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Subaru Legacy/Outback

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Comments

  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    I'll bet, knowing how sleazy dealers are, they they have a ton of small print on the documents that you sign when picking up the car that absolves them of telling you about "aftermarket" parts and the warranty.

    I'd definitely take aim at the dealer on this though. Heck subaru doesn't even warranty SPT parts nor STi parts, etc. And these are official parts sold by subie dealers from SOA!

    -mike
  • lakepoplakepop Member Posts: 221
    Using your info/my zip.....NADA says $17,150....KBB says $18,175. I'd say the dealer is some high...but ASKING price does NOT equal SELLING price. Be a good consumer and make him an offer to start the negotiating.
      OK...my .02 : )
  • ssnyder4ssnyder4 Member Posts: 14
    Hi all. Does anyone have any updated information about the EPA's progress approving an ECU MOD for the Legacy / Outbacks regarding hesitation / stalling? I am having this problem with my '02 Outback (8K miles) and just took it in to the shop for them address this issue. No source of the problem found---yet the problem still exists.

    Thanks!
    Shane.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Bob: I think the strike plate can be moved slightly. Someone mentioned having this done on their Forester by a dealer. Worth a look.

    Dan: Outback sedans are not popular so they're also a bit tough to re-sell. I'd negotiate down and try to beat the book value on it.

    Shane: IMO it's time to escalate it to 800-SUBARU3, open up a case, have them contact your dealer to figure out a plan. It's not that the dealer isn't trying, just maybe they need a little motivational push from SoA.

    -juice
  • outbikeoutbike Member Posts: 6
    Hello All -

    I have a '96 OB w/ 107K and still running strong.

    Was curious if any of you knew of any aftermarket or Subaru accessory kits that would allow me to install daytime running lights.

    Appreciate the input and help!

    Thanks,
    Brian
  • tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    You might also try Adding DRL's.

    tidester, host
  • hypovhypov Member Posts: 3,068
    Brian-
    Check out Hella's website. IIRC they have DRL add ons available.

    -Dave
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Actually, since you have auto-off headlights, one solution is to just leave them on all the time!

    Seriously, they shut up when you remove the key, so it won't drain the battery. Plus that keeps your taillights on.

    The only catch is some interior lights, like the clock and stereo, might dim slightly.

    -juice
  • otis123otis123 Member Posts: 439
    Just bought Michelin Pilot Sport A/S tires to replace OE Firestone Wilderness tires (got 40K out of them).
    The Pilots are unbelievable - ultra high performance (just hope I get at least 30K out of them). I've driven through several spring highway floods at 70mph and they track like they're on rails = no slip at any wheel. The water shoots out and up - higher than the roof of the Outback. The Beaner also no longer leans when cornering (the Pilot's sidewall is almost 3 times as thick as the Firestones). Snow performance is also supposed to be excellent, but I'll have to wait until next year...
    French? **** the French! They probably have a villa waiting for Saddam on the French Riviera. But I'll still buy the best product for the best price I can get it at in the marketplace. Remember Pearl Harbor? I used to buy Hitler's VWs too (but don't have the time/patience for their reliability)!

    Ralph
  • lark6lark6 Member Posts: 2,565
    I have them in a plus-one for my '00 Forester, mounted on a set of OZ Superleggera alloys. I took them off for winter and put the OEM wheels back on, wearing Dunlop SP Sport 5000s. In hindsight I could have run the Michelins in winter but I didn't want to risk damaging the alloys. The Pilot Sports are great, they really boost the handling of my car and offer much improved traction in all conditions.

    As for the French connection, the Pilot Sport A/S are made in Michelin's facility in South Carolina. I grew up in SC and still have most of my family there; the parent company may be French but they are providing jobs to hard working South Carolinians who might otherwise be stuck in low-paying jobs in textile mills or tourism. At least that's how I live with it.

    Ed
  • otis123otis123 Member Posts: 439
    Jobs. There you go.

