Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations

stever

It's been 45 years since I was in Nassau***, but back then it was mostly scooters and pickups, and lots of people on foot. Puerto Rico was notable a few years back - had a rental car and don't remember gas prices, but do remember vegging out in the parking lot of some "state" attraction while my wife was buying something inside. An employee cruised down to the parking lot in a golf car and stopped next to a Jeep parked an aisle away. He then put a few gallons of gas in the Jeep from a jerry can he had hauled on the back of the golf car. Looked to me like he was borrowing some "state" gas, and at $4.50 a gallon, I guess you can't blame him.

If any place needs fleets of Leafs and Volts charged by panels, it's down there.

The local Caddy/Chevy dealer is running a quarter page ad this morning looking for sales reps. $60 to $100k the first year. Doubt that I could deal with all the liars and by that I mean the customers....

roadburner

driver100 said:

Rather than get a $3000 car which may be a money pit, I would consider this 2008 Cadillac for $12000. It is being sold at a Ford dealer, it will be certified, Carfax report. They have a 2008 MKZ for $10k. These are pretty solid cars that can last a long time (hopefully).

Those Cadillacs ARE pretty durable, but unlike the CTS and ATS, you just really can't feel comfortable in a Caddy of that vintage unless you are wearing plaid Ban-Lon pants with white shoes and belt.

And an "Ask Me About My Grandchildren" bumper sticker...

fezo

I'm liking oldfarmer's Century. Driven only by a little old man.1/4 mile at a time....

roadburner

Like this?

houdini1

roadburner said:

driver100 said:

Rather than get a $3000 car which may be a money pit, I would consider this 2008 Cadillac for $12000. It is being sold at a Ford dealer, it will be certified, Carfax report. They have a 2008 MKZ for $10k. These are pretty solid cars that can last a long time (hopefully).

Those Cadillacs ARE pretty durable, but unlike the CTS and ATS, you just really can't feel comfortable in a Caddy of that vintage unless you are wearing plaid Ban-Lon pants with white shoes and belt.

And an "Ask Me About My Grandchildren" bumper sticker...

So....what's your point ?

robr2

roadburner said:

driver100 said:

Rather than get a $3000 car which may be a money pit, I would consider this 2008 Cadillac for $12000. It is being sold at a Ford dealer, it will be certified, Carfax report. They have a 2008 MKZ for $10k. These are pretty solid cars that can last a long time (hopefully).

Those Cadillacs ARE pretty durable, but unlike the CTS and ATS, you just really can't feel comfortable in a Caddy of that vintage unless you are wearing plaid Ban-Lon pants with white shoes and belt.

And an "Ask Me About My Grandchildren" bumper sticker...

For my job, I'd consider one. I drive all over New England, need reliability and space to haul samples and visiting national sales managers. When my Passat dies, something like that or maybe this might do the trick:

2004 Buick LeSabre $9000 37K miles

Mr_Shiftright

An old Audi A6 twin turbo? Tell you what--picture yourself riding on a cobblestone street, and in the back seat is a hand grenade with a very loose pin.

nyccarguy

Maintenance question

Reading my Pilot's owner's manual it says to replace the timing belt at 60K if your vehicle is driven in extreme temperatures (over 110 degrees or below minus 10). While I don't drive in those conditions, should I just have it done (along with the h20 pump) at 60K or wait until the maintenance minder tells me to?

imidazol97

fezo said:

Those Cadillacs ARE pretty durable, but unlike the CTS and ATS, you just really can't feel comfortable in a Caddy of that vintage unless you are wearing plaid Ban-Lon pants with white shoes and belt.

And an "Ask Me About My Grandchildren" bumper sticker...

Now that's the kind of exaggeration that continues to misrepresent the GM image...
The people with Ban-Lon plaid pants, white shoes, and an "Ask me..." are all in FL
driving BMWs thinking they're reliving their youth. Or they have a Toyota of some
flavor, at least the ones here in Ohio.

graphicguy

Those body on frame Lincolns and Caddys have proven drivetrains and had the "kinks" worked out of them a long time ago. Do they handle well? Nope. But, they sure are comfy with a ton of room inside....usually with all the amenities anyone would need.

