Haven't had much luck with their appliances. Fridge lost an ice maker and still frosts up, dishwasher broke entirely, and the microwave broke a 2nd time and we replaced that as well.
Haven't had much luck with their appliances. Fridge lost an ice maker and still frosts up, dishwasher broke entirely, and the microwave broke a 2nd time and we replaced that as well.
GM sold the Fridigaire brand in 1979 - doubt your appliances had anything to do with GM.
Most major appliances are made in Mexico and Korea. Whirlpool is still the big player. I know they keep closing USA factories putting more Americans on the Unemployment lines. Frigidaire is a bit player owned by Electrolux which is a Swedish company. Many household appliance names are part of that conglomerate. Bottom line we don't make enough appliances in the USA to spit at. Same place our cars will be in another 10 years.
I would bet there are still some UAW holdovers that are still there, sabotaging the product as always...
If that's the case, there were probably some former [non-permissible content removed] still building Benzes in the '80's and former Tojo henchmen building Toyotas then too.
It's all relative.
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Your right to resell your own stuff is in peril It could become illegal to resell your iPhone 4, car or family antiques
The Supreme Court is scheduled to hear oral arguments on the case on Oct. 29.
Both Ammori and Band worry that a decision in favor of the lower court would lead to some strange, even absurd consequences. For example, it could become an incentive for manufacturers to have everything produced overseas because they would be able to control every resale.
It could also become a weighty issue for auto trade-ins and resales, considering about 40% of most U.S.-made cars carry technology and parts that were made overseas.
about Chrysler, my '95 Dodge, and the useless worthless UAW workers that built and assembled it. I wonder if those maggots realize they are so useless.
I was watching a show on animal planet about the circle of life and a dead hippo and elephant carcass was feeding a lot of wildlife. I then realized that calling them maggots was far too complimentary.
There were thousands of maggots on the carcasses, but I realized that UAW workers were less productive than the maggots, as the maggots perform a vital service and function of cleaning up the waste of the world; whereas UAW workers make the waste themselves. :shades:
'21 BMW X3 M40i, '15 Audi S4, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
The demise of the domestics was for sure the blame of the companies from top to bottom. From the CEO to the Janitors, they were all over paid and not doing the best job possible. I'm not convinced the GM is doing a whole lot better. I think they could end their USA operations and end up making more off their Chinese sales. GM is being propped up by our tax dollars. With subsidies and government fleet sales. I don't think the UAW appreciates our sacrifice for their benefit.
I think the Chicken Tax may be going away over the next several years as part of KORUS. However it is probably hurting GM and Ford more than Toyota and Nissan.
When the Ranger was stopped in December 2011, it had already sold 70,000 models that year. Compact pickups are still a significant segment, with Rangers still being sold off Ford lots today.
Toyota and Nissan now stand un-opposed; with Toyota selling more than 12,000 Tacoma’s this past month alone. That shows that there are still buyers in the compact pickup market, and that a proper small pickup is still more important to truck-buyers than something like the Honda Ridgeline (which couldn’t sell more than 1,000 last month.)
Oh no question anyone involved, associated, or related to the making of my '95 Dodge was either highly incompetent or highly criminal and fraudulent.
The managers pulling the strings, the engineers planning obsolescence, and the assemblers all share blame.
I used to say the only redeeming feature on the car was the engine, but since I've found out head gasket repair at 40-45K miles could be considered a powertrain/engine issue, I can't even say that.
I never replaced the seats, the trunk liner (though I had to realign it a couple times), and......
It's easier for me to list parts that were replaced.
'21 BMW X3 M40i, '15 Audi S4, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
Man, for how lousy yours was, I sure still see a fair number around, as they are approaching twenty model years old. And the ones I see typically aren't spewing smoke or have huge holes in them either.
I can't say that about same-era Hondas I see...rustout above where the rear plastic bumper wraps around the side. Same with the previous-generation Dodge trucks...big holes above the rear wheel openings.
2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
Speaking of logic... I don't see any valid arguments as to why Civic owners are more anxious to sell than Neon owners? Anyone got a good argument as to why that would be the case?
Do you really want try and argue Neon owners are happier and more satisfied than Civic owners??? Last I checked, Chrysler was on bailout #2 working on 3 and Honda is just fine.
