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Comments
Actually, I'm guessing that assumption is quite correct. Oh well. I think I'll complain anyway.
Mazda has seriously stumbled in its effort to rescue itself from the position of being the 5th largest Japanese Automobile seller. Very, very disappointing package options. Hopefully someone beats some sense into the heads of the people that came up with these ridiculous combinations, or fires them outright, and they can get things figured out by the time the hatch comes out.
Sorry Rich (audi) - but these options DO go far enough to convince a large number of people (me included) to NOT consider the Mazda 6 unless the combinations are made more sensible. Anyone who doesn't realize this, especially the people at Mazda, have to be somewhat deluded
Anyway, I think they messed up big time. In order to compete in this tough market, they are going to have to loosen up these constraints, or lose a lot of sales. I hope they realize this real soon.
I just want a 6i-MT or 6s-MT, Cloth, Side Airbag package. Nope, they can't do it. OK, I'll compromise and get the Bose, Sunroof or Sport package if I have to, but NOT Leather. Sorry, I think Mazda just lost a customer, unless they change this real soon. Nissan had these same dumb-donkey constraints on the Altima last year, now it's better. But, I'm probably not going to wait a year for Mazda to correct their blunder.
We need to get an insider in Mazda marketing to help us out.
Mazda has forgotten it is not the market leader. It has to beat the others, not charge more !
And make the options more flexible. These are being built in the US, not being shipped from Japan, when limiting the number of choices might be more cost-effective.
I think this is the result of someone's marketing exercise/blunder.
ABS and side airbags are a great example. In the vehicles that it is an option mazda can't seem to find more than 10% of the buyers who really will pay for the option. It has not hurt sales since mazda's numbers have been climbing in a downward market.
But if we listen to people on this board, everyone wants and demands ABS and if its not offered will buy elsewhere. reality is much different.
Gneral Motors made ABS standard on most of their cars a few years back,
It did nothing to increase sales but it did increase costs. This feature is quickly vanishing.
Mazda spent alot of time to make this car a reasonably priced car that meets or exceeds the expectations of MOST buyers and it will do that.
Those of us who are in the biz know that many demands vanish when people drive the car and fall in love. This car will not be any different.
But as others have pointed out, Mazda has imposed stupid option packaging contraints in the past. I can say unequivocally, if I have to get the sport package in order to get the other options I want...specifically, heated seats, sunroof, ABS/TC and Bose...then I'm shopping elsewhere. If you want boy-racer, that's fine...but to me the ground effects and spoiler totally cheese-up an otherwise fine looking car. It's like tacking a spoiler on an A4 or 3-series, IMO.
I'm going to put in my two cents to Mazda...hopefully they'll get their act together on this by next summer, if not a lot sooner.
Can any dealers or Mazda wonks on this board shed any light on what's reality versus software defects?
Will other "pay to play" because they just have to have this car - yeah. Will profits go up because of the packaging - probably. Do I think that everyone wants a car just exactly the way I want it? No.
Do I give a hoot what others want and whether or not they will pay extra? Heck no. Cars cost way too much as it is, and I won't feed the greed with so many other good vehicles out there, no matter what the hype is on the 6.
Ive been on the fence between a 6 and a Passat. I probably would have liked the 6 but I thought it was going to be cheaper and what a screwy pricing/option structure. I'm sure they will have to discount it and ease up on the ridgid option structure within a few months.
I'm now leaning toward a Passat. Its a beautiful car and VW will let you order one just how you like it. Dirve one before you decide on a 6.
1. Moonroof
2. ABS
3. Bose sound systems
Yes. I get it. When you buy the moonroof, you will be driving with your eyes looking out of the moonroof. SO you need better brakes.
Same with Bose audio. you are so engrossed in listening to the music that yo uwill always brake at he last moment. So you need ABS.
Right?
Heated Front Seats
Heated Door Mirrors
16-Inch Alloy Wheels
Anti-Theft Perimeter Alarm
8-Way Power Driver Seat
17-Inch Alloy Wheels (didn't you just force me to get a special set of 16's?)
215/50 R17 V-Rated Tires
Clear-Lens Halogen Fog Lights
Dual Exhaust Outlets with Bright Tips
Sculpted Front Air Dam and Rear Apron
Side Still Extensions
Rear Spoiler with Integrated Brake Light
Black Interior Trim
Electroluminescent Gauges With Red Illumination
Titanium Color Power Window Switch Panels
side airbags/curtain bags
dead animal hides on the seats (leather)
= about $5000 dollars extra. What, am I made of money?
