Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

driver100 · April 2019

jipster said:

oldfarmer50 said:
Here’s a story with a happy (I hope) ending.

Ford has had a history of paint problems on their aluminum hoods. My 15’ Mustang was no exception. In summer of 2017 @ 9000 miles I noticed some bubbling on the center leading edge. Took it to the dealer and they got Ford to approve a repaint under warranty.

Fast forward to this spring. I take the car out for the first time and notice similar a problem on the outboard edge of the hood. Disappointed since the car still only has about 12k miles. But it’s out of warranty now.

Went through the same procedure at the dealer except this time Ford denies the claim. Seems I’m SOL. Same day I get an email from the dealer with one of the routine “how was your visit?” questions. I decide to vent a bit and tell them how disappointed I was with Ford’s decision especially since the car had such low mileage. Didn’t expect anything to come of it.

Today I get an email from the owner saying the dealership will do the second repaint on their own to insure my satisfaction. I was pretty impressed that they would do this. The car goes in next week.

Great news for you oldfarmer! Earl Schieb is saddened for his loss though. :-(

Yeh, great news oldfarmer.....nicely done. They will be disappointed when they learn you only buy a new car every 20 years though.

explorerx4 · April 2019

@oldfarmer50,
Maybe the manufacturer paid for the whole job the first time, but the dealer only did part of it.

driver100 · April 2019

jmonroe1 said:

tjc78 said:
.I don't want to be the guinea pig with a wannabe.

You crack me up... A Genesis is hardly a wannabe especially now. It is just another player in the luxury market.

I'll admit that Hyundai is slow getting the dedicated Genesis network up and running but once they do and add a few entries I just can't see how companies like Lexus, Acura and Infiniti wouldn't be a little concerned

They need an SUV like the RX350 / QX60 / MDX
C'mon, you shouldn't be so hard on him for saying "wannabe". I think I put him up to using that term. Do you really think he could have come up with that all by himself ?

jmonroe

Yes, JM, it is your term, but it works. Every year the reviewers say the Genesis is better than ever and has caught up to the leaders (BMW, MB, Audi). Then the cracks begin to get mentioned, not as good handling, transmission not as smooth, inside finish not as nice etc. The Genesis is a good car......but, it is like if you really like Coke, then No Name Cola just ain't going to do it for you.

driver100 · April 2019

abacomike said:
The Florida State Legislature (both Houses) just passed a new bill regarding “Texting While Operating A Motor Vehicle” (includes trucks, buses and motor homes)! The penalty is a PRIMARY OFFENSE with big dollar fines and points on your driver’s license. &nbsp

It's about time. More accidents are caused by distracted drivers than anything else these days, and the problem is getting worse. Of course in Florida, there is a big lobby group against allowing driving while texting to be a primary offense.... gives cops more power to pull drivers over. This law helps protect the innocent who could be hit by a selfish moron who isn't paying attention to what he is doing.

driver100 · April 2019

jmonroe1 said:

henryn said:
I would be more likely to buy a used Genesis than a used BMW or Mercedes. No way I would buy any car like that new, just too rich for my blood.
For a minute there I thought you were going to say you wouldn't want to own a German car that's out of warranty and that would have caused sparks to fly.
jmonroe

I thought we shot that myth down with roadburners X3 that has 200000 miles on it.

driver100 · April 2019

oldfarmer50 said:

explorerx4 said:
MY guess is, since the manufacturer already paid to have it fixed once, they said it's on the dealership this time, since it wasn't done right the first time.
Funny thing, Ford has known about this problem since at least 2005 but didn’t fix It until 2016. Other car companies keep selling engines that blow up or trannys that fail early for years knowing that it will drive away buyers. Is it so difficult for them to change direction or is it a bean counter decision?

Companies don't care any more. Cut costs. Make it through this quarter and save our jobs for another 3 months. Money going out doesn't help the bottom line. Who cares if you buy another Ford in 3 years....the CEO will be gone by then or he may preserve his job by not paying out for a repair.....and instead will try and find a new customer.

driver100 · April 2019

explorerx4 said:
@oldfarmer50,
Maybe the manufacturer paid for the whole job the first time, but the dealer only did part of it.

Just a guess, but I think they repaired the hood which had bubbles on it. Then the fenders erupted, and now it is out of warranty. The dealer is honorable, and decided to help a customer out....probably a slow day in the paint department too. They have the staff, paint doesn't cost much, do a little PR work and hopefully make a satisfied customer, who will tell 10 other people.

driver100 · April 2019

Mr_Shiftright said:

driver100 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

driver100 said:

cdnpinhead said:

dino001 said:
BTW, you missed entire Chrysler line of "early praise turned pile of junk": PT Cruiser, 300/Charger, Challenger, Caliber. Those were often very attractive visually, evoking a lot of desire until first reports of poor quality came in.
This is most certainly true. The LH trio (Dodge Intrepid, Chrysler Concorde & Eagle Vision) were praised to the rafters by CR when they first came out and turned out to have many issues, mostly related to the automatic transmission. CR later downgraded them significantly. That was my first and (God willing) my last daily driver with an automatic transmission.
To follow up with the "shame on me" piece, (the LH was the shame on you), CR did the same damn thing with the Lincoln LS.

While we are mentioning Chrysler lets not forget the Prowler.
What was that all about?
Those are developing a collector base. Why is another question.
Yeh, I don't get it....seems they are selling around the $30000 mark.

