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Honda Civic 2005 and earlier

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Comments

  • s852s852 Member Posts: 1,051
    If the manual says 10,000 miles and you do not meet their definition of severe conditions, then taking it to the dealer every 3,000 miles would be an outrageous waste.
    If you want to be extra safe, then do the "severe conditions" schedule of 5,000 miles.
    Honda spent lots of time and money designing the new engines in the 2001 Civics to require less maintenance, but the dealer stills wants to get the money of 3,000 mile services that cars needed in the 80's and earlier.
    Some cars need a first oil change at 500-1000 to get rid of "metal shavings," but most do not and the owners manual will say if it does or not. Many years ago all cars needed that, but now sometimes the engines are partially broken in before they are installed into the car at the assembly plant.
  • petrie3petrie3 Member Posts: 47
    Thanks for all the input on leasing, etc. I generally agree with all the comments made about long term leasing being less attractive than buying. Generally, if you put alot of miles on and/or usually keep your car more than 3-4 yrs. it makes sense to buy. Bottom line comparison involves an assumption of what you do with the capital (i.e. downpayment)and payment level that you save when leasing. Prior to the stock market decline, you could make alot more investing than avoiding a 7% lease or loan payment. Remember though, this is my 24 yr. old daughter's car. The first one she is buying/leasing herself. Cash is in relatively short supply for her and, surprise surprise...she doesn't always listen to Dad's advice to buy a cheaper car that she can afford rather than have to get a new one! That said, a $240 lease payment is one she can afford on her income. She gets to keep her savings for a "rainy day" fund, etc. I lease my cars for 3 years because I prefer to save capital for my own use and I own my company and write off the lease payment against it (to the % that the car is business use, anyway).

    Actually, my primary question was aimed more at the cap cost being at dealer invoice and Edmunds TMV at about the same level. I think Honda dealers have a 2% holdback, but I have also seen ads for many Civics at well-under invoice. What gives? :-)) I'm curious, plus I want to know that my daughter is getting a good deal, even if she didn't take all of Dad's advice! ;-))
  • gasguzzgasguzz Member Posts: 214
    I don't find it unusual using dealer invoice in a lease program, since it's a given they'll be making money elsewhere. The equation is always equal - it doesn't matter where they place the profit margin, as long as they gain it. It highly unusual to ACTUALLY SELL Hondas below invoice. Ads and dealer stock are two different matters - remember the 'ol bait-and-switch tactic. FINANCIALLY, no, your daughter is not getting a good deal (because of higher cost). But since you've already rationalized the cost of the transaction... yes, Hondas are a good deal (in terms of mechanical longevity).
    Welcome to the club.
  • s852s852 Member Posts: 1,051
    It is common for dealers to list prices on ads that are for a limited number of cars (or even just one) that are sold even before the paper gets to the news stand.

    If you can write off the lease as a business expense, then that is another situation that can make leasing cheaper than buying.

    For most people who cannot do that, as far as saving capital: You can finance a car for 5 years and not even put up the minimum charges required for a lease (first payment, plus misc fees and deposits).
    My credit union offers 72 month loans with 100% financing including tax and license.

    I could probably 100% finance a 2001 Civic at invoice plus tax and license for 5 years, and sell/trade it at 36 months for similar payments to leasing for 36 months.
    Financed at 6 years, the payments would be even lower even with zero down and, if originally purchased at little above invoice, should still have some equity by the 36th payment even with that long of a loan.
  • raybearraybear Member Posts: 1,795
    You might be able to shave a couple hundred off, no more than that, and it only adds up to a few dollars a month difference. Don't kill yourself shopping.
  • gasguzzgasguzz Member Posts: 214
    You can never really project your car's future value. What they don't tell you is that buying at $99 down could put you "upside down" (loan > value)after 3 years.
    Do not fall for $0 down deals no matter what the APR - that only increases your risk.
  • s852s852 Member Posts: 1,051
    I have purchased 3 Hondas with $0 down and 5 year loans ranging from 5.9% to 7.9% via my credit union and I have been able to sell all of them for more than the remaining loan balance after less than 24 payments. So I know it can be done.
    If I purchased a new Hyundai or a Ford Taurus, I probably could not have done that.
    It is important that your purchase price is as low as possible so that the difference between the original purchase price and the value when you sell is a small as possible.
  • bordsourcebordsource Member Posts: 95
    The Civic EX does, in fact, use the VTEC-E system, which partially explains why the car may be more sluggish around town when compared to old EX. The extra torque alone can't make up for the revised system.

