Lincoln LS

scottc8 · August 2001

This is happening after the redesigned regulator is installed? No wonder you guys are steaming. Not to spread suspicions, but could some unscrupulous dealers be replacing the old mechanisms with new "old" mechanisms?

I didn't get any touchup paint from Lincoln, either, just the Waterford crystal. But, when I went to the dealer to buy some, they insisted on not charging me for it.

smwls8 · August 2001

While I can appreciate the attention to detail and the engineering accomplishments of the manufacturers mentioned in the previous post, #4501,the author forgot to mention one important fact. Not ONE of the manufacturers mentioned produce a V-8 rear wheel drive sedan in the price range of the LS. Sure, an LS400(430) is an awesome automobile, for $60K. The majority of the "Quality" issues when one compares US auto's to their foreign competition can be directly traced to their respective parts suppliers, not the manufacturer. Sure, the domestic manufacturer's can do a better job in some area's, but they have made vast improvements. There is no need to denegrate Lincoln for the incredible risk it took with the LS. A 911 was nowhere near the car it is today the first or second year it was produced. I drove a co-worker's 1997 MB E420 today(40,000 miles). Lincoln isn't the only manufacturer with electrical problems. The Mercedes' in-dash computer did not work, the remote functions did not work(lower windows, open sunroof). It had great steering feel and ample power(felt no faster than my LS). Yes, it was a nice car, but was it 20-30K nicer than my 2000 V8 LS? I don't think so.

Now to my main reason for this post. My Lincoln dealer told me today the 2003 Navigator will be totally redesigned. Any rumors, hp ratings etc.? Any news greatly appreciated.

Sam

klarson1 · August 2001

Got an email from Jim Rogers over the weekend... He offered to help with my window problem... He also said that my first fix was probly with the "new and improved regulator"
so obviously to me the new fix didn't fix anything.
So guys just how long do you think this thing will go on before Lincoln realizes that no matter how good the trans,,, the engine,,,, the handling...
I don't want a car with windows that fall down....
by the way I NEVER roll down the rear windows and it failed anyway....the very first time after 5 months of nonuse...
Kevin
Who called the dealer today and found the service writer I was waiting to call me had quit....
Dropped the car off this afternoon and got a sable as a loaner..

riez · August 2001

I want better cars, regardless of where they come from. I'll consider buying a car from any country. Why is it that Detroit partisans always bring up the Europeans when discussing Japanese quality? Think I mentioned Lexus, Infiniti, and Acura as the affordable standards of the world. Wouldn't say the same for MB or BMW. Why is it that a $25,000 Camry can be built as well as a $60,000 LS430? Or a $15,000 Civic as well as a $45,000 RL? Quality pays for itself. It is not related to the cost of the car. It is related to the work processes used. You are equating interior materials (high quality leather in LS430 vs good cloth in Camry) with reliability. Both can be equally reliable and troublefree, regardless of their cost. As for history, I don't care about the past. I don't plan on buying a used car. Or a classic. I want to buy an '02 or '03. Build quality today and tomorrow matters. If you want to go back far enough, compare the engineering and quality progress that Toyota, Nissan, and Honda made from 1960 or 1970 to today compared to where GM, Ford, and Chrysler were and are now? Who progressed more in the past 30 or 40 years? Why does it take Detroit so long and still not quite where Lexus, Infiniti, and Acura were 5 or 10 years ago? Guessing Mr. Crosby might now have all the answers.

ezaircon4jc · August 2001

It sure sounds like a recall to me! As LS1bmw0 said earlier, it's not a matter of if, it's a matter when! Hopefully when is before the warranty runs out!

omega8 · August 2001

Any recommendations for new performance tires for the LS Sport-V8(aggressive driver)?

smwls8 · August 2001

You've made it quite clear in your previous posts that you are interested in cars other than the Lincoln LS, so why would you continue to rant about the state of the American auto industry, and how Detroit is"still not quite where Lexus, Infiniti, and Acura were 5 or 10 years ago?" This thread is for those interested in the LINCOLN LS, a fine AMERICAN made automobile.

