Was that the guy that bought the beater 3000GT or Stealth or something?
Yeah, something like that, it truly was a classic case of someone making an [non-permissible content removed] of themself the way he defended it, LMAO. I wish I didn't miss the post that was deleted.
yes, we have chosen the terraza. price, warranty, and previous gm experiences are what brings us to the terraza. we would rather have an enclave or acadia, but they are priced too high for us. we can get a loaded terraza for thousands, if not $10,000, less. our 02 venture at 80k miles, has been excellent, with only the only repair being the ac, replaced by gm, well outside of warranty. crash ratings are 5 star, production was from 2005-2007 (3 years), and it is fwd, not awd (discontinued in 2006), with a proven 3.9 v6. resale isn't as important, as we will keep it for a long time.
thanks for the advice so far. i'm thinking of waiting for the next round of incentives, after the gm red tag event expires january 1. would incentives generally increase in january 2008, for a 2007 discontinued buick, versus 1.9% for 72 months or $2000 rebate right now? i suppose the incentive could worsen, but i wouldn't think so.
so after we agree on a price, just have the dealer fax and we sign the deal as a contract? where should i start on a counter offer? msrp is $33,489, invoice is, $31,158, and tmv is $31,025. the dealer's initial offer was $31,530. what do i do next? thanks again everyone.
I didn't see need in your definition of investment.
Thought that was implied by the message.
But if you are talking need then you don't need a car to make more money
No I don't need a car but for me to make the money I am making I would either need to take public transportation which is time prohibited or take a taxi which would cost me more than owning a car (either that or don't make as much). So it is an investment simply because of the costs involved in not having a car is by far greater.
You could "invest" in those subway tokens
The subway is even further from me than my work.
or other public transportation
That would be time and distance prohibitive as the nearest place I could get public transportation is a mile from where I live drops me off almost a mile from work and would take me over 3 hours to take.
or live closer to work
Cost prohibitive as I would be spending tens of thousands just to do that and I would be losing out on some benefits of where I live.
If you admit buying cars into your definition of investment then just about anything else fits the category and must be included as well.
I would have to disagree with you on that one. My basic use of the term investment means that the outlay of cash to get that "investment" is less than the cost of doing without. In this case the cost of owning a car is less than the cost of doing without, therefore it is an investment.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I am not playing with semantics. A car is a good investment for most people simply because it allows them to do what they are doing for less.
Tell me if you do something that costs you $100 a day to do and you can buy something for $20,000 and sell it 5 years later for $5,000 that would eliminate that $100 a day is it a good investment? Yes it is.
A long time ago in a galaxy far far away I worked in a store. About every other day we had some guy come up in a taxi to buy something (according to the taxi driver this guy spent over $400 a month in taxi fees). This guy would have been better off buying an inexpensive used car and driving it back and forth himself. Oh course that presuming he was capable of driving, but you get my point.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
"A car is a good investment for most people simply because it allows them to do what they are doing for less."
And then there is a 50 MPG+ scooter, if it don't snow, and you don't mind getting wet. ;-) You can even find older low mileage cars driven by older people for almost nothing. Sure, they may drink gas, but the license is cheap and you can get by with only liability insurance to offset that. Crash it? Go get another.
I bought a $50,000 Lexus LS400 in 96 or 97 for $15k with 48k miles. Probably could have bought a Buick for less than half that, but this is what showed up. (Didn't want a Buick anyway.) Today it is still below 60k and it still drives like new with decent gas mileage. My insurance cost is low and my license costs $38 per year. We use my wifes 03 Avalon 95% of the time and I drive my 79 Cutlass from time to time. I could probably put collector plates on it for a low one time fee too.
I could have purchased a new Malibu for the same price as the Lexus, but it is nowhere near the car, and license and insurance would have been multiples of the Lexus on a new car. Others would not have considered it, but to me, it was a no brainer. The hit was already taken. And, it is still an upscale experience compared to the Avalon. Snow? That's another story, but it never moves in winter, and it shows. I think an older couple had it since new, and doubt they drove it in winter either. There is no indication that they did.
