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There has been a lot of good advice from well qualified people in this thread. Just because it gets a little uncomfortable does not mean it can't be of some use for other people who are really looking for advice.
According to the HONDA web site their "certified" used cars are 'checked for scratches and scuffmarks on the wheel covers and the doors and fenders. They do not state how noticeable the blemishes must be before they attempt to remove them.
Tyden made the error of believing what the car salesman said. In most circumstances, you talk with someone, you believe what they say, they do what they say they're gonna (or fail to, aplogize, and make a real attempt to make it right) and everything goes smoothly. In this case, it didn't go that way - to say the least. Mistaking this for a normal circumstance, as I think Tyden did, she's outraged. Being outraged strikes me as reasonable, but . . . Being outraged in this circumstance is certainly unrealistic. Kinda like the analogy about calling a group of Hells Angels sissies. Most normal folk won't kick your rear for such a comment, although it is impolite; but a group of Hells Angels might well put you in the hospital, and feel entirely justified in doing so. With most people, believing what thay say works out fine. Not so in the context of buying a car.
So, Tyden, I STILL don't think you're crazy or unreasonable. It should be clear to you, though, from what's happened here and at the dealership, that believing what your car salesman says is an unrealistic course of action. I guess that includes me in the group that says 'you should expect nothing', though I'm not inclined to join in the criticism you've received. Believe your own eyes; believe your gut; do what you need to do. You're dealing with a different breed of cat here. It's wild, but it's true. Don't say "USED" out loud, LOL. Say "USED CAR SALESMAN".
I decided to see what else is being posted... RIVERTOWN-
I can appreciate what you're saying. It was my inexperience that got me in trouble, I realized that once I spoke with the owner. I expected a "business man" to do what he said he would, that won't happen again.
I went to the dealer and if you saw my paperwork, they can't even get that right. I was promised by the owner that I would get copies of ALL of the maintenance and work papers that they have on my car. Well I get two invoices that have the prices whited out, a clean copy of my carfax report because the one I received was by fax and very messy. That is it. No other work and not even the certification check list. I'm very disappointed about that. They say their getting me a owners manual and they say they did another alignment, it was late so I'm not sure if the problem is fixed, I'll get to drive it more tomorrow, but the paperwork has errors all over it. I don't even have the energy to list all of the errors.
I appreciate everyone who responded to give me helpful and constructive criticism the way rivertown and some others did. Thank you. Hopefully the alignment worked and I can get the paperwork straightened out, then I will be satisfied. They still didn't fulfill everything that was agreed upon but corrected paperwork would really make my month at this point. The manager wasn't in so I couldn't address it with anyone in authority. Thanks alot, some of you guys really helped me.
FWIW, I still get flabbergasted when a car salesperson says one thing and then does another. LOL, most people just don't that. It's weird.
I'm glad you got to some sort of improved spot. Were it me and even if I were satisfied with the alignment, I'd follow up with the Honda Zone Customer Service rep. IF the car is Honda certified, he/she may want to have the car gone over by another dealer - to protect Honda from a warranty claim for work that the original dealer should have, but may not have, done.
you're right. I might have to call customer service anyways if they won't fix the paperwork. I'm not sure if any harm can come out of the errors they made on paper but one way or the other, I believe I'm entitled to a complete copy of everything they did to the car and for it to be correct. I'm not going to argue with anyone anymore. I'm just going to simply ask and if they say no, I'll ask for an explaination and take it to the next step. I've documented everything. So far, they are ALMOST meeting me half way. Thanks.
"Don't trust car sales people, make sure you understand all of the paperwork, and make sure they are filling it out right. You basically have to know their job and do it for them."
GOOD for you! I'm really glad things are moving in the right direction, and I think you should give yourself credit for being able to turn some things around.
"I'm not going to argue with anyone anymore. I'm just going to simply ask and if they say no, I'll ask for an explaination and take it to the next step. I've documented everything."