Why you chose this thread to shout from your soap box about the sad state of the American automotive industry is beyond those of us here who happen to own an LS, and quite frankly we don't care to know.

The fact that we have made an investment in a Lincoln is proof positive that we have faith in the future of this company and automobile, accepting the LS in spite of the fact that it is not, in your eyes, a "perfect" Japanese car.

By the exchange of information with other Lincoln LS owner's and Lincoln employee's on this site, we collectively strive to improve the quality of ownership and the quality of future versions of this car as a common goal.

"As for history, I don't care about the past." Sir, anyone who would make a statement like that, irrespective of what they drive, is in need of more than all the knowledge the Japanese have amassed.

johnnylinc · August 2001

This window-mechanism deal is distressing to say the least, and mine haven't even failed yet. While it's true that a supplier provided the inadequate/under-engineered/faulty/whatever part, it is the manufacturer that is responsible for the product. The badge doesn't say "Lincoln, with window regulators by Pop's Regulators of Encino", it just says "Lincoln".

Someone at Ford said these regulators were O.K., and Ford SHOULD be busting its collective tail to get the bad parts out and the good parts in. This has been going on for at least eight months now; why the heck are people still having to drive around with taped windows and unsatisfactory dealer support, with no real resolution in sight? Good grief.

The REALLY distressing thing is that, at one time, Ford had someone in charge who really DID understand what Crosby (and Deming and Juran) meant. His name was Donald Petersen; he was Ford President from 1980 to 1985, and Chairman and C.E.O. from '85 until his retirement in 1990. He wrote a fascinating book called "A Better Idea" (published by Houghton Mifflin in 1991) that should be required reading by everyone in the upper strata of Ford's bureaucracy. I sorta doubt that Jac the Knife would take the time, though.

Ultimately, the product is management's responsibility, and Mr. Nasser is at the top of the pile. Do I think he's personally responsible for these failed parts? You bet I do; that's why he gets the big bucks. Quality really IS free--if Nasser doesn't understand that, then maybe Bill Ford needs to hire someone who does. The concept absolutely must start at the top.

I really, really like my LS; it'll be a year old on Saturday. I don't however, like the fact that I'm just marking time until my windows take their apparently inevitable one-way trip to the bottoms of their tracks...

johnnylinc · August 2001

From what I understand, the '03 Navigator will be a revamp of the current platform, but it'll have independent rear suspension and new interior and exterior styling--it won't look as similar to the Expedition as does the current model.

I wouldn't expect any powertrain changes; I'd guess that the 4-cam 5.4 will still be present. The latest info suggests that it'll be on sale this spring.

Here's a link to an interesting Auto News article about Ford's near-term direction regarding product releases--there's a brief mention of the 'gator.

http://www.autonews.com/html/main/stories0827/ford827.htm

lolaj42 · August 2001

will be a BIG issue/item of discussion at the upcoming Wixom Homecoming event in October. Hopefully, Lincoln will have already announced a recall on this failure, otherwise, I can see alot of upset LLSOC club members grilling Ford people on this. Forget about the new 02MY airbox, we'll be clamoring for rear window regulators that work! (Though, I'm a fortunate one that hasn't yet had a problem . . . knock wud)

riez · August 2001

smwls8... I just like cars. Couldn't care less if from Japan, Europe, Korea, Australia, or AMERICA. Isn't the LS supposed to be competitive with the best of the rest of the world? Isn't it sister to the British Jaguar S-type? I'm trying to learn more about it, like I am with the CTS, G35, IS300, Passat, Marauder, etc. Since I don't know what I will end up buying in the near future, not sure you can either. You guys keep talking about the secret changes for '03. That interests me. But so do failing window regulators. As for a sense of history, let us keep our subject in perspective. We are talking about cars and build quality, not world history. Don't think you'd want me to hold the Pinto against Ford today? The Edsel? The Vega against Chevy? Cimarron against Cadillac? If automotive history and heritage are key, shouldn't we all be clamoring to drive Packards? Stutz? Your comments reminded me of the nice teenager, baron, on the CTS site. He reminds everyone that in ought nine or thereabouts Cadillac was proclaimed by some muckymuck in Europe something like the Standard of the World and that that is as relevant to buying a car today as it was 90 years ago. I disagree, but I don't attack him for his enthusiasm.

