New Sierra/Silverado 2500 & 3500

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  • mgdvhmanmgdvhman Member Posts: 4,157
    8.1 or Allison....But I know with the 1st gear ratio of my 2500 right now....I sure as hell wouldn't want 285's with 3:73's.....

    you are not going to have a dog that can't pull anything....but going from 245's to 285's...you are going to notice it big time....and a 4:10 just would have helped take up the slack...

    as I've said before....the 1st gear of the 2500 is lower for towing and seems dog like sometimes when driving dry....but just step into it a little bit and she picks right up...

    Good Luck

    - Tim
  • chrisj7chrisj7 Member Posts: 6
    rates the towing capacity the same 12k for ball and hitch towing 3.73/4.10 but it greatly increases for fifth wheel applications. i'am just curious why some gm enginer would offer the 3.73 as an option? did they have any praticular application in mind? hey thanks for the info on the tire sizes maybe i can go to a 265 and still get a decent look?

    chris
  • mgdvhmanmgdvhman Member Posts: 4,157
    have gone from 265's to 285's and had good luck...and even 245's to 285's...but I believe they all had 4:10's...

    - Tim
  • mgdvhmanmgdvhman Member Posts: 4,157
    when you take off

    - Tim
  • greggauchogreggaucho Member Posts: 62
    Do you know if you can put chains on with 285s? Something to consider.
  • woolyback2woolyback2 Member Posts: 21
    I'm new at this so if I am jumping in at the wrong place I apologize.
    I trying to decide between the 2001 Sierra, 2500, ExC., with the 6.0L engine with a 4.10 axle ratio and the 8.1L engine with a 3.73 ratio.

    I will be pulling around a 8000 lb 5th wheel.
    I've read everything I can about the towing limits and I'm still confused.
    I understand the the truck will weigh 9200 lbs and the GCWR for the 6.0 with a 4.10 ratio is 16,000 lbs. so does that mean that I will only be able to pull the difference (6800 lbs.) minus the passenger and anything else I might add to the trucks weight.

    I'd appreciate any advice on this, thanks.
  • n75v111n75v111 Member Posts: 243
    NO BRAINER!!
    I'll be pulling 5th wheel about same as you.

    I THINK good probability 8.1/3.73/Allison will get as good 'a milage as 6.0/4.1/GM transmission.

    (Absolutly no reason to get 8.1 with 4.10 unless your pulling goose neck and lowboy with construction equipment on it)

    The 8.1/Allison is still the best choice even if the pulling gas milage is a couple mpg less. That allison transmission with grade braking alone is reason enough.

    Drive one if you can find it to be convinced.

    Only problem is that the 8.1 is going to take a lot longer to get delivery on, but if you don't mind being a little patient I think its worth it.

    The 8.1 has been on constraint but insider informaton told me last week that the 'Constraint' has been removed and 8.1 production will ramp from 1% build to 30% build of total HD units.

    Good luck with your decission.

    75v
  • richardm6richardm6 Member Posts: 45
    woolyback2
    I don't think any of the curb weight on any of these trucks are anywhere close to 9,200lbs. The 6.0 would probably do fine, but if I were going to buy either the 6.0 or the 8.1 I'd go with the 8.1. I think you would get about the same fuel mileage in everyday driveing and maybe a little better towing, because the 8.1 won't be working as hard.

    By the way I didn't go with either I went with the Duramax/Allison.

    Hope this helps Richard Mc
  • mgdvhmanmgdvhman Member Posts: 4,157
    that's the GVW.....truck..gas...you..and stuff...total rating...

    The curb weight on a 2500 HD..ext. cab SB 4WD is 3021 Lbs...

    - Tim
  • sovercash1sovercash1 Member Posts: 112
    Tim,

    My 2001 Chevrolet Crew Cab Duramax/Allison, 4x4, Long Bed weights 6800lbs..

    I have the shipping weight from the Transporter, the weight at the trash dump and I took it and weighted it on CAT Scales a few miles from me.. Full of Fuel Without me in it, Weights 6800lbs all three places said the same thing..

    A 4x4, ExtCab, Long box, Duramax/Allison weights around 6,200lbs full of fuel and no driver.....
  • markbuckmarkbuck Member Posts: 1,021
    on the 'ol "run a bigger engine at a relatively smaller load and you will get better fuel economy than a smaller engine working at larger throttle openings".

    While this was true in the old days of primary and secondary carbs, I suspect in the closed loop multiport fuel injection days that we live in, it cost x fuel economy to make a specific amount of HP. So within a reasonable range, as long as the engine will make the necessary HP at whatever RPM you plan at towing, probably doesn't make as much difference.

