I'd have to say no. No dealer is going to bring in a competitor on their own lot. Also, most states have pretty strict guidelines for granting dealer licenses.
Why do you want a license if you are not prepared to do it right?
MONEY TALKS. I think if i went too a used car dealer and paid him $200 month and $200 each car
Your money needs to be talking alot louder.... Used cars sold via a dealership come with warranty responsibilities and other liabilities......the owner of the license is on the hook. what if one of your test drives results in a crash or fatality? You willing to cover his liabilities? $200 won't do it.
I thought of doing the same thing here in Orlando as there's a huge car auction about a mile or so from my house. I think it's a Manheim auction. Sounds pretty convenient, right? Pick up a vehicle or three here and there, sell them on ebay or autotrader. Even drive them as my personal vehicle so I can save a bundle not paying for that. . That is until I researched Florida's licensing requirements to get a dealer's license so I could go to the auction as you have to be a dealer. Between bonding requirments, liability insurance, a place of business (not your house), a garage, capital to finance your inventory, etc. etc. it was just not something I wanted to risk. . And all that assumes I'm market savvy enough to pick out the cars I know I can make a profit on. Hey, I read Edmunds fora right? What more is there to learn?
Just a suggestion wgrey, I'm not in the biz, but when you come here asking dealers for their advice, maybe your should tone it down a bit. There really are some knowledgeable people here who can guide you down the right path if you're really serious about getting a dealer's license. . Good luck, and drop me an email. I'd be curious to know how you make out. My email addy is in my profile.
...housekeeping. Some posts have been swept away as they were replies to other deleted posts. Some will be receiving an email shortly. If there is another mess made soon, I'll have to close the room for the night.
Your sales tax is calculated on the purchase price wether it is the invoice or not. If there is a trade some states give you a tax credit on the value of your trade and you pay tax on the difference(price - trade = difference). If a dealer chooses to sell you a car for $500 under invoice, that is not a rebate from the manufacturer and is taxable. Heck, he could sell you the car for $100 if he wanted. You pay sales tax befor the rebate because dealers keep it as a convience for the customer. Say you buy a computer at Best Buy for $1000. This computer has a manufacturers rebate of $100. You don't pay tax on $900 you pay it on the full boat and wait 6-8 weeks for the rebate check. Same thing with cars without the 6-8 week wait.
As far as your second point, yes that is what they are selling the car to you for. They don't include state fees because those are the states, not theirs. When you go into the grocery store or WalMart, those prices don't include tax. I don't know about where you live but where I sell outside Chicago, There are 3 different tax rates that vary 2 points depending on where you live. That is why we never quote a full Out the Door price unless we are asked and can get specific titling information. They usually include the rebate to make it easy. What if you opt for the finance rate instead of the rebate? You are back up to the origional number. Hope this info helps
I work in a dealership and this question comes up alot around this time of year. The answer is subjective in some cases the 05 may be the better deal. I'll explain lets say you buy the 05 and you put 30K miles on it and go to trade it in 3 years later, because your buying late in the year you really have a low mileage 05. If you were to buy the 06 you would have moderate to high mileage (the 05 would have about 10-11K per year at resale or trade in time as opposed to the 06 which would have 14-to 15K) This is really important to consider especially at this time of season. Conversely if you were to only average 9-10K per year the credit you would get for the mileage may not be enough to overshadow the vehicle being a year older. Also the dealer may not be as aggressive with an 06 on his lot while his still trying to clear out 05's so you may end up paying more to get the vehicle. I hope this helps good luck.
......... Mike and Audi have pretty much summed it up ......
$200........? .. thats not enough to cover an auction fee, let alone the $1,000 deductible on any of the vehicles in the rolling inventory ...
You're talking "at least" $6,000 in basic liability insurance, at least another $6,000 in "basic" full coverage insurance, figure another $1,000 in plates .... then you need to be liquid, as in "Cashola" to cover the the last 2/3 vehicles you bought because the last 2 or 3 haven't sold yet, so now you're talkin' another $50/$60,000 in just the el cheapo stuff .... and lets not forget the little things you didn't catch the first time around like: tires, paintwork, wiper blades, detail work, the compressor is coughing up a lung on that last Contour, and "dang" - I didn't notice that windshield had a bullet hole in it ... and Speakin' of holes, you can wear a hole in your pocket in just a few weeks ...l.o.l.......
$200....? ... how about $200,000+ just to get up and rolling with Billy Bob's Barbeque and Used Car Emporium ... then what about next month.?
$200....? .. you can't buy your first months Ad's with that - or buy steam off a hotdog ............
