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Lexus ES 350
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Luckily, no such problems with my ES. Perfect drive every time.http://a332.g.akamai.net/f/332/936/12h/www.edmunds.com/media/townhall/webxi- cons/emotorcons/emo_smiley.gif
What killed the deal was that they low balled me by around 3K on my trade in. This is the third time in around 5 years that I've walked away from a Lexus dealer solely on what they were offering on my trade. They seem to make a habit of this. They would increase the trade in by 2K for me, but then they wanted to push the price of the Lexus back up to $41.5K! The previous 2 times, I've managed to get pretty much what I expected on the trade when I bought a different make of vehicle, so it's not as if I was asking too much on the trade in.
Whilst looking at Edmunds for a suitable replacement over the Lexus, I saw that Infiniti has a new G35 coming out for 2007. As I said above, my wife has the G35 Coupe which we both love, but I usually need a bigger car and neither of us cared for the look of the 2006 G35 sedan. However, we both love the look of the 2007 model, so come release time, I'll be heading to the Infiniti garage to pick one up. I know that at least Infiniti will be fair to me on the trade in side of the deal and I have a suppliers discount program with Nissan which will also help with the purchase price.
steering wheel ( knock on wood )
so far - super happy with my car.
During the test drive accelerating from 0 to 35-40 you could hear a pleasant growl from the engine, whereas the Lexus I don't remember hearing much engine sound at all. I assume crusing at highway speeds in fifth gear would be pretty quiet, I just don't know if it would be Lexus quiet.
One thing I noticed was the Lexus ES350 uses a heavy guage aluminum radiator where the tiny cooling fins are thick enough not to crush when hit by a bug traveling at 70mph. The Infiniti G35 had the same flimsy cooling fins that are on my 1997 Maxima. I suppose this doesn't matter (my Maxima still cools fine) but it makes me wonder what else is cheaper or different.
This is going to be a tough but fun decision. Hope you make the right one too.
Not intending to start a G vs. ES debate but IMHO the ES is a boulevard cruiser when compared to the new G in terms of handling, power, torque, & driving dynamics.
It does sound like a fun decision
Now, I'm reading through one of the owners manual.... I believe all the manuals together weigh about 5 lbs. I guess I've got my homework ahead of me.
One thing I was reading that the owner's manual explicitly stated that Octane 91 or above must be used. This must be a change to the original owner's manual as I've seen the wording in the earlier versions. I've used super for so many years so no big deal but was surprised that they changed the owner's manual. Note: Car is a Sept 2006 Build.
Seriously doubting I made a wise choice. One of the reasons happened when I phoned my dealer to inquire about winter tires. I live in Canada and have to get winter tires.
I was told I have to buy both the tires and the rims only from them. Total price is C$2600 for 4.
He said I cannot buy them anywhere else because the rims have sensors. If I don't use Lexus rims "half the dashboard won't work". :P
Yikes!
This after paying for a car that is sold in Canada at full price, which is thousands of dollars more than the US price (when using current conversion rates).
Has anyone else on this forum bought winter tires? From a non-Lexus dealer? Just the tires or rims too?
Thanks.
BTW, congratulations on your purchase, can't wait until I get mine.
Your Lexus dealer is trying to rip you off. This is a bit of a surprise since you got such a good deal on your initial purchase. With Lexus, the service & parts departments are separate business units from sales and are aparently run quite differently at your dealership.
You can even install the wheels/tires without the sensors - you will just have the low pressure warning come on - it will not make half the dashboard work - dealer is being dishonest
I don't know why you said I got a good deal on the intial purchase - it was no deal at all.
The following appeared in the Sept. 2006 Motor Trend in an article entitled "Backdraft: troubled by gas? Try cooling your fanny," by Arthur St. Antoine.
(Motor Trend 58.9 (Sept 2006): p28(1).)
