Subaru Crew - Meet The Members II

paisan

The NJTP does this very well. Often changing the speed limits from 65->55->45 depending on the conditions.

-mike

paisan

Interstingly, if you get hit in an accident by a DUI driver, do everything in your ability to NOT have him arrested for DUI, at least in NY/NJ. Unfortunately most insurance companies have a clause that if you are operating your vehicle to commit a crime, the insurance is not in effect. Since most states have made DUI a crime, their insurance doesn't have to cover your damages/meds and you are stuck going after the individual yourself, rather than his insurance company which will no doubt have more $ than the idividual.

-mike

tincup47

to ridiculous extremes in theory, but reality is another thing. A passive 10 second data collector will put no restrictions on what you choose to do with your vehicle, it just records what the vehicles sensors recorded. It won't automatically call the cops, it won't keep a permanent record of all your actions.

mrk610

I do ems in Atlantic City and the Co that has the contract has a camera on the windshield of the trucks . the only time that it records is if you stop suddenly or have a major jolt to the truck . With the way people drive I set the thing off at least 4 or 5 times a day. It seems that the lights and sirens on my ambulance attracts people like flys to a lite . It only records 10secs b/4 and after the incident that se it off . The trucks are also have a sat link so they can see were we are at all times . BIG BROTHER IS WATCHING.
mikek

mrluther

When I worked for the DEA in Boston during the 1980's, we drove around in a white 1970 Ford Econoline van. The van was equipped with microphones that were always on, for documenting raids and arrests. All was recorded and used in case building, even hundreds of hours of Boston Bruins arguements.....go Big Brother!!!!

rsholland

has a comparison test of the WRX-STi against the Mitsubishi Evo VII.

I haven't read the whole article yet, but scanning the spec sheet: The Evo is a tad quicker, and has a tad higher top speed. The STI is a bit better in the twisties, and is a bit less expensive.

Other interesting articles on Civic Type R (mechanically the same as our Acura RSX S-Type), and a commentary on the the Jeep Cherokee (Liberty) rollovers from last fall.

Bob

rsholland

Legacy down 19%, Impreza up 153%

Bob

http://www.media.subaru.com./

kens

I was reading through i-club and someone posted this interesting article on Subaru ABS from SCC:

http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/archives/technobabble/techno_0402.shtml

It basically says how Subaru has engineered their ABS to the point where it's too conservative for rally-style driving. Very interesting.

Ken

rsholland

barresa62

It makes a lot of sense. Unfortunately, the way Subaru set the ABS up goes against the sporting nature of the WRX. This is the main reason why SCC is installing an off/on switch for the ABS. I can tell you from personal experience that when I hit a bumpy patch of road and give sufficient (not a total slam of the brakes) pressure to the brake pedal it can make me wet my pants!! The sensation of no brakes sends all the wrong signals (pardon the pun) to my brain. The first time I experienced this was unnerving to say the least. I think this is unacceptable in a performance vehicle and something Subaru needs to rectify on an otherwise competent package.

Stephen

bigfrank3

Computers on GM vehicles have been recording the maximum speed the vehicle has been driven for about 20 years. Early on they lost when they tried to deny warranty claims based on high recorded speeds. It is still being recorded today, though.

Ken, interesting article. There is one intersection that I travel that is full of small, bumpy frost heaves before the stop sign. The ABS on my Forester kicks in every time, even when approaching slowly.

Regards,
Frank

kens

The article made a lot of sense to me too. I also remember thinking that the ABS on my Forester does tend to kick in sooner than other vehicles. So far, it seems to work well for me. I think it's just a matter of getting used to it's rapid engagement.

For applications like the WRX, couldn't Subaru simply program ABS to kick in a little later like with the BMWs mentioned in the SCC article?

Ken

paisan

I don't believe the Civic Type R is the same as the RSX Type S. The Civic Type R will be the same as the RSX Type R when we eventually get it here. Andy aka Weasel555 is from england, but living here in the US on the I-club and he got to drive one on a track back in England a few months ago, and said it was nothing like the RSX type-S.

-mike

rsholland

200 HP engine and 6-speed tranny as our RSX S-Type.

Bob

locke2c

Frank,

Funny you should mention that. I believe it's a standard part of OBDII. 97-up Subarus record maximum speed as well, have your dealer connect their scan tool and they'll tell you what it is.

-Colin

kens

I was reading the Sundy New York Times this morning about the bombing in Israel that killed 9 people. The pictures in the paper (pg 10) showed scenes of the incident, one of them showing the charred remains of what looked like an Impreza.

http://www.nytimes.com/2002/03/03/international/middleeast/03ISRA.html

Just thought it was strange to see a Subie in such unfortunate news...

Ken

lilbluewgn02

Subarus were until recently the highest selling vehicle in Israel

hypov

to see that it is.
The incident and the Subie.

-Dave

lilbluewgn02

It's the reason we can't have Michael's Bar Mitzvah in Israel....I just get angrier and angrier

lark6

Quick OT: I used to work with an Israeli man. One day I drove my Studebaker to work and he raved over it, not so much over its condition but because he recognized it as "an Israeli car." Seems Studebaker had an assembly plant in Haifa that assembled CKD (completely knocked down) cars shipped from South Bend, and he remembered seeing a lot of them on the roads there.

Ed

bluesubie

There's a guy on the i-club that goes by the screen name of IsraelGT. I believe he owns a GC8 and lives in Tel-Aviv. He's a huge Scooby fan and loves the new age Impreza. Haven't heard from him in a while so I hope he's ok.

-Dennis

storyteller

What does that Subaru badge logo "mean"? All those stars. Is there some kind of story or translation for that? To my eye, since one star is bigger it looks like they are saying: "A star among stars."

"To infinity and beyond?"

Anyone know?

rsholland

http://www2.gol.com/users/stever/subaru.htm

storyteller

Thanks, Bob. You always come through.

ateixeira

I'm going to turn this upside down, and talk common sense instead of debating the legal merits.

Speed limits are set artificially low, because face it, everyone pushes it a little bit. If the limit is 55, 85% of traffic is doing 65, with the left lane at 70 or more. For the most part police let you get away with about 10mph over the limit.

By the way, this is all done safely, assuming conditions are good. Most highways were designed with 75mph travel in mind, and with cars far less safe than the ones we drive today.

In fact, driving 55mph in the left lane can be down right dangerous. You'll have frustated drivers tail gating you. You'd better get up to speed when merging onto a highway, too. Pull in at 45mph and you may cause a collision.

This is all common sense. Almost all of us drive this way. Right? I think we can all admit that.

Yet, on paper, it's illegal. We are all breaking the law, even though IMHO it's unsafe NOT to.

Enter the black boxes. You are driving at real-world reasonable and safe speeds, yet in court this "common sense" argument carries no weight. How dare you go 56 mph in a 55 zone, you criminal! You're at fault, go directly to jail, do not pass go, do not collect $200.

-juice

cfocfo

Great Posts

tincup47

You already get tickets for going over the speed limit from Radar and Laser. I know, got one myself for doing 63 in a 50. Everyone goes that speed on that road, but I don't have a legal leg to stand on. I don't think it is common sense to not avail ourselves of technology on the chance it could be abused. In that case we would not be even discussing this, because the internet would not be here. I agree that these items should not be used for traffic enforcement, or to track your movements. A ten second data loop would help prevent this, prohibitting on-site downloading of the info would prevent police from using it as evidence to support traffic violations.

ateixeira

Wait a sec, I don't get it, are you arguing to support me, or against me? It sounds like you are backing my argument up 100%.

Instead of cameras, we need a human (i.e. cop) with some common sense to weed out the people that are doing dangerous things vs. just going a little over the limit.

A black box is like that camera you seem to be angry with - zero tolerance for a seemingly reasonable speed.

I agree with that reasoning 100%.

-juice

paisan

Here is a flip side...

Over the weekend I smacked my crossmember and lower control arm on a triangle-island thing while making a right turn onto a road. Speed limit 55mph. I hit it at about 50-55mph. A black box probably would have shown me in the right, even though I was clearly going too fast for the turn. It doesn't give a clear picture IMHO and doesn't take into account the situation at hand, kinda likea computer, garbage in garbage out.

-mike

ateixeira

I think in that scenario it would prove useless. They probably wouldn't even read the data.

-juice

locke2c

quote: Speed limits are set artificially low, because face it, everyone pushes it a little bit. If the limit is 55, 85% of traffic is doing 65, with the left lane at 70 or more. For the most part police let you get away with about 10mph over the limit.

juice,

that's only true in densely populated areas, and most of texas in general. ;-)

anywhere I've been outside of large metropolis in this country people stay close to the real speed limit because the traffic is lighter, there's less of that mob-mind that it's OK to speed, and it's easier to be picked off by polizei.

here in the sprawling 300k population of Wichita, 5 over is the norm in the left lane, with very few people doing more than 10 over. even in rush hour.

-Colin

paisan

In my travels upstate NY generally 5-7mph over is the norm like colin said. Only in NJ and the NYST-way do I find psychos doing 90+mph.

-mike

ateixeira

I think my 85% rule covers that scenario, though. Not to mention most collisions (where the Black Box would be useful) would occur in the densely populated areas.

Maybe it's because speed limits around me are ridiculously low. In MD I think the max is 65mph, while VA allows 75mph on roads that aren't as wide or as straight.

I think if the limit is 55, people go 65. If it's 65, they may only go 70. At 75, people are close to the limit, because it's likely a more reasonable speed limit to begin with.

Again, though, a black box or a camera can't do the type of reasoning we are right here, right now.

-juice

paisan

really? hmm highest i've ever seen posted on the East Coast was 70.

-mike

tincup47

It wasn't a camera. I was alone on that straight stretch of road at the time, not endangering anyone. Just because you have a human involved gives no guarantee of common sense being applied. I am not angry at cameras, have no problem with them. I am also not angry at the officer, he was enforcing the law our elected officials passed. I have a friend who swears safety belts are dangerous because he was thrown free from a vehicle that caught fire. You can find anecdotal exceptions that refute any safety technology, that does not mean they should not be utilized.

kens

I agree with Colin. I believe you'll find people doing 10+ over the speed limit near heavily populated areas and interstates that are connect these areas.

Take for example highway 5 in California. It goes through the heart of the valley with nothing but farm land. Being the shortest distance between LA and SF the majority of drivers on it are from these two metropolitan areas. The posted limit is 65, but people typically do 80-90 on it.

Ken

ateixeira

Sorry, tincup, didn't catch that from your post. The Officer probably wasn't have a good day. Plus, you were more than 10 over, which is usually the "let you off with a warning" limit around here.

-juice

tincup47

I'm not trying to justify my actions or criticize the officer, I was violating the speed limit. I also know it is irrelavent what speed the majority of people drive on that stretch of road. I was irritated at getting the ticket, but mostly at myself.

ateixeira

Well, I bet if you had been going 8 over the limit, he wouldn't even have stopped you. The officer still exercises his judgement.

-juice

paisan

You were probably acting in a threatening manner hee hee. Last time I got pulled (about a week ago) I saw the trooper going in the other direction on a 2-lane blacktop 50mph limit, I was doing about 60-65, he made a u-turn in my rearview mirror, and I pulled over before he even caught up with me. Was able to get out of it cause he knew I knew and I didn't make him work hard Also having a clean lisc. helps too.

-mike

Karen_S

What's your opinion on these devices in the mass transit industry? Do you think an employer is justified installing black boxes/recorders in company owned vehicles?

AND...would you consider installing one in your teenager's auto????

KarenS, whose son will soon be 16. Yikes!
Host
Owners Clubs

paisan

Absolutely. Employer in company vehicles, absolutely. If the driver doesn't like it he can work for another company! Teens' car, nah, cause they'll be stupid either way, black box or not.

-mike

bat1161

Definitely for transit , as well as company vehicles. I don't like the idea of them in personal cars though.

Mark

ateixeira

Definitely yes for mass transit. Maybe for company cars, depends on how the information obtained is used. Definitely no for my kid.

Don't know about anyone else, but I plan on having an open and trusting relationship with my daughter. Spying on her using any such methods (black box, GPS, speed limiters) shows an implied mistrust and creates the expectation of irresponsible behavior.

Do you bug your teenager's phone? Do you conduct random drug tests? Doesn't sound like the type of parent I wish to be.

-juice

tincup47

I knew he had me, put on my signal immediately, pulled over in a place that would not put the officer in any risk, and had my info available, and greeted him in a pleasant manner. I never try to be confrontational with anyone who has a gun.

tincup47

If your daughter was in an accident, wouldn't you like to know what really happened? Most people have terrible recollections of the circumstances leading up to an accident (and most tend to lie to cover their mistakes). I do not advocate these being used for spying on anyone, and since recording the last 10 seconds the vehicle was in operation would be useless unless the vehicle was disabled in an accident, I don't see how it could be used for that. It wouldn't even be good for monitoring speeding violations. I had slowed to under 5 mph the 10 seconds prior to stopping my car.

ateixeira

That would be totally secondary. How would the information help her? It would only satisfy one's curiosity.

I already look at which cars are safe (crashtest.com has a nice summary of all crash tests plus some real-world data), it's a factor before I buy.

To me nimble handling is at the top of my list, so I also put a premium on accident avoidance. I'll take as many air bags as you've got, traction control, stability control, AWD, etc.

And you can bet she'll be enrolled in Bob Bondurant, or a similar place, not just some driver's ed program. Plus she'll get plenty of time behind with wheel with me before she's off on her own, including snowy parking lots to practice emergency manuevers.

I may stop short of forcing her to wear a helmet all the time, though. ;-)

-juice

tincup47

I understand all that, but she will not be the only one on the road. Also, more safety advances could come from real world crash data, as opposed to current lab testing. This could lead to even safer vehicles, better driver training for everyone, improved roads, etc. Forensic evidence of accidents is an important tool to find ways to minimize future accidents. That is why it is mandated in Commercial Air Travel and Professional Auto racing.

cliffy1

Actually, I don't think speed limits are based on the assumption that people are going to push the envelope a bit. They are revenue enhances disguised at safety measures.

locke2c

they're somewhat based on fuel consumption as well, to take a less negative look at things. ;-)

higher speed = more gas consumed. it's that inescapable aerodynamics thing that starts to really have an effect beyond 60mph or so.

-Colin