You are implying the amount of cars for sale isn't reflective of those left on the road, but I don't see any logical arguments as to why that wouldn't be the case here!!! Feel free to try. I have a feeling they will all be pure malarkey!
'21 BMW X3 M40i, '15 Audi S4, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
By your own yardstick, then, you buy into the advertisement that Chevy trucks are the most dependable, longest-lasting trucks on the road, correct? By those left on the road, that is how they are measuring.
I think old Neons are apparently cheap to buy, cheap to fix and that is the reason I see so many here in salty NE Ohio.
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I think old Neons are apparently cheap to buy, cheap to fix and that is the reason I see so many here in salty NE Ohio.
Well I'll agree they're cheap. I don't see many Neons on the road around here. Not that it means anything. I know several people happily driving older high mileage vehicles which I wouldn't tolerate on a daily basis.
My FIL is content with his 95 Tahoe with 180k. To me it should be crushed. It drives like crap, stinks when it runs, a/c doesn't work, power seats and power locks blow fuses constantly, and leaks oil on my driveway. But the truck runs. So I guess that can count towards being the most dependable trucks on the road. But most people would have dumped it 10 years ago.
I owned a '95 Neon Sport 2dr. Not the worst car I've owned, but from my experience, a Civic of that period was a better car overall. At least based on my comparison with a buddies '94 Civic Si that he owned when I had my Neon. I had the Neon for 3 years and 75k miles. Nothing horrible happened, but it certainly was in the shop for lots of little things. Plus by 75k miles it started to degrade fast.
Civics were certainly more reliable overall. IIRC the Neon had more room.
First gen Neons are virtually all gone here in the northwest, too. Especially coupes, which are hens teeth. I see second gen cars a bit though.
My brother had a nearly new first gen coupe, a 96 I think. He hated it after awhile, and that's saying something when his previous car was a K-car. He was happy when it got hit and totaled, and replaced by a Subaru.
Buying American sounds wonderful. However we have to make what people want at a price they are willing to pay. Some here seem to think this happened over night. When I bought a new Land Cruiser in 1964 I wanted a CJ Jeep. To get one equal to the Land Cruiser in power and features it was almost double the price. And the best one on the market was the Datsun which was also more than the Toyota. So we were losing market share long before we started sending jobs to Mexico and elsewhere. If we cannot compete don't expect the Guvmint to fix it. Both parties are selling US out as we speak. NAFTA, KORUS now TPPA. Perot warned US, but too many people were entrenched into their parties, to think before they voted. Same will happen again this year.
Not just that, but we now have a gubbamint who has made it so country of origin can be virtually impossible to determine for many products. Hard to buy American when the treacherous corporate slime who control both parties have legislated their way to even further deception.
Actually that is a direct result of our participation in the UN and WTO. We lost our lawsuit on Country of Origin Labeling. In other words we are allowing a bunch of slime balls in the WTO tell US what to do with imported goods. The fact that our food may contain toxic ingredients from China is no longer labeled on our food. Unless a product says it is from USA grown whatever it probably is not. 80% of the juice we get is now from China. I quit drinking any juice I have not squeezed from fruit I grow or picked.
Sorry, I can't read your message on my Taiwanese smartphone, guess I'll have to put on my Vietnamese shirt and Indonesian pants and drive my Korean car over to Wal-Mart to buy some German beer and Mexican hot sauce. :shades:
It would be entertaining to try to find a big "American" corporation. Ford sure seems American at first glance but they, like GM and Chrysler and the rest operate worldwide, with employees and suppliers all over.
Ditto Apple, Microsoft.
Take something "simple" like Hershey that exists to sell candy bars to generate profits to run all the homes for wayward kids. They have at least one Mexican factory and are increasingly focused toward China.
You like Dagoba or Scharffen Berger? That's Hershey. Most of the cocoa comes from West Africa.
You want to forgo a candy bar because the country of origin label says Ivory Coast?
Found 54 Civics, 5 Dodge Neons. However, remember that in those days they also had the Plymouth Neon. But, searching on that one, I only found two.
So, in my case, that's 54-7 in favor of the Civic.