    It would be another story if they were being made in France and exported to the USA (then I would not trust them - right now at least - LOL!)

    Ralph
  • blackbeanblackbean Member Posts: 100
    I have had Michelin Pilots before - they are excellent but only lasted 30K (and because they were so fun to drive hard! :-) I also have had Dunlop Sport A2's and they are better riding and still pretty sporty and lasted about 40k (same driving :-) So, for the money (about $140 less) I am going with the Dunlops again when the OEM Bridgestones wear out.

    I have been getting around 23 mpg overall with my 2002 LL Bean. I just got back from a 500 mile trip to Vermont, fully loaded, with Thulke skirack loaded and still got 23 MPG (all the extra drag hurt!) and was running mid-grade 89 Octane. I switch to 91 when the ambient temp rises above 60 F because then you need to worry about knock (pre-detonation) sensors compensating and robbing you of power and fuel economy.
  • dmartelldmartell Member Posts: 3
    What is your opinion on a 1999 Legacy Wagon Brighton with 50K miles and a 5 speed standard transmission for $10,000?
  • idahodougidahodoug Member Posts: 537
    My opinion is that you're looking at a '99 Brighton with 50k miles for $10,000. Kind of light on details to make a judgement, eh?

    I'd check out used car values here on this site to get an idea, actually....

    IdahoDoug
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Didn't the Brighton lack ABS? Plus it didn't get a roof rack. IMO they look kind of odd without them, at least the wagons do.

    I dunno, it's not well equipped, and it's not exactly a steal in terms of price. I'd spend a little more an at least get an L.

    My rule of thumb is 10% depreciation right away, then 10% every year after that. The '04s are almost here (some already are), so pretty soon that'll be a 5 year old car that should have depreciated 50-60%. That would put the original value at $20-25 grand.

    No, IMO the price is too high. For a better equipped Outback or 2.5GT that would be a deal.

    -juice
  • mws1672002mws1672002 Member Posts: 19
    Hi, I have a 2003 Subaru Outback sedan with the H-6 engine. I have had problems since I bought the car with it shutting off every 2000 miles or so. I have had it in at the dealer now seven times, and a Subaru rep has down loaded the information from the cars diagnostic computer twice. They have had no luck in determining the problem. At this point they are about to give up since they cannot replicate the problem. Has anyone on here ever heard of this problem as it is very annoying and potentially dangerous. And is there any other recourse than to live with the problem?
  • subearusubearu Member Posts: 3,613
    First off, it's a horizontal layout for the engines, so it's H6 not V6. ;-)

    It's probably a slim 'chance' that the service guys can duplicate the problem that doesn't happen all of the time. They need to duplicate it since they're looking for any codes the OBDII computer might be storing, but it appears as if no codes get thrown by this event.

    By any chance do you have an aftermarket car alarm or starter installed?

    -Brian
  • mws1672002mws1672002 Member Posts: 19
    No I have not added anything to the car. It ran fine until it reached 1500 miles and then it shut off for the first time. The warning lights came on and the engine died, nothing alerted me to the fact that it would shut off. It starts back up immediately and runs fine, until the next event. The Subaru reps took a fuel sample and said the premium gas I am burning is not the problem either.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    I'm just leaving mine on all the time too.

    I just did 3,000 miles in the '97 OB Ltd that I picked up last week or so ago. When I get around to converting all the liters to US gallons, I'll check the mpg. The heated seats are nice, but I really am a cloth guy I've decided....

    Steve, Host
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I'd ask for an ECU replacement. The car is brand new and it's happened often enough now that there really is no excuse. They have to start taking actions even if they cannot reproduce the problem.

    At least that's what I'd ask for, politely of course. Work with the dealer, and call 800-SUBARU3 to open up a case file, have SoA help you as well. Remember, be curteous, I used to work for a Help Desk and believe me you get better results that way.

    For those that do not follow the Subaru Crew - Modifications topic, I installed the trim from Bit's Outback on my Legacy. What is interesting is that it's the Plood from a 2000-2001 model, which means I added an extra cup holder. So now I have 3 in front, 2 in back, 5 total. As many as any Subie.

