Mazda Protegé

hkchan · February 2001

According to Edmunds and others, the invoice on a '01 ES is $14,525, which is $363 more than a '00. But you don't pay $84 (invoice) for the NLEV Emissions on the '01 any more, so the difference is now $279.

I assume the '01 LX you drove was a 2.0. A lot more powerful than a '00 ES? I thought it would be marginal since the '01 weighs ~100lbs. more. And a lot noisier?

chikoo · February 2001

vocus likes doing things which he can look back upon and kick himself in his butt!!

vocus...keep a cool mind.

mazda is not closing shop...

hkchan · February 2001

Show us a link for the comparison.

gamejunki · February 2001

I checked out Kiplinger's Site (http://www.kiplinger.com/php/cars/2001/) and their information is wrong. It says this is information for 2001 Protege but the information is for 2000 with 122 HP and 1.8 Liter engine in the ES model. I also looked up the 2001 Honda Accord DX/LX/EX like you stated and came up with a price of $1878/$1977/$2025 for maintenance costs. Also, the Accord and Protege are not competitors. A fully loaded Protege ES would cost around $18,000 while the fully loaded Accord will cost you around $23,000 to $24,000.

hkchan · February 2001

It doesn't matter they're not competitors. Common sense (doesn't always work) tells us that the Accord should cost more (or at least the same if the Accord is more reliable) than the Protege on expected repairs and maintenance over five years. The "estimates" are provided by IntelliChoice. Some sample numbers.

Protege ES: $3,107
Civic EX: $2,241
Corolla CE: $2,977
Sentra: no information
Focus: no information
Neon: no information

Accord EX: $2,025
Camry LE: $4,284
Altima GXE: $2,482

vocus · February 2001

I went to CarsDirect.com and comparably equipped the cars. Here's what it gave me:

2001 ES 2.0 w/Premium Pkg., cassette, auto.:
$17,141 invoice

2000 ES w/Premium Pkg., fog lights (std.01), rear spoiler (std.01), NLEV (std.01), cassette.:
$17,357 invoice

That's what I came up with. Since I am on the S-plan pricing and get it 1.5% (is this right?) below invoice, it would be about the same for both except for the rebates, which are $1500 vs. $750. See what I mean???

nikecar · February 2001

edit (not relevant after vocus' post)..............

hmmm seems you are right.. the main thing is what's cheaper when you get to the dealer? The deciding factor is whether or not you can afford extra payment of the 01. You were negative with the Cavalier when you got the DX, so I'd assume you still shall be more under with either of these cars.

Go with what you can afford. if you can do the 01, get it. but regardless...

GET A PROTEGE ES!!!! whether its a 00 or 01, you can't go wrong over a base LX model.

hkchan · February 2001

Ok. You want to add as much as possible to the '00 to make it more "comparable" to the '01. Make sure you really want the stuff. Also, the cassette player costs less in the '01 ($120 vs. $213). Hate to say it, but do you really want to load it up? Again, can you explain your opinion that the '01 LX 2.0 (that's the one you drove, right?) was a lot more powerful and a lot noisier than the '00 ES?

vocus · February 2001

I drove the 2001 LX 2.0 model, yes. The engine seemed to take off immediately when touching the gas. It seemed a lot quicker from start-up than the 1.8 in the 2000 ES I am driving today. But also, I can not hardly hear the engine in the ES I have today either. It was quite audible in that LX 2.0 if I remember correctly.

And yes, I want both cars loaded up to the max. The 2000 ES I have today is not loaded (no Premium Pkg. or spoiler), but the one coming in on the truck is (Premium & auto.) from what the dealer said. We shall see.

I am going to get the car that has the best deal, since I do have some negative equity to hide.

magilla · February 2001

I've been searching for info on the S-Plan. The dealer led me to believe yesterday that the car is "heavily" discounted under the S-Plan. If what I'm reading is correct, then maybe I'm living in a different universe than you all are. 1.5% of $14,525 is only $218! That's it! I thought it was some dramatic discount, like $1,000 under invoice. This is crap.

Locally, the dealer was advertising all their '01 ES models for $12,999, which included the $750 rebate, a loyalty discount ($700 off if you're trading in a Mazda), and the college grad discount. Let's see, I don't qualify for the loyalty or college grad discount (I'm older than their requirement of 2 yrs), but the deal would still come to $14,099 which is under the S-Plan of $14,307 (net). No thanks.

What does make sense, though is to let them keep the $750 rebate and finance as much as possible at 0.0% for 48 months. I can invest the down payment amount that I would've normally given them in a 6.0% savings account at ING Direct and make money off the deal.