sniemietz · August 2001

For those of you holding out hope that the new level of regulators will solve the problem..don't bet the farm. I have been through 2 of the new level parts on the same window... Are there plans for a new new level part? Maybe an old fashioned crank?

fantom · August 2001

I remember riez telling us he wanted to pay no more than $30K for a performance sedan in the next year or so. Seems he is in the wrong discussion since he can't afford an LS anyway. Maybe he should stick to the Camry and Acura boards. For the price, they are very good products.

However, they have problems also, and when they do GOOD LUCK with the dealerships. You will not find the kind of open, honest dialog from those supposed high quality Japanese products that you are seeing here from Lincoln. Many import products sound better than they are because they don't fess up to their production errors. You will be on your own. They will of course serve you coffee in their fancy waiting area while giving you a $100 oil change and "fluid level check". And when they wash your car for free they will take no responsibility for the inevitable scratches you will get...also for free.

I suspect riez is putting excess weight on the infamous Consumer Reports foreign car bias, so he should stick with Camry or Acura. IMHO the folks on this board, based on actual experience, don't buy his line. Give me the give and take of good old American honesty to the myth of any current Japanese quality superiority, which died long before Philip Crosby did.

eor2 · August 2001

Sorry to hear that this seems to becoming a bigger problem for some of you folks. So far, no problems (6K). I am concerned about the quality problem and find it somewhat surprising. My LS is the third Ford product in 12 years. I had a 90 Ford Ranger PU, that had virtually no problems. Kept it for 95k miles. Sold it in '98 and bought an F150, that now has 52K miles. Absolutely no problems of any sort on it. Thus I conclude that FMCO can build quality stuff. Either that or I am extreamly lucky. Which I doubt, as I once bought a Vega with aluminum block and steel pistons, that any fool could have seen wouldn't work. Also bought one of the early Oldsmobiles with a diesel, which spent more time in the shop than out the last 6 months I owned it. So much for whining, I love the LS.

garnes · August 2001

smwls8 - I'll second your response to riez. I don't understand why some people have this compulsion to trash American cars with goofy assertions about quality not being up to older Japanese cars. Go visit a Lexus board and check out the discussions about all the little gremlins bothering them. But after paying such a large sum for their cars, such problems are dismissed - you'd have to in order to avoid a nervous break down. The Lincoln LS is a fine luxury car. Reading the many posts on this board have really got me interested in the car in addition to its good looks. In addition, many posting on this board have got to be the most informed/studied car owners around, and they love this American car.

For sake of argument, even if you assume the import is always more trouble free, the large additional cost makes it difficult to see these cars as the best overall value. Value is one aspect not discussed as much. The LS is a lot of car for the money - that should be self evident. Put many of the imports up against an equally priced American car and there is no contest in my book.

Example - put a Camry (really a Malibu sized car)up against an Impala. The Camry is even more expensive than the Impala. Heck, the Impala is larger, heavier, safer, more powerful, and STILL gets better mileage than the Camry V6. I guess that Japanese engineering is just years behind lowly American Chevy.

And please spare me the resale value stuff - the additional import cost, if saved and invested over 5 or 7 years comes to a tidy sum. The resale HAS to be better just to break even.

People have to be more objective.

(I'm sorry for all the GM stuff, but just making a general point)

karzz · August 2001

The JD Power Sales Satisfaction survey for 2001 was released on August 8th. Lincoln showed solid gains from last year. Lincoln beat Mercedes, BMW, Porsche, Saab, Audi, etc. Lincoln was rated at #6 right behind Jaguar and Infiniti. Of the other brands I listed, only Mercedes made it into the top ten.

