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2.Comfort - I'm 6'3". Wife is 5'11"
3.Warranty - I keep a car for a long time
Kia Sephia
During the first two years of my ownership, the Escort was actually a leased vehicle and I was very religious about following the manufacturer's recommendations for service.
He said something that I am not sure I can repeat, but the result was Ms. Robinson resting her chin on her chest to try to hide the smile that had crept across her face.
I will suggest my roommate use it when she goes to look at cars. It looks like she will have a long list of cars to whittle down.
And all the cars will be treated the same with none excluded right off the bat due to past performance.
What this means is that she will look at the current crop of cars from all makers and this includes the Koreans.
A 2001 Kia Sephia LS equipped comparable to my 2001 Toyota Echo would sticker for not much less money.
Now, if I made the same deal for a Sephia as I did for my Echo and I sold the Sephia to a private party tomorrow, I would be a couple of thousand dollars upside down.
If I sold my Echo to a private party tomorrow, I would not be upside down.
The Sephia is definitely not a car you want to pay full sticker for.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
2000 Kia Sephia
1. Clock kept reseting. Had it replaced.
2. I agree with Major. I would change the tail lights.
3. Gas pedal could be moved to the right a little.
Toyota upgraded the child seat tether anchor, but I was not having a problem with it. It passed government tests, but Toyota wanted it to be better so they upgraded it.
15k miles plus and only in the shop for routine maintenance. I do not count the upgrade work as an extra visit since it was done the same time as routine maintenance and it was not something I complained about.
We can't because I don't think that either one is true.
Hopefully, your predictions of your Sportage being reliable are better than your predictions of the Mariners having an easy time winning the World Series. Not saying they won't reach the World Series and win it. I am just saying that having to go the full five games to just get to the ALCS is not having an easy time.
1. Three out of eight plastic screw-hole covers fell off the armrests in sub-zero weather last winter.
2. At 6500 miles (11 months), a high-idle problem developed; it's not a big deal but a nuisance. It seems to be a little better now but my dealer tells me there is a software upgrade coming for the engine computer to fix it.
3. In the past week a minor rattle has developed from the dash/windshield area. It may be due to a trim strip (the black one that runs from the cowl to the rear window along both sides of the roof) that was replaced due to hail damage, and the body shop did not have the fasteners they needed, so it's not properly latched down. I'll know when I get the fasteners installed.
That's it. Not bad for one of the first samples of a new design, I think. In the "what would I improve if I could" category, here's my wish list (already given to Hyundai in the comprehensive survey they sent me several months ago); I've included only things that are realistic to expect on a $12,000 econocar:
1. Different color on beige interior fabric. I call the color "puke brown".
2. A tad smoother shifter. The 5spd is pretty good, but not quite as smooth as a couple of Civics I've owned.
3. Thicker paint.
4. Less expensive all-in-one radio/cassette/CD upgrade.
5. More rigid rear seat belt buckles, so the belts can be put on with one hand.
6. A shutoff switch for the center vents that keeps them shut. The only way to shut them down completely is to use the Recirculate button, which resets to off when you turn off the engine.
7. A power trunk release and panic button on the remote keyfob.
8. A rear-seat cupholder (like the slide-out unit that Elantras in other lands get).
9. Fog lights available as a dealer-installed option (at a reasonable price).
10. The rear ashtray colored the same as the console (tan), instead of black.
11. Larger coat hooks.
12. Rear windows that roll all the way down.
Kind of a long list, but most of these are nits, and the list of things I like about the car is much longer.
I thought my Echo had developed a rattle last night. It turned out to be the empty plastic pop bottle I had in one of the cupholders.
This is not really a complaint against Toyota, but had I to do it over again, I would have gotten an Echo without the rear spoiler. No problems with it. I have just changed my mind as to which way I like better.
I would make ABS, side air bags, and the power windows a little easier to get. From what I understand Echoes with those options are almost impossible to find.
Almost time for lunch.
My Toyota is the best car in the world its so reliable and it drives like a sports car with the kids in the back seat.
And the facts are that the Elantra GLS received a poor in the IIHS test and the Focus ZX3 got one star for protecting the rear passenger in a side impact crash.
Now you cannot compare the results of the Echo in the first case because the IIHS has not run tests yet, but you can compare the results of the Echo in the second case and the Echo did markedly better.
Given the award winners in this category, I guess Edmunds doesn't really care about safety.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
I think that Edmunds does care about safety, because about half of the voters had kids. But whatever appealed to the staff for the most wanted, it probably was not the looks of the Echo.
iluv
Also, crash safety will provide you some protection against the OTHER driver. P.S. now that you are saying sayonara, maybe the Mariners will win today.