I went to test drive a 2005 Sienna today, and had several things happen that threw me off guard. The salesman knew I was coming - we had an appointment, plus I called as I was leaving for the dealership. He also knew which two cars they had that I was interested in. And, he knew I was prepared to buy this morning if I liked the car and the price.
1. He kept me waiting 20 minutes after I got there. 2. He started by showing me a car without the side curtain airbags that I had told him we had to have. His excuse was that he couldn't remembers little things about everyone. 3. The first car I came to see was sold last night, but he somehow didn't know that until he actually went to get the keys. 4. The second car was in a wreck yesterday, which he didn't know until he spent awhile wandering around the lot looking for it. 5. Now they are offering to do a dealer trade to get another one like my first choice and sell me a car at their cost. They say their invoice is $1000 more than Edmonds list because they are part of the Southern Toyota group (may have remembered name wrong). They also charge $399 for dealer fees, in addition to the destination charge of $595.
My questions are: 1. What are the chances it was a fluke that both cars I came to see weren't available? 2. If they sell it to me for their invoice, even with all the additional fees, it it still a fair price? Or, is this Southern Toyota thing something to avoid? To be honest, even if the price is fantastic, my confidence level is so low with them, I would probably be paranoid for the rest of the transaction if I did buy from them
Yeah, that sounds like a bad experience, and it would be good to go somewhere else if there is another dealer nearby. However, if they are the closest dealer, I would still go there despite your bad experience.
"my confidence level is so low with them, I would probably be paranoid"
That would not matter to me. In my opinion, we buy a car, not the dealer. Once we drive the car off the lot, I forget about the dealer. I just enjoy the car.
If you re-visit the dealer, all you have to do is check to see if they have the car you want in stock. If you like it, then make an out-the-door offer. If they accept, cough up the dough and drive the car home.
If they start giving you double-talk, you can assume your offer has been declined and you can leave. Yes, it is that simple.
>They say their invoice is $1000 more than Edmonds list because they are part of the Southern Toyota group (may have remembered name wrong). They also charge $399 for dealer fees, in addition to the destination charge of $595.
I would be even more concerned about accepting an invoice price that is inflated an additional $1000 as their invoice and then an additional $399 puff in price. I'd look for another dealer in another part of the country and buy there or switch brands.
"What are the chances it was a fluke that both cars I came to see weren't available?"
ZERO. I have heard that... "It was in a wreck" and "it has already been sold" baloney so much it is sickening. Your salesman is a liar....who's using all the tricks in the book. If you are determined to buy at that dealership I would ask for another salesman. Going to another dealership you are just as likely to run into the same type of thing. Good luck.
Have been looking at 05 4runners for a couple of weeks now (not in a rush to buy). I thought with the end of the year the dealers would really like to move them out with 06's on the way and therefore there was a chance of good deal. Looking at SR5's and Sports (both V8) in the range 35-36k MSRP I have really struggled to get them under 32-33k excluding tax, tags. Calculating the invoice to be between 30-31k including the options but without other destination charge etc. They are very resistant to getting near that figure citing TDA, wholesale financial reserve etc. I would have thought Toyota would be giving them excellent incentives to move these vehicles. All the dealers I have been to have between 6-10 05 4runners on their lot.
Do they really think as we eneter 06 they can get over invoice for an 05? Are they just playing hardball? What are the current incentives from the factory to the dealer?
I'm tempted to wait till after Christmas and get an 06 if they will not move anymore.
.. ** He kept me waiting 20 minutes after I got there ** .....
Everyone gets busy .... but to make a customer wait 20 minutes is waaaaay to long .. the salesman should have introduced you to another salesperson discussed the facts briefly, then move to his current customer and "split" the deal with your new salesperson ........ as far as the "Southern Toyota group" - are saying SE Toyota...? ... what state do you live in.?
I am in NC, and was shopping in Durham. Your right, it was Southeast Toyota. If what they are saying about all the fees are true, then would I get the same fees added at another area Toyota dealership? There are 3 within an hour of me, but they are all further away, and with the price of gas and hiring a sitter and taking off from work, it costs me quite a bit to take a couple of hours to check out another deal.
Toyota just sent me a canned email listing all the disclaimers for Edmonds, Kelly, and 4 other sites pointing out the statements about the listed invoice doesn't include local advertising costs, etc.
Anyway, I think I'll go to the Honda dealership down the street from me, pay a little more, and get the 2006 Odyssey of my family's dreams.
Thanks for all your feedback. I was worried that I might have missed on a great deal just because I didn't like the way I was handled.