For criteria I used 1994-2000 for all models. The Neon came out in early 1994 as a 1995, but I still used 1994 as a starting point just in case anyone happened to list an early Neon erroneously as a "94".
The Civic no doubt outsold the Neon every single year, but I'd imagine that in most years, it was either 2:1 or 3:1. But never 7.7:1 (54:7)!
However, I'd also wager that reliability was not the only factor at play here. No doubt, the Civic was much more reliable than the Neon, especially in the Neon's early years. But, keep in mind that poor resale value ensured that the Neon would total out more easily. In fact, a friend of mine lost a 2nd-gen Neon a few years ago when someone sideswiped it. Damage was relatively minor, but enough to total it. Unfortunately his replacement car, a 2003 or so Hyundai Sonata suffered the same fate. He rear-ended a truck that had a trailer hitch, at low speed, but it was still enough to total the car.
Demographics might come into play as well. A lot of young people buy Civics, but a lot of middle-age and older people buy them as well, and they're going to, as a general rule, take better care of their cars and hold onto them longer. I think the demographics for the Neon, especially the first generation, were seriously skewed towards younger people, who tended to buy them and rag them out, wreck them, neglect them, get them repossessed, etc.
But, don't worry, despite my defense of the Neon, I'm not in the market for a used one!
Andre, I think you're pretty much spot on. As much as some may argue, demographics/economics explain a lot of it. No question a minor wreck or expensive mechanical failure will send a Neon to the bone yard far quicker than a similar year Civic.
There was a dealer film on Youtube promoting the 1966 Chevrolet Nova. At one point, the narrator notes that the scrappage rate for 1956 Fords is about 10 times higher than the rate for 1956 Chevrolets (during the 1964-65 timeframe).
Granted, the 1956 Chevrolet had better rust resistance than the 1956 Ford, but I'd wager that lots more people simply WANTED to save the Chevrolets versus the Fords. The 1955-57 Chevrolets were already considered to be desirable cars, even if not necessarily collectible cars, by the mid-1960s.
Of course, those Chevrolets were more desirable because they were all-around better cars compared to the Fords (and, I'm guessing, the 1956 Plymouths, too)...much like the Civic versus the Neon.
The 1955-57 Chevrolets were already considered to be desirable cars, even if not necessarily collectible cars, by the mid-1960s.
That's definitely true. Back in college when I worked at Denny's, I remember talking old cars with the general manager, and mentioned I'd love to get a 1957 DeSoto. He said that, in 1965, his first car was a '57 DeSoto, Fireflite 4-door hardtop, pink with a white roof and spear. Paid $500 for it. He said that at the time it was considered a major loser car, but it was fast, and could embarrass plenty of hipper, cooler cars in a drag race. Still, he couldn't shake the loser image (I'm sure being a 4-door hurt it almost as much as being an orphan), and got a '57 Chevy Bel Air convertible before too long. He only paid $500 for it, as well. It wasn't nearly as fast as the DeSoto, but was considered a much cooler car at the time.
Even to this day, whenever I think of a '55-56 Ford I immediately think of Aunt Bea on the Andy Griffith show, and associate it with a nice, pleasant enough car, but kinda conservative and stodgy. But when I think of a '56 Chevy I think of a much more youthful, hip car. I'd put the Plymouth somewhere in between, but I think by the mid 60's the tailfins were really dating it, compared to a Chevy or Ford which had much more modest fins. And a '56 Plymouth is a bit big compared to a Chevy or Ford, as well.
The interesting part is that, up until 1955, FORD had the reputation as the "youthful" car in the low-price field, thanks to the flathead V-8 and better styling compared to the Chevrolet and Plymouth. Park a 1953 Ford next to that year's Chevrolet and Plymouth - it's no contest!
But the 1955 Chevrolet, with its new V-8 and sharp styling, completely reversed those respective images overnight.
As for the image of the 1957 DeSoto, there wasn't any nostalgia for 1950s styling in the 1960s. Buyers considered cars with large fins and other exaggerated styling features to be very dated and old-fashioned looking. I remember reading that, by the mid-1960s, you couldn't give 1959 Cadillac away!
The only 1950s cars people were really saving in the 1960s were the 1955-57 Thunderbirds, 1955-57 Chevrolets, and...the Edsel! The first two because of clean and handsome styling (and changes to the succeeding generations), and the third because it was already a cult car.