I've driven one. They are actually more competent than you might expect, and fairly quick and fun--but the lack of a V8 and a manual transmission make it a perennial odd-ball choice for a collector car. They do indeed sell in the $30K range if they are pristine. Auction values confirm this. I'm amazed that Chrysler even agreed to build it. Most of them have few miles on them.

The article said the horsepower was pretty good, torque not so good. But the only V8s were big heavy magnums....not much more HP. Chrysler didn't have a suitable manual around.
You don't know who to believe but some car people liked the concept model, Chrysler wanted to see what they could do working with aluminum, it brought some attention to the boring Chrysler line up, it was relatively cheap advertising to get the Chrysler name out there. It seems the people at Chryco thought it accomplished what they wanted, but, sales were pretty minimal.

driver100 · April 2019

ruking1 said:

driver100 said:

stickguy said:
The Genny SUV should be out in early 2020. It’s gonna be nice.
I'm not so sure about this:

But, I do like this:

Would have liked screen built into the instrument panel more.
I would NOT be an early adopter of the first generation Genesis CUV/SUV. While to some it may “look” good to great, my take it’s a “me too” type product. Are there any words on prices?

Estimated Arrival and Price: Genesis has said that the GV80 will debut at some point in 2019 before going on sale in the United States in early 2020 as a 2020 model. Like other Genesis models, the GV80 should undercut its competition by at least a few thousand dollars

Does anyone else experience a delay when you press "Quote"? Maybe that is another tradeoff!

abacomike · April 2019

driver100 said:

The Genny SUV should be out in early 2020. It’s gonna be nice.
I'm not so sure about this: But, I do like this: Would have liked screen built into the instrument panel more.
I would NOT be an early adopter of the first generation Genesis CUV/SUV. While to some it may “look” good to great, my take it’s a “me too” type product. Are there any words on prices?
Estimated Arrival and Price: Genesis has said that the GV80 will debut at some point in 2019 before going on sale in the United States in early 2020 as a 2020 model. Like other Genesis models, the GV80 should undercut its competition by at least a few thousand dollars Does anyone else experience a delay when you press "Quote"? Maybe that is another tradeoff!

Yes, at times - not always.

explorerx4 · April 2019

@driver100,
I'm guessing you didn't take a high school freshman logic class.
An early rule I learned is you can't take a single example and turn it into a general rule.
You can consider this a way to characterize yourself as a life long learner(assuming you get it).

oldfarmer50 · April 2019

abacomike said:
The Florida State Legislature (both Houses) just passed a new bill regarding “Texting While Operating A Motor Vehicle” (includes trucks, buses and motor homes)! The penalty is a PRIMARY OFFENSE with big dollar fines and points on your driver’s license. Governor DiSantos is expected to sign the bill into law this week.

Police are allowed to pull a driver over and ticket him/her if observed texting while operating the vehicle. This has been needed for a long time. So, I would advise anyone who is in Florida (residents or those on business or vacation) to heed this very carefully. Out of State license holders will have their home State DMV’s notified of the offense. Out of State drivers (licensed by another State) might have to appear in court from my understanding.

Warnings (written) will be given out until January 1st, 2020. After that, the law will be enforced with fines and points on your license. 1st offense is not too expensive but becomes more expensive with succeeding infractions.

NY has had similar laws for years. Doesn’t make a bit of difference. Tonight on the news they reported a fatal accident where a car crossed over and hit an oncoming driver head on. Guaranteed that someone was texting.

abacomike · April 2019

oldfarmer50 said:

The Florida State Legislature (both Houses) just passed a new bill regarding “Texting While Operating A Motor Vehicle” (includes trucks, buses and motor homes)! The penalty is a PRIMARY OFFENSE with big dollar fines and points on your driver’s license. Governor DiSantos is expected to sign the bill into law this week.

Police are allowed to pull a driver over and ticket him/her if observed texting while operating the vehicle. This has been needed for a long time. So, I would advise anyone who is in Florida (residents or those on business or vacation) to heed this very carefully. Out of State license holders will have their home State DMV’s notified of the offense. Out of State drivers (licensed by another State) might have to appear in court from my understanding.

Warnings (written) will be given out until January 1st, 2020. After that, the law will be enforced with fines and points on your license. 1st offense is not too expensive but becomes more expensive with succeeding infractions.
NY has had similar laws for years. Doesn’t make a bit of difference. Tonight on the news they reported a fatal accident where a car crossed over and hit an oncoming driver head on. Guaranteed that someone was texting.

Hardly a day goes by that I don’t observe a driver texting while driving. I don’t receive many texts but at least Siri dictates texts to me through CAR-PLAY and I can send a response hands-free by dictating a return text. Most of the time, I tell Siri not to send a response.

oldfarmer50 · April 2019

driver100 said:

jipster said:

oldfarmer50 said:
Here’s a story with a happy (I hope) ending.

Ford has had a history of paint problems on their aluminum hoods. My 15’ Mustang was no exception. In summer of 2017 @ 9000 miles I noticed some bubbling on the center leading edge. Took it to the dealer and they got Ford to approve a repaint under warranty.

Fast forward to this spring. I take the car out for the first time and notice similar a problem on the outboard edge of the hood. Disappointed since the car still only has about 12k miles. But it’s out of warranty now.

