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  • maennjmaennj Member Posts: 20
    exb0,
    wow, this is the first reply that I find really useful on my topic. Now I understand why they wanted to avoid the survey. It's always the money, I thought they wanted to look good but obviously they don't care.
    What supports your argument too, that I called this dealer a week earlier asking about the car lease, I didn't mention my credit and that I'm fresh immigrant, and they told me a really good prices over the phone. Next week, I talked to them again and I explained my credit situation and that's I'm new here, they gave me totally different prices (2x the old price) and this is what made me aggressive on the price.
    Thanks exb0, you've been helpful and I agree with you about what should I do next.
  • maennjmaennj Member Posts: 20
    boomcheck:
    maybe I didn't clarify my question, but I'm not concerned about what I should have done. I've been treated wrong and I want to know how to respond now. Not what I should have done when I was there.

    And this still doesn't make sense to me:
    it's just at the last minute when they knew I wasn't totally satisfied, they refused to give me the papers and started giving excuses.


    Believe it doesn't make sense to me either. It's as simple as 1-2-3 though:
    1- We agreed on prices, I've filled the forms and signed papers he printed from his computer with all prices I've wanted. After that I complained to him about his salesperson. They felt that I'm not giving them high rating in the phone survey
    2- He said "I'd rather not sell the car than having low rating", and I didn't give him the response that he wanted (I told him you will get good rating except for salesperson rating and he didn't like that)
    3- He made me wait about 30 minutes and then came back telling me that we have BIG problem, the primary applicant should insure the car, not you (the co-applicant). Because he knows that the primary applicant is just here to support me with his credit score and he wouldn't use the car/pay for the insurance. Yes this is the stupidest excuse I've ever heard and doesn't make sense to me either. If you don't believe me I can give u the dealer phone and you could call and ask them.
  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    If the car is strictly in your name you will have to have stand alone insurance unless your state is different.

    You can check on this yourself.

    I'm not going to try to speculate on what happened because I wasn't there.

    As a recent immigrant you may find getting credit difficult. A very large down payment may help and your employer may be able to help if they have ties to a credit union or bank that can assist.

    I've never blown my stack with a customer but after spending my entire life in retail I can tell you I have come close once or twice.

    This may have been ALL of thier fault but I will say that in any business, ther are always a very small percentage of customers that you simply don't want.
  • fathertedfatherted Member Posts: 7
    As exb0 and some others have said, you don't have any credit history right now because you've only been here 3 months. I also am an immigrant, came here in 1992. It takes a few years to build up a credit history and a lot of places will not give you a loan right now. It's just the way the banks operate and there's not much you can do except get a couple credit cards, use them and pay them off each month. My first two cars I bought here were used and I had to pay cash. No shame in that.
  • boomchekboomchek Member Posts: 5,516
    Ok, so now we're getting somewhere:

    the primary applicant should insure the car, not you (the co-applicant). Because he knows that the primary applicant is just here to support me with his credit score and he wouldn't use the car/pay for the insurance. Yes this is the stupidest excuse I've ever heard and doesn't make sense to me either.

    Some companies will allow another person to insure the car, and some unfortunately won't. It's not a "stupid excuse" but just the way some financial institutions choose to do business.

    If your co signer (who is actually the main buyer on papers) doesn't want to go by the rules set out by the financial company, then it's not the dealer's fault. They need to send in the paperwork to the finance company and it has to be exactly as the finance company stipulates in order to release funds to the dealer. The names have to match where the loan holder is the primary driver.

    Now back to the dealer. So ok, hey weren't very straight forward with you, and wasted five hours of your time. Whether they were jerks, or if they were the nicest people in the world, they still have to go by the finance company's rules.

    Trust me if they could they would roll the car, even with a potential for a bad survey. The fact that they kept mentioning the bad survey and the fact that the deal went sour 30 minutes later is not connected even though it sounds like it is.

    2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX

  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    I missed your question earlier...sorry.

    I can't speak for other stores because I've only worked where I am now.

    We have a dedicated night crew that does our used car inspections.

    They check, I think 105 different items and they seem to find EVERYTHING. If a dash light bulb is out, they notate that. They check for oil leaks, they do a compression or leakdown test and write the numbers down. They measure brake pads and lining and they write down how many milimeters of lining are left.

    They load test every battery and if the battery is weak, we replace it.

