I have had minor issues with my NOX. First was the strut noise, the correction was the replacement of both front strut mounts. Even though now I am back and forth with the dealer because the alignment is off. Second, I kept hearing a humming noise from the rear when I would ,make a shart left or right turn this is due to a deffective rear differential. I have been waiting 1 week so far and no update. I use my NOX back a forth to work since Arpil 04, and I am at 11200 mile, Yikes! I am thinking of trading it in, but I will wait to see if the repair od the differential changes my mind.. Over all I have not heard any huge issues like my differential problem form any one. Will appreciate any info anyone may have.
BELIEVE IT OR NOT, THE DEAD ANIMAL SMELL IS GETTING LESS. SOME TIMES I DONT EVEN SMELL IT. DEALER DID NOT CHANGE COOLANT. IT IS A DARK RED. HAD IT TESTED GOOD TO 32 BELOW. HAVE 3200 MILES. WILL HAVE DEALER CHECK IT AGAIN AT NEXT OIL CHANGE. I HAVE A SOUP TO NUTS WARRANTY TILL 75,000 MILES. IM GOING BY WHAT HE SAID CHEVY TOLD HIM, THAT IT IS IT COOLING SYSTEM SEALANT TABLETS THAT GM LOVES TO PUT IN AT THE FACTORY. ANYONE ELSE HEARD THAT.
pa53---please turn your CAPS LOCK off. This is considered SHOUTING on message boards and most people will skip over your post and not respond for this reason.
pa53-- Thank you for your comments. I did observe an odor reduction after the first coolant change, but the odor is back and very strong barely a week after the second change. Whatever it is, it does not give up easily. The dealer also told me that my first Equinox does not smell anymore after sitting in their parking lot for around 3 months (that was the time it took for the replacement). However, my second Equinox smells really bad. Will it improve? Who knows......
Just as a side note, Mr_shiftright has made a good point on the use of CAPS LOCK. However, I did not feel offended by the uppercase text and really appreciated your comments.
we purchased an LT in June. now have about 3000 miles. gas mileage has been nowhere near rating. in town is in similar range to your exp. on the highway, we're getting 20-22. have yet to bring it to dealer's attention.
clothes hooks, one on each side, are behind the rear doors. you have to open the tail gate to find/use them. awful, just awful placement. makes you wonder what they were thinking?
How many of your front seat passengers have reflexively reached up to grab the hand grip - only to discover there is none? Has anyone taken matters into their own "hands"? [sorry]
i don't have an Equinox, but thought i would comment.
if the coolant was replaced, and then turned dirty and smelly again, does that mean the as it passes through the radiator or the engine it is fouling up?
what could be going on inside those parts to make such a bad smell?
I think you asked the (multi) million dollar question GM is trying to answer. I initially thought the vehicle received a bad batch of coolant, perhaps contaminated with bacteria.
The dealer followed GM's temporary corrective action and did a 2-stage flush and coolant fluid replacement. The odor improved for around one day, and then started to deteriorate. One day more and I noticed a sizable number of black particles floating on the fluid.
The dealer then did a second flush and fluid replacement (this was last Friday, the 8th). The odor subsided slightly and started to get strong on Wednesday. On that day, I left the vehicle in the garage and when I returned one hour later I thought there was a dead animal in the garage.
Today I removed the cap of the plastic compartment and noticed that, besides the terrible smell of rotten fish, there were various black particles (gelly like) floating again on the fluid. However, today I also noticed the presence of white particles floating on the fluid. The white particles are shaped like small scales (or flakes). The dealer indicated they saw the white particles the first they replaced the fluid.
Going back to your question. I am a chemist and this mystery is really interesting. As I said, the odor reminds me of rotten fish. Therefore, there must be a source of nitrogen and sulfur somewhere in the engine (hoses? gaskets? pump?). As I mentioned above, I thought the vehicle received a bad batch of coolant, but this can not hold true after the two fluid changes.
In short, there must be some chemical (or biological) interaction happening between the engine (and its components, like hoses and gaskets) and the coolant fluid. Something is breaking down and giving off the volatile components of this odor.
The dealer also mentioned that GM uses just one grade of coolant on all of their vehicles. And the Equinox seems to be the only vehicle from their lineup presenting this problem.
Hi michigan99, First sorry about the caps. Now has anybody tried to find out what the difference between this 3.4 and other 3.4s. What are they using thats different in this engine than say the grand am. That could be the key.
I'd suspect combustion gases getting into the coolant passages. Would have to be a bad head gasket seal or a crack/porosity in the block or head. I believe these vehicles have a Chinese built engine so anything is possible. Can't believe the one that was bought back by GM is still sitting on the lot, would have thought it would have been rushed to a disassembly shop for inspection.
Hi tommc: The Equinox does use a chinese engine, but according to GM's website the engines are built according to procedures and processes determined by GM. I read something on where the engines are made, but I am not sure whether they use a joint-venture plant (or toll manufacturer) to make the engines or it is a fully-owned GM plant.
Your comments on the combustion gases and how they could get to the coolant fluid make sense to me. The odor takes some time to build up, so it is reasonable to consider that a small gas leak could contaminate the coolant and progressively turns the coolant into something really smelly. The contaminant must have some sort of sulfur compound, as the odor is very characteristic.
The last part of your comments is something that also amazes me. When the dealer stated that they were unable to fix the odor problem and the whole vehicle would be replaced (and all this happened very quickly), I basically thought two things:
1. They found something really bad and wanted the vehicle out of the streets very quickly. [And, obviously, did not tell me the whole story, which was hard to believe considering the high professionalism of the dealership]. I thought this possiblity to be possbile but very unlikely.
or.
2. They did not know what it was and, because they were dealing with a new model, GM wanted to take the car apart to investigate the unusual problem.
After realizing that the vehicle sat in the parking lot for three months and nothing was done, and also learning that GM became aware of the problem around mid-September and is now trying to figure it out, the only conclusion in this case is that this was sheer incompetence.
How is it possbile that GM designs a great vehicle like the Equinox and does nor react to such problems very quickly?
