Stories from the Sales Frontlines

Kirstie_H · February 2006

Since we've got a number of discussions in which consumers can share their shopping stories, this topic is specifically for salespeople to share their stories, good and bad.

Consumers are welcome to read and ask questions, but no "bashing," please! If you disagree with the salesperson's perspective, that's the breaks

Entertain us, sales crowd!

isellhondas · February 2006

I don't care if somone disagrees with me! That creates interesting dialogue in these forums. Sometimes we can even convince each other of something.

Bashing is a different story.

danf1 · February 2006

I disagree.

Kirstie_H · February 2006

Hey, we'll have plenty of other topics for that.

Let's bring on the stories!

dwilliam · February 2006

yer killin me snake!!! LOL

http://www.dot.state.tx.us/services/vehicle_titles_and_registration/title_your_v- ehicle.htm

all you should have to do is pull up the PDF file for title application

The Anonymous (and RIGHT) Dealer

black_tulip · February 2006

How about this one? Man kills himself over an unsatisfactory deal?

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/13831219.htm

kyfdx · February 2006

Something tells me that his problems really had nothing to do with a bad car deal..

graphicguy · February 2006

While I'm not a salesperson, I do have 2-3 people from different dealerships that contact me when they have a car that I might be interested in.....both used and new.

They actually call me every several months to tell me of a particular vehicle.

I buy cars, not only for myself, but my son, sisters, my sisters' kids and my mother. The sales people figure that at least one of them may be in the market for a car at any given time. I'd say 50% of the time, they're right.

Matter of fact, I just helped my 17 year old niece buy a nice '99 Mazda with 74K miles. That resulted from one of those phone calls. Sales person was from a Ford dealer. They got the car in on a trade from an older couple who bought a new Ford 500. I had mentioned to him a couple of months ago that my niece was in the market.

These sales people don't bother me with some of the "less than desireable" cars that come in. Just when they get a really nice car, do I get a call.

michaellno · February 2006

That story was in the papers here in Denver as well.

Somehow, the guy managed to hang himself in the lavatory.

I believe that he had just been charged with arson in the fire at the dealership, so that might also have contributed to his decision.

jlawrence01 · February 2006

When you start bringing a dealership 3-4 sales per year, the SMART salesmen will start notifying you when something "interesting" hits their lot.

My brother calls his friends at dealerships around Cincinnati when he is looking for a specific model. Generally, within a few days or a couple of weeks, he'll get a few callbacks. It means sales for the dealerships and a reduction of time that he needs to seek out vehicles.

It is all about relationships ...

bolivar · February 2006

And, the paper is saying one of the cars burned up was a Ford GT. $150,000++++

british_rover · February 2006

I had a perfect example of this last friday night. Had a guy come in with his wife off the street. Said he had driven by a few times and saw the vehicle we had parked out front. Liked the look of it and saw that we had just dropped the price by a 1000 dollars and wanted to know if that was our rock bottom best, best price.

Now he has not even introduced himself or given me the chance to really introduce myself and I have not even been able to get out of my office yet before this takes place. I introduce myself ask him if he has ever been inside a Land Rover before or driven one and he goes well know I have never even touched one I just liked the look of it. Oh well you have to look inside it and drive it first make sure it is the right car for you.

I pull it up let him and his wife play with all the buttons show them that it has three user selectable suspension settings and several other automatic settings. He goes, "Wow I didn't even know it could lower it self that is great no need for running boards." I say, "Exactly right sir and it lets you get into parking garages that other tall vehicles could not get into."

He has a trade with a ton of miles that he is convinced he will be upside down in. By now it is right at closing time so I ask him to come back tomorrow when it is light out and we can apraise his trade easier. He agrees and comes back right in the morning on Satuday. Our preowned manager takes his car for a trade puts a number on it and to the customers suprise he is actually over 4,000 dollars up.

Now the guy is just ecstatic and we sit down to work out the price of the new car. I don't even need to negotiate he is so happy with all of the extra features that the Land Rover has and that he was actually right side up on his trade that he just agrees to our 1000 dollar off knock down price.

He went from being a I want your best, best rock bottom price customer, who would have ended up being a grumpy customer probably, to a very happy 100 CSI all the way and I have no problem paying the asked for price customer. That is building product value.

jipster · February 2006

How much more would you have gone down to get to "rock bottom price" had he persisted?

isellhondas · February 2006

They left happy! It doesn't always have to be about money.

Both sides were content with the deal.

golic · February 2006

Obviously "that" was the rock bottom price since they both agreed.

