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Comments
Search for a TSB for your specific model on NHTSA.gov.
Also, make sure your tires are worn evenly, and rotated regularly. Differences in circumferences might confuse the ABS sensors.
vtec_2003: your mileage is atypical. If it's new, most of them tend to improve with age, usually by about +2 mpg.
You should be able to negotiate the price on that warranty down to about $1300, FWIW. Try those links above.
Doug: sounds like you're already doing the things you should. The next big service is the 60k miles (96k KM), and that's when I'd start doing more in-depth preventative maintenance.
-juice
This car could easily end up with one of our 5 kids, so I would want to ensure that things were done first.
Appreciate your expertise.
Doug
enjoy
Cheers
Pat
Len
This was a variation of your "find an older couple" trick - we had planned a trip to AK in March to visit and then I remembered an old friend who had gotten an Outback for a retirement gift. So I had seen the car when it was one week old and sort of knew its history. I called her but she hadn't considered selling it.
But the hint worked, and she went to the dealer the next week to check out new ones. Negotiations ensued, successfully (TMV, "verified" by Terry over in Real World Trade In Values), and we wound up taking an extra week of vacation and drove it 3,000 miles down the Alaska Highway to Boise. The studded tires came in handy in Alberta the first week of April!
So it had a bit less than 34,000 miles on it when I bought it; almost beat your record, LOL. Limited, with heated leather. And it's that's bright red, my lucky car/canoe color - same as my 17 year old Tercel was.
Steve, Host
Bob
Bob
Interesting that you won't see the new outback/Legacy until early 2004. The suggestion from the fleet guy at tmy dealer is that they will probably hit Australia in about October/November. Subaru Australia are currently selling Outbacks and Libertys (Legacys to you) with all on road costs included which is very abnormal. Subarus are normally waiting list only in Australia. That is probably to clear the supply chain of 03 stock before releasing the new model.
I've half decided to roll my lease over for 6-12 months and look at the new Outback against the Forester Xt which will be released here in July.
Of course, the key difference is that Foresters for US are sourced from Japan where as Legacy/Outback is made in USA so the factory will have to retool for them. May explain why Australia will see the Outback first.
Cheers
Graham
http://www.subdriven.com/index.html
It's a winner, for sure.
Bob
Basically all the maintenance and wear and tear stuff.
-juice
Jim
Doug
Steve
Steve
Just didn't see mention of memory settings and monotone black paint...
SOA, don't forget the driver memory settings for the USA version AND monotone paint (the two-tone paint is soooo 90's)!
:-)
Ralph
Craig
FYI - '96 Outback MT has 2.2 SOHC. '96 Outback AT & '97 to '99 Outback have 2.5 DOHC. '00 to '03 Outback H4 have 2.5 SOHC. '01 to '03 Outback H6 have 3.0 DOHC.
DaveM
You can also tell by looking at the redline. DOHC had it at 6500rpm, while the SOHC engines go to 6250rpm.
My way's easier, Dave. :P
-juice
OK, your way is easier.
DaveM
-juice
Hatch rattle: Had this for many months, drove me nuts. I finally fixed it by inserting washers to move one of the brackets w/ the sliding spring loaded block towards the hatch. They're supposed to contact the hatch when closed. Four washers (two per bolt) = no more rattle on mine. I think the bolts were 10mm head, IIRC.
utahsteve
Ralph
The power is fine, but the handling has always been disappointing when compared to my previous Audi A4, much less my wife's WRX. Too much sway/body roll for how good the car is in other ways.
But the most bothersome thing is that the tires "cup" wear badly. I'm becoming convinced this is a characteristic of the Subie AWD system. Our old '97 Legacy did it badly, our '03 WRX does it to a degree, and my VDC with 15K miles on it has road noise that can't be drowned out with the McIntosh cranked up. Any remarks/suggestions?
My '03 Outback H4 AT has 13.5k miles on the original Bridgestone Potenza RE92's and appear to be wearing evenly.
I rotate the tires (front to rear / rear to front) every 7500 miles. Are you rotating your tires?
DaveM
Anybody know if we will get a 20% increase in fuel economy like the Japanese version? That would put the Legacy from 28 highway to 33 or 34. Right up there with Accord and Camry. With the added advantage of a wagon and AWD I would probably be swayed. If mileage stays at 28 though - I will probably go with the Mazda 6 wagon(which the legacy wagon looks quite a bit like).
DaveM
As for the cupping, I doubt it's the system since your older subie and the VDC use different AWD systems. My family has serveral subies all AT and none have cupping over serveral years serveral tire brands, and serveral driving styles.
-mike
Keep in mind that the Outback's don't get the sportshift AT that the GT's get. The H6 is a smooth & quiet motor. Take it for a drive before you decide.
-Brian
As Brian said, be sure to test drive it first. My guess is that you'll love the power of the H6 but prefer the handling of the GT.
Decisions, decisions...8~)
Jim
Longtime lurker here. Have been car shopping off and on for about three years - my husband's Accord just keeps going and going and going. We've finally decided to go ahead and buy, and the final decision is between the Outback (base wagon) and the CR-V EX. I would say that our heart is telling us Outback, but our gut is telling us CR-V. The reason is our complete satisfaction with our two Hondas. They've been so reliable, with only minimal repairs and routine scheduled maintenance. I'm wondering if the Outback will live up to that Honda reliability? I know Subaru's have a good reputation, and Consumer Reports says the Outback is just as reliable than the CR-V. But my very unscientific observation is that there are FAR more postings in the Subaru Legacy/Outback Wagons - Problems & Solutions discussion than the CR-V Owners: Problems & Solutions discussion. I'm hoping that you loyal Subie fans will be able to give me some insight into the disparity. Thanks so much!!
Number of vehicles sold -- a vehicle that over the years has only sold 100,000 units will have fewer postings than one that has sold 750,000. I don't know the volume of CR-Vs to OBs. My observation is that there are probably a good deal more OBs out there than CR-Vs. Now, if you were comparing OBs to Civics or Accords . . .
"cult" following -- some vehicles have a greater base of aficianados who tend to focus much more on their favored vehicle, so post more. Some cars are merely transportation, with a much smaller or non-existent cult following so have fewer posts. Subarus in general, and the OB in particular, tend to have a fairly high, and vocal, cult following in relation to the total numbers sold. I do not know about the CR-V.
I'm sure others on the board can come up with other reasons, but these two are the ones that immediately come to my mind.
I also have had good experiences with my Hondas (two Acura Integras). I've also had good experiences with my Mazdas (2), Toyota (1), Nissan/Datsun (1), Subarus (2). Neutral experience with Lincoln (1), slightly negative with Dodge (1) and Ford (1), and really terrible, awful, horrible with Jeep (1 and never again).
The CR reliability ratings are valuable and worthwhile. Just don't make the assumption that a good reliability rating from CR (or any other source) is some sort of a guarantee. Even a highly rated vehicle will have some units that have problems. Hondas do have some problems (automatic transmissions, most notably), but at a still acceptably low rate. As you can see from this board, Subarus, too, have some problem areas (transmissions, head gaskets). Of course, these are problem areas for many manufacturers, and at much higher problem rates. Just check out the Chrysler minivan boards about transmissions or Ford Windstar boards about head gaskets.
Whatever you decide, good luck!
--K9Leader
2000 Outback Ltd. wagon (35k miles and so far, so good!)
1998 Toyota Sienna (83K miles and so far, so good!
1994 Lincoln Mark VIII (103K miles and a few frustrating problems, but man is it sleek and fast and smooth!)
Yes, I know this is very unscientific. And I know that reliability ratings aren't guarantees - I could go out and buy the CR-V tomorrow, and end up with a lemon...
Interesting that you observe there are more Outbacks than CR-Vs on the road. I'd guess the opposite. Maybe it's the geography... I don't live in the Rockies or New England, where I'd suspect OBs far outnumber CR-Vs. (Actually, I live in the Washington DC area, so I suspect we have a lot more Outbacks here than in many areas of the country.)
I had also thought about the "cult" following among Subarus making the numbers appear higher on the Subaru boards, and had talked about this with my husband, but I didn't articulate it as well as you did. I'll have to show him your post.