Ford had the most brands (4) in the top 10. Mercury and Ford divisions had strong showings, above the industry average.

ezaircon4jc · August 2001

Check out the '02 pricing. Over on the Camry board, Japanese car fan "mind numbed robots" actually believe $30k for a loaded Camry is reasonable! And to think my LS with way more features was only $31k! I don't care what the resale is (which is pathetic on ANY car), there are much better FWD appliance's available for the same money!

stanny1 · August 2001

The Camry is a Japanese designed Buick. It is riding on it's past reputation. What a soul less appliance. Absolutely an appliance for zombies. It does everything well but at about a .7 level. An average car for average Americans who want to drive and stay "average", now at an above average price.

ezaircon4jc · August 2001

Now they've got a salesman touting what a great price $30k is for a Camry. Oh yea, horsepower isn't what it's cracked up to be! I thought selling wasn't allowed on Edmunds?

desertguy · August 2001

I think Lincoln dealers are at an distinct disadvantage in these surveys. Mercedes dealers generally just sell Mercedes. BMW dealers just BMWs etc. Many Lincoln dealers are also Ford/Merc dealers as well. Both dealers in my area are FLM dealers. When 80% or more of your sales are Fords, your customer base is just not the same and the dealership will be slanted toward this customer base. (Many of these sales are to entry level/first time buyers as well)

carjim · August 2001

You owners will have to verify the hazard that Blue Oval News says is caused by the battery in the trunk being unprotected. The article is referring to T-Birds' batteries shorting out and includes the statement that the LS is set up in the trunk the same way...

Read the report, consider the source and let us know if you think there is a danger. Thanks.

ezaircon4jc · August 2001

Unprotected from what? It is way more protected from the things that kill batteries (heat) in the trunk than out in the open, under the hood, exposed to the elements. My battery still looks new after a year and 24k miles.

lolaj42 · August 2001

I believe I have heard (read) about battery shorts in the LS (as posted on this site). However, I do not recall more than one or two incidents. Further, the folks that did report problems on this site later stated that they had them successfully corrected fairly quickly by their dealers. As it has been several months since these incidents were reported, I wouldn't consider the battery location in the trunk to be a major area of concern. To the contrary, as ezaircon4jc states, the battery is better protected in the trunk than under the hood.

ls1bmw0 · August 2001

From the article it sounded like the problem was because something got laid across the two terminals. What is interesting is that the positive terminal has a shield so the item had to have moved the shield aside for it to arc.

I don't agree with BON's assertion about it not being protected. There a cover that goes over the entire spare wheel area where the battery is located. Under normal conditions, there is no way that the battery would have contact.

ezaircon4jc · August 2001

like me you use that area for extra storage

smwls8 · August 2001

The LS has been the first luxury brand I have purchased new, and overall the dealer treatment has been excellent. I have read posts here reporting poor service/treatment by some L/M dealers, and I hope that is the exception, not the rule. The past 12 months with my 2000 I have had excellent treatment, including free loaner's when dropped off for just an oil change and tire rotation. While Lexus and Infiniti enjoy a reputation of good customer service, not all luxury manufacturers have an official loaner policy, instead putting it off on their dealers(Audi, for one).

When the subject of resale value comes to the forefront, I am reminded of a post by Bill(BrentwoodVolvo), where he told about a super straight and clean Lexus LS400 came in on trade. The problem? Because of high mileage(I believe 80K+) and several model years old, the once 50K+ automobile could only qualify for a mid to high teen loan(Bill, forgive me if I don't remember this to the tee). The point here is this. Almost every car, once it has 100K+ on the odometer and is 60 months old(most financing) is not worth very much. Even if it was manufactured by a Japanese Company(probably in America).

I bought my LS to drive and enjoy now....what it is worth 5 or 6 years from now with 100-150K on the clock is of no importance. I may not even be alive then, so should I waste one second of my life worrying about what the percentage of original value will be 5 or 6 years from now...or on the contrary enjoy the grin I get as my dohc V8 is revving through the gears to 6,000+rpm's.....