Went through the same procedure at the dealer except this time Ford denies the claim. Seems I’m SOL. Same day I get an email from the dealer with one of the routine “how was your visit?” questions. I decide to vent a bit and tell them how disappointed I was with Ford’s decision especially since the car had such low mileage. Didn’t expect anything to come of it.

Today I get an email from the owner saying the dealership will do the second repaint on their own to insure my satisfaction. I was pretty impressed that they would do this. The car goes in next week.

Great news for you oldfarmer! Earl Schieb is saddened for his loss though. :-(
Yeh, great news oldfarmer.....nicely done. They will be disappointed when they learn you only buy a new car every 20 years though.

Funny you say that. When I made the appointment with the paint shop I told the guy how I appreciated the gesture. He said “well, we want you to come back and buy another car when your Mustang reaches 100,000 miles”.

At the rate I put on miles that will be 2048 and I’ll be 96.

suydam · April 2019

driver100 said:

abacomike said:
The Florida State Legislature (both Houses) just passed a new bill regarding “Texting While Operating A Motor Vehicle” (includes trucks, buses and motor homes)! The penalty is a PRIMARY OFFENSE with big dollar fines and points on your driver’s license. &nbsp
It's about time. More accidents are caused by distracted drivers than anything else these days, and the problem is getting worse. Of course in Florida, there is a big lobby group against allowing driving while texting to be a primary offense.... gives cops more power to pull drivers over. This law helps protect the innocent who could be hit by a selfish moron who isn't paying attention to what he is doing.

Not really enforceable in practice though. People just put down their phones. Hopefully it could become like seat belt laws, also difficult to enforce but just the threat resulted in greater compliance.

oldfarmer50 · April 2019

Is this really happening? Is the tech to do this readily available? Opinions?

https://youtu.be/dkHFf4_oAKs

jmonroe1 · April 2019

driver100 said:

jmonroe1 said:

tjc78 said:
.I don't want to be the guinea pig with a wannabe.

You crack me up... A Genesis is hardly a wannabe especially now. It is just another player in the luxury market.

I'll admit that Hyundai is slow getting the dedicated Genesis network up and running but once they do and add a few entries I just can't see how companies like Lexus, Acura and Infiniti wouldn't be a little concerned

They need an SUV like the RX350 / QX60 / MDX
C'mon, you shouldn't be so hard on him for saying "wannabe". I think I put him up to using that term. Do you really think he could have come up with that all by himself ?

jmonroe
Yes, JM, it is your term, but it works. Every year the reviewers say the Genesis is better than ever and has caught up to the leaders (BMW, MB, Audi). Then the cracks begin to get mentioned, not as good handling, transmission not as smooth, inside finish not as nice etc. The Genesis is a good car......but, it is like if you really like Coke, then No Name Cola just ain't going to do it for you.

That doesn't bother me, I prefer Pepsi. I guess you can say I'm ahead of the curve there too.

jmonroe

jmonroe1 · April 2019

driver100 said:

jmonroe1 said:

henryn said:
I would be more likely to buy a used Genesis than a used BMW or Mercedes. No way I would buy any car like that new, just too rich for my blood.
For a minute there I thought you were going to say you wouldn't want to own a German car that's out of warranty and that would have caused sparks to fly.
jmonroe
I thought we shot that myth down with roadburners X3 that has 200000 miles on it.

There you go again citing the exception. I'm sure there are heart specialists and brain surgeons who smoke but I'm pretty sure they are the exceptions.

jmonroe

explorerx4 · April 2019

@oldfarmer50,
There is some software called Forescan that can change a lot of stuff on your car's computer.
Vehicle history reports are pretty important. You may need them from more than one source.

jmonroe1 · April 2019

driver100 said:

explorerx4 said:
@oldfarmer50,
Maybe the manufacturer paid for the whole job the first time, but the dealer only did part of it.
Just a guess, but I think they repaired the hood which had bubbles on it. Then the fenders erupted, and now it is out of warranty. The dealer is honorable, and decided to help a customer out....probably a slow day in the paint department too. They have the staff, paint doesn't cost much, do a little PR work and hopefully make a satisfied customer, who will tell 10 other people.

And you did it again. Paint ain't cheap and it costs plenty to apply it. When my Genny was backed into this past Winter, you could barely see the damage to the lower right quarter panel yet it cost well over 1300 bucks to repair the damage. When I asked both shops that provided the estimates, "why so much for so little damage" ? They both said, "the painting".

You gotta stop shooting from the hip.

jmonroe

explorerx4 · April 2019

@oldfarmer50,
Want to hear some great V8 noise? Makes me want one(ain't going to happen).
https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/classic-cars/a27314748/ford-gt-supercharged-v8-sound/

oldfarmer50 · April 2019

explorerx4 said:
@oldfarmer50,
Want to hear some great V8 noise? Makes me want one(ain't going to happen).
https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/classic-cars/a27314748/ford-gt-supercharged-v8-sound/

Sweet! What do those old GTs go for now....$300k....$400k?

driver100 · April 2019

explorerx4 said:
@driver100,
I'm guessing you didn't take a high school freshman logic class.
An early rule I learned is you can't take a single example and turn it into a general rule.
You can consider this a way to characterize yourself as a life long learner(assuming you get it).