And AUDIA8Q I really did value your input and opinion until you went in to stereo typical car salesman tirade about WHAT is best for the consumer and what we should want and not, please spare us the sales jargon!!!!
I hope Mazda NA comes to its senses and decouples the ABS and side air bags from any other options on its 6.
If it were for me, I'd just forgo the ABS myself than take the options packages, but I still think it's silly to tie the safety-related options to "luxury" options.
I hope they keep track of what the most popular options people select on the website in addition to market research surveys to determine which packages are most popular.
I see that they decoupled the moonroof from the ABS/airbags in the Protege. Why did they do that, if no one is willing to pay for those things? Why can't they do that with the 6? If they're offering six levels of options, with the airbags and ABS only added on the top, how much is it going to cost them to add one more configuration, with ABS and airbags and only one or two forced packages/options? It seems like sensible, safety-conscious types who want airbags wouldn't want the sport package or the moonroof. The packaging just doesn't make sense.
It's not trivial to have to take $4000 of unwanted options to get safety features you want. That turns a well-priced car into a total waste of money. I don't think everyone's going to drive the car once and fall in love with it to the extent they ignore the price. I'm sure I would like a G35 if I drove one, but I'm not going to pay for one. I think it's perfectly reasonable to decide not to buy the 6 based on the option packaging.
You don't build brand enthusiasm and loyalty by pissing people off. Maybe those of us in this forum are totally unrepresentative of the buying public--we're not suckers.
Right on brotha i couldn't of said it any better!!!
Charging extra to get the car you want is nothing new. It is the exact same thing as giving discounts for option packages, just worded differently.
Edmunds posters are certainly not the typical buyer, but they certainly are the typical target of the 6 - ie people who like drivers cars and care a great deal about them. Also rememember that the typical buyer will buy the typical best sellers - Accord and Camry.
Have we seen these yet? Are these the same gauges that have been on all of the websites?
Most have been reasonable and fun people but not really enthusiast or "real drivers." They fit the Camry/Accord group perfectly in most cases.
to everyone else who has resorted to name calling and stuff because I like the way they have packaged the car you can all live in misery and whine together cause I'm finished here. I try to explain why mazda does something and the benefits of it and you all have the answers so you obviously dont need anyone with insight or perspective..
Those of you who email me with questions (10-15 per day) find another source.
if you have all the answers about car marketing come over and fill out an applications. We pay very well and I'm sure ALL the car makers would be interested in your insight. I guess Mazda has led me down the path and I should listen to edmunds people. hahahah Of course these are the same people who told me that our dealership was doomed because the dot.coms who were going to wipe out the retail the auto industry..
If you don't like something about the car buy something else. simple. Honda sure gives everyone alot of choices. haha
"the huge majority of people who post on edmunds do not represent the typical car buyer....not even close"
is that the huge majority of people who post on Edmunds are informed and know what they want, and that the typical car buyer is stupid! haha
We all know it's easier to sell a car to somebody who is uninformed and doesn't know what they want, or at least most car salespeople should know this.
The target demographic for the Mazda 6 IS the a-typical, informed buyer, and that means a higher degree of market awareness, and a lower propensity to being bull-shitted by the car salespeople and managers. It means the suits that planned the package options were ill-informed, and this might bite Mazda in the hind-quarters at a time they can least afford it. The Mazda 6 isn't going to be a marathon runner - if it can't get out of the blocks fast, like a sprinter - it will be another also-ran, literally. Sorry Richard, but I throoughly disagree with your asessment about typical Mazda 6 buyers being willing to accept the financial hit of additional packages and features - no car is worth 4000 more than its worth, regardless of how much fun to drive it is. The Protege can cost more than the Civic or Corolla, or some other competitors, comparably eqiupped, but the percentage hit is tiny compared to the Mazda 6. Current Package Options = Big Mistake. Period.
Possible good thing about this is the package options will start being heavily discounted in the very near future, and people will be able to absorb the relatively smaller financial hit of a few unnecessary, but livable options, for less. But I doubt Mazda's aim was to have another bargain, best-of-both-worlds-but-not-great vehicle that is not a sales force, if not a leader, on the market.
I also agree with Ashu in that Mazdas are usually bought by people who seek them out, not by the normal also-ran shoppers in the classes. When I was looking for my 99 DX, the Protege didn't really occur to me at first, until I passed a Mazda dealer on my way to look at a Civic. I didn't even know it was redesigned, for crying out loud! I am glad I stopped and investigated, I ended up liking the 99 so much, I traded it for a 2001 model.
