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Comments
classic negotiating strategy says: let them make the first offer.
why name any number at all? just let each dealer know that you are faxing several others, tell them it is a competitive market and that you expect to pay LESS THAN invoice price. Let them make the first move and play it from there.
good luck!
I'd appreciate any advice!
Thanks
Anyway that's beside the point of this post. I'm wondering why Subarus need a Limited Slip Diff. I thought that the cars AWD system acted like an LSD already. After all, the saying goes "from the wheels that slip, to the wheels that grip".
If the LSD is that big of an advantage on a Subaru then I'll go ahead and spring for it I suppose. What's the story??
installed options such as the ski and bike
attachments are priced? Edmunds lists
invoice and MSRP but dealers quote
other numbers (probably depends on how
much they charge for installation I suppose).
If you buy the options with the vehicle,
would one expect to get a better price
than buying them later or should I just
buy these at a sports store and install
them myself?
Any opinions on the roof-vs-back bike
carrier would also be appreciated.
Thanks.
Good luck to you.
Hop this helps. Feel free to ask if you need further data!
Don
The AWD system shifts power from front to rear and vice-versa, and it works very effectively. Still, they have open differentials in each axle, front and rear, so each axle can send all the power to one side. So in a worst case scenario (say both right side tires are on ice) two wheels could spin and you wouldn't move forward.
I have this setup and it's never happened to me, but in theory it could. Think about this, though, a FWD car with an open diffy can send power to a single wheel (the path of least resistance). So one wheel off the ground or on ice and you're stuck.
With the rear LSD, power can also shift to the other side. The differential isn't open, so it would lock to shift power to the left, and you'd pull forward.
Shane: sounds like the dealer is giving you a hard time, so I'd pass on the options now, and order them from a wholesaler like QSubaru (via e-mail). You don't pay sales tax or shipping, so it's actually cheaper.
-juice
Many thanks in advance . .
I'd take the 22450 quote, especially since they're all so close together. I doubt you'll find one that will be significantly lower than that.
That's $90 under "invoice".
-juice
"the invoice is actually 22540"
I got 20776 base invoice from intellichoice for
an S "1CC", which I suppose is for a car w/o
automatic trans. One of the dealers quoted
22599 for a "1CD", which I suppose is with auto.
juice, how did you arrive at 22540?
Regards...
When you say "invoice", dealers aren't subtracting their holdback, it's their only profit when they're selling at or below invoice regularly.
-juice
http://www.apa.ca/apa_eng/home_en.htm
This is the webpage of the "Autombile Protection Association", based in Montreal and Toronto.
you have to join (~$50 cdn); this includes two free invoice checks, Lemonaide, etc etc.
I live down the Annopolis Valley, am a member, and it'll still save you bucks! Dexter's is usually unwilling to deal (personal opinion), Valley Subaru in New Minas may do better (I'm not affiliated). Threaten to go to Montreal and pick it up for $500 over invoice (the APA deal).
Two very good dealers in this area are; John and Phil's in Corvallis; and Mark Thomas Motors in Albany. They both were very attentive, gave us plenty of advice, and LOTS of time to test drive several cars (Foresters and Outbacks, manuals and automatics). When it came time to buy, I did all my negotiating by fax and email, and it worked out great ($500 under invoice on a 2000 OB).
Somewhat less helpful, and a little less competitive in price were Capital Subaru in Salem; Romania Subaru in Eugene; and Royal Moore in Hillsboro.
At the bottom of the barrel was Carr Subaru in Beaverton (where, they have a bunch of really dirty used (auction) cars, and told me they would turn back the odometer on a used Outback if i wanted them to..( said they did it all the time......!!).
Even worse was Thomason Subaru in Oregon City, where they tried to hustle me and the sales manager was downright rude.
if anyone is looking for a subaru in western oregon, and wants a real soft-sell and helpful kind of salesman, ask for Larry Lockhart at John and Phil's in Corvallis. (no, he's no relation and i don't get any kickbacks...).
