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VW GTI (All styles)



  • evergreenevergreen Posts: 213
    Has the 4dr model hit the show rooms yet?
  • zanookzanook Posts: 3
    i have a 2002 gti, just got back from the gas station after realizing that the fuel flap fails to respond to the switch, effectively preventing me from refueling and driving to the dealer who last touched my car last week.

    does anyone know how to open the fuel flap manually? there's nothing i can find in the manual about this, nor in the haynes manual for the car.

    any help is appreciated!
  • waiwai Posts: 327
    You can try to use a small screw driver to slip through the tiny gap and see if it will clip it open or not?
  • vw79type2vw79type2 Posts: 37
    I try to get my information first hand rather than relying on secondary sources, especially those like J.D. Power. Out of all the people I know on a personal level, VW is the clear favorite. If you want to buy into all the marketing hype the Japanese and Korean car manufacturers have been able to stir up thats fine, most people do.

    A few months ago I heard about a study where it was shown that Japanese car buyers have a false sense of security in regards to the reliability of their cars. The subjects were found to claim their vehicles were reliable despite the fact they had to take their vehicles in for repairs on a more frequent basis compared to other makes.

    Hyundai has made leaps and bounds in terms of quality, but their products just aren't to the point where I would take a chance buying them yet. Give them time to put out their next generation of automobiles and you might find one in my driveway (That's if they could get beyond looking ugly as sin, but that's subjective on my part).

    Subaru, on the other hand, seems to be going in the opposite direction. People I know had less trouble with their Subaru's in the '90's than the more recent models.

    Now maybe this is all geography and I happen to live in an area where things aren't the norm in terms of vehicle reliability. That's a possibility given many of the dealerships in the area have older sales staff from the wheeler-dealer era and are more concerned with making a quick buck so they can retire sooner rather than building a reputation of selling quality cars to their customers.
  • guy1974guy1974 Posts: 119
    Just wondered how reliability has been since you bought your GTi as I am thinking of getting one later this year.
  • zanookzanook Posts: 3
    i actually own 2 GTI's : both 2002. i drive the 5-speed and my wife has the auto tiptronic. both cars have had their share of issues: the auto had problems with cold mornings starts, but mine has been really good mechanically speaking.
    its only been within the last 6 months have i encountered any problems with my GTI as a result of electrical issues. as of right now the heated seats, the autodefrosted side mirrors and the actuator to the fuel door filler are the only components that have failed aside from having to replace a fuse here and there. we've been driving our GTI's for over 4 years now and they're still great fun to drive and are without MAJOR problems.
  • moparbadmoparbad Posts: 3,868
    I don't know where you get your reliability information from. But, VW has been in the pits for years. I have owned VW's and believe me, its true. Hyundai has improved 1000 percent and is rated much better than VW. Subaru is also rated good.

    I don't know where you get your reliability information, since you never post any actual data and your statements are generalizations.

    1000% :surprise: :sick: :confuse:
  • riposteriposte Posts: 160
    Here are some interesting links:

    Jetta Reliability

    Golf reliability

    Hyundai reliability (also shows VW way near the bottom)
  • mbrashiermbrashier Posts: 3
    Saw one at my delaership today.
    I wanted a GTI (2 door). My wife wanted a 4 door Rabbit.

    Now we can have both. Stoked! Waiting for one with leather and sunroof.
    Hopefully I can talka good deal on it.

    Why doesn't VW have the 4 door GTI on Also no test drives on any car site I have been to. WTF?
  • I am very into tuning, and was just curious how much power the DSG has been known to safely handle at this point. 300hp, 300lb ft of torque or what? I know its hard to say for sure, but best guesses. Thanks.
  • 600kgolfgt600kgolfgt Posts: 690
    I noticed the first two links were from edmunds showing the JD Power quality circles, while the Hyundai link was from a Hyundai dealer site. Nice try. Now how about showing Hyundai's JD Power quality circles as well so we have a more balanced comparison....
  • riposteriposte Posts: 160
    The Hyundai link cites a JD Power survey, so it's the same ultimate source.

    Nice try.

    If you're going to assassinate character, you're going to have to try MUCH harder.