My take home work car is a fine Japanese machine, a 2001 Nissan Maxima. It is a well constructed auto with plenty of power and a solid structure. But when I slip behind the wheel of my LS on the weekend and steer through the first corner I come to....I am reminded why race cars and other brands have stayed with the "outdated" rear wheel drive platform, and why I am proud to be able to support an American manufacturer with my driving dollars.

m87 · August 2001

Reuters is running a item today quoting Ford spokesman Ed Lewis that the Wixom plant, shut down on August 15th, will be down at least through Wednesday August 29th, and a decision to restart production was being made day to day.

riez · August 2001

Got my copy of the Motor Trend New Car issue. In their preview of the Cadillac CTS (they estimate 5-speed manual will go 0-60 mph in 7.1 seconds, but pan the rear seat room and engine output and love the chassis; speculate there will be a "super CTS" in 12-18 months) they mention "the uprated V-6s coming from Jag and Lincoln for '03." No further details. They show the '02 V-6 with 210 hp. Is that accurate? Glad to see the secret info is now coming out publicly. Too bad so little changes in the '02 LS. Compare that to all the changes in the IS300. And the G35 info. Lincoln needs to move faster with product changes. (fantom... I don't want to have to borrow more than $30,000 on top of trade in, credit card rebate, and cash. New '01 LS V-6s are discounted up to $4,000 off sticker. Guessing '02s similar. That puts one solidly within my range. Hope price increase in '03 isn't too much. Then I wouldn't want to overborrow.)

ls1bmw0 · August 2001

riez please don't take this seriously, but there is a reason secret information is secret

Why show your hand if you're holding aces.

I've seen the 03 LS and it is worth waiting for especially if it meets your time frame. While the CTS numbers are all estimates, I've seen what the 03 LS has in store and it will be extremely competitive in both the V-6 and V-8 models. Frankly, I don't think the CTS can hold a candle to it.

I suppose I could be like BON and spew competitive advantage secrets just to get website hits but I made Lincoln a promise and LLSOC or this Edmunds board isn't that kind of a site.

Brian

klarson1 · August 2001

Picked the car up today from the dealer...but of course I then had to spend the next
2 hours trying to get the duct tape residue off the door and window.. what a job...basically the only thing you can do is rub it off...tried alcohol,mineral spirits, cleaner wax,etc... finally just rubbed it off with a dry towel... what a chore... next time the window fails , which it will,
I'm just gonna rip the door panel off, drill a hole and pin the darn thing up.. permanently..

By the way... anyone else had a problem with the rear chrome piece that goes around the license plate? I'm talking about the piece that extends up the trunck lid with the Lincoln emblem.
It has separated from the trunk lid and is sticking out...about 1/8 an inch.... not a big deal, just something for the local hoodlams to notice and decide to rip the whole piece off.

geesh I gotta get a new atitude....uhmmm maybe I'll buy myself a power boat....nobody every has a problem with them.. :-) I hate having to turn my head sideways everytime I see one of these....just to get the full effect...

Kevin
who by the way... for some strange reason... still loves his LS !!

Oh... almost forgot.... Jim Rogers... if you see this, obviously the window has been fixed.. THANKS anyway...
Maybe you can convince the people, who can make a difference, to address this issue once and for all, Please.....Please....

ronniepooh · August 2001

I agree 100% with your rear wheel drive preference. I must say, personally, I dont know if I could ever go back to a FWD platform, no matter whats under the hood. Some may consider the following trivial, but its not to me. Let me know if you can relate:
You are in the left lane when suddenly, traffic in front of you backs up and stops because some yahoo decides at the last minute to make a left turn, but traffic is heavy on the other side, so you have to wait. You have enough room to go around the car in front of you and get in the next to the left lane, but traffic is zipping by at about 40mph +. You spot an opening, turn your wheel hard right, jam your foot down on the gas, hit that next lane, then whip the wheel back again straight. Try this in the LS. Point and shoot suspension/drivetrain. You execute the move flawlesly, no effort. No body lean. No acceleration squat. Beautiful.

