Honda Odyssey 1999 - 2004

jimjps · August 2001

Historically long warranties are signs of desperation. Chrysler was in sad shape when they started the 7yr/70Kmile waranty. When the company turned around and sales went up they dropped the 7/70 warranty it. VW sales in the US were very low when they started the 10/100 warranty, their sales have picked up and now they are dropping the 10/100. If sales are so bleak that you may go out of business, then there is nothing to loose by having a long warranty. That seems to be the logic to me. If Kia sales grow according to their plans I expect they will drop the 10/100 warranty in a few years.

maxbuster · August 2001

Does anyone know if the power sliding doors are covered by the Honda Extended warranty?

Also, I remember seeing but cant find now a post for the 7yr/100k/0ded for $850 - does anyone know what dealer was offering this?

rk17 · August 2001

According to Kay Honda, the lists for 2002 have not opened yet -- I don't know what exactly does that mean -- but any information on other dealers selling 2002 Odyssey at MSRP prices will be greatly appreciated.

alison11 · August 2001

We have a 2000 Odyssey with 35,000 miles. Recently it began making a clanking noise over sharp bumps, definitely from front end- brought it in , they found loose calipers in front and replaced both- still clanking- any suggestions would be truly appreciated! Love the van but am tiring of odd problems- eg had transmission replaced, persistent shimmy (tires wore out at 26,000 miles), rear brake noise. Our Accords were much more reliable with over 180,000 miles!

If anyone has experienced our latest dillema please respond!

mschafer · August 2001

There are several folks who have installed the Donnelley inside rear view mirror. It has an outside temperature probe and compass; and it is also autochroic (auto-dimming).

Here's the link:

http://www.donnelly.com/shopdonnelly/default.asp

It's the second item on the page.

greenacresn40 · August 2001

Hello RK,

I don't know what is going on in N.J. but I can tell you that our Honda dealer- " COUNTRY MOTORS "
in Butler, PA has taken orders for 2002 Ody's. We ordered ours in June and I think their allotment is 5-10 per month. Our salesman Bernie says our ODY will be built in Sept.
We are paying MSRP and they threw in fog lights, bug shield and mud flaps, no other fees added ! They are great people to deal with !

The waiting game begins. Waiting for what MSRP will be and when we can pick it up to break it in !!

You can reach Bernie at 1-800-786-2756.
Tell him "Farmer Tom" sent ya.

Good luck in finding a great price on an ODY

diploid · August 2001

Good luck finding an Odyssey in NJ. Planet Honda in Union, NJ is the only Honda dealer we know of that actually has Odysseys on their lots (but they're already sold- unless you can fork over a higher down payment than the guy that the car's reserved for). All other Honda dealers don't even have them in their lots.

larry110 · August 2001

I've been trying to figure out how to put a VCP in the EXL RES. The dealers can't answer my questions. They thought they knew, but they were basing that knowledge on the 2001 model. Now they say it probably can't be done without a custom modification.

I bought a VCP and had a chance to look around in a 2000 model. I had forgotten that there was so much room on the floor between the center console and the front seats. As it turns out the VCP will fit on the floor right up against the center console and not be in the way at all. The center tray can even still operate as designed, up or down.

Thanks for all the suggestions.

ahha · August 2001

I live in the Bay Area and have decided to
buy a top-of-the-line (EXL inc. Navigation
and Entertainment systems).

I would be grateful for any referrals on Honda
dealerships in the Bay-Area, Northern California
or L.A. area who sell Odysseys at MSRP?

I can put up with very minimal markups disguised
as dealer installed options. But then again,
with a fully-specified Odyssey, there just simply
aren't too many more options to add-on.

Contact/Phone nos/URL would be helpful. Thanks

billg7 · August 2001

I don't know about California (CA). Does California still have a law that you can only buy your car in CA? You could find out by asking the Department Of Motor Vehicles. If a CA car has to have a special package added to it, that other states don't require, for smog, then I am sure you couldn't do it. You would see that package listed on the sticker. The auto manufacturers would also know, as a double check.

But if you can buy your car anywhere, I would consider buying it in another state, like across the border, in Arizona for example, if you can't find MSRP in CA. I once took a plane to another state and then took a taxi to an out of state dealership and bought my car there. It worked out well and I had no problems.

