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If we're done talking about Toyota in 2007, then we can retire this one. If we continue on the domestic vs import track, or talking about GM vehicles here, then I'm going to have assume we're done.
Again, our discussion here are topic-driven and not simply an open chat room deal where anything goes. Let's get this one back on track please.
As far as I'm concerned, Cadillac was, is, and always will be The Standard of the World! I don't care if I have a fortune bigger than that of Bill Gates. There will only be two makes of cars around my estate - Buicks and Cadillacs!
Where the heck have you been, dude? Cadillac hasn't offered any of that stuff in almost 15 years! Curb feelers NEVER were standard equipment on a Cadillac. They are aftermarket. If you see any modern Cadillac sporting that self-destructive add-on junk, blame the dealer and the car's owner. Fortunately, both I and the dealer from which I purchase my cars have the good taste to avoid this crap.
Workers will make miracles out of nothing if you let them.
Companies with worker suggestion programs seem to do better. I worked for RCA in the early 1970s. They would reward worker suggestions. I received several thousand dollars for ideas that were implemented. It was based on the real savings as a result of using the employees idea. It is a valuable resource that is not used much today. The mentality is you need a college education to have good ideas.
hypnosis44: I believe the writer is a journalist. Journalist interview people and report statements made by those they interview. I expect that she also interviewed those that had counter statements. If not she failed at the primary objective of journalism which is to collect information and condense it for distribution.
She is an expert on the auto industry. And if the assertion in her book is incorrect, someone would have challenged it. So far, no one has.
hypnosis44: Do you really think the President of GM after driving GM into a wall is going to say "I confess - I did it"? No, he is going to say that those who have no say in management decisions actually made the decisions for management. In short "The workers did it, not me!"
Her quote wasn't from the president of GM. It was from a supervisor, and he didn't have any more control over management decisions than a lineworker. And do you think that the UAW is going to admit, "We keep the lines overstaffed to pad membership numbers, thus ensuring more dues from members and more money for the union?"
The SUV/ Truck cash cow is over, and it may never return
If that is true, why is Toyota planning to sell 250k full size PU trucks in 2007? Why did they spend a huge pile of cash building a new plant in San Antonio to build those 250k Tundra PU trucks? It will be a long time before the PU truck market diminishes. The SUV market is diluted by all the CUVs being offered.
hypnosis44: The canard part of this is that it is not representative of employee wages nor presented in the context of the average pay for UAW workers. The corrections and actual earnings of UAW workers was widely reported in response to this. It would be similar to saying that some Toyota's or, name your make, blow up within 25 thousand miles. It is hyperbole at its most disengenus. Or as they say in politics; partially accurate, but untruthful. This site seems to be particularly redolent with anti american worker sentiment.
No, you specifically said that no line worker makes a six-figure salary, and you have been proven incorrect. (Research is a wonderful thing.)
Not all UAW members make that much money, but some (primarily the more skilled workers, from what I can tell) clearly do.
hypnosis44: You mean the Taylor system (of which this is a variation) invented by an American and rejected by American management and then adopted by the Japanese decades ago?
No...Taylorism was invented in the early 20th century, and actually adopted by Henry Ford I. You mean the Deming system, which was rejected by Detroit after World War II, and embraced by Japan.
I don't care where it comes from - it obviously works. That is what matterrs.
hypnosis44: Your original statement about workers, which you left out of the above, was pure cant and targeted those least able to defend themselves or to affect changes in management. It was a cowardly and destructive statement. Statements similar in tone and nature have done more to damage Americans than a hundred terrorist attacks ever will. Was it Terrorism? Yes!! Were you having a bad moment? maybe.
Nonsense. It was the truth, and sometimes the truth hurts. Deal with it. Get out of the union hall, and see both sides of this issue. You'll be better informed.
hypnosis44: Probably not quite: An increase in the value of the yen by 20% against the dollar would also affect the value of all other major currencies and would have them also bidding on the same property which would drive the price up.
You know, you'll have more credibility on this subject if you show some actual knowledge regarding it. I'm still trying to figure out where you ever got the idea that the exchange rate does not affect the price of goods.
hypnosis44: Providing people with jobs was what the building of America was about at one time. We ran up against the opposite to this during the Reagan era when forced buy outs and the destruction of towns and cities became "business as usual".
