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Thanks in advance.
I traded my 98 Nav for an early '03 with the CD based, joystick control Navigation system. Does anyone know if there is any reason I should NOT be able to swap out that system with the newer and current DVD touch screen system. There will probably be some wiring and harness differences but other than that...There is one on ebay right now and if I were sure of the compatability. I will be asking my dealer also but my faith in whatever their answer is.......well you've all had experience with dealers, service managers, etc.
Ed (enskanker)
Try asking the pros over in Real-World Trade-In Values for a price.
You can also get a rate from a bank or credit union and take that to the dealer and invite them to match or beat it.
Steve, Host
Could someone please help with some info/advice?
Thanks!!!!
I was reading over a couple pages of recent posts and have a question.
My last vehicle purchase was back in Jan '04, when gas was $1.25/g.
Since then gas has more than doubled (Less than two years) and if the trend continues, we could see prices in the $5-6 range in only a few short years.
I've never owned an SUV and have no problem in regards to ownership, people should be able to get what their family wants/needs.
With that said, if prices do get to $5/g in ... say 2007 will it change the way you view purchase or will you stay with the current type?
If that is how it is in 2007, and it is time for a new vehicle purchase would you replace it with the same, but new model or go with something else more economical?
Thanks.
All that said, and though my Nav is lucky to break 17mpg on the hwy and gets <12mpg around town, I still love the thing. My wife drives it mostly doing soccer mom type things - kids to/from school, shopping, etc and while it is overkill unless the whole family of 5 is in it, I still like the fact that my wife and kids are in a vehicle that will protect them far better than an econobox should something happen. Peace of mind is worth something, n'est pas? Plus there's nothing like it for long family trips what with room aplenty, the DVD player, Nav system, AWD and 4WD, etc etc. A Prius is fine for commuting, but if u got a family, u need a family vehicle.
Oh, one more thing, over the long haul with higher initial cost and huge battery replacement and other maintenance costs etc, that Prius will cost a heck of a lot more than their greener-than-thou owners think.
Our other vehicle is my primary commuter car, I travel almost 100miles daily so we wanted to max out MPG. It's a Honda Civic Hybrid, and I'm getting 63-68MPG and +900 mile tanks. Most people get less, but I push the envelope as much as I can.
When it's time to replace the Grand Caravan ( in 2011 ) I'm not sure what will be the next vehicle.
I hear you about family safety, and should be one of the most important considerations.
Perhaps they will have a hydrogen Gator or some other major fuel improvement by then?
17 mpg ain't too bad when there's 5 people and all their gear on board. That's 85people-mpg:>)
A hydro-Gator eh? Heh heh. Anything's possible I guess. Wouldn't want to buy the first year of hydrogen powered cars though! Could be some pretty explosive bugs to work out!
I was recently in the market for another vehicle. I drove a Civic hybrid. It was kinda nice, but I gotta admit the saying "can't get out of it's own way" must've been written with that car in mind:>) And your mpg figures are way above what epa or even honda says. You should open a gas-savers driving school!
Natch, the idea of 50 or 60 mpg appeals to me for a commute vehicle. (Presently I drive 70 miles round-trip and am driving a Lincoln LS which gets about 23mpg on my commute). But I am concerned about the long-term costs of hybrid technology. Did u lease your Civic hybrid? From what I've read (autoextrememist.com is a good place), whomever is the owner of a hybrid when the batteries need replacing is in for an extremely rude awakening!
I bought my little car, and did alot of research before hand. You're wise about waiting for the bugs to get out of new technology, I too waited an extra year.
The battery issue doesn't concern me for a number of reasons.
It is warranted for 10yr/150K miles....But I hope/plan to drive this over 300K miles over 10 years. I use the battery so lightly that I think in my case it is a non-issue. Battery is another reason why I choose a Honda, and not the Prius...The Prius must have a good battery or be stranded, while Honda will just keep running, but with less performance. If I should decide to replace it, I could get a guaranteed used one, or possible after-market ones, or spend the $2K for a new one installed. But in the case that I've already crossed 250K miles I'll just drive it as is.
But enough about my commuter car!
Honestly, I've never driven a Navigator, it's probably a good thing because if I did, I'd likely want one
We have a whole Hybrid Vehicles forum with lots of discussions - check it out!
Steve, Host
Wow, what an absolutely luxurious ride. Doing 85 to 95 is a smooth as sitting still. MPG is bad around town in the 12's and I get close to 17 MPG on the Navi loaded with 3 Adults and 3 Children.
I guess I see it this way, Navi is advertised at 13 City/18 Hwy. Take your averge midline car that gets say 18/24 or 5/6 MPG better City/Hwy. Is the fuel cost of 50% more worth it. Well, that is for each to decide. But man, you can't beat the ride. Sort of like paying for 1st Class Seat in a Plane vs Economy Class, sure is nice up front.
Like I said, anyone who owns a late model Navi knows what I am talking about.
Given the likely severe depreciation, I could not afford to sell it and replace. Plan to keep it for awhile; regardless of Gas Prices, as if they continue to climb, I wouldn't get anything for it anyway.
Interesting enough, I was looking to trade my Chyrsler T&C Minivan for a Honda or Toyota Minivan and one dealer told me, "We Do Not Take Any Domestic SUVs on Trade". Well, the Media sure had tainted SUV's. But just smile as you drive in comfort passing the econo-boxes.
Yeah, that's what I did. My 'economy' car is a Lincoln LS :>)
I'm probably trading in my LS for a Fusion. At least the Aviator is averaging 16. I'm doing good to get 17 in my LS (18 if I'm really careful). 22 would be a nice improvement.
Years ago I had a 1959 Oldsmobile 98.
Back in its day was a beautiful, luxury vehicle.
That car was practically carved from an anvil and the sheer weight alone made it float over anything. Ahhh, the memories.
That did about 13-14MPG too.
Allen;
Not a Zephyr, eh? :>) The Fusions look nice. If u get the V6, that's pretty much the same engine as I have in my LS (V6, Getrag). I do get 22-23 on my commute but it will drop under 20 if my wife drives it around town. U have the V8 don't you? Still, 17 seems low for that, even if it's mostly city. Lighter Fusion V6 probably will be a bit more mpg than my LS?
Don't really like the Zephyr as much as the Fusion or Milan, not to mention the $5K savings.
If I wasn't looking to get a mustang later I might wait for the 3.5L Zephyr or the SVT or ST Fusion.
Me too - my economy car is a Lexus LS430
I have the standard audiophile stereo in my '05 Gator. I know I can get Sirius installed at the dealer for about a bazillion bucks, but I was wondering if any of the aftermarket XM tuners will connect to it. I'm running around with a portable XM car kit and I'm tired of messing with the wires. Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. BTW, I just took a 1000 mile round trip vacation and I can't quite figure it out. I go 5 mph over the 65 or 70 speed limit and I average 16.5mpg. I go 10 mph over the limit and I average 16.7mpg. I guess if I do about 150, I could make the trip on a single tank. That is if I lived.
- $3.03/gal
I followed misterme back to his hideout in the hybrid forum area to learn more about how he gets (or says he does) 69mpg in a car rated for 45. He pointed me to his description of how he drives for mileage and while some of his methods would be a real stretch to implement in any kind of traffic, especially here where I live, I nevertheless decided to try for myself as I did a 160 mile round trip drive on at in the Navigator. I did learn a couple of things, maybe nothing new, but I'll pass it on here and I'd love to hear from anyone else who has tips for good gas mileage.
Firstly I'll say that my 2004 Nav w/17K miles gets in the 16s on the road and more like 11 around town. unfortunately what I'll describe applies mainly to on the road (hiway) miles. My results are purely from the on-board mpg calculator. The terrain I drove on is mildly hilly with some long fairly flat miles and one drive up and over an 1800 ft mtn pass and down the other side. Results are divided into 3 sections based on the legs of the trip and pretty much eliminating most city/traffic light areas.
The first leg I reset the mpg calc as I accelerated onto the freeway from the stop light near my home. Up and over 1800 feet, down the other side and proceeded 75 or so miles to my freeway destination exit. So this was pretty much all freeway, with that long climb up at the start. mpg at end: 17.6 Not a real big deal, but better than my usual 16.5 or so.
next leg again I reset mpg as I started onto the freeway up a hill then down into Berkeley and on down hiway 17 (880) to an offramp in Fremont. This was about a 35 mile leg and the mpg at end was 20.4 !! There may have been a little more down than up involved in this leg, but I must say that the number was staying pretty constant as I drove.
Final leg was Fremont to home, appx 55 miles, again up and over the mountain and the number was 17.2. I did hit a little freeway traffic on this leg and I got off and bought a bunch of stuff at Ikea and went thru the drive-up line at In n Out Burger on the way so theres a wee bit of city in this number.
Anyhow, I come away convinced I can improve the mileage #s in the Nav anywhere from 5 to 20 or so %. So what did I do?
On the first leg, I didn't really slow down much from normal, but I did experiment a little. Maybe did 70-75 top speed. I did follow some suggestions from misterme and this is where it gets a bit hairy and nerve-wracking cause u gotta keep an eye out on everyone else.
* Basically, a light foot on the gas whenever it's on the gas.
* S L O W acceleration.