Now try it in a torque steering FWD car. You'll be lucky if you dont torque-steer shoot yourself across 3 lanes of traffic, or worse, across the 3 lanes, then back across the 3 lanes again. AARRGHH!! I hate FWD!

scottc8 · August 2001

The only other car I've owned that had it was a 1960 Austin-Healey 3000. Believe me, if there were any electrical hazards related to the battery being in the trunk, they would have shown up in that car. Lucas, Prince of Darkness, was my co-pilot.

packv12 · August 2001

The return of the Magazine Prophets?

I cannot believe some of the posts talking about Ford's emminante demise. Their "cash crunch" make me wonder, where are these figures coming from?

Stock is market capitalization, where is the mention of the bonds they floated before all of this? I'm not supposing that they have hoards of cash on hand, but I think that you are seriously over estimating there position! If the stock is so all important, are you figuring for the split? Has consideration been paid to the two spin-offs, Associated Finance (AFS) or of Visteon (VC)? Of course AFS won't show up, since they have been purchased by Citigroup (C). This has added to the value enhancement of stock ownership, unless you are a speculator.

That LSD has raised it's ugly head again, what would Timothy Leary say? My shop teacher summed it up well a million years ago, "It's great for morons who want to leave two rubber strips up the road". I don't say that it isn't nice, but check out Ford's history. Since 1995 (possibly before), if you ordered Traction Control on any model, you could not order LSD. Something about it being not needed, along with causing axle wind-up, as the diff attempts to equalize power to a braked wheel! Wears out the clutches quickly, although I think that a Torsen diff would do.

To the undecided GM shopper on the board, what's up? You pointed out the Crown Vic's accel times, if that's what is important, buy one! You are not undecided, but merely an annoyance. If you report to be interested in you vehicle mixes you've mentioned, why worry about a Crown Vic?

Regarding your concerns about recalls, outside of the California mandated ignition module recall, I can't think of any. There is a huge difference between a stop shipment order and a recall! I never see any mention of GM's recall of their new Envoy (et. all) because of lower control arms. Supplier problems! Ford doesn't suffer the same dilemma? Let's see, we want a more competitive company, so it should be less vertical. How do we control overall quality if we are not vertical?

I fear that some folks are living in the past. Ford ain't going broke anytime soon and their actual financial picture looks better than GM's at present. Gee, didn't GM almost become insolvent in the 1990's? Have they turned everything around that quickly, or has the press bought into it?

As to the lease question, especially since it expires in MY 2003, what will be will be. I don't see any loud and course Jatco 5-speed in the LS, but I could be wrong. You can buy your car at lease end and show me that I'm wrong, that the Jatco is superior to the Gertrag in long range operation.

There are people on this board who propose to tell the engineers what to do, with out knowing all the insights they have. I've seen senseless arguments about the first gear ratio of the automatic, without knowledge of what other gear ratios would be involved.

I, for one, am pleased with my LS. It handles and rides better than any American car yet produced. I'll leave it to the engineers to decide the parameters, and if I don't like them, I'll shop elsewhere! Before I signed the contract when I bought, I knew what was included on the car, so I have no reason to whine! Any modifications that I make are up to me, but I will not chastise any person in purchasing, production, and/or engineering for the vehicle, because I truly like my LS.

*** This post was originally deleted because I did't follow the Terms of Agreement which are clearly stated within this site. I am sorry for any offence that I may have caused to any members and regular posters to this board. I would encourage that we, as members, review our membership agreement and live within the guidelines. I will, in the future, attempt to more closely adhere to these guidelines. ***

stanny1 · August 2001

Jatco, who makes a lot of auto trannys for Nissan, has never experimented with a Manual tranny to my knowledge. Packv12 - have you heard of a Jatco manual?

riez · August 2001

Wife and I were looking over the new car info. Both quite impressed, on paper at least for now, with the G35. RWD, near 50/50 balance, 280 hp, 6-speed manual, 112 inch wheelbase, and more. And all for around $30,000. Includes Infiniti's well earned reputation for quality, dealer service, and their excellent warranty (superior to Cadillac & Lincoln). Starting to sound like an offer too good to refuse. Is the '03 LS V-6 going to be offering that kind of power? Or the 6-speed manual? Some times things are kept secret if one is behind and one's secret won't leap one ahead. Looks like the '02 CTS and '03 LS V-6 might be in that category compared to the '03 G35? (packv12... I'm also interested in the '03 Mercury Marauder. That is why I mentioned the interesting performance attributed to the Crown Vic. Mr Cupka at the Marauder site here says the Marauder should go 0-60 mph in 6.5 seconds and that a Crown Vic ordinarily won't go 7.0. Apologizing for offending people and then calling me "an annoyance" seems contradictory.)