No, the goal of entrepreneurs who started a business was either to have their idea brought to life, or fulfill their dream. Providing a job to others was secondary.
Sorry, but history didn't start with the Reagan era, and if you believe that providing jobs was the main goal of businesses, then you need to do LOTS more research. You aren't too well-informed.
hypnosis44: When I was building my business part of the gratification was in creating jobs and affecting peoples lives, as well as being a art of the community. Now we let our people die.
And if you weren't concerned about making money while building your business, I'll bet that it didn't last too long. No business lasts long if it loses money, or only breaks even.
hypnosis44: I always love this elitist view of the world, it explains so much about the failure of management and the American business model.
Here's a quiz, focusing on the auto industry:
Who invented the self starter for automobiles?
Who came up with the idea of professionally styling vehicles and changing the looks every year to stimulate sales?
Who adapted the principles of the assembly line and mass production to the automobile industry?
Who designed the Model T?
Second question - were those milestones - all of which substantially grew the industry and generated new wealth - the result of the union (or workers) or the founder or highly place executives within the company (i.e., "management")?
hypnosis44: In owning my own businesses, as well as managing others, and for that matter every time I got a dividend check, I understood and appreciated that the workers had made the money for me. There are a million ideas floating around out there but without workers to make them happen, nothing happens but day dreams. The continued implicit and explicit denial of this reality by elitist management and investors continues to sap the moral spirit of American workers.
And without the entrepreneurs who take the risk to form the company or make their ideas a reality, those workers wouldn't have a job.
For that matter, if you hadn't got the ball rolling, neither would any of the people who worked for you.
Again - you need to realize that that unions (a collection of workers organized to represent their interests) can be as destructive and/or stupid as management. Pointing this out does not make one "anti-worker" or "elitist."
Sorry, but workers aren't saints. They aren't sinners, either (I never said they were). They are human beings, as prone to goodness and intelligent decisions - or selfishness and shortsightedness - as anyone else. If anyone can't see both sides of the issue here, it is you.
I'm lost and it looks like everyone else is also. Please keep your comments pertinent to the TOPIC! Also, the personal insinuations need to stop immediately. Don't make me get my delete finger warmed up.
Will Toyota be able to bolster sales up to double last year? That was their stated goal to sell 250k Tundra PU trucks. So far not so good. Through February the Tundra is off over 20% from a year ago. At current sales rate they will not top last years sales of the Tundra PU. What say ye Toyota fans?
2007 Toyota Tundra Makes a Strong Debut in the Large Pickup Segment, Power Information Network Reports - Daily Auto Insider The Daily Auto Insider Wednesday, March 21, 2007 March 2007
Initial trading patterns for the all-new 2007 Toyota Tundra suggest a strong start for this model in the domestic-dominated large pickup segment, according to real-time retail transaction data from the Power Information Network (PIN), a division of J.D. Power and Associates.
Since the all-new 2007 Toyota Tundra large pickup was launched in early February, owner loyalty for this model, which represents the percentage of Tundra owners who traded for another Tundra, is 53 percent (February only) — more than twice the January rate of its predecessor and more than 20 percentage points higher than in February of 2006, according to a PIN news release.
Additionally, trading from the Tundra to each of the mainstream domestic large pickups (Chevrolet Silverado 1500, Ford F-150, Ram 1500) dropped considerably in February when compared with January, while trading in the reverse direction increased.
Nevertheless, owners of domestic large pickups remained relatively loyal to their vehicles. According to PIN data, both the Silverado 1500 and F-150 experienced owner loyalty increases of 4 percentage points when comparing transactions in February to those in January, while the Ram's owner loyalty remained steady. (Loyalty for the Titan is not included since it has only been on the market for three and one-fourth years.)
The combination of increased Tundra loyalty and steady domestic model loyalty raised the large pickup segment share of industry from 12.4 percent in January to 14.4 percent in February.
"It's still early, and owner loyalty is just one measure of marketplace success, but so far the Tundra seems to be gaining strength in the segment," said Tom Libby, senior director of industry analysis at PIN. "This is an interesting scenario because the impressive strength of the Toyota juggernaut is being pitted against the domestics' long-time stronghold."
The Tundra's owner loyalty rose in February even though it sold at a higher average retail transaction price than any of its direct competitors. The actual retail transaction price for the all-new 2007 Tundra in February was $33,182 — almost $900 more than the F-150 ($32,312) and $1,450 more than the Silverado 1500 ($31,727). The Ram 1500 ($25,564) and the Titan ($27,664) both sold at prices considerably below the competition.