    Check out pics here:

    http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4291761427

    Thanks bit!

    -juice
  • ladywclassladywclass Member Posts: 1,713
    lookin good ....
  • c_hunterc_hunter Member Posts: 4,487
    Looks good. I bet somebody will want your black plastic trim now!

    So, feeling extremely thirsty today, or are the three cans of soda just for the photo? :-)

    Craig
  • subearusubearu Member Posts: 3,613
    I believe all 4 door locations are 6½".

    -Brian
  • reblack_jrreblack_jr Member Posts: 57
    I recently took my 01 Outback LTD in for a leak repair in the roof. Water has been collecting in the switch/lamp assembly that controls the roof windows. After complaining for some time I took the switch/lamp out and found that the water dripped ran/out only when the car was cornering. The dealer diagnosed it (checked for vent being open) and them decided the only way to repair it was to pull out the headliner. This was done and they say it is now fixed (of course it has not rained since and I am not sure the repair was successful). They also said there was/is a bulletin on this problem. Anyone have an idea what is up? They said the water is collected in channels around the rear roof opening and was directed towards the front when the car is turning. Does anyone know whether this is really the situation? I do not have a "picture" of the arrangement and have difficulty understanding.
    Thanks!
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    It only took me about an hour. Guess I did get a little more thirsty than usual. Shoulda put beers in there, though. ;-)

    Yes, I have spare black trim for anyone that hates the plood. It'll fit 2002-2003 models, or 2000-2001 if you're willing to give up the cup holder.

    -juice
  • schizaschiza Member Posts: 31
    I have the same problem on our LL Bean. My car shuts off every 2 - 3 weeks when stopped. The only difference is that my car's power shuts off as well the engine. It starts up no problem and runs smooth. I've brought it to the dealer 2 times already. I have under 2000 miles on it. They've replaced the ignition and some relay switch. It happened again 2 weeks ago. I'm bringing it in Tomorrow to see if they can fix it. They're going to keep it for a while to see if they can duplicate the problem. We did install an auto starter by the dealer. They seem to think it's not the auto starter. Suburu is also looking into this, the dealership has told us that they're bringing one of their own tech's to look at. The car otherwise has been very good. This problem however needs to be fixed and I will not live with this problem. The fact that I've had this car for 3 months and it's been in the shop for 2+ weeks doesn't sit with me well. I'll post again once I found out more info. I will hire a lawyer if I have to. Hopefully it doesn't come to that
  • tkevinblanctkevinblanc Member Posts: 356
    Those sound like two pretty different problems.

    Both problems are, of course, completely unacceptable.
  • rumc3rumc3 Member Posts: 31
    I have a '97 Legacy GT Wagon w/auto. One thing I don't like is the high revving at highway speeds...3,000 RPM's at 70 is a tad high and probably is why my overall gas mileage is only about 22mpg. Otherwise, car has been great..just turned 70,000.
    Do newer Legacy's still rev high like this? FYI, I got the GT Wagon in black..very sharp. I didn't go with the Outback because I don't like the two-tone, the white letter tires (today's version of whitewalls?) and what's with the gold wheel crap? What is up with Subaru? Do they think this looks good? They should take a good look at the Audi Avant wagons, and design the Suburu accordingly.
  • sebberrysebberry Member Posts: 148
    has their own opinions. I like the gold on the wheels. I like the two tone paint treatment. If you want a car that looks like an Audi, then please buy one of those. Think of how boring the streets would look if all wagons, or cars for that matter took their styling cues from Audi. No, I like the distinguished look of the Outback, and I also like it when people drop their jaws when the SUV-look alike Outback powers into and out of corners, and zips around city streets like a sports car.