A few personally-directed posts have been removed. Please keep it civil and let's not accuse other members of anything.
MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name. 2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h) Review your vehicle
redstar...while regional incentives, options and pricing is different with Toyotas, I bought a V6 4R about 3 months ago. Mine is 4WD. Has a spoiler, sunroof, upgraded wheels/tires and some other minor options. I liked the V6 so much that the V8 was unimportant to me. Plus, the added MPG was more appealing (although we're still talking high teens to mid 20s MPG).
I looked at the V8s (which around here have a $1,500 rebate) but still coudln't get it close to under $30K. My V6, with the above options, was around $33K MSRP, however.
People are still buying trucks and SUVs in droves around OH. I don't know of any Toyota dealer who will sell at invoice minus the rebate. My dealer took my $500 over invoice (remember, I didn't use the rebate) offer and ran with it after a little "give & take". I forget the exact number, but it was somewhere in the 28ish range.
I believe most think this runup in gas prices based on the Katrina tradedy is termporary. So, that may have some bearing on it, too. Believe it or not, but hybrid HIghlanders are kind of languishing on the lots here, too.
I don't know where you live, but if you get any snow, 4Rs will be relatively in demand come December and the white stuff starts flying.
Toyota's marketing charges are real. You might want to take a look at what CarsDirect can get one for, or what Edmunds says they are selling for in your area to get a general idea of what you could buy one for.
In the "Prices Paid" forum, prices are all over the map. Again, I think it's because of the regional Toyota pricing differences that causes the wild swings.
I think if one were to read van shopper's post carefully, it should be clear that he wasn't being dealt with in an "honest" or professional manner. Keeping the customer waiting 20 minutes when you already have an appointment, getting a customer to come in to look at a vehicle that "suddenly" is not available, saying their invoice is $1,000 more than Edmunds,copping an attitude. These are all tricks of the trade. Your salesman senses your fear van shopper...so naturally he is going to go for the jugular.
Do your homework. Find a salesperson you are comfortable with and can trust. Then go back in with an offer like you own the place.
If you have any doubts on this you should always ask to see the invoice. Edmunds, KBB are great sources for information but some people take their word for gospel, both are sometimes off on invoice prices(worst I've seen is $800) the difference was in option prices and that some regions have additional fees that dealers have to pay or manditory options that aren't factored in. Some cases they've been higher on those prices (they once had a price on a CD player that was only 200 but both sites had it listed for 350) anyway the point is that any reputable dealer will gladly show the invoice some even volunteer it before the negotiating starts. If your still looking at a Toyota try a different dealership or go back and ask for a different salesperson, this isn't uncommon. Good luck in your shopping
.. **Toyota just sent me a canned email listing all the disclaimers for Edmunds, Kelly, and 4 other sites pointing out the .... **
The SE region does indid have advertising that most times will not show on the invoice, it's based on current TV and future paper Ad's the dealer is charged with, it's very common for the SE region .... that's why if you read the Edmunds TMV and their pricing sources they indicate they don't show advertising costs ...... $1,000..? .. not on this planet, maybe $350 a copy .........
"Finally, in the South and Southeast large independent distributors control the pricing of Toyota vehicles, and they may set prices at different levels than those established by Toyota for the rest of the country. Similarly, in the Northeast a single independent distributor distributes Subaru vehicles."
The offer they gave me was for a van they didn't even have on the lot, so even if the price was fantastic, I wasn't going to accept it. But, for academic purposes, here it is (give or take a few dollars, I didn't save the paper work):
2005 Sienna LE with package #6 (no mats or Toyoguard) in Blue
$26,700 (they showed me paperwork stating this was their cost for the car) + $595 destination fee + 3% tax + $399 paper work fee + $75 tag and misc. fees =$28,587.85
Verses a 2006 Odyssey EX with a few dealer options added (roof rack, third row sun shade) for about $29,500 OTD (we haven't made a final decision on a few things, so we don't have a firm price yet). We would have saved an additional $300 more on the Sienna due to their lower finance offer on the remaining amount after our downpayment (1.9 verses Honda's 2.9 for the labor day weekend). We do not have a trade-in, so that was not part of the equation. In the end, I am paying about $1,300 total more for a car which we like better. (Cue all the posters who can't wait to tell me I'm paying too much for the Honda.)
I am perfectly satisfied with our choice to get a 2006 Honda, and my family is beyond excited - they love all the options of the seats in it. As an added bonus, the dealership is just 3 miles from my office, and offer shuttle service for any repairs or maintenance. Plus, they are very kid friendly - just a nice buying experience.