Four of five large pickup models sold with loans that included an annual percentage rate (APR) between 9 and 11 percent, while the F-150's APR was far below the competition at slightly more than 7 percent. The monthly payment for these models, purchased with a 72-month loan, ranged from $558 to $603.
"New products and stable fuel prices will drive a strong rebound in the large pickup segment in 2007, increasing from 13.5 percent of the total sales market in 2006 to 14.2 percent," said Jeff Schuster, executive director of automotive intelligence at J.D. Power and Associates. "Toyota dove head first into a very competitive segment with a solid entry, and although the model lineup is not yet as robust as the competition, we expect the Tundra to nearly double in volume from 124,508 in 2006 to 210,000 in 2007."
PIN data also indicates that while the national transaction price for the 2007 Tundra was the highest in the competitive set, the Tundra did not sell at the highest price in every region of the country. Specifically, the Tundra commanded the highest transaction price in the Midwest, Southwest and West, but its price was second highest in the Northeast (after the F-150) and third in the Southeast (after the Silverado 1500 and F-150). Additionally, the Tundra's price ranged from a high of $34,394 in the West to a low of $32,796 in the Southwest. Transaction prices in the Southwest for each of the five large pickup models were lower than in any other region, reflecting the fierce competition in large pickups in this particular part of the country.
Some one is not telling the truth. AutoSite shows a 21% decline in Tundra sales from last year. GM full size trucks are up 12% in that same time frame.
Still ramping up. Final goal when all is in place is 250k. Right now, the target is about 150k - 175k. They will achieve that with minimal incentives I predict. I don't know where you are, but sales have really taken off here in N.E. My buddy even dumped his 06' GMC (lemon #2) for one a bout a week ago and he works for GM as a service mngr. That says something about how strong a contender the new Tundra is.
Bring on the diesels, the duallies and the HD lineup. That should really help them gain an even stronger foothold, all of it of course built in the good ol USofA :shades:
Bring on the diesels, the duallies and the HD lineup. That should really help them gain an even stronger foothold, all of it of course built in the good ol USofA
I dont think Toyota will bring the HD duty TUNDRA just out of pity for the domestics. I mean all three of them are flirting with bankruptcy (especially FORD and CHRYSLER). The full size truck is their last line of defense. If they lose that market they are finsihed.
Your comments about economy and helping developing countries is all fine and dandy, but you didn't address what I was explaining concerning the bad path this country is taking and the repercussions that we will experience when other countries-Japan/China acquire the revenue necessary to dictate the worlds (that includes the United States) economy. U.S. goods will go up quite a bit when we no longer are the richest country. This is not about where the products are made, it is about where the money ends up.
Toyota is still a ways away from catching up to GM in US marketshare. I think they still lag behind Ford as well.
I also think a full lineup of Tundra models will make for healthy competition amongst the segment. Trust me, I am a Ford guy at heart and I have faith that the next F-150 will leapfrog the competition in capabilities (Heck, right now they have the best payload and towing for their class even though they are some of the oldest designs) It's good to see outside competition putting everyone on notice. The consumer wins in the end.
It's pretty much just a perception thing. There isn't much of a difference in quality from brand to brand now-a-days. The last couple years haven't been good for Toyota but they are still selling well based on perception.
I know, I was responding to a posters claim of heavy/increasing anti-American worker sentiment. Those folks building the Tundra have every bit of support from me as the guys building F-150's and Silverados. I think most people agree as it would be rude to wish good American jobs to disappear from the landscape.
I know that you are bringing the discussion back on course as requested ... but the month of Feb was at best a half-month. Most 2006's were sold out and the 2007's only began to trickle in by 2-5. .. then the buyers had to look the few over. .. then the buyers had to decide which new model to get. .. then the dealers had to fight the fact that the initial shipments from TX were mainly Reg Cab base models @ $23000+ .. but the buyers are requesting/buying the Dble Cabs. .. so the RC's sit as lot anchors while there are few if any DC's in any configuration.
Ramp up is difficult and it's way too early to judge anything after 3 weeks of sales and a plant that is just coming on stream.
