I did read that AAM just spent $3 billion upgrading it's facilities, which seems like a lot of coin when you consider total revenues were $3.7 billion (could this be a case of them being caught in the banking crisis???)
Your idea of tying compensation to workers earnings is valid. Problem is, there is so much corporate INCEST on executive boards, this would never happen. If Congress was run like executive boards, there would be ethics violation charges flying all over the place.
I hear he's busy selling cars, may have a female friend taking up his time, and has lunch once a week with head people from GM giving advice on how to handle the people who are their workers to maximize productivity from the UAW.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
As far as the American Axel strike goes I fully support the UAW. I'm glad that NAFTA and free trade is being brought up and talked about this election season !!!
Rocky
P.S. Marsha7, did you miss me or something ?
We have all missed you my friend. Hope all is going well for you. Is that strike at Axle still going. No news recently. Must not be busting any knee caps