That odometer talk is scary. I believe there is a seal that breaks if it's tampered with. What morons.
-juice
I went to Halpert Subaru/Suzuki on Mentor Ave in Painesville. It was top rated by AAA, and they were really nice. It's a small place, and only one salesman was there, because the other had to leave to take care of his daughter. Anyway, he was really nice.
I test drove an L model, and I liked it. Since it's built on a car platform, the ride is really smooth, and it has incredible pickup. I also test drove the Vitara to compare the two. The Vitara is built on a truck platform and rides like a truck. It a V6 but only has 150 or so horsepower while the Forester is a 4 cylinder, but has 160+ horsepower. Definitely a big difference!
He had a Forester just off the truck that he said he would give me at $300 over invoice.
The salesman said that they and Ellacott Subaru on Warrensville road do a lot of high volume business, so you might want to check them both out. Let me know how it goes and what kind of price they talk! I hate the whole negotiating process, too.
Also do you find that if a dealer has to trade with another local dealer for the car taht it affects the pricing? I'm trying to decide what to offer for a cash sale with minimal hassle. I'm thinking about offering $300 over invoice.
I went to Royal Moore just to see what was on the lot. I told the guy who approached me flat out that I was not buying today, I just wanted to look at the stickers. I also told him that I was not even looking for me - a friend was going to be the buyer. Still he was on me like white on rice. After I finished looking I said thank you and tried to leave. He and another guy tried to put on the pressure. Everytime I said no and turned to leave, they said something else. I hate to be rude and turn my back on someone, but finally I just said "Look I'm not buying today. I hate to be rude, but I'm leaving." I walked away with them still talking to my back.
Oregonman: I've seen a few, but with me being on the east coast that doesn't help you. You can always custom order one, and get exactly the options and color that you want.
I wouldn't even make that offer, let them name their price first. I've seen some prices below that, around $100 over. Just let them know you're going to compare their price with other quotes in person and on the web.
-juice
I'm going on Saturday to a dealership closer to my house. I'd like to buy from them, so that if I have to have any service done, they're close and they'll know me. So...I'll see what kind of price they want, and if it's the same as the other dealership, I'll get one, otherwise, I'll just buy from the first dealer.
Insurance will vary quite a bit based on your demographic and by the make and model. For example, I pay CNA about $800/year for my Forester in CA, but I'm married and have a clean record.
Shopr around. Some insurance companies classify the Forester as a car, others as a SUV. The latter will tend to be more expensive.
Ed
Stephen
I go through Costco's Executive Member program to get Travellers insurance at a hefty discount. Shop around, try Progressive and some on-line quotesmiths.
strvt: Automotive News lists a current dealer incentive for the Legacys at 0-$500, probably based on quotas. I've seen some prices under invoice, but this is regional, so you'll have to shop around. Forester has cut rate financing but it was for 2000 models only.
-juice
A local no-haggle dealer has a 5 speed sedan for $300 under invoice, and an auto for $303 over invoice. Both are under $19k even with freight.
Here's my thoughts:
Pro: steering, handling, braking, torque, style, traction, rear LSD, moonroof, seats, leather wheel/shift knob.
Con: small back seat, no turbo yet, and no wagon body style offered.
One thing to consider is that the new one arrives this fall or perhaps early winter. That will have a longer wheelbase, and we're supposed to see a turbo option, perhaps even on the wagon.
The price will increase, but they're really addressing all the significant cons I can think of.
I attended an i-Club meet, and here's some of the cars that showed up:
http://thejuiceman.homepage.com/iclub.html
Get yours and send me a photo, and you'll be up there too! Seriously, they're fun cars with loyal owners.
-juice
http://www.egr.unlv.edu/~simon/2.5RS/edit/spy.html
$25k sounds about right. Just keep in mind the performance levels we're talking about. 60 mph in the mid 5's. Nothing at that price can touch it.