The last couple years haven't been good for Toyota but they are still selling well based on perception
Huh? I can't believe that we exist in the same world. What are we perceiving differently. What has not been good for Toyota? Sales up, profits up, new investments all over the place, new products such as hybrids and trucks coming out every 6 months that are changing the vehicle industry.
If you're mentioning being more in the spotlight and taking heat from every source imaginable from the Bluewater greenies to the goofball press blaming them for 100 years of pollution in Canada then yes it's been 'difficult'. But that's OK. Being in the spotlight means fending off the slings and arrows while having a thick skin and holding the course. Business is never easy.
I consider millions of vehicles recalled due to lawsuits brought about by Toyota trying to cover up steering and sludge problems significant. I am also sure as a salesman you do not dwell on such problems. Or point out that was a long time ago. I do not consider claims settled last year that were in the courts for 6 years a long time ago. Toyota better hope they do better with the new Tundra than Nissan has done with the Titan. What started out with a bang for Nissan is less than a pop in sales now.
They will be lucky to sell 175,000 this year. This could be another Titan like truck, so don't get too excited.
On another site a-t-b-o- last week they had a report from Toyota stating because of the slow sales of the Tundra, they are holding off plans for the HD models.
Nissan has also announced that the planned 2010 HD models that were to feature the Navistar diesel (same as the Fords) have been canceled.
Didn't you read the C&D driver article. It says the Tundra is selling very well. It could very well happen that FORD and CHRYSLER will cease to exist in three years and GM will be the sole American car company battling with TOYOTA.
I haven't read it, but my above post has information relating to current information not a magazine that has delayed printing information, but usually good information none-the-less.
Yes, there may be some truth to that, but the history still stands and the Cadillac brand is still the best known though there are others in the segment. You are right about the foreign car status that for some reason people feel proud to buy based on that. A friend of mine has that popular Lexus 330 model SUV. It is nice but for the money I would rather have a Buick Renevous or the new GM SAV that Buick, GMC, and Saturn produce.
Cadillac is no longer the best known luxury brand in the world. Mercedes has taken over that spot (and Rolls Royce holds it in the ultra-luxury market), and has held it since at least the early 1970s.
Lexus is still not sold in many parts of the world, so Cadillac is better known than Lexus outside the U.S.
Mercedes are sold throughout the world - Europe, Asia, South America and Africa. In some of those places, Cadillacs are not even available. And not just the smaller Mercedes, or the models used as taxicabs, but the S-Class models. Go to Europe, Asia, South America or Africa...more than likely, the truly rich are riding around in a Mercedes S-Class.
The 5.7 is a little pricey, but the truck is in the ballpark of domestic pricing. And the Tundra holds its value quite well, so if resale value is important...
C'mon up to Mass. around tax day. Last year, dealers were offering 12 grand off full size Chevy utes and pickups...
And there's the meat and potatoes of this discussion. The Titan bombed....and it actually is a pretty good truck. Better quality, in fact, than the new Tundra. It's built stronger, with better componants. I'm not sure exactly what Toyota was thinking coming out with a new truck than uses a c-channel frame with rivets holding the crossmembers together. Maybe they thought their untouchable by the press reputation would make up for their shortcommings. Easy. I know that you Toyota salemen that spend all day posting propoganda on Edmunds are going to respond with all kinds of good reasons for using inferior materials and manufacturing processes, but the bottom line is the Toyota truck has the lowest crash rating of any full size truck made. I dont think you can earn that honor using top notch materials. The bottom line is that every other half ton truck made - Ford, Chevy, Nissan, and dodge (for crying out lowd) are better trucks, and all of them cost substantially less. How can you be the last manufacturer to come out with a current generation truck, charge more for it, and still be inferior? Boys, it's gonna be a long year.
This point is misleading. American Toyota workers replace American Ford/GM workers at a dispropotionate rate. Buying a Toyota in no way supports the USA wether it was assembled here or not....the money goes to Japan.
Ford sold more F-150s in the Dallas / Ft Worth Metro area than Toyota did nationwide in it's first month. Sure, Toyota's sales were up last fall....they were giving away the 2006 Tundras with 0% interest. Keep your shirt on. The Toyota truck is no world beater. They should have called it the "Titan II".
Tundra's have held their value fairly well the past few years...as have Ford and Chevy trucks. History speaks for itself. 12 grand off ads mean zippo. Go try to find a nice, cheap pre-owned Chevy, Ford, or Toyota 1/2 ton at a bargain price and see how far you get.