stanny1 · August 2001

May not be introduced with the 6 speed manual. It may available later as was the case with the IS300 five speed manual edition.

lolaj42 · August 2001

Beware, the HP numbers may not turn out to be true. Witness the Q45 claim (no magazine has yet to duplicate the performance Nissan/Infiniti claims). Also, Nissan had to recently re-state their published engine performance specs for the G35 and Altima models (which use the same engine) because no independent firm could substantiate them. The whole ploy with the stating that the G35 could make 260 HP was to equal what Acura states for their TL-Type S. As I don't subscribe to the car rags, I wouldn't know where you get your quoted spec for 280 HP, but from what I've seen in other press reports (non car rags), Nissan has had to do alot of backtracking on their initial performance claims.

alphanstein · August 2001

What happened to the August posting? Weren't they supposed to have the car on a two year lease, which would mean they should have data up until Nov 2001? Is there something awry at Edmunds?

akirby · August 2001

Just out of curiousity, do you like Ginny Cream Ale and Hyundais?

johnnylinc · August 2001

If I remember correctly, they post the monthly update at the end of the month--I'd expect to see the August report within the next few days.

Riez re: G35.
This sounds like it has the potential to be a very nice car, but I would surmise that it'll have noticeably less passenger space than the LS. Sounds more like a 3-series BMW, size-wise, and the 3 has significantly less room than the Lincoln. I'd also bet that Infiniti dealers will be demanding near or above MSRP for the car, too, so the drive-out price comparison will be an important factor given comparable equipment.

As always, it comes down to a personal choice by the individual who signs the check. After one year, 14k miles, excellent dealer support & service, and no problems, I really, really like my LS.

riez · August 2001

Since I can't afford a Q45, I don't worry about its problems. Isn't its output issue similar to what Ford had with the Cobra? The reviews of the 240 hp Altima seem quite impressive. I don't see why Nissan can't get 280 hp (figure from Motor Trend) out of a good DOHC 3.5L V-6. They claim to get 300 hp from it for their new 350Z coupe. Doesn't BMW get about 330 hp for their 3.2L M3?

I, too, initially thought G35 might be smallish on inside. That is something I'll be looking for when I first get to sit in one. Car & Driver's preview discussed how its 112 inch wheelbase is one of the biggest in its class and that it will have ample headroom and legroom front and back. The LS reviews I've read have not made the LS's back seat seem cavernous. Motor Trend pans the CTS' rear seat room. C class and 5 Series aren't known for their roominess, either. So I'm guessing the G35 will be more than competitive on interior room. (akirby... I prefer red wine. For heck of it, wife and I may test drive the new XG350 also. Bland but inexpensive and loaded with equipment. As I've said before, I'm willing to consider any decent car from any country that I can afford. Our problem is she wants luxury and I want performance. Have to find the right mix. Infiniti G35, Lexus IS300, VW Passat AWD, CTS, and LS V-6 are at the top of my current list. Hyundai isn't.)

ls1bmw0 · August 2001

Just want to show that the LS isn't the only car that has problems. Our other "car" is a 1997 Chevy Suburban 1500 with 40,000 miles. This is my wife's daily driver so it doesn't get driven that much and lives a pretty low-stress, pampered life.

So far we've had to replace both sets of brakes twice, replaced the rear axle seals, replace the battery, get the leather driver's seat stitiching fixed, replace the power steering adjustable effort sensor and just yesterday had to replace the alternator.

Since it's a truck I had higher expectation levels about the durability of these parts. I guess you can get bad quality no matter what you get. Seems like it still is a little bit of luck-of-the-draw since I know other Burb owners that don't have any problems. Sounds similar to us LS owners.

