I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today!

uplanderguy · November 10

Cavalier wagon sold for $30k.

While I like the car, I’ll withhold editorial comment on the sale price.

imidazol97 · November 10

It's nice to see a Cavalier wagon restored or still in good shape. Almost all of the rare sightings at car cruises here are in terrible shape, but it's nice to see the few examples card for by someone, patina and all.

xwesx · November 10

uplanderguy said:
Cavalier wagon sold for $30k.

While I like the car, I’ll withhold editorial comment on the sale price.

Wow! Not me.....

I think the real problem with this one is that you cannot use it. If you use it, the value tanks quickly. So, you have a 1985 Cavalier wagon museum piece? I don't know about that! I guess that in another sixty years, it will be a real gem.

texases · November 10

Plennnnnnty of other cars I'd buy for $30k!

stickguy · November 10

poking around on BaT the other day and there were a few right away with ultra low miles. Weird. The 1979 Continental, and a 90s Mustang Cobra R. The Lincoln is like the Cavalier, in who wants to pay a premium for a museum piece. The Cobra, just sad it never got used as intended (and that one I think pushed 200K)

fintail · November 10

Wild price on that Cav, but if there's a sentimental thing or one is a J car freak, I can imagine it - has to be the best one remaining. For 30K I could have a small collection of malaise material.

uplanderguy · November 12

I have to laugh. I know what 'malaise' means, generally, in old cars, but for me, 'malaise' is '90's til now. I just stopped caring, for the most part, after the late '80's, when there were still some cars out there that were late '70's leftovers that I liked.

A friend just sent me a link to a Continental Mark V with virtually no miles, that sold on BaT for $140K.

He just drove to MA, btw, to buy a '62 Corvair.

roadburner · November 12

I loved American muscle cars and some coupes like the 1973 Grand Am. From then until the early to mid ‘80s there wasn’t much that caught my eye.
I had not been driving my 1995 318ti all that much due to work and some deferred maintenance (30 year old cooling system, anyone?) but after getting the maintenance squared away and taking it on a week long tour with the BMW Classic Car Club I think that I love it more than ever. It has everything I need and nothing I don’t.
Except for heated seats.

fintail · November 12

uplanderguy said:
I have to laugh. I know what 'malaise' means, generally, in old cars, but for me, 'malaise' is '90's til now. I just stopped caring, for the most part, after the late '80's, when there were still some cars out there that were late '70's leftovers that I liked.

A friend just sent me a link to a Continental Mark V with virtually no miles, that sold on BaT for $140K.

He just drove to MA, btw, to buy a '62 Corvair.

When I say malaise, I almost mean it in a kind of fond sentimental manner - malaise cars are the cars of my childhood. Some of them may not be objectively good, but plenty are interesting and they have character lacking in most mass market material today. Cars in my memory - Tempos, bustleback Sevilles, woody K-cars, clattery MB diesels, edgy Japanese cars, there's a lot to look at, and the era has become popular with the next generation of enthusiasts. My cut off point for vintage interest seems to be the early 00s.

tjc78 · November 12

We are very close in age and I share the same sentiments as you on the 80s cars.

andre1969 · November 13

I always thought of "Malaise" as the period from 1973-1982. A lot of people think it started earlier, like '71 or '72, and I think that rationale is because high performance engines seemed to hit their peak in 1970, and things started to drop off from there. But I still think the '71-72 cars were still pretty good. A lot of that horsepower loss when they went from gross to net was either a paper loss, or the previous engines had been over-rated, or a bit of both. Although in some cases, they did cut compression, so there was a real loss in power/performance here and there.

But for most mainstream cars, I don't think there was any difference. A Mopar with a 318 most likely performed the same whether it was a '71 rated at 230 hp, or a '72 rated at 150. I think the Chevy 350-2bbl went from 255 gross to 165 net. But I'm sure my grandparents' '72 Impala performed the same as a '71 with the same engine. And if it was slower than a '70, that was most likely the result of the '71 being heavier.

But in '73, emissions controls started strangling everything, from the most mundane to the highest peformance. And the bumper regulations added weight and in most cases, did nothing for the cars' looks. And while there were bright spots here and there, it seemed like the industry as a whole just kept going downhill through 1982. But then in '83, it seemed like things started to improve. The cars may still have been crap by today's standards, but the electronics started getting better, fuel systems started improving, and there was some return to improved performance.

But, everyone has their own definition of "Malaise." And some cars, like the early Taurus/Sable, early LH cars, and so on, were probably so bad that they rivaled the worst of the '73-82 era when it came to reliability. But, they were improved in terms of performance, fuel economy, handling, etc.

texases · November 13

Part of the negative on '72 cars was the switch to SAE net hp ratings, all cars lost reported hp, many with no change in design or actual hp. I consider '73 the beginning of malaise, because of the bumpers and the rapid decline in performance. You had to search more, but I think there were a few '72 models with good performance.

kyfdx · November 13

I think the Lincoln 460 was 3XX HP in 1971, and the new 1972 was only around 220 HP

texases · November 13

kyfdx said:
I think the Lincoln 460 was 3XX HP in 1971, and the new 1972 was only around 220 HP

Yes, and that drop included actual performance losses, per wiki:

From 1968 to 1971, the 460 was rated at 365 gross hp. In 1972 SAE net horsepower, which accounted for real world power losses created by engine accessories and the exhaust system, was adopted as a standard in North America, resulting in a significant decrease in horsepower ratings of all engines. In addition, a reduction in the 460 compression ratio (to 8.5:1) and modification of camshaft timing to allow the engine to comply with Federally mandated exhaust emissions standards, caused the rated output to plunge to 212 hp (158 kW); output continued to change nearly annually thereafter to improve fuel economy and emissions performance in line with increasingly stringent Federal requirements, dropping as low as 197 hp (147 kW) in 1977.

fintail · November 13

I've seen the 1973-82 period for "malaise" too, and I agree that the term can vary by who is using it. I see malaise being alive at least through the 80s, as there were peak malaise era (1979-82 perhaps) designs on the market until the end of the decade, and some early 90s cars can have the vibe as well. For new entrants, malaise stereotypes (low power output, drivability quirks) were usually fading by the end of the decade. I see the very angular cars of the late 70s-early 80s as being the malaise aesthetic.

I kind of look at it that way, malaise is a vibe, and it can carry on to other items from the era - household goods, (especially residential) architecture, clothing, etc, again in a somewhat fond sentimental way, as it is memories of being a kid for me.

fintail · November 13

Unusual spot, Jag X-Type wagon.

I spotted an (insert obscure car name here) classic car today!

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