The real test for the Tundra will be contractors using a truck as a truck. Bouncing from one pad to the next on new terraced lots. When the frame breaks in two it will make news.
I have also heard the excuse that the new Tundra is not selling because everyone wants a crew cab not a regular cab. Seems Toyota missed the mark and built more regular cabs than they can sell. Regular cab PU trucks are sold to fleet buyers. I cannot see Toyota cutting into that market with an unproven Truck.
I don't know where you get you ideas from, but Tundra hasn't proved to be a lower-quality truck. So you can ease up on the lies. The trucks been out for 6 weeks?
All we really know about the truck is it is extremely powerful, tows a lot, and doesn't have a fully-boxed frame. There are more crash tests to come, and how many full-size truck buyers weigh that heavily? Pretty hard to get hurt in one of these, if wearing a seat belt. Let's wait for the IIHS test before selling the house, k?
It's too early to tell how it will sell, they aren't even fully-ramped up yet! :confuse:
OK lets throw a little logic onto your rant and see if any of it makes sense.
Name one specific benefit to the fully boxed frame with some verifiable data to support it. Don't bother, there is none. We've beaten that horse to death. I'm not sure if you realize that the open C frame is just under the bed. Ohhhh you didn't. I understand your post then.
Your math is fuzzy too. While yes the Reg Cabs are way off the market, intentionally, and are sitting unsold the Double Cabs are priced anywhere from $2000 to $5000 under the the others ( all equipment the same ). These are in short supply.
The CrewMax's just arrived and there are waiting lists. Go figure.
Comments
Again, our discussion here are topic-driven and not simply an open chat room deal where anything goes. Let's get this one back on track please.
Companies with worker suggestion programs seem to do better. I worked for RCA in the early 1970s. They would reward worker suggestions. I received several thousand dollars for ideas that were implemented. It was based on the real savings as a result of using the employees idea. It is a valuable resource that is not used much today. The mentality is you need a college education to have good ideas.
She is an expert on the auto industry. And if the assertion in her book is incorrect, someone would have challenged it. So far, no one has.
hypnosis44: Do you really think the President of GM after driving GM into a wall is going to say "I confess - I did it"? No, he is going to say that those who have no say in management decisions actually made the decisions for management. In short "The workers did it, not me!"
Her quote wasn't from the president of GM. It was from a supervisor, and he didn't have any more control over management decisions than a lineworker. And do you think that the UAW is going to admit, "We keep the lines overstaffed to pad membership numbers, thus ensuring more dues from members and more money for the union?"
If that is true, why is Toyota planning to sell 250k full size PU trucks in 2007? Why did they spend a huge pile of cash building a new plant in San Antonio to build those 250k Tundra PU trucks? It will be a long time before the PU truck market diminishes. The SUV market is diluted by all the CUVs being offered.
No, you specifically said that no line worker makes a six-figure salary, and you have been proven incorrect. (Research is a wonderful thing.)
Not all UAW members make that much money, but some (primarily the more skilled workers, from what I can tell) clearly do.
No...Taylorism was invented in the early 20th century, and actually adopted by Henry Ford I. You mean the Deming system, which was rejected by Detroit after World War II, and embraced by Japan.
I don't care where it comes from - it obviously works. That is what matterrs.
Nonsense. It was the truth, and sometimes the truth hurts. Deal with it. Get out of the union hall, and see both sides of this issue. You'll be better informed.
You know, you'll have more credibility on this subject if you show some actual knowledge regarding it. I'm still trying to figure out where you ever got the idea that the exchange rate does not affect the price of goods.
No, the goal of entrepreneurs who started a business was either to have their idea brought to life, or fulfill their dream. Providing a job to others was secondary.
Sorry, but history didn't start with the Reagan era, and if you believe that providing jobs was the main goal of businesses, then you need to do LOTS more research. You aren't too well-informed.
hypnosis44: When I was building my business part of the gratification was in creating jobs and affecting peoples lives, as well as being a art of the community. Now we let our people die.
And if you weren't concerned about making money while building your business, I'll bet that it didn't last too long. No business lasts long if it loses money, or only breaks even.
Here's a quiz, focusing on the auto industry:
Who invented the self starter for automobiles?
Who came up with the idea of professionally styling vehicles and changing the looks every year to stimulate sales?