    jjpcat- I find it interesting that you should say that the Civic's ride is harsh. I find it too soft, more specifically uncontrolled, especially on rebound. The old Civics rode much farmer, which lent a better sense of control. I disagree, however, that it's the worst in class. I, for one, found the Neon's ride choppy and the Cavaliers just flat out bad (uncontrolled, but surprisingly hard, just bad). The Sentry is better, though.
  • ian2ian2 Member Posts: 168
    I took a non-VTEC Civic out from the dealership just to compare. The damn thing didn't have a techometer so I had to go by the feel. In the 5th gear while doing 60-70km/h, I was able to get the car to actually accelerate. Even though not as quickly as my 1.6 non-VTEC, it does feel more powerful than a the 1.7 VTEC. So the question is, what the hell was Honda thinking?! I shift between 2000-2500rpm and the my car picks up speed swiftly. With VTEC, I'd have to shift between 3000-4000rpm while putting up with the engine revving at 4000rpm while going 75mph. Just for a test, at 90mph, my non-VTEC 1.6 spins at just over 3500rpm.
  • devoredevore Member Posts: 39
    >In the 5th gear while doing 60-70km/h, I was able to get the car to actually accelerate.

    I wouldn't expect to get a whole lot of acceleration in 5th gear at 43 mph. In fact, you're probably wasting gas accelerating in 5th at that speed.

    >I shift between 2000-2500rpm and the my car picks up speed swiftly.

    That seems like a really low shiftpoint to me, and in my totally uninformed opinion, I'd say you're actually hurting your fuel economy by shifting that early. Even if I'm driving "easy" on the car, I'll shift at about 3000rpm in my '01 EX. In normal driving, I shift at about 4000rpm.

    >With VTEC, I'd have to shift between 3000-4000rpm while putting up with the engine revving at 4000rpm while going 75mph. Just for a test, at 90mph, my non-VTEC 1.6 spins at just over 3500rpm.

    What car are you referring to here? In my '01 EX, I'm at about 3700 rpm @ 75mph, and right about 4000 rpm @ 80mph.

    I find it really hard to believe a 1.6L four cylinder engine can get your car up to 90mph @ 3500 rpm, unless they've drastically changed the gear ratios between years, or something.
  • gasguzzgasguzz Member Posts: 214
    Yes, I agree. There is a special consideration when doing $0 down deals. It does have a direct relationship on what the car your buying is and the purchase price. There are those who go for Kia/Hyundai//Daewoo at $0 down and say it has better a value (on warranty and price) - just wait and see in the long term.
  • soberssobers Member Posts: 496
    SHopping for a frined for 2001 Civic LX Auto.
    200 over invoice, $100 for Keyless, 48 Docs, 150 New plates.
  • civic_cx_92civic_cx_92 Member Posts: 87
    2001 Honda Civic 4 door sedan tested as best pick.


    http://www.highwaysafety.org/vehicle_ratings/ce/html/summary_small.htm


    another kudos for Honda.


    CX

  • fowler3fowler3 Member Posts: 1,919
    gduffy, you can advertise your '97 Civic for free
    on autotrader.com no photo.

    fowler3
  • patpat Member Posts: 10,421
    can also be done for free through Edmunds.com's Used Power Shopper which is partnered with autotrader.com.