I am always fascinated by the people who post and ask, Hey, I just bought this car - here is what I paid, did I get screwed???

Who cares...it's tooo late. Enjoy the car, part of me wants to rain on thier parade and say - Just two days ago someone in your area spent 5k less *snicker*

And another part of me, just wants them to feel good by posting "Wow, what a deal"

I didn't mean to rain on you, Jipster....i am just cranky and wanted to rant.

*rant over*

mirth · February 2006

part of me wants to rain on thier parade and say - Just two days ago someone in your area spent 5k less

There will always be SOMEONE who will say this, whether they are full of it or not. So it doesn't pay to ask. Just enjoy the car and move on.

jipster · February 2006

"What does that matter?"

It doesn't matter to me. I'm just curious. Agree,if both sides are happy and content...more power to them.

isellhondas · February 2006

Then it must matter.

british_rover · February 2006

He could have probably gotten another 1000 bucks off with a little more work and if he had really wanted to grind another 500 dollars more but that would have been the limit.

We try not to give away cars for invoice but it does happen from time to time.

jipster · February 2006

"I didn't mean to rain on you, Jipster..."

No problem. You're ranting was fairly brief as far as ranting goes.

Though tempted at times, I usually try to make people happy by telling them they got a "good deal" reguardless of the circumstances.

jipster · February 2006

Thank you for that straight/honest answer british_rover.

black_tulip · February 2006

I am always fascinated by the people who post and ask, Hey, I just bought this car - here is what I paid, did I get screwed???

Who cares...it's tooo late.

I do.

In general, everything in life is a learning experience. Therefore, it is perfectly valid to do a post-mortem analysis to learn from your mistakes so as not to repeat it in the future.

black_tulip · February 2006

I am not sure if it has anything to do with product value. The fact that he got $4000 from his trade sealed the deal. On the other hand, if he was $4000 upside down, I doubt any of the features in the new car would have moved him.

graphicguy · February 2006

When you start bringing a dealership 3-4 sales per year, the SMART salesmen will start notifying you when something "interesting" hits their lot.

j.....So true, it's all about networking and relationships....on both the customer's side and the salesperson's side.

It seems like I'm always helping someone buy something every 3-4 months. Really, a quick glance at these boards and it wouldn't be so hard for those people to do the same themselves. I think the stereotype of getting "hosed" at a car dealership is unfortunately alive and well.

There's probably 3-4 sales people, at different dealerships, that I'm in contact with every couple of months. Sometimes they bring something to the table that's interesting. Other times, I don't have anyone I know who's in the market, and no matter what the vehicle, I'm not interested.

I do have long standing relationships with someone at a Toyota, Chevy and Ford dealerships. Of course, those folks have made their profession a career, as opposed to just a brief stopping point.

One salesmanager, at an Acura dealership (Superior), I actually play golf with. I bought my son's car there. Interestingly, they don't carry used cars that are less than 3 years old....nothing 1-2 years old (which I find a bit odd). But, their inventory is always filled with nice used cars.

On the other hand, I've tried to buy an Infiniti on several occasions. We've got only one dealership in the area. I always give them a shot at my business, but could never get to a "meeting of the minds", so I've never bought from them. Nice people, though. They still call every 6 months, or so.

Bottom line, if you've got a relationship with someone in the biz, there's a mutual trust built up that I won't waste their time, if they don't waste mine. In short order, if they've got something I (or a family member) want, I'm confident I get a good deal and their confident I'm not going to "jack them around".

Of course, that's always predicated on doing a little bit of REALISTIC research hear before you walk in the door.

mirth · February 2006

Therefore, it is perfectly valid to do a post-mortem analysis to learn from your mistakes so as not to repeat it in the future.

Sure, but if some yahoo on an internet board tells you you paid way too much, why would you take their word for it? Even if more than one does, how can you be sure that they are right? Your circumstances and geography might not match up with theirs. Plus, they may just not know what they are talking about. Or they are ignoring the fact that although they paid $2000 less on the car they got a higher interest rate, lower value for their trade, and bought the extended warranty for $1500.

If you went and believed that person, you would have a much harder time of it next time you bought a car because your assumptions would be incorrect. Grain of salt.

bretfraz · February 2006

That's an excellent point. Does the person doing the post mortem actually know what they're talking about? Does that person have all the facts and pertinent info? A detective has the coroner's report, he has a police report, eyewitness accounts, the ability to interview those involved, whatever is at his disposal to determine cause of the crime.