* Shift into *Neutral* whenever momentum will keep you going (like a small or even large downward slope in the road - though gotta watch speed - don't let the thing run away from ya.)
* Use cruise for flat areas, decelerate using the cruise or your right foot when going up a hill - that's where a lot of gas gets burned - and you end up going 20 or more mph slower as you crest the hill (that's when u gotta watch out for following cars) then going down hill you can accelerate again with a gravity assist.
Even short rises in the road, if u decel or even shift to neutral, u'll see the mpg begin to tick up. Whereas if you kept up speed up the rise, it'd tick down.
I noticed that if I kept speed up around 75 or more, which is where I usually am, keeping up with the Jones' and all, the mpg meter seemed to want to level off around 16.4 or so. But if I slowed down (I know, I hate doin it too) to between 60 and 65, I could be at 19.0 to 20.5 and it would hold or be slowly going UP if I also practised the neutral momentum and slowing down til crest the hill deals.
Around town?? Slow acceleration, coast in neutral where possible, certainly no sense racing to the next stoplight - a nice coast up to it is fine. Of course combining trips saves gas too, don't idle over a minute unless at a traffic stop, etc.
OK, lots of this in apple pie, and lots prolly sounds nutty (like shifing into neutral) and might be unsafe at times. But it did pay off. I love seeing that meter at 20.4mpg doing 63mph on the freeway in my big comfortable Navigator, gotta admit that.
I'm now trying all these methods with my LS for a complete tank (I don't have a trip computer in my V6 LS). She usually gets right about 22mpg on my commute, and I drive it like it wants to be driven. Now, I'm wussy-footin and neutralising and coasting etc Oh, and keeping my speed to 60-65 on the freeway. This morning, no kidding, at 60mph the ONLY vehicle I passed was a garbage truck. Everyone else flew by me. I'll check back in on that board and this when I have a number for this tank.
I don't know how to link to a message here, but if u want to see misterme's complete writeup, it's message #323 in the "Hybrid Tips: Optimizing mileage" forum.
Here's the link:
Hybrid Tips: Optimizing mileage
Steve, Host
tidester, host
Really? I didn't know that. Certainly, as I pointed out, it *could* be dangerous if done in traffic. In any case that's one they'd have a tough time catching me doing, eh?
Also, if true, perhaps the original poster (misterme) should have been told this as well.
The language here says no coasting in neutral when traveling upon a downgrade - I suppose it's perfectly fine to coast uphill all you want. :-)
Steve, Host
Haha. Well, u might as well keep the Nav then eh?!
I'm not inclined to do 55 or 60 mph either. You being in Nevada, it's got to be real hard to go that slow. I may take a long trip with the family over the holidays and would like to get better mpg if I can. If I slow down to 60-65 and practice some of these tips and saw 19 or 20mpg hiway I'd be pretty happy.
I could get a Prius or Civic and get 40 or 50 mpg, but then I'd have to leave 1/2 the family or all the gear at home:>)
Just ain't no winnin.
To set the record straight, if you take a look at my message it wasn't trolling at all, and in fact as benign as possible, only had a question.
Honestly asked, honestly answered.
I'm glad that you were able to get some good results using a few of my tips, that's why I posted them.
You're right, all of them are not applicable all the time under all conditions and while it may take some initial work to implement them, after a while good habits become routine and hardly even thought of.
99.9% of drivers don't realize how much improvement/savings can be had no matter what they drive and mistakingly think their vehicle just gets what it gets.
If you don't want to implement them that's fine, but to many people even a little relief from the pump helps.....or could be alot of relief depending on how their used, even in a Navigator.
Thanks for posting a link to the tips here, I'm glad they're getting around.
EB that you can get on the Gator - but not the plasma display dash. I guess the engine is the same now, didn't used to be.
Your 6 speed tranny I'm sure keeps the revs on the hiway lower than the 4 speed tranny in my '04. So probably you would see less of a difference. Coasting in neutral (which I've been informed is illegal in some states so be aware of that) helps because it drops the engine RPM to idle speed and takes the load off it.
So I promised to report back on my mileage experiments with my Lincoln LS and the number is in. After wussy-footing it for about 280 miles, I got 28.3 mpg which is about 25% better than my normal 22mpg when I pretty much hot-rod the car.
I mentioned engine braking before because I have had to change my driving habits while driving the 'Gator. In my Dakota and Outback, I am able to pretty much judge how much they will decelerate when I take my foot off of the accelerator, but I'm having trouble with the Navigator because of the 'coasting'. I know that while coasting, the tranny tends to 'drive' the engine, keeping the rpm's up while decelerating. I would assume that the higher gear ratio would keep the engine rpm's down while coasting.