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Comments
Bob
Actually, all Jeeps aren't lemons and they can certainly go places Subaru owners wouldn't dare. Of course the vast majority of Jeep owners never make use of their off-road capabilities but then neither does any other SUV owner segment.
-Frank P.
Frank is right though - Jeeps' suspensions are set up to handle more strenuous off-road conditions than our Subarus' are.
Ed
Obligatory on topic comment: towed the OB along, fine as usual- except for all the bugs we killed going to the fireworks show at Grand Coulee Dam, and the seagull bombers were relentless! Got the bugs & bird poop washed off, waxed it this afternoon (Zymol - good stuff!), so we're ready to go again... soon as the laundry's done (if ever!)
Cheers!
Paul
Ross
Send up a flare - we'll meet at the chat & dispatch a search & rescue team from there!
Cheers!
Paul
So what does this have to do with Subarus? Hmmm... well, it made me appreciate my Forester a little bit more.
-Frank P.
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20010715/bs/autos_japan_fujiheavy_dc_1.html
Thanks for the article, Ash. When did GM increase FHI ownership from 20% to 21%?
..Mike
..Mike
My wife's idea of "roughing it" means staying at a Holiday Inn instead of a Hilton.
Loosh: if you get an expense account, don't forget to take some of us on that back nine with you!
Jeep 101 sounds like fun, actually. The Outback Rendezvous is right here in town, though, so I will check that out.
Sorry I missed last week's chat, had some family duties to attend to. I'll be checking out the transcript soon.
-juice
Scroll down to the bottom half of the page for the individual brand name scores. Looks like Subaru still has some work to do. I bet if more people visited Town Hall and received the kind of personalised treatment that they have from Patti though, the scores would be much higher!
I was rather surprised to see the huge drop in CSI scores from 2000 to 2001 for Audi (-37). Daewoo was the biggest loser by far though, losing a whopping 84 points, dropping them from 5th position in the industry last year, to 33rd (out of 36 brand names).
Drew
Host
Vans, SUVs, and Aftermarket & Accessories message boards
I find it hard to believe BMW is on top, though. I guess they're measuring customer satisfaction, not quality. Free service, right? Plus those lattes while they wait.
-juice
Got back from a weekend trip to Yosemite with my wife and eight other friends of ours. We rented our usual place just outside of the park and spent lots of time just kicking back.
The weather was excellent -- cool and breezy with nary a cloud. On Saturday, we hiked up to Sentinel Dome right near Glacier Point for an amazing panaoramic view of Yosemite Valley. I highly recommend this easy hike to anyone who goes to the park. The rest of the day we spent down by the Merced River in the valley.
Of course, I took my trusty Forester with me on the trip. I got to enjoy my short-throw Kartboy shifter along the twisties. The 3-4 shifts are now a lot more confidence inspiring with a definite click-click engagement.
With my wife, a friend and lots of cargo, I still managed to get an all time high 29 mpg! My milage included driving into and around Yosemite as well as coming down. I wonder if the synthetic oil I'm using now helped a bit. ;-)
Ken
-mike
Thanks!
Patti
I hit 30.4mpg as my record, but we're not even close to Frank's best. I think all roads in Atlanta are down hill!
paisan: sweet - I remember you said you actually sought out an H-stock to autocross with. What are you quicker in? I bet the XT6. I can't imagine anything would actually go faster than the Mach 2.5 we achieved in central PA.
-juice
-mike
I say try both. Or have a buddy drive one as a reference, and see which is quicker (or more fun, at least).
-juice
XT6/MX6
weight: 2900/2600
hp: 145/110
torque: 156/130
trans: AT/MT
drive: AWD/FWD
Tires: Same Size
-mike
But the extra ratio and less drivetrain loss would even it out. I bet it'll be about even on a dry day, no contest if it's wet.
That's great that they're in the same class. You can take your pick.
-juice
I'd consider trading my Jeep 101 reg for that, except that I recenly had a week-long Outback rendezvous of my own in rural South Carolina.
Ed
-Brian
Blame the weather
Cheers!
Paul
Couldn't ping or tracert to edmunds.com. Perhaps my ISP's DNS's were on the blink.
-Brian
She hates her Saturn now. The rear facing infant seats hardly fit in the back seat - not to mention the middle position is just plain useless for any seat, rear facing or forward facing. Aside from that, it feels 'cheap' to her now since driving the Outback.
One thing I noticed coming back to the Outback was the stereo (besides the obvious ride and handling). The sound was 200x better in the Outback. Even the stock speakers sound more bassey (sp?) than the Saturns stock system. If it sounds this good stock, it can only sound that much better with upgraded speakers.