Sorry - forgot to add, there are other dealer options added to the Ody - meant cross bars (not roof rack), back-up assist (4 sensors), MP3 player, and all weather floor mats.
you and your family are happy with the purchase....That is ALL that matters....Good luck and many safe and enjoyable miles in your new Odessey EX. A very wise decision!
I believe the most important thing is to buy a vehicle you really like, and it sounds like you have done exactly that. Good for you!
I don't know if you paid too much or not. However, since you bought a van that your family loves, you will be more inclined to keep it longer instead of trading it in after a couple years, and that is where you will save the money.
I'm a 40 year old woman. I'm a car buyer. I'm intelligent, dress professionally and act the same.
In my recent car buying adventures, I visited a few (around 8) different dealers. Some salesmen wouldn't walk up to me, but would go to men that came in after me (no, they didn't have appointments or know them.)
I had one sales manager tell me a vehicle only had ABS on the back - he said I couldn't see it since it was 'hidden'. I looked up the window sticker online - no ABS. The next night he denied saying it - "I never told you that". :surprise: I had others tell me that ABS and side air bags weren't as important as DVDs, but I got into that discussion earlier in this thread and won't rehash it. Another salesman said to me "Maybe you need a man to help you make this decision." I walked out.
My worst experience was at a local Ford dealer. Sales man was about my age. I was honey, baby, sweetie, dear and babe to him. "Don't move, babe." "Hey sweetie, I still got the Freestyle here for you." "Honey, what can I do to put you in this car?" I can honestly say that Ford lost a sale due to this dealer's tactics - bait and switch, stranding me when I had a scheduled appointment and general treatment of a female customer.
I bought a Subaru. Used. I was treated with respect and as an intelligent person by my salesman.
My question for the dealers - do you know how your staff treats customers? I sent an email to the Internet Manager detailing my complaints about the Ford man, but I don't believe it will do any good.
Sounds like a horrible experience you've had. I often wonder how the sales types treat women, but I am actually more concerned with what they do to the women in the service department. I know enough about cars to tell them to pound sand, but I shudder to think what they tell women.
Buying a car is still harder for women, but I have heard of at least one good strategy to use when dealing with the sales folks. Take a man. A brother, a co-worker etc. Someone to be the decoy. You intiate the conversation and describe what you want. The salesguys will focus on the man and completely ignore you. After a while, the friend should say to the sales guy, " I don't know why you are talking to me. She's the one buying a car." At this point they are supposed to be overcome with embarassment and the rest is supposed to go smoothly.
The sad thing is that it probably doesn't have anything to do with them being in sales.... They're probably just people who don't treat women with respect. I'm sure before selling cars, when they go home or go out, and after they're done selling car, they will be treating women the same way.
Before I got in the car business, I was in journalism. My editor was a single lady, very professional as well. She went to an import dealership, and one of the first questions the salesman asked her was, "Are you the decision maker or do you have a husband?" Not exactly tactful, but... I find it hard to judge this situation. Especially if I have a "30-something" lady in looking at BMW's. Most of the time, I proceed just like she's the "decision maker" with the intent and means to buy something. Yet, when I ask her to buy the car, she says ... "Well, can you make a copy of this, I need to take and show it to my husband." Well why isn't the husband, who appears to be an integral part of this purchase, not here. Sometimes it's as if they haven't spoken a word to each other about buying a car, and when I follow up to talk to the husband, he has a completely different take on everything. (Price, payments, car, etc.) On the flip side, if I would have asked something like "Will anyone else be in on the decision," she is likely to get upset. Possibly leave and later call my GM (And that has happened to me before.) I'm not trying to insult the lady. Heck, I know my wife is just as capable at buying a car as anyone. But I like to know where I stand and where she stands as well. Now most of the time, I don't have to worry about this stuff because she will say something like "my husband just sent me out to look at some and see what I like." By the way, I would never, never, neverevereverever, refer to a lady as sweetie, babe or honey. That is so disrespectful.
When I get that feeling in the pit of my stomach... the nauseous one.. when I'm getting ready to commit major wads of cash to a purchase..
I say.. "Great, but I have to run this by the wife... neither one of us makes major financial decisions without the other's input".
Sure, it is just a way to step back, and reassess, before making a commitment. So, even if it isn't exactly true, it is a way to delay making a major decision. It really doesn't matter if the wife or husband has to be consulted, or whether the buyer even has a wife or husband..
I'm sure a lot of BMW buyers have the resources that makes the purchase the same as if I were buying a Honda Civic.. But, I think there are plenty who are making a major financial purchase that is extending their car buying budget to the maximum... That brings along a whole different set of anxieties to the table..