Hi tommc: I gave more thought to your comments on combustion gases getting into the coolant, and they definitely would explain many of the things that happened to my car:
1. The problem is gradual. I received a brand new vehicle and it did not smell. After 400 miles there was a slight odor. At 1000 miles the odor was very strong. A leak would explain how the concentration of contaminants could increase slowly over time.
2. The dealer changed the coolant fluid twice and the odor always came back. The odor did improve right after the fluid being replaced, but it deteriorated after a couple of days. A continuous leak could explain how the problem could come back (apparently from nowhere).
3. From the chemical point of view (by the way, I am a chemist), a leak of combustion gases into the coolant would explain much of the nature of the smell. We can not forget that, if this leak is responsible for the problem, this is happening BEFORE the catalytic converter. Or, in other words, fairly reactive by-products of the gasoline combustion process would have the opportunity to meet different chemicals present in the coolant before being chemically reduced/oxidized/neutralized by the converter. Gasoline contains a very small amount of sulfur, and those reactive sulfurated chemical species could easily react with nitrogen-containing products (for instance, ammonium quaternaries sometimes used as corrosion inhibitors) and form very smelly substances. The coolant of my car smells like rotten fish!
4. A leak could also explain why the cars are apparently presenting the problem with various degrees of severity, ranging from nothing to very bad.
5. The dealer noticed the presence of white flakes in the coolant. I also noticed the same material after the second coolant change. The flakes could be a product of chemical reaction between combustion gases (SOx, NOx, CO2, CO and other) and the chemicals from the coolant and sealant. Perhaps they may contain a sizable amount of carbonates and sulfates. I know GM got samples of this weird material extracted from my car and I am sure they are analyzing its chemical nature.
If a leak is really the root cause of this problem, GM will have a pretty tough situation to handle. It could be caused by a defective/substandard seal or gasket, which is bad enough, as the corrective action will not be simple. Or, even worse, it can be a design flaw. Either way, this is not looking good.
Quote--"The dealer also mentioned that GM uses just one grade of coolant on all of their vehicles. And the Equinox seems to be the only vehicle from their lineup presenting this problem. "
OK, the Pontiac Vibe isn't a Chevy, but read Problem and Solution discussion board. Same problem, and it started as an '04 model. I'm not 100% on it, but I think the Vibe/Matrix uses a Chinese made engine also. Coincidence?
I can't find any review that speaks to the engine's origins. But since it's made by Toyota, I'm skeptical they would sub it out to China. NUMMI is more a joint venture between GM and Toyota, less a world venture. Several automotive journal articles I've read mention the Equinox as the first GM car to use the Chinese engine in North America.
After reading a number of posts from the Vibe forum, I believe they are referring to a different smell altogether. They appear to be having an issue with the all to common "rotten egg" smell caused by the catalytic converter doing it's emissions job with the unburned by-products from fuel. It’s very common, especially with many new cars. It's not related to the coolant.
I to have the same problems. I have a massive leak coming from the front that soaked the whole front passenger side. Struts changed earlier, waiting for read differential to be repaired hatch piston has broken 3 times. they now have my car for over 3 weeks
When I started having problems with my Equinox I thought the odor would be coming from the tail pipe. I did some checking and found that the exhaust fumes coming from the tail pipe did not have the bad odor I felt when the car was idling.
I left the engine running and walked around the car, and the bad odor started around the driver's door, and got really worse close to the hood area.
The situation with the Equinox can not be related to the catalytic converter, as the coolant deterioration (caused by contamination?) is obviously happening before the combustion gases reach the converter.
Has anybody else heard anything from GM on this bad odor problem?
Michigan, Oh I agree completely that the Nox odor is coming from the coolant. Mine stinks too - it's just not noticable with the cap on the expansion tank. I was just saying that after reading the Vibe posts it appears to me that they are not talking about the same thing.
I read the posts on the Vibe and I agree with you. The problems reported there seem different from the ones presented by the Equinox.
The rotten egg odor from the tail pipe is pretty common, but the situation with the Equinox seems to be a different animal (or, perhaps, a dead animal I should say).
I do not know how many Equinoxes will turn really bad, but I can not believe I had the bad luck to have the first vehicle replaced (because of the odor problem) and the second presenting the same problem.
This is what I call bad luck! (Or, GM may have a really large problem to handle).
I am currently going over the process of a second vehicle repurchase with GM. However, I will not be happy to turn my Equinox in because I like the vehicle very much! Excluding the foul odor, my Equinox has been operating without any problems. As I will return the vehicle to GM very soon (hopefully), I have been trying to find another car to buy. It has not been an easy task, as I use the Equinox as my yardstick and other vehicles do not even compare.
(the foul odor problem) to GM or is everyone just depending on their dealers to do it? I would hope that everyone's been sending letters and making calls to GM to ensure they are working on a solution.
I've been poking around for some time now trying to figure out what my next car was gonna be and after deciding that the Mazda3 was too weak im now planning on either the Chevy HHR or Nox.
I just hope that by the time the HHR comes out that the problem with the Nox is solved.
The issue with the Vibe/Matrix is totally unrelated. His an issue that Toyota also continues to have the with Corolla which is what the Vibe/Matrix really are.
I sent an email to GM-Canada (where the Equinox is made) and received a reply stating that because I was an US-resident I should contact GM in the US. Very helpful, don't you think?
Then I sent a note to GM-US and also got a reply stating that someone was already working on my case. The person they mentioned is the same one who handled the first vehicle repurchase. I do not know if the same person is handling the second case.
In short, I called the dealership today and they have not received any update on how to handle or fix this problem.
I will also be sending an email to ConsumerReports later today.
My personal suggestion to you after having two bad Equinoxes in a row (with the same problem) is to avoid buying an Equinox until this problem is identified and resolved.
The Equinox is a very impressive vehicle and different people asked me quesions on it. Some were even considering the idea of buying one. They changed their minds after learning about my 6-month struggle to get a functional car. I truly hope GM can solve this problem, as I am not going to buy a third Equinox at this point, but I would definitely buy another one in the future.