"Never wrestle with a pig. All you'll get is dirty, and the pig enjoys it." ~ Mark Twain
Post #22 on this discussion has not been addressed as yet. This is really important. Lots of unscrupulous dealers pass off their own certification as the actual Honda certification. Usually a reputable Honda dealer always has an inventory of Honda certified used cars and does not charge $500 or another amount to have any car on the lot certified. A manufacturer certified used car has to meet certain minimum standards before being certified. The point is if it's Honda certified you can take it to any Honda dealer afterwards if you are not satisfied with the current dealer.
I bought a certified ("Starmarked") used 1998 Mercedes E320 last October, which I found on the internet through the national Mercedes-Benz website. When I was shopping around, a MB dealer tried to pass off a car as starmarked/certified but when I checked the MB website for this car using the VIN it was not listed. To confirm, I called MB and they said that this car was not MB certified. The point I am trying to make is that there are all types of unethical dealers out there just waiting to rip you off!
To get back to the car I bought, the MB dealer repaired all exterior and interior scratches, cleaned, polished, and went the whole nine yards on it! When I took delivery, the car looked and felt brand new!
Tydenmal, I bought a certified used car about 1 year ago.Dealer did a complete servicing of the car,(at least his maintence records say he did)and a inside and out detailing.Car looked brand new.I guess each manufacturer must have different standards for their certified used car program or as ghomaz suggests maybe it is only dealer certified not Honda certified.
They gave me a Honda certified used car warranty booklet, they said its Honda certified and the purchase agreement or invoice, not sure which one it is, in the big box that says optional equipment and accessories down the side, it says Honda certified vehicle but then it says on the other document which I believe that is the purchase agreement, it only says used certified vehicle. I just came back from the dealership.
they printed off all of the "transaction" papers to have all of the corrections on it. The one thing they did not do for me is I asked for them to write on the purchase agreement or invoice that the car is Honda Certified 7yr/100000 powertrain and 1 year bumper to bumper. They would not do it for me. They said instead that they are going to order a book that in detail explains the warranty. Does that sound right to you????
They are going to give me a new remote, and a new full key. So that's something. And they are going to do a radiator flush and a tune up, since it was requested before the transaction and it doesn't cost them much. They won't address the Leather steering wheel issue or the "touch up" or damage that nobody seems to know about that the original owner must have done to the right front door. I also requested all of the work and maintenance paperwork for the car, including the certified worksheets. I still have to wait for those.
It appears that they are "trying" to meet me half way but I'll have to wait and see after this weekend when they program the remote and do the tune up and radiator flush...
What do you think I should do about the Certified issues? Thanks alot for your input...
You really are having a bad experience. Since I have never bought a Honda certified used car, I checked out their website http://www.hondacars.com/certified/landing.asp and in my opinion if indeed a car goes through that exhaustive 150 point checkup, you should not be having any problems at all (whether cosmetic or mechanical) with your car! I would take up the issue with Honda Customer Service or your local Better Business Bureau (complaints can be lodged online).
My experience has been that Honda makes excellent cars but has the worst dealers (at least in the New York City vicinity)! You'll find out when you take your car for servicing. They'll charge you an arm and a leg and do all sorts of unnecessary things that are not required as per the owners manual and you won't have a choice because everything is a package deal (7.5K miles/15K miles/...service package , etc.). It is beyond me why Honda allows its dealers to have their own set of service procedures which totally deviate from procedures mentioned in the Honda owner's manual! But that is another discussion topic altogether.
