Gosh, I'm sure glad this isn't the "How to be Petty" thread. That would be a real shame if we had to change the title.
MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name. 2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h) Review your vehicle
Model Year Rebate Expires Source Camaro 2012 Financing Incentive: 1.9% to 3.9% 04/30/2012
That's actually really good that a 3 year old car, in the midst of rising gas prices still commands a financing percentage that high. It certainly offsets the $10 grand back/0 percent for 7 years financing they are offering on their trucks...
>You don't think the moderators should step in when people post tastelessly like they did? Children died and the guy was cheering like it was good news.
I don't know anything about tasteless posts and children dying.
I'm talking about the taunts which I suspect would fit under the description of behaviors in the Membership Agreement.
From what I've read on various sites, one would be better off from a powertrain standpoint to get a Mazda (Skyactiv) 3 Diesel, which will be available next year. Is the Cruze diesel going to have 300+ ft-lb of torque?
BTW, I'm actually basing that on something historical, not just hopin' and wishin' like some (ahem) folks here do.
Here's something really interesting AND historical.... an article on how Ford and Mulally helped save the auto industry. Also interesting is that GM wouldn't play, as they were so close to gone themselves. So Ford teamed up with Toyota, Chrysler, and Honda, among others:
Naaah. Those are the perfect cars. Nothing ever goes wrong.
Here we go again! Must be at least the fifth time I've seen a comment like that in sarcasm. Yet I'm still waiting to see where some actual Toyota FAN has made that claim. Seems like only the GM fans believe it!
But surely you can understand why we think it's weird that a recall of over 600K vehicles would go unmentioned on a Toyota board. That absolutely would not happen here.
2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
Still has the Chevy truck grill and Camaro like tail lights, Buick headlights? With all that money we gave em they coulda reopend the styling department!
Actually, 269 hp and 0-60 in 6.3 seconds sounds competent, at least. However, they need to also make sure it gets good fuel economy. I'd say the benchmark for this class of car right now, love it or hate it, is the Toyota Camry.
With the 4-cyl engine it's EPA-rated 25/35, and 0-60 is around 8.4 seconds I think. With the V-8, the EPA rating is 21/30, and 0-60 is around 6.3 seconds (I think MT or someone got 5.8 out of one on their test)
So, with the E-assist, the Malibu gets 25/37 and 0-60 is around 8.7. Not bad, but you give up some trunk space, have more complexity to deal with, and a higher base price.
The current 3.6 V-6 though, seems to be a bit of a guzzler. EPA rated 17/26, which sounds pretty bad compared to the Camry's 21/30. However, unless you do a LOT of driving, and gas gets really expensive, the Malibu won't bankrupt you compared to the Camry. Still, if you do mostly local driving, and those figures are accurate, the 3.6 is using about 24% more fuel than the Camry.
So, hopefully this Malibu turbo can deliver on the fuel economy, as well as performance.
Just looking at the specs on the Camaro ZL-1 and I see the mpg rating is 14 city / 19 hwy. I understand you are getting a lot of power, but those ratings are from when the ZL-1 is using a small fraction of that 580 hp.
The older-design 2012 Shelby GT500 for comparision is getting 15 /23 rating, with around 550 hp. There's no official mpg rating for the 650+ hp 2013 Shelby that I could find.
But I would guess the Camaro ZL-1 is going to get hit with a significant gas-guzzler charge. I believe those are still in effect? It's just kind of tough to say, "I have plenty of $, am not worried what mpg I get, and what might happen to the price of gas." when it's a Chevy. I can see people who are buying a top of the line Porsche, or an exotic (Ferrari, Lambo, AMG, Bentley ..) saying that. I don't know ... is the target audience, the guy who's going to drive this 100 miles/year - to a show or 2, garage it, and pass it on to the kids; who then can hopefully sell it for $1,000,000 in 2042?
The gas guzzler tax is a bad idea in a long list of bad ideas. It is Un-American and should be applied fairly and equally to all vehicles, not just cars while avoiding trucks.
'18 Porsche Macan Turbo, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
Just looking at the specs on the Camaro ZL-1 and I see the mpg rating is 14 city / 19 hwy.
Not surprising considering the CTS-V uses a similar powertrain and is rated at 14/19 too. I think it's about $1,300. I doubt that will scare off anyone that wants a ZL-1.