    Accessing autotrader through Edmunds would be the polite thing to do for the site that gives you all this wonderful information and these great message boards for free. ;-)

    Pat
    Host
    Sedans and Women's Auto Center Message Boards
  • ian2ian2 Member Posts: 168
    When I drove the the 1.7 VTEC, I was also forced to shift between 3000 and 4000rpm, otherwise, the engine whould shake at me. My '98 has no VTEC and I can keep up with traffic easily when shifting between 2000 and 2500rpm.

    At 140km/h (~90mph), my engine revs at just over 3500, maybe 3600.
  • mdrivermdriver Member Posts: 385
    If the 01 Civic EX has the VTEC-E engine, this would explain the lack of response at highway speeds. My gen6 HX behaves exactly like this. It is terminally unresponsive at anywhere from 65 to 80 mph in 5th. I have to almost floor it to get it to respond, and only then does it pick up. By contrast, a non-VTEC does not go into this "sleep mode" and is ready to respond instantly. I would not buy the VTEC-E equipped Civic for this reason in the future. The VTEC-E system only increases mileage by a couple of MPGs and is not worth the aggravation.
  • f6bikerf6biker Member Posts: 33
    I saw a TV report claiming $3 gas prices by August. There are only a few cars that get really good fuel economy like the Civic and the Civic is the top of its class for size and comfort too. When gas goes up you will have to wait in line to buy all of these high mpg cars, just like the 1970's. I think that we bought a good car at the right time.
  • tazerelitazereli Member Posts: 241
    I would like to know how people feel about the new suspension of the civic. My 98 EX has the 4 wheel double wishbone and was wondering if people were missing this or didnt even notice?
  • newcivnewciv Member Posts: 22
    .....didn't even notice. Anyone who thinks the Double-wishbone is better, or noticably better I should say, has been reading too many Road&Track magazines. In theory, its better for a race-car, but I'll bet anyone on this board that you'll NEVER be able to decipher a difference with your 01' Civic.

    I'll take this non-discernable difference for the added rear-seat passenger space and much improved frontal crash results !!

    NewCiv
  • bigkahunaflbigkahunafl Member Posts: 128
    I have a 2001 EX Sedan with nearly 3,000 miles on it. When the engine is cold my car will surge about 300-400 rpm's when shifting around the 40 mph mark on my automatic transmission. The engine sometimes will surge one more time after the first time, but never again. It's almost like the clutch (even though this is auto) was pushed in too early on a shift. Anyone else experience this problem?
  • carguy000carguy000 Member Posts: 55
    Yesterday I was going to get supper and I hadn't driven the car since I had come home from church...so the engine was cold. I noticed, also around 40, that it just didn't shift right. It was very much like you described. I have an auto with 1,300 miles. I don't know if it is my imagination or not. I didn't notice it this morning though. I'm going to look at my RPM gauge the next time to see if my RPMs go up when I notice this. I'll report later if I notice it. Other than this, I love my Civic and have had no problems with it.
  • raybearraybear Member Posts: 1,795
    Many cars will idle high until the engine warms up. My Subaru does the same thing. It is normal.
  • mdrivermdriver Member Posts: 385
    After driving the 01 EX and LX several times, I believe that the strut suspension in the front actually improves cornering over the old double wishbone. The problem seems to be in the back where excessive bouncing seems to take place. The rear is still a double wishbone design, although altered to save space. I've seen this bouncing when following 01's, both EX and LX, 2 and 4 door. I think the attempt by Honda to make the Civic ride more luxuriously has (or will) backfire. The gen6 suspension seems much more controlled and supple at the same time, although cornering is nothing to write home about in either gen6 or 7.
  • justinjustin Member Posts: 1,918
    Thank you! Thank you very much for your post. I have, since December when I got my 2001 EX, maintained that in fact, the strut suspension is harsher and flatter/better handling, than my 97 Civic. I think Honda wanted to made the safety and room improvements, but were so afraid that the enthusiasts would scream, so they made the strut suspension very stiff. Seriously, in my EX coupe, I feel like I might as well be driving a Miata.....fun usually, but gets annoying on occasion...