    Anyway, enough of my rant and on to my question:

    How does the new Haldex AWD system that is going on cars such as the 4motion and some Audis compare to the Subaru Active all-wheel drive (not the VDC/VTD) featured on the LL Bean? Is it the same system in a different packaging? Not that it really matters now, I have my OB and will for hopefully a quater million kilometers.
  • leo2633leo2633 Member Posts: 589
    I agree about the gold wheels and the outline white letters on the Outback. I don't care for them either. Here is what I did about it. My wife has a 2003 Outback base model, which doesn't come with the gold trimmed wheels. They come on Limited (and higher) models, which is one reason we opted for the base model. When the car was 3 days old, I took it to a tire shop, and had them dismount the tires, then remount them with the blackwalls facing out. It looks much sharper this way, IMHO. I have a 2001 Forester S, and I had the OWL tires turned on that when new, also. And, yes, I do admit to being OCD!

    Len
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I prefer the monotone styling, too, but that's what you get on the GT and on the base Outbacks. Only the high-end Outbacks have the silver/gold wheels. Tires are cheap to replace. Or you could even mount them with the RWL facing in. I wouldn't let that make me sway a $20-25 grand decision.

    Both OB and GT have a 4.11 final drive, but the Outback has bigger diameter tires, 7% bigger to be exact, so it should rev a little lower on the highway.

    So, try a base Outback, see how that "fits". Costco charges just $28 to remount all 4 tires.

    -juice
  • paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    Stalling problem. I'm gonna go out on a limb here and suggest an alternator replacement. If that fails then an ECU replacement. I've seen a similar problem on Isuzus I deal with that have had bad alternators.

    -mike
  • mn_patmn_pat Member Posts: 67
    My car had an intermittent stalling problem. It turned out to be the Cam Positioning Sensor.

    The problem first presented itself as intermittent stalls and it would always restart immediately. It progressed into stalling and not restarting. The replacement of the sensor was $130.00
  • bkaiser1bkaiser1 Member Posts: 464
    My 01 OB (H4/5sp) turns 3500 rpms at 70mph and 4000 rpms at 80mph, which looks high, but really isn't too bad. At that speed, the engine is barely audible and still returns decent mpg in the mid-20's.

    I agree that lower cruising rpms would help economy, but I like that I almost never have to downshift to pass or pull mountain passes. A taller 5th gear would lower rpms, but would make downshifting necessary to keep your speed. Ideally, 5th would stay the same and Subaru would add a tall 6th (!) gear...
  • goosegoggoosegog Member Posts: 206
    I don't have to worry about the hokey raised white letters on mine because they are disintegrating and falling off on their own.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    6 speed, yummy!

    Maybe you can Dremel the RWL off. Don't try this at home kids. ;-)

    -juice
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    I don't much care for the gold trim either, nor the RWL. The alloys do look a bit better than the mounted studs I took off today though.

    Ah well, I'm going to try Subearu's chirp killer method again tomorrow. I gave it a brief shot last week but was preoccupied, and it didn't work. I have fob stuff in the manual plus 2 separate security system fob direction sheets, and nothing jumps out at me for de-chirping the '97 OB.

    Steve, Host
  • subearusubearu Member Posts: 3,613
    The fob I have ('00 Outback) has Part #: 88035AC230 on the back. It's a 2 button type, with the LOCK button larger than the UNLOCK button. LOCK is on the left portion of the fob. There is a small red LED above the LOCK button to indicate activity.

    Not sure what system the '97 had. Hopefully the 'press both buttons for ~5 secs' works!

    -Brian
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    My buttons are the same size and no led (or part # for that matter - just an FCC# of GOH-M24). It's still early here - I'll wait an hour or so before disturbing the neighborhood testing button pushing. Thanks!

    Steve, Host
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    There aren't any dogs nearby in my neighborhood. Pressing both buttons is the panic mode - boy, a 125 decibel alarm is loud :-)

    I found an old Usenet post about moving a dip switch that I may try if no other '97 owners have any suggestions for killing the chirp. Failing that, I'm gonna find the disarm button and just turn it off. My 3 manuals aren't helpful. Hate the chirp!

    Steve, Host
  • outback_97outback_97 Member Posts: 130
    I used the alarm ONCE on my car, when the car was new and I was worried about parking in a poorly lit lot for a basketball game. When I and three buddies from work returned to the car after the game, I couldn't disarm it due to a bad battery in the remote. We got into the car, the alarm wailing, and here's four guys frantically rooting through the car looking for a tiny phillips screwdriver to get into my garage door opener to replace the battery. We could have been stealing the car blind. Did anyone stop us or dare to say anything? Of course not. The only alarms I hear going off frequently are in the parking lot at the ski resorts from the avalanche control concussions and people bumping into cars. I find them really annoying and ineffective.

    I was so sick of deafening myself whenever I had to disconnect and reconnect the battery that I just snipped a wire going to the siren. No more chirp, no more stupid siren, but I still have keyless entry, which is just fine by me. That was my solution!

    utahsteve
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    There is a little wire going to the siren on mine, complete with a disconnect plug. Unplugging it had no effect at all....

    I wouldn't mind removing the siren entirely but I don't want to mess up the fobs.

    Steve, Host
  • bkaiser1bkaiser1 Member Posts: 464
    There's a small blurb on the Outbacks in today's WSJ (section D, p2)... a stranger in Florida emailed me here at work after seeing my name and place of work listed under the "Driver's" heading. Other than being male, I appear to be way out of the demographic for my own car! I'm 28, single, and earn half what they list as "average" for the car. So much for demographics...

    Brian
  • outback_97outback_97 Member Posts: 130
    Steve (Host): Hmmm, when I did it I cut a wire coming out of the "brain" of the alarm, not anything on the siren itself. The alarm module had a description right on it that described what wire did what. Worked great for me, the parking lights still flash and everything else is normal, just no sound.

    Brian: I'm under 30 (for a few more weeks) and single (for a few more months) and own an Outback. Not sure about income, but I'm definitely not rich. What exactly were the demographics in the article? At the "new owner" orientation thing that I went to after purchasing the car, there seemed to be a lot of much older people and... ummm... errrr... "non-traditional" couples in attendance. Not that there's anything wrong with that! Wow, what's the P.C. way to discuss this? Think older Forester commercials and their choice of celebrity spokeswomen. Just my empirical observation at that time. I think Subaru's "demographics" have expanded since that time.

    utahsteve
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    That sounds similar to the dip switch article technique. Which means fumbling around peering under the dash and trying to keep my reading glasses on while half upside down. I think I'll go transplant the rose bushes today instead, lol.

    Steve, Host
  • hypovhypov Member Posts: 3,068
    no wonder car thieves love oem alarms....
    minimal guess work. ;-)

    -Dave
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    They're all wrong, Brian. You have a "K" in your name, for instance. Plus you're a techie.

    -juice
  • bkaiser1bkaiser1 Member Posts: 464
    The WSJ listed the "average" driver profile as Male, 51 years old, married, with a household income of $91,500. It also said we like skiing, foreign travel, wildlife, and cultural events. Go figure.

    As far as the "non-traditional" couples you mention, it's true: Subaru's are very popular among us "non-traditional" folks... particularly lesbians, for some reason. Subaru became the first automaker in 1991 (?) or somewhere thereabouts to actively target market to the gay population. Subaru invests heavily in this market and has succeeded in tapping into a largely ignored market with billions in disposable income.

    Brian
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    51 seems a bit high, but maybe. My dad is 63 and owns one.

    They forgot to mention the names are "Dave" and "Mike", and they didn't bring up Mac ownership, or even pets! What do they know? ;-)

    -juice
  • grahampetersgrahampeters Member Posts: 1,786
    G'day

    I guess the demographics may be skewed by the sample selection. If you buy the WSJ and are likely to be questioned in their survey, the chances are that you are older, wealthier and more conservative than the rest of the population. Tha demographic looks out of whack with the Subaru population generally - critically there is no mentin of the Dave factor.

    Put it down to poor sample selection

    Cheers

    Graham
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