    I do believe a larger engine might last longer running at smaller throttle openings, but I'm not even sure about that.

    Comments/criticisms?????
  • mgdvhmanmgdvhman Member Posts: 4,157
    Gross Axle Wt Rating (lb)
    4670

    Rear Gross Axle Weight Rating (lb)
    6084

    Curb Weight (lb)
    3352

    Rear Curb Weight (lb)
    2278




    Gross Vehicle Wt Rating (lb)
    9200




    Gross Combined Wt Rating (lb)
    16,000

    - Tim
  • 4x44x4 Member Posts: 114
    Took her to the deer lease this weekend and got 13.4 going and 13.6MPG on the way back...this is with 285's..my odemeter is off by one tenth of a mile so i add that back in at the end..Used her fairly hard this weekend with all the rain and mud...i love the truck and the power of the 6.0 is plenty unless you will tow just a whole lot...my father in law has one like mine but 2wd (CRew Cab 2500HD) with the 6.0 and he pulls a big tralver trailer...he said going 75 to his deer lease he got 10.5MPG...not too bad and he said he couls hardly feel it back there..
  • woolyback2woolyback2 Member Posts: 21
    Thanks guys for all of the comments I'm getting a good education from this topic, I was leaning towards the 8.1 so is the 3.73 ratio a good match for the weight I'd be pulling. It would definitely not be more than 8000 lbs. more like 7500 lbs tops.
    Still confused about those figures in post #433.
    Is there a web site that explains just what they mean. Does the GVWR of 9200 lbs. mean that the truck is only rated to carry that much, a total of it's own weight plus the cargo.
    When the GCWR is 17000 lbs. at 3.73 ratio does that mean that you deduct what the truck actually weighs and what is left is what you can tow.
    Thanks again for all of your help and advice.
  • mgdvhmanmgdvhman Member Posts: 4,157
    ...truck..gas..you..cargo..

    - Tim

    GVW - Gross Vehicle Weight
  • blawlessblawless Member Posts: 29
    Remember that all of these are ratings. Although not recommended, you can exceed these but your vehicle will become unstable and may be damaged. In the case of an accident or warranty issues, overloading will be considered.

    GVWR: Gross Vehicle Weight Rating- The maximum weight for vehicle, passengers, cargo, accessories, fuel etc.

    GRAWR: Gross Rear Axle Weight Rating- Maximum weight on the rear axle.

    GFAWR: Gross Front Axle Weight Rating- Maximum weight on front axle.

    GCWR: Gross Combined Weight Rating- The maximum weight for TRAILER, vehicle, passengers, cargo, accessories, fuel etc.

    Curb Weight: The actual weight of the vehicle, passengers, cargo, accessories, fuel etc. This can also be the weight of an empty truck instead, but since the weight is used to determine payload, I choose the loaded route.

    To answer your original question, I would go with the 8100 with the 3.73. Is there any particular reason your are not interested in the 4.10 with the 8.1? If you pull quite a few times a year and climb a lot of hills, you might consider it.

    Hope I could help you out. Go to your local dealer, gmc.com, or chevrolet.com and get the 52 page brochure, it includes some nice charts showing all of the info and explaining the limits.
  • cdeancdean Member Posts: 1,110
    Woolyback

    Get the 8.1 /Allison

    see below
  • cdeancdean Member Posts: 1,110
    Well, I finally got to drive one. My uncle just took delivery of SC 2500HD, 8.1/Allison.

    Thats one mean looking truck. The most aggresive truck Chevy has put out. The truck stand very tall with the Allison. Easily 2 inches higher than my '98 3500C. And, it was only 2 wheel drive. I like the rims and hood sheetmetal a lot.

    The 8.1 is just massive under the hood. The whole truck is just a LOT of steel.

    I was REALLY impressed with how clean the engine bay is. There are no hoses, wires, and such running all over the place. I mean it is CLEAN. In fact, back right of the compartment is entirely empty--nothing but a wheel well.

    THE DRIVE

    First impression--SMOOTH. Very slick ride. It felt very solid and heavy when going over rough roads. It absorbs bumps with a little stiffness, but overall much smoother than I had anticipated.

    The engine is just plain power. its hard NOT to chirp the tires. At highway speeds you barely have to touch the throttle to hold 55...its hard NOT to drive 70.

    I LOVED the Allsion. Under moderate accleration, it shifted very crisply and kept the engine in between 2500 and 3500 rpms. The engine seems to really pull good. It doesn't want to 'rev all the way' like the 5.3 does. It was strange feeling 5 shifts from a stop.