Generally, they're well cared for, too.

I like "old peoples' iron". If looking for a 2nd car, that's what I'd be looking for.

robr2

nyccarguy said:

Maintenance question

Reading my Pilot's owner's manual it says to replace the timing belt at 60K if your vehicle is driven in extreme temperatures (over 110 degrees or below minus 10). While I don't drive in those conditions, should I just have it done (along with the h20 pump) at 60K or wait until the maintenance minder tells me to?

Bradd - that recommendation is for people who drive regularly in those conditions. You and I drive in similar conditions. I never replaced the timing belts in any of my Hondas per that recommendation. My 91 Accord was done at 90K. My 08 Accord was totaled at 98K with the original timing belt. My 00 Odyssey didn't have the belt done until 124K/13 years old - Honda says 105K/7 years. Yes, it was stupid of me to go that long.

Now YMMV so do what you feel comfortable with.

houdini1

roadburner said:

driver100 said:

Rather than get a $3000 car which may be a money pit, I would consider this 2008 Cadillac for $12000. It is being sold at a Ford dealer, it will be certified, Carfax report. They have a 2008 MKZ for $10k. These are pretty solid cars that can last a long time (hopefully).

Those Cadillacs ARE pretty durable, but unlike the CTS and ATS, you just really can't feel comfortable in a Caddy of that vintage unless you are wearing plaid Ban-Lon pants with white shoes and belt.

And an "Ask Me About My Grandchildren" bumper sticker...

So....what's your point ?

nyccarguy said:

Maintenance question

Reading my Pilot's owner's manual it says to replace the timing belt at 60K if your vehicle is driven in extreme temperatures (over 110 degrees or below minus 10). While I don't drive in those conditions, should I just have it done (along with the h20 pump) at 60K or wait until the maintenance minder tells me to?

NYC, you must be wanting a new ride. I always buy a new one just after I have spent a lot of preventive maintenance, new tires, etc. Kidding aside, you are probably good to at least 100K.

fezo

I'm thinking our $3K Camry guy is a one and done poster. Either that or he hates what he's hearing so much that he won't speak to us....

graphicguy

fezo said:

I'm thinking our $3K Camry guy is a one and done poster. Either that or he hates what he's hearing so much that he won't speak to us....

Fezo....his post was a bit sketchy. His insurance paying? Someone else's insurance? No insurance? Was he actually the perpetrator? I think when we tried to get details, he backed away.

nyccarguy

robr2 said:

nyccarguy said:

Maintenance question

Reading my Pilot's owner's manual it says to replace the timing belt at 60K if your vehicle is driven in extreme temperatures (over 110 degrees or below minus 10). While I don't drive in those conditions, should I just have it done (along with the h20 pump) at 60K or wait until the maintenance minder tells me to?

Bradd - that recommendation is for people who drive regularly in those conditions. You and I drive in similar conditions. I never replaced the timing belts in any of my Hondas per that recommendation. My 91 Accord was done at 90K. My 08 Accord was totaled at 98K with the original timing belt. My 00 Odyssey didn't have the belt done until 124K/13 years old - Honda says 105K/7 years. Yes, it was stupid of me to go that long.

Now YMMV so do what you feel comfortable with.

Thanks rob (& others). I think I replaced the TB on my Prelude around 76K miles. I'll just wait until there is a "4" on maintenance minder (code for timing belt service). We've curbed the Pilot's mileage to a little over 12K per year. It continues to be a great truck that serves our family of 5 well. Last night I did a Costco run that included the purchase of a new twin mattress for our 3 year old. Everything fit without any drama.

@houdini‌

Well I am a card carrying member of Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous;). It is always tempting to look into switching out, especially since I've got some equity in it. It will be 4 years old this May & paid off by May 2016;)

roadburner

imidazol97 said:

fezo said:

Those Cadillacs ARE pretty durable, but unlike the CTS and ATS, you just really can't feel comfortable in a Caddy of that vintage unless you are wearing plaid Ban-Lon pants with white shoes and belt.

And an "Ask Me About My Grandchildren" bumper sticker...