I am sure I read about this somewhere here..cant find it now.
A dealership I have been trying to work with (on every car they wont give me anything beyond employee financing and 2000 total in rebates, not even a cargo mat)... has just told me they had got another vibe.. one that was purchased a few weeks ago, but the finincing couldnt go through so it was returned. they are saying they are selling it new. so he quoted me the price of the car minus the employee pricing and rebates, and said that there might bbe a little room to work with it.
My friend says I should run away. that this is a shady thing some dealers do. that it cant be considered new if it has been titled. I want to know how much i could get off the price because of those miles, and can i still buy it as 'new' (minus the price) to use my GM card that has to be on a new car.
on a side note, the dealer fee on all their cars at the place is $599
1) If the financing "fell through", then the car was never titled.. You don't get title to the car, until the dealer has been paid..
2) The $599 "dealer fee" should be considered part of the selling price.. If this is the case, then this dealer is charging the employee price plus $599. If they insist on this fee, I'd find some place cheaper to do business.
Bmw3434, here is my advice to help you not offend anyone, especially women customers:
Don't ask the customer any questions.
A customer comes into your store to get information, not to answer a bunch of silly questions. The best way to help the customer is to answer their questions in a pleasant manner.
If you a good sales person, you should be able to tell pretty quickly if the customer is serious or not.
so just to be clear, and thanks for answering this....
here is an example of the math he is giving me... MSRP: 19830.00 after employee discount: 17994.55 -2000 (rebate and switiching from a jeep rebate) brings us to = 15994.55 = taxes (whish he says is 6% sales tax, 599 dealer fee, and 44 tag) this brings us to 17755.16
( it then can figure in my GM card)...
now is that on the up or up, or is he playing the dealer fee twice?
They wont give me anything..not even fthe cargo mat. when i asked about a promise on a certain ammount to drive my used car up there , they suggested I donate it (heh)..
Your feedback is really appreciated. like to nail down this purchase by tommorow noon.
"Don't ask the customer any questions." I'm sorry, but I disagree. Respectfully, of course. Here's what I mean: If I didn't ask questions, how in the world would I know what would best fit the customer's needs - both men and women. It's not like they are buying a can of beans.
If I don't ask questions, I might as well be a web page...
Since when is it a silly question when I ask "What sort of features, options, colors etc., are you looking for?"
Beleive it or not, everybody doesn't just spill their guts when you say hello.
If I don't try to find out what particulars they are looking for, then I am no help.
"If you a good sales person, you should be able to tell pretty quickly if the customer is serious or not."
Dawson, the dealer is allowed to charge whatever they want. If you don't feel like paying it, then you have to go somewhere else. That's the way it works.
Comments
No dealer is going to bring in a competitor on their own lot.
Also, most states have pretty strict guidelines for granting dealer licenses.
Why do you want a license if you are not prepared to do it right?
Have you tried sending her back to the manufacturer?
Your money needs to be talking alot louder....
Used cars sold via a dealership come with warranty responsibilities and other liabilities......the owner of the license is on the hook. what if one of your test drives results in a crash or fatality? You willing to cover his liabilities? $200 won't do it.
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That is until I researched Florida's licensing requirements to get a dealer's license so I could go to the auction as you have to be a dealer. Between bonding requirments, liability insurance, a place of business (not your house), a garage, capital to finance your inventory, etc. etc. it was just not something I wanted to risk.
.
And all that assumes I'm market savvy enough to pick out the cars I know I can make a profit on. Hey, I read Edmunds fora right? What more is there to learn?
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Good luck, and drop me an email. I'd be curious to know how you make out. My email addy is in my profile.
As far as your second point, yes that is what they are selling the car to you for. They don't include state fees because those are the states, not theirs. When you go into the grocery store or WalMart, those prices don't include tax. I don't know about where you live but where I sell outside Chicago, There are 3 different tax rates that vary 2 points depending on where you live. That is why we never quote a full Out the Door price unless we are asked and can get specific titling information.
Terry.
$200........? .. thats not enough to cover an auction fee, let alone the $1,000 deductible on any of the vehicles in the rolling inventory ...
You're talking "at least" $6,000 in basic liability insurance, at least another $6,000 in "basic" full coverage insurance, figure another $1,000 in plates .... then you need to be liquid, as in "Cashola" to cover the the last 2/3 vehicles you bought because the last 2 or 3 haven't sold yet, so now you're talkin' another $50/$60,000 in just the el cheapo stuff .... and lets not forget the little things you didn't catch the first time around like: tires, paintwork, wiper blades, detail work, the compressor is coughing up a lung on that last Contour, and "dang" - I didn't notice that windshield had a bullet hole in it ... and Speakin' of holes, you can wear a hole in your pocket in just a few weeks ...l.o.l.......