I recently got picked up. Couldn't understand why the highway patrol was stopping me, but figured it was the smoke colored license plate covers. Nope. "Did you know that your tabs were expired?" You're shittin me. "Nope, in fact they expired over two years ago." We had been driving it all that time without them. The cop felt bad as he knew it wasn't intentional, but had to write me up as it was over six months. He suggested I go to to court and explain to the judge. He did mention the license plate covers when he came back from his car. I said 'I knew you were gonna get around to that. But I suppose you didn't notice that Harley with straight pipes go by.' He just laughed and said he really didn't care if I took them off, but he had to mention it. He was a nice guy and had a sense of humor. Always say things like that with a smile on your face though. :-)
Anyway, the fine was like $120, so I figured I had nothing to lose by going to court. I was the minority there. The courtroom was full of foreigners who couldn't speak English, so they had 7 or 8 translators there, on our nickel, I'm sure, and our population is under 100k with a high percent professionals. I expect most were illegals, but of course no one asked, just gave em a small fine and turned em loose.
The judge asked them all for their story, then reduced their fine. So, now I'm up, and I wait for her to ask for my story. She said how do you plea. What am I gonna say, so I say like the rest of them. Guilty. "50 bucks". I figured that was cheap, so said nothing and paid. Makes ya feel quite stoopid, it does. We never saw a renewal notice though, so you just don't think about it.
So, now I've had the car about ten years. I expect I could still get about $8k out of it. Not bad. Damn, the garage stove is still on again. Luckily, my wife is in bed, he he. Better go finish up.
My mother's Buick LeSabre has a switch on the dash that turns everything from English to Metric. And it's makde in Toronto. Just something to think about
The judge asked them all for their story, then reduced their fine. So, now I'm up, and I wait for her to ask for my story. She said how do you plea. What am I gonna say, so I say like the rest of them. Guilty. "50 bucks". I figured that was cheap, so said nothing and paid. Makes ya feel quite stoopid, it does. We never saw a renewal notice though, so you just don't think about it.
What I find FAR more objectionable is the way many judges brush off traffic violations for the affluent.
I had a driver with FOUR speeding tickets in SIX months. A quick sob story and he fines the driver $100 for ONE ticket and wipes away the rest. What does THAT do for puclic safety?
My mother's Buick LeSabre has a switch on the dash that turns everything from English to Metric. And it's made in Toronto. Just something to think about
Wow! How revolutionary, a base-10 system of measure. The next thing you know, we will have 10 fingers and 10 toes.
I;m new to the discussion, but will be happy to answer questions-I have been in the car business for 20 years and can tell you what you need to ask your dealer
Welcome to the Forums, snapper2! You'll find yourself in good company around contribute to the Stories from the Sales Frontlines discussion, or you'll be flogged
MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name. 2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h) Review your vehicle
I am a femaley woman who is a sales manager in both a Ford and Nissan dealership!!! I actually wear 2 hats-I am also the finance director!!! And award winning is our middle name we are frequent winners of the president's award
You sound like quite the woman. Being femaley I would have guess you are attractive. It's always nice to envision a beautiful woman on these boards... :shades:
What I find FAR more objectionable is the way many judges brush off traffic violations for the affluent
Hey the judge can't help it if they belong to the same country club. Certainly that has to come with some priviliges. The $50K country club membership that is.
I'm only playing Joel you are the best F&I manager in the world who can get anyone bought
Sick, lame, lazy, or 8 ball crazy. Bring me a utility bill a current pay stub showing $1600 a month, a $1000 down payment and a 450 plus credit score and you ride TODAY!!!
LOL, I get my fair share bought but don't always deliver them. They either give me info they can't verify, can't afford the payment, or on the rare occasion don't like the car they qualify for.
It all depends on how they are set up. If I take the app and do the qualifying my odds go way up. Not that I am bragging on my ability its just that I ask the hard questions that some times sales people will shy away from because they are afraid of the answer. I also have the advantage because I know by looking that they will qualify for a used Taurus, not a new Expedition.
What... is the air-speed ... of an unladen swallow?