Now that's the kind of exaggeration that continues to misrepresent the GM image...
The people with Ban-Lon plaid pants, white shoes, and an "Ask me..." are all in FL
driving BMWs thinking they're reliving their youth. Or they have a Toyota of some
flavor, at least the ones here in Ohio.

Just the "old" GM image; you don't seriously think that the age of that average DTS driver is under 60, do you?
The latest info on Cadillac ownership I found was a cite to a 2013 Strategic Vision study- average Cadillac owner age was 65, BMW was 48. Though I'd expect Cadillac to have dropped a bit and BMW to have increased.

Judging by the number of Avalons and Camrys running around with permanently activated turn indicators, I would say Toyota is poaching from Buick showrooms...

isellhondas

nyccarguy said:

Maintenance question

Reading my Pilot's owner's manual it says to replace the timing belt at 60K if your vehicle is driven in extreme temperatures (over 110 degrees or below minus 10). While I don't drive in those conditions, should I just have it done (along with the h20 pump) at 60K or wait until the maintenance minder tells me to?

The maintenance minder isn't likely to tell you when to change your timing belt. I would change it at 100,000 miles along with the water pump, belts and front seal.

Then you can take it easy for awhile.

jayrider

roadburner said:

imidazol97 said:

fezo said:

Those Cadillacs ARE pretty durable, but unlike the CTS and ATS, you just really can't feel comfortable in a Caddy of that vintage unless you are wearing plaid Ban-Lon pants with white shoes and belt.

And an "Ask Me About My Grandchildren" bumper sticker...

Now that's the kind of exaggeration that continues to misrepresent the GM image...
The people with Ban-Lon plaid pants, white shoes, and an "Ask me..." are all in FL
driving BMWs thinking they're reliving their youth. Or they have a Toyota of some
flavor, at least the ones here in Ohio.

Just the "old" GM image; you don't seriously think that the age of that average DTS driver is under 60, do you?
The latest info on Cadillac ownership I found was a cite to a 2013 Strategic Vision study- average Cadillac owner age was 65, BMW was 48. Though I'd expect Cadillac to have dropped a bit and BMW to have increased.

Judging by the number of Avalons and Camrys running around with permanently activated turn indicators, I would say Toyota is poaching from Buick showrooms...

My LaCrosse beeps a warning if you leave the turn signal on.

oldfarmer50

stickguy said:

old farmer is probably calling right now.

Ha ha if only you knew how much I wanted to. It meets all my criteria: low milage, rust free and CHEAP.

oldfarmer50

driver100 said:

Rather than get a $3000 car which may be a money pit, I would consider this 2008 Cadillac for $12000. It is being sold at a Ford dealer, it will be certified, Carfax report. They have a 2008 MKZ for $10k. These are pretty solid cars that can last a long time (hopefully).

As long as it didn't have the Northstar engine. Although I guess by 2008 they corrected the head gasket issue.

I always thought those old style DTS ( Devilles) would be nice cars for not a lot of money.

oldfarmer50

robr2 said:

roadburner said:

driver100 said:

Rather than get a $3000 car which may be a money pit, I would consider this 2008 Cadillac for $12000. It is being sold at a Ford dealer, it will be certified, Carfax report. They have a 2008 MKZ for $10k. These are pretty solid cars that can last a long time (hopefully).

Those Cadillacs ARE pretty durable, but unlike the CTS and ATS, you just really can't feel comfortable in a Caddy of that vintage unless you are wearing plaid Ban-Lon pants with white shoes and belt.

And an "Ask Me About My Grandchildren" bumper sticker...

For my job, I'd consider one. I drive all over New England, need reliability and space to haul samples and visiting national sales managers. When my Passat dies, something like that or maybe this might do the trick:

2004 Buick LeSabre $9000 37K miles

By that stage GM had cured every problem with the 3.8L engine. If you couldn't get at least another $100k miles out if that car I'd be surprised. Totally unexciting but dependable and comfortable.

I'm always impressed how comfortable my old Lincoln is.

driver100

fezo said:

I'm thinking our $3K Camry guy is a one and done poster. Either that or he hates what he's hearing so much that he won't speak to us....