The thing is, Mazda needs to listen to its customers a little more. Otherwise, they will lose them.
The 6 will a FAILURE....read FAILURE.....prove us wrong if you can.
(if it stays with the same option packaging)
Failure => it will sell no more than the crappy 626.
So mazda NA will still stay in the dumps.
Maybe the Euro MAzda will go up.
Oh well.
I also agree with those who are bummed that they need to load their vehicle out to the hilt to get a single option they want. In my case, I like strippy vehicles that give you lots of bang for the buck and I know I'll enjoy my base 4cyl 5spd except for the cheesy seat cloth.
One thing is for sure in this highly competitive market: You can't win 'em all.
Mazda has done it's market research. It knows who it's target customer is, how they want the vehicle packaged, and how much they want to pay for it - do you?? If so, send your resume to Mazda.
When launching a new model, it makes sense to reduce the variations. This makes it easier for their suppliers and the assembly line to get comfortable with the product and make sure the first units are as perfect as possible. Saab has done so with the new 9-3 and it's launch package and it seems to be working.
More than likely, Mazda will loosen up the option combinations if the market demands it. Until then, all you can do is continue to contact them and hope for the best. You may not agree with their plan, but it's their plan and attacking it isn't going to make it change.
For crying out loud, Mazda is a business. They just made the best car in its class (or so we've all read), and they are giving us costly packages rather allowing the base price to creep higher. Comparably equipped, it's STILL no more than the competition in price, and that'll be enough for Mazda to move cars.
Can't get the options you want? Shop elsewhere. Mazda will have plenty of customers, and when the hype dies down, then they can become more flexible down the road to draw new customers in.
Don't say this strategy won't work. It has for years. Audia8q knows this. I'd be worried for Mazda only if he, the long-time sales manager, were worried also. The man's been extremely helpful, professional, and knowledgable here on the board. I think we only owe him thanks.
That's a lot more than can said for most people here now.
I'm not happy with the packaging either. It sucks. But if you can make more profit, more power to ya. It doesn't have to be from any of us. Yes, this is going to cost Mazda some customers, but the sales it does get will be more profitable, and big-ticket customers are better to keep long-term. Yet, you can still hop into a "6" for only $19k.
So no ABS for me. I think I'm going to get a stripper 6i for $19,050 and throw some alloys and an alarm on myself with the $500 rebate Mazda will so graciously be giving me for having recently graduated college. Someone want to complain about that next? Honda doesn't have this at all.
That said, are the power seats more comfortable than the manuals?
"You have selected Anti-Lock Brakes/Traction Control
This requires the addition of
Premium Package and Comfort Package and BOSE® Audio Package and Sport Package and Side Air Bags/Side Air Curtains and Power Moonroof and Leather Seat Upholstery
>> $+4925 to MSRP
Or you may cancel your selection of Anti-Lock Brakes/Traction Control"
Now, I know Nissan and several others have done things like this, but this is pretty extreme, I think even the Mazda dealer would have to agree. When it comes right down to it this makes ABS a $4925 option, which is simply wrong. I'm usually not one for goverment intervention, but I wouldn't mind seeing Congress pass a law stating that all safety-oriented options be available ala-carte, even if it's by special order. Heck, I'd even like to see ABS available as a dealer-installed item, like A/C still is on some low-end cars.
-Jason
Just because there are lots of high paid people from Ford over at Mazda doesn't necessarily mean that they know what to do. Look at what's been happening at Ford for the past few years.
Personally I want to see Mazda and the 6 do well. I own Ford stock.
As for the disapointment being expressed from our friends south of the border, changes to option packages are easy to make. You might even some some running changes through this model year.
The Mazda dealer network in the States will be providing feedback to Mazda USA on a continual basis and option packages will be refined accordingly.
This isn't a car that will be on the market for two weeks. It will be on the market for years. Plenty of time for mazda to get the packaging right. What matters is the quality and desirability of the actual car. That doesn't look like it will be a concern.
Those of you who email me with questions (10-15 per day) find another source.
if you have all the answers about car marketing come over and fill out an applications. We pay very well and I'm sure ALL the car makers would be interested in your insight. I guess Mazda has led me down the path and I should listen to edmunds people. hahahah Of course these are the same people who told me that our dealership was doomed because the dot.coms who were going to wipe out the retail the auto industry..
Well goodbye to you sir.