A coworker just bought a used truck from a local megastore. They were happy their payments were a lot lower than their previous truck, plus the new truck is bigger and better equipped. On the surface everyone is happy. I saw the contract and it's scary: Paid top dollar for a 4 yr old truck with 60K on it, 72 month loan, 10.99% interest rate, $1200 extended warranty. My analysis says they got hosed. But then, I wasn't there in the sales office wheelin and dealin, so who knows what took place?

Philosophically I agree a post mortem analysis should be done but it's almost impossible to do one accurately without all the info. And besides, who wants to hear they got porked?

jlawrence01 · February 2006

We have contacts at a Ford and a Cadillac dealership. In general, they know roughly how and what we like to buy. In general, we are usually within $500 and pretty much split the difference.

Do we grind? Oh, occasionally. Especially if the salesman (usually a newbie), acts like we are straight off the farm and starts trying to sell us a used car at 15% above retail. Or if it is obvious that they don't know their beans.

I like dealerships that sell quality used cars and take pride in it. While you still have to do the mechanical inspection, it makes the process a lot easier.

british_rover · February 2006

They took a 72 month loan on a 4 year old trucks? If that is the case they got hosed no matter what they paid. I hope they never plan to trade out of it ever cause they are probably 50% buried in the car right now and getting worse.

isellhondas · February 2006

Exactly.

A lot of the so called "Prices Paid" posts are dead wrong. I (usually) just bite my tongue but I can tell you, a lot of those deals judt didn't happen.

So, now the person who asks.." did I get a good deal" feels that they paid too much or got hosed.

Some people just love to rain on parades.

bobst · February 2006

When we bought Hondas in 1995, 1997, and 1999 we always had to pay $150 or $200 over invoice. Otherwise, our offers were turned down.

We were going to buy a car last March, so I checked the Prices Paid forum and found a couple people who claimed they got their Accord for $500 under invoice with no doc fee. I couldn't believe it, so we drove to Fairfax Honda, offered $500 under invoice, and they accepted.

mirth · February 2006

...they have no value. I'm just saying you have to take them with a grain of salt.

jipster · February 2006

The people who ask, "Did I get a good deal?" probably didn't do their research in the first place. Otherwise, they would know whether they got a good deal or not.

If they can go to a Prices Paid board and type in, "Did I get a good deal?" AFTER they buy, they can certainly go to Edmunds TMV and read other posts in prices paid to get a general idea of what a good deal is BEFORE they buy.

deadeye1950 · February 2006

I'm assuming they were going after a unit bonus which would explain taking the hit. You know, $300 a car back to car one if you hit your number. Just a thought, John

isellhondas · February 2006

Good advise, except some of the "Prices Paid" never happened. Then they go out armed with incorrect information and get frustrated when those numbers weren't attainable.

Or maybe they DID happen...like someone else said, the store needed two more cars on the 31st of the month to earn a bonus of some type so they caved in and lost a few bucks to earn a bunch more.

Or maybe they underallowed on the trade in or just maybe the trade was an extra sharp, popular car that they knew they would be able to sell for a healthy profit?

It's good to be a knowledgable shopper but there can be a lot of variables to consider!

bobst · February 2006

Your thought might be interesting, John, if I had any idea what you were saying.

jipster · February 2006

No doubt many posts "never happened". You sales guys read the prices paid forum quite a bit, and probably have a better idea than I do of how many are bogus posts. But,I would make an educated guess at about 5-7%. With a higher % not telling the complete story. It seems the most questionable posts are: those that pop up out of nowhere,from a first time poster who does not follow up, little to no info in profile, have a price significantly higher or lower than the norm, the post is lacking in details, and it just doesn't sound right... different than the others.

I think most people who read Prices Paid forums often enough can generally tell which ones to weed out and which ones to accept.

mackabee · February 2006

Bob, what John is saying is that the day you bought your Accord the dealership was probably a car or two away from hitting a sales goal from the factory. For example: Your sale would be Accord number 49 and the stores goal was 50. So the store figured we can lose $500.00 on this one and break even on the next one (Accord #50)or make a profit. So at the end of the month when they report all their Accord sales to the distributor and reached the 50 Accord sales, the distributor will cut the dealership a check for $15000 or more depending on the final number over 50. The sales managers may share in this "bonus" or it may just be for the dealer principal. So to illustrate, they lost $500.00 to sell you a car but made $14,500.00 in the end. Not bad heh? Wish I would have been a dealer principal.
:shades:
Mackabee

bobst · February 2006

Thanks for explaining that in English, Mack.

By the way, the 2005 Accord is much nicer than the 1999 model. The steering is easier and the clutch takes much less effort. It doesn't even have all the rattles I was afraid of - knock on wood.

kyfdx · February 2006

I'd say over 90% are "true", to the best knowledge of the person posting..

Details are often left out.... Any post with a trade-in obviously is hard to evaluate.. Some people don't even understand their own deal, or how much they paid.

But, as jipster says... if you read them enough, you can get a good feel for which ones offer information that you can use..

You can get a lot more information there about real prices, than anywhere else.. After all, without those forums, I'd have to assume that the Honda dealers are sold out of almost every model and that they sell all units at MSRP!!

regards,
kyfdx
Host-Prices Paid Forums

mackabee · February 2006

You're welcome Bob!
Mack

biancar · February 2006

Does anyone know what happened to "Cliffy," who sold Toyotas in the Northern Virginia area? Mack, you guys used to be in touch, weren't you?

Just curious, because I want to test-drive a Toyota Solara convertible and wondered if he's still around.

manamal · February 2006

Last I heard he (cliffy) was at the same dealership, but working on Scions.

mackabee · February 2006

I haven't heard from him in a while. I know he was managing the Scion side of the house at Springfield Toyota/Scion. You may want to call the dealership and ask. Let us know what you find.
Mackabee

thebill · February 2006

lol...i think im going to like this forum...that prices paid forum is getting no where

jmurman42 · February 2006

"I am always fascinated by the people who post and ask, Hey, I just bought this car - here is what I paid, did I get screwed???

Who cares...it's tooo late. "

How true!

jmurman42 · February 2006

I received this Internet inquiry the other day.

It was from a woman in North Carolina who is looking to buy a Civic LX Coupe, particulary with automatic transmission and Galaxy Gray. I say this because the LX Civic is a very hgard car to come by. Now, our dealership is in Maryland...so this woman is looking for a car and is implying that she will drive the over 500 miles to buy said car...right. And I have some swampland in Florida for you too.

My policy here is that everyone gets a response to their inquiry. So I sent her a response...it went like this "I searched a 5 state area (which I did) and found a number of Honda dealers that have this exact Civic. Good luck to you."

So about an hour later I get a phone call from North Carolina.

Customer: "I am confused by your email"

Me: "How so?"

Customer: "You say that there are delaerships that have this car...will you give me their addresses?"

Me: " You do use the Internet for your research right?"

Customer: "Yes...but..."

Me: "...then you need to do more research."

Customer: "Well...what do you mean by 'Good Luck to you?'"

Me: "Exactly what it says...Good luck"

This was the obvious end to the conversation. Was I representing my dealership in the best possible light? Nope...but it felt good.

raybear · February 2006

I'd say over 90% are "true", to the best knowledge of the person posting..

Trouble is, too many people believe the ten percenters, the ones who decide that no one could possibly get a better deal than they did so there's some serious embellishment going on. How many times do I have to read, "But it said on Edmunds..."

I got hit with this one yesterday...the potential customer told me he had expected a much better deal than I had offered, saying that my price only matched Edmunds. Now I know he probably forgot to add the automatic transmission or looked up a more basic model but no one likes to be told that...I had price the car to reach a sales target so it was well into holdback and I included the rebate (which he also questioned me on).

kyfdx · February 2006

While I feel your pain (sort of).. it looks like Edmunds worked out for him!!

I agree with everything you said... But, I'm sure that those kinds of buyers would be a pain... whether they got incomplete information here... or from anywhere else (brother-in-law?).

Your story is a good example, though.. You can do all the research you want, but you never know when you'll happen to be in the dealership at the right time, when all the stars are aligned... and get the "deal of the century". We have a lot of members... Sometimes, those "unbelievable" deals happened just as described.

If that person had posted that deal on Edmunds (and, they might..

), how many people would believe them?

regards,
kyfdx
Host-Prices Paid Forums

1racefan · February 2006

Sounds like she would have been a good candidate for one of those auto buying services that charge the fee to locate and buy the car for you.

sigt1 · February 2006

and you didn't give her a few names... why?

british_rover · February 2006

This happend on my day off so I heard about it yesterday. Our F&I guy was out with a couple in a SC Sport. They were not familar with the area and happend to be hearing impaired as well so he was having difficulty communicating to them. He told them to go down to the bottom of this hill and at the light take a left. Well this particular intersection is kind of strange in that about half way down the hill there is a light that you cannot make left or right turns at. You can only go straight when it turns gree. The husban got confused and took a left at this light when it turned green cause he did not see the sign. Well you know what happend there was a cop just a few cars behind them and he pulled them over.

OOps.

They lucked out though cause the cop got another call over his radio and had to leave. They just got a warning.

Stories from the Sales Frontlines

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