I really thought the S-Plan deal would have been better than that. Anyone want to share the real numbers through this plan?

hkchan · February 2001

What? The $14,307 (S-Plan) is before the $750 rebate. The $14,099 (your local dealer) is after the $750 rebate. You can still get the $750 rebate (or 0% financing) if you buy the car under the S-Plan. Same thing with the $400 college graduate rebate.

The $700 "loyalty" discount for trading in a Mazda doesn't mean much (unless there's more to it than just a promise). $700 added to an unknown amount (your trade) is still unknown. It'll work if you own a Mazda that's worth less than $700.

vocus · February 2001

I joined the EAA just to get the S Plan (oh please, who didn't?).

I want to know the real deal with the S-Plan. Just how much can I save (%) on a 2000 and/or 2001 Protege ES???

hkchan · February 2001

What's the problem? Take the invoice (minus the freight). Take 1.5% off. Add the freight back. That's the price. Take the $400 college graduate rebate if you qualify. Take the $750 (or $1,500 on a '00) rebate if that's what you want. That's it, except tax is added before the rebate(s). At least in Maryland.

hkchan · February 2001

"...my payment on the 2001 should be about $10 more a month than on the 1999 STRIPPED DX I am driving now!"
Does that number come from taking the 0% financing instead of the rebate? And because you're trading in two cars? And your trade-in on the '99 DX was upside-down? Excuse me if it seems like I'm trying the dampen people's enthusiasm for getting a new car.

nikecar · February 2001

just as HKchan said.. make sure you get what you want..

I know you are spending 213 for a cassette, but why don't you pass on that, and get an after market set. Kenwood makes a component system that is a CDplayer that you can hook up another CDplayer or an EQ or a Cassette I believe. Its in the latest Crutchfield issue.

but the payment you are saying $10 more, does that include the negative equity the DX will add? If you didn't have the Cavalier equity I'm sure you'd be paying less than a $10 difference.

no real relevance......We have some friends they had a sportage. due to their fault, they had to trade it in and they got a Rodeo. A STRIPPED Rodeo, and because of the massive negative equity, for the rpice they ended up getting that car (about $28K) we could have bought 2 PRoteges.

vocus · February 2001

I used to be a high-mileage driver (30K a year or so) and that lowers the value. Also, the car was bought with negative equity financed into the balance. Both of those things combined means I am like $4000 negative on the DX, but have another trade-in to offset that. That includes everything. Taxes, tags, and all of it.

Chan: I don't qualify for the 0% financing anyway, so it's not an issue.

hkchan · February 2001

Hehe. You're not the first one (and won't be the last) to say I'm nosey, kidding or not.
Which dealer does the '00 ES you're driving come from? I thought sfrat said Heritage had '01 ES's in stock? Have you seen any '01's with the ABS/SAB package? Yes I'm nosey and lazy.

vocus · February 2001

I haven't been to Heritage yet, but am going to check tonight. The 2000 ES I am driving right now comes from Schafer & Strominger Mazda in Towson. I have not even seen a 2001 ES yet, only the LX. And the one I saw didn't have it.

nikecar · February 2001

Good luck tonight.. hopefully you will be driving a new ES (regardless of year)... then you can REALLY be zoom zoom zooming.. instead of just Zooming in the DX.

magilla · February 2001

Chan, yes I goofed re: the $750. It is a little better deal. However, I anticipated that the S-Plan would be something REALLY great like $500-$1000 off of invoice. Alas, not so. The folks at EAA (who were quick to point out that I probably had NO interest in aviation) mentioned that the plan is 4% above the cost to Ford employees. The bottom line is that it's a good deal - Give $40 and get $237+.

FYI: There are loads of '01 ES' in the Phoenix area. I've driven the 5-sp and the auto. Don't even bother with the automatic. What a waste! The stick completely rocks. ABS/SAB package and moonroof. The only thing I haven't seen here is any darker colored ones. All I have seen is white, silver, gold, and the color in between silver and gold. Great little vehicle.
Was about to buy a '01 Civic EX, but this one is far superior. Even feels more substantial. Much more value and fun than the Civic.

maltb · February 2001

"Was about to buy a '01 Civic EX, but this one is far superior. Even feels more substantial. Much more value and fun than the Civic."

The magazines have been saying this for the last three years, but it appears that the magazine target audience is either deaf or the wrong demography

An interesting Article in yesterdays Automotive News comments on Honda's lack of recognizing the the new generation of hot rodders that were snatching up Civics. Now they have all but alienated those people with the 2001.

To that I say, "Zoom-Zoom"

hkchan · February 2001

magilla, I would argue that it's "give $40 get more than $237 (I assume it's 1.5%)". It's $237 below invoice. It would be hard, but I guess not impossible, to negotiate a price equal to invoice on your own on a '01 right now. That's not counting the time wasted negotiating with the dealer(s), but some people actually like the experience.

mpgman · February 2001

It's down to a 01 Pro ES or a 01 Golf GLS. Golf has great seats that also have super height adjust for driver and passenger. Golf also has standard 4 wheel disc/ABS/side air bags/4 head curtain air bags/full size spare/100,000 mile on powertrain. Drove a 2.0 ES and thought it was great. So...what should I pay for either an auto or 5 speed ES with ABS and SAB and cassette, but no hole in the roof? And how does one become eligible for the S plan and who do I contact? Tx.

vocus · February 2001

Went tonight to Schafer & Strominger Mazda/Dodge (what a combo, eh?) and signed the papers for my black mica 2001 PROTEGE ES 2.0!! I pick it up tomorrow night. It was the only ES in the place with the Premium Pkg. It's loaded with every option, and I got the S-Plan pricing too. Boy, was the sales manager mad because he had to let it go at that price!

HAHAHA

Mine just came in on the truck TODAY!

What luck, huh? I cannot wait until this weekend so I can do some serious ZOOM ZOOMing!!!

theparallax · February 2001

Congrats Paul! Just be sure to take it easy while breaking it in!!

hboyd · February 2001

Driving the 2001 ES for the 2nd day in a row now... Nowhere do I stop, that I always gaze at our new "machine" with a wide smile!!! The ride takes some time for your body to get acclimated; it is STIFFER than a '95 ES, but not uncomfortable. Good sized bumps/holes do create a small jerk to the driver, but road feel is extremely good!! The car really takes off from a standstill (auto)... shifting at about 3100 RPM... and the engine tells ya it's moving the Protege -- like it should! No buzziness sounds like in the Honda. I do not miss my 5-speed; the new automatic mated to the 2.0L provides ample thrust to this car. [I came from the mentality that it was a mistake to buy an automatic with a 4-cylinder... but I was wrong!!!!] --- ZOOOOMMM ZOOOMMMMMMM

MARTIN

PS... Does anybody want to give my old 1995 a new home???

MARTIN

vocus · February 2001

Thanks alot. I am going to take it easy breaking it in. No revving over 4000, constant speed driving, no cruise control, hard stopping, or all in 1000 miles. It's going to be hard, but I am going to do it.

protegextwo · February 2001

I am EXTREMELY happy for you my friend. Life is short and I know things have been tough for you lately. Nonetheless, you now have a very nice toy. Enjoy your new car and have some fun.

Your friend;
Larry

speedypt · February 2001

Way to go studman! I am OFFICIALLY jealous! Please post pics when you get a chance!

Regards and congrats,

Pete

brandongray · February 2001

Don't see Classic Red in the color options for 2001. Whatsup with that? That was arguably the best color. Why didn't they drop one of the two tans instead? Millenium Red is too dark and Corolla-like.

Come on y'all. Show the love for the Classic Red!

orinocoflow · February 2001

Way to go! Congrats on your new Pro. You deserve a good smile (or hundreds) when getting into that new ES for some serious zooming. Good luck.

Gene

theparallax · February 2001

I don't like the color selection either. The red is gone, and so is the blue. Actually, there is NO blue in the color selection!

I would like to see classic red and midnight blue mica back, and introduce some colors like what VW has. I think they have a pretty nice color selection on their cars.

vocus · February 2001

Well, I have to pick up the car tonight. It's suppose to snow 4-6 inches tonight. I love it. Go out and get a new car, and even Mother Nature is shocked.

I saw the car through the window of the service bay (getting PDI'd) and wanted it so bad last night!

I can not WAIT until either this weekend, or until the roads clear up and I can get out and do some ZOOM ZOOMing!!!

nikecar · February 2001

congrats...

so how much you paying a month now, and what they give you on the DX?

vocus · February 2001

My car payment went up like $50 a month, and they only wanted to give me $7000 for my DX, but they upped it to $8000 when I threatened to walk out the door. The ES 2.0 is going to be kept for a long time. Otherwise, I wouldn't have bought another Protege because their resale value sucks.

hkchan · February 2001

Congratulations. So where did the "$10 more a month" come from? And are you sure you can't get the 0% financing? If so, what's the interest rate?

unmarkedcar · February 2001

Has anyone noticed that the engine will rev up and down by itself. I have a 2001 LX 2.0 that will do this. I have also noticed it on my 2000 celica. It will do it more on a cold day.

speedypt · February 2001

Mine doesn't do that, but then again, I live in Phoenix (for two more days). I'll let you know if mine does this when I get to Chicago.

