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Comments

  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel a Certified Edmunds Poster.Posts: 15,338
    Seems a bit contradictory if he knows what he wants

    Gotta look around, touch, feel, sit in, and such to find out what I want. Its called research.

    2008 Sebring Ragtop, 2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel a Certified Edmunds Poster.Posts: 15,338
    Take a number snakeweasel, they're pretty busy in Hyundai service departments...

    Couldn't tell you, with two Hyundais with a combined mileage of well over 200k I have been in the service department three times. Once for a free oil change on each car and once to replace an exhaust manifold under warranty after 130k miles.

    Compare that to my sisters Toyota that goes into the shop every other week.

    FWIW when I took it in they had way more VW's in for repairs (the dealer also sells VW's and Mazdas).

    2008 Sebring Ragtop, 2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • thebillthebill Posts: 194
    In my autogroup, there is a set pay scale and there is no deviation from it. Every person makes the same commission, from the newest greenpea to the oldest veteran.

    There is no negotiation. No exceptions.

    Enough already guys.
  • travlertravler Posts: 138
    All I am saying is that the salesman is an employee of the dealership and therefore will put the interest of the dealership (and his job) over my interests.

    If you do the right thing for your customer you are essentially looking out for the interests of your dealership, your future, and your family. Long term customer relationships are the key to a successful salesman.

    I make more in accounting than the average car salesman makes.

    The "average" salesman, yes. Probably about 75% are failures. It's not hard for the average secretary to beat their wages. However, the career salesman is a another issue.
  • Re: 1. Don't be too sure, and I get a new car every year to use, which is a 400 month net benefit easily, not including the insurance I don't pay on it.

    2. I only need one job. But I liked sales pay better.
    3. I can get off any night I want, and only work 2 nights until nine anyway. You can always swtich to see your child in extra curricular things. The other 5 days, I either am off at 5:30, or off completely.
  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel a Certified Edmunds Poster.Posts: 15,338
    If you do the right thing for your customer you are essentially looking out for the interests of your dealership,

    Again "doing the right thing" and "having their best interests at heart" are two different things.

    However, the career salesman is a another issue.

    I am on par, maybe even higher, than the average career car salesman. I know, I have done enough of their taxes ;)

    2008 Sebring Ragtop, 2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel a Certified Edmunds Poster.Posts: 15,338
    Re: 1. Don't be too sure, and I get a new car every year to use, which is a 400 month net benefit easily, not including the insurance I don't pay on it.

    You are paying taxes on that benefit I hope.

    3. I can get off any night I want, and only work 2 nights until nine anyway.

    Most salesmen around here work three weeknights a week, everyone works a full day one day monday through friday and everyone works a full day saturday, by virtue of a bad state law dealerships are closed on Sunday and everyone gets one weekday off.

    I still like my non tax season hours better (tax season hours stink big time).

    2008 Sebring Ragtop, 2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • golicgolic Posts: 714
    C'mon snake. Don't tell me you wouldn't rather have the "tax bill" than the

    1. Car payment
    2. Insurance payment.
  • I don't have to report anything that my employer doesn't deduct. And they don't claim my car as a benefit to me. It's available to be driven by anyone. It's not mine. In fact, I can WRITE off the mileage used on my demo by customers for test drives, cause it's my gas!! I can't take to & from work, though. I also deduct my laundry, cause it's my shirts, embroidered with the name of my great dealership!!
  • I can't take mileage to and from work as a deduction, but I do take the car home at night.
  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel a Certified Edmunds Poster.Posts: 15,338
    Well that would depend on the whole package doesn't it. I would rather have the car and insurance payment on a $100K salary than the tax bill and a $50K salary.

    2008 Sebring Ragtop, 2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • travlertravler Posts: 138
    Well that would depend on the whole package doesn't it. I would rather have the car and insurance payment on a $100K salary than the tax bill and a $50K salary.

    50k would be a mediocre salesman not long for the business.

    He sounds like a career salesman to me. Am I right sundayoff?
  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel a Certified Edmunds Poster.Posts: 15,338
    I don't have to report anything that my employer doesn't deduct.

    Wrong.

    And they don't claim my car as a benefit to me.

    If it is a disciminary benefit you have to report it, that is unless you cannot drive it home, you cannot drive it for personal use, and you cannot have access to it when you are not at work. If you drive it home its a taxable benefit. Of course there are rules that the IRS has on this.

    I can WRITE off the mileage used on my demo by customers for test drives,

    I would love to see you try to explain that one on a tax audit.