I just spent some time looking through the other posts on this board, and haven't seen anything like my experience. If anyone has experienced similar frustrations, please let me know!
I purchased my 'nox Aug. 31st. Everything was great w/it till last Thursday. On my way to work, my spedometer bottomed out, several "dummy" lights came on, and my steering got super tight. I had 'nox towed to the nearest Chevy dealership, and they had it for 2 days trying to figure out what happened. It acted up for them too. End result...they reset the computer, 'cause they couldn't figure it out.
I got the 'nox back Friday evening, and over the long weekend, didn't drive it. Went to work on Tues., it was fine. It wasn't until I had a carload of groceries later that evening that it did the same thing AGAIN...except this time, when I attempted to accellerate after stopping at a light, it felt & sounded like it was trying to go, but really wasn't moving.
Fortunately, the dealership was only a few miles up the road. One of the service guys came to me, and brought me a loaner (I explained that due to rush hour traffic, I didn't feel safe trying to drive it there myself).
They had the car all week, and finally determined that it was the speed sensor in the computer that was screwed up. They overnighted the part, and I'm getting ready to pick up the 'nox now.
Has anyone heard of this kind of craziness? I really do love this vehicle, and don't want to get rid of it...but I bought it assuming that a new car would be more reliable than what I was driving before! I'm just hoping it doesn't happen again...the weather is starting to get colder, and I really don't want to get stranded in the snow, or have to take another day off of work for a vehicle that is brand spankin' new!
Nice article on the China origins of the Equinox engine. GM is going to be building a whole lot more there too.
After reading these posts, I saw that the Equinox that we have (We are a GM supplier) was out front, and I went outside and popped the hood. I opened the overflow tank and damn if it didnt smell like road kill! The coolant was brown instead of red also.
Welcome to the "SmellyNox" club! This club has been acquiring new members by the hour. Are you getting the "propane" odor through the vents when the vehicle is idling with the fan on (and recirculation off)?
By the way, I am a member too. (I also happen to be a GM supplier)
I talk with a person from GM. They offered me an extended warranty of 1 year free oil change to compensate not having my car back yet.....LOL She said she will get back to me in 2 days with something else, 3 days later I did not hear from her so I called them back and they new right away the first one never called me. Now the new lady handling case asked me for 2 days also. I feel all there doing is giving me the run around till GM figures out what to do about there problem.
Well I'm in week 2 and the part(s) ordered have not yet been delivered. Not sure what was ordered but according to the parts dept. this happens at times when one hears a humming noise, was told not a danger to drive. Hmmmm...I wonder.. I will update you with any info I get. I will be going to another dealer where I know the tech who will work on the NOX and hope for the best. Thanks for you info also.
Thanks much for the response but my decision to purchase an Equinox will rest solely upon my own experiences with the vehicle.
I understand that the Equinox is a first year vehicle and problems will no doubt occure. The Mazda3 which was one of my previous choices also suffered a major problem for which some buyers also suggested other people steer clear of the Mazda3. But Mazda did assure its customers that they were working on the problem and after what seemed to be about 5 months later provided a solution to the 3's weak A/C problem.
I probably will still make the purchase because by the time I do im sure GM will have provided and answer by then.
npgmbr, I think this is a wise decision and I would do the same if I were you. It's a great vehicle in so many ways. People must realize that there have already been thousands and thousands of them sold. This coolant problem seems severe here because there is so much talk about it but this is such a selective group of people that it's not a fair representation of the public at all. No doubt this is a real problem for some (maybe even me), and it might even require a large widespread recall of some sort. But I have to keep reminding myself that if I never read this forum (or the EOC), then I would have never even looked at the coolant and the car would without doubt still be the best vehicle I have ever bought. I suspect there is a silent large majority that feels the same.
I agree with both of you when you praise the Equinox. It is a a great vehicle and GM did a fantastic job designing it. Around March 2004 I started looking for a new vehicle and test drove different models and makes. In April I finally tested the Equinox and bought the car on the same day I drove it. My driving experience with the vehicle has been great, it is very spacious and comfortable and my overall rating is very high.
Unfortunately, I cannot ignore the bad odor problem. And I cannot understand how I got TWO cars with the same problem. Perhaps I am just very unlucky. This odor creates difficult situations. We had three or four rainy days last week (and temperatures around 35-40oF) and it became hard to drive my Equinox. When I moved the air flow to the windshield the car would automatically overide the air recirculation switch (my Venture minivan does the same). As a consequence the windshield would defog very quickly, but the odor would enter the cabin as quickly as that. Or, in other words, I had to either stand the odor or drive with a fogged windshield. The vehicle is great, but this is unacceptable in my opinion.
I have been discussing the repurchase process with GM and we may have a solution soon. The additional problem I have been handling over the past days is to select a replacement vehicle. This has not been an easy task, as I am using the Equinox as my benchmark and all other vehicles fall short of expectations. Not to mention that all possible candidates are more expensive. [I can also say that the Equinox is the best vehicle I ever had]
Not knocking your concerns at all. I completely understand your situation and am very thankful that Im not having this problem.
I just wonder how long its gonna take GM to come up with a solution. Its hard for me to understand why its happening to the Equinox and none of the other new models.
As I said before, I plan to purchase an HHR or Nox so I guess that won't be until about this time next year unless the HHR comes out earlier. But if I go with the HHR I know that I'll be risking some disconfort for some months if the car has a defect that can't be easily disgnosed and repaired like the Nox strut issue. But overall its a chance im willing to take as long as GM addresses the issue.
I must say I really do feel for you guys with smelly Noxs. I hope GM can fix it for you soon.
There are quite a few Noxs on the road here in the Metro DC area and I wonder if those folks are having the same problem or is the problem associated with a build date, vin number or sometime of that nature.
Has anyone else by any chance heard anything from GM yet?