No, I didn't take a high school logic course.....good deduction.
Just tell me what point you are trying to make, no time to try and figure it out.
Just tell me what I am using as an example, and turning it into a general rule.
Often, past history does indicate what will happen in the future.

driver100 · April 2019

abacomike said:

oldfarmer50 said:

abacomike said:
The Florida State Legislature (both Houses) just passed a new bill regarding “Texting While Operating A Motor Vehicle” (includes trucks, buses and motor homes)! The penalty is a PRIMARY OFFENSE with big dollar fines and points on your driver’s license. Governor DiSantos is expected to sign the bill into law this week.

Police are allowed to pull a driver over and ticket him/her if observed texting while operating the vehicle. This has been needed for a long time. So, I would advise anyone who is in Florida (residents or those on business or vacation) to heed this very carefully. Out of State license holders will have their home State DMV’s notified of the offense. Out of State drivers (licensed by another State) might have to appear in court from my understanding.

Warnings (written) will be given out until January 1st, 2020. After that, the law will be enforced with fines and points on your license. 1st offense is not too expensive but becomes more expensive with succeeding infractions.
NY has had similar laws for years. Doesn’t make a bit of difference. Tonight on the news they reported a fatal accident where a car crossed over and hit an oncoming driver head on. Guaranteed that someone was texting.

Hardly a day goes by that I don’t observe a driver texting while driving. I don’t receive many texts but at least Siri dictates texts to me through CAR-PLAY and I can send a response hands-free by dictating a return text. Most of the time, I tell Siri not to send a response.

If there are fairly heavy fines it could make a difference. Especially, because, I believe, if you are in an accident they can check your phone records to see if you were on the phone when the accident occurred....which will increase the penalty and cause insurance rate to go up.

driver100 · April 2019

suydam said:

driver100 said:

abacomike said:
The Florida State Legislature (both Houses) just passed a new bill regarding “Texting While Operating A Motor Vehicle” (includes trucks, buses and motor homes)! The penalty is a PRIMARY OFFENSE with big dollar fines and points on your driver’s license. &nbsp
It's about time. More accidents are caused by distracted drivers than anything else these days, and the problem is getting worse. Of course in Florida, there is a big lobby group against allowing driving while texting to be a primary offense.... gives cops more power to pull drivers over. This law helps protect the innocent who could be hit by a selfish moron who isn't paying attention to what he is doing.
Not really enforceable in practice though. People just put down their phones. Hopefully it could become like seat belt laws, also difficult to enforce but just the threat resulted in greater compliance.

They can check phone records. The police here ride in tow trucks and even buses, and they look down into cars to see if the driver is on his phone. People still do it, but, using phones while driving has dropped off a lot.

driver100 · April 2019

jmonroe1 said:

driver100 said:

jmonroe1 said:

henryn said:
I would be more likely to buy a used Genesis than a used BMW or Mercedes. No way I would buy any car like that new, just too rich for my blood.
For a minute there I thought you were going to say you wouldn't want to own a German car that's out of warranty and that would have caused sparks to fly.
jmonroe
I thought we shot that myth down with roadburners X3 that has 200000 miles on it.

There you go again citing the exception. I'm sure there are heart specialists and brain surgeons who smoke but I'm pretty sure they are the exceptions.

jmonroe

I have proof of an X3 with high mileage.........give me an example of a BMW with high maintenance.
A friend in Florida has a 1986 BMW with over 200000 miles on it........how many 1986 Gennies are on the road?????

driver100 · April 2019

jmonroe1 said:

driver100 said:

explorerx4 said:
@oldfarmer50,
Maybe the manufacturer paid for the whole job the first time, but the dealer only did part of it.
Just a guess, but I think they repaired the hood which had bubbles on it. Then the fenders erupted, and now it is out of warranty. The dealer is honorable, and decided to help a customer out....probably a slow day in the paint department too. They have the staff, paint doesn't cost much, do a little PR work and hopefully make a satisfied customer, who will tell 10 other people.
And you did it again. Paint ain't cheap and it costs plenty to apply it. When my Genny was backed into this past Winter, you could barely see the damage to the lower right quarter panel yet it cost well over 1300 bucks to repair the damage. When I asked both shops that provided the estimates, "why so much for so little damage" ? They both said, "the painting".

You gotta stop shooting from the hip.

jmonroe

And you believed them? The body shop probably has a good supply of paint, the paint tech guy has a few free moments, it costs the dealer very little but it is great PR.....actually relatively cheap advertising to keep a customer happy. These days retailers and most businesses have loss leaders to get you in the door. If they do it right they can also deduct it as an expense. Basically free labor, and how much can paint be to paint the top of a fender?

jmonroe1 · April 2019

driver100 said:

jmonroe1 said:

driver100 said:

explorerx4 said:
@oldfarmer50,
Maybe the manufacturer paid for the whole job the first time, but the dealer only did part of it.
Just a guess, but I think they repaired the hood which had bubbles on it. Then the fenders erupted, and now it is out of warranty. The dealer is honorable, and decided to help a customer out....probably a slow day in the paint department too. They have the staff, paint doesn't cost much, do a little PR work and hopefully make a satisfied customer, who will tell 10 other people.
And you did it again. Paint ain't cheap and it costs plenty to apply it. When my Genny was backed into this past Winter, you could barely see the damage to the lower right quarter panel yet it cost well over 1300 bucks to repair the damage. When I asked both shops that provided the estimates, "why so much for so little damage" ? They both said, "the painting".