I just bought the 99 Accord with 30,000 miles as a certified used Honda. During the deal, I told the dealer that the car had to be certified for me to buy it. He said it would cost me around $800. I, knowing it was the day before the last day of the month, said, throw it in the deal and ill buy the car. He agreed, put it on the contract papers, and the car was mine. However, after driving it for a few days, Im kinda under the impression they didnt really certify the car, or rushed it through to get it out of the way. The wipers arent new, they just put that rain-ex stuff on the windshield. There is a vibration at idle sometimes and most of the time between 65-70mph. The floormats in the rear are clean but have a bleach stain across both of them. The remote for the trunk didnt work, they replaced it, but only after i complained a lot. The aftermarket starter/alarm/remote was causing problems (sirens in the middle of the night, etc), so they said they would take it out, and left a hole in the plastic in the inside where the little red light used to be. It looks like a burning cigarette made it. Going through the 150-point inspection process on the Honda website seems like they shouldve done a more thorough job. I plan to take it to another dealership and have them check it out, and then anythig they find (cause of the vibration) they will fix under the certification warranty. The whole point of a certified low mileage used car is to make the car "like-new". I dont expect an Accord with 30,000 miles to have vibrations at different speeds. I agree with ghomaz, great cars, worst dealers.
...... This is probably about the umpteen time this discussion has come up .. but here goes.
This special "certification" process of the "1,392 point inspection" is merely more or less, a hop around the corner and back, an oil change, tire rotation (if needed) and the checking and addressing of any blatant noise or something that seems to be funny and out of place .. the same thing any average to good dealer "might" do.
Not picking on Honda or any dealer, but if it passes the basics, it's done. If there is problem down the road, the dealer depends on the warranty to cover it.
This is a marketing ploy to move their used vehicles and cuts down on the competition (or so they feel), that's all .. they drop a factory warranty on the vehicle (that you pay for) and Wango Tango - it's "certified". -- Put your hands on the TV and you will be saved, same thing. l.o.l..
Terry - did I tell you I was getting another crotch rocket?? You know I'm turning 40 at the end of the year! (It's a used Honda, so I'm still on topic, right?)
After riding sportbikes, I rode a Fat Boy in San Antonio last August (home on a Make-A-Wish trip). It was almost 700 lbs, wimpy brakes, skinny tires and scared me. I'm out on those.
Additionally, I see several each month in lemon law suits. I've NEVER seen a Honda, Yamaha, Kawasaki or Suzuki motorcycle in a lemon law suit.
Having studied CPO programs and interviewed dealer personnel about them, one thing I can say with strong certainty is the following statement is NOT TRUE:
The whole point of a certified low mileage used car is to make the car "like-new".
but people believe it anyway - no way around it, no matter if you change the wiper blades, the brake fluid (required for Honda certified cars), etc, it's still a USED CAR!
ISn't age a bear....I turn 40 in dec....was planning on buying my sports car then....a certified s2K or someting....then came a baby. My SAAB 9-3 Convertable dreams morphed to a Toyota Camry. (Good car, but *fun* is not how I would describe it)
I've gone middle age crazy several months early - after selling my GSX-R750 last year, I wasn't going to buy another bike, but the same friend (known him 16 years) is selling the Honda CBR900RR that he replaced the 750 with, and he offered me a heck of a deal. Picking it up in two weeks.......my BD is December, too - the 30th.
In fact they have also advertised (on their webpage) that Intellichoice has ranked Honda's certified program as "best-in-class" for the fourth year in a row. It seems to me that, if what you all say is true, Honda and Intellichoice can be taken to court for misleading consumers (misrepresentation, business malpractice, etc....). This may also be a good Consumer Reports story!
That's what I hate about selling used cars. Most customer's would complain about scratched, dings, etc. It's used! for God's sake! I would tell them if they want it new then buy a new one. ; ) Mackbee
This is the problem with the marketing, the salesperson and the dealership, the marketing and the salesperson makes the certified vehicle sound as though the car is supposed to be like new. If there are dings, scratches, tares, cracks, etc. these things are supposed to be fixed and any maintenance that the car needs is supposed to be done before the car can be CERTIFIED. I asked tons of questions about can this be done, will that be done every question was answered with a "Don't worry about it hun, it all has to be done the car has to be absolutely perfect before it leaves the lot, its a certified car." With that kind of statement to all of my questions, I expected an as close to like new car as possible, and isn't that the point buying a certified car instead of just a regular used car anyways?