Operate worldwide, but where an item is refined and/or assembled is key. I can buy a GM car made in Korea or Germany or Mexico, but they are labeled as such, and the company is American. Thank heavens for the VIN, I guess.
I like Lindt and those Costco peanut butter cups :shades:
I don't buy this self-destructive one world ideology some (including here...) wish to foist upon us. None of those candy bars are actually refined and produced in Ivory Coast, that's a simple raw material. Not every part in a German car is made in Germany either, but the final assembly is there, and that's important.
It must be voluntary. I drink a juice that claims to be "from Brazil and USA". For eons, I had a problem finding a toothbrush with a country of origin label, but recently found one made in Switzerland (and it wasn't expensive). I won't consume anything made in China, and if I had pets I would be very leery of that too. Watch out for dog treats, there was recently an issue, and the corporate owned media didn't seem to mention it.
That's one reason why the area I live in is so economically depressed. Anything logged or mined is shipped out for processing and manufacturing into the finished product.
But we're too far from the economic centers and skilled employees to set up something as simple as a furniture factory. The shipping alone would kill you before you got up and running.
If country of origin final assembly was critical, Mercedes would eat the freight and close the Alabama factory. Means squat. What counts is management and a pool of trained workers and competent suppliers. The location is just important for transportation and infrastructure and currency reasons. And of course politics.
Don't impose a duty on our imports; we'd have to shut down a line in Tuscaloosa. :P
This morning, at Bob Evans in Breezewood, PA, I saw another Neon! A second-generation white car, with black "racing" stripes and black wheels. It was clean and rust-free and apparently running!
2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
The reasons for malaise there are many-fold. Like you mention, distance from economic centers. Maybe local infrastructure and education. The weather won't lure in many transplant industries, either. Nice scenery and outdoor fun, but that can only do so much.
Country of origin and manufacture are both critical, especially for things you're going to put in your mouth, or trust in a potential crash at 60mph. Do you trust corporations to oversee such operations with any degree of accountability or responsibility? I don't. It took MB many years to get that factory up to snuff, with the latest tech and imported experts. How much worse will it be in corrupt third world locations? Not to mention how origin of final assembly can link to local crimes, as it does to the social and environmental disaster in China.
If it didn't matter, why would some buy legislation to hide it?
I think the manufacturer is more critical if you are concerned about crash safety. There was a considerable difference in the crashworthiness of a VW and a Mercedes in the 1960 and 1970s, even though both came from Germany.
For that matter, whatever you can say about a 1970s Vega, it did have a stouter structure than a contemporary Pinto.
There is less difference today among vehicles, regardless of national origin, but that is because of government regulations and pressure from consumers (hence, the emphasis on "5-Star Crash Ratings" in various commercials).
True, but if I was to wager that a safety based assembly problem would happen in either the homeland or in a third world cost saving location, the latter would see it.
If buying US is a sign of patriotism, I would be more patriotic buying a new Mercedes ML350 Bluetec than a Cadillac SRX. Not to mention easier on the environment with about 50% less fossil fuel used.
Very specific example you use there, but there are Cadillacs not built in Mexico and Benzes not built in the 'States, too...of course. Remember that Benz is a German-based company and GM is an American-based company. Look up which employs more Americans. Just sayin'. But it's your money to spend, of course.
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I was specific because I want a certain type vehicle. The SRX would not get it as they do not offer it with a diesel engine. I will NEVER buy another gas engine vehicle. That said most of the German diesel vehicles that fit my current criteria are not close to the Mercedes USA content. I will look at the Jeep GC diesel when and if it every makes it here. I am skeptical of Italian engines after the Liberty diesel fiasco.
However, I'd also wager that reliability was not the only factor at play here.
To counter your defense of the Neon vs. Civic:
Offsetting that more Neons are totalled because they are worthless and useless, and insurance companies won't pay for them, but total them out with non-existent resale value I'd say that:
1) More Neon's are totalled out due to fraudulent claims, since a Neon with a bad transmission, head gaskets, and non-functioning AC is the perfect car to have "stolen" (I use that term loosely) and set afire during the hot summer; so it's found burnt to a crisp or otherwise "destroyed" for the fun of it.
