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The DTS should come down a lot in price, I think, and maybe at the $40K price point it could sell quite nicely as the "squish-mobile" counterpoint to a proper sport STS. So could they accomplish that by continuing the Lucerne as that model? I dunno. Other luxury carmakers basically mint money making Euro-style sport models even in their larger cars, with Lexus the obvious exception. I think you could sell two models side by side that are approximately the same size and price range, if one is a dedicated sport model and the other is a luxo-cruiser without a whiff of road feel or noise (a la LS460 and the Lucerne, DTS, etc). The question is if such an approach can yield high enough profits to make it worth it.
And Cadillac eventually needs a smaller version of the CTS, shortened on the same platform, to compete head to head with other automakers' entry models.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Don't they have the BLS in Europe?
That's something that always surprises me...the American brands always say no one's willing to buy a high end smaller car, and so they won't make them. And yet BMW sells lots of 3-series and Minis, Merc sells the C class, Acura sold a bunch of RSX and TSX, Lexus has somethingorother (dunno about Infiniti). They're making money off of them. I bet if Ford made a Mercury version of the Focus it'd sell (maybe not a Lincoln version...then again Ford should make Mercury their sport brand...liquid metal, very cool, heh).
Didn't know your Catalina was a convert - cool man!! :shades: .
Heck, around here 40-degrees is a heat wave (honestly even 30-degrees is nice considering the weather we've been getting this year)!! I've been tempted a couple of times to take the '86 Cutlass out, especially a few weeks ago when it hit 60+ degrees for a day, but left it on its jack-stands - I did pull the cover off and start it though. The '65 Impala, it'll see the light of day again come June.
Before I sold it, I'd take the '66 Impala out year round as long as it wasn't too cold and the roads were nice. People thought I was NUTS!!
FWD and Cadillac need to disappear completely if the brand is ever going to get the same respect as it's German rivals.
I don't care if I can walk into a Cadillac dealer and buy a 1000 hp, 200 mph track queen that can lap the Nurburg in 2 minutes flat as long as it is still sharing the same showroom floor with a front drive DTS sporting wire wheels, a landau roof and curb feelers , or a blinged out gangsta mobile rollin on 25 inch Frisbees that freewheel.
Cadillac shows no focus. Sadly, the new SRX is showing signs that Cadillac is more interested in being a competitor to Acura and Volvo than the Germans.
http://money.cnn.com/2009/02/25/news/companies/auto_outlook/index.htm?postversio- n=2009022514
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Now mind you, this is just a C-class which can be had for under 30 grand. All these technologies and features carry down from the bigger S-classes and even the Maybachs.
Now listen to a review of the Cadillac CTS (CTS-V even). Listen to the supposed "features". Bigger wheels, bigger grill, very fast, etc...
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Both are very nice cars imo and I would be proud to own and drive each. But, when I am researching the Merc, I find innovation. I find engineering effort, I find attention to detail. With the Cadillac, I see just another car. Nice car, but nothing unique. Very American.
I mean no offense by these comparisons. They are both very good cars.
Reminds me of those days I've heard about...bigger fins, biggest front end in the industry...maybe GM is still living in the 60s?
To those who would knock the new SRX, I would say that it should not be forgotten that the Lexus RX, FWD and based haevily on the Highlander and all, is in many months the #1 seller of all the Lexi. If it deviates slightly from the new Cadillac philosophy, the new SRX should still be a source of nice profits for GM.
To those who would say that the current DTS is an autobahn-worthy competitor to the likes of the S-class, even the LS, I would say test drive the competition. The difference is almost blinding. But there are others here dismissing the STS, and since the model changeover it is my understanding that it is just a larger CTS on a stretched version of the same platform, and while it may be a little outclassed by the competition, it is very much NOT a wallowing Cadillac-of-old.
The European BLS in't going to cut it in my hypothetical reconstruction model - a proper RWD smaller car is demanded in this price range, which could be developed off the existing CTS platform, using at least one of the same powertrains.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
But you're right, uncorked those vehicles can roll. The S-Class is a really nice machine, and quite comfy-cozy!!
V8s and front wheel drive platforms really do not work that well, and only GM has tried to stick with it. GM is learning though that this combination will never match the prowess of the LS400, S-Class, A8 or 7 series BMW. So if it is going up against that crowd 300Hp and FWD will not cut it.
No such beast resides at my Cadillac dealer and my own car is free of any of that self-destructive add-on junk. In fact, no Cadillac has come from the factory with either a vinyl roof or wire wheels since at least 1996 if I include the old school Fleetwood Brougham.