Who adapted the principles of the assembly line and mass production to the automobile industry?
Who designed the Model T?
Second question - were those milestones - all of which substantially grew the industry and generated new wealth - the result of the union (or workers) or the founder or highly place executives within the company (i.e., "management")?
hypnosis44: In owning my own businesses, as well as managing others, and for that matter every time I got a dividend check, I understood and appreciated that the workers had made the money for me. There are a million ideas floating around out there but without workers to make them happen, nothing happens but day dreams. The continued implicit and explicit denial of this reality by elitist management and investors continues to sap the moral spirit of American workers.
And without the entrepreneurs who take the risk to form the company or make their ideas a reality, those workers wouldn't have a job.
For that matter, if you hadn't got the ball rolling, neither would any of the people who worked for you.
Again - you need to realize that that unions (a collection of workers organized to represent their interests) can be as destructive and/or stupid as management. Pointing this out does not make one "anti-worker" or "elitist."
Sorry, but workers aren't saints. They aren't sinners, either (I never said they were). They are human beings, as prone to goodness and intelligent decisions - or selfishness and shortsightedness - as anyone else. If anyone can't see both sides of the issue here, it is you.
2007 Toyota Tundra Makes a Strong Debut in the Large Pickup Segment, Power Information Network Reports - Daily Auto Insider
The Daily Auto Insider
Wednesday, March 21, 2007
March 2007
Initial trading patterns for the all-new 2007 Toyota Tundra suggest a strong start for this model in the domestic-dominated large pickup segment, according to real-time retail transaction data from the Power Information Network (PIN), a division of J.D. Power and Associates.
Since the all-new 2007 Toyota Tundra large pickup was launched in early February, owner loyalty for this model, which represents the percentage of Tundra owners who traded for another Tundra, is 53 percent (February only) — more than twice the January rate of its predecessor and more than 20 percentage points higher than in February of 2006, according to a PIN news release.
Additionally, trading from the Tundra to each of the mainstream domestic large pickups (Chevrolet Silverado 1500, Ford F-150, Ram 1500) dropped considerably in February when compared with January, while trading in the reverse direction increased.
Nevertheless, owners of domestic large pickups remained relatively loyal to their vehicles. According to PIN data, both the Silverado 1500 and F-150 experienced owner loyalty increases of 4 percentage points when comparing transactions in February to those in January, while the Ram's owner loyalty remained steady. (Loyalty for the Titan is not included since it has only been on the market for three and one-fourth years.)
The combination of increased Tundra loyalty and steady domestic model loyalty raised the large pickup segment share of industry from 12.4 percent in January to 14.4 percent in February.
"It's still early, and owner loyalty is just one measure of marketplace success, but so far the Tundra seems to be gaining strength in the segment," said Tom Libby, senior director of industry analysis at PIN. "This is an interesting scenario because the impressive strength of the Toyota juggernaut is being pitted against the domestics' long-time stronghold."
The Tundra's owner loyalty rose in February even though it sold at a higher average retail transaction price than any of its direct competitors. The actual retail transaction price for the all-new 2007 Tundra in February was $33,182 — almost $900 more than the F-150 ($32,312) and $1,450 more than the Silverado 1500 ($31,727). The Ram 1500 ($25,564) and the Titan ($27,664) both sold at prices considerably below the competition.
Four of five large pickup models sold with loans that included an annual percentage rate (APR) between 9 and 11 percent, while the F-150's APR was far below the competition at slightly more than 7 percent. The monthly payment for these models, purchased with a 72-month loan, ranged from $558 to $603.
"New products and stable fuel prices will drive a strong rebound in the large pickup segment in 2007, increasing from 13.5 percent of the total sales market in 2006 to 14.2 percent," said Jeff Schuster, executive director of automotive intelligence at J.D. Power and Associates. "Toyota dove head first into a very competitive segment with a solid entry, and although the model lineup is not yet as robust as the competition, we expect the Tundra to nearly double in volume from 124,508 in 2006 to 210,000 in 2007."
PIN data also indicates that while the national transaction price for the 2007 Tundra was the highest in the competitive set, the Tundra did not sell at the highest price in every region of the country. Specifically, the Tundra commanded the highest transaction price in the Midwest, Southwest and West, but its price was second highest in the Northeast (after the F-150) and third in the Southeast (after the Silverado 1500 and F-150). Additionally, the Tundra's price ranged from a high of $34,394 in the West to a low of $32,796 in the Southwest. Transaction prices in the Southwest for each of the five large pickup models were lower than in any other region, reflecting the fierce competition in large pickups in this particular part of the country.