The Edmonds people here should know if you can buy an out of state car, if you live in CA, as they are located in CA. If a person can buy his vehicle in any state it opens up your options a bit and with the limited availabilty of the Odyssey it may come in handy.

arbabc · August 2001

I have only one infant at this time. So, the Sienna would do fine in terms of space. But, I would rather have the Ody's cargo capacity over the Sienna's. I agree with about the resale value of the Ody is higher than that of the Sienna. Thanks for your advice.

arbabc · August 2001

I completely understand what you are saying. I just want to point out that if the supply vs. demand of the Ody(say 5 cars demanded with 3 supplied per day) was equivalent to that of the Sienna(say 10 cars demanded vs. 6 supplied per day), then market forces would determine the value of the Ody and the value of the Sienna without any bias. That's probably why people are reluctant to pay MSRP for the Ody.
Now if Honda increased production and kept the invoice price unchanged, then they would sell more Ody's for larger profits while the consumer would pay less. The dealer would make a lower margin on each Ody, but the increased volume would make up the difference. We'd all be happy.

arbabc · August 2001

I guess you would need the Ody with 4 little ones. I just got home from our first vacation with "the boy" who is 4 months. Man, it felt like the longest road trip that I ever took! My hats off to you for handling 4.
By the way, which do you feel rides better and feels safer to you, the ML320 or the Ody? Thanks.

flxomac · August 2001

I'm reading too many posts about problems with the 1999 oddy: noises, wheel and brake problems, that should not be happening on a honda. maybe its true what they say about avoid buying a car that is in its first year of a major design change, so that the "bugs" can be worked out in subsequent model years.

Hope I didn't offend anyone who owns a 1999 model.

billg7 · August 2001

Consumers Reports shows more failures in the 1999 Odyssey then the 2000 but does not show it to be a lemon. As failures occur over the standard 3 year warranty period, improved and preferred parts will be used, to replace the failed ones.

So the reliability of the 1999 Odyssey should approach that of the 2000 and 2001 models, as time goes by. It may be a good idea to buy an extended warranty on a first year model.

dave84 · August 2001

Huh?

rxb123 · August 2001

I'm waiting for my 2001 new vehicle to arrive. Meanwhile I have to decide whether or not to buy the extended warranty (quoted was $1450 to go out to 7 yrs). Sounds expensive, but is it worth the cost? Actually, it sounds like triple A auto club and doesn't cover everything"). Is the amount negotiable? Any good tips to help in my negotiation? thanks!

raybear · August 2001

You can get the Odyssey in Southern California for MSRP. A few dealers north of the Bay Area also sell at sticker.

I have to disagree with billg7 regarding an Arizona purchase, the Arizona dealers have a doc fee that averages $200 more than California dealers, and the prices are no better than Southern Cal.

self_mechanic · August 2001

I got my 2000 LX from Tracy Honda.
For LX the price is MSRP plus $1000 worth of Options of your choice. For EX, the price is MSPR + $2000.00 worth of options of your choice. Since you are buying EXL with nevagation and entertainment system, thoes items can be qualified as options, and you should be able to get EXL at MSRP price at Tracy Honda. Talk to Dell Disney. He is the manager of Tracy Honda. Good luck to you.

btj07 · August 2001

in response to rxb123

I recently purchases an 01 ody EX and decided to purchase the extended warranty 7/100/50. The dealer quoted me some outrages amount (roughly $1200). After doing some research through this forum I found some dealers were selling the above for around $900. Our host Drew should be able to offer some assistance finding the specific posts. I told this to my dealer and he came down to $955. This is absolutely negotiable, DO NOT PAY $1450. If your dealer will not come down in price say no thanks and shop around. It does not matter what dealer you purchase your warranty from. People will differ in their opinion whether to buy or not buy. Since this is a long term investment I thought it would be in my best interest.

jandrews7 · August 2001

FYI: Consumer Reports includes the 1999 Honda Odyssey in its list of "used cars to avoid"

darelldd · August 2001

Thanks mschafer, for the Donnelly link. That's just what I was looking for. Still wish they'd include it in the vehicle. I mean really...I can get a DVD player, but no thermometer? Nuts.

- Darell

arbabc · August 2001

1) Basic Economics. Supply vs. Demand determines market price. Here are some ficticious numbers just for example's sake.