The downside from all of this is that the B4 or 'hot' Legacy won't come soon enough. We may end up shopping for something to replace her 'plain' Saturn sooner than we thought (like this year instead of maybe next year or the year after). Of course it'll be another Sube! Guess I could 'settle' on a GT sedan (WRX probably wouldn't be roomy enough for the car seats and all).
-Brian
Patti, I took your suggestion and went for the more challenging roads. To quote my fishing directory, "The only problem is access. Where it was once accessible by two-wheel-drive vehicles, it is now a very rough trip in four-wheel-drive by any of the three routes. *Drivers with improper vehicles and poor skills have ruined the roads.* Only a short-wheel-base truck is advisable. ... rough road with numerous mud holes ... one terrible mud hole that could require winching ... the (other) routes are even worse." I took one of the "other" routes. It has brutal to say the least. The only other vehicles in the area were all major trucks and one Jimmy. I now understand the state of the roads. One loud and obnoxious family left in their monster truck and upon reaching one of the deeper/rougher mud holes proceeded to dig its way through, using its great clearance, aggressive tires and massive power to throw mud 15-20 meters. I had previously inspected that spot and it was vastly "improved" as a result. &*^%$##@^&. Rufus did make it through despite their best efforts.
I had thought that road clearance was the limiting factor for the Foresters off road capacity but it is actually the approach angle. Some pics: http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4292470983&idx=0 I didn't get some of the more spectacular "crossings", I really didn't want to stop for some reason. You may note the wad of mud stuck in the fog lamp housing. That was not splash, it was carved out of the hole. Rufus is slowly improving the approach angle - he removed a bit from the left tow ring and a bit from the under bumper. There was never any doubt about traction. The only thing that worries me now is that I'm getting over confident. I do carry a little camping shovel, but ... Later.
Ross
Dennis
Way to hand in there, Rufus! Photo #12 was my favorite.
-juice
Don't loose sight of the fact that the IIHS has a vested interested in rating cars tough. One, if they actually do succeed in getting mfgs to beef up their cars they could reduce personal injury claims. maybe. somewhat.
That's giving them the benefit of the doubt. Being a bit more critical, it's obvious that being tough on crash tests allows them to rate more vehicles "below acceptable" or whatever and thus justify higher insurance premiums for them.
-Colin
Drew
Host
Vans, SUVs, and Aftermarket & Accessories message boards
-juice
considering the way I've driven it, I would have expected more problems with it; but I've had none other than the usual brakes, muffler, etc.
I've got 140,000 miles on it, original clutch
compared to the 2000 outback I had, which had 3 or 4 major problems (like the car stranding me), the mazda has been awesome
anyway .. I still have my mazda sitting in the garage when I get back from the UK. The outback is gone...
-mike
..Mike
..Mike
The wife has a 626 with the same engine in Ash's car, and it's been decent, but not as good as our Forester. Decent quality, nice engine, but nose heavy and understeers like a wet dog on a marble floor.
-juice
But crashes occur in myriad ways in the real world. One could certainly build crash tests are are tougher or easier, depending on angle of impact, size of impact area, attitude of vehicle before impact (braking brings the nose down), etc.
I'm just saying the fundamental relationship between IIHS and insurance companies cannot be overlooked... insurance companies want to make money, not safety.
-Colin
Even if you want to pursue the conspiracy theory route, allowing more damage to the cars, while protecting the occupants, would increase their profits without harming people.
I agree it's just one type of collision, but it's currently the toughest in the auto industry.
D/C fell on their face - their demand for a retest actually lowered their score.
-juice
OK, I know I'm getting old, but Edmunds, please don't play these games with me. Don't trick me into thinking I have Alzheimer's just yet...
Bob
-juice
Yes, it was a lab test. Thank God for that.
-juice
They put in new fuel lines, and heavy steel protective plates. This was due to re-routing of the fuel lines in 2000 for the new transmission that the trooper got. It's actually an upgraded tranny with grade-logic (drops a gear on downgrades from 4->3 for engine braking if you let off the gas)
-mike
I use www.crashtest.com as a reference, because they publish results from IIHS, NHTSA, plus other results from Japan, Europe, and Australia. When you find consitently good scores across the board, as you will with the Forester and the Legacy, I feel the calculated risk has been minimized.
Hmm, you work for Land Rover, right? Any chance they had a similar leak in IIHS tests? ;-)
-juice
Dennis
Now reviewing a compilation of different crash test datasources and picking something that did well on all does make sense. Condemning a vehicle prematurely due to ONE test is what I had a problem with.
You're safest if you never get in a vehicle. Trying to engineer things so that not even one child will be harmed is moral lunancy and impossible anyway-- someone won't belt their kids in, or there will be that 1 in a million freak accident that defies explaination.
-Colin