    Class dismissed.
  • kurtamaxxxguykurtamaxxxguy Posts: 1,798
    ..for vw and audi fan sites that discuss all kinds of ways to rechip and otherwise boost power. The VW GTI with DSG is very similar to the Audi A3 with DSG so info applying to the Audi will also apply to the VW.

    Keep in mind that chipping your car will void the warranty, and that DSG problems with the STOCK engines have been reported/discussed on various forums, including Edmunds.
  • 600kgolfgt600kgolfgt Posts: 690
    >If you're going to assassinate character, you're going to >have to try MUCH harder.

    >Class dismissed.

    If you're gonna be so defensive in thinking that my response was a character assassination attempt - then it's back to summer school for you.... :shades:
  • riposteriposte Posts: 160
    I note that you didn't refute the facts of the discussion, that the sources cited were all from JD Power.
  • 600kgolfgt600kgolfgt Posts: 690
    > I note that you didn't refute the facts of the discussion, that the sources cited were all from JD Power.

    It's one thing when you have JD Power stats given from a "neutral" source (Edmunds), vs. a partisan source (Hyundai dealership).

    Besides, I know from personal experience that with proper maintenance, VW powertrains will hold up much longer than Hyundais. Case in point, back in 1992, I was driving a 1987 VW Golf (that I purchased brand new) with 200,000 miles at the time. My co-worker purchased a 1992 Hyundai Excel brand new. Five years later, my Golf at 275,000 miles was still going strong while the Hyundai's drivetrain virtually disintegrated at 55,000 miles.

    Now don't get me wrong, Hyundai has made leaps and bounds in quality since then, while VW's gremlins became more apparent, but based on my experience (good and bad) with VW's, I will still buy them over a Hyundai because they tend to be more durable over the long haul.

    Today, I own a 1997 Jetta (185,000 miles) that doesn't burn a drop of oil and a 2003 Wolfsburg Jetta (75,000 miles) that has been relatively trouble free. I keep up the maintenance on these cars on a regular basis (I have the factory OBD II diagnostic computer/software), and I am more than confident that they will last (I normally keep my cars an average of 10 years) - despite the rampant unreliability reports.

    Enjoy your Hyundai...
  • riposteriposte Posts: 160
    "It's one thing when you have JD Power stats given from a "neutral" source (Edmunds), vs. a partisan source (Hyundai dealership)."

    You're kidding, right? They both cite the same information source. Are you inferring the Hyundai dealer somehow altered the results of the JD Powers polls?? What ARE you inferring, exactly, because your "logic" so far has been wildly irrational.

    Glad you had such good luck on your 1997 Jetta. Sadly you are in the distinct minority.

    I am hopeful that VW has cleaned up their act. It'll take a few years to see how these new ones age.
  • Pretty much all car awards have little to nothing in common with predicting reliability.

    If you buy a car based on an award you are a doofus.
    If you brag that your car has won 'such and such' an award, you are a TOTAL doofus.

    Read this cnn article:

    Do your own research, talk to a mechanic, and make a budget. Buy the car because you like it and you can afford it. Service the car and don't whine when something breaks, because it is something that machines do. Stop talking about these worthless lame awards.
  • riposteriposte Posts: 160
    I'd like to see you substantiate your wildly broad claim that "Pretty much all car awards have little to nothing to do with predicting reliability".

    The JD Power awards are an indication - nothing more, of what may lie ahead. I doubt that a car that starts off with reliability/quality issues IMPROVES over time.

    I've never bought a car because it won a Car & Driver or whatever award.

    You're really going off the deep end about "dont whine when something breaks, because it it something that machines do". OMG you're a total RIOT!

    You want to know what breaks? POORLY DESIGNED / BUILT machines! Well-built and designed ones DO NOT, because that's what "Quality" is! Duh.

    Part of doing one's research is to check for quality ratings, and JD Power is *one* of many. Consumer Reports is another. It's also interesting to check the enthusiast discussion boards, such as here @ Edmunds, or, in the case of VW,, which documents many of the VW reliablity issues (also the good sides of the product, naturally).

    BTW - you've never answered me about why posting a link to Hyundai dealer which references a JD Power award is a problem. Are you claiming that the dealer altered the findings, or what? Oh, I know - you tried to change the topic, and say "don't pay attention to awards".

    I believe I hear your Mommy calling....