    The engine braking from the transmission is a GREAT feature. I can see this combo becoming very popular Very fast. At low speeds, it feels like you are driving a standard. When you let off the gas, the tranny holds the gear, so you the engine whines down, just like if you were driving a manual. The tow haul features 5th gear lockout and computer selected downshifting when the brakes are applied.

    Overall impression: I WANT ONE! GM really stepped up to the plate nicely. Everything about the truck seems very well thought out.

    And just plain powerful. The Allison should do for GM what the Cummins did for Dodge. The heavy duty performance of that tranny is awesome.
  • mgdvhmanmgdvhman Member Posts: 4,157
    Ford has the "Not so super crew".......Chevy don't..

    LOL

    - Tim
  • cdeancdean Member Posts: 1,110
    single cab
  • mgdvhmanmgdvhman Member Posts: 4,157
    Reg.Cab...

    get it right man!

    LOL

    - Tim
  • markbuckmarkbuck Member Posts: 1,021
    having an effect on the SD's.

    Ford offering a $1000 credit on the V10's.

    Uh oh, more decisions for Buck. Back to a stripper SD CC V10 5speed????
  • ryanbabryanbab Member Posts: 7,240
    haha single cab????

    Ryan
  • markbuckmarkbuck Member Posts: 1,021
    CC = Crew Cab
  • cdeancdean Member Posts: 1,110
    actually, i've noticed a whole new line of advertisements from Ford. They don't talk anything about power or options or yada yada, they just show some tough guy and a crew cab 4x4 Superduty, and say something like 'Still King of the Hill'.

    I like the one about 'have you seen that you've got mail movie? This guy hasn't..." (Show guy in Ford with tough music in background)
  • loyalgmcguyloyalgmcguy Member Posts: 64
    Hate to change topics but have to ask "what's a deer lease"? Is this your hunting spot? On a related note, are all you HD 6.0 owners getting 13-14 MPG on the highway and is this with 3.73's or 4.10's?
  • suburbansrulesuburbansrule Member Posts: 34
    I'm wondering what kind of gas mileage the 8.1 is getting?
  • hunter98hunter98 Member Posts: 273
    Ive got a half ton 5.3 4x4 Ext Cab 3.73 w265 and I only get 13.5-14 driving mixed 30-80 mostly 75-80. A friend with a ld 2500 gets 13 on the interstate going 70. The 2500HD is only available with the 4.10 rear end which from what I have heard is getting maybee 12 at interstate speeds 70+ at the most. They might get 14 going 55 downhill but...

    Everything is speed dependant!
    Hunter
  • n75v111n75v111 Member Posts: 243
    Aren't we all.

    Especially those of us with one on order or about to.

    Still the 8.1 with 3.73 vrs 6.0 with mandatory 4.10 should keep them close enough that if you "have to ask" maybe you'd beter be looking at Motor Scooter!!!

    I've pulled a 5th wheel for 3yrs with an F150/5.0/220hp and can say 'Been There, Done That' -- Pedel to the Metal down hill to make 40 up the next--- DON'T WANT TO DO THAT ANYMORE.

    75v
  • n75v111n75v111 Member Posts: 243
    Someday -- Soon I hope.

    75V
  • chevygertchevygert Member Posts: 3
    Please email me at j_gert78@hotmail.com....I have a question for you....

    Thanks
  • jlflemmonsjlflemmons Member Posts: 2,242
    I have a "oddball" 2K 2500 w/HD suspension. Think somewhere between the 2500 and the 2500HD and you get the picture. 6.0L with 3.73 and the 4l80E tranny. GM certified towing on sticker says 9200lbs w/weight distribution hitch. That said, I consistently get 12mpg in town, 8.4mpg pulling a 7400lb travel trailer at 65MPH. I haven't driven the truck solo on the highway, but have been told to expect 16-18 mpg based on whether or not I can keep my foot out of it.
  • bigorangefanbigorangefan Member Posts: 22
    engine management control module is also effected by an increase in tire diameter and as a result performance and fuel mileage can be effected by the wrong info being sent to the computer as well as a false mph reading. the module can be upgraded to your tire/wheel specs for about $150.00 and is located behind the glove box.
  • n75v111n75v111 Member Posts: 243
    all that math on tire size gear ratio conversions.

    If i go to 265's like Roger350, can dealer change computer to have speedometer correct??