P.S. The "Big Green Monster" cost us more than the LS.

Brian

keyrow · August 2001

As you may have surmised already, most of the posters on this site are total fanatics about their LS as am I. All of us DID consider the competition and chose the LS when we voted with our wallets. We are totally convinced that the LS is the best VALUE in a performance oriented sedan. I initially wanted an M5 but the household master wouldn't go for it, insisting upon getting her own Lexus (she later decided the jade green Infiniti I30 was pretty so she bought it instead). I had to "settle" for the LS and am surprisingly happy with it. Yes, it is not in the same league with an M5 but for half the price I don't think it can be bested. As to what the competition is in '03 is not a factor to me as I will not be looking for a replacement before '05, if then as I usually keep a vehicle until its death. I also will not presently consider a FWD vehicle, and if I decide my left foot is no longer functional and I need a slushbox then the Jag XKR will be my next vehicle. What I am trying to say is that you shouldn't expect too much sympathy from us when promoting other vehicles since we have already looked at them and found them lacking in either interior room, handling or "style" and we do not understand why you have not reached the same conclusion, but to each his own. Afterall, you will be writing the check and I wish you as much happiness with whatever car you choose as I have with my manual LS.

As a side note I am a part time detailer, seriously considering making it full time, and will be happy to answer any questions any of you may have on the care of your LS.

Jim

thomas_l · August 2001

klarson1: The front and rear logos on my 00 LS (8/99 production) did that a month or so after I got mine. The front one wasn't bad and just needed to be seated really good. I tried to re-attach the one on the bad with weatherstrip glue and it didn't work right. It stuck OK, but some of the chrome in the logo and the black backing came off with the original adhesive and it looked almost as bad as not having one there. Dealer #3 that I have been working with replaced the license surround under warranty.

thomas_l · August 2001

My 87 Fiero GT has the battery in the rear with the rest of the drive train. It gets baked as it is mounted high close to the right hand vent where engine/trans heat escape. I have had no problems with it. Other Fiero owners have relocated theirs to the front in place of the spare. Maybe a little cooler and drier up there but still behind the radiator. Supposedly a marginal gain in weight balance too. With my luck I would have a flat tire out in west hell the very day I moved my battery :-D

airwolf1000 · August 2001

A friend of mine informed me that he saw an LS on the Road (A straight road) No apparent sign of a crash, had lost its rear axle. He said it looked like the axle released from the chassis and went back up in to the wheel well. I did not see it but he said it was and LS Just like mine.

What could have caused this?

Did he overpower it, tried to do the rev and drop routine (Which I think the 3K RPM limiter would prevent)?

To take a line frome SNL "Talk amongs yourselves".

Regards,

Airwolf

thomas_l · August 2001

Maybe his rear window fell so hard it knocked the halfshaft out of the hub?

ls1bmw0 · August 2001

Or him and his buddies got really drunk one night and decided that they would tie the car to a tree by the axle to keep it from getting stolen at the bar, then forgot about it when they went to drive home

thomas_l: ROFLMAO

gregwo · August 2001

I have the V6 non-sport but if it helps any, I just put a set of Yokohama AVS db on. Super quite, well balanced, little stiffer ride, but worth the trade off...I hit a suggested 30mph chicane at 90mph on my way to work this morning...yeooo I think I need to clean my pants........

airwolf1000 · August 2001

Seriously guys, any clues. Besides forgetting while you were drunk that the rear windows were not to be rolled down because they cause a an inevitable reaction that drops the rear window and the halfshaft tubes in one fell swoop.

O.K. and also Bri do you have something going on with Thomas_L or can we all be in on the ROFLMAO secret. Don't want to go throught the ITH deal like someone had to previously. Oh wait it just hit me, the ROFLMAO is part of the 03 LS and you could tell us but then you would have to take us out.

Back to the Axle... Enquiring minds wanna know what happened to this poor LS Baby. Maybe its a mileage thing like all of a sudden all the Window Regulators going out.

Airwolf

Lincoln LS

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