GM
Truck sales
Bring on the diesels, the duallies and the HD lineup. That should really help them gain an even stronger foothold, all of it of course built in the good ol USofA :shades:
I dont think Toyota will bring the HD duty TUNDRA just out of pity for the domestics. I mean all three of them are flirting with bankruptcy (especially FORD and CHRYSLER). The full size truck is their last line of defense. If they lose that market they are finsihed.
I also think a full lineup of Tundra models will make for healthy competition amongst the segment. Trust me, I am a Ford guy at heart and I have faith that the next F-150 will leapfrog the competition in capabilities (Heck, right now they have the best payload and towing for their class even though they are some of the oldest designs) It's good to see outside competition putting everyone on notice. The consumer wins in the end.
.. then the buyers had to look the few over.
.. then the buyers had to decide which new model to get.
.. then the dealers had to fight the fact that the initial shipments from TX were mainly Reg Cab base models @ $23000+
.. but the buyers are requesting/buying the Dble Cabs.
.. so the RC's sit as lot anchors while there are few if any DC's in any configuration.
Ramp up is difficult and it's way too early to judge anything after 3 weeks of sales and a plant that is just coming on stream.
Revisit this in 4th Qtr.
Huh?
I can't believe that we exist in the same world. What are we perceiving differently. What has not been good for Toyota? Sales up, profits up, new investments all over the place, new products such as hybrids and trucks coming out every 6 months that are changing the vehicle industry.
If you're mentioning being more in the spotlight and taking heat from every source imaginable from the Bluewater greenies to the goofball press blaming them for 100 years of pollution in Canada then yes it's been 'difficult'. But that's OK. Being in the spotlight means fending off the slings and arrows while having a thick skin and holding the course. Business is never easy.
Again, zero to do with Toyota...
Like it or not, today Cadillac is playing second fiddle in status and prestige to Mercedes and Lexus in even its home market.
On another site a-t-b-o- last week they had a report from Toyota stating because of the slow sales of the Tundra, they are holding off plans for the HD models.
Nissan has also announced that the planned 2010 HD models that were to feature the Navistar diesel (same as the Fords) have been canceled.
Lexus is still not sold in many parts of the world, so Cadillac is better known than Lexus outside the U.S.
Mercedes are sold throughout the world - Europe, Asia, South America and Africa. In some of those places, Cadillacs are not even available. And not just the smaller Mercedes, or the models used as taxicabs, but the S-Class models. Go to Europe, Asia, South America or Africa...more than likely, the truly rich are riding around in a Mercedes S-Class.
incentive to get its own dealers to buy one !!!!!!!!!
Or is it they are too expensive?
http://www.www.autoblog.com/2007/03/17/toyota-offers-tundra-deal-to-dealers/
C'mon up to Mass. around tax day. Last year, dealers were offering 12 grand off full size Chevy utes and pickups...
I have also heard the excuse that the new Tundra is not selling because everyone wants a crew cab not a regular cab. Seems Toyota missed the mark and built more regular cabs than they can sell. Regular cab PU trucks are sold to fleet buyers. I cannot see Toyota cutting into that market with an unproven Truck.
All we really know about the truck is it is extremely powerful, tows a lot, and doesn't have a fully-boxed frame. There are more crash tests to come, and how many full-size truck buyers weigh that heavily? Pretty hard to get hurt in one of these, if wearing a seat belt. Let's wait for the IIHS test before selling the house, k?
It's too early to tell how it will sell, they aren't even fully-ramped up yet! :confuse:
It'll be a good, not great year.
DrFill
Name one specific benefit to the fully boxed frame with some verifiable data to support it. Don't bother, there is none. We've beaten that horse to death. I'm not sure if you realize that the open C frame is just under the bed. Ohhhh you didn't. I understand your post then.
Your math is fuzzy too. While yes the Reg Cabs are way off the market, intentionally, and are sitting unsold the Double Cabs are priced anywhere from $2000 to $5000 under the the others ( all equipment the same ). These are in short supply.
The CrewMax's just arrived and there are waiting lists. Go figure.