1. Elantra has same scores as ECHO on driver front and rear side impact - 4.
2. Elantra had BETTER scores than ECHO on passenger front (5 vs. 4) and front side impact (5 vs. 3).
Unfortunately, we should not directly compare the NHTSA scores of the ECHO and Elantra because under the NHTSA rules, cars that are not within 500 pounds of each other should not be compared. ECHO is 2160 pounds and Elantra is 2897 pounds as tested by the NHTSA.
Also, as you pointed out, we cannot compare IIHS ratings for the ECHO and Elantra because the ECHO has not been tested yet. So I don't know what basis you have for saying that Edmunds.com's editors don't care about safety because they chose the Elantra over the ECHO. There is no evidence, at least not that you have presented, to back that assertion.
(Also, you forgot to mention that when comparing the ECHO to the ZX3 on NHTSA crash tests, the ZX3 bested the ECHO on three out of four categories.)
I clearly made the comparison in that regard between the Echo and the Focus ZX3.
I know you cannot compare the results of the IIHS test even when it is done on the Echo.
By mentioning that test, I was pointing out that the Elantra got the worst possible overall score on that test.
Also, the Focus ZX3 got the worst possible score in the side impact test for protection of rear seat occupants.
BTW, don't you think the fact that the Elantra had side impact air bags and the Echo did not might have had something to do with the better score of the Elantra in the NHTSA test?
My whole point is that this seems to indicate that safety is only a "legitimate" issue when the people at Edmunds wants it to be rather than truly a motivating factor.
You mischaracterized the tests and what you can compare. Or at the very least you made it hard to understand.
You lumped the front impact test results which cannot be compared between the Elantra and the Echo with the side impact crash test results which can be compared between the two.
The Elantra got a five in protecting the front seat occupants and a four in protecting the rear seat occupants in a side impact crash.
The Echo got a three in protecting the front seat occupants and a four in protecting the rear seat occupants during a side impact crash.
I still think the lack of side impact air bags in the Echo tested and the presence of side impact air bags in the Elantra tested might have something to do with the higher rating of the Elantra in protecting the front seat occupants.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
I don't understand why you are complaining about how I stated the Elantra's and ECHO's test scores. What I stated is accurate, although I organized my thoughts differently than you did. Anyone who wants all the facts can go to the NHTSA web site, http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov, and the IIHS site, http://www.iihs.org. At least I gave the full story on the ECHO vs. ZX3, while you only mentioned the one NHTSA test in which the ECHO outperformed the ZX3. IMO, that is misleading. And I also pointed out that the NHTSA scores should not be compared between the ECHO and Elantra because of the weight disparity--which you did not mention in your initial post on this subject.
We should also consider that the ZX3 is a 2dr hatchback, and many owners will seldom/never carry rear passengers. Those drivers who do carry rear passengers would do well to avoid the ZX3 because of the poor rear side impact results.
Anyway, if crash safety is a buyer's paramount concern, he/she will likely not buy an ECHO, Elantra, or ZX3, but a Civic. The 2dr Civic with optional side air bags scored 5 stars in all the NHTSA tests and also had excellent IIHS test results. In fact I believe that if the Civic 2dr met the $13,000 bar set by Edmunds for Economy Cars, they would have chosen it as the Most Wanted, based not only on superior crash-worthiness but on other attributes that make it an excellent small car, like reliability, quality, roominess, and gas mileage. They did name it the runner-up to the Golf in the Hatchback/Coupe under $20,000 category. The Civic DX 2dr missed the bar by only $250 ($500 including the side air bags), so anyone who wants a crash-worthy car and doesn't mind a basic vehicle, or mind paying more for an up-level LX or EX, can choose the Civic.
Can you give us a link?
My roommate and I took test drives of the 2001 Kia Rio sedan and the 2002 Kia Spectra sedan. The reasons behind the test drive and the details on the test drives including my thoughts on the cars will be posted when I have more time.
I will also post responses to Backy including my pick for the best car and to Randy.
Regarding your questions about not signaling, that is one of my pet peeves. I signal all the time. It is so ingrained that even if I am the only one on the road, I signal. If there is only one way to go, I still signal.
I live right on the border between two states and the state that I don't live in seems to use turn signals less. It could just be the county I travel to in that state. It is a very upscale county and I guess the people think they are too important to use turn signals.
Iluv, I believe Duel was Spielberg's first movie as director.
I soon got an indication that nothing had changed. I was on the passenger side when the saleswoman opened the driver's door. A very unpleasant odor reached my nostrils.