That depends on the size of the dealer's incentives and on how badly the swallow needs a new vehicle. However, I don't regard growing wings as a practical or reasonable tip for getting the best deal. :P
LoL! I believe you should consult Monty Python as I understand he's the leading authority on such matters having taken an interest in swallows during his quest for the Holy Grail.
Comments
-moo
Just kickin it back over the fence.
I caught it
Yeah, something like that, it truly was a classic case of someone making an [non-permissible content removed] of themself the way he defended it, LMAO. I wish I didn't miss the post that was deleted.
so after we agree on a price, just have the dealer fax and we sign the deal as a contract? where should i start on a counter offer? msrp is $33,489, invoice is, $31,158, and tmv is $31,025. the dealer's initial offer was $31,530. what do i do next? thanks again everyone.
IMHO, the most one should pay for such a unit is invoice less holdback and rebate.
Thought that was implied by the message.
But if you are talking need then you don't need a car to make more money
No I don't need a car but for me to make the money I am making I would either need to take public transportation which is time prohibited or take a taxi which would cost me more than owning a car (either that or don't make as much). So it is an investment simply because of the costs involved in not having a car is by far greater.
You could "invest" in those subway tokens
The subway is even further from me than my work.
or other public transportation
That would be time and distance prohibitive as the nearest place I could get public transportation is a mile from where I live drops me off almost a mile from work and would take me over 3 hours to take.
or live closer to work
Cost prohibitive as I would be spending tens of thousands just to do that and I would be losing out on some benefits of where I live.
If you admit buying cars into your definition of investment then just about anything else fits the category and must be included as well.
I would have to disagree with you on that one. My basic use of the term investment means that the outlay of cash to get that "investment" is less than the cost of doing without. In this case the cost of owning a car is less than the cost of doing without, therefore it is an investment.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Tell me if you do something that costs you $100 a day to do and you can buy something for $20,000 and sell it 5 years later for $5,000 that would eliminate that $100 a day is it a good investment? Yes it is.
A long time ago in a galaxy far far away I worked in a store. About every other day we had some guy come up in a taxi to buy something (according to the taxi driver this guy spent over $400 a month in taxi fees). This guy would have been better off buying an inexpensive used car and driving it back and forth himself. Oh course that presuming he was capable of driving, but you get my point.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
And then there is a 50 MPG+ scooter, if it don't snow, and you don't mind getting wet. ;-) You can even find older low mileage cars driven by older people for almost nothing. Sure, they may drink gas, but the license is cheap and you can get by with only liability insurance to offset that. Crash it? Go get another.
I bought a $50,000 Lexus LS400 in 96 or 97 for $15k with 48k miles. Probably could have bought a Buick for less than half that, but this is what showed up. (Didn't want a Buick anyway.) Today it is still below 60k and it still drives like new with decent gas mileage. My insurance cost is low and my license costs $38 per year. We use my wifes 03 Avalon 95% of the time and I drive my 79 Cutlass from time to time. I could probably put collector plates on it for a low one time fee too.
I could have purchased a new Malibu for the same price as the Lexus, but it is nowhere near the car, and license and insurance would have been multiples of the Lexus on a new car. Others would not have considered it, but to me, it was a no brainer. The hit was already taken. And, it is still an upscale experience compared to the Avalon. Snow? That's another story, but it never moves in winter, and it shows. I think an older couple had it since new, and doubt they drove it in winter either. There is no indication that they did.
I recently got picked up. Couldn't understand why the highway patrol was stopping me, but figured it was the smoke colored license plate covers. Nope. "Did you know that your tabs were expired?" You're shittin me. "Nope, in fact they expired over two years ago." We had been driving it all that time without them. The cop felt bad as he knew it wasn't intentional, but had to write me up as it was over six months. He suggested I go to to court and explain to the judge. He did mention the license plate covers when he came back from his car. I said 'I knew you were gonna get around to that. But I suppose you didn't notice that Harley with straight pipes go by.' He just laughed and said he really didn't care if I took them off, but he had to mention it. He was a nice guy and had a sense of humor. Always say things like that with a smile on your face though. :-)
Anyway, the fine was like $120, so I figured I had nothing to lose by going to court. I was the minority there. The courtroom was full of foreigners who couldn't speak English, so they had 7 or 8 translators there, on our nickel, I'm sure, and our population is under 100k with a high percent professionals. I expect most were illegals, but of course no one asked, just gave em a small fine and turned em loose.