$200....? ... how about $200,000+ just to get up and rolling with Billy Bob's Barbeque and Used Car Emporium ... then what about next month.?
$200....? .. you can't buy your first months Ad's with that - or buy steam off a hotdog ............
Terry
1. He kept me waiting 20 minutes after I got there.
2. He started by showing me a car without the side curtain airbags that I had told him we had to have. His excuse was that he couldn't remembers little things about everyone.
3. The first car I came to see was sold last night, but he somehow didn't know that until he actually went to get the keys.
4. The second car was in a wreck yesterday, which he didn't know until he spent awhile wandering around the lot looking for it.
5. Now they are offering to do a dealer trade to get another one like my first choice and sell me a car at their cost. They say their invoice is $1000 more than Edmonds list because they are part of the Southern Toyota group (may have remembered name wrong). They also charge $399 for dealer fees, in addition to the destination charge of $595.
My questions are:
1. What are the chances it was a fluke that both cars I came to see weren't available?
2. If they sell it to me for their invoice, even with all the additional fees, it it still a fair price? Or, is this Southern Toyota thing something to avoid? To be honest, even if the price is fantastic, my confidence level is so low with them, I would probably be paranoid for the rest of the transaction if I did buy from them
"my confidence level is so low with them, I would probably be paranoid"
That would not matter to me. In my opinion, we buy a car, not the dealer. Once we drive the car off the lot, I forget about the dealer. I just enjoy the car.
If you re-visit the dealer, all you have to do is check to see if they have the car you want in stock. If you like it, then make an out-the-door offer. If they accept, cough up the dough and drive the car home.
If they start giving you double-talk, you can assume your offer has been declined and you can leave. Yes, it is that simple.
I would be even more concerned about accepting an invoice price that is inflated an additional $1000 as their invoice and then an additional $399 puff in price.
I'd look for another dealer in another part of the country and buy there or switch brands.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
ZERO. I have heard that... "It was in a wreck" and "it has already been sold" baloney so much it is sickening. Your salesman is a liar....who's using all the tricks in the book. If you are determined to buy at that dealership I would ask for another salesman. Going to another dealership you are just as likely to run into the same type of thing. Good luck.
Do they really think as we eneter 06 they can get over invoice for an 05?
Are they just playing hardball?
What are the current incentives from the factory to the dealer?
I'm tempted to wait till after Christmas and get an 06 if they will not move anymore.
Confused would be car buyer.
Red
Everyone gets busy .... but to make a customer wait 20 minutes is waaaaay to long .. the salesman should have introduced you to another salesperson discussed the facts briefly, then move to his current customer and "split" the deal with your new salesperson ........ as far as the "Southern Toyota group" - are saying SE Toyota...? ... what state do you live in.?
Terry.
Toyota just sent me a canned email listing all the disclaimers for Edmonds, Kelly, and 4 other sites pointing out the statements about the listed invoice doesn't include local advertising costs, etc.
Anyway, I think I'll go to the Honda dealership down the street from me, pay a little more, and get the 2006 Odyssey of my family's dreams.
Thanks for all your feedback. I was worried that I might have missed on a great deal just because I didn't like the way I was handled.
Make of Vehicle - Toyota
Model - Scion
Could this pose any problems in the future when it eventually gets transferred to a new owner?
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I looked at the V8s (which around here have a $1,500 rebate) but still coudln't get it close to under $30K. My V6, with the above options, was around $33K MSRP, however.
People are still buying trucks and SUVs in droves around OH. I don't know of any Toyota dealer who will sell at invoice minus the rebate. My dealer took my $500 over invoice (remember, I didn't use the rebate) offer and ran with it after a little "give & take". I forget the exact number, but it was somewhere in the 28ish range.
I believe most think this runup in gas prices based on the Katrina tradedy is termporary. So, that may have some bearing on it, too. Believe it or not, but hybrid HIghlanders are kind of languishing on the lots here, too.
I don't know where you live, but if you get any snow, 4Rs will be relatively in demand come December and the white stuff starts flying.
Toyota's marketing charges are real. You might want to take a look at what CarsDirect can get one for, or what Edmunds says they are selling for in your area to get a general idea of what you could buy one for.
In the "Prices Paid" forum, prices are all over the map. Again, I think it's because of the regional Toyota pricing differences that causes the wild swings.