Odyssey daily supply = 1000
Sienna daily supply = 1500
Odyssey daily demand = 2000
Sienna daily demand = 2000
Odyssey daily shortage = 1000 = more people willing to pay more in order to get the Odyssey
Sienna daily demand = 500 = fewer people willing to pay more in order to get the Sienna

Conclusion, Honda Odyssey prices are artificially inflated by relatively higher shortage in supply.

2) Again, Elementary Economics. Current production vs. increased production. Here are again some ficticious numbers just for example's sake.

Current production = 1000 daily
Average Cost of manufacturing to Honda = 20,000
Average invoice price honda charges dealers = 25,000
Honda's daily gross profit = 1000(25,000-20,000) = 5,000,000
MSRP = 30,000 = what customers pay
All Honda dealer's profit = 1000(30,000-25,000) = 5,000,000

Increased production = 1500 daily
Average Cost of manufacturing to Honda = 20,000
Average invoice price honda charges dealers = 25,000
Honda's daily gross profit = 1500(25,000-20,000) = 7,500,000
MSRP = 30,000 = NOT what customers pay
Customers pay = 28,333.33
All Honda dealers' profit = 1500(28,333.33 -25,000) = 5,000,000
Dealer margin went down to 3,333.33 from 5,000 but profit remained unchanged.

Conclusion, Honda + Consumer wins, dealers not hurt.

bjk2001 · August 2001

rxb123:

Don't waste your money. You have 3 yr/36k miles to decide you need it or not. $900 is about right price you can get at any dealer in US for it. I didn't buy extended warranty for my 01 EX.

Someone said from GEICO insurance you can pay very little per year to get same kind of coverage, but you have to have a new car less then 11K miles.

bjk2001 · August 2001

self mechanic:

You should come down to So Calif. I got my 01 EX @ MSRP without mandatory options from Metro Honda. Spreen Honda also offered MSRP no options. There are other dealers in So Cal are selling @ MSRP. If you paid options @ MSRP you paid too much, I got some Honda options from internet web site at a discount price, too.

bjk.

dave84 · August 2001

Please explain to me why "Honda Odyssey prices are artificially inflated". I haven't heard anything that leads me to believe that Honda is purposely holding back on Odyssey production, thereby creating increased demand and artificially inflating prices. I think that currently, the market is working in a very natural, "non-artificial" way.

Your second scenario with increased Odyssey production and decreased prices for buyers only works if dealers start having unsold vans on their lots. If I was a dealer that continued to sell all my Odysseys, even with an increased allocation, before they even arrived on the lot, what incentive would I have to go below MSRP? Why should a dealer's overall profit remain the same when he starts selling more vans? The answer is, it shouldn't. As long as he can easily sell every van, the more vans he sells, the more overall profit he should have. Basic economics.

mommyof4 · August 2001

I think both are equally safe. ML has the lowest bumper height to match regular cars, and I think that's a plus. It would cause a lot less damages to both vehicles.

ML also matches up with other SUVs quite well. I heard of people in accidents with other monster SUVs and they walked out without problem. Then again, seems to me that ones who drive the mid-size SUVs are generally better drivers than those soccer moms who drive Suburban and the like.

As for ML AND Ody match up, well, I think they would both hold up quite well. Our ML is approaching 4 years old and I feel safer in that than the crummy 01 Windstar I drove when our Ody was in the shop getting repaired. BTW, we were in a wreck in our Ody in April. My infant son and I survived the wreck; he was perfectly fine, while I had a broken left thumb while trying to stop the van from going into opposite traffic flow.

So, I think both of them are safe. Of course, my ML was made by Diamler Benz, NOT Diamler Chrysler.

beeryr4 · August 2001

Ok, so the 2002 Ody has a new engine and a new transmission. Are they used in any other Honda? Is there any history on their reliability? I have my deposit on an '02.

The "conventional wisdom" says to avoid the first model year of a new or redesigned car. Wait until the next model year so that any bugs / kinks are worked out. I don't like the idea of being an expensive guinea pig.

DTKWOK · August 2001

Actually, the engine is not new, it's still the same 3.5L , but with a "new" VTEC system and some exhaust tweaks. This setup is used on the MDX. The 5 speed is also currently used on the MDX and I believe on some of the larger Acura vehicles.

darelldd · August 2001

I just placed my order for a 2002 EXL-NAV-RES at University Honda in Davis, CA. (530) 758-8770. Their policy is to never charge more than MSRP for any vehicle. By ordering one, there is no chance of being forced into options, but if you want options, they will sell them at "their cost" (whatever that really means). It's a good dealership to do business with. We also bought our 2001 Civic EX from them last year. The only problem, of course, is that we have to wait until November for delivery. They say there are 15 on the waiting list for "whatever comes in first."

If you want the nicest person there, ask for Jessica, and tell her that Darell sent you....

- Darell

jtjackson33 · August 2001

I have a 2001 EX with 15,000 km on it. I just took it in the other day as I was hearing some new noise (vibration and humming) at certain speeds (I suggested it may be transmission related). The dealer checked it out and has ordered me a 'new' transmission (said it was transmission bearing noise). I understand that they do not replace with a 'new' transmission but with a 'remanufactured' one. Should I be concerned about this?

diploid · August 2001

"The 5 speed is also currently used on the MDX and I believe on some of the larger Acura vehicles."

But isn't the MDX the largest vehicle from Acura?

Actually I know what you meant, but I couldn't resist.

There is rumor floating around that the current MDX engine will be bumped up in displacement to give more horsepower- does that mean that the redesigned Odyssey (I think it's nearing its 4-5 year cycle) will incorporate the new MDX engine, as well?

arbabc · August 2001

Thanks for your assessment of the ML & the Ody. As I wrote in an earlier post I ruled out the ML because of poor reliability. Obviously your experience has been otherwise. The only thing is that Daimler Chrysler has refused to acknowledge that they put on bad fuel pumps on their MLs, and still continue to do so. I never heard a more pathetic excuse as the one where they claim that the problem is american fuel. To me safety also means that when my wife goes out at 2AM to see a patient in the hospital, she does not have to worry about her car or van or suv stalling on her in even a good/safe neighborhood at that awful hour. Even though I feel the ML is better than the Ody in crash tests, it fails in reliability. So, I may end up buying the Ody because it meets most of my criteria.

mommyof4 · August 2001

I almost got a 2000 T&C Ltd. minivan when I found out the wait on an Ody. Well, I walked into a Chrysler dealership near me, armed with my checkbook, ready to write that big check and trade in our car. Unfortunately, the dealership offered me a really rotten deal on the lease (didn't want to buy at the time). The cost ended up to be MSRP+ and I don't even get to keep the van at the end of 3 years. Six months later, I got my Ody and my husband was happy that I DID wait for it, because it was too difficult to pull out the backseat, even with both of us pulling.

I'm glad you like your van...it's important, considering how much time you spend in that thing.

Shalom.

mommyof4 · August 2001

Like my husband has always said, Diamler Chrysler can still make good cars...just the reliability is not as good as others. I happen to have a good ML and I'm glad I did, especially I almost went for a Explorer (Thank God I didn't get one...). Reliability is important for us females, especially ones with kids. So, if I were you, go with the one with the best reliability history.

Good luck!!

arbabc · August 2001

Huh ?

arbabc · August 2001

Thanks. I've started looking for the best deal on the 2002 Odyssey. Let's see if I can do better than MSRP.

miniman · August 2001

MSRP is just a name give to a dollar amount. Forget MSRP.
Ask this question: what do I get for $26k in an Odyssey EX versus similarly equipped DC with cash back and haggling, Ford w/ 0.9% financing... If the Honda at $26k compares favorably (considering options, reliability, resale, safety, whatever else you want to factor in or out of your decision), then pay MSRP, but don't fret it because that is the car's value on the open market. In fact, while some pay over MSRP for mandatory options and dealer sleeze factor, you can perhaps consider MSRP a good price. If you think a competing van will perform better in your analysis on all aspects including price, then buy it. But make your decision on dollars, not the arbitrary name given to the dollar amount (MSRP, dealer invoice, etc).
How good a deal is not a today question - it will be a question answered in 3, 5, 7, 10... or however many years you keep the van before its demise via sale, crash, theft... A competitive today-price on a van that performs poorly in a crash, quality, resale, etc may cost you more in the long run.

mchwe · August 2001

anyone know where i can find specs on the 2002 odyssey? the honda website still describes 2001 model. i have heard that it will have side airbags and or head curtains.

i am also going through the odyssey vs ml 320 debate, but the loaded odyssey seems to be quite a bit cheaper.

thanks!

ojc · August 2001

Ordered an '02 thru a So Cal dealer about 2-3 hours from Los Angeles. MSRP is their rule, with no required add-ons. I did not ask about other options at cost, as the dealer in Davis, CA promises, so I will call them tomorrow. But a 2-3 hour's drive from LA to save the minimum $1500 over MSRP that LA dealers ask is worth it, and beats flying to AZ.

You LA dealers are a big ripoff!

ahha · August 2001

Which So. Cal dealer offered you MSRP?
Curious about the specs and color your ordered?

drew_ · August 2001

As someone who has been following all issues since 1997, I can tell you that in fact, the high sulphur fuel levels + the underground gas station tank liners + the design of the early fuel pumps were all contributors to the failures. Since the redesign and change (which occured starting in January 2000), there have been very few fuel pump failures that I've read or hear of. You'll find that people who do have the problems had an older fuel pump design. Here's the information from the inside. MB did a very lengthy analysis to come to the conclusion:
http://www.escribe.com/automotive/european/mbmc/m9000.html

People with fuel pump problems didn't have the vehicle suddenly stalling on them, but in fact they had problems with the vehicle starting up after leaving it overnight, for example. The problem also doesn't occur suddenly and out of the blue. There are always signs, such as the fuel gauge being very erratic and not going up to the full mark even with a full tank. When these signs were continuously ignored for months, the condition worsened as time progressed.

As for overall reliability, the '00 ML has improved to average (according to JD Powers), which is incidentally the similar to the Honda Odyssey and the Acura MDX.

drew_ · August 2001

You may be interested in these pictures of various wrecked MLs. After seeing the types of internal crash tests that MB conducts (about 30 different varieties), you too will quickly come to the conclusion that for overall safety (not just the publicised crash tests), the ML is probably one of the top vehicles out there:

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumIndex?u=137587&a=10126395&f=0

Here's also another interesting message. I particularly liked the part about the most expensive part of the vehicle being the one that you hope you'll never have to use. MB's sophisticated central crash sensor box is bought by Volvo for use in their vehicles. It's about $1600 compared to the $400+ of other vehicles.
http://www.escribe.com/automotive/european/mbmc/m15466.html

Town Hall's M-class discussion topic can be found here, if you're interested:
http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumList?u=137587

IMHO, the decision is fairly simple in that if you plan to transport more than 5 people very frequently, the minivan is the route to go. If you plan to have 2 extra people only occasionally, an SUV with a 3rd row may be a good choice, particularly if you want 4WD + stability control.

Good luck on whatever you decide on.

Drew
Host
Vans, SUVs, and Aftermarket & Accessories message boards

dave84 · August 2001

No explanation for your statement that Odyssey prices are artificially inflated?

jmurman42 · August 2001

How do you come up with the numbers that the Odyssey is LESS sought after than the Sienna? Where are Toyota's numbers published that they sell more Sienna's than the Odyssey?

As far as your numbers go, they are purely fictional dream land.

jmurman42 · August 2001

We had a customer that came into the dealership yesterday wanting to trade in their 99 Odyssey EX. They are at the end of their lease, with 30,000 miles on the car. The book value on this is 21,800! 2,000 more than their "payoff". They are trading in on a 2002 at a payment of only 20 more per month than the 1999. Not bad.

tag9 · August 2001

Try www.hondanews.com.

pmcmullen · August 2001

anyone know where i can find specs on the 2002 odyssey?

http://hondanews.com/Forms/honda/odyssey/index.html

arbabc · August 2001

My MSRP hangup on the Odyssey has more do with how much profit the Honda dealers make versus how much Honda makes. Honda obviously should increase their invoice price. I have no problem paying Honda more for a vehicle that truely deserves it.

arbabc · August 2001

You have made of your mind one way and no matter how I reason with you, you are going to stick to your guns. Well good for you. Go on believing what you do. And I'll go on believing what I believe. End of discussion.

Honda Odyssey 1999 - 2004

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