"Amerigon's Climate Control Seat (unveiled on the 2000 Lincoln Navigator and now available on models from Ford, GM, Toyota, Nissan, and Hyundai) actively circulates cooled air through breathable cushion trim (the seat's solid-state heat pump is self-contained and runs independently from the car's climate control)."
So, assuming Toyota uses the best technology in their flagship Lexus line, the seats are actively cooled by their own heat pump.
They should have done better or simply deleted the feature as it really serves no purpose whatsoever on a hot summer's day.
Heck I would gladly have taken a strip of that great looking wood on the passenger side of the dash.
FWIW--I get no steering wheel vibration on my ES 350; as far as the engine noise is concerned, I can hear it but it's not like it overwhelms the cabin--i.e., at least at idle I can hear it just enough to know that it's running. OTOH if you're referring to louder noises such as knocking and the like--I don't hear any of that except for a very brief moment when the engine first starts up when cold...and even then the noise isn't that loud.
FWIW however--once I read the instructions in the ES manual a bit more closely, I realized that they are really more or less the same just like in the GMC manual; I say this because I chose to program another Homelink button on the ES and, rather than pull out the GMC manual again (why I just don't memorize the darn instructions, I have no idea!), I just went off of the ES manual...and gosh darn, I was able to program it on the first try.
Here's some of my thoughts.
First off, Lexus did a wonderful job and had enough cars that the lines to drive them weren't excessively long. The entire affair was handled with polish and class. Kudos to Lexus for an entertaining and informative afternoon.
Lexus LS 460 - Very much the "big brother" to our car. Nice but not drop dead "holy cow, I can't believe it" nice. Very fast, nicely balanced and pretty flat through s-curves. On the negative side, the throttle is still very non linear with small changes corresponding to either no change in power or massive "throw you back in the seat" acceleration; the brakes, too were very notchy and "grabby" with small moduations in pressure causing unpredictable and overly aggressive braking. All in all the drivetrain was a major dissappointment in it's lack of harmony and linkage. As this is clearly present in our cars (the ES) one begins to think that Lexus just can't get engines and tranny's to link together properly.
M-B S 550 - WOW!!! Both inside and out, this car radiates class and elegance. Literally everything about it pretty much screams "in this car you have reached the pinnacle of automotive sophistication and refinement." Everything looks like quality and radiates good taste. Awesome, simply awesome. The engine is incredibly torquey (sp?) and it feels like the ability to accelerate is limitless. Power delivery is entirely linear with the degree to which the accelerator is pressed and there is no hesitation whatsoever when you push the gas pedal. Power delivery is immediate with your right foot, the accelerator pedal and the drivetrain all feeling as if they are governed by one mind. Very impressive! The transmission is as smooth as fresh butter and you never feel any shift points at all. On the negative side, the car is heavy and the front end doesn't respond to rapid direction changes as nimbly as the Lexus. There is very little body lean, however and the car maintains a nice neutral posture thru s-curves. The steering is positively awful. The steering wheel is too big and feels like a Mack truck it's so heavily weighted. All this comes at a price (what doesn't?). $86k is what you'll need to bring one of these home.
BMW 750 - This is one seriously ugly car. And you know what? It gets even worse (if that's possible) when you get in. The interior looks cheap and as if it's ergonomics (I admittedly use the term loosely) were designed by a psychotic, retarded person. Buttons and knobs are strewn everywhere with little or no apparent planning. The button to adjust seat position is mindlessly placed on the side of the center stack by your right knee. Buttons are everywhere and you don't even want to get me started on the mind nubbingly dumb-assed "I-Drive" system. It's all a design and ergonomic nightmare. Chris Bangle should be shot for the exterior but whoever "designed" (again, I use the term loosely as this thing doesn't appear so much designed as thrown into some cosmic blender and put together based on whatever spilled out) should be given to Saddam Hussein's kids (if they were still alive, but I guess you get my point). Now onto something a bit more pleasant. The car drives like a dream. As with the M-B, there is total harmony between the engine, transmission and accelerator pedal. Power delivery is immediate and the thing is a rocket ship. There is essentially no body lean and it handles like a slot car. Pretty impressive for a 4500 lb. vehicle. There is simply nothing bad to say about the driving dynamics of this champ. If you could get by it's "Ugly Betty" appearance and hideous interior, this is a killer car. And a steal at "only" $74k.
