Subaru Crew - Meet The Members

aling

I think you mean side steps, right? ;-) The brushguard is attached to the front end of the vehicle.

Drew

paisan

I just recently read an interesting post on the Isuzu Trooper board about the auto tranny's in the trooper...

Apparently it's not a fluid driven device (it has lubricant) There is an electromagnetic clutch that engages and disengages the gears shifting up and down as it sees fit. So when it is engaged, the engine is actually connected to the wheels (whereas on a fluid based auto-trans, there is never a solid connection) I wouldn't have believed it except on my trooper as soon as I let off the gas below 50mph, it downshifts to 3rd and actually applies engine braking, w/o me downshifting, same thing into 2nd....(but only if I completely lift off the gas)

Whacky stuff.

-mike

aling

My M-class has an 5 speed adaptive tranny which is designed so that it never needs any tranny fluid changes ever! Also, the torque converter has the ability to lock not only the top gears, as with most other vehicles, but all of the lower gears as well. This allows it to hold a gear when going downhills to apply engine braking as well. Also, between gearshifts, the engine computer actually retards the ignition for a millisecond so that the shifts are seemless.

I have to agree with others on the Sportshift tranny. I have it, and it's lots of fun. When I'm not in the mood for manual shifts, I just leave it alone and let it do its stuff. The H6 could really use something like this, especially since the Japanese models already have it (licensed from Porsche). I'd like to see the + and - gate on the left side of the gearshift, closest to the driver (like in the Acuras) and not like with the Tiptronic though.

grahampeters

The preference for Auto v manuals varies from country to country. Autos are far more popular in the US than anywhere else in the world although Australians also prefer auto shifts, particularly in larger cars. In Europe, they are much rarer and are, to misuse an Australianism, considered slightly poofy (implies effeminate homosexuality). Manuals are macho. Women and incompetents drive autos. Grudgingly, exceptions are made for large luxury cars like S class and 7 series BMWs. Given how atrocious London traffic is, I regretted the necessity to be perpetually macho. I would happily trade off my skill at hand-leg co-ordination for an easier life in traffic. Back home in Australia, the manual seems a much better idea.

The mix of user preferences around the world explains why international makers have to offer both manual and auto transmissions. A solely US manufacturer can afford to offer only Auto as the percentage of customers who would choose a Manual is insignificant and the manufacturer can afford to either divert them (at some loss of satisfaction) to an Auto or lose those customers to other manufacturers, the cost of tooling up for a Manual exceeding the marginal profit coming from those customers selecting a Manual.

For each manufacturing run, you need to consider both the initial or fixed costs and those which vary in line with production. Thus it might be cheaper to set up for say an Auto as there is already a large pool of spares in the supply chain, but the marginal cost of producing each manual transmission may be less. If there are enough manuals sold to recover the extra costs of filling the supply chain with spares, it might be worthwhile making a manual.

In countries where the equation runs the other way and where the manufacturer does not have a large whole world customer base, they may buy in an auto from a specialist supplier or reuse transmissions from other suppliers. The Chrysler Auto was (possibly still is) very popular for bespoke British car makers like Bristol, Aston Marten and similar. These were frequently mated to retuned American V8s.

The tuning of the auto transmissions used by other makers is never as sharp as those made specially for an individual maker's engines. The shifts tend to be lazier and generally set up for a slushier drive. This is not as feasible for a smaller engine pushing a heavyish car, say a Subaru, where the auto really does have to be carefully tuned to the engine in order to pull the car along with any spirit. The differential between acceleration and fuel economy in the manual compared to auto really shows up those manufacturers who take the easy route.

I believe that the actual additional cost of manufacturing an auto as compared to a manual is now minimal although it used to be much more expensive. In many countries, the scale economies flowing from the proportion of autos made as compared to manuals, means that there is no premium charged for an auto. In others however, the market will bear a premium and hence the auto is sold at a premium price. I think that most manufacturers in Australia do not charge a premium but Subaru do.