2) More Civics were raced and or modified Fast and Furious style and wrecked and/or totalled because of that.
Demographics might come into play as well.
Offsetting that:
3) My equal age friend bought a '94 or '95 Prism LSi which we all know was a Toyota Corolla. He drove his car harder than mine, did not maintain it quite as well as I maintained mine, and had zero issues to 100,000 miles.
I think demographics and the way a car is driven is widely over exaggerated on here. If a car is built correctly, it can handle being driven like a grandma or being tracked 3 times a year just as well and just as reliably. A well built car can handle both equally. A car being driven hard should only exhibit greater wear on wear and tear items (brakes, pads, rotors, tires).
Maintenance does matter, but I don't think young people neglect their cars more so than other age groups like you suggest. Aren't old folks more forgetful (to change oil and the like) afterall? :surprise:
'21 BMW X3 M40i, '15 Audi S4, '16 Audi TTS, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
Comments
I had no idea.
Haven't had much luck with their appliances. Fridge lost an ice maker and still frosts up, dishwasher broke entirely, and the microwave broke a 2nd time and we replaced that as well.
Nowadays I avoid that brand.
GM sold the Fridigaire brand in 1979 - doubt your appliances had anything to do with GM.
GM -> Frigidaire
Ford -> Philco
Chrysler -> Airtemp
AMC -> Kelvinator
I would bet there are still some UAW holdovers that are still there, sabotaging the product as always...
If that's the case, there were probably some former [non-permissible content removed] still building Benzes in the '80's and former Tojo henchmen building Toyotas then too.
It's all relative.
It could become illegal to resell your iPhone 4, car or family antiques
The Supreme Court is scheduled to hear oral arguments on the case on Oct. 29.
Both Ammori and Band worry that a decision in favor of the lower court would lead to some strange, even absurd consequences. For example, it could become an incentive for manufacturers to have everything produced overseas because they would be able to control every resale.
It could also become a weighty issue for auto trade-ins and resales, considering about 40% of most U.S.-made cars carry technology and parts that were made overseas.
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/your-right-to-resell-your-own-stuff-is-in-peril- -2012-10-04
I was watching a show on animal planet about the circle of life and a dead hippo and elephant carcass was feeding a lot of wildlife. I then realized that calling them maggots was far too complimentary.
There were thousands of maggots on the carcasses, but I realized that UAW workers were less productive than the maggots, as the maggots perform a vital service and function of cleaning up the waste of the world; whereas UAW workers make the waste themselves. :shades:
That'll never change, though, so no sense complaining.
When the Ranger was stopped in December 2011, it had already sold 70,000 models that year. Compact pickups are still a significant segment, with Rangers still being sold off Ford lots today.
Toyota and Nissan now stand un-opposed; with Toyota selling more than 12,000 Tacoma’s this past month alone. That shows that there are still buyers in the compact pickup market, and that a proper small pickup is still more important to truck-buyers than something like the Honda Ridgeline (which couldn’t sell more than 1,000 last month.)
http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2012/09/where-did-the-compact-pickups-go.html- #more-157859
They're probably too close in size to the F150 now, though.
The managers pulling the strings, the engineers planning obsolescence, and the assemblers all share blame.
I used to say the only redeeming feature on the car was the engine, but since I've found out head gasket repair at 40-45K miles could be considered a powertrain/engine issue, I can't even say that.
I never replaced the seats, the trunk liner (though I had to realign it a couple times), and......
It's easier for me to list parts that were replaced.
I can't say that about same-era Hondas I see...rustout above where the rear plastic bumper wraps around the side. Same with the previous-generation Dodge trucks...big holes above the rear wheel openings.
Scoreboard = 3
I did the same search for Honda Civics:
Scoreboard = 45
45-3 = game over for Dodge.
So much for your theory.
45-3
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Did the Civic outsell the Neon by 15 times? A good question, but I don't know the answer to.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
All this means is that more folks want to sell their Civics!
I'm talkin' cars on the road here.
Do you really want try and argue Neon owners are happier and more satisfied than Civic owners??? Last I checked, Chrysler was on bailout #2 working on 3 and Honda is just fine.