Oops, yeah that was a typo. Wonder if anyone's ever found a way to fit one into a Camry though? I've seen an old 70's Dodge Colt with a 440 V-8, a PT Cruiser with a 426 Hemi, and one of those K-car based mid-80's Dodge Daytona with a 318, so I guess it's possible if you put your mind, talent, and wallet to it!
The ace in the hole for the Camry is the hybrid. 43/39 with 200hp for less than 26 grand, that'd be the one I would go with personally.
Yeah, that is pretty impressive. In the past, one disadvantage to the hybrid Camry was that the battery pack cut trunk space from around 15 cubic feet to something like 10.9. A friend of mine has one, and I didn't think the trunk looked THAT small all things considered, but I guess those figures don't lie. I think the latest Camry has something like 13 cubic feet of trunk space. It's not gonna rival Lemko's '89 Brougham in that regard, but it's still not too bad.
Are those in the showrooms yet? I cruised the Ford lot Sunday when I was out in the Cobalt and didn't see any. None of the salesmen stood in front of me like they usually do or I would have asked him/her.
Supposedly the new Fusion is moving to Flatrock, MI.
Terrific news IMHO. It's not that Mexico can't build quality; I just would choose to not support Mexico with a high-ticket purchase....especially with the news that has been coming out of Mexico lately. Sheesh.
2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
I have a co-worker with a Mazda Protege with the same powertrain and the thing just keeps ticking right along. I don't know the mileage he's got on it and it looks like hell but whenever he passes by in the parking lot, the engine sounds sewing machine smooth.
Oh and edit to that last post regarding the Fusion: Just read again and it looks like the hybrid and future plug version will stay in Margaritaville...
Mine was a GT, that shared the DOHC 1.8l with the Mazda Protoge ES and the Mercury Tracer LTS. It was a revvy little engine, great bang for the buck.
The gear box would snag gears on occasion, too bad they couldn't use the Miata's shifter in those cars. I drove it for 107k miles on the original clutch, then it was totalled. :sick:
Ford Credit treated me badly, then I had a bunch of quality issues - rust on the fuel filler opening, trim falling out of the doors, seams coming undone, etc.
Basically a good powertrain wrapped in a car built to a (low) price point.
The Fusion lineup looks great. If they move production back to Michigan hopefully they can keep a close eye on quality and do well with those. They sure look good.
I wanted to find out by seeing one. I didn't brave the showroom. I just didn't feel like the BS from the salesfolk when I just wanted to look--but I couldn't see one parked on on the aircraft carrier size display area for new models. I think on the website it said they had 500 new cars sitting.
Just for historical accuracy, mcdawgg's post mentions nothing about a recall and is not in response to any other post...just a vague "I expect the Toyota haters to be here soon". The recall is posted after my post of March 8.
2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
I may be the only actual Toyota owner in that thread. Mostly it's fintail, Gary, and imi complaining about 'em lacking soul or steering feel or whatever.
xlu will pop up only when he has bad news, and never to respond to good news, so mcdawgg's post was probably referring to him specifically, which is why I found it funny. To us it was not vague at all.
Insider joke, I suppose. Any one who doesn't follow the thread wouldn't have understood.
may be the only actual Toyota owner in that thread. Mostly it's fintail, Gary, and imi complaining about 'em lacking soul or steering feel or whatever.
Yeah, I've certainly noticed the light steering with the few Toyotas I've driven. I moved my MIL's '05 Camry v6 this morning. Still felt very tight even with 160k on it. Loved how smooth and quiet the engine is. Neither my Expedition or my wife's Taurus are in the ball park as far as NVH goes. But yeah, the steering is WAY to light for my tastes. I prefer steering effort that requires more than a pinkie finger. It's been a great car so far, a front wheel bearing has been it's only failure. Though it was in the shop a few weeks ago for some kind of recall.
My recent experience with a '12 Chev 3.6 was 34 mpg combined. 1500 rpms at 65 mph. (twice idle rpms) After driving it nearly 200 miles and unable to put 6 gallons in it to fill it back up, I can't put it in gas guzzler category. Less than half the miles were on the interstate.