  • poita33poita33 Posts: 11
    Thx for the article on awards jitteryjoe. I didn't know much about the often quoted J.D. Power awards, but after reading the article I can now put the awards in context. I think everyone should read that article since so many seem to place too much emphasis on them.
    Perhaps the safety awards may be of more value; I think the Rabbit and GTI should do very well, which is what I am more concerned about.
  • guy1974guy1974 Posts: 119
    All machines however well built will break eventually - especially something as complex as a car with thousands of parts. Reliability surveys can give you some statistical idea of how reliable a type of car is but considering that for popular cars millions are made there will always be unreliable examples.

    Also I would trust data from an independent source in preference to a manufacturer because most surveys or data can be represented in several ways - you have heard the saying "lies, damn lies and statistics". Always make sure you are comparing like for like - not merely JDF Power as their surveys have lots of facets.

    Also why do you continue with this "class dismiss" stuff? Sounds like you don't like differing views. Discussion is good.
  • riposteriposte Posts: 160
    I find it highly unlikely that any business which has any desire to stay out of court and avoid horrible publicity would modify a document like that. At any rate, I've invited the other poster to find an alternate source, and they've refused. Oh well; I guess it was "OK" after all! :-)

    Regarding whether machines break or not, that's not the question - the point is that the other poster basically was asking us ("me" specifically) to disregard "Quality" as a reason to purchase a car. This is a ridiculous contention. Your point about "there will always be unreliable examples" is, of course, true, and just the opposite is true, too: a model with a documented history of poor reliablity will have samples which did not have any problems. That's why statistical valid surveys are important. As I've said, JD Power is ONE measure; there are others. Having said that, personally, I would dismiss a vechicle which had a reputation for many problems immediately after purchase, under the assumption that if things are that bad right out of the factory, they're unlikely to get much better.

    You ask "why do you continue with this "class dismiss" [sic] stuff? Sounds like you don't like differing views. Discussion is good."

    Indeed. "Discussion" IS good! A two-way exchange of reasoned and rational ideas IS good. The other poster has not exhibited any of those traits. In the face of that, the exchange between the two of us is one where the other poster has made ridculous statements. I've corrected them, and challenged him/her to prove that I was wrong. The other poster's only response was to attempt to change the subject. Given the above, the other posted is being treated exactly as he deserves.

    Respect is earned. It is not a right.
  • cited consumer reports as a source of quality ratings. Do you know how that survey works? As far as statistical surveys go it has a very low response rate (between 6 and 12 percent). Of the approximate 480,000 responses how many do you think were about the GTI? The fewer data points the more meaningless the study. CR reports does not show to consumers how many cars were involved in the study, the type of problems incurred, the exact number of problems encountered, or what the difference is between a good rating and a poor rating.

    This article talks more about how CR works:

    With the sample size it is fruitless to compare the GTI against a more popular car like a civic or matrix.

    Yeah, I never said anything about the Hyundai dealer comment because I didn't post it. Talk to 600kgolfgt.

    To reiterate on the JD Power. It's a quality survey for the first 90 days. If I buy the car for the long haul (say ten years) that's 2.5% of the car's operational lifetime. I don't think that's a good representation of how the car is going to perform overall. Think of people that build a new house. How many home owners experience problems in the first three months of ownership? That doesn't mean the house is going to fall apart. A car is a machine, and a complex machine at that. Some machines are better designed than others, some machines last longer than others. I'll tell you how I did with my VW in 10 years. However, if you think the first 90 days are so important I can tell you that right now:

    133 days of ownership:
    0 minor problems
    0 major problems
    best mileage on a tank of gas: 33 mpg (all hwy)
    worst mileage on a tank of gas: 21 mpg (all city)
  • riposteriposte Posts: 160
    Interesting post to allpar.

    I dismissed it after the first sentence, because it's the crux of their entire argument, and it's flat-out WRONG! "Response rate" is NOT the key to validity: obtaining a statisticaly valid number of replies IS the key. They are two very different animals.

    CU routinely declines to publish ratings for vehicles for which they do not have valid statistical samples.

    I understand your comparisons of a house to a car, but I don't believe that's a great analogy; houses are mostly custom built. Just about every piece of wood is cut by hand. Every piece of dryway is put up by hand. And so on, and so on.