You gotta stop shooting from the hip.

jmonroe
And you believed them? The body shop probably has a good supply of paint, the paint tech guy has a few free moments, it costs the dealer very little but it is great PR.....actually relatively cheap advertising to keep a customer happy. These days retailers and most businesses have loss leaders to get you in the door. If they do it right they can also deduct it as an expense. Basically free labor, and how much can paint be to paint the top of a fender?

Of course I believed them. The guy that hit me had Allstate insurance and they were the ones that paid for the repair. If that wasn't the going rate, do you really think they would have paid that price? Why are you trying to argue about this ? Your ploy of trying to have the last word is getting old and has worn itself out.

jmonroe

ruking1 · April 2019

driver100 said:

jmonroe1 said:

driver100 said:

explorerx4 said:
@oldfarmer50,
Maybe the manufacturer paid for the whole job the first time, but the dealer only did part of it.
Just a guess, but I think they repaired the hood which had bubbles on it. Then the fenders erupted, and now it is out of warranty. The dealer is honorable, and decided to help a customer out....probably a slow day in the paint department too. They have the staff, paint doesn't cost much, do a little PR work and hopefully make a satisfied customer, who will tell 10 other people.
And you did it again. Paint ain't cheap and it costs plenty to apply it. When my Genny was backed into this past Winter, you could barely see the damage to the lower right quarter panel yet it cost well over 1300 bucks to repair the damage. When I asked both shops that provided the estimates, "why so much for so little damage" ? They both said, "the painting".

You gotta stop shooting from the hip.

jmonroe
And you believed them? The body shop probably has a good supply of paint, the paint tech guy has a few free moments, it costs the dealer very little but it is great PR.....actually relatively cheap advertising to keep a customer happy. These days retailers and most businesses have loss leaders to get you in the door. If they do it right they can also deduct it as an expense. Basically free labor, and how much can paint be to paint the top of a fender?

None of the individual points & over all take are simply NOT backed up by facts.

stickguy · April 2019

that CL video clip was interesting. and yet another reason I don't want to go near it. So hard to find the few remaining real people (like me) selling a legit, clean creampuff. Might be easier to just buy new or gently used CPO next time and keep it a long time. Or buy out my lease. Or something.

oldfarmer50 · May 2019

driver100 said:

abacomike said:

oldfarmer50 said:

abacomike said:
The Florida State Legislature (both Houses) just passed a new bill regarding “Texting While Operating A Motor Vehicle” (includes trucks, buses and motor homes)! The penalty is a PRIMARY OFFENSE with big dollar fines and points on your driver’s license. Governor DiSantos is expected to sign the bill into law this week.

Police are allowed to pull a driver over and ticket him/her if observed texting while operating the vehicle. This has been needed for a long time. So, I would advise anyone who is in Florida (residents or those on business or vacation) to heed this very carefully. Out of State license holders will have their home State DMV’s notified of the offense. Out of State drivers (licensed by another State) might have to appear in court from my understanding.

Warnings (written) will be given out until January 1st, 2020. After that, the law will be enforced with fines and points on your license. 1st offense is not too expensive but becomes more expensive with succeeding infractions.
NY has had similar laws for years. Doesn’t make a bit of difference. Tonight on the news they reported a fatal accident where a car crossed over and hit an oncoming driver head on. Guaranteed that someone was texting.

Hardly a day goes by that I don’t observe a driver texting while driving. I don’t receive many texts but at least Siri dictates texts to me through CAR-PLAY and I can send a response hands-free by dictating a return text. Most of the time, I tell Siri not to send a response.

If there are fairly heavy fines it could make a difference. Especially, because, I believe, if you are in an accident they can check your phone records to see if you were on the phone when the accident occurred....which will increase the penalty and cause insurance rate to go up.

I always thought that the police could check phone records to determine if someone were on the phone but I believe in the US at least they would need a search warrant. Unless it was a serious accident I doubt they would bother.

Maybe the legal experts here can educate us.

sb55 · May 2019

Is the new proposed Florida law only texting? What about holding the phone and talking? In most states that have cell phone laws, it's all cell phone in hand use, not just texting.

ab348 · May 2019

Nova Scotia passed a similar law to great fanfare a few years ago. After an initial flurry of handing out tickets, it now seems universally ignored both by drivers and the police. I see people using phones and texting while driving all the time.

driver100 · May 2019

jmonroe1 said:

driver100 said:

jmonroe1 said:

driver100 said:

explorerx4 said:
@oldfarmer50,
Maybe the manufacturer paid for the whole job the first time, but the dealer only did part of it.
Just a guess, but I think they repaired the hood which had bubbles on it. Then the fenders erupted, and now it is out of warranty. The dealer is honorable, and decided to help a customer out....probably a slow day in the paint department too. They have the staff, paint doesn't cost much, do a little PR work and hopefully make a satisfied customer, who will tell 10 other people.
And you did it again. Paint ain't cheap and it costs plenty to apply it. When my Genny was backed into this past Winter, you could barely see the damage to the lower right quarter panel yet it cost well over 1300 bucks to repair the damage. When I asked both shops that provided the estimates, "why so much for so little damage" ? They both said, "the painting".