What people do to their cars after they purchase them is their business. Heck, I've seen plenty of new BMW 7-Series sporting, of all things, aftermarket Buick portholes. I've actually seen a C-Class sporting fake Ferrari Testarossa side grilles.
After that, ZERO outside of the enduring Corvette.
IDIOTS!
Regards,
OW
Regards,
OW
Regards,
OW
I must admit I did not know how much any US sedan was out-classed until I drove the competition. It took the CTS that year to drastically change that for 1 model.
Regards,
OW
I feel bad that he is being crushed by the current events regarding GM's plight.
Regards,
OW
Now, if they made it look like this, I'm sold!
Regards,
OW
All of the high-end cars are taking a big hit lately. Now is the time to pounce if you've got the dinero!
Regards,
OW
Wouldn't you classify the S-Class, 7-Series, and LS as land yachts, or do they get a pass because they're imports?
In this context I believe yacht means "big and floaty". Those other cars are big but probably only the LS is even a bit floaty.
Some place other than where you are? :P
Sorry, I just had to do that!
Agreed. Hope he's ok. You would think even if he lost his job he would be able to post. 62', if you are out there, we are missing your input.
The 2009 weighs 3,415 lbs. The 2010 Camaro SS is 3,913 lbs.!!
Consider the SS396 Chevelle, and there you have it! The old one wins!
Regards,
OW
'68 Malibu at 3309 lbs? No a/c, no power windows, antenna, door locks, or mirrors, no leather, no air bags (6), no auto trans, no 5th gear, no stability control, no alloy wheels, no sunroof, no 8 spkr Bose stereo, no CD, and maybe 30 more things not in the car.
Close. The V-8 weighed 3,170, while the SS396 weighed 3,475 (coupe)
Camaro was about 100 lbs lighter in both respects.
But dave is right about the safety equiptment, and these old cars would've folded like a pup tent in a hurricane, as they had very little safety engineered in them.
Anyway, I don't know what this banker guy's been smoking:
Praise for American cars isn’t limited to the enthusiast press. James E. Malackowski, president of Ocean Tomo LLC, a Chicago merchant bank, wrote: “GM has higher average quality and newer green technology and patents than the other 14 automakers combined. Ford and GM together hold approximately a third of all green technology patents. GM has 70 percent of the patents in the emerging technology category. This domestic share increases to 85 percent if Ford is added.”
On Value of a 2010 Camaro?
I paid $10,600 for a new '84 V6 Camaro. 105 HP!!!! My '82 house has gone from $53k to $253k and now back down to $180k with the bubble bursting. It will now buy 8 of next year's V6 Camaro's if the base price really starts at $22k as R&T stated, which is only twice the price of my '84. I think mine stickered for $11,600 in '84. Then, Look at what the 2010 model has: Nearly triple the HP, 500 lbs more materials converted into dozens of std features, all the safety equipment, 5x the warranty, and 15x the reliability. The 300 HP V6 in the new one also gets 26 mpg hwy like my '84 did. Then we wonder why UAW and salary wages are up 5x since '83 and GM can't make a profit at cars. Perot said there'd be a giant sucking sound down by the Rio Grande. He didn't fortell the other one at the Left Coast.
Agree the added weight also adds tons of safety and convenience. Death lives in the older cars.
Regards,
OW
The values are all messed up! Once I am a little further away from the one year mark of my car, my value should start to level of, along with pay off. Still not where I need it though.
Yep and if you look at the computer industry, you'll see even more dramatic improvement. People have on their desktops what used to be the supercomputer at Sandia Labs in 1984. And yet computer manufacturers are struglling to stay in business, make many components overseas, and employ temporaries here in the U.SS. at about $10/hr with no benefits.
Product performance is not really relevant to making profit or good wages, unless your company makes something substantially better then the rest of the companies. All cars and car companies have improved.
The problem is there is too much capacity globally. There was getting to be too much capacity even when the economy was good. Manufacturers even then were losing money.
Regards,
OW
GM Posts $30.9-Billion Loss for 2008, Second Biggest Ever
Fire the entire management. Fire everyone up top. Have GM do nothing but build fleet cars at cost for the government.(plus do some r&d and so on of course).
No dealers and no advertising budget.
In any case I'd make it a condition to get another DIME of funding that GM's entire management needs to go. They clearly can't figure it out.
Chrysler is even worse!
Ford is surviving, good for them. They should be the lone remnant of the Big 3 failures!