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I should note the Accord and Camry have had their teething problems their first year out and those plants aren't unionized. I have seen people with people post that they have had problems with Accord's that were made in Japan even. The only thing I worry about with unions in the Automotive world is the health care and pension plans they make the Domestic Big 3 pay out and the debates about what plants you can close and what plans you can't close. Where I live in NJ Hyundai was thing about making cars in Edison, New Jersey where Ford is making their pick-up trucks but Hyundai couldn't offord to pay those workers the money Ford was paying them. Hyundai is now making a new plant in Alabama. I don't know whats going to happen when Ford stops making pick-up trucks in Edison, NJ and the plant closes up in a couple years.
Also did a quick rust check this morning -- none visible on door (have Sepang) but will try the q-tip test later.
BTW, the paint is nice and thick on my door frames. And no rust.
Hopefully it is really a superficial issue that can be easily fixed, and they throw owners a bone or 2 (free service and a gift card) + extend the warranty to lifetime on the doors.
That should take the sting out of resale, not that most consumers will know about this years down the road (if the problem is resolved correctly).
Plus, if they really did cure the problem at the factory, I can once again consider the 5 door when it comes out (although the 3 looks like a winner also).
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
I thought it was 6/03 and 7/03? I'm wondering if some major changes in the primer process were undertaken during the shut down?
Rich
arrived at dealership from Factory on 08/04/2003.
how much time does it take to ship the car from Factory to Dealer?
Rich?
From: Technical Services Dept (Mazda)
Sent: Tuesday, October 21st, 2003 10:40 a.m.
To: All Dealers All Regions - OF; All Dirs All Rgns-SR
Subject: Mazda 6 Door Sash Rust
Importance: High
Mazda North American Operations is aware of 2003 Mazda 6 surface rust/staining, mostly on the door sashes, and is currently investigating the issue and working on a solution. Detalied repair procedures and warranty information will be sent to you by October 31, 2003.
If Mazda 6 customers come into your dealership before October 31 with a concern about door rust, please let them know Mazda is aware of the situration and is developing repair prodcedures. We recommend taking customers' names and contacting them to schedule an appointment when repair procedures become available.
We appreciate your cooperation and support in this matter. Thank you for your commitment to customer satisfaction and "Fix-It-Right-The-First-Time."
Mazda North American Operations
Quailty Group
Technical Services Department
A few things concern me:
1) When did Mazda find out? Surely if cars after 7/03 are ok then something was changed in 6/03. Correct? We know there was a period that the plant was shut down.
2) The wording in the above post such as "mostly in the door sashes" makes me very nervous. When I pushed the person on the phone to say it was only the doors that were affected, they would not confirm.
3) What other metal was cleaned with the same procedure? Are we seeing the rust on the sashes first due to the thinness of the paint in that area?
4) Unless Mazda can prove to me that only the doors were cleaned with the faulty process I'm going to assume the entire car was improperly cleaned prior to the priming. I think everyone else should do the same.
I don't think anyone should settle for anything less than a buy back offer. I would buy another 6s in a heartbeat. What do we do if Mazda extends the corrosion warranty? Bring our cars in for touch up painting every year or so? Even factory painted doors won't match. I certainly do not want my 6s re painted with new doors by a dealer.
Sorry for the diatribe, but my phone call really set me off.
Mark.
Perhaps a 20/20 special can fish the real story out... man, this is a roller coaster ride! Up and down, up and down. Unfortunately, it's a $20k+ roller coaster ride!
I'm not a bodyshop pro but any scrape and repaint solution is not gonna be permanent. There's no way they can get into those welded areas, at least to my satisfaction. I don't think Mazda knows how effective that would be and I don't wanna be a guinea pig. I can't wait to see what their "fix" is. This board will be hopping the next few months, should be fun.
The permanent fix for the MZ6 may well be to buyback the car...
"If I recall correctly the rust is forming where two separate pieces of the door meet, right? If so, maybe a "soapy" lubricant was applied where those two pieces meet to aid the robots welding process in that the pieces would gain a better fit if they could slide together more easily. After the welding process, the lubricant was not removed and then paint was applied over it.
I know it's far fetched but it's just another way to look at what jbah's Mazda reps told him. It would also explain how the rust is forming from underneath the paint if in fact the "soap" statement is true.
Mazda's "soap" theory may be right but we just don't have all the details yet."
Anyway, I'm glad to hear that all those with rust will be hearing something soon. I know I'd be writing to Mazda every single day if I had a brand new car with rust.
The cause of rust was due to an additive in a soapy solution the plant used to facilitate the installation of the weather stripping.
This has cause minor surface rusting where the "spiked" soapy solution came in contact with sheet metal.
Mazda "realized" the problem and removed the additive to the solution (they still use soapy solution for stripping install).
**This additive was removed and vehicles not affected Post JULY 22 !! Not early July as reported earlier.
Check your MFG dates.
Call MNAO 1800 222 5500 and talk to Sid x1159 or Todd x1187
Sad that I was calling regarding the buyback return of my RX-8 for HP and MPG issues.