Thanks again - would still welcome input from others on the board as well!
In general all the subaru related topics have very high number of postings. the "Meet the Members" has almost 15,000 postings. "Future Models" and "Foresters" are also over 10,000 postings. This Outback wagons topic is over 8,000. Mostly with messages like this.
The Legacy/Outback wagons Problems topic is one of the least posted of all the subie topics.
I think we just like to talk/write and happen to enjoy reading/posting on these boards.
--Jay
Over the course of the first 50K miles, I've had WAY more headaches with my Subaru than all of my previous cars combined. The dealer has been able to fix most of the problems, but it hasn't always been easy to get things fixed.
Most notably, the clutch problem took a full 2 years to get corrected, the paint problems left me without a car for 5 weeks, 2 window regulators have failed. No car maker is perfect (but Honda is close) and I won't say that this experience will prevent me from buying another Subaru, but MY experience with this Outback has been less satisfying than it could have been.
Others here with similar mileage have had no problems with their vehicles, so it's hard to really gauge how prevalent some of these problems are. I only throw my experience out for comparison's sake, rather than to try and talk anyone out of a Subaru. I do think, however, that the Subaru's made in the USA (like mine) tend to be slightly less solid than the ones made in Japan and will likely gravitate towards a WRX or Forester next time around.
Brian
vamoodys: as always, YMMV, you've had good luck with Honda and I can't blame you if you stick with them. However, let's look at a few things.
CR ratings for the Outback this year are actually slightly higher than the CR-V's ratings. Small difference, but still. More importantly, Subaru offers a 67% longer powertrain warranty. I still don't get why Honda offers just 3 years, and by the way no roadside assistance either (Subaru gives you 3 years of that).
Also, the Civic had something like 6 recalls. The CR-V is a newish design based on that Civic, and that probably explains why the reliability ratings dipped down.
But forget all that. You said your heart says Outback. Get the Outback. So what if you have a couple of minor problems to deal with, maybe the car spends 2 days at a dealer per year (worst case scenario)? As long as you are happier the other 363 days?
Would you prefer to have a perfectly reliable car that you know you won't like as much, 365 days of the year? Not me.
Pardon my rant, some times I think people get a little carried away about reliability. Liking the car overall is far more important.
Just my opinion.
-juice
Outbacks have better handling and are more comfortable and quiet. But a little pricy. A the same money ($21000), you got a base outback, but you can get a CRV EX with moonroof, cd-changer, security and side airbag. I don't care the moonroof, but I think the base outback should have had at least side airbags. CRVs definitely have more value in the same price range. One thing I don't like CRVs are the body-roll in curve roads, this is probably a common SUV thing(I never drove a SUV before.) The CRV engines are kind of loud compared to subaru. In terms of reliability, I met two guys the other day when I had my car(still in the shop now)repaired, one has a 89 Legacy(maybe), the other has a 98 outback. 89 legacy has a bad head gasket, the 98 has a problematic transmission. The mechanic said to me he recommended to buy a honda if I plan for a new car. I still think about outback, I like the look, AWD(may not be neccessory in here(Sacramento,California), but we do have rain here)). Well, the decision thing is driving me crazy.
The OB has a lot of hidden content that you might not notice until you've lived with it for a while.
CR-V has its own set of issues: PTTR, driveline noises, seats that rock in their base, etc. They're still reliable. Keep in mind people with problems tend to seek out boards like this, so you'll see more than your fair share of problems.
-juice
Accord had new front pads at 30K (not covered), air conditioner re-charge at 35K (not covered), muffler and part of exhaust at 40K, pass. side front wheel bearing at 55K, driver door lock mechanism at 65K, glovebox doesn't shut right (started at 40K), driver weatherstripping cracked at 50K, no radio display since 75K, new radiator at 106K, dashboard temperature control knob has broken 3 times! = average reliability in my book.
LLBean had new front pads & rotors at 22K (covered by warranty). That's it. = excellent reliability in my book, so far (knock on plastic wood).
Ralph
Steve
<ducking and running for cover after that post>
IdahoDoug