    I really don't think that many people have actually driven the new Civics, yet they are commenting on how bad the new suspension is....makes no sense to me. To me, it is completely obvious. There is a big difference - but it is not negative one.
  • bigkahunaflbigkahunafl Member Posts: 128
    I don't think this is idle, it is surging around the 2500 mark or higher.
  • ejonavinejonavin Member Posts: 36
    So much for wishbone better than struts. I will have to agree 100% that the struts handle very well, and the problem lies in the rear double wishbone. I thought I was just imagining it... then one day I had through a road that had lot's of speed bumps (every 3 feet it seems) and the front went through with no problems, but the rear just didn't like it.

    I like the new quicker steering. Handles very well overall.

    Acura 1.7 EL (Canadian EX sedan)
  • cartagramcartagram Member Posts: 115
    Although I had test driven '00 Civic sedans several times in the weeks preceding my purchase, I was surprised by the bounce of the '01 Civic LX as it went through dips in the road, and by the harshness or stiffness of the suspension when confronting broken pavement.

    But, the car does seem to take curves confidently and quickly.

    If you wanted a softer ride, what could you do? Change tires (mine are Firestones), struts...? Add soundproofing? Or just accept the Civic as a sub-Accord and revel in its positive points?
  • scully7475scully7475 Member Posts: 1
    I am new to the forum and need some assistance. I adore my 1995 Civic. Everything has been wonderful- except for the paint.
    Beginning about 3 years ago it started to fade. It is now significantly gone. The hood and the roof are the most effected, however there is the start of a new patch fading on the bottom of one of the doors.
    Yes, I live in Arizona and do not always have my car in covered parking, but this is beyond sun damage.
    I called someone at Honda Corporate who said others have called with the same complaint but he was not aware of a recall.
    Does anyone have any advice?
    Thanks,
    scully7475
  • gasguzzgasguzz Member Posts: 214
    2k-Sedan EX. Swapped the entire stereo system and noticed this (after removing seats/backs, front/rear dash, trunk liner and door speaker grilles): Thin-pile carpet with no backing, and behind the body panels - bare sheet metal. Design... with no splashguard behind he rear fenders and underneath the trunk floor, it creates a resounding resonance in the trunk interior (check it out when you drive and have the pass-through seatback down).
    So if you're thinking doing Dynamat here and there, forget it since you'll have to do the entire car (unless you can rationalize the cost). Pumping up the volume is more "cost effective".
    Regardless, ACCEPTING where the Civic market segmentation is - it's a great car.
    Good luck.
  • joshuae73joshuae73 Member Posts: 21
    I just got mine 3 weeks ago for $15700 with floormats, (+ tax and license). Also I paid $400 for an alarm system that guarantees this if my car is stolen:

    they would pay me the difference between what insurance pays and how much a new car costs.

    Out the door price was $17,700 with everything.

    Filled the tank 3 times. Here are my mileage numbers:

    33.7
    34.2
    37.3

    I can't believe I got 37.3 MPG on 60% highway driving. I am stunned and amazed.
  • justinjustin Member Posts: 1,918
    good numbers there! i have an EX automatic coupe 2001. I only ever seem to get 29-30, all city driving. guess the auto trans really does make a difference. have not had the oil changed yet...waiting until 4k miles.
  • zluzlu Member Posts: 1
    I have a 2000 honda civid lx and will hit 30,000 miles soon. I always go to a Honda service center for any service of my car, but this time I got a coupon for 30k mi service which is much cheaper then honda service provides. Shall I stick with the honda service center or take advantage of the coupon? Thanks for any response.
  • s852s852 Member Posts: 1,051
    Having the service done somewhere else is probably fine, but it looks good at resale to have all dealer service.
    I would check for coupons from the dealer and also shop around at other Honda dealers.
    I had oil changes at my Honda dealer for $19.95 and most other services for prices in the range of mom and pop mechanics especially when the dealer had coupons.
  • dilynnmdilynnm Member Posts: 4
    Hey,

    Has anyone purchased a new vehicle using carsdirect.com or any of the other online services? My wife and I are going to purchase a Honda Civic Ex soon and we didn't talk money yet, but the salesman wanted to inform us that he didn't have a lot of room to move.