My recent experience with a '12 Chev 3.6 was 34 mpg combined. 1500 rpms at 65 mph. (twice idle rpms) After driving it nearly 200 miles and unable to put 6 gallons in it to fill it back up, I can't put it in gas guzzler category. Less than half the miles were on the interstate.
One thing to consider is the '12 Impala (that's what you rented right) has the direct injected 3.6, the Malibu uses the port injected 3.6.
Comments
Time to tell all the Korean and Japanese brand-buffs that too!
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Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h)
Review your vehicle
Camaro 2012 Financing Incentive: 1.9% to 3.9% 04/30/2012
That's actually really good that a 3 year old car, in the midst of rising gas prices still commands a financing percentage that high. It certainly offsets the $10 grand back/0 percent for 7 years financing they are offering on their trucks...
That means that GM loan has a higher-than-market rate.
What incentive? :confuse:
I don't know anything about tasteless posts and children dying.
I'm talking about the taunts which I suspect would fit under the description of behaviors in the Membership Agreement.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I was not as fortunate.
I don't think think there is anything wrong with asking for a source from any poster, though, especially when it's bad news.
Let's get back to GM...who wants a diesel Cruze?
http://www.chevrolet.com/tools/currentoffers/results.do?zipCode=44240
Here's something really interesting AND historical.... an article on how Ford and Mulally helped save the auto industry. Also interesting is that GM wouldn't play, as they were so close to gone themselves. So Ford teamed up with Toyota, Chrysler, and Honda, among others:
Inside Ford's Fight to Avoid Disaster
Here we go again! Must be at least the fifth time I've seen a comment like that in sarcasm. Yet I'm still waiting to see where some actual Toyota FAN has made that claim. Seems like only the GM fans believe it!
Alrighty, then. I stand corrected. Let's wait until they collect on the dealer lots...sorta like the ZR-1 did in 2010.
Regards,
OW
2013 Chevy Malibu's turbo four rated at 269 HP, 0-60 in 6.3 seconds
GM is #1? :confuse:
Regards,
OW
That is so true!!!!
I bet 99% of the US population doesn't know you can get an Audi A4 Wagon/Avant style in the US!
Even Audi's website kinda hides the fact.
LOL
With the 4-cyl engine it's EPA-rated 25/35, and 0-60 is around 8.4 seconds I think. With the V-8, the EPA rating is 21/30, and 0-60 is around 6.3 seconds (I think MT or someone got 5.8 out of one on their test)
So, with the E-assist, the Malibu gets 25/37 and 0-60 is around 8.7. Not bad, but you give up some trunk space, have more complexity to deal with, and a higher base price.
The current 3.6 V-6 though, seems to be a bit of a guzzler. EPA rated 17/26, which sounds pretty bad compared to the Camry's 21/30. However, unless you do a LOT of driving, and gas gets really expensive, the Malibu won't bankrupt you compared to the Camry. Still, if you do mostly local driving, and those figures are accurate, the 3.6 is using about 24% more fuel than the Camry.
So, hopefully this Malibu turbo can deliver on the fuel economy, as well as performance.
You mean there is an American motor that is a gas guzzler?!? Say it ain't so!
:sick:
A V8 Camry? Sign me up!
The ace in the hole for the Camry is the hybrid. 43/39 with 200hp for less than 26 grand, that'd be the one I would go with personally.
The older-design 2012 Shelby GT500 for comparision is getting 15 /23 rating, with around 550 hp. There's no official mpg rating for the 650+ hp 2013 Shelby that I could find.
But I would guess the Camaro ZL-1 is going to get hit with a significant gas-guzzler charge. I believe those are still in effect? It's just kind of tough to say, "I have plenty of $, am not worried what mpg I get, and what might happen to the price of gas." when it's a Chevy. I can see people who are buying a top of the line Porsche, or an exotic (Ferrari, Lambo, AMG, Bentley ..) saying that. I don't know ... is the target audience, the guy who's going to drive this 100 miles/year - to a show or 2, garage it, and pass it on to the kids; who then can hopefully sell it for $1,000,000 in 2042?
The problem is, they are garishly painted and only turn left.
Not surprising considering the CTS-V uses a similar powertrain and is rated at 14/19 too. I think it's about $1,300. I doubt that will scare off anyone that wants a ZL-1.
Except it didn't go unmentioned, and you looked less than 24 hours after the recall was announced.