    2008 Sebring Ragtop, 2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2015 Honda CTX700D

  • But if you make 100,000k , I'll be economically viewing you in the rearview mirror of the free car I drive, by more than 1/3rd again! And a couple years ago, I enjoyed paying tax on more than twice your number, which brings me back to why, sad though it is, it pays to be a commission salesperson, and bench the college education, in favor of the reality that the certificate, and the paycheck, don't go hand in hand, although I use my Biological Science/Zoology degree every day, because it's a jungle out there big fella.
  • And actually I don't take any deductions from my business, not even the shirts, because they don't exceed the minimum expense limit, so it's a mute point.
  • turboshadowturboshadow Posts: 349
    Moot point.
  • lrguy44lrguy44 Posts: 2,197
    Actually, when you set your hourly rate, who are you looking after? High end dealerships (BMW, mercedes, Land Rover, etc.) are far different from the "typical" low end (Hyundai, Chevy, Ford, etc.). We close at 7 during the week, 5 on Saturday. I do the whole deal (show, price finance), and 30-50% of my business in a given month is repeat or referral. If I don't try to fill a need (as you do as a CPA) I won't have any customers. As far as bearing the interest of the dealership - if I'm doing my job right I am bearing both interests - which actually means I have to satisfy both to meet my own goals. Finally - a truely good salesperson will hit some home runs (big grosses), have some mini deals, and do some in the middle. A salesman who only makes high grosses is losing deals, and the salesmen only doing minis can't build value in himself or his product. It is no different than the selling I did in the corporate world before cars - wish I had found this industry years ago.
  • british_roverbritish_rover Posts: 8,458
    We actually closed the deal over the phone and just didn't print one. I went over my notes with him over the phone and listed out the three options he wanted and he said yeah that is all I want. I still don't understand how you can negotiate the price of the car without knowing the MSRP. A 2,500 dollar difference in MSRP is a big deal.
  • bobstbobst Posts: 1,783
    "I still don't understand how you can negotiate the price of the car without knowing the MSRP"

    I haven't looked at the MSRP of any car I have bought since 1985. Many of us think the MSRP is a meaningless number.
  • socala4socala4 Posts: 2,427
    I'm with Bob. I never pay much attention to MSRP, either.
  • travlertravler Posts: 138
    It matters when that's what the public is willing to pay. Otherwise, it just a starting point.
  • raybearraybear Posts: 1,795
    I think the idea is that you still need to know what the car should cost, MSRP is just a guide.
  • travlertravler Posts: 138
    Doing the right thing in my mind means everyone is happy; customer, dealer, family, self.

    No games, no false promises, no gimics. Our dealer has a 75% retention rate. That's one of the highest in the industry. We're doing the "right thing" for all involved. That's how to run a good business.

    I've seen thousands of applications, and most are professional people. You're right. Salesmen are on par with the best of them. : :surprise:
  • thebillthebill Posts: 194
    We can go back and forth all day long about MSRP vs. invoice.

    If the Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price is what they say the vehicle should go for.....anything below that is great.
  • Some people here said that they prefer to deal with commissioned salesmen, as non-commissioned salesmen do not have the same interest in their jobs. But this is hardly the case. The vast majority of working people in North America do not get commissions. Does it mean they do not work as hard as they can? There is always something to look forward to, such as a promotion, satisfying a customer, or simply feeling great about honestly doing your job. You are not out there to rip someone off and/or to take advantage of an uninformed buyer, which is exactly what commissioned salesmen so often do.

    From my perspective as a customer, I much prefer to deal with someone whose next paycheck's size does not depend on being able to sell me their product at the highest price possible.
  • socala4socala4 Posts: 2,427
    One of the points that I try to make with these posts is that life is easier and prices are lower if you simply adapt to the system, and accept it for what it is. To paraphrase the Serenity Prayer: "God give me the strength to change what I can change, accept what I cannot change, and the wisdom to know the difference."

    Since there isn't a thing that you can do about it, why not just have fun with it and pay as little as you can? At this point, the system is such an inherent part of the buying process that it simply cannot be changed. People who take short cuts trying to "avoid the hassle" usually end up paying more, which in my view is an unnecessary trade-off.

    Let the other guy pay more than you, and worry about how you can save money for yourself. I figure that only a very small percentage of readers of this forum will even accept what people like me are saying, so things should keep working well enough to our advantage. (Ironically, if everyone shifted gears and followed the lead of professional negotiators, we'd have to change tactics because we would all be too predictable, so it's fortunate that not everyone will listen...)
  • there's Internet available these days. Customers can find out the invoice and dealer incentives numbers, and negotiate over email, which is much less confrontational than face-to-face
  • bobstbobst Posts: 1,783
    Malibu, I suspect you can get a lower price in person than you can over the internet.

    If you offer $25K OTD over the internet, they may turn you down.

    If you walk in with your checkbook and offer that price, I think the sales manager will be more inclined to accept. They hate to see money walk out the door.
  • golicgolic Posts: 714
    I think most internet departments are bombared with oddball requests and emailers sending out blanket give me your best price or Ill go elsewhere emails.

    There was a whole discussion on how to make me a better online salesman. About two-thirds of the posts were real enlightining before the other third turned into obnoxious arguing.

    It was a good read.
  • bobstbobst Posts: 1,783
    Well, about every topic in this DG turns into arguing, but I never think the posts are obnoxious.
This discussion has been closed.