    I have a price in mind by looking at edmunds and carsdirects websites and will use this info when dealing, but want to know if people are satisfied with carsdirect if the honda dealers in my area won't negotiate.

    Based on the prices some of you have paid, I'm not paying MSRP either and want to use carsdirect as a bargaining chip, but I may have to actually use it.

    Any info would be of great help.

    Thanks,

    dilynnm
  • joshuae73joshuae73 Member Posts: 21
    I never actually used carsdirect.com but I know they offer cars at invoice + dealer holdback + destination charge. so the Civic EX sedan 5-speed would be $15726.

    That is a good price according to Edmunds, and I haven't seen any flat out offers from dealers below that price. It could be used as a bargaining chip, but I decided against buying from carsdirect.com because it seemed there was no dealership associated with it, nobody to "bring the car back to" if there were problems... I thought it would lack the personal component. Of course you can bring it to any dealership, but the anonymity seemed too scary for such a big cash transaction.

    I used 2 bargaining chips:

    1) I shopped around at 4 Honda dealerships and got print-outs of offers, which I showed to the other dealers. Most dealers were willing to offer me Edmunds TMV price. When I showed the other dealer, they agreed to throw in floor mats for the same price.

    2) FIND PROBLEMS with the car you will buy. I noticed the trunk fabric was not perfectly tucked in on one corner of the trunk, and that there was some dirt in the back-seat floor, probably from people who tracked dirt in the car... and I said, well, I want my new car to be PERFECT. The manager agreed to knock a couple hundred dollars off. I was able to tuck in the trunk fabric just fine, and they vacuumed the back floor and covered it with brand new floormats!

    But now, I am not totally sure I really DID get a good deal... because all I see are the internet prices... I don't actually know any human who BOUGHT the same car, so I can't really be SURE I got a good deal!
  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    Right now, Civics are in good supply. No need to pay MSRP. Just find a different dealer.
  • jjpcatjjpcat Member Posts: 124
    I couldn't agree more for what your guys were saying here. I have never owned any Civic before my current 2001 Civic LX. But I owned a 96 Accord LX and a 98 Lexus ES300 before this one. I would say Civic handles way much better than that Accord (which has double wishbone at both front and rear) and is on par with the Lexus. On the freeway on-ramp near my home, both Lexus and Civic would start complaining at 37-38mph. The Accord would complain at 32mph with the factory tires and 34mph after I changed tires.

    But Civic's suspension (especially the rear one) leaves too much to be desired. I think this is my only major complain against this Civic. There are 5 annoying speed bumps from my home to the entrance of the community. I used to run over them at 15-20mph with the Lexus without making my wife mutter. With the Accord, I would run over at 5-10mph. But this Civic forces me to come to complete stop at each bump and even that still makes my wife complain about headache when the rear end runs over the bumps at sub-walking speed. On the streets, it reminds me of every hole/dip larger than a few inches. As I said in one of my previous message, I didn't experience this problem with Corolla/Sentra/Cavalier/Neon or even Accent. So I don't know what's wrong with Civic.

    Other than that, I like this Civic. Its auto transmission is as smooth as that of the Lexus. And, for all the things I hate my 96 Accord: horrible brake, jerky transmission, bad handling, weak AC, noisy interior, sub-par assembly quality, and factory floor mats that didn't fit the floor, Civic is doing a (much) better job.
  • cheapownercheapowner Member Posts: 47
    Since there many complains about '01 rear suspension. I decided to take a close look at the sedan's rear suspension at the dealer. The LX does not have rear sway bar but EX does. The previous generation LX has holes predrill for aftermarket sway bar. I think Honda just found a way to save a few bucks and car nuts are not going to happy about it.
  • rkanrkan Member Posts: 11
  • pbagratpbagrat Member Posts: 25
    I have a '93 Civic which has been a reliable car, but a bit harsh on the ride and lots of road noise. I really had my heart set on a V-6 Accord LX, but would consider a Civic EX if the ride quality has improved.

    So, any 2001 Civic owners, please give me your input. I wanted something larger than my Civic, but the new one is only 1.7 inches smaller in rear leg room than the Accord. Also my '93 is a manual transmission, but it doesn't have much pep to it (maybe its the 143,000 miles?). Any suggestions? I would rather spend the extra money if necessary to get a smoother/quieter ride.
  • rkanrkan Member Posts: 11
    I thought sway bars affected the body roll in turns, and did not have much to do with the "bounce" up and down. What is everybodys opinion on stiffer aftermarket struts to help control rebound?
  • mdrivermdriver Member Posts: 385
    I too noticed that the pre-drilled holes were absent from the LX, making it difficult to install a sway bar. However, sway bar or no sway bar, the rear bounces in both EX and LX. I have also read an article in a British auto magazine about the Civic coupe. They said the rear bounced too.

    By-the-way, the UK gets a Civic coupe with climate control, break-away side mirrors, alloys and I think rear discs. It is made in Ohio just like the US market Civics. Why not put those useful features on US Civics?
  • raybearraybear Member Posts: 1,795
    The nice thing about them is you can use them for a price quote and then take it to your local dealer (or another internet service) to see if they can beat it.
  • gasguzzgasguzz Member Posts: 214
    Sure, replacing with higher performance shocks in the rear will help, it's all relative on how much you want to spend. But before you part with your green, consider the Civic's weight distribution of 60-front/40-rear.
  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    About the rear suspension in the 2001 Civics?

    Funny...I haven't heard any, except here.
  • fitz6fitz6 Member Posts: 3
    I purchased a 2001 lx 5sp. from carsdirect in Feb.
    for 13912. Other than having to travel 30 miles to pick it up it went flawless. Also, if you register with gomez.com before you buy your auto they rebate you 100.00. Takes about 6 was to receive your check. I would not hesitate to use them again in the future. I've purchased 4 new cars and by far this was the most economical with the least amount of BS. One other piece of advice get your financing in order before you buy. I used the internet and went with peoplefirst.com. Again I register with gomez and I received 50.00 for taking this loan out. The salesman that I got the car from told me that he sells about 25 cars a month by way of the internet
  • bordsourcebordsource Member Posts: 95
    I agree with everything said about the rear supension. Has anyone else noticed how the rear end hops when you hit a bump mid corner? It also seems lik the rear rolls more than the front. It's not horrible, but it is noticible, and it is worse than the previous generation. And it's no worse than many of the cars out here, Nissans in particular since they have beam axle rear suspensions.
  • ejonavinejonavin Member Posts: 36
    So what's the solution to rear bounce? stiffer springs? Struts? Bushings?
  • young898young898 Member Posts: 5
    My 3-week-old civic with only 1000 miles on it has a major problem.
    When I make a sharp turn(like parking into a spot), there's a loud clunk sound from near the front-right wheel. It sounds like two metal parts are bumping into each other.
    I brought my car to a Honda dealer and show them the problem. The service people told me that it's a rare problem and they didn't know what caused the problem. Three technicians checked my car for about an hour and then told me I need to rent a car to get back home. They need some time to figure out what's wrong with the car.

    It really hurts to watch them repeatedly turn the wheel on my brand new car just to locate where the sound comes from. They repeat turning the wheel for about 10 minutes without even raising the car.

    Anybody has any similar problem? Thanks for any response.

    Sad-Civic-Owner.
    (Did I put too much trust on the quality of a Honda?)
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