Ford is supposed to beat that with the Fusion hybrid. Let's see.
The new Fusion is gorgeous, too.
Good one!
Oops, yeah that was a typo. Wonder if anyone's ever found a way to fit one into a Camry though? I've seen an old 70's Dodge Colt with a 440 V-8, a PT Cruiser with a 426 Hemi, and one of those K-car based mid-80's Dodge Daytona with a 318, so I guess it's possible if you put your mind, talent, and wallet to it!
The ace in the hole for the Camry is the hybrid. 43/39 with 200hp for less than 26 grand, that'd be the one I would go with personally.
Yeah, that is pretty impressive. In the past, one disadvantage to the hybrid Camry was that the battery pack cut trunk space from around 15 cubic feet to something like 10.9. A friend of mine has one, and I didn't think the trunk looked THAT small all things considered, but I guess those figures don't lie. I think the latest Camry has something like 13 cubic feet of trunk space. It's not gonna rival Lemko's '89 Brougham in that regard, but it's still not too bad.
That's plenty adequate. Any more and it should probably be RWD so the front half of the car doesn't tear itself away from the back half.
Are those in the showrooms yet? I cruised the Ford lot Sunday when I was out in the Cobalt and didn't see any. None of the salesmen stood in front of me like they usually do or I would have asked him/her.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
link title
Terrific news IMHO. It's not that Mexico can't build quality; I just would choose to not support Mexico with a high-ticket purchase....especially with the news that has been coming out of Mexico lately. Sheesh.
http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.efda853/15400#MSG15400
The thread had been inactive for 2 days prior to mdawgg's posting.
I'm not so sure that's good news. It had a lot of trim pieces falling off here and there. Powertrain was good, though.
Oh and edit to that last post regarding the Fusion: Just read again and it looks like the hybrid and future plug version will stay in Margaritaville...
The gear box would snag gears on occasion, too bad they couldn't use the Miata's shifter in those cars. I drove it for 107k miles on the original clutch, then it was totalled. :sick:
Ford Credit treated me badly, then I had a bunch of quality issues - rust on the fuel filler opening, trim falling out of the doors, seams coming undone, etc.
Basically a good powertrain wrapped in a car built to a (low) price point.
The Fusion lineup looks great. If they move production back to Michigan hopefully they can keep a close eye on quality and do well with those. They sure look good.
I wanted to find out by seeing one. I didn't brave the showroom. I just didn't feel like the BS from the salesfolk when I just wanted to look--but I couldn't see one parked on on the aircraft carrier size display area for new models. I think on the website it said they had 500 new cars sitting.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
U.S.A.(1or 4), Canada(2), Mexico(3), Japan(J), Korea(K), England(S), Germany(W), Italy(Z).
xlu will pop up only when he has bad news, and never to respond to good news, so mcdawgg's post was probably referring to him specifically, which is why I found it funny. To us it was not vague at all.
Insider joke, I suppose. Any one who doesn't follow the thread wouldn't have understood.
I should test drive a new one and a new GS, drive it like I do my stodgy looking old AMG, and see if it keeps up.
Yeah, I've certainly noticed the light steering with the few Toyotas I've driven. I moved my MIL's '05 Camry v6 this morning. Still felt very tight even with 160k on it. Loved how smooth and quiet the engine is. Neither my Expedition or my wife's Taurus are in the ball park as far as NVH goes. But yeah, the steering is WAY to light for my tastes. I prefer steering effort that requires more than a pinkie finger. It's been a great car so far, a front wheel bearing has been it's only failure. Though it was in the shop a few weeks ago for some kind of recall.
I opted to keep the refund for my taxes, and not get the Volt.
They should do that next year as my taxes have paid for the building of the Volts.
Early April Fools!
One thing to consider is the '12 Impala (that's what you rented right) has the direct injected 3.6, the Malibu uses the port injected 3.6.
I'm not so sure that's good news. It had a lot of trim pieces falling off here and there. Powertrain was good, though.
Let it go juice - it's been over 20 years. A friend had a 1990 Subaru that was a piece of junk - should I avoid Subaru's today??
BTW, I had a 95 Escort made in Mexico. I sold it to my niece who sold it to her BIL - it's still running today.
I just had to buy some 3.99 gas. Most I ever paid.