Regards,

Pete

unmarkedcar · February 2001

sfrat · February 2001

Sounds like you lucked out finding the 01 ES. The black is a pretty color. Good luck during the break in period, its so tough keeping the rev's down, because the car just wants to go, and you can feel the power. Can't wait till I'm over 600 miles. I would recommend you consider waiting until tomorrow to get the car. I know its tough but it sounds like this snow will be gone by then, and you'd avoid tracking the snow in the car, the salt, etc.

unmarkedcar: My engine revs to about 2000 when started cold. I'm assuming this is to warm the car up faster, and get the oil flowing. I wonder if I should be waiting till the rpm settles down to idle before I take off. Any thoughts?

unmarkedcar · February 2001

That is what I am trying to figure out?...mine will rep up and down till it warms up....I usually wait 1 - 2 min to warm up. I think mine is doing the same thing....I think it will bounce up and down

sfrat · February 2001

Mine revs up and down between 2000 and 2500 or so before it settles down. I'm going to check the manual and see if there is any mention of it. Its most definately some sort of warm up procedure or to keep the car from stalling out right after starting. I'm going to start waiting until its back to idle before driving though, unless someone else has any thoughts.

Anyone?

unmarkedcar · February 2001

I do not see anything in the manual....I also checked the manual of my celica, and it is not mentioned either.

the_big_h · February 2001

I've also noticed the rev up when starting the car on a cold morning. I can't recall exactly where I read this, maybe the mazda's website or in the manual, but I remember reading that it's not necessary to let the car warm up to idle rev before taking off. As for myself, I do wait until the rev goes down to ~1500 before taking off, takes about a minute or so. To wait for it to go down to idle (>1000) will take at least 3-5 minutes.

vocus · February 2001

Due to the inclement weather conditions here today in Maryland, it looks like I am not going to be able to pick up my 2001 ES 2.0 after all. I tell ya, go out and get the car I always wanted and Mother Nature goes berserk.

Anyway, going to have to go tomorrow and get it I guess. I talked to the dealer and he told me they put the car on the showroom floor, and about 15 people have already come in and wanted to buy it. Now I feel special.

Just kidding. I guess that means like 24 more hours before I get to ZOOM ZOOM ZOOM!

speedypt · February 2001

Tomorrow is my last day at my current job and it's shaping up to be a busy one. I don't think I'll have much opportunity to visit the board for a week or more, and probably not anymore during the day. I'll be a night poster!

The cool news is that I'm going to be Zooming across the USA starting early Sunday morning from Phoenix to Chicago. 1800 mile road trip! I'll try to post some pics and a full report of the Protege on a real live long haul! I will be packing "Trigger" on Saturday and giving her a bath and checking everything over before I leave.

I'll still be on the board for the remainder of today, but I'll be scarce after that. Catch you all on the Windy City side!

Regards and TTFN,

Pete

vocus · February 2001

Have a wonderful and safe drive and we shall chat with you when you get to Chicago. By the time you return, I will have my ES 2.0 and definitely some pics of it and all. Just have to figure out how to post them...

Later dude!

ZOOM ZOOM ZOOM

nikecar · February 2001

good luck and drive safely.. don't want a ticket spoiling your fun!..

And vocus, go to photopoint.com You can post them for free there.

gamejunki · February 2001

I don't know if anyone saw my post around 350's, but I picked it up last night at Freeman Mazda here in Irving, Texas. Its a Silver 2001 Mazda ES with standard options and Manual Trans. I also added an extended warranty for 100,000 miles or 6 years for $1400. Don't know if this was a wise investment but I am not a savvy mechanic and I know parts for foreign cars can get expensive. I couldn't wait to drive it around! I put about 70 miles on it driving it around town. I didn't know you shouldn't rev it past 4000 RPM's. Is that gonna damage the engine? I hope to take it on a 2 hour trip to LongView this weekend and help work it in. A friend of mine told me not to drive it at a constant speed for the first 1000 miles, is this true? I still have alot to learn about this puppy but I am enjoying it nonetheless. I will probably post some pics of the car + me with a huge GRIN! Oh, even got a lil Zoom-Zoom sticker from the dealer.

Thanks again guys for all the advice and comments about the performance of this baby. I'm glad I got this car over the Focus.

unmarkedcar · February 2001

No it should not...I would avoid it if you can. You should take it easy for the first 3k. I would also not recommend driving at one speed for a long period of time. Try changing speed once in a while. This will help fuel economy in the long run.

Mazda Protegé

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