<There are quite a few Noxs on the road here in the Metro DC area and I wonder if those folks are having the same problem or is the problem associated with a build date, vin number or sometime of that nature.>
I live in Harford County, Maryland, and I was just in DC a few hours ago. If I had known you were that close I would have stopped in to see you and let you smell my Nox. Naaa, that sounds a little too kinky. Nevermind. <g>
There is no noticable odor inside or outside the vehicle. But if you unscrew the cap to the overflow tank and put your nose to it you can smell that it is indeed pretty rancid.
I guess I'm the newest member of the smelly Nox club...thanks for having me! Mine is in the shop for it's second coolant flush. I told the service manager about everything I've learned from this site and equinoxownersclub.com and he said this is the first time he's heard of it. I guess the whole service dept had to shut down the first time they flushed the coolant! Stunk them right out of the shop!! It's a great vehicle, just wish I didn't have the plug my nose when I drive it.
I regret to hear about your problem. My experience with the coolant flush is not very positive. My dealer did it twice, I saw some improvement over the following 24 hours but the situation deteriorated very quickly on the subsequent days.
I believe you when you mentioned what happened to the shop personnel handling the flush process because the same happened when I took my vehicle in. I am a chemist and normally used to bad odors, but the smell that comes from the overflow tank is unbelievable and most certainly one of the worst I ever felt.
I received some information from GM indicating they have been working very hard on this problem and a solution is expected soon. After gathering data from different sources I am pretty sure GM will need to recall a sizable number (all of them?) Equinoxes because of this odor problem.
Unfortunatley I have run into the same rancid problem as many of you. My dealer is going to do a flush next week to try to remove the odor and the dark sludge from the coolant. Hopefully they are successful, but it doesn't look promising. My dealer had not heard of the problem either.I have a feeling they are just buying themselves a little time.
My wife has complained of an odor, but I haven't yet smelled it (1500 miles). The NOX is going in tomorrow to have the back driver side window regulator replaced - any one else have problems with this? I also have noticed on 2 separate occasions that washer fluid is leaking from the front of the car...to the point where the tank is empty. Both times this has happened is when the rear wiper/washer was used.
Michigan99, since the first coolant flush didn't help, I guess they are going to drain it, run a bleach soln through the system, remove and sanitize the overflow reservoir and then do another coolant flush... I get it back in the morning so we'll see what happens. After everything I've read on the net, I'm not too confident. Although the service manager I'm working with has the regional GM rep involved on the case and that rep assured the service people that GM has a team hard at work on the fix. Seems to me that they should figure all of this stuff out before they launch a new line of vehicles!
My dealer did two flushes to virtually no avail. There was some improvement for a couple of days, but it went bad again.
This whole situation is very sad and disappointing.
It is sad because we are talking about a great vehicle. GM did a fantastic job designing the Equinox, and this should not be happening.
I also find it dissapointing because of the lack of reaction showed by GM. Here is why I say this:
* I bought my first Equinox on April 29th.
* From day one I felt the "propane" odor, as I received the vehicle with 350 miles on (it was brought form a different location with my agreement). Initially I thought it was something coming from the outside, but soon I realized it was coming from the vehicle (or, more precisaly, from under the hood and not from the tail pipe).
* I took the car to the dealership twice and the problem could not be fixed. When I received the "fixed" vehicle after the second visit I decided to test it before leaving the dealership. The odor was there. I called the service manager and he agreed something was not right. He asked me to leave the vehicle there for further investigation.
* After some days trying to fix the vehicle (with help from GM) they could not resolve the problem.
* On May 25th a decision was made to replace the whole vehicle.
* I insisted that the replacement vehicle should come directly from the factory.
* It took three months to receive the replacement vehicle.
* On September 2nd I finaly received the new vehicle (with 8 miles on). It did not smell. I also heard some comments on the coolant problem. I checked the cooland and everything was normal.
* One week later (400 miles) the car started to show the same odor.
* I returned to the dealer and asked to drive the vehicle for some more days to see whether the odor would go away.
* The odor got progressively worse. I took the car back to the dealer around 10 days later. They informed then that they had other vehicles with the same problem and that GM had just started to investigate it.
* I also learned that my first Equinox sat in the dealer's parking lot for around 4 months and no additional work had been done by GM. I initially thoughr that GM wanted to buy the car back to fully investigate this weird problem.
To make a long story short, I feel a tremendous disappointment because a customer takes a brand new vehicle (which happens to be a brand new model, with an engine made at a non-traditional location) back to a dealer (a specialized group of mechanics and technicians) and the problem can not be solved. It amazes me that nobody from GM had at least the curiosity of sending an engineer to the dealer to check it out. Now, it has been almost 5 months since my original problem and I do not think there is a final solution to the problem.
A great car such the Equinox did not deserve this lack of responsiveness.
My dealer told me that GM has been working very hard to have this resolved, and I am sure they will find a solution. But this problem has unfortunately snowballed significantly.
Wow, what a mess! You'd think it wouldn't be that difficult to disassemble the engine and troubleshoot what is causing the problem. I can't believe they let your first one sit there that long. Sounds like the chatter is increasing around this problem though so if they're smart, they'll have a fix for us soon or the Equinox sales are going to go down the drain.
I agree with you. This problem has to be solved quickly. Otherwise it will be necessary to build a large drain to accomodate the loss of sales. I think it goes without saying that different friends and co-workers have witnessed all the problems I have been facing for almost 6 months and this is not reflecting well on them. Just to tell you a short story: some days ago I received an e-mail from a co-worker about the Equinox. The reason for the e-mail was that this guy made some comments to his wife about my difficulties. She send him this note: "Earlier this morning I happened to catch a commercial for the Equinox. Believe it or not, this is its slogan: "The Chevy Equinox--It's full of surprises!"
My only comment to his note was: "Indeed!"
The Equinox deserves a better luck and I am sure this will be resolved.
I bought my Equinox in August. I have a little over 2200 miles on it. Thankfully, I have not had the odor problems that seem to be going around. However, I did have a problem with the driver's side back window. I brought it back to the dealer, and they told me they replaced the switch, that the original one was bad. I have previously owned a 98 Malibu, that was wrought with Electrical problems. After getting rid of that car, I vowed not to buy another Chevy, I was taken back in by the look and size of the Equinox,(my other car is an 03 Mitsu Outlander). I am worried that the bad switch is just a sign of things to come. Also, how has everyone else's mileage been? I am a little disappointed by my mileage, 18-19, all highway.