Terry.
Do your homework. Find a salesperson you are comfortable with and can trust.
Then go back in with an offer like you own the place.
The SE region does indid have advertising that most times will not show on the invoice, it's based on current TV and future paper Ad's the dealer is charged with, it's very common for the SE region .... that's why if you read the Edmunds TMV and their pricing sources they indicate they don't show advertising costs ...... $1,000..? .. not on this planet, maybe $350 a copy .........
Terry.
Why does the car I'm looking at have a different invoice price or MSRP than what's listed on Edmunds.com?
Steve, Host
The offer they gave me was for a van they didn't even have on the lot, so even if the price was fantastic, I wasn't going to accept it. But, for academic purposes, here it is (give or take a few dollars, I didn't save the paper work):
2005 Sienna LE with package #6 (no mats or Toyoguard) in Blue
$26,700 (they showed me paperwork stating this was their cost for the car)
+ $595 destination fee
+ 3% tax
+ $399 paper work fee
+ $75 tag and misc. fees
=$28,587.85
Verses a 2006 Odyssey EX with a few dealer options added (roof rack, third row sun shade) for about $29,500 OTD (we haven't made a final decision on a few things, so we don't have a firm price yet). We would have saved an additional $300 more on the Sienna due to their lower finance offer on the remaining amount after our downpayment (1.9 verses Honda's 2.9 for the labor day weekend). We do not have a trade-in, so that was not part of the equation. In the end, I am paying about $1,300 total more for a car which we like better. (Cue all the posters who can't wait to tell me I'm paying too much for the Honda.)
I am perfectly satisfied with our choice to get a 2006 Honda, and my family is beyond excited - they love all the options of the seats in it. As an added bonus, the dealership is just 3 miles from my office, and offer shuttle service for any repairs or maintenance. Plus, they are very kid friendly - just a nice buying experience.
Sorry - forgot to add, there are other dealer options added to the Ody - meant cross bars (not roof rack), back-up assist (4 sensors), MP3 player, and all weather floor mats.
Thanks again for the help and support.
Midsize is doing just fine however.
We had one of our better months w/ the XC90.
Quite a few people trading in Tahoe's and Expedtions.
I don't know if you paid too much or not. However, since you bought a van that your family loves, you will be more inclined to keep it longer instead of trading it in after a couple years, and that is where you will save the money.
In my recent car buying adventures, I visited a few (around 8) different dealers. Some salesmen wouldn't walk up to me, but would go to men that came in after me (no, they didn't have appointments or know them.)
I had one sales manager tell me a vehicle only had ABS on the back - he said I couldn't see it since it was 'hidden'. I looked up the window sticker online - no ABS. The next night he denied saying it - "I never told you that". :surprise: I had others tell me that ABS and side air bags weren't as important as DVDs, but I got into that discussion earlier in this thread and won't rehash it. Another salesman said to me "Maybe you need a man to help you make this decision." I walked out.
My worst experience was at a local Ford dealer. Sales man was about my age. I was honey, baby, sweetie, dear and babe to him. "Don't move, babe." "Hey sweetie, I still got the Freestyle here for you." "Honey, what can I do to put you in this car?" I can honestly say that Ford lost a sale due to this dealer's tactics - bait and switch, stranding me when I had a scheduled appointment and general treatment of a female customer.
I bought a Subaru. Used. I was treated with respect and as an intelligent person by my salesman.
My question for the dealers - do you know how your staff treats customers? I sent an email to the Internet Manager detailing my complaints about the Ford man, but I don't believe it will do any good.
Buying a car is still harder for women, but I have heard of at least one good strategy to use when dealing with the sales folks. Take a man. A brother, a co-worker etc. Someone to be the decoy. You intiate the conversation and describe what you want. The salesguys will focus on the man and completely ignore you. After a while, the friend should say to the sales guy, " I don't know why you are talking to me. She's the one buying a car." At this point they are supposed to be overcome with embarassment and the rest is supposed to go smoothly.
So where are these things going then?
Not exactly tactful, but...
I find it hard to judge this situation. Especially if I have a "30-something" lady in looking at BMW's. Most of the time, I proceed just like she's the "decision maker" with the intent and means to buy something. Yet, when I ask her to buy the car, she says ... "Well, can you make a copy of this, I need to take and show it to my husband."
Well why isn't the husband, who appears to be an integral part of this purchase, not here. Sometimes it's as if they haven't spoken a word to each other about buying a car, and when I follow up to talk to the husband, he has a completely different take on everything. (Price, payments, car, etc.)