I don't usually post on other topic sites so let me know if he ever gets back...and tell me where to find it.

driver100

jayrider said:

roadburner said:

imidazol97 said:

fezo said:

Those Cadillacs ARE pretty durable, but unlike the CTS and ATS, you just really can't feel comfortable in a Caddy of that vintage unless you are wearing plaid Ban-Lon pants with white shoes and belt.

And an "Ask Me About My Grandchildren" bumper sticker...

Now that's the kind of exaggeration that continues to misrepresent the GM image...
The people with Ban-Lon plaid pants, white shoes, and an "Ask me..." are all in FL
driving BMWs thinking they're reliving their youth. Or they have a Toyota of some
flavor, at least the ones here in Ohio.

Just the "old" GM image; you don't seriously think that the age of that average DTS driver is under 60, do you?
The latest info on Cadillac ownership I found was a cite to a 2013 Strategic Vision study- average Cadillac owner age was 65, BMW was 48. Though I'd expect Cadillac to have dropped a bit and BMW to have increased.

Judging by the number of Avalons and Camrys running around with permanently activated turn indicators, I would say Toyota is poaching from Buick showrooms...

My LaCrosse beeps a warning if you leave the turn signal on.

Only Buick would think of that!

oldfarmer50

nyccarguy said:

Maintenance question

Reading my Pilot's owner's manual it says to replace the timing belt at 60K if your vehicle is driven in extreme temperatures (over 110 degrees or below minus 10). While I don't drive in those conditions, should I just have it done (along with the h20 pump) at 60K or wait until the maintenance minder tells me to?

You could probably go another 20k miles without trouble but why chance it considering the potential damage to today's interference engines. If you're planing on selling soon I'd say no but otherwise...

imidazol97

Driver100 said:

jayrider said:

My LaCrosse beeps a warning if you leave the turn signal on.

Only Buick would think of that!

All my leSabres have had that feature. It was a warranty issue and Buick found so many of its turn signals were being burned out by drivers who left them on that they added the bells to remind folks. They actually had one person who drove from Ohio to their winter home in Florida with the right turn signal on all the way.

henryn

imidazol97 said:

Driver100 said:

jayrider said:

My LaCrosse beeps a warning if you leave the turn signal on.

Only Buick would think of that!

All my leSabres have had that feature. It was a warranty issue and Buick found so many of its turn signals were being burned out by drivers who left them on that they added the bells to remind folks. They actually had one person who drove from Ohio to their home in Florida with the right turn signal on all the way.

My 2005 Tahoe has that feature as well. As I discovered to my chagrin the other day!

graphicguy

driver100 said:

Driver, something I have come to grips with since driving Mercedes automobiles is living the experience of being pampered.  I never used to feel that way, however since my buying, driving, service and ambiance experiences have been that of being spoiled rotten, I have learned to live with the "snobbish" pursuit of driving perfection.

Mike, I feel pampered in a different way. I thought my 535 bmw was about as nice as a car can be. The E400 is so much more comfortable and the interior is so much more luxurious, when I am sitting in the car I feel like I am in a dream car. From the fine materials to the well thought out design to the ultimate comfort...I can't believe they could make a car so refined.

The dealership experience adds to that.......truly a Taj Mahal, and you could eat off the service area floor. They answer all questions immediately and politely. I feel like I am treated like a King....by the dealer and just by sitting in my E..



Excellent post. I think most dealers are trying to up their customer service game. Even the wife's service at Honda includes a dealership with office cubicals,wifi, printer, keurig coffee maker.

My Caddy dealer has a wood panelled conference room, fompletenwoth big screen display with complimentary Skype. They have Starbucks, petit fours, pastries. Don't neec that.

I bring the car in for service, sit in waiting room with recliners until the service person brings the key for my loaner.

And my Audi dealer wonders why they can't entice me to come back for a visit.

driver100

henryn said:

imidazol97 said:

Driver100 said:

jayrider said:

My LaCrosse beeps a warning if you leave the turn signal on.

Only Buick would think of that!

All my leSabres have had that feature. It was a warranty issue and Buick found so many of its turn signals were being burned out by drivers who left them on that they added the bells to remind folks. They actually had one person who drove from Ohio to their home in Florida with the right turn signal on all the way.

My 2005 Tahoe has that feature as well. As I discovered to my chagrin the other day!

What's next, a low blood sugar warning?

(I will go on the record as saying Buick is making fine well made automobiles these days. I found these facts:

The average age of Buick buyers has dropped to 57, from 64 five years ago. “And that’s as the average age for the industry is going up,” .

The Regal, a German-engineered sport sedan from General Motors’ European Opel brand, is largely responsible for Buick’s more youthful appeal. Its buyers are the youngest in the brand’s small portfolio, with an average age of 43. Even more telling, almost half of the Regal’s buyers come from import brands.)

jayrider

driver100 said:

jayrider said:

roadburner said:

imidazol97 said:

fezo said:

Those Cadillacs ARE pretty durable, but unlike the CTS and ATS, you just really can't feel comfortable in a Caddy of that vintage unless you are wearing plaid Ban-Lon pants with white shoes and belt.

And an "Ask Me About My Grandchildren" bumper sticker...

Now that's the kind of exaggeration that continues to misrepresent the GM image...
The people with Ban-Lon plaid pants, white shoes, and an "Ask me..." are all in FL
driving BMWs thinking they're reliving their youth. Or they have a Toyota of some
flavor, at least the ones here in Ohio.

Just the "old" GM image; you don't seriously think that the age of that average DTS driver is under 60, do you?
The latest info on Cadillac ownership I found was a cite to a 2013 Strategic Vision study- average Cadillac owner age was 65, BMW was 48. Though I'd expect Cadillac to have dropped a bit and BMW to have increased.

Judging by the number of Avalons and Camrys running around with permanently activated turn indicators, I would say Toyota is poaching from Buick showrooms...

My LaCrosse beeps a warning if you leave the turn signal on.

Only Buick would think of that!

They know their customers !!

explorerx4

Check off 2015. Traded 2002 Explorer for CPO 2013 Escape.
Mid level SEL AWD 2.0 heated seats.

Michaell

explorerx4 said:

Check off 2015. Traded 2002 Explorer for CPO 2013 Escape.
Mid level SEL AWD 2.0 heated seats.

Let me be the first to congratulate you.

driver100

explorerx4 said:

Check off 2015. Traded 2002 Explorer for CPO 2013 Escape.
Mid level SEL AWD 2.0 heated seats.

And, I'll be the second. Looks great!

oldfarmer50

driver100 said:

explorerx4 said:

Check off 2015. Traded 2002 Explorer for CPO 2013 Escape.
Mid level SEL AWD 2.0 heated seats.

And, I'll be the second. Looks great!

Very nice. Nice color for that vehicle, looks classy.

roadburner

Nice!!!

houdini1

explorerx4 said:

Check off 2015. Traded 2002 Explorer for CPO 2013 Escape.
Mid level SEL AWD 2.0 heated seats.

Nice explorerx4. Your driveway looks awfully crowded in that pic.

explorerx4

My big decision was to decide if I should going from splitting 99% of my driving from 2 vehicles to 1.
Decided to not drop down a vehicle. I really like my Fusion, so the other choice was to replace the Explorer.
My wife and I test drove a 2012 Limited with everything except Nav and a mid level 2013 SEL.
She drove a 2009 Limited for 4 years with the same drivetrain as the 2012 I was considering. I liked it, except the brakes seemed a bit soft to me. She thought the engine didn't sound quite right and we both liked how the 2013 drove, so we decided on that one.
I decided on my numbers beforehand and the dealer exactly met them, so I didn't counter.

qbrozen

driver100 said:

Agreed! I would consider going Cadillac, but, it wouldn't be easy. I'd have to really feel I was going to be getting something superior. But price would matter because even if the cars are comparable, why change unless the Cadillac is either a better car, or is substantially lower in price? I do believe if it ain't broken don't fix it. I wouldn't change to save a few bucks, but, I would expect to pay less for a car which hasn't got a proven track record.

well, we probably all know I'm not the typical shopper, but this is the choice I made. If you didn't follow along, I was shopping Porsche, Jag, Benz, and BMW. The Caddy was cheaper (after rebates) AND I found it nicer AND it outperforms all the others. I'm also a former Benz and BMW owner (although, to be fair, only old benzes).

Mr_Shiftright

Drove a lo miles '96 C4 Corvette today, black on black, very tidy car, to see if I could get used to an automatic in a car like this.

The answer is NO.

qbrozen

An old 4-speed slushbox? Good god, no.

stickguy

Bradd, wait until the normal interval recommended.

roadburner

@‌isellhondas
A friend is looking for a car for her son, one of the vehicles she is looking at is a 2004 CRV. Anything to watch out for? I steered her towards the car because I thought it would be the best choice based on how much she had to spend.

driver100

qbrozen said:

driver100 said:

Agreed! I would consider going Cadillac, but, it wouldn't be easy. I'd have to really feel I was going to be getting something superior. But price would matter because even if the cars are comparable, why change unless the Cadillac is either a better car, or is substantially lower in price? I do believe if it ain't broken don't fix it. I wouldn't change to save a few bucks, but, I would expect to pay less for a car which hasn't got a proven track record.

well, we probably all know I'm not the typical shopper, but this is the choice I made. If you didn't follow along, I was shopping Porsche, Jag, Benz, and BMW. The Caddy was cheaper (after rebates) AND I found it nicer AND it outperforms all the others. I'm also a former Benz and BMW owner (although, to be fair, only old benzes).

I did follow along and understand why you went with a Cadillac. I also know you like to be a bit different, and that's OK too - I get that. I still think "MOST" typical MB, BMW, and Audi drivers won't even think to try Cadillac. I am guessing that is the problem Cadillac has right now...the cars are obviously good. Getting people to switch is very difficult - especially if they like what they are already driving, and first they have to get to the showroom.

bwia

I will repeat that surprising statistic. Although luxury automobiles make up only 5% of the auto industry sales they however generate over 50% of auto makers profit. So a shout out to you guys for subsidizing my driving addiction.

imidazol97

driver100 said:

I still think "MOST" typical MB, BMW, and Audi drivers won't even think to try Cadillac. I am guessing that is the problem Cadillac has right now...the cars are obviously good. Getting people to switch is very difficult - especially if they like what they are already driving, and first they have to get to the showroom.

Good analysis of the attitude and image. Honda has a major coverup problem with potential deaths and injuries (1700 reported) possibly that could have been reduced were the problems reported to NHTSA and no one thinks that is a major problem. GM had a problem and it's hashed over and over. Then the older owner image of Cadillac (and nee Buick) is brought out to reinforce the negative image. I wonder what the demographics of buyers looks like for Audi, Honda Acura, Toyota Lexus look like for their sedans exclusive of the SUVs which move the owners' age downward?

oldfarmer50

roadburner said:

@‌isellhondas
A friend is looking for a car for her son, one of the vehicles she is looking at is a 2004 CRV. Anything to watch out for? I steered her towards the car because I thought it would be the best choice based on how much she had to spend.

Anything to watch out for? How about the price? Never saw people ask for so much for miled up old cars.

Mr_Shiftright

Fortunately, right after I took the C4 out and endured the slushbox tedium, I got a chance to drive a '68 Firebird 400/335HP convertible with 4-speed. It had all the nice modern mods you want in an old car---better brakes, suspension, ignition, tires--whilst still retaining an utterly stock appearance. It was a real pleasure to drive a car that talks back to you on so many levels.

But for a 500 mile trip? No way. Those older muscle cars wind up pretty tight on the freeway. It needs a 5 speed or 6 speed.

It would be fun to own one car from each decade, 60s through 2010s. The 80s will take some soul-searching though.

qbrozen said:

An old 4-speed slushbox? Good god, no.

graphicguy

I think there's a luxury car buyer shift. The BMW and Benz marques are moving away from the sp;forty aspect of their mainstream lux cars and Cadillac is adding the performance that those brands abandoned. Just hearing drive and Mike talk about their E class, that seems readily apparent. Two different kinds of buyers.

Maybe Cadillac abandoned that demographic too soon. Maybe BMW and Mercedes know where their market is going (softer, cushier). Nothing wrong with their approach. But, Cadillac seems to be hell bent on sticking with the performance luxury product.

They've done a really good job with the product. They compete well with anything in their segments...especially the ATS and the CTS, in whatever guise you can find them.

Snap up theses cars at the prices they're charging, because I can't imagine this is going to last much longer. The market will notice. Doesn't happen very often....great car, exceedingly well built, great materials, great driving dynamics, ground breaking (and functional) tech, can cruise with the best of them, can rock with the best of them. Styling is subjective, but I don't know if there are any better looking cars in the segment these Caddies compete in.

I don't know of any other manufacturer whose warranty is better....with all maintenance included (BMW maybe?) for 4 years. My dealership is as nice as any I've been in, including Lexus (quite a turnaround from several years ago).

If they got my attention, as an amateur car buff and higher end car shopper, I think they're going to be alright. Just have to stay the course.

driver100

graphicguy said:

I think there's a luxury car buyer shift. The BMW and Benz marques are moving away from the sp;forty aspect of their mainstream lux cars and Cadillac is adding the performance that those brands abandoned. Just hearing drive and Mike talk about their E class, that seems readily apparent. Two different kinds of buyers.

Maybe Cadillac abandoned that demographic too soon. Maybe BMW and Mercedes know where their market is going (softer, cushier). Nothing wrong with their approach. But, Cadillac seems to be hell bent on sticking with the performance luxury product.

They've done a really good job with the product. They compete well with anything in their segments...especially the ATS and the CTS, in whatever guise you can find them.

Snap up theses cars at the prices they're charging, because I can't imagine this is going to last much longer. The market will notice. Doesn't happen very often....great car, exceedingly well built, great materials, great driving dynamics, ground breaking (and functional) tech, can cruise with the best of them, can rock with the best of them. Styling is subjective, but I don't know if there are any better looking cars in the segment these Caddies compete in.

I don't know of any other manufacturer whose warranty is better....with all maintenance included (BMW maybe?) for 4 years. My dealership is as nice as any I've been in, including Lexus (quite a turnaround from several years ago).

If they got my attention, as an amateur car buff and higher end car shopper, I think they're going to be alright. Just have to stay the course.

GG, heres the average age of luxury car buyers, The average Lexus buyer is 61, compared with 61 for Lincoln, 54 for Mercedes, 49 for BMW, and 48 for Audi, and the average Cadillac buyer is 59. Cadillac is going for a younger customer, but my guess is bmw and Mercedes would like younger buyers, but are pushing to keep their aging fans. I think I am a good example, I like a car with great handling, but, now comfort and luxury are becoming more important to me. Mercedes attracted me more than bmw would. Cadillac seems strong on performance with a good balance of luxury, but seems to be going after a younger demographic with more performance.

Cadillac really has it's work cut out for i with bmw, Audi and Mercedes trying to grab more of the pie in that all important luxury car market. A really good article that explains it well is this one:
CAN THE NEW CADILLAC CATCH UP TO BMW

roadburner

I heard an interesting story today. A friend of mine in our small group at church is a diehard Corvette enthusiast, and recently bought one of the first C7s. When he was looking at the car that he ended up buying he asked the sales guy if it had Magnetic Selective Ride Control and the sales guy said yes. He bought the car and-just like the two Car and Driver Corvettes, his C7 now needs a new engine(the rod bearings are shot- at 6,000 miles). To add insult to injury, while looking at his car in the service bay the tech told him his pride and joy does not have MSRC. He's going to stop by and talk to the sales guy to see if he can trade up to a C7 with MSRC at an advantageous price since he is a long-time customer. I'll let you know what happens.

I'll say one thing, I don't care what brand it was, I'd be absolutely livid if I spent big bucks on an exclusive high performance car and the motor went south at 6,000 miles. My friend showed me a picture of the poor sled in the service bay- the whole subframe had to be removed- including the front suspension. Mechanical bits everywhere. Sad.

stickguy

I still think it will never be the same, no matter how carefully they try to put it back together.