You are implying the amount of cars for sale isn't reflective of those left on the road, but I don't see any logical arguments as to why that wouldn't be the case here!!! Feel free to try. I have a feeling they will all be pure malarkey!
I think old Neons are apparently cheap to buy, cheap to fix and that is the reason I see so many here in salty NE Ohio.
Well I'll agree they're cheap. I don't see many Neons on the road around here. Not that it means anything. I know several people happily driving older high mileage vehicles which I wouldn't tolerate on a daily basis.
My FIL is content with his 95 Tahoe with 180k. To me it should be crushed. It drives like crap, stinks when it runs, a/c doesn't work, power seats and power locks blow fuses constantly, and leaks oil on my driveway. But the truck runs. So I guess that can count towards being the most dependable trucks on the road. But most people would have dumped it 10 years ago.
I owned a '95 Neon Sport 2dr. Not the worst car I've owned, but from my experience, a Civic of that period was a better car overall. At least based on my comparison with a buddies '94 Civic Si that he owned when I had my Neon. I had the Neon for 3 years and 75k miles. Nothing horrible happened, but it certainly was in the shop for lots of little things. Plus by 75k miles it started to degrade fast.
Civics were certainly more reliable overall. IIRC the Neon had more room.
My brother had a nearly new first gen coupe, a 96 I think. He hated it after awhile, and that's saying something when his previous car was a K-car. He was happy when it got hit and totaled, and replaced by a Subaru.
Ditto Apple, Microsoft.
Take something "simple" like Hershey that exists to sell candy bars to generate profits to run all the homes for wayward kids. They have at least one Mexican factory and are increasingly focused toward China.
You like Dagoba or Scharffen Berger? That's Hershey. Most of the cocoa comes from West Africa.
You want to forgo a candy bar because the country of origin label says Ivory Coast?
Found 54 Civics, 5 Dodge Neons. However, remember that in those days they also had the Plymouth Neon. But, searching on that one, I only found two.
So, in my case, that's 54-7 in favor of the Civic.
For criteria I used 1994-2000 for all models. The Neon came out in early 1994 as a 1995, but I still used 1994 as a starting point just in case anyone happened to list an early Neon erroneously as a "94".
The Civic no doubt outsold the Neon every single year, but I'd imagine that in most years, it was either 2:1 or 3:1. But never 7.7:1 (54:7)!
However, I'd also wager that reliability was not the only factor at play here. No doubt, the Civic was much more reliable than the Neon, especially in the Neon's early years. But, keep in mind that poor resale value ensured that the Neon would total out more easily. In fact, a friend of mine lost a 2nd-gen Neon a few years ago when someone sideswiped it. Damage was relatively minor, but enough to total it. Unfortunately his replacement car, a 2003 or so Hyundai Sonata suffered the same fate. He rear-ended a truck that had a trailer hitch, at low speed, but it was still enough to total the car.
Demographics might come into play as well. A lot of young people buy Civics, but a lot of middle-age and older people buy them as well, and they're going to, as a general rule, take better care of their cars and hold onto them longer. I think the demographics for the Neon, especially the first generation, were seriously skewed towards younger people, who tended to buy them and rag them out, wreck them, neglect them, get them repossessed, etc.
But, don't worry, despite my defense of the Neon, I'm not in the market for a used one!
Most Neons were built in Toluca, Mexico, though some came from the Belvidere plant.
Aren't most Civics from that era made in the USA?
Granted, the 1956 Chevrolet had better rust resistance than the 1956 Ford, but I'd wager that lots more people simply WANTED to save the Chevrolets versus the Fords. The 1955-57 Chevrolets were already considered to be desirable cars, even if not necessarily collectible cars, by the mid-1960s.
Of course, those Chevrolets were more desirable because they were all-around better cars compared to the Fords (and, I'm guessing, the 1956 Plymouths, too)...much like the Civic versus the Neon.
That's definitely true. Back in college when I worked at Denny's, I remember talking old cars with the general manager, and mentioned I'd love to get a 1957 DeSoto. He said that, in 1965, his first car was a '57 DeSoto, Fireflite 4-door hardtop, pink with a white roof and spear. Paid $500 for it. He said that at the time it was considered a major loser car, but it was fast, and could embarrass plenty of hipper, cooler cars in a drag race. Still, he couldn't shake the loser image (I'm sure being a 4-door hurt it almost as much as being an orphan), and got a '57 Chevy Bel Air convertible before too long. He only paid $500 for it, as well. It wasn't nearly as fast as the DeSoto, but was considered a much cooler car at the time.