The salesperson and the marketing say so, but the dealer tells you different only after you have to question something that was expected but not done. So the big question is who is lying? American Honda or the "Honda" dealerships? And I think its interesting that ghomaz, brings up a possible law suit, Who would we bring to court, American Honda or the individual Honda Dealer? It would seem to the dealer.
If the dealer stated that it should "be perfect", then they're wrong. I guarantee that I, for one, can find at least one problem with any certified used car you show me, whether it's a Honda, BMW, M-B, whatever.
The assumption, or being gullible enough to believe, that a used car can be made "perfect" is unreasonable.
American Honda advertises the same way that GM, Ford, and everyone else does on their CPO vehicles. It would be bad advertising to mention that it's "not quite perfect", for risk of skepticism.
I think there's an assumption that MUST be made that a used car cannot be perfect, just like a reasonable person should assume that eating 3 orders of Mickey D's fries per day could make you fat.
Working in the legal field, I feel there's nothing there for any type of suit, especially against Honda, but if the dealer's representatives are making claims like that, a BBB hearing is in order.
No used car is perfect, you should understand - but a dealer shouldn't imply that it is, either.
If you go through life with the thinking...."trust but confirm" you can't go wrong. It's ok to trust salespeople, some even go to church on sundays....but confirm what they are saying to your satisfaction. This way everyone wins.
a polite way to say "don't trust in the first place".
It's okay to trust (car) salespeople, just like it's okay. . . to leave your door unlocked to get drunk with strangers to drive fast on ice to swim in shark infested waters to taunt a cop.
It's probably okay to trust a car salesperson, in church on Sundays or anywhere else, like you would most anybody else - as long as you're not buying a car.
"If you don't trust the dealer, then don't do the deal."
Trust a dealer to what? Do what he/she says he's/she's gonna do, like Tyden's dealer? If that's a real conditon to doing a deal, you better plan on walking.
I thought post 73 was right on. If you mean rivertown. And I wonder why 74 was deleted. I didn't see what that person said... Guess I'll never know, but it must have been bad. And exactly how do you know that a sleazy dealer is a sleazy dealer, unless the transaction already happened? Explain that one to me.
And for zueslewis, I never implied that my car should be perfect and never expected it but those were the EXACT words of my salesperson. If this is my first real transaction with a big dealer like Honda, how am I supposed to know what would be a full-fledged lie? I am normally really cautious with everything, but this was my first time and you have to learn from your mistakes right. At the same time, I don't believe that what I was looking for was unreasonable. If it was, wouldn't the salesperson have said to me that is not reasonable? He said yes to everything. It seemed to me that everything that I was asking was pretty basic and is normal procedure with the purchase of a certified Honda, I questioned everything but he said yes to everything. It didn't seem necessary to demand for it all to be put in writing, that of course, was my fault. I don't expect my salesperson to contradict everything that we discussed, they have a job to do and if they want regular customers they need to provide service that they answer to, you get regular customers when there is trust. So for these people here, they can critize me all they want! I'm here for information and good accurate advise that I can use, and for those in my situation or about to be in my situation they could learn from this thread!
If someone has a problem with the issues that I have with the dealer that misled me, (I know, there was some ignorance on my part for not knowing) but if there is a problem, you don't have to read my thread and you don't have to reply, really. What is the point of being rude. I don't believe that I have done or said anything wrong. There is a way to provide constructive critisizm without being rude. And again, I really do appreciate the good advice that was given to me.
At this point, I'm still waiting for some paperwork that should have been presented to me before, I would have gotten it over the weekend but something came up and I should hopefully have everything that they will consider anyways, resolved. Once it seems that we are at a dead end, I will report back with the results. Thanks.
I ,for one, agree with you. Really, the whole point of going in for a manufacturer certified used vehicle is to get some peace of mind by purchasing a more reliable used car than from a regular private (or used car dealer) transaction. (Isn't that why the Edmunds TMV for a certified used car is higher than the regular appraised value?)
Zueslewis says that one can't really pursue the legal route since this is similar to suing MacDonald's for making one fat. There is however, one important difference. Nowhere does MacDonald's claim in writing that their food will NOT make you fat or that their food will make you thin. Honda, on the other hand, has put everything in writing (website, advertisements, etc.). As for people who keep on whining ad nauseum that one should always buy a new car, well, they should realize that everybody has some level of budgetary constraint. I did buy a new Accord but I had to buy a certified Starmarked Mercedes E320 since I couldn't afford a new one and I really wanted an E-class. But thankfully, I am very happy with the whole Mercedes dealer experience.
I agree, but this is not a HONDA issue, it's a dealer issue. To go after Honda is a complete waste of time that'll take 2 years, in the least - I know because my firm files suits against the manufacturers - it's what they do.
The dealer franchise is at fault for allowing the sales nimrod to spout off without follwoing through. The BBB is a great place to start, but they have not GUTS at all, so small claims is the proper direction once a mechanic gives a written estimate of what it takes to make the car as sharp as was advertised.
It pays the dealer to allow the salesguy to spout off! Shucks, they pay him to spout off!
I agree, the dealer's the place to focus in an attempt to get the car right.
I'd also let Honda know about the situation, maybe even include a link to this thread. Honda's spent some bucks to win confidence in their certified program, AND they've got some warranty responsibilities. It's very nice to think about the heat they might put on this dealer.
The dealer did a crappo job from start to finish - pre-sale prep, sale, paperwork, customer service, etc., etc. I bet he was great at cashing the check, though.
... a perfectionist customer who expected an immaculate new car for a used car price. I bought a CPO car a couple of years ago; it had a couple of door dings and a very minor interior flaw, but so what? I bought a great automobile for 60% of the cost of a new one AND I had the security of a manufacturer-backed warranty. If door dings and scratched hubcaps are able to make your life wretched and miserable, I'd suggest buying new-and trading every two months.
There are several articles on Certified Used Vehicles here at Edmunds.com. I have a feeling that some of you may be interested in what they have to say. Here are links to a couple:
I just hate it when a customer is labelled 'too picky and too cynical' AFTER they've trusted a car salesman and been screwed. 'Too late picky and too late cynical' seems like it to me. Surely, some used cars are worthy of purchase and some used car dealers are worthy of patronage by even the most discriminating of customers.
You are 100% correct. There are some people that should never buy used cars. There are some that should never buy demos. There are some that should never buy new cars.
Then there's that special group that should not buy any car. They should just stay on the bus. :^)
Of course, I was talking about BEFORE the actual sale. When I see people touching every rock chip on a six year old car, and asking countless questions about the car's history etc, I know these people shouldn't be buying used.
In most cases, I don't know the car's history and I tell them that. When they ask me if it's ever been in an accident, I tell them I have no way of knowing because I don't.
If something about a used car scares a person, they should keep looking.
Comments
In this case, it didn't go that way - to say the least. Mistaking this for a normal circumstance, as I think Tyden did, she's outraged.
Being outraged strikes me as reasonable, but . . .
Being outraged in this circumstance is certainly unrealistic.
Kinda like the analogy about calling a group of Hells Angels sissies. Most normal folk won't kick your rear for such a comment, although it is impolite; but a group of Hells Angels might well put you in the hospital, and feel entirely justified in doing so. With most people, believing what thay say works out fine. Not so in the context of buying a car.
So, Tyden, I STILL don't think you're crazy or unreasonable. It should be clear to you, though, from what's happened here and at the dealership, that believing what your car salesman says is an unrealistic course of action.