Mazda keep shooting themselves in the foot.
I'm still not buying the soapy solution excuse for the rust. It doesn't make sense. This solution would have to eat through the paint, primer, and galvanization (if any) to expose the sheet metal for rusting. Our doors still have fairly intact (poor quality, but intact) paint.
Man, what happens if you get that "soap" on your skin?!
I took the opportunity to check a couple of 6's on the showroom for the dreaded rust problem. My car was produced at Flat Rock on 02/03 and I haven't seen any evidence of the problem, BUT, I did plainly see rust on the White 6s with a build date of 06/03 in the weatherstripping channel. Both the sales staff & service manager stated that they hadn't heard a thing about the problem. The second car was a Redfire 6s with a build date of 08/03 and NO sign of rust. No word from anyone on how the rust issue will be addressed. Thank God for the internet (or Al Gore) for making me aware of the issue.
- Mark
fowler3
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
However, to get the same engine you have to get the MZ3s, so that has to be included in the comparo. Anyway, once you equip the MZ3i comparable to the MZ3s there's only about $700 difference, so IMO you'd have to be nuts to get the MZ3i, unless you realy don't care about the stuff in the 1PP package.
Here's how they compare:
MZ3i
base $13680
AT1 $900
AC1 $850
1PP $1190 (power pkg. with alloy wheels)
dest $520
total $17140
MZ3s 4-door
base $16405
AT1 $900
dest $520
total $17825
MZ6i
base $18750
AT $850
alloy wheels $400
dest $520
total $20520
This may not be the way you would equip yours, but this shows the pricing with the roughly the same equipment. Sure you CAN equip a MZ3 to be more than a MZ6, but not with comparable equipment. If the way they packaged the MZ6i options means you can equip one for less than a MZ3s, then it could in fact be less expensive for you to go that route. If you can live without power windows and such (and don't mind the smaller engine), the MZ3i could be a better choice for you.
To get a Mazda6i with all of that, it would cost a whopping $25,165 and it still doesn't have the 6-disc changer (not available with moonroof), xenon headlights, navigation system, tire pressure monitoring system, and electro-hydraulic steering. The 3 is actually quite a bargain, and it is not that much smaller, noisier, or less refined. In fact, the suspension components come right off the 6! And the 3's lower weight will give it better handling and better performance compared to the 6i.
Now if it is a persistent problem, or something is really wrong, then the light will come back on. Then you definitely want to high-tail it to the dealer.
To date, on my Mazdas, I have never had one come back on the second time (at least not for tens of thousands of miles.)
My brother's Mustang was a different story...we tried resetting it, and it immediately came back on. Sure enough, a $400 dealer bill was fairly quickly forthcoming.
I think they set the CEL with ridiculously low tolerance either because of government emissions requirements, or they really want that $80 to hook up your car to an analyzer. (-;
Only the rear. The Mazda3 has struts up front.
Mazda is very strange indeed. The U.S. is the most profitable car market in the world. We are generally willing to spend more money on a car than most of the world. And yet, navigation, xenons, and stability control have been available on the 6 overseas since day one. But, this wouldn't be Mazda's first marketing mistake... I figured that would have been one good thing to come out of their relationship with Ford.
I agree. I'm most likely going to buy a 3 instead of a 6 but since we will probably never take the 3 on long trips, where the nav would be most useful to me, it's useless. I would be more inclined to take a 6 on trips instead of the Escape mostly due to it's extra passenger and cargo capacity.
If I get a good deal on a 3 with the nav then I will take it but I'm not going to ask for it specifically.
One other note, opting for the SAB/SAC/ABS package on the 3 does not require anything else if you go for one of the s models. Even if you want the i model you still only have to get the power group and A/C. They made it a lot easier to get only what you really want on the 3.
A comparably equipped 6 will be about $6000 more than the 3 I want. The 6 holds two advantages the way I see it, a V6 and more room. Other than that it's pretty much a wash.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
It is a sports car and it is a rotary, but the EPA sticker states 18 city 26 Hwy.
Owners logs are reporting 15 to 18 mixed. Also tank is 12 gals, so going to the gas station every 3rd day is no fun - sports car or not.
I traded my 3.5 ton Ford Excursion(Triton V-10)it got 16mpg all day long.
Well Mazda corp is making good and fair offer to buy it back. Back she goes. Nice, fun, free, 3 month test drive.
Cheers.
Here's my theory. It's probably an engineering and/or supplier problem, more than anything else. The Mazda3 will be be sold globally in larger volumes than the Mazda6, and in most of the world the Mazda3 is considered a full size car. So, they had to get the engineering and production issues completed for putting this equipment in the Mazda3 first. Remember that the Mazda3 is built in Japan for the whole world. Different engineering groups within the company may have been responsible for the two cars.
This equipment will appear on the Mazda6, maybe mid-year or on 2005 models. Very few Mazda3 units will be sold with NAV/Xenons in the US.