Also, the RS may become the base version, so you can imagine how well equipped the entire line will be. AWD, ABS, moonroof, power everything standard.
The longer wheelbase may indeed affect the quickness and directness of the steering, and perhaps add weight. We'll have to wait an see how much.
The wagon would address texsubaru's point, but everyone here knows I'm a wagon fan.
-juice
Thanks that was just the info I'm seeking. I calculate your invoice at 25486. So you got it for over $1000 under invoice. Wow. Can you verify that you paid cash with no trade? How long did the process take? And do you have any suggestions for limiting the foot dragging? Did you have to threaten to write the attorny general? One more question? How did you pay - would they take a personal check or did you come armed with a certified check? Thanks in advance foor your help.
I'll check out Tacoma Suburu but if the deal was worth my time, I don't mind going to Spokane either, always a good get-away and nice excuse to take some time off.
I will go this weekend to talk with different dealers and let you know what I discover. Might even do a Pt.Angeles trek.
Stephen
Automotive News listed a dealer incentive for some 2000 models, but I guess it's regional.
-juice
I'd second Subardriver's advice on Thomason's weekend ad prices. We actually had a good experience buying our 2000 Limited OB and our 97 through Thomason. We were in and out of the dealer within three hours.
I'd have financing ready from somewhere else and not add any other options through them. I'd also avoid trading your car in if at all possible.
Ask for Don or Faith Leith. They're an older husband and wife team and treated us with respect. The other sales people were all kids. They'll try to push the NW Protection Package on you, which as we all know is hogwash. I'd just go in on Friday and say I want this car in the ad with no additional options.
You could also try getting Wentworth to match the price, but I wouldn't count on it. In my Subaru search, I found Carr to be the worst of the Portland dealers. Horrible service too.
I am currently in the market for a 2001 Forester S. Here are the features I would like:
Auto, Feature III, Sound III, Blue Color
I would ike to at least make a downpayment on a car this weekend. I have been told I will have to have the car factory ordered since Blue is impossible to find in VA.
My question is which dealers should I consider?? I had a GREAT test drive experience with Tom G. from Stohlman's but he is the only price I have heard (23,000). Can I do better and where should I talk to??
I am new at this and any advice would be GREATLY appreciated. Thanks!!
Tev
Bob
Price sounds about right. Fitzgerald is in Rockville near White Flint, and they lists these no-haggle prices (none are blue, however):
Manuals: Silver 22647
White 23195
Autos: Silver 23614
Black 24259
Red 23703
Here's the URL:
http://www.fitzgeraldautomall.com/
The site lists specifics on options. It's the model in highest demand, so prices are above invoice. Margins on L's are smaller.
I'd avoid Farrish Subaru. Bait and switch, not pleasant. You may indeed have to order one.
-juice
Bob's thinking of Paul Brothers Subaru. Paul Brothers bid on my GT wagon purchase but they were rather expensive. Friendly, though. They're a tiny dealership. You can also go to Subaru of America and select Dealer Search to find others.
If you don't mind me offering my unsolicited two cents, it sounds like you're in a hurry. I'm sure you know, but dealers like people in a hurry, because those in hurry are easy to harry
Anyway if you can wait, click on my profile (above, the underlined blue "miksmi") and read about some other purchacing options that'll save you money and time.
Hope this helped you. Please let us know what you end up doing.
..Mike Smith . Silver Spring MD
..Mike
Mike: I didn't mean to sound like I was in a big hurry. I am just resigned to the fact that I will have to factory order a Blue 01 Forester S and that can take 7-9 weeks. Basically, I would like to have a new car by the end of the summer. I was also hoping some places might have a Memorial Day sale or something.
Again, thanks for all the help. I'll check out a few of the dealers that were listed.
Tev
Good hunting!
..Mike
..Mike