I guess that includes me in the group that says 'you should expect nothing', though I'm not inclined to join in the criticism you've received. Believe your own eyes; believe your gut; do what you need to do. You're dealing with a different breed of cat here.
It's wild, but it's true.
Don't say "USED" out loud, LOL. Say "USED CAR SALESMAN".
I can appreciate what you're saying. It was my inexperience that got me in trouble, I realized that once I spoke with the owner. I expected a "business man" to do what he said he would, that won't happen again.
I went to the dealer and if you saw my paperwork, they can't even get that right. I was promised by the owner that I would get copies of ALL of the maintenance and work papers that they have on my car. Well I get two invoices that have the prices whited out, a clean copy of my carfax report because the one I received was by fax and very messy. That is it. No other work and not even the certification check list. I'm very disappointed about that. They say their getting me a owners manual and they say they did another alignment, it was late so I'm not sure if the problem is fixed, I'll get to drive it more tomorrow, but the paperwork has errors all over it. I don't even have the energy to list all of the errors.
I appreciate everyone who responded to give me helpful and constructive criticism the way rivertown and some others did. Thank you. Hopefully the alignment worked and I can get the paperwork straightened out, then I will be satisfied. They still didn't fulfill everything that was agreed upon but corrected paperwork would really make my month at this point. The manager wasn't in so I couldn't address it with anyone in authority. Thanks alot, some of you guys really helped me.
FWIW, I still get flabbergasted when a car salesperson says one thing and then does another. LOL, most people just don't that. It's weird.
I'm glad you got to some sort of improved spot. Were it me and even if I were satisfied with the alignment, I'd follow up with the Honda Zone Customer Service rep. IF the car is Honda certified, he/she may want to have the car gone over by another dealer - to protect Honda from a warranty claim for work that the original dealer should have, but may not have, done.
Well said.....That sums it all up.....
"I'm not going to argue with anyone anymore. I'm just going to simply ask and if they say no, I'll ask for an explaination and take it to the next step. I've documented everything."
"Never wrestle with a pig. All you'll get is dirty, and the pig enjoys it." ~ Mark Twain
I bought a certified ("Starmarked") used 1998 Mercedes E320 last October, which I found on the internet through the national Mercedes-Benz website. When I was shopping around, a MB dealer tried to pass off a car as starmarked/certified but when I checked the MB website for this car using the VIN it was not listed. To confirm, I called MB and they said that this car was not MB certified. The point I am trying to make is that there are all types of unethical dealers out there just waiting to rip you off!
To get back to the car I bought, the MB dealer repaired all exterior and interior scratches, cleaned, polished, and went the whole nine yards on it! When I took delivery, the car looked and felt brand new!
I bought a certified used car about 1 year ago.Dealer did a complete servicing of the car,(at least his maintence records say he did)and a inside and out detailing.Car looked brand new.I guess each manufacturer must have different standards for their certified used car program or as ghomaz suggests maybe it is only dealer certified not Honda certified.
they printed off all of the "transaction" papers to have all of the corrections on it. The one thing they did not do for me is I asked for them to write on the purchase agreement or invoice that the car is Honda Certified 7yr/100000 powertrain and 1 year bumper to bumper. They would not do it for me. They said instead that they are going to order a book that in detail explains the warranty. Does that sound right to you????
They are going to give me a new remote, and a new full key. So that's something. And they are going to do a radiator flush and a tune up, since it was requested before the transaction and it doesn't cost them much. They won't address the Leather steering wheel issue or the "touch up" or damage that nobody seems to know about that the original owner must have done to the right front door. I also requested all of the work and maintenance paperwork for the car, including the certified worksheets. I still have to wait for those.
It appears that they are "trying" to meet me half way but I'll have to wait and see after this weekend when they program the remote and do the tune up and radiator flush...
What do you think I should do about the Certified issues? Thanks alot for your input...
and in my opinion if indeed a car goes through that exhaustive 150 point checkup, you should not be having any problems at all (whether cosmetic or mechanical) with your car! I would take up the issue with Honda Customer Service or your local Better Business Bureau (complaints can be lodged online).
My experience has been that Honda makes excellent cars but has the worst dealers (at least in the New York City vicinity)! You'll find out when you take your car for servicing. They'll charge you an arm and a leg and do all sorts of unnecessary things that are not required as per the owners manual and you won't have a choice because everything is a package deal (7.5K miles/15K miles/...service package , etc.). It is beyond me why Honda allows its dealers to have their own set of service procedures which totally deviate from procedures mentioned in the Honda owner's manual! But that is another discussion topic altogether.
This special "certification" process of the "1,392 point inspection" is merely more or less, a hop around the corner and back, an oil change, tire rotation (if needed) and the checking and addressing of any blatant noise or something that seems to be funny and out of place .. the same thing any average to good dealer "might" do.
Not picking on Honda or any dealer, but if it passes the basics, it's done. If there is problem down the road, the dealer depends on the warranty to cover it.
This is a marketing ploy to move their used vehicles and cuts down on the competition (or so they feel), that's all .. they drop a factory warranty on the vehicle (that you pay for) and Wango Tango - it's "certified". -- Put your hands on the TV and you will be saved, same thing. l.o.l..
Terry.
Terry - did I tell you I was getting another crotch rocket?? You know I'm turning 40 at the end of the year! (It's a used Honda, so I'm still on topic, right?)
Terry.
Additionally, I see several each month in lemon law suits. I've NEVER seen a Honda, Yamaha, Kawasaki or Suzuki motorcycle in a lemon law suit.
Pls drop an e-mail when you have the chance.
The whole point of a certified low mileage used car is to make the car "like-new".
My SAAB 9-3 Convertable dreams morphed to a Toyota Camry. (Good car, but *fun* is not how I would describe it)
http://www.hondacars.com/certified/landing.asp
In fact they have also advertised (on their webpage) that Intellichoice has ranked Honda's certified program as "best-in-class" for the fourth year in a row. It seems to me that, if what you all say is true, Honda and Intellichoice can be taken to court for misleading consumers (misrepresentation, business malpractice, etc....). This may also be a good Consumer Reports story!
They're still used cars, although Honda doesn't seem to want consumers to think so!
; )
Mackbee
The salesperson and the marketing say so, but the dealer tells you different only after you have to question something that was expected but not done. So the big question is who is lying? American Honda or the "Honda" dealerships? And I think its interesting that ghomaz, brings up a possible law suit, Who would we bring to court, American Honda or the individual Honda Dealer? It would seem to the dealer.
The assumption, or being gullible enough to believe, that a used car can be made "perfect" is unreasonable.
American Honda advertises the same way that GM, Ford, and everyone else does on their CPO vehicles. It would be bad advertising to mention that it's "not quite perfect", for risk of skepticism.
I think there's an assumption that MUST be made that a used car cannot be perfect, just like a reasonable person should assume that eating 3 orders of Mickey D's fries per day could make you fat.
Working in the legal field, I feel there's nothing there for any type of suit, especially against Honda, but if the dealer's representatives are making claims like that, a BBB hearing is in order.
No used car is perfect, you should understand - but a dealer shouldn't imply that it is, either.
The problem is that you believed them.
Well, you learned a good lesson. Enjoy your nice new car, and when it is time to buy a new one, don't believe anything the sales people tell you.
It's okay to trust (car) salespeople, just like it's okay. . .
to leave your door unlocked
to get drunk with strangers
to drive fast on ice
to swim in shark infested waters
to taunt a cop.
It's probably okay to trust a car salesperson, in church on Sundays or anywhere else, like you would most anybody else - as long as you're not buying a car.
Keep your eye on the deal, not the dealer.
That is really the only way to put the sleezy dealers out of business. Don't do business with a sleezy dealer.
TB
Trust a dealer to what? Do what he/she says he's/she's gonna do, like Tyden's dealer?
If that's a real conditon to doing a deal, you better plan on walking.
Seriously, trust a dealer to do what?
And for zueslewis, I never implied that my car should be perfect and never expected it but those were the EXACT words of my salesperson. If this is my first real transaction with a big dealer like Honda, how am I supposed to know what would be a full-fledged lie? I am normally really cautious with everything, but this was my first time and you have to learn from your mistakes right. At the same time, I don't believe that what I was looking for was unreasonable. If it was, wouldn't the salesperson have said to me that is not reasonable? He said yes to everything. It seemed to me that everything that I was asking was pretty basic and is normal procedure with the purchase of a certified Honda, I questioned everything but he said yes to everything. It didn't seem necessary to demand for it all to be put in writing, that of course, was my fault. I don't expect my salesperson to contradict everything that we discussed, they have a job to do and if they want regular customers they need to provide service that they answer to, you get regular customers when there is trust. So for these people here, they can critize me all they want! I'm here for information and good accurate advise that I can use, and for those in my situation or about to be in my situation they could learn from this thread!
If someone has a problem with the issues that I have with the dealer that misled me, (I know, there was some ignorance on my part for not knowing) but if there is a problem, you don't have to read my thread and you don't have to reply, really. What is the point of being rude. I don't believe that I have done or said anything wrong. There is a way to provide constructive critisizm without being rude. And again, I really do appreciate the good advice that was given to me.
At this point, I'm still waiting for some paperwork that should have been presented to me before, I would have gotten it over the weekend but something came up and I should hopefully have everything that they will consider anyways, resolved. Once it seems that we are at a dead end, I will report back with the results. Thanks.
Zueslewis says that one can't really pursue the legal route since this is similar to suing MacDonald's for making one fat. There is however, one important difference. Nowhere does MacDonald's claim in writing that their food will NOT make you fat or that their food will make you thin. Honda, on the other hand, has put everything in writing (website, advertisements, etc.). As for people who keep on whining ad nauseum that one should always buy a new car, well, they should realize that everybody has some level of budgetary constraint. I did buy a new Accord but I had to buy a certified Starmarked Mercedes E320 since I couldn't afford a new one and I really wanted an E-class. But thankfully, I am very happy with the whole Mercedes dealer experience.
The dealer franchise is at fault for allowing the sales nimrod to spout off without follwoing through. The BBB is a great place to start, but they have not GUTS at all, so small claims is the proper direction once a mechanic gives a written estimate of what it takes to make the car as sharp as was advertised.
I agree, the dealer's the place to focus in an attempt to get the car right.
I'd also let Honda know about the situation, maybe even include a link to this thread. Honda's spent some bucks to win confidence in their certified program, AND they've got some warranty responsibilities. It's very nice to think about the heat they might put on this dealer.
You really have to separate the manufacturer from the dealer on this one.
A customer needs to be told the truth. This car is Certified and let me show you what that means in black and white.
I also see a fussy, hard to please customer who probably should have bought new and not used.
I bet he was great at cashing the check, though.
- Certified Used Vehicle Programs
- Certified Used Cars — The Wave of the Future
- Pre-owned Peace of Mind
Enjoy.
Car_man
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Surely, some used cars are worthy of purchase and some used car dealers are worthy of patronage by even the most discriminating of customers.
Then there's that special group that should not buy any car. They should just stay on the bus. :^)
Unfortunately my comments belong in the inconsiderate drivers thread and not the inconsiderate buyers thread.
TB
Of course, I was talking about BEFORE the actual sale. When I see people touching every rock chip on a six year old car, and asking countless questions about the car's history etc, I know these people shouldn't be buying used.
In most cases, I don't know the car's history and I tell them that. When they ask me if it's ever been in an accident, I tell them I have no way of knowing because I don't.
If something about a used car scares a person, they should keep looking.