The judge asked them all for their story, then reduced their fine. So, now I'm up, and I wait for her to ask for my story. She said how do you plea. What am I gonna say, so I say like the rest of them. Guilty. "50 bucks". I figured that was cheap, so said nothing and paid. Makes ya feel quite stoopid, it does. We never saw a renewal notice though, so you just don't think about it.
So, now I've had the car about ten years. I expect I could still get about $8k out of it. Not bad. Damn, the garage stove is still on again. Luckily, my wife is in bed,
he he. Better go finish up.
The story is accurate, and it's part of it.
It may be part of the story but that story has nothing to do with (car) buying tips and how to get the best deal. Let's stick to the topic at hand.
Thanks.
tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper
What I find FAR more objectionable is the way many judges brush off traffic violations for the affluent.
I had a driver with FOUR speeding tickets in SIX months. A quick sob story and he fines the driver $100 for ONE ticket and wipes away the rest. What does THAT do for puclic safety?
Wow! How revolutionary, a base-10 system of measure. The next thing you know, we will have 10 fingers and 10 toes.
Come on what flavor do you sell?
Are you a Manly Man who sells domestics (preferably of the Ford variety) or one of those wimpish import sellers?
MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR
Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h)
Review your vehicle
Joel,
You had a typo I figured I would help you say what you were trying to type was...
Are you working for those award winning import dealers? :surprise:
I can understand not being used to hearing or using words like award winning :shades:
GP
-moo
One for the good guys.... Harde, har, har harrrr :P
I'm only playing Joel you are the best F&I manager in the world who can get anyone bought
Oh I forgot the Pats really did win and I don't have end any of my posts about how great you are yet...
Only 4 more games to go 16-0... Than I can read Jmonroe and Joel state that I am one of the wisest and all knowing of Nissan ( we will keep it real )
GP
Moo How is it going over at Porsche any more 4 pounders?
You sound like quite the woman. Being femaley I would have guess you are attractive. It's always nice to envision a beautiful woman on these boards... :shades:
Along with Kristie of course...
GP
Hey the judge can't help it if they belong to the same country club. Certainly that has to come with some priviliges. The $50K country club membership that is.
Stroking a stroker?
How about a 16 lber!!!!! Turbo Cabriolets rule!
Biggest deal and commission ever for me. I don't know what the back is yet though.
-moo
I wasn't talking about the facts. I was talking about your assumptions and generalizations. Those don't belong here.
Correct me if I am wrong but that sounds like a $3200 commision?
GP
But wait.... There's more?
Gotta love it!
-moo
-moo
And the customer was probably just as excited as you were
Must be nice selling those high lines
GP
Sick, lame, lazy, or 8 ball crazy. Bring me a utility bill a current pay stub showing $1600 a month, a $1000 down payment and a 450 plus credit score and you ride TODAY!!!
LOL, I get my fair share bought but don't always deliver them. They either give me info they can't verify, can't afford the payment, or on the rare occasion don't like the car they qualify for.
It all depends on how they are set up. If I take the app and do the qualifying my odds go way up. Not that I am bragging on my ability its just that I ask the hard questions that some times sales people will shy away from because they are afraid of the answer. I also have the advantage because I know by looking that they will qualify for a used Taurus, not a new Expedition.
-moo
Good. What... is the air-speed velocity of an unladen swallow?
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
That depends on the size of the dealer's incentives and on how badly the swallow needs a new vehicle. However, I don't regard growing wings as a practical or reasonable tip for getting the best deal. :P
tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper
Nelson
-moo
LoL! I believe you should consult Monty Python as I understand he's the leading authority on such matters having taken an interest in swallows during his quest for the Holy Grail.
Maybe we should take this to Off Topic Chatter? OTC - Discussion Suggestions
tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper