GM News, New Models and Market Share

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  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Member Posts: 16,970
    Psst, this is a GM thread.

    Time to tell all the Korean and Japanese brand-buffs that too!
    2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Administrator Posts: 11,245
    Gosh, I'm sure glad this isn't the "How to be Petty" thread. That would be a real shame if we had to change the title.

    MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR
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    2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h)
    Review your vehicle

  • anythngbutgmanythngbutgm Member Posts: 4,277
    edited March 2012
    Model Year Rebate Expires Source
    Camaro 2012 Financing Incentive: 1.9% to 3.9% 04/30/2012

    That's actually really good that a 3 year old car, in the midst of rising gas prices still commands a financing percentage that high. It certainly offsets the $10 grand back/0 percent for 7 years financing they are offering on their trucks...
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    My credit union offers 3.49% for up to 60 months.

    That means that GM loan has a higher-than-market rate.

    What incentive? :confuse:
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,706
    >You don't think the moderators should step in when people post tastelessly like they did? Children died and the guy was cheering like it was good news.

    I don't know anything about tasteless posts and children dying.

    I'm talking about the taunts which I suspect would fit under the description of behaviors in the Membership Agreement.

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Fortunately for you those were deleted before you read them.

    I was not as fortunate.

    I don't think think there is anything wrong with asking for a source from any poster, though, especially when it's bad news.

    Let's get back to GM...who wants a diesel Cruze?
  • fezofezo Member Posts: 10,386
    Give me a diesel Cruze wagon. :)
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Member Posts: 16,970
    Whaddya know, offers on lesser Camaros 'exclude ZL1'.

    http://www.chevrolet.com/tools/currentoffers/results.do?zipCode=44240
    2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
  • kernickkernick Member Posts: 4,072
    From what I've read on various sites, one would be better off from a powertrain standpoint to get a Mazda (Skyactiv) 3 Diesel, which will be available next year. Is the Cruze diesel going to have 300+ ft-lb of torque?
  • tlongtlong Member Posts: 5,194
    BTW, I'm actually basing that on something historical, not just hopin' and wishin' like some (ahem) folks here do.

    Here's something really interesting AND historical.... an article on how Ford and Mulally helped save the auto industry. Also interesting is that GM wouldn't play, as they were so close to gone themselves. So Ford teamed up with Toyota, Chrysler, and Honda, among others:

    Inside Ford's Fight to Avoid Disaster
  • tlongtlong Member Posts: 5,194
    edited March 2012
    Naaah. Those are the perfect cars. Nothing ever goes wrong.

    Here we go again! Must be at least the fifth time I've seen a comment like that in sarcasm. Yet I'm still waiting to see where some actual Toyota FAN has made that claim. Seems like only the GM fans believe it! ;)
  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Member Posts: 16,970
    But surely you can understand why we think it's weird that a recall of over 600K vehicles would go unmentioned on a Toyota board. That absolutely would not happen here.
    2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
  • fezofezo Member Posts: 10,386
    Trust me, A Mazda Skyactive with a diesel and 300 ft-lbs of torque will not get tossed out of my driveway!
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
  • circlewcirclew Member Posts: 8,666
    Whaddya know, offers on lesser Camaros 'exclude ZL1'.

    Alrighty, then. I stand corrected. Let's wait until they collect on the dealer lots...sorta like the ZR-1 did in 2010.

    Regards,
    OW
  • circlewcirclew Member Posts: 8,666
    Coming this fall....

    2013 Chevy Malibu's turbo four rated at 269 HP, 0-60 in 6.3 seconds

    GM is #1? :confuse:

    Regards,
    OW
  • fho2008fho2008 Member Posts: 393
    Still has the Chevy truck grill and Camaro like tail lights, Buick headlights? With all that money we gave em they coulda reopend the styling department!
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,966
    it isn't marketed at all,

    That is so true!!!!

    I bet 99% of the US population doesn't know you can get an Audi A4 Wagon/Avant style in the US!

    Even Audi's website kinda hides the fact.

    LOL
    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • andre1969andre1969 Member Posts: 26,088
    Actually, 269 hp and 0-60 in 6.3 seconds sounds competent, at least. However, they need to also make sure it gets good fuel economy. I'd say the benchmark for this class of car right now, love it or hate it, is the Toyota Camry.

    With the 4-cyl engine it's EPA-rated 25/35, and 0-60 is around 8.4 seconds I think. With the V-8, the EPA rating is 21/30, and 0-60 is around 6.3 seconds (I think MT or someone got 5.8 out of one on their test)

    So, with the E-assist, the Malibu gets 25/37 and 0-60 is around 8.7. Not bad, but you give up some trunk space, have more complexity to deal with, and a higher base price.

    The current 3.6 V-6 though, seems to be a bit of a guzzler. EPA rated 17/26, which sounds pretty bad compared to the Camry's 21/30. However, unless you do a LOT of driving, and gas gets really expensive, the Malibu won't bankrupt you compared to the Camry. Still, if you do mostly local driving, and those figures are accurate, the 3.6 is using about 24% more fuel than the Camry.

    So, hopefully this Malibu turbo can deliver on the fuel economy, as well as performance.
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,966
    The current 3.6 V-6 though, seems to be a bit of a guzzler. EPA rated 17/26,

    You mean there is an American motor that is a gas guzzler?!? Say it ain't so!

    :sick:
    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • anythngbutgmanythngbutgm Member Posts: 4,277
    With the V-8,

    A V8 Camry? Sign me up! :D

    The ace in the hole for the Camry is the hybrid. 43/39 with 200hp for less than 26 grand, that'd be the one I would go with personally.
  • kernickkernick Member Posts: 4,072
    edited March 2012
    Just looking at the specs on the Camaro ZL-1 and I see the mpg rating is 14 city / 19 hwy. I understand you are getting a lot of power, but those ratings are from when the ZL-1 is using a small fraction of that 580 hp.

    The older-design 2012 Shelby GT500 for comparision is getting 15 /23 rating, with around 550 hp. There's no official mpg rating for the 650+ hp 2013 Shelby that I could find.

    But I would guess the Camaro ZL-1 is going to get hit with a significant gas-guzzler charge. I believe those are still in effect? It's just kind of tough to say, "I have plenty of $, am not worried what mpg I get, and what might happen to the price of gas." when it's a Chevy. I can see people who are buying a top of the line Porsche, or an exotic (Ferrari, Lambo, AMG, Bentley ..) saying that. I don't know ... is the target audience, the guy who's going to drive this 100 miles/year - to a show or 2, garage it, and pass it on to the kids; who then can hopefully sell it for $1,000,000 in 2042?
  • michaellnomichaellno Member Posts: 4,120
    A V8 Camry? Sign me up!

    The problem is, they are garishly painted and only turn left.
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,966
    The gas guzzler tax is a bad idea in a long list of bad ideas. It is Un-American and should be applied fairly and equally to all vehicles, not just cars while avoiding trucks.
    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • dieselonedieselone Member Posts: 5,729
    Just looking at the specs on the Camaro ZL-1 and I see the mpg rating is 14 city / 19 hwy.

    Not surprising considering the CTS-V uses a similar powertrain and is rated at 14/19 too. I think it's about $1,300. I doubt that will scare off anyone that wants a ZL-1.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    surely you can understand why we think it's weird that a recall of over 600K vehicles would go unmentioned on a Toyota board

    Except it didn't go unmentioned, and you looked less than 24 hours after the recall was announced.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    The ace in the hole for the Camry is the hybrid. 43/39 with 200hp for less than 26 grand

    Ford is supposed to beat that with the Fusion hybrid. Let's see.

    The new Fusion is gorgeous, too.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    The problem is, they are garishly painted and only turn left.

    Good one!
  • andre1969andre1969 Member Posts: 26,088
    A V8 Camry? Sign me up!

    Oops, yeah that was a typo. Wonder if anyone's ever found a way to fit one into a Camry though? I've seen an old 70's Dodge Colt with a 440 V-8, a PT Cruiser with a 426 Hemi, and one of those K-car based mid-80's Dodge Daytona with a 318, so I guess it's possible if you put your mind, talent, and wallet to it!

    The ace in the hole for the Camry is the hybrid. 43/39 with 200hp for less than 26 grand, that'd be the one I would go with personally.

    Yeah, that is pretty impressive. In the past, one disadvantage to the hybrid Camry was that the battery pack cut trunk space from around 15 cubic feet to something like 10.9. A friend of mine has one, and I didn't think the trunk looked THAT small all things considered, but I guess those figures don't lie. I think the latest Camry has something like 13 cubic feet of trunk space. It's not gonna rival Lemko's '89 Brougham in that regard, but it's still not too bad.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Even the V6 models in this class can hit 60mph in less than 6 seconds, and not just the Camry, either.

    That's plenty adequate. Any more and it should probably be RWD so the front half of the car doesn't tear itself away from the back half. :D
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,581
    And it's funny too, as IMO the Avant is much better looking than the sedan, I'd take the former, but the latter is just boring.
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,706
    >The new Fusion is gorgeous, too.

    Are those in the showrooms yet? I cruised the Ford lot Sunday when I was out in the Cobalt and didn't see any. None of the salesmen stood in front of me like they usually do or I would have asked him/her.

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Member Posts: 16,970
    Is the new Fusion built in Mexico too? Not being a wiseguy, just asking.
    2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Member Posts: 16,970
    Funny the Toyota mega-recall hit here a day before it hit the Toyota forums. Did this begat that? Guess we'll never know.
    2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
  • anythngbutgmanythngbutgm Member Posts: 4,277
    Supposedly the new Fusion is moving to Flatrock, MI.

    link title
  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Member Posts: 16,970
    edited March 2012
    Supposedly the new Fusion is moving to Flatrock, MI.

    Terrific news IMHO. It's not that Mexico can't build quality; I just would choose to not support Mexico with a high-ticket purchase....especially with the news that has been coming out of Mexico lately. Sheesh.
    2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    edited March 2012
    Link to the post that came before you ever mentioned it here, since you apparently missed it:

    http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.efda853/15400#MSG15400

    The thread had been inactive for 2 days prior to mdawgg's posting.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    edited March 2012
    Hmm, is that where my '91 Escort was built?

    I'm not so sure that's good news. It had a lot of trim pieces falling off here and there. Powertrain was good, though.
  • anythngbutgmanythngbutgm Member Posts: 4,277
    edited March 2012
    I have a co-worker with a Mazda Protege with the same powertrain and the thing just keeps ticking right along. I don't know the mileage he's got on it and it looks like hell but whenever he passes by in the parking lot, the engine sounds sewing machine smooth.

    Oh and edit to that last post regarding the Fusion: Just read again and it looks like the hybrid and future plug version will stay in Margaritaville...
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Mine was a GT, that shared the DOHC 1.8l with the Mazda Protoge ES and the Mercury Tracer LTS. It was a revvy little engine, great bang for the buck.

    The gear box would snag gears on occasion, too bad they couldn't use the Miata's shifter in those cars. I drove it for 107k miles on the original clutch, then it was totalled. :sick:

    Ford Credit treated me badly, then I had a bunch of quality issues - rust on the fuel filler opening, trim falling out of the doors, seams coming undone, etc.

    Basically a good powertrain wrapped in a car built to a (low) price point.

    The Fusion lineup looks great. If they move production back to Michigan hopefully they can keep a close eye on quality and do well with those. They sure look good.
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,706
    >Is the new Fusion built in Mexico

    I wanted to find out by seeing one. I didn't brave the showroom. I just didn't feel like the BS from the salesfolk when I just wanted to look--but I couldn't see one parked on on the aircraft carrier size display area for new models. I think on the website it said they had 500 new cars sitting.

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Just look for a VIN that starts with 1 rather than 3.

    U.S.A.(1or 4), Canada(2), Mexico(3), Japan(J), Korea(K), England(S), Germany(W), Italy(Z).
  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Member Posts: 16,970
    Just for historical accuracy, mcdawgg's post mentions nothing about a recall and is not in response to any other post...just a vague "I expect the Toyota haters to be here soon". The recall is posted after my post of March 8.
    2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I may be the only actual Toyota owner in that thread. Mostly it's fintail, Gary, and imi complaining about 'em lacking soul or steering feel or whatever. :D

    xlu will pop up only when he has bad news, and never to respond to good news, so mcdawgg's post was probably referring to him specifically, which is why I found it funny. To us it was not vague at all.

    Insider joke, I suppose. Any one who doesn't follow the thread wouldn't have understood.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 58,581
    Go drive a previous Camry or the one before that, you'll see what I mean :shades:

    I should test drive a new one and a new GS, drive it like I do my stodgy looking old AMG, and see if it keeps up.
  • dieselonedieselone Member Posts: 5,729
    may be the only actual Toyota owner in that thread. Mostly it's fintail, Gary, and imi complaining about 'em lacking soul or steering feel or whatever. :D

    Yeah, I've certainly noticed the light steering with the few Toyotas I've driven. I moved my MIL's '05 Camry v6 this morning. Still felt very tight even with 160k on it. Loved how smooth and quiet the engine is. Neither my Expedition or my wife's Taurus are in the ball park as far as NVH goes. But yeah, the steering is WAY to light for my tastes. I prefer steering effort that requires more than a pinkie finger. It's been a great car so far, a front wheel bearing has been it's only failure. Though it was in the shop a few weeks ago for some kind of recall.
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,966
    There was a box to check if I wanted a Chevy Volt delivered to my driveway rather than the tax refund.

    I opted to keep the refund for my taxes, and not get the Volt.

    They should do that next year as my taxes have paid for the building of the Volts.

    Early April Fools!
    '18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • dave8697dave8697 Member Posts: 1,498
    My recent experience with a '12 Chev 3.6 was 34 mpg combined. 1500 rpms at 65 mph. (twice idle rpms) After driving it nearly 200 miles and unable to put 6 gallons in it to fill it back up, I can't put it in gas guzzler category. Less than half the miles were on the interstate.
  • dieselonedieselone Member Posts: 5,729
    My recent experience with a '12 Chev 3.6 was 34 mpg combined. 1500 rpms at 65 mph. (twice idle rpms) After driving it nearly 200 miles and unable to put 6 gallons in it to fill it back up, I can't put it in gas guzzler category. Less than half the miles were on the interstate.

    One thing to consider is the '12 Impala (that's what you rented right) has the direct injected 3.6, the Malibu uses the port injected 3.6.
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    Hmm, is that where my '91 Escort was built?

    I'm not so sure that's good news. It had a lot of trim pieces falling off here and there. Powertrain was good, though.

    Let it go juice - it's been over 20 years. A friend had a 1990 Subaru that was a piece of junk - should I avoid Subaru's today??

    BTW, I had a 95 Escort made in Mexico. I sold it to my niece who sold it to her BIL - it's still running today.
  • dave8697dave8697 Member Posts: 1,498
    another thing to consider is the smaller, lighter size of the port injected Malibu.

    I just had to buy some 3.99 gas. Most I ever paid.
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