    75v
  • 4x44x4 Member Posts: 114
    Yeah I did get 13.6MPG with 285's in my Hd2500 Crew cab 4x4 wit 4.10's....i got 13.4 going and 13.6 on the way back...and that was going 72-75MPH the whole way which was a 35o mile trip one way..also had the occasional burst up to 85...

    And yeah the deer lease as it is referred to down here in Texas is our hunting "spot"...

    N75v111..you talk about the 6.0 like it is a 4cyl..i don't know what you have been told but if you are getting the 8.1l because you think the 6.0 is not strong enough you are wrong...i have been very happy with the 6.0 and the power..to be honest, the truck hauls [non-permissible content removed]...and i have got a crew cab and 4x4 with the 33inch tires..getting 12MPG in city and you saw my earlier posting of highway mileage..if you will have to gas the truck to keep it at the same speed on hills you are wrong...maybe it is the 4.10's that help the 6.0, i don't know cuz i never drove a 6.0 with the 3.73...but i would take my 6.0 over the triton v-10 any day, much more power in the 6.0 than any triton engine..
    I wouldn't get the 8.1l unless
    a)My company paid for the gas via gas card
    B)I pulled the hell out of something a lot
    C)I just had to have the allison to say i had it..

    I pull a 22 Bay boat and maybe an occasional trailer bigger than that so i don't need a 496 to do it, nor do i need a $5500 diesel to do it..again, if i was money bags i would buy the diesel..but i am not, in fact i just graduated college...my father in law pulls his big [non-permissible content removed] tralver trailer with his crew cab6.0 and he says he can't even feel it back there at 75MPH..he also said he got 10MPG doing it...

    yeah the dealer can recalibrate the speedo or you can buy a hypertech reprogrammer to do it yourself when you want
  • gordo13gordo13 Member Posts: 20
    I'm thinking about getting the 2500 HD 4x4 with the Duramax/Allison set-up. Can anyone give me comments from first hand experience with this set-up in regards to power, engine noise, and fuel milege?
  • blawlessblawless Member Posts: 29
    Trailer boats magazine gave the following numbers for the 8.1.
    Highway empty:
    55mph-17mpg
    65mph-13mpg
    Highway towing:
    55mph-8.3mpg
    65mph-7.3mpg

    The vehicle was a 2001-2500HD-4WD-8.1L-XC with a 4.10 gear ratio. Towing tests were performed with a 9700lb boat.
  • roger350roger350 Member Posts: 157
    When I get a chance, I'll post the speedo error caused by changing from the 245's to the 265's. I drove a particular route in town before the switch using the trip OD, and just have not gotten around to doing it again with the 265's. Maybe tonight.
  • hunter98hunter98 Member Posts: 273
    Congratulations sounds like you have a really nice truck. I wish my 1500 did better, but the best I can get is about 14.5, averages around 14 and lows of 13. This is running 73-80 on the interstate and some highway. Best wishes and I really hope all of you get that good of milage. I think this will be my last half ton truck for a while. Duramax/Allison looks awefully darn tempting.

    Hunter
  • n75v111n75v111 Member Posts: 243
    Not putting down the 6.0 at all and the reason it's only offered with the 4.10 is to make it even better in GM's market positioning of the new HD's.
    I would also pick the 6.0 over either of the V10's and think is is a great power plant. I of course would have went with 6.0 had the 8.1 not been available and probably would have been totaly satisfied over my F150.

    I'll just have wait and to see how the 8.1/3.73 gas millage compares to the 6.0/4.10 -- but as I said they may be about the same -- the 8.1/Allison fits my needs better regardless of fuel consumption.

    The Allison is a major factor in my selecting the 8.1 if your pulling good loads such as large 5th wheel RV's etc.

    These things are so expensive that I don't want to wish later on that I had more power or the durability of the Allison.

    I have friend who pulls Big Big [non-permissible content removed] size 5th wh horse trailer w/RV quarters all over the country and has lost transmissions in two big rams, two silverados and one F350 over the last five years (yeah 5 new $35/$40K PU's) thus the importance of the Allison to me.

    Sorry - Did not mean to imply the 6.0 was bad.

    Thks for the speedo reprograme info.

    75v
  • markbuckmarkbuck Member Posts: 1,021
    if it is much different that 265/245 = 8.1% I'll be really suprized. (assumes same wheel size and same aspect ratio)

    So, driving 60 mph indicated will be 65mph....