Besides the odor problem, my second Equinox has been performing flawlessly. The first one (also blessed with the odor problem) presented problems with the air-conditioning (the air-conditioner tried to start up by itself without being activated, and kept switching on and off).
As of the gas mileage, my first one was really bad. It used to make 16-17 mpg on highways. By the way, I regard myself as a good driver and as a comparison my 2004 Chevy Venture (which uses a similar 3.4 V6 engine) achieves 28-29 mpg on highways.
My second Equinox has been doing better in terms of gas mileage. Best rate was 21.8 mpg on highways, and the worst rate beoing around 18.3 mpg (combination city/highway). Overall gas mileage after 2800 miles is 20.1 mpg.
You said that your vehicle does not have the odor problem. Did you remove the cap of the expansion compartment to check it out? In case you have not, I suggest you do so, as together with the odor a black "gunk" forms in the cooling system. IF YOU HAVE NOT REMOVED THE CAP TO INSPECT THE FLUID YET, BE CAREFUL WHEN YOU DO SO. THE TANK IS NORMALLY PRESSURIZED AND THE FLUID WILL REFLUX VIOLENTLY IF THE ENGINE IS WARM. A spill of the rancid coolant fluid is not something you want to handle.
just picked up the equinox from service. had to have the regulator replaced on back driver side window. it appears too, that they are having problems with a valve for the rear window washer fluid (see my earlier posting #142) they are replacing that next weekend. as for the odor, next wekend they are flushing the sytem, they contacted GM and GM is sending (according to the service manager) a cleaning solvent for the system and an additive to add to the radiator during refill to "eliminate" the odor. time to start looking into the Lemon Law just in case it comes to that.
Hi, Our equinox has been running great and got 28 MPG on the highway, and no problems until checking it out at 1600 miles where we have some black stuff in the cooling system also. And the rotten egg smell as well when opening up the radiator cap, however there isnt any odors when driving in the car and with the cap installed. Will have the dealer check it out next week. Although the car still works great and no issues other than the black build up in the overflow tank. I will forward a message when i figure out what it is. If cant be fixed am also thinking about getting the general exchange it as well
I picked the Nox up this morning...they drained the coolant, ran water through the system for 10 minutes, then ran bleach through to kill anything lurking in there, then refilled it with coolant. They also removed the vent hose from the expansion tank and replaced it with a much longer one that they ran over by the wheel well. Apparently the original design has the vent hose exiting directly in front of the air intake for the cabin air. By redirecting it near the wheel they hope if any bad smells build up they will not be drawn into the cabin. I can still faintly smell the "propane/rotten fish" smell which is probably permanently baked into the engine and will smell any time it's hot. I will update when I know more. ALSO, I haven't gotten better than 17 MPG since I received the vehicle and I now have close to 5,000 miles on it. I got 21 once with a very strong tail wind, but have been averaging between 15-17.
my Nox, gets around 28 on the highway, and 21 in the city, today got 21 in stop and go traffic with combinatino highway and sitting in traffic for 2 hours on a 6 1/2 hour trip and only took 13 gallons for 280 m iles plus sitting in traffic for so long. Our vehicle now has 2000 miles on it and gas mileage hasnt been an issue.And just noticed the blackened coolant today. unfortuneately the odor and darken coolant will probably come back again. Keep us posted
This new type of hose may definitely help. But I noticed that the expansion tank smells terrible when the engine is warm. Or, in other words, the smell seems to be able to permeate the plastic (HDPE?) wall and get to the engine compartment, and then to the ventilation system.
I have also noticed that the upper part of the expansion tank (on the inside wall) shows a brown discoloration. This started to happen after the coolant was changed.
We were considering buying an Equinox (although, I am not too sure after reading about all of the smeely NOXs). Our biggest conern since our teenager will be driving the car is about visibility issues. The rear headrests seem large and sort of in the way of seeing out the back, and the rear side windows seem very small-possible blind spots? Also there is a lot of "car" between the front windshield and the front driver/passenger windows-does that cause more blind spots? Any info on this from those of you who have been driving this car for a bit would be greatly appreciated as I am not sure a teenage driver will be able to adjust to blind spots very quickly.
Comments
Second, I kept hearing a humming noise from the rear when I would ,make a shart left or right turn
this is due to a deffective rear differential. I have been waiting 1 week so far and no update. I use my NOX back a forth to work since Arpil 04, and I am at 11200 mile, Yikes!
I am thinking of trading it in, but I will wait to see if the repair od the differential changes my mind.. Over all I have not heard any huge issues like my differential problem form any one.
Will appreciate any info anyone may have.
Just as a side note, Mr_shiftright has made a good point on the use of CAPS LOCK. However, I did not feel offended by the uppercase text and really appreciated your comments.
Best regards!
if the coolant was replaced, and then turned dirty and smelly again, does that mean the as it passes through the radiator or the engine it is fouling up?
what could be going on inside those parts to make such a bad smell?
I think you asked the (multi) million dollar question GM is trying to answer. I initially thought the vehicle received a bad batch of coolant, perhaps contaminated with bacteria.
The dealer followed GM's temporary corrective action and did a 2-stage flush and coolant fluid replacement. The odor improved for around one day, and then started to deteriorate. One day more and I noticed a sizable number of black particles floating on the fluid.
The dealer then did a second flush and fluid replacement (this was last Friday, the 8th). The odor subsided slightly and started to get strong on Wednesday. On that day, I left the vehicle in the garage and when I returned one hour later I thought there was a dead animal in the garage.
Today I removed the cap of the plastic compartment and noticed that, besides the terrible smell of rotten fish, there were various black particles (gelly like) floating again on the fluid. However, today I also noticed the presence of white particles floating on the fluid. The white particles are shaped like small scales (or flakes). The dealer indicated they saw the white particles the first they replaced the fluid.
Going back to your question. I am a chemist and this mystery is really interesting. As I said, the odor reminds me of rotten fish. Therefore, there must be a source of nitrogen and sulfur somewhere in the engine (hoses? gaskets? pump?). As I mentioned above, I thought the vehicle received a bad batch of coolant, but this can not hold true after the two fluid changes.
In short, there must be some chemical (or biological) interaction happening between the engine (and its components, like hoses and gaskets) and the coolant fluid. Something is breaking down and giving off the volatile components of this odor.
The dealer also mentioned that GM uses just one grade of coolant on all of their vehicles. And the Equinox seems to be the only vehicle from their lineup presenting this problem.
Your comments on the combustion gases and how they could get to the coolant fluid make sense to me. The odor takes some time to build up, so it is reasonable to consider that a small gas leak could contaminate the coolant and progressively turns the coolant into something really smelly. The contaminant must have some sort of sulfur compound, as the odor is very characteristic.
The last part of your comments is something that also amazes me. When the dealer stated that they were unable to fix the odor problem and the whole vehicle would be replaced (and all this happened very quickly), I basically thought two things:
1. They found something really bad and wanted the vehicle out of the streets very quickly. [And, obviously, did not tell me the whole story, which was hard to believe considering the high professionalism of the dealership]. I thought this possiblity to be possbile but very unlikely.
or.
2. They did not know what it was and, because they were dealing with a new model, GM wanted to take the car apart to investigate the unusual problem.
After realizing that the vehicle sat in the parking lot for three months and nothing was done, and also learning that GM became aware of the problem around mid-September and is now trying to figure it out, the only conclusion in this case is that this was sheer incompetence.
How is it possbile that GM designs a great vehicle like the Equinox and does nor react to such problems very quickly?
1. The problem is gradual. I received a brand new vehicle and it did not smell. After 400 miles there was a slight odor. At 1000 miles the odor was very strong. A leak would explain how the concentration of contaminants could increase slowly over time.
2. The dealer changed the coolant fluid twice and the odor always came back. The odor did improve right after the fluid being replaced, but it deteriorated after a couple of days. A continuous leak could explain how the problem could come back (apparently from nowhere).
3. From the chemical point of view (by the way, I am a chemist), a leak of combustion gases into the coolant would explain much of the nature of the smell. We can not forget that, if this leak is responsible for the problem, this is happening BEFORE the catalytic converter. Or, in other words, fairly reactive by-products of the gasoline combustion process would have the opportunity to meet different chemicals present in the coolant before being chemically reduced/oxidized/neutralized by the converter. Gasoline contains a very small amount of sulfur, and those reactive sulfurated chemical species could easily react with nitrogen-containing products (for instance, ammonium quaternaries sometimes used as corrosion inhibitors) and form very smelly substances. The coolant of my car smells like rotten fish!
4. A leak could also explain why the cars are apparently presenting the problem with various degrees of severity, ranging from nothing to very bad.
5. The dealer noticed the presence of white flakes in the coolant. I also noticed the same material after the second coolant change. The flakes could be a product of chemical reaction between combustion gases (SOx, NOx, CO2, CO and other) and the chemicals from the coolant and sealant. Perhaps they may contain a sizable amount of carbonates and sulfates. I know GM got samples of this weird material extracted from my car and I am sure they are analyzing its chemical nature.
If a leak is really the root cause of this problem, GM will have a pretty tough situation to handle. It could be caused by a defective/substandard seal or gasket, which is bad enough, as the corrective action will not be simple. Or, even worse, it can be a design flaw. Either way, this is not looking good.
I hope GM can fix this very quickly.
OK, the Pontiac Vibe isn't a Chevy, but read Problem and Solution discussion board. Same problem, and it started as an '04 model. I'm not 100% on it, but I think the Vibe/Matrix uses a Chinese made engine also. Coincidence?
http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0UDO/is_3_16/ai_939549- 22
I left the engine running and walked around the car, and the bad odor started around the driver's door, and got really worse close to the hood area.
The situation with the Equinox can not be related to the catalytic converter, as the coolant deterioration (caused by contamination?) is obviously happening before the combustion gases reach the converter.
Has anybody else heard anything from GM on this bad odor problem?
Oh I agree completely that the Nox odor is coming from the coolant. Mine stinks too - it's just not noticable with the cap on the expansion tank. I was just saying that after reading the Vibe posts it appears to me that they are not talking about the same thing.
I read the posts on the Vibe and I agree with you. The problems reported there seem different from the ones presented by the Equinox.
The rotten egg odor from the tail pipe is pretty common, but the situation with the Equinox seems to be a different animal (or, perhaps, a dead animal I should say).
I do not know how many Equinoxes will turn really bad, but I can not believe I had the bad luck to have the first vehicle replaced (because of the odor problem) and the second presenting the same problem.
This is what I call bad luck! (Or, GM may have a really large problem to handle).
I am currently going over the process of a second vehicle repurchase with GM. However, I will not be happy to turn my Equinox in because I like the vehicle very much! Excluding the foul odor, my Equinox has been operating without any problems. As I will return the vehicle to GM very soon (hopefully), I have been trying to find another car to buy. It has not been an easy task, as I use the Equinox as my yardstick and other vehicles do not even compare.
This whole deal is very sad!
I've been poking around for some time now trying to figure out what my next car was gonna be and after deciding that the Mazda3 was too weak im now planning on either the Chevy HHR or Nox.
I just hope that by the time the HHR comes out that the problem with the Nox is solved.
The issue with the Vibe/Matrix is totally unrelated. His an issue that Toyota also continues to have the with Corolla which is what the Vibe/Matrix really are.
I sent an email to GM-Canada (where the Equinox is made) and received a reply stating that because I was an US-resident I should contact GM in the US. Very helpful, don't you think?
Then I sent a note to GM-US and also got a reply stating that someone was already working on my case. The person they mentioned is the same one who handled the first vehicle repurchase. I do not know if the same person is handling the second case.
In short, I called the dealership today and they have not received any update on how to handle or fix this problem.
I will also be sending an email to ConsumerReports later today.
My personal suggestion to you after having two bad Equinoxes in a row (with the same problem) is to avoid buying an Equinox until this problem is identified and resolved.
The Equinox is a very impressive vehicle and different people asked me quesions on it. Some were even considering the idea of buying one. They changed their minds after learning about my 6-month struggle to get a functional car. I truly hope GM can solve this problem, as I am not going to buy a third Equinox at this point, but I would definitely buy another one in the future.
I purchased my 'nox Aug. 31st. Everything was great w/it till last Thursday. On my way to work, my spedometer bottomed out, several "dummy" lights came on, and my steering got super tight. I had 'nox towed to the nearest Chevy dealership, and they had it for 2 days trying to figure out what happened. It acted up for them too. End result...they reset the computer, 'cause they couldn't figure it out.
I got the 'nox back Friday evening, and over the long weekend, didn't drive it. Went to work on Tues., it was fine. It wasn't until I had a carload of groceries later that evening that it did the same thing AGAIN...except this time, when I attempted to accellerate after stopping at a light, it felt & sounded like it was trying to go, but really wasn't moving.
Fortunately, the dealership was only a few miles up the road. One of the service guys came to me, and brought me a loaner (I explained that due to rush hour traffic, I didn't feel safe trying to drive it there myself).
They had the car all week, and finally determined that it was the speed sensor in the computer that was screwed up. They overnighted the part, and I'm getting ready to pick up the 'nox now.
Has anyone heard of this kind of craziness? I really do love this vehicle, and don't want to get rid of it...but I bought it assuming that a new car would be more reliable than what I was driving before! I'm just hoping it doesn't happen again...the weather is starting to get colder, and I really don't want to get stranded in the snow, or have to take another day off of work for a vehicle that is brand spankin' new!
Nice article on the China origins of the Equinox engine. GM is going to be building a whole lot more there too.
After reading these posts, I saw that the Equinox that we have (We are a GM supplier) was out front, and I went outside and popped the hood. I opened the overflow tank and damn if it didnt smell like road kill! The coolant was brown instead of red also.
Welcome to the "SmellyNox" club! This club has been acquiring new members by the hour. Are you getting the "propane" odor through the vents when the vehicle is idling with the fan on (and recirculation off)?
By the way, I am a member too. (I also happen to be a GM supplier)
I will update you with any info I get. I will be going to another dealer where I know the tech who will work on the NOX and hope for the best.
Thanks for you info also.
Thanks much for the response but my decision to purchase an Equinox will rest solely upon my own experiences with the vehicle.
I understand that the Equinox is a first year vehicle and problems will no doubt occure. The Mazda3 which was one of my previous choices also suffered a major problem for which some buyers also suggested other people steer clear of the Mazda3. But Mazda did assure its customers that they were working on the problem and after what seemed to be about 5 months later provided a solution to the 3's weak A/C problem.
I probably will still make the purchase because by the time I do im sure GM will have provided and answer by then.
I think this is a wise decision and I would do the same if I were you. It's a great vehicle in so many ways. People must realize that there have already been thousands and thousands of them sold. This coolant problem seems severe here because there is so much talk about it but this is such a selective group of people that it's not a fair representation of the public at all. No doubt this is a real problem for some (maybe even me), and it might even require a large widespread recall of some sort. But I have to keep reminding myself that if I never read this forum (or the EOC), then I would have never even looked at the coolant and the car would without doubt still be the best vehicle I have ever bought. I suspect there is a silent large majority that feels the same.
Ed
I agree with both of you when you praise the Equinox. It is a a great vehicle and GM did a fantastic job designing it. Around March 2004 I started looking for a new vehicle and test drove different models and makes. In April I finally tested the Equinox and bought the car on the same day I drove it. My driving experience with the vehicle has been great, it is very spacious and comfortable and my overall rating is very high.
Unfortunately, I cannot ignore the bad odor problem. And I cannot understand how I got TWO cars with the same problem. Perhaps I am just very unlucky. This odor creates difficult situations. We had three or four rainy days last week (and temperatures around 35-40oF) and it became hard to drive my Equinox. When I moved the air flow to the windshield the car would automatically overide the air recirculation switch (my Venture minivan does the same). As a consequence the windshield would defog very quickly, but the odor would enter the cabin as quickly as that. Or, in other words, I had to either stand the odor or drive with a fogged windshield. The vehicle is great, but this is unacceptable in my opinion.
I have been discussing the repurchase process with GM and we may have a solution soon. The additional problem I have been handling over the past days is to select a replacement vehicle. This has not been an easy task, as I am using the Equinox as my benchmark and all other vehicles fall short of expectations. Not to mention that all possible candidates are more expensive. [I can also say that the Equinox is the best vehicle I ever had]
I hope all this ends well.
Thank you for your comments.
Not knocking your concerns at all. I completely understand your situation and am very thankful that Im not having this problem.
I just wonder how long its gonna take GM to come up with a solution. Its hard for me to understand why its happening to the Equinox and none of the other new models.
As I said before, I plan to purchase an HHR or Nox so I guess that won't be until about this time next year unless the HHR comes out earlier. But if I go with the HHR I know that I'll be risking some disconfort for some months if the car has a defect that can't be easily disgnosed and repaired like the Nox strut issue. But overall its a chance im willing to take as long as GM addresses the issue.
I must say I really do feel for you guys with smelly Noxs. I hope GM can fix it for you soon.
There are quite a few Noxs on the road here in the Metro DC area and I wonder if those folks are having the same problem or is the problem associated with a build date, vin number or sometime of that nature.
Has anyone else by any chance heard anything from GM yet?
<There are quite a few Noxs on the road here in the Metro DC area and I wonder if those folks are having the same problem or is the problem associated with a build date, vin number or sometime of that nature.>
I live in Harford County, Maryland, and I was just in DC a few hours ago. If I had known you were that close I would have stopped in to see you and let you smell my Nox. Naaa, that sounds a little too kinky. Nevermind. <g>
Ed
I regret to hear about your problem. My experience with the coolant flush is not very positive. My dealer did it twice, I saw some improvement over the following 24 hours but the situation deteriorated very quickly on the subsequent days.
I believe you when you mentioned what happened to the shop personnel handling the flush process because the same happened when I took my vehicle in. I am a chemist and normally used to bad odors, but the smell that comes from the overflow tank is unbelievable and most certainly one of the worst I ever felt.
I received some information from GM indicating they have been working very hard on this problem and a solution is expected soon. After gathering data from different sources I am pretty sure GM will need to recall a sizable number (all of them?) Equinoxes because of this odor problem.
My dealer did two flushes to virtually no avail. There was some improvement for a couple of days, but it went bad again.
This whole situation is very sad and disappointing.
It is sad because we are talking about a great vehicle. GM did a fantastic job designing the Equinox, and this should not be happening.
I also find it dissapointing because of the lack of reaction showed by GM. Here is why I say this:
* I bought my first Equinox on April 29th.
* From day one I felt the "propane" odor, as I received the vehicle with 350 miles on (it was brought form a different location with my agreement). Initially I thought it was something coming from the outside, but soon I realized it was coming from the vehicle (or, more precisaly, from under the hood and not from the tail pipe).
* I took the car to the dealership twice and the problem could not be fixed. When I received the "fixed" vehicle after the second visit I decided to test it before leaving the dealership. The odor was there. I called the service manager and he agreed something was not right. He asked me to leave the vehicle there for further investigation.
* After some days trying to fix the vehicle (with help from GM) they could not resolve the problem.
* On May 25th a decision was made to replace the whole vehicle.
* I insisted that the replacement vehicle should come directly from the factory.
* It took three months to receive the replacement vehicle.
* On September 2nd I finaly received the new vehicle (with 8 miles on). It did not smell. I also heard some comments on the coolant problem. I checked the cooland and everything was normal.
* One week later (400 miles) the car started to show the same odor.
* I returned to the dealer and asked to drive the vehicle for some more days to see whether the odor would go away.
* The odor got progressively worse. I took the car back to the dealer around 10 days later. They informed then that they had other vehicles with the same problem and that GM had just started to investigate it.
* I also learned that my first Equinox sat in the dealer's parking lot for around 4 months and no additional work had been done by GM. I initially thoughr that GM wanted to buy the car back to fully investigate this weird problem.
To make a long story short, I feel a tremendous disappointment because a customer takes a brand new vehicle (which happens to be a brand new model, with an engine made at a non-traditional location) back to a dealer (a specialized group of mechanics and technicians) and the problem can not be solved. It amazes me that nobody from GM had at least the curiosity of sending an engineer to the dealer to check it out. Now, it has been almost 5 months since my original problem and I do not think there is a final solution to the problem.
A great car such the Equinox did not deserve this lack of responsiveness.
My dealer told me that GM has been working very hard to have this resolved, and I am sure they will find a solution. But this problem has unfortunately snowballed significantly.
I agree with you. This problem has to be solved quickly. Otherwise it will be necessary to build a large drain to accomodate the loss of sales. I think it goes without saying that different friends and co-workers have witnessed all the problems I have been facing for almost 6 months and this is not reflecting well on them. Just to tell you a short story: some days ago I received an e-mail from a co-worker about the Equinox. The reason for the e-mail was that this guy made some comments to his wife about my difficulties. She send him this note: "Earlier this morning I happened to catch a commercial for the Equinox. Believe it or not, this is its slogan: "The Chevy Equinox--It's full of surprises!"
My only comment to his note was: "Indeed!"
The Equinox deserves a better luck and I am sure this will be resolved.
I have previously owned a 98 Malibu, that was wrought with Electrical problems. After getting rid of that car, I vowed not to buy another Chevy, I was taken back in by the look and size of the Equinox,(my other car is an 03 Mitsu Outlander). I am worried that the bad switch is just a sign of things to come.
Also, how has everyone else's mileage been? I am a little disappointed by my mileage, 18-19, all highway.
Besides the odor problem, my second Equinox has been performing flawlessly. The first one (also blessed with the odor problem) presented problems with the air-conditioning (the air-conditioner tried to start up by itself without being activated, and kept switching on and off).
As of the gas mileage, my first one was really bad. It used to make 16-17 mpg on highways. By the way, I regard myself as a good driver and as a comparison my 2004 Chevy Venture (which uses a similar 3.4 V6 engine) achieves 28-29 mpg on highways.
My second Equinox has been doing better in terms of gas mileage. Best rate was 21.8 mpg on highways, and the worst rate beoing around 18.3 mpg (combination city/highway). Overall gas mileage after 2800 miles is 20.1 mpg.
You said that your vehicle does not have the odor problem. Did you remove the cap of the expansion compartment to check it out? In case you have not, I suggest you do so, as together with the odor a black "gunk" forms in the cooling system. IF YOU HAVE NOT REMOVED THE CAP TO INSPECT THE FLUID YET, BE CAREFUL WHEN YOU DO SO. THE TANK IS NORMALLY PRESSURIZED AND THE FLUID WILL REFLUX VIOLENTLY IF THE ENGINE IS WARM. A spill of the rancid coolant fluid is not something you want to handle.
Good luck with your Equinox.
Our equinox has been running great and got 28 MPG on the highway, and no problems until checking it out at 1600 miles where we have some black stuff in the cooling system also. And the rotten egg smell as well when opening up the radiator cap, however there isnt any odors when driving in the car and with the cap installed. Will have the dealer check it out next week. Although the car still works great and no issues other than the black build up in the overflow tank. I will forward a message when i figure out what it is. If cant be fixed am also thinking about getting the general exchange it as well
This new type of hose may definitely help. But I noticed that the expansion tank smells terrible when the engine is warm. Or, in other words, the smell seems to be able to permeate the plastic (HDPE?) wall and get to the engine compartment, and then to the ventilation system.
I have also noticed that the upper part of the expansion tank (on the inside wall) shows a brown discoloration. This started to happen after the coolant was changed.