You gotta stop shooting from the hip.

jmonroe
And you believed them? The body shop probably has a good supply of paint, the paint tech guy has a few free moments, it costs the dealer very little but it is great PR.....actually relatively cheap advertising to keep a customer happy. These days retailers and most businesses have loss leaders to get you in the door. If they do it right they can also deduct it as an expense. Basically free labor, and how much can paint be to paint the top of a fender?
Of course I believed them. The guy that hit me had Allstate insurance and they were the ones that paid for the repair. If that wasn't the going rate, do you really think they would have paid that price? Why are you trying to argue about this ? Your ploy of trying to have the last word is getting old and has worn itself out.

jmonroe

Yours was a real job that the garage was getting paid for....of course they are going to charge the going rate to do the repair, especially since the insurance company is paying for it.

The Mustang is in the dealers shop, the body repair guy has a few extra moments, a few ounces of paint isn't worth a huge amount, the dealer can write the repair off as an expense so costs a fraction of the real cost.....and it is good PR to satisfy a customer. If it needs to go under heat lamps those are already there and are paid for. It is cheap advertising for the dealer, and the beauty of it is the customer, in this case our good friend oldfarmer, is happy he got free bodywork that may have cost $1000 or something, but, it cost the dealer very little. That is how a lot of successful retailers work these days....finding a way to give perceived value.

There is a good possibility oldfarmers repair cost the garage nothing, might even have made a profit. They do it for free, write in the books they did a $1300 repair, record it as an advertising expense, get a tax deduction of $500. Just saying, there are lots of possibilities for doing the repair for free.

Think outside the box.

Now, you can reply with anything you want....you can have the last word.

imidazol97 · May 2019

driver100 said:

Just tell me what I am using as an example, and turning it into a general rule.
Often, past history does indicate what will happen in the future.

Solo anecdotes are turned into rules all the time by some of the fans of certain brands.
They last forever. Perfect. No trends of sludging, transmission failures, runaway
acceleration, AC compressors blowing up, etc.. And those cars last forever and never need
repairs, just "routine service."

However, the same fans turn anecdotes about the brands they don't
want, typically historically US brands, into tales of fact.
And when someone criticizes, the person with the criticism is the victim of criticism.

So just sit back and and enjoy the ride. It's all PR/

driver100 · May 2019

oldfarmer50 said:
Is this really happening? Is the tech to do this readily available? Opinions?

https://youtu.be/dkHFf4_oAKs

Worthwhile watching.....thanks for posting OF. Confirms my thoughts about CL and the newspaper these days.
I believe they have those devices, and I wouldn't buy a car from CL. There are too many things that can go wrong, and too many scammers trying to make a quick buck. Pay a bit more, and buy from a dealer who has a good reputation and a warranty. The only other way to buy is from someone you know, directly or indirectly.

driver100 · May 2019

sb55 said:
Is the new proposed Florida law only texting? What about holding the phone and talking? In most states that have cell phone laws, it's all cell phone in hand use, not just texting.

Mike will probably answer, but, when they were trying to get this law passed, it did include cell phones. I would say about 25% of the drivers in Florida have a cell phone up to their ear.....scary when I am stopped at a stop sign I see them making left turns in front of me with one hand holding the phone up to their ear.

dino001 · May 2019

driver100 said:

Mike will probably answer, but, when they were trying to get this law passed, it did include cell phones. I would say about 25% of the drivers in Florida have a cell phone up to their ear.....scary when I am stopped at a stop sign I see them making left turns in front of me with one hand holding the phone up to their ear.

You should feel lucky they didn't hold a bagel in their other hand and steered the by their thighs.

driver100 · May 2019

imidazol97 said:

driver100 said:

Just tell me what I am using as an example, and turning it into a general rule.
Often, past history does indicate what will happen in the future.
Solo anecdotes are turning into rules all the time by some of the fans of certain brands.
They last forever. Perfect. No trends of sludging, transmission failures, runaway
acceleration, AC compressors blowing up, etc.. And those cars last forever and never need
repairs, just "routine service."

However, the same fans turn anecdotes about the brands they don't
want, typically historically US brands, into tales of fact.
And when someone criticizes, the person with the criticism is the victim of criticism.

So just sit back and and enjoy the ride. It's all PR/

I thought that was what it was about but wasn't sure.
Great post.....beautifully said.

driver100 · May 2019

dino001 said:

driver100 said:

Mike will probably answer, but, when they were trying to get this law passed, it did include cell phones. I would say about 25% of the drivers in Florida have a cell phone up to their ear.....scary when I am stopped at a stop sign I see them making left turns in front of me with one hand holding the phone up to their ear.
You should feel lucky they didn't hold a bagel in their other hand and steered the by their thighs.

I wouldn't be surprised if some of them do that. I was in slow moving traffic and was noticing the young lady in the car behind me. She had her phone up to her ear and was concentrating way more on the conversation than on my car which was in front of her. I moved very carefully because there were periods of time when she wasn't aware of anything going on around her....all her attention was on that phone.

snakeweasel · May 2019

oldfarmer50 said:

abacomike said:
The Florida State Legislature (both Houses) just passed a new bill regarding “Texting While Operating A Motor Vehicle” (includes trucks, buses and motor homes)! The penalty is a PRIMARY OFFENSE with big dollar fines and points on your driver’s license. Governor DiSantos is expected to sign the bill into law this week.

Police are allowed to pull a driver over and ticket him/her if observed texting while operating the vehicle. This has been needed for a long time. So, I would advise anyone who is in Florida (residents or those on business or vacation) to heed this very carefully. Out of State license holders will have their home State DMV’s notified of the offense. Out of State drivers (licensed by another State) might have to appear in court from my understanding.

Warnings (written) will be given out until January 1st, 2020. After that, the law will be enforced with fines and points on your license. 1st offense is not too expensive but becomes more expensive with succeeding infractions.
NY has had similar laws for years. Doesn’t make a bit of difference. Tonight on the news they reported a fatal accident where a car crossed over and hit an oncoming driver head on. Guaranteed that someone was texting.

There are many causes of distraction while driving. I read somewhere, I'll see if I can find it, that texting and cell phone use only count for a small percentage of distracted driving. Other things can cause distractions include fiddling with controls for climate control or radios (think about all those big infotainment displays), talking to passengers, unruly kids, something loose in the car, an accident along the side of the road, rubbernecking that dream car, a scantily dressed person along the side of the road, day dreaming, jamming to the music and a host of other things.

In the last ten years I have been in two accidents (very low speed ones) where I was hit by a distracted driver, they even admitted it. Neither were distracted by texting, one by their kids and one was rubbernecking an accident.

My point is that distracted driving does not always equal texting and we really have to address all aspects.

snakeweasel · May 2019

jmonroe1 said:

That doesn't bother me, I prefer Pepsi.

jmonroe

Hey nobody's perfect.

jmonroe1 · May 2019

driver100 said:

jmonroe1 said:

driver100 said:

jmonroe1 said:

driver100 said:

explorerx4 said:
@oldfarmer50,
Maybe the manufacturer paid for the whole job the first time, but the dealer only did part of it.
Just a guess, but I think they repaired the hood which had bubbles on it. Then the fenders erupted, and now it is out of warranty. The dealer is honorable, and decided to help a customer out....probably a slow day in the paint department too. They have the staff, paint doesn't cost much, do a little PR work and hopefully make a satisfied customer, who will tell 10 other people.
And you did it again. Paint ain't cheap and it costs plenty to apply it. When my Genny was backed into this past Winter, you could barely see the damage to the lower right quarter panel yet it cost well over 1300 bucks to repair the damage. When I asked both shops that provided the estimates, "why so much for so little damage" ? They both said, "the painting".

You gotta stop shooting from the hip.

jmonroe
And you believed them? The body shop probably has a good supply of paint, the paint tech guy has a few free moments, it costs the dealer very little but it is great PR.....actually relatively cheap advertising to keep a customer happy. These days retailers and most businesses have loss leaders to get you in the door. If they do it right they can also deduct it as an expense. Basically free labor, and how much can paint be to paint the top of a fender?
Of course I believed them. The guy that hit me had Allstate insurance and they were the ones that paid for the repair. If that wasn't the going rate, do you really think they would have paid that price? Why are you trying to argue about this ? Your ploy of trying to have the last word is getting old and has worn itself out.

jmonroe
Yours was a real job that the garage was getting paid for....of course they are going to charge the going rate to do the repair, especially since the insurance company is paying for it.

The Mustang is in the dealers shop, the body repair guy has a few extra moments, a few ounces of paint isn't worth a huge amount, the dealer can write the repair off as an expense so costs a fraction of the real cost.....and it is good PR to satisfy a customer. If it needs to go under heat lamps those are already there and are paid for. It is cheap advertising for the dealer, and the beauty of it is the customer, in this case our good friend oldfarmer, is happy he got free bodywork that may have cost $1000 or something, but, it cost the dealer very little. That is how a lot of successful retailers work these days....finding a way to give perceived value.

There is a good possibility oldfarmers repair cost the garage nothing, might even have made a profit. They do it for free, write in the books they did a $1300 repair, record it as an advertising expense, get a tax deduction of $500. Just saying, there are lots of possibilities for doing the repair for free.

Think outside the box.

Now, you can reply with anything you want....you can have the last word.

I don't want the last word. I just wanted to clarify that paint work is not cheap.

In @oldfarmer50's case the dealer probably screwed up when Ford paid to have it repaired but it was good to hear that his dealer stepped up and did the right thing by painting his hood again. Not all dealers would do that. Unfortunately I have first hand knowledge about one that wouldn't.

jmonroe

snakeweasel · May 2019

driver100 said:

abacomike said:

oldfarmer50 said:

abacomike said:
The Florida State Legislature (both Houses) just passed a new bill regarding “Texting While Operating A Motor Vehicle” (includes trucks, buses and motor homes)! The penalty is a PRIMARY OFFENSE with big dollar fines and points on your driver’s license. Governor DiSantos is expected to sign the bill into law this week.

Police are allowed to pull a driver over and ticket him/her if observed texting while operating the vehicle. This has been needed for a long time. So, I would advise anyone who is in Florida (residents or those on business or vacation) to heed this very carefully. Out of State license holders will have their home State DMV’s notified of the offense. Out of State drivers (licensed by another State) might have to appear in court from my understanding.

Warnings (written) will be given out until January 1st, 2020. After that, the law will be enforced with fines and points on your license. 1st offense is not too expensive but becomes more expensive with succeeding infractions.
NY has had similar laws for years. Doesn’t make a bit of difference. Tonight on the news they reported a fatal accident where a car crossed over and hit an oncoming driver head on. Guaranteed that someone was texting.

Hardly a day goes by that I don’t observe a driver texting while driving. I don’t receive many texts but at least Siri dictates texts to me through CAR-PLAY and I can send a response hands-free by dictating a return text. Most of the time, I tell Siri not to send a response.

If there are fairly heavy fines it could make a difference. Especially, because, I believe, if you are in an accident they can check your phone records to see if you were on the phone when the accident occurred....which will increase the penalty and cause insurance rate to go up.

Yes you can check phone records but it could be meaningless. Let's say my text alert goes off as I am driving home, now my phone is set up so that it only alerts me of a text if the texter is in my contact list so I know it's not a random text. So I pull into the closest parking lot so I can safely read the text and respond. Then I pull out onto the road and almost immediately get into an accident. Since the phone records show the exact time of the text and we can only give an approximate time of the accident can they claim I was texting at the time and if so how do I defend myself?

snakeweasel · May 2019

driver100 said:

jmonroe1 said:

driver100 said:

jmonroe1 said:

henryn said:
I would be more likely to buy a used Genesis than a used BMW or Mercedes. No way I would buy any car like that new, just too rich for my blood.
For a minute there I thought you were going to say you wouldn't want to own a German car that's out of warranty and that would have caused sparks to fly.
jmonroe
I thought we shot that myth down with roadburners X3 that has 200000 miles on it.

There you go again citing the exception. I'm sure there are heart specialists and brain surgeons who smoke but I'm pretty sure they are the exceptions.

jmonroe
I have proof of an X3 with high mileage.........give me an example of a BMW with high maintenance.
A friend in Florida has a 1986 BMW with over 200000 miles on it........how many 1986 Gennies are on the road?????

Someone in my neighborhood has a Yugo, I see it being driven every now and again. Those Yugos must have been great well built cars.

abacomike · May 2019

sb55 said:

Is the new proposed Florida law only texting? What about holding the phone and talking? In most states that have cell phone laws, it's all cell phone in hand use, not just texting.

My understanding is that it is texting only.

abacomike · May 2019

snakeweasel said:

The Florida State Legislature (both Houses) just passed a new bill regarding “Texting While Operating A Motor Vehicle” (includes trucks, buses and motor homes)! The penalty is a PRIMARY OFFENSE with big dollar fines and points on your driver’s license. Governor DiSantos is expected to sign the bill into law this week.

Police are allowed to pull a driver over and ticket him/her if observed texting while operating the vehicle. This has been needed for a long time. So, I would advise anyone who is in Florida (residents or those on business or vacation) to heed this very carefully. Out of State license holders will have their home State DMV’s notified of the offense. Out of State drivers (licensed by another State) might have to appear in court from my understanding.

Warnings (written) will be given out until January 1st, 2020. After that, the law will be enforced with fines and points on your license. 1st offense is not too expensive but becomes more expensive with succeeding infractions.
NY has had similar laws for years. Doesn’t make a bit of difference. Tonight on the news they reported a fatal accident where a car crossed over and hit an oncoming driver head on. Guaranteed that someone was texting.
There are many causes of distraction while driving. I read somewhere, I'll see if I can find it, that texting and cell phone use only count for a small percentage of distracted driving. Other things can cause distractions include fiddling with controls for climate control or radios (think about all those big infotainment displays), talking to passengers, unruly kids, something loose in the car, an accident along the side of the road, rubbernecking that dream car, a scantily dressed person along the side of the road, day dreaming, jamming to the music and a host of other things. In the last ten years I have been in two accidents (very low speed ones) where I was hit by a distracted driver, they even admitted it. Neither were distracted by texting, one by their kids and one was rubbernecking an accident. My point is that distracted driving does not always equal texting and we really have to address all aspects.

Your elaboration regarding what could constitute distracted driving is eloquent. In my experience, the texting distraction seem to occur on the Turnpike or Interstates as I have observed texting frequently:

As an example, I see a driver holding the steering wheel with one hand and see the phone in the other hand with his/her thumb tapping away on the keyboard. Since most vehicles now come standard with bluetooth, there is no need to hold phone to make or receive calls.

ab348 · May 2019

I don't use my cell all that much so it is unusual for it to go off when I am driving. But when it does, even with bluetooth, it is incredibly distracting. First it is alarming when the music level drops and I hear the ring tone. Then I have to find the button on the steering wheel to answer the call, which wouldn't be so tough if I used it more but which for now I always have to take my eyes off the road to find. Then I'm into the call and thinking about the conversation which is also distracting, and at the end I have to find the disconnect button. I really think anything you do while behind the wheel is distracting to some extent. Agree though that texting is about the worst thing you could do since it requires eyes to be taken off the road for long stretches.

stickguy · May 2019

I see texting more at stoplights. No danger in that, but real annoying since they never notice the light changing.

oldfarmer50 · May 2019

stickguy said:
that CL video clip was interesting. and yet another reason I don't want to go near it. So hard to find the few remaining real people (like me) selling a legit, clean creampuff. Might be easier to just buy new or gently used CPO next time and keep it a long time. Or buy out my lease. Or something.

You know, that’s the kind of stuff that you always had to watch out for, it’s just amazing that the technology to do it is reachable by the average scammer. The stories on line are endless of how dishonest flippers doctor cars. Everything from the simplest, such as using a $20 scan tool to clear codes, to more sinister like cutting the wire to the CEL light.

I think the first thing to do in a private sale would be to check the person’s license against the title. If they match that clears 50% of the chance of getting scammed. If you meet at the sellers home address which matches the other documents you can be pretty sure that it’s a legit sale.

Then you only have to evaluate the actual condition of the car...which is a whole other story.

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