    And the odo will read 92% as fast. And you will get 8.1% more miles until you warranty expires....
  • hunter98hunter98 Member Posts: 273
    It is just over 4%-5% bigger, depending on the brand and the tread depth of the comparitive tires. Most just fall in about 4.5%. When the speedo shows 70 your goin 73. I usually set it on 72 (75) and 76 (80) on the interstate, plenty fast for me, it does give you an extra 1500 or so miles under the standard warranty and will reduce your cost to trade trucks, figuring $.25 per mile, 1620 miles, that is just over 400 bucks. So the tires did pay for themselves, well almost mine are michelins.

    Best of luck

    Hunter
  • richardm6richardm6 Member Posts: 45
    gordo13

    I took delivery of my truck on Nov 1st I have 550 miles on it so far. Acceleration is GREAT mash the pedal and it pushes you back in the seat. At idle you can barely hear the engine, under hard acceleration you hear a mild rummble, when you get to cruising speed the engine gets very quiet again. The first tank of fuel it got about 17 mpg.
    I will fill it up again before the weekend and let you know.

    Hope this helps Richard Mc
  • 4x44x4 Member Posts: 114
    one tenth of a mile...no noticeable power loss either...saw and heard my first DMAX today...very impressive..the fellow and i had a conversation standing next to the engine while it was running...you can still hear that distinctive sound of a diesel but not nearly that of a PSD or Cummins...I would say the DMAX is 10 times quiter than a PSD and 20 times quiter than the cummins...this guy i talked to has 318 miles on this tank of gas and supposedly has an 1/8 of a tank left..that doesn't sound too impressive to me but it should get a lot better...this guy also got a great deal on his DMAX...he said he got it for invoice + advertising...final drive out on a crew cab LS 4x4 SWB DMAX/Allsion was 35,500...but that is because he also cashed in 2300 in GM card savings...thats still one hell of a deal..

    n75v..no offense taken..i just don't want someone to choose the 8.1 cuz they think the 6.0 can't handle the truck...

    Hunter98, thanks for the congradulations...i am really pleased with the truck..of course i would rather have a DMAX, but just graduating college i think i have a dam* nice truck...maybe after this Accounting degree gets to work i get can get a dmax in a few years...
  • gordo13gordo13 Member Posts: 20
    Thanks for the Duramax/Allison information. I'm selling my 1985 K20/383 Stroker and I'm going to need another truck, out here in California they're saying if I order now I'll get the truck next spring. I really appreciate the information as I don't feel like I'm making the big purchase blind. Can't wait to here the next mileage report. Thanks Again.
  • woolyback2woolyback2 Member Posts: 21
    Man-o-man there is an awful lot of knowledge out there, what a great info site for anyone buying a truck.

    Got another question about the GCWR in the trailering section of the 2001 Sierra brochure.
    On the line for the 8100 V8 (L18) it shows the following GCWR :
    3.73 = 17,000lbs.
    4.10 = 19,000 lbs.
    3.73 = 20,000 lbs
    4.10 = 22,000 lbs.
    I don't understand how it can have the the same ratio twice and come up with a different GCWR, could it be a misprint.

    Also would the suspension on the 2500 8.1 be stiffer than the 2500 6.0.
    Thanks
  • ryanbabryanbab Member Posts: 7,240
    is there two because for
    3.73 = 17,000lbs.
    4.10 = 19,000 lbs
    These are for a 2wd
    and
    3.73 = 20,000 lbs
    4.10 = 22,000 lbs
    are for a 4wd???

    Just a thought

    Ryan
  • trampertramper Member Posts: 12
    Just ordered a 2500 'rado hd ext. cab long bed w/8.1, allison. Dealer said 3.73 was only avail. with duramax. Wanted the 3.73 hoping for a little better mpg, guess I will go the bigger tire route. Anybody have a clue why we don't have the 3.73 option? Dealer said 8 to 14 weeks to deliver. I suspect longer tho. Anybody know or heard any more about increasing production of 3/4 tons as greggaucho's[post #266 predicted]? Any news appreciated. tramper
  • suburbansrulesuburbansrule Member Posts: 34
    4x4 you've got one cool crew cab would like to see some pics with the new wheels. I'm going to order a crew cab on Monday, actually I should say I'm going to know if they accepted the order on Monday. I'm going with the 8.1 just so I have plenty of power. Thank you and everybody else for all the info that you post and for returning comments, its nice to chat with a bunch of GM finatics like I am.
    Travel safely,
    Suburbansrule

    ps. 4x4 would you be interested in selling the
    stock wheels you took off the crew cab?
  • hunter98hunter98 Member Posts: 273
    Im pretty sure the 3.73 is available with the 8.1L, and the 4.10 is also. But with the 6.0L only the 4.10 is available. Your dealer needs to check his computer.

    Good Luck

    Hunter
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