On the flip side, if I would have asked something like "Will anyone else be in on the decision," she is likely to get upset. Possibly leave and later call my GM (And that has happened to me before.)
I'm not trying to insult the lady. Heck, I know my wife is just as capable at buying a car as anyone. But I like to know where I stand and where she stands as well.
Now most of the time, I don't have to worry about this stuff because she will say something like "my husband just sent me out to look at some and see what I like."
By the way, I would never, never, neverevereverever, refer to a lady as sweetie, babe or honey. That is so disrespectful.
Thanks!
I say.. "Great, but I have to run this by the wife... neither one of us makes major financial decisions without the other's input".
Sure, it is just a way to step back, and reassess, before making a commitment. So, even if it isn't exactly true, it is a way to delay making a major decision. It really doesn't matter if the wife or husband has to be consulted, or whether the buyer even has a wife or husband..
I'm sure a lot of BMW buyers have the resources that makes the purchase the same as if I were buying a Honda Civic.. But, I think there are plenty who are making a major financial purchase that is extending their car buying budget to the maximum... That brings along a whole different set of anxieties to the table..
regards,
kyfdx
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But when you are led to believe she, or he for that matter, is ready to buy and then drops that bomb on you, it's maddening.
Thanks!
Commission sales is all about closing... Not a job that I would be good at.. I never know when to stop talking..
regards,
kyfdx
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Sorry I just couldn't leave that one out there.
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A dealership I have been trying to work with (on every car they wont give me anything beyond employee financing and 2000 total in rebates, not even a cargo mat)... has just told me they had got another vibe.. one that was purchased a few weeks ago, but the finincing couldnt go through so it was returned. they are saying they are selling it new.
so he quoted me the price of the car minus the employee pricing and rebates, and said that there might bbe a little room to work with it.
they say it has 1500 miles on it.
http://www.pontiac.com/ws/nvlWindowSticker.pg?makeId=002&year=2005&modelId=85&postalCode=3- 0269&pvc=240&mmc=2SL26&VIN=5Y2SL63865Z449173&GMS=junebug&isGMFF=true&isbp=true&originating- Brand=VIBE
My friend says I should run away. that this is a shady thing some dealers do. that it cant be considered new if it has been titled.
I want to know how much i could get off the price because of those miles, and can i still buy it as 'new' (minus the price) to use my GM card that has to be on a new car.
on a side note, the dealer fee on all their cars at the place is $599
what do you guys think?
1) If the financing "fell through", then the car was never titled.. You don't get title to the car, until the dealer has been paid..
2) The $599 "dealer fee" should be considered part of the selling price.. If this is the case, then this dealer is charging the employee price plus $599. If they insist on this fee, I'd find some place cheaper to do business.
regards,
kyfdx
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how much of a discount should I be able to get with the fact it has 1500 miles on it?
Don't ask the customer any questions.
A customer comes into your store to get information, not to answer a bunch of silly questions. The best way to help the customer is to answer their questions in a pleasant manner.
If you a good sales person, you should be able to tell pretty quickly if the customer is serious or not.
here is an example of the math he is giving me...
MSRP: 19830.00
after employee discount: 17994.55
-2000 (rebate and switiching from a jeep rebate)
brings us to = 15994.55
= taxes (whish he says is 6% sales tax, 599 dealer fee, and 44 tag)
this brings us to 17755.16
( it then can figure in my GM card)...
now is that on the up or up, or is he playing the dealer fee twice?
They wont give me anything..not even fthe cargo mat. when i asked about a promise on a certain ammount to drive my used car up there , they suggested I donate it (heh)..
Your feedback is really appreciated. like to nail down this purchase by tommorow noon.
I'm sorry, but I disagree. Respectfully, of course. Here's what I mean:
If I didn't ask questions, how in the world would I know what would best fit the customer's needs - both men and women. It's not like they are buying a can of beans.
If I don't ask questions, I might as well be a web page...
Since when is it a silly question when I ask "What sort of features, options, colors etc., are you looking for?"
Beleive it or not, everybody doesn't just spill their guts when you say hello.
If I don't try to find out what particulars they are looking for, then I am no help.
"If you a good sales person, you should be able to tell pretty quickly if the customer is serious or not."
Agreed.
Thanks!
If you were really a GM Employee, they wouldn't be allowed to charge this fee on your deal..
If it were me (and it isn't), I wouldn't buy a car from this dealer, unless they removed the fee.. $600 is a lot of extra money on a $16K car!!
I'd shop around, and find another dealer...
regards,
kyfdx
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