    A car, on the other hand, is assembled using mass-produced parts; every part of particular type is identical to every other. If one fails early in the life of the car, it's very likely that the replacement will, too. The variable is that the people actually screwing the car together may have done a bad job at the factory, and the dealership could replace the part (or re-install the existing part) correctly.

    I would be hesitant to buy a car with a great deal of problems early in the ownership experience because it might be an indicator that there's a problem with the parts (design or construction), OR that there's an assembly problem at the factory. Either way, if I come across a car with that problem, it sends up a red flag; to me, at least.

    Specifically regarding the "90 day are so important" comment, I think I've said a number of times that that is one of several measurements which I believe should be considered.

    I hope that you're able to report back in ten years with excellent news for your VW! There can't be too many great cars out there to chose from, and there's a lot of really good things that can be said about the new GTI!
  • voochvooch Posts: 92
    Going back to the 90 day thing yet again. My previous car before the GTI was a Toyota Celica. My chances should be pretty good with a Toyota. Well in the first month of ownership I had plenty of "problems". Upon delivery there was: a cigarette burn on the parking brake handle, a broken piston on the hatchback, a broken seat cushion, and a scratch on the drivers door. After driving it for a while I found that there was an excessive amount of wind noise coming from the drivers door. I wouldn't consider these things as part of a trouble free ownership experience, yet none of them kept me from getting from A to B. The dealership took care of each one of the problems. After they were all fixed, the car was near flawless for the next 5 years. I think I had to have the hatchback piston replaced again under warranty. The mpg was incredible too. I certainly miss it. Out of all the cars I've owned, I consider that Celica to be the most reliable, yet I had the worst experience with it in the first month of ownership of all my cars. This experience alone leads me to pretty much discount initial ownership surveys when determining "reliability". I actually would put more weight on the dealership that will be servicing the car. The Toyota dealership I bought the car from had a top notch service dept.

    On the other hand, my new 2006 GTI has performed flawlessly for it's first 5 months or so of life. Who knows if it will do as well as the Celica. I don't care since I did not buy it as a purely functional thing to get from point A to point B. I knew of VW's perceived reliability problems when I bought the GTI. My purchase was almost purely an emotional decision. I'd guess most GTI owners would be the same way. If I were in the market for an Accord or Camry or Civic LX or Impala or Malibu or Altima or Sentra or all the other emotionless cars, reliability would probably be much higher on my requirements list, along with the requirement of having a boring car. If reliability was one of my top priorities, I'd probably sheep out and buy an Accord or Camry like the rest of the lifeless population. I'm not saying it is smart or logical to have a disregard for reliability, it just wasn't a priority when buying this particular type of car. It certainly would be a nice bonus to have it continue to perform flawlessly for the duration though. Unless it leaves me stranded on a regular basis, I will continue to be happy with it. I plan on getting rid of it when the warranty expires though. Maybe trade it in on a Scirocco!
  • 600kgolfgt600kgolfgt Posts: 690
    Read the section about Hyundai. If upper management arrogance starts to seep in, there could be rough days ahead. Just ask VW...
  • 600kgolfgt600kgolfgt Posts: 690
    > Glad you had such good luck on your 1997 Jetta. Sadly you are in the distinct minority.

    You have read way too many news clippings. Now back to reality:

    If that were the case, then that would mean more than 50% of Jettas have problems. Even the worst manufacturer doesn't have problems with 50% of their cars (more like 10-15%). So your argument flies in the face of logic. Especially due to the fact that I see lots of 1993-1998 Jettas still on the road.

    The same can't be said for the older Hyundais, however...
  • riposteriposte Posts: 160
    Lots of allegations there; I'm not a auto industry insider, so I don't know what's true, and what's not.

    All I know is that Hyundai's are better now than they've ever been. That's not to say that they're especially satisfying to drive, but it's always good to have good cars from which to choose.

    Check out these articles on VW:
    Mechanic’s Tale: VW Need More Healing

    Mechanic’s Tale: VW, Heal Thyself
  • riposteriposte Posts: 160
    J.D. Power and Associates Reports:
    The Vehicle Dependability Gap between Luxury and Higher-Volume Brands Narrows Significantly

    Guess what manufacturer is sixth from the bottom?
  • Sounds like you should buy a ... Mercury??
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