What the saleswoman did next I could not believe. She reached in and turned the car on. No, that is not a typo. She did not get in, she simply reached in. Also, I was very surprised that she did not ask to see my driver's license and did not ask to see proof of insurance. I walked around to the driver's side and my roommate went to the passenger side. We got in and the saleswoman did not go with us. Another surprise. The final surprise was that she did not slap a dealer's plate on the car.
I turned on the air conditioning to see if it would help with the smell and also I wanted to see how the acceleration was. It definitely helped the smell.
The Spectra was an automatic and as I accelerated onto the highway, I felt myself wishing the car had a few more horses or it was a manual. Definitely felt underpowered. Feelings shared by my roommate. It also felt like it was balking at changing gears.
I can't really say how the car reacted to bumps because we were in that very upscale county in the next state and potholes and bumps don't exist on the highway we were traveling. The seats did feel fairly comfortable. I felt the driver's seat was more comfortable than the passenger seat.
After getting off the highway, traveling down a city street for a while, I pulled into a parking lot to switch places with my roommate. Steering feel was similar to my Echo.
Remember I said that my roommate felt the acceleration was lacking and felt underpowered? She likes automatics and had wanted her next car to be automatic, but if she were to get a Spectra, she would want a manual.
One thing I noticed when getting into the passenger seat was that the smell seemed a little stronger. I turned up the A/C even more and it did not seem to help.
One thing both my roommate and I noticed when we got back to the dealership and out of the car was that there was a burning smell coming from somewhere. I did not really associate it with the car we were just in, but my roommate did. I hope nothing happened because I forgot to mention it to the saleswoman.
Stylewise, I think Kia did a pretty good job. It is a nice looking car. Qualitywise, I think they have room for improvement. My feeling comes mainly from looking at the exterior of the car.
I am pressed for time and must end this. If there is something more you want to know, just post it and I will deal with it in my next post. If no questions, I will probably post about the Rio test drive next instead.
But I want to leave you with the word for the day (in regards to that Rio test drive). The word for the day is buzzy.
If you have time I'd be curious as to details on the quality (fit, finish, materials) and also how quiet the car was, overall and engine noise.
One thing I was the most disappointed in was the fuel economy numbers of the Spectra, but I guess my Escort and Echo have left me spoiled. I get about 36mpg with the Escort and around 41mpg with the Echo.
Speaking of fuel, the sales lady told us the Rio had a full tank of gas and I joked that we would be back when the tank was almost empty. She did not seem to be joking when she said that would be fine.
Sorry if my review is not up to the standards or detail of a professional review, but those guys get to be with the cars a lot longer than I did. Also, I did not take notes during the test drives. When she gets home, my roommate and I should be going to take a look at Hyundais and I am going to take a pad of paper to jot notes down. I will take this pad of paper with me on all future test drives.
We are taking these test drives because her son is in the market for a low end car, but she will be in the market for a car soon too. I am having her write down all the things that are important to her such as safety, reliability, quality, resale value, etc., and then I am having her rate the importance of each on a 1 to 10 or 1 to 5 scale.
We are going to use that to pick the best car for her and we are also going to use your (Backy's) push/blocker system and see what the answer is that way.
Now what was that about world series pie? ; )
Oh btw, I did not get to the Hyundai dealership. Had more important things to do. Might not be until this weekend.
I am not sure if that remark is in a review that is still reachable because I think Edmunds may have revised it due to protests that it was in bad taste.
If I can find it, I will point you to it.
My friend, the dealer tells me that he is selling few to the bruised credit crowd, and a goodly number of senior citizens are purchasing both Rio and Sephia/Spectra models.
There are still a large number of Ford Aspires (Kia) and Pontiac LeMans (Daewoo) on the road in this area, Metro Detroit, and an increasing population of Kia and Hyundai vehicles. BTW happened to see a Daewoo transit bus on a Detroit street. Believe it was on a test route. Interesting..
The ECHO is the only comfortable sedan for us within the price parameters set for this forum. Now, when will Toyota offer an ECHO LE with padded armrests on front doors, fold down armrests for driver and front passenger, soft and padded material on the doors, quality seats like in even the least expensive Sienna, and Cruise?
P.S. We have no grudge against Kia. We test drove the Sedona and were VERY impressed with the comfortable, quiet ride with nice acceleration. It was as comfortable, quiet, etc. as either the Sienna or Odyssey. The Sedona also had the most leg and foot room for driver and front passenger of all minivans we have driven.
Iluv, how would I know how to spell sayonara in japanese? I ain't japanese, next time, say: Ahnyoung! to say hi and Ahnyoung! to say bye..
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
No wonder you like Kias. Especially if smell is your first criteria. ; )