Lexus SC 430 - Ughhh! Who buys this thing? It looks like an upside down bathtub. It's proportions are all wrong and it's cramped inside. It's not terribly fast and it handles like a Cunard ocean liner. I simply don't know what to say. This baby is just a joke.
Lexus GS 450h - OK, I'm on record as saying that I despise the hatchback appearance of the GS and I stick to that. And the interior is cramped. I couldn't car less about any dimensions that Lexus publishes that say that this is as roomy (or roomier) than the ES...it's not! You feel confined and claustrophobic. It's interior is quite spartan, perhaps taking its lead from it's target demographic, the BMW 5 Series. It's instrumentation is very nice, however and thankfully there are just enough buttons and knobs to control everything that needs to be controlled on a regular basis. You say you want power? Well, let me tell you, have you come to the right place! If the BMW 750 is a rocket ship (and it is), this thing is an anti-missile missle. This thing is frighteningly fast. This must be what driving a Ferrari is like (well, maybe not quite, but close). In very unLexus-like fashion, power delivery is pretty much immediate and the car feels like it could take off with another millimeter or two of accelerator travel. The chassis is as flat as a carpenter's level and it handles s-curves with complete composure and confidence. This thing is like driving a go cart at a carnival. Except it's much bigger, has a roof and goes a whole lot faster. Oh, and it costs just a little more too ($62k). The brakes are a little notchy in reassuringly Lexus-like fashion (what's the problem here guys, you can get this right...you really need to work on this..."Relentless Pursuit of Perfection" huh?...well you have some work to do here) and you have to be very careful modulating them or they grab way too hard, a characteristic seen on just about every Lexus vehicle. If Lexus wants to know how to do brakes right, they should just copy whatever M-B is doing because, let me tell you, they have it dead solid perfect.
OK, end of rant, er, I meant review.
Flame away!
For pure driving with nothing else considered I'd probably go for the GS 450h by a tiny margin over the BMW 750, but that'd be really close and you could make a very compelling case for either one.
The dreaded accelerator lag and lack of brake linearity is completely unacceptable on a car of this class.
I have to say... I am really sad that I'm hearing more and more owners reporting this transimission issue. I have been following the ES350 since Feb. when it was released at the Chicago auto show. I was 100% sure I was going to buy this car... but with this transimission issue, I have to basically pass on this car. To pay almost 40K for a car that could potentially have a major transmission issue... that scares the hell out of me. I really wish Toyota or Lexus would address this issue. I'm sure there are other customers that they are losing b/c of this. For me, I need to get another car in the next couple months. Although I'm looking at other cars (TL,RL,GS300,etc).... the ES350 would have been my #1 choice. Very depressing....
I turned in a 2003 ES350, and had no transmission problems with that car either.
I'm a very picky guy so don't think I'm just giving Lexus a pass on the problems.
I hope you will reconsider.
Regards.
I turned in a 2003 ES350, and had no transmission problems with that car either.
I'm a very picky guy so don't think I'm just giving Lexus a pass on the problems.
Thanks for your reply. It's good to hear some ES350 owneres who don't have any transmissions issues. I realize that no car is perfect in any means. There are always flaws or preferences that doesn't make everyone happy. Although, the transmission is a totally different thing. To me, that's a "major" issue. Yes, if there were more post on how Lexus fixed the issue, instead of ignoring or not being able to reproduce the problem. That would be more encouraging. I will definitely give the car a chance again.... maybe test drive again and talk to the Lexus dealer about my concerns. Maybe they will give me more insight and can reassure my concerns.
Btw, which package did you get? I wanted the Prem Plus w/ Nav.