Even to this day, whenever I think of a '55-56 Ford I immediately think of Aunt Bea on the Andy Griffith show, and associate it with a nice, pleasant enough car, but kinda conservative and stodgy. But when I think of a '56 Chevy I think of a much more youthful, hip car. I'd put the Plymouth somewhere in between, but I think by the mid 60's the tailfins were really dating it, compared to a Chevy or Ford which had much more modest fins. And a '56 Plymouth is a bit big compared to a Chevy or Ford, as well.
But the 1955 Chevrolet, with its new V-8 and sharp styling, completely reversed those respective images overnight.
As for the image of the 1957 DeSoto, there wasn't any nostalgia for 1950s styling in the 1960s. Buyers considered cars with large fins and other exaggerated styling features to be very dated and old-fashioned looking. I remember reading that, by the mid-1960s, you couldn't give 1959 Cadillac away!
The only 1950s cars people were really saving in the 1960s were the 1955-57 Thunderbirds, 1955-57 Chevrolets, and...the Edsel! The first two because of clean and handsome styling (and changes to the succeeding generations), and the third because it was already a cult car.
I like Lindt and those Costco peanut butter cups :shades:
I don't buy this self-destructive one world ideology some (including here...) wish to foist upon us. None of those candy bars are actually refined and produced in Ivory Coast, that's a simple raw material. Not every part in a German car is made in Germany either, but the final assembly is there, and that's important.
But we're too far from the economic centers and skilled employees to set up something as simple as a furniture factory. The shipping alone would kill you before you got up and running.
If country of origin final assembly was critical, Mercedes would eat the freight and close the Alabama factory. Means squat. What counts is management and a pool of trained workers and competent suppliers. The location is just important for transportation and infrastructure and currency reasons. And of course politics.
Don't impose a duty on our imports; we'd have to shut down a line in Tuscaloosa. :P
Country of origin and manufacture are both critical, especially for things you're going to put in your mouth, or trust in a potential crash at 60mph. Do you trust corporations to oversee such operations with any degree of accountability or responsibility? I don't. It took MB many years to get that factory up to snuff, with the latest tech and imported experts. How much worse will it be in corrupt third world locations? Not to mention how origin of final assembly can link to local crimes, as it does to the social and environmental disaster in China.
If it didn't matter, why would some buy legislation to hide it?
For that matter, whatever you can say about a 1970s Vega, it did have a stouter structure than a contemporary Pinto.
There is less difference today among vehicles, regardless of national origin, but that is because of government regulations and pressure from consumers (hence, the emphasis on "5-Star Crash Ratings" in various commercials).
Luckily, vehicles have VINs.
To counter your defense of the Neon vs. Civic:
Offsetting that more Neons are totalled because they are worthless and useless, and insurance companies won't pay for them, but total them out with non-existent resale value I'd say that:
1) More Neon's are totalled out due to fraudulent claims, since a Neon with a bad transmission, head gaskets, and non-functioning AC is the perfect car to have "stolen" (I use that term loosely) and set afire during the hot summer; so it's found burnt to a crisp or otherwise "destroyed" for the fun of it.
2) More Civics were raced and or modified Fast and Furious style and wrecked and/or totalled because of that.
Demographics might come into play as well.
Offsetting that:
3) My equal age friend bought a '94 or '95 Prism LSi which we all know was a Toyota Corolla. He drove his car harder than mine, did not maintain it quite as well as I maintained mine, and had zero issues to 100,000 miles.
I think demographics and the way a car is driven is widely over exaggerated on here. If a car is built correctly, it can handle being driven like a grandma or being tracked 3 times a year just as well and just as reliably. A well built car can handle both equally. A car being driven hard should only exhibit greater wear on wear and tear items (brakes, pads, rotors, tires).
Maintenance does matter, but I don't think young people neglect their cars more so than other age groups like you suggest. Aren't old folks more forgetful (to change oil and the like) afterall? :surprise: