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Total Cost= $9,600
Had he worked a regular schedule, it would have never happened... As he was pulling out of the parking spot at work, next to a large truck, a person cutting through the parking lot at high-speed to avoid having to wait for the near by stoplight rammed into him. It totalled the car.
Funny part is, he had the tow-truck bring the car to the dealer, where he had the appointment. So when the mechanic came out to do the back window work, he had one heck of a big surprise... the front-end of the car was destroyed! Needless to say, he used that appointment to get a damage estimate instead.
The point is, it could have been much worse.
Glad your Prius is now ok.
JOHN
Meanwhile, I read the posts which are making me wonder if it's worth the wait:
-- People seem to be filling up around 7 gallons and averaging about 40 mpg. That equals a crummy cruising range of 280. Who likes having to stop at a gas station so often?
-- The car, already 5 grand more than a great ICE car ike the Corolla, seems to require replacing the tires--An additional $400 plus a trip to the shop.
-- Reports of warning lights coming on, sometimes siginifying a serious problem, other times signifying nothing.
-- Reports of the poorly sealed M5 in the differential, causing the car--occasionally--to lose power.
I am aware that most people posting on this forum are happy with their Prii, but taking the above in concert, I'm wondering if I shouldn't cancel the order and go for a Corolla or Matrix.
What are your takes on the subject?
Oh, and speaking of the tires, visiting Tire Rack, it seems that Michelin Hydroedge are the highest rated tires overall. Any reason, other than cost, that I shouldn't consider those to replace the OEMs?
> averaging about 40 mpg.
Last week it was -18F degrees here. So naturally some people will report low MPG. I personally got 39.1 MPG.
But back when it was warm, it was at 50 MPG. And that's without the car even having been broken in yet.
Clearly, you are getting sent a very misleading message due to the unfortunate timing.
> Reports of the poorly sealed M5 in the differential
There are nearly 8,000 members on the Yahoo group (hence the appeal here, being much smaller). Not a single one of those owners have reported the "M5 problem". It is turning out to be just a rare fluke. Sometime that could happen, but in reality doesn't for virtually everyone. In other words, the same as any other vehicle.
> Reports of warning lights coming on, sometimes siginifying
> a serious problem
Without any facts, that is nothing but a rumor. Can you be more specific? I certainly don't know to what you are referring.
There is a known "warning light" scenario for new owners. But that is simply excess sealant burning off in the exhaust system, exactly the opposite of serious: a non-issue. It finishes the burn and is gone forever.
JOHN
I do see her concern because of the (sometimes) impatient drivers on freeways when smaller vehicles (like the Prius) are attempting to merge. I'd appreciate comments from new Prius owners on your experience.
I test drove it and it looked ok. However, this was a weekend, traffic was light, no big SUV's trying to run me down, no kids in the back, and sans any grocery in the trunk!
Thanks,
Ramesh
> drivers on freeways when smaller vehicles (like the Prius)
> are attempting to merge.
First, note that some of the fastest vehicles on the road are "small cars". So size really is meaningless. Actually, so is HP doesn't mean a whole lot either. It's torque that you really desire. And Prius has loads of it.
Second, take a test-drive. Ignore what your ears and butt tell you. Just watch the speedometer. You'll be shocked at how much faster the 2004 Prius is than the HP leads you to believe.
Lastly, keep in mind that automatic transmissions take a performance hit when shifting from gear to gear. Since Prius doesn't have any gears at all, just a permanently engaged power-split device, it doesn't have that limitation. The acceleration curve is remarkably consistent.
JOHN
For the price I would say that Toyota should include most of the options as standard (seat adjustment, fog lights and DR Lights...).
> most of the options as standard
Lots of goodies come standard already. See:
• CVT (Continuously Variable Transmission)
• Automatic Climate-Control with Electric A/C
• Anti-Lock Brakes
• Traction-Control
• Cruise-Control
• Power & Heated mirrors
• Power windows
• Power door locks
• AM/FM/CD with 6 speakers
• Keyless-Entry remotes
• Cast Aluminum Alloy rims
• Tilt steering with audio/climate controls
• 60/40 Split-folding rear seat
• Multi-Display with trip computer
• Rear Defroster
• LED Brake Lights
That's quite a bit for a $19,995 base price for midsize car that offers very low emissions and fantastic efficiency.
JOHN
For the price I would say that Toyota should include most of the options as standard (seat adjustment, fog lights and DR Lights...).
I currently have a 00 Celica and trying to compare acceleration w/Prius. I have a 60 mile round trip commute each day, and considering the Prius for my next car.
With my tires pumped up to the maximum (for improved handling, better MPG, and longer tire life), I can accelerate from a dead stop to 60 MPH in just under 10 seconds.
In other words, it's faster than necessary. I haven't ever needed to accelerate that quickly.
JOHN
Ask yourself: how many times a day do you need to accelerate at full throttle from 0-60? For me, the average is a number far less than 1.
I assume a Prius that is using its electric motor about 50% of the time and ICE 50% would have less of a reduction in MPG say only 10%...do you have enough MPG numbers to give a % reduction in MPG at this time for the 04 Prius???
Thanks, Mike
I have a Celica 2000 GT auto. I test drove 2004 Prius twice already. Prius felt a little weaker but you won't be dissapointed. Prius had plenty of power and didn't feel weak like a Honda civic.
Well, I did it. I am now the proud owner of an '04 Prius Pkg 9. I was sure that a new Camry was my likely choice as the Corolla was a bit small and the Prius has a 4 month waiting list. So I strolled into a nearby dealership to look at Camrys. I spotted a Prius waiting to be picked up (Silver Pkg 7). A salesman asked if I was interested in a Prius. He said a customer cancelled an order due in next week and if I was seriously interested he would ask if he could sell it to me. I told him yes knowing how much of an opportunity this is. He called me 5 hrs later and said it just came off the truck and had to picked up today.
It is a Driftwood Pearl, Pkg 9. The factory snuck in glass breakage sensor, mats, cargo net and applique for an additional $448, for an MSRP of $26,202. Closed the deal at sundown so I'll pick up the car today. I'm really excited about getting this car!! I would like to ask you guys/girls a big favor. If you can share your advice on how to break in the car or other owner's tips I would greatly appreciate it. I want to do everything right and get the most from this car.
I'm going from an '84 Corvette to a Prius, so I'm sure I'll have a few adjustments to make.
I passed on the extended warranties (surprisingly offered at a generous discount this weekend only) and the premium care plan. What do you guys think of ext warranties/premium care? I plan to study the owner's manual thoroughly when I get it. Wish me luck!
Thank you in advance
Rich
Welcome. I have found this board to be the most informative of any that I have subscribed to. In fact, I bought my Prius largely because of information I have gotten here (metallic blue with package #9.
My only irritation with Toyota about this car is their "glitzy" way of naming the colors. Why not just metallic blue, metallic green, black, white, etc. ?
Sorry got off the subject I am posting...which is this suggestion for you. Go to this site: http://john1701a.com/ and download the Toyota Prius User-Guide. I found it extremely helpful as all the information in it has been provided by Prius owners.
The site as a whole is quite interesting. John1701 keeps it updated and I go into on a regular basis. John is also a regular contributor to this thread and an example of the type of people we have here. Information about the Prius and answer questions...no fussing and fighting (thanks to Sylvia).
I really enjoy my Prius and know that you will too.
Stan
Because if car companies called paint colors "white", "black", "red" etc. the marketing people who think up those exotic names like "Tideland Pearl" wouldn't be earning their salaries! I guess it's also recognition that people often buy cars for emotional reasons. Besides, I kind of like the fact that my low-buck Elantra is "Champagne" instead of "tan". :-)
Rich
I certainly would like to know about the salesman calling you up about an specific production date. The production cycle for the 05 models would most likely start in July or August.
Toyota dealers need to learn how to treat customers other wise they will loose dedicated and loyal customers...myself included.
Mike
I've got 300 mi on my Prius now. According to the consumption graph I'm averaging 47.7 mpg! Temp is around 62 deg F (SF Bay Area). I'll know exactly when I fill up. I'm showing 4 bars left, how much farther should I go prior to refilling? How much can I expect at warmer temps? How about when the engine is broken in a little more? I has plenty of power for twisty, coastal Hwy 1 and freeway travel. MY WIFE LIKES IT!!! Thanks in advance to all.
Rich
Here's the chart that some owners have adopted based on Multi-Display distance shown on the Consumption Screen, indicating the farthest to expect before refilling:
40 MPG = 360 miles
41 MPG = 369 miles
42 MPG = 378 miles
43 MPG = 387 miles
44 MPG = 396 miles
45 MPG = 405 miles
46 MPG = 414 miles
47 MPG = 423 miles
48 MPG = 432 miles
49 MPG = 441 miles
50 MPG = 450 miles
51 MPG = 459 miles
52 MPG = 468 miles
53 MPG = 477 miles
54 MPG = 486 miles
55 MPG = 495 miles
It gives you an idea what's realistic for distance based on the 9 gallon non-emergency capacity available.
There's still gas remaining beyond that, but with the bladder inside the tank (to significantly reduce evaporative emissions) measuring the capacity is difficult.
JOHN
Indirectly, over time, dealers who abuse their customers get lower CSI ratings, and this in turn is a lever that the car maker can use to reduce allocations [the ultimate punishment] or even pull a franchise in extreme cases. Generally, though, dealers are free in this country to do whatever they want with price...period.
This sword cuts both ways - with cars in heavy supply and weak demand, discounting is common, and no buyer has ever complained about paying UNDER MSRP for a new car. Occasionally, one model gets hot, as the Prius is now for Toyota, and the rule of the marketplace is everybody for themselves. At various times in the past 20 years, we've seen this phenomenon come and go for models as varied as the Viper, PT Cruiser, Miata, new T-Bird, certain BMWs [usually M-models], and others. In almost every case, supply eventually catches up with demand, and the discounting begins {Ford has had a hard time giving away T-Birds lately; PT Cruisers carry rebates. Both of these cars were commanding prices over MSRP for months after their initial release - in the case of the T-Bird, some of those early cars traded at $10k or more over MSRP.]
The Prius is a special case in that it is unlikely production of this specific model is going to significantly increase any time soon - Toyota is committing production and engineering resources on hybrid versions of the RX, Highlander, and eventually the Camry. If you absolutely have to have a Prius, then you have to be patient and determined, as evidenced by all of the stories that have appeared on this board.....just don't hold your breath for Toyota to go after dealers on the price issue - they are constrained by the law from interfering in most cases. Your only defense is not to buy from dealers who take advantage of these kinds of supply/demand problems...blaming Toyota [or any other car maker] is a waste of time. There simply isn't any legal basis for them to intervene.
> production of this specific model is going to significantly
> increase any time soon - Toyota is committing production
> and engineering resources on hybrid versions of the RX,
> Highlander, and eventually the Camry.
How can you come to that conclusion?
A purpose (among many) of automakers is to make money. Ignoring a hot product like Prius would be self-defeating. From engineering to training is complete. All they have to do is order more parts from suppliers so they can make more. Everyone wins at this point by increasing production... even the other hybrids, since the endorsement for them takes very little effort with Prius carrying a such strong momentum.
JOHN
Elaine
Thanks,
Andrew
I bet the median age is 50 or so. It's about 42 for Corolla, but Prius costs more and would tend to have wealthier buyers.
-juice
I may be wrong - nothing would please me more. Another point is that there is, as you know, considerable disagreement in the industry as to whether the Prius is actually making any money for Toyota, or is a massively successful marketing device to help sell all of their future hybrid models. No one outside of the corporate suite probably knows for sure, but I'm not sure it is in Toyota's best interest to make an investment to ramp up production of the Prius in the short term to meet this initial demand, and then have to scale it back again when the market focuses on other hybrid models.
I'm not looking for an argument here - my main point is that pricing in the USA is a dealer-driven issue, not a manufacturer-driven one. Toyota could indeed solve the market-pricing issue by dramatically increasing the number of cars for sale, but I just doubt that is what is going to happen.
Pressing one of the speed buttons for the fan invokes the manual mode.
Then you'll get a flow of air at the specified temperature continuously.
The catch is, it won't stop when the cabin temperature reaches the specified value.
JOHN
It said, "Your car knows who you are"
Maybe it also "Knows where you live?"
In addition, the battery technolgy is NIMH...but the newer battery technology is Li-Poly? Any comments or ideas?
Mike
> upgrade capability??
Yes, it can be upgraded. In fact, there is a SSC (Special Service Campaign) currently for those that got early 2004's so dealers can do exactly that.
> but the newer battery technology is Li-Poly?
Not only can you do that, you can also connect battery-packs in tandem. I know of 2 owners that have already done that. One was with just another NiMH battery-pack, another was a Lead-Acid. They now both get even more impressive city MPG.
Also, a few schools have went even further. Since the system is electric based, rather than using technology from back in the 20th, it makes a fantastic prototype platform.
JOHN
I agree completely. I guess it proves that the older you get, the wiser you get, e.g., you know that it really doesn't matter if your car has 300 hp, can go 0-60 in under 7 seconds, and can top 140 mph.
But perhaps I'm going further off-topic here... sorry.
Thanks Yachtie
> does anyone know if Prius will have software or > computer upgrade capability??
> Yes, it can be upgraded. In fact, there is a
> SSC (Special Service Campaign) currently for
> those that got early 2004's so dealers can do
> exactly that.
John, what is the SSC for? My 04 Prius was delivered in early December. I have not gotten any call about this SSC. If the new software could direct the electric motor to work more often in colder temperature, it might get better MPG. The electric motor seldomly works alone in colder temperature but more often when it's warmer outside as I observed from the screen.
On Jan 29 when it was -13F in Minneapolis, I simulated EPA city test by driving 11 miles with 23 stops on flat roads in 31 minutes. All the accessories were turned off so I had to wear a thick coat to keep myself warm (filled with dawn, not heavy in weight). The result was 35.8MPG. You wrote you got 39MPG when it was -18F. I figure you must be driving a longer distance with fewer stops.
Bad alignment will cause that too.
Crosswinds at the moderate level have not been an issue at all for me. The windy season (Spring) hasn't begun yet, so I'm uncertain about the extreme level. But with a car so heavily optimized for forward aero-dynamics, you could likely feel wind from the side similar to a larger volume vehicle like a minivan.
With my classic Prius, crosswinds were odd. You could feel them sliding across the vehicle surface. But it was too slippery for the wind to get a good grab. So it didn't affect driving.
JOHN