Perversely, I understand that the whole life cost of owning an auto is now much less than for a manual. You have to try a whole lot harder to stuff an auto transmissioned car than a manual. Routinely, police vehicles are fitted with auto transmissions primarily because they are harder to break and cheaper to maintain.

We are now reaching a point where the performance of a well developed auto is better than a similar manual; shift speed is quicker, fuel economy sometimes better and ease of driving significantly better. Improved transmissions, particularly those with supershifts etc. will make sporting driving feasible without learning how to use a clutch. Maybe in a few years time, the only drivers with manuals will be hold outs for times past. I am not sue that i will be that fussed either way.

Cheers

Graham

amishra

Graham, excellent point about the popularity of manual transmissions in other countries, especially in European and developing countries.

I think that the majority of automatic transmissions are built by domestic North American manufacturers. Really, how many cars does GM make, and how many actually have a stick shift as an option?

Then you look at world-manufacturers like Honda, Mazda, Toyota, VW, Subaru, and wherever you travel you see cars made by these companies, and you can be guaranteed they must be offered in both stick and automatic.

So the death of manual is not going to happen, well.. maybe in North America it might, since the average driver likes big easy boats.

lucien2

GM makes a 5-speed?!? rilly? Oh right, the 'vette...

I am willing to let my manual go but only in favor of a smart auto with some sort of Tiptronic type sport shift. However, it will be years before this technology trickles down to cars I can afford. for all intents and purposes, I will be buying manuals for the forseeable future.

I am getting about 20 in the city and 27 on the highway. Granted the OB is heavier, but I guess I am too zealous in the city. I know that, for mileage sake, I should be upshifting around 2500 but this Phase I engine practically begs me to hang on until 3000-3200.

Colin-
Neon ACR? kewl. How was life with that car? Couldn't have been great since it is gone, but I wondered what that car was like as a daily driver. Sure looked good on paper.

paisan

My Trooper is similar (no dipstick, just a plug somewhere)

paisan

How do sports shifters differ from the 1-2-3-D configuration of the cars transmissions now? When I want to "manumatically" shift, I just drop it down with the gear selector. I know on some models like the Lincoln, if you put it in 2nd gear it won't upshift auto-matically to 3rd but bounce you off the rev limiter. Whereas on the Chrysler version, if you go to redline, it will automatically upshift you. On my Trooper I can actually start out in 3rd gear they call it winter mode.

-mike

kate5000

this time wrong wheels are mounted on 4x2. Yet, people are lining up to buy them at MSRP+. I'm amazed. So many folks are nit-picking what Consumer Reports said about this or that, and then jump into buying a 1st year model with all the teething problems. Also, some of the Firestones on 4x4 models seem to be of a concern (very close in specs to recalled ones).

Not to be cruel to Escape/Tribute owners, but can you picture this:

When the throttle is stuck in the open position, you're trying to steer the vehicle into a safer place... then the steering wheel comes off. Now you're bracing yourself for the crash, and two wheels are coming off. You're helplessly watching them rolling away from your car, and the last thing you see is the tire's tread coming off.

Sorry, couldn't resist.

amishra

suddenly my 2000 OB with my 2 failed fuel-injectors feels much better..

c_hunter

Sorry to enter this discussion late, but I thought I would add that aerodynamic drag DOUBLES with every 1.4X increase in speed (such as going from 55mph to 77mph or 60mph to 84mph), which will reduce your gas mileage quite a bit. The total drag on a vehicle also includes rolling resistance which actually decreases with speed, so there's usually a sweet spot where the combination of aero drag and rolling resistance is lowest. From that point, though, increasing speed will really eat into MPG on a high drag vehicle (one with a high drag coefficient, large frontal area, or both). I think the Forester probably falls into this category, just based on it's tall boxy shape.

Craig

kens

Shane,

Milage varies with many variables so it's hard to say what's going on. In general, your milage should improve with the engine breaking in. Warmer weather also fares well. Have you been driving just a little faster? Given the way the Forester is shaped, I think you get a lot more turbulent airflow as you pass the 80mph mark. I've found that 5mph can make a difference over extended periods. BTW, EPA milages are usually based on optimal conditions.

Graham,

Interesting read on MT vs. AT. I'd also like to add that the Japanese market has been similar to the European market in that a larger percentage of consumers prefer stick shift. In fact, it used to be the case that you HAD to be able to drive stick in order to receive your driver's lisence -- the road test was with MT vehicles. In recent years, however, ATs have become increasingly popular and they now issue "restricted" lisences that allow the individual to drive only AT vehicles.

Ken

locke2c

The Neon ACR was okay. even though it was rated at 150HP and 132lb-ft and weighed maybe 2500lb, it felt weaker than the numbers would indicate.

It came with shamefully bad OE tires for what it was --a clubracing / autocross homologation car. they were worse than the RE92's my 2.5RS came with! I want to say they were some sort of bridgestone but I can't remember.

It had really good suspension and handled nicely once I mounted decent tires. (AVS Intermediate) I was really annoyed by the lack of low-end and midrange power though, so when I was shopping 2 years later the 2.5RS appealed to me but felt weak up top. After a few mods the RS is great.

-Colin

bat1161

For me manual is the way to go. That is one of the things that caused me to go for the 00 Outback wagon the dealer had lying around (no one in the Staten Island area of NYC wanted it!) rather than taking the time to order one from the factory. I learned to drive on a 66 Cad., but for the last 12 years have been driving stick only. It is hard to find a decent car in 5SPD in the NY area, but the Subaru is the nicest one I have driven in a long time. The only time I find myself mildly annoyed with the stick is when I am sitting in traffic (which in NY is often), but then once I get moving I think there is no way I will ever drive an auto again!
As for the autostick that is out there, similar to that on the Dodge Stratus that I have rented, I feel that it is too limited in response. I feel that there is nothing like the real thing.

subearu

The Acura TL has this feature - but Acura says it actually shifts (slightly) faster in manual mode. I'll have to look at the brochure again for specifics.

-Brian

rsholland

TL/CL Sport-Shift (5-speed version) lets you shift from 1/2 - 5. The 1 - 2 shift is combined into one shift. That way you can't over-rev in 1st. gear, before up-shifting.

Bob

kate5000

heated seats on Ford Explorer are standard only on the Limited version, not even on upscale Eddie Bauer edition (as per Ford brochure).

And here I'm in my humble Forester, warming up my back... hee hee hee.

torek

I got the package that has the front and side brush thingies. The front one might push a weed or two down but is clearly not very functional. The side ones let you reach the roof easily, but also get in the way of getting in and out.

Chris

davechen

Manual trannys are much more fun to drive!
But as metropolitan areas such as the SF-Bay Area continue to get more and more congested, the allure of shifting starts to go away.
Also, I tried an Audi A4 with the auto-shifting buttons on the steering wheel and found it, at the risk of (definitely) offending pushbutton shifting fans, silly! If you forget to shift, the darn thing upshifts for you (near redline) and downshifts as you slow down. As an option, it isn't bad to just "have", but I can't see myself using it...

EPA mileage estimates are based on very little.
All testing is done on a dynamometer, and they "correct" for missing real life conditions by reducing the test values by a *fixed* percentage.
These missing conditions can be BIG: wind resistance & rolling resistance of those other two wheels, ambient air temp, etc!

The city mileage is calculated using a 7.5 mile (on the dynamometer) test that simulates a mix of stop-and-go, low speed driving, and idling.
The highway mileage test is 10 miles at an average 48 mph, no stops or idling. 48 mph...Huh? With no traffic, I estimate the average to be more like 65 mph!!
In both cases, the engine is new and warmed up, air conditioning, stereo, headlights, etc are OFF.

Basically, the tests are kinda weak. Mileage is based on a total of 30 minutes of laboratory testing and 3/4 gallon used. Plus they don't measure fuel consumption directly --they measure exhaust gases.

DaveC

subaru_team

You bet! Also, you have my commitment to personally crusade for an H-6 - 6 Spd. My dream car? Hmmmmmmmm - yup - right up there next to a '57 Chevy Belair ragtop (manual tranny of course!!)

hardenbr

on the mileage issues discussed above. The listed MPG for any vehicle is an average, not just meaning average for that vehicle (hills, speed, AC, etc.), but also an average from vehicle to vehicle.

I know as an owner of a brand new car none of us wants to consider that we might not have gotten the best of the breed, but it's possible (make that likely) that some cars off the same line simply aren't going to be as good as other cars.

NASCAR drivers simply accept that two identically prepared engines will not perform the same. And that is with meticulous analysis. What do you think the cances are of two engines performing the same off a production line?

My point: You are not be doing anything wrong with your driving style. Your particular car may just not be capable of the MPG that some others have reported. If it were me, I would accept the best my car could do, and have fun with it. You can worry about every start and stop, and still not achieve 30 MPG, and not enjoy your new car, and THAT would be a shame.

My 2c, Russ

aling

Luckily you have the brushguard in front. Maybe you need a rear guard as well. Sorry, couldn't resist. ;-)

Read the IIHS's SUV bumper report here: http://www.cnn.com/2000/US/09/13/suv.crash.tests.01/index.html

http://www.hwysafety.org/news_releases/2000/pr091300.htm

Note that although the BMW X5 performed well in the rear end crash (evidently because of its hydraulic bumper absorbers), the trailer hitch installation requires that the absorbers be removed permanently, hence the performance will definitely be degraded if a hitch is installed.

FWIW, the X5's OEM hitch cost + install job is about US$1200! It requires that part of the exhaust system be dismantled temporarily, the rear bumper removed, and as mentioned, the absorbers removed permantly, no doubt a time consuming procedure.

On another note, the IIHS typically conducts the bumper tests several weeks before their full scale 40mph offset crash test, so look for that to be out soon!

Drew

subaru_team

These are so tough difficult to respond to. FYI - the EPA actually sets the "Estimated Average MPG". When they test vehicles to get this number, the testing is always done under ideal circumstances (test track with tires filled to exact pressures, etc.).

Some folks will get better and other's worse. Also, you would be amazed at the number of ways folks have of calculating their mileage. Because I drive a test vehicle, I'm required to track my mileage and report on it monthly. In the past two months (both spent driving mostly on expressways), I had a variation of about 6 MPG (increased mileage the second month??). Was I more light footed? I'm not sure. I hadn't checked my tires during that period but the car was more broken in! My suggestion - do a few months worth of data collection and then review it with your dealer.

Thanks!

paisan

Thanks for the in-depth post. I just kept wondering if it auto-matically upshifted why not just do the 1-2-3-D thing.

-mike

paisan

I do have a rear reciever hitch, and I leave my 10" reciever in there at all times... It's my pseudo rear bumper guard. Besides the way I drive, if i'm getting rear ended, it's gonna be by a 747 and then it wouldn't matter....

-mike

subaru_team

Hi Dennis! I looked at your case and you have been VERY patient. We appreciate it. You should see some action on this either later today or tomorrow morning. If not, please e-mail me directly at pmickel@Subaru.com.

Thanks!

dsackman

Excellent description of the F1 gearbox. Thanks.
One errata through. Michael Schumacher's feet has nothing to do with changing the gears in a Formula 1 race car. The clutch in an F1 car is only used to start the car from standstill. After that the electronics does everything.
Awesome technology.

aling

Ah, that 10" receiver would act sort of like a lance! I'm sure your Trooper's rear end would be okay, but the other car's radiator wouldn't be :-)

Why use Tiptronic? Because shifting using 3-2-1 is not as fun! :-) And it's also slower, and doesn't necessarily cause the tranny to upshift. I do wish that the Tiptronic gate was pull down (towards you) to upshift, and push upwards to downshift. This way, it's like driving on of those WRC rally or British Touring cars!

aling

Yes, I realise that. I was referring to the good old days though :-)

BTW, I have no clue how the F1 cars clutch works. Can you describe that in a little more detail? I know that the steering wheel has four paddles. Two of the smaller (upper) ones are for up and downshifting, and the two large paddles at the bottom is for the clutch.

TIA!
Drew

bluesubie

Thanks Patti!

Dennis

kens

Patti,

Just some feedback for Subaru, but it would be nice to see a little more refinement in our manual trannies for the future. I had to have the clutch on my 5-speed 98 Forester replaced under warranty at only 23K miles due to the faulty pressure plate design in early Foresters/Impreza 2.5 RSs. The clutch works fine now, but it still is a little more sensitive compared to those found in other models.

Ken

dsackman

I will need to do some research to be able to supply 100% correct information. My understanding is that each driver and manufacturer has a different setup. The number, position and mechanics/electronics for each car/driver will be different. Also interesting is that each driver has his own steering wheel specially designed.

A bit off topic, but it shows to what degree automatic/semi-automatic gear boxes have evolved.

Daniel

texsubaru

One thing that really shows up in those rear collision tests for most SUVs is that having a spare tire mounted on your tailgate has a definite downside.
The IIHS press release on those latest tests said of the Trooper: "Intrusion of the spare tire mounted on the back of this SUV crushed both of the rear tailgates and shattered the glass," and of the Montero, "Once again, the rear tailgate and glass were crushed in the rear-into-pole impact by the spare tire mounted on the back," but for the Rodeo, "the 2000 model Rodeo comes with the spare tire located underneath the vehicle (tailgate-mount optional) and damage was reduced from more than $2,000 in each rear crash test (1996 model) to less than $1,000 (2000 model)." And I believe the best-performer out of that set they tested, the BMW X5, doesn't have the spare on the tailgate (though apparently its decent bumpers probably have more to do with the overall performance in the tests).
Makes me glad that my Forester doesn't have an externally mounted spare, although I suppose there is something of a tradeoff in having to unload any stuff in the back if you have to get to the Forester's spare.

miksmi

texsubaru, Re: <1622</A>>, It's a known problem with the configuration of this forum software. I've asked Bonnie (moderator) about it and it's not likely to change, as it's difficult to correct and low on the priority list. That doesn't mean it doesn't annoy me to no end; I feel your pain. And I try to spellcheck every message. Unfortunately, it doesn't prevent me from reading a message in one topic and replying to it in another

Loosh, Re: <1625</A>> Subarus vs. Subaru's. Hmm, but I think might have blundered elsewhere. Dr. Thesaurus needs all the help he can get. Thanks for bolstering my usage. So what's the plural of GT? I think I've been writing GT's (ugh, busted). GT->GTs, Legacy->Legacies, Outback->Outbacks (or Outbax, hehe I can see the hair on the back of your neck standing at attention). Correct?

Chris, sounds like another enviable trip. Post a note once you've updated your site.

Graham, thanks for the informative post <1631</A>>. Interesting to see the economics of manual vs. auto. Certainly a complicated subject.

1622Women and incompetents drive autos.Clubs

Hehe Graham, you're not running for political office anytime soon, I presume? (not after that anyway) Fortunately, 1625myClubs wife drives a manual, hehe. Unfortunately, she drives the GT and I drive the Civic.

1631The differential between acceleration and fuel economy in the manual compared to auto really shows up those manufacturers who take the easy route.Clubs

So what does that say about a Subaru Legacy wagon -- did FHI take the easy route? Here are its EPA MPG numbers:
auto 22 city, 27 highway
man 21 city, 28 highway

..Mike

grahampeters

I have to stress that the "Women and Incompetents drive Autos" is not my idea but the macho European concept. It strikes me as slightly weird that the Australian male psyche, which approximates that of Texans, can cope with autos. Mind you, I seem to remember that autos are big in Texas too. The shrinks would probably have a field day on that one.

As to me, I figure that an auto is fine, if it doesn't cost any more. As to women driving manuals. Both my sisters do. My wife plain doesn't drive, much to my irritation. However, having accompanied her on trial trips before several of her four failed license attempts, I am sort of glad! At least she can't ram me if she has no car. That's not a female thing; it's just that she is a lot more aggressive than I feel safe with on the road. She has however recently realized that my insurance extends to her learning in my Outback. I was able, legitemitly to argue against her learning in previous cars as they were too fast (Golf GTi and Passat Turbo), or strange (Mercedes handbrake) to be learnt on.

Cheers

Graham

blane

grahampeters:

Could your wife's concerns about driving have anything to do with driving on the left side of the road?

paisan

Personally I really like the spare being on the outside rear. All the other SUVs have it mounted underneath, which makes it get extremely dirty, also when you lose a rear tire you are that much closer to the ground trying to get the tire out. My first preference is outside, second as the forester has it, in a well.

The reason the X5 does so well is that it's basically a car raised up, it isn't a body on frame design (SUVs don't have 5mph bumpers) they are basically plastic over sheet metal and then the frame rails attach to them.

And off road, the rear mounted spare is in-valuable.

-mike

subaru_team

I know that the clutch action is very different in our recent model years (going to a hydraulic clutch) and it does bear getting used to! (I struggle going from my husband's '90 Legacy to my 2K GT). I will send your thoughts on up to the powers above (no, not that high - just a few floors up!!).

lucien2

I think abbreviations might be an exception, as GTs could be read as GT "S." Any english majors out there??

Legacy is tricky. In English, certainly, the plural of Legacy is Legacies. But here Legacy is a proper noun denoting the name of an object. Would it therefore simply be Legacys? I kinda hope not because referring to Ford Foci seems cooler than talking about Focuses. That sounds like Homer Simpson compaining about the Flandereses.

Outbax...*snick* I like that!!

Spare Tires-
My 4Runner had the tire underneath. Yea it got dirty, but the hassle of messing with a dirty spare once or maybe twice in a year was better than having to swing a rear tire mount out of the way every time I wanted to get into the tailgate.

WARNING!: Un-PC Spare Tire Story follows...

It was about 15 minutes or so before I got off work, and a young lady was shopping for wine. There is a grocery store in the same shopping center as my store, and she left her cart of stuff at the door. Now, if you are in retail (or, I guess, sales in general) you develop a sense of reading folks fairly quickly. I had a feeling she wasn't going to want any help from a male- she had a T-shirt on that said "These Are Not My eyes" right across the chest- but I am obligated to check up on people. Funny t-shirt concept I agree, but I was right about the customer. I waded through the haze of patchouli. "Is there something I can help you find?" queried Lucien. "No, I can make my own decisions, thanks." Alrighty then, no prob. Back to the ofice where I catch up on a little paper work and then head out the back door. Well what to my wondering eyes should appear, but the self same young libber, about to shed tears! She was standing at the back of an older Isuzu Trooper, all packed up with groceries and a bottle of Kendall-Jackson (figures). And the spare tire assembly swung wide open. Dear reader, she did not want to ask for help. I could see the frustration mounting deep inside her idealistic collegiate soul as I approached my trusty Soob. The lump of pride she swallowed trundled to her gut as laborously as an air-cooled microbus leaving Denver. "I, uh, I, could you help me with this thing? I borrowed this truck from a friend and I think I broke it." "What is the problem?" I asked, but I had my ideas. "This spare tire thing is frozen open and won't close" Hmmm...let's have a look-see. "Isuzu doesn't want you getting crushed by anything other than the realization that we all gotta work together," is what I wanted to say, but instead I just disengaged the lock that keeps the tire arm open, swung the whole affair shut, and wished her a good evening.

kate5000

From Blueovalnews.com

Ford Escape can't "Escape" from recalls - fourth
one just issued by Ford points to possible fuel
leakage.Ford Motor Company issued its fourth recall on the Ford Escape in less than two months. The newest, but consistent string of "Escape" recalls,is focused around a fuel line leakage (recall 00S27). The affected models were produced from October 1999 though September 1, 2000, or nearly every Escape currently on the road and on dealers' lots.

miksmi

The lump of pride she swallowed trundled to her gut as laborously as an air-cooled microbus leaving Denver.

ROTFLMAO! Loosh, GET OUT OF RETAIL NOW and become a writer! I'm still wiping away the tears. Funny tee-shirt but she's right, it's a sad but true male instinct to confuse a woman's eyes with her chest. Slipsies, that was a stereotype.

Oh, and it's not Un-PC, it's PIC, Politically InCorrect

miksmi

Kate, you are merciless! Your "interest" in the Escape is quite mischievous.. but it's funny news, so keep on posting. I don't think anyone gets offended by unhidden off-topic posts, or at least they are too polite to mention anything. I prefer in situ over hidden posts as sometimes I snag these forums in batch over a hideously slow modem and the software isn't smart enough to download the hidden posts. It's easy to scroll past the OT stuff if it doesn't interest someone. Just my two cents.

..Mike

abhidharma

Great story, Lucien2! I echo Mike's comment about your writing.

And I guess it's no surprise she was driving a Trooper.

Randy

p0926

Good news! The Forester has the best score in its class in the IIHS's 5 MPH (bumper basher) tests.

http://www.hwysafety.org/vehicle_ratings/low_speed_smsuv.htm

My apologies if many of you have seen this already. What got me to look it up was a story on the news last night regarding the IIHS's recently completed tests for mid-size SUVs.

http://www.hwysafety.org/vehicle_ratings/low_speed_midsuv.htm

Compare the $2218 cost in total repairs for the Forester to the over $11K for the Trooper. OUCH!!! Interestingly, the BMW X-5 scored the best in that class with its repair figures on par with the Forester.

2000 Legacy models also scored quite well with repair costs well below avg.

http://www.hwysafety.org/vehicle_ratings/low_speed_midinexp.htm

Just another reason to feel good about your Subaru!

-Frank P.

thecat

Loved the story .. and while I have not obtained permission from any "Ruling Legal Authority" to do so I hereby appoint you the title -

"EARL OF EDMUNDS" - "BARD OF SUBARU"

You're a NUT, man ! Or is it man''''s (with 4 apostrophy's)

-hutch

paisan

On the trooper... It's the fact that it has a rear mounted spare tire... If you get rear ended the other car will hit the bumper which was un-touched in the accident.

The worst part is the tester got out and says "This is the worst bumper we've tested so far" Had they tested the bumper that may have been true...

Don't even get me started on how much of a crock a lot of the safety testing is... I want to know real world #s....

-mike

dalelynn

While eagerly waiting for my new Forester S Premium I currently drive a Trooper, stick, and yup, with the outside back spare. By the way, I am SO GLAD the spare in the Forester is inside the vehicle. Anyway, re the trooper spare= it creates an annoying blind spot for one and the back window has to be hand cleaned and cleared of debris, especially in the fall, on a more than regular basis. Also, when you add a tire mounted bike carrier, the vehicle gets distractingly long. Aside from that, I have been rear-ended on two occasions(both times at about 5 mph). The first time, I was actually protected by the spare and other than some ripped stitching on the cover I incurred no damage to speak of. The second time was by a smaller car that rammed under the spare, knocked in the bumper and pushed the trailer hitch into the gas tank. Repairs for that incident were over $1,300.

Again, there is no doubt in my mind that subaru put their spare tire in in just the right place where it's easy to get to yet out of the way.

FrankMc

I was on vacation and therefore was wading through the posts. The Subaru credit card used to have a 5% 750 per year rebate on the purchase or lease of a new Subaru. That deal will expire at the end of November.
The new deal is a 3% 750 per year rebate on the purchase or lease of a new Subaru *OR* parts from a Subaru dealer *OR* repairs made by a Subaru dealer. This change has just recently been made (Let's face it the 5% deal was just too good to last). This deal makes it more practical for many people who currently own Subaru's (and maybe 90% sure of buying another one... but are concerned that they might just want a Thunderbolt 4.3 XT the next time), that they will make sure that they get the benefit of the card.
I know some people that own Subaru's and will buy another one, but "since they last so long, it's way too early to build up points since they only last 5 years".

Sorry for the late response

Frank

FrankMc

Just to clarify. The points only last 5 years and then they expire.

aling

Here are more details on the recall. More fuel to add to the fire, so to speak ;-)

http://www.bonforums.com/escape_onhold4.htm

Drew