    Now, we may not fix every little thing depending on the age of the car etc but if it's a safety item, it get's fixed and we replace anything apt to cause trouble. If the car is due for a timing belt, it get's done and we do a complete job including water pump replacement, seals etc.

    If it's small problem isn't causing an immediate problem, we disclose that as well. We disclose everything we find.

    If we find too many problems, we wholesale the car.

    When a deal is agreed on, we have the customer sign the Inspection Report and we give them a copy.

    As a result, we have very few problems and we sell a lot of used cars to repeat and referral customers.

    I'm glad our store operates in this manner.
  • oldfarmer50oldfarmer50 Member Posts: 24,237
    "...we sell a lot of used cars to repeat and referral customers..."

    I can see why. For used cars I tend to go to family first and then to new car dealers. Far back would be the independent lots and private sales. The reason? Because with the second choice guys I would always have the nagging doubt that I was buying trouble.

    If a dealer showed me the inspection you describe I would be much more likely to offer a higher price.

    Any plans to open a branch in NY?

    2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible

  • sbatncplsbatncpl Member Posts: 3
    Apologies if I have posted to an incorrect forum. I am in the market for an 07 Chevrolet Suburban LTZ, used, prefer no NAV or backup camera. Is $27,500 a reasonable offer to make for this type of vehicle with about 30k miles? I don't want to begin negotiating with dealers and look like an idiot with this kind of offer. AND. Why do car sales representatives NOT return e-mail questions and the like? Is it fear of technology, or are they supposed to speak to you via the telephone instead.
  • boomchekboomchek Member Posts: 5,516
    I can't answer your question about pricing, since i'm in Canada, but I can try and answer about email responses.

    Many dealers still don't have a proper or dedicated email department, or they don't take internet customers seriously. They might be too busy with floor customers or not enough staff to answer emails. However I am pretty sure they should have somebody to check email throughout the day and answer it.

    Have you tried calling about a certain unit, or is email your only choice for communication?

    2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX

  • verdugoverdugo Member Posts: 2,288
    wow, this is the first reply that I find really useful on my topic.

    Wow, that was harsh. In addition, most of the information that exb0 referred to wasn't provided in the first few mails.

    And plenty of other people have mentioned the surveys in other posts, although, not to the detail that exb0 used.

    I think plenty of other posts were useful, even if they weren't what you wanted to hear.

    If you decided to go ahead with a lease, remember the advice you were given here regarding paying down (aka down payment).

    Good luck
  • shawbegshawbeg Member Posts: 11
    I'm interested in buying a "new" older vehicle (this car is a 2008 with roughly 180 miles on it -- presumably from test drives). What caveats might I not know to consider. The dealer lists MSRP as just under $18,600 and the internet price as $14,200 (I'm rounding down a tad in both cases). Pricing Specs on a site called "Carseek" go as follows:

    Base Invoice Price: $16,865
    Base List Price: $17,995
    Destination Charge: $670>
    Gas Guzzler Tax: $0
    Average Sales Tax and Fees: $0
    Dealer Holdback: $360
    Target Price: $17,237

    I'm new at buying new. I'm new at buying from dealers. I've done most of my car buying as pre-owned, sold by owner. The car is nearly 2 hours away, and I'm expecting to go see it and test drive it on Saturday. I also plan to email the rep and manager to get a list of specs about the car as well as their anticipated fees, etc. -- you know, ask them what the "drive away price" would be (isn't there an acronym for that?). Help appreciated.
  • fezofezo Member Posts: 10,386
    Looks good over here but wait until the actual sales folks ring in.

    "drive away price" = out the door (OTD) price.
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
  • shawbegshawbeg Member Posts: 11
    Thanks! I knew I'd seen an acronym that I couldn't decipher. OTD - that was it! :-)

    When you say "looks good", you mean the price they have listed as their internet price?
  • tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    Is $27,500 a reasonable offer to make for this type of vehicle with about 30k miles?

    You should check out the Chevrolet Suburban Prices Paid and Buying Experiences discussion as well as our Used vehicles, used car prices, used car values at Edmunds.

    tidester, host
    SUVs and Smart Shopper
  • madmanmoomadmanmoo Member Posts: 2,039
    The only example that I have that is close to his situation is the one I referenced. My customer, with the student visa, was willing to put down 1/2 of his lease payments which totalled around $30k. Porsche Financial wasn't interested. He was willing to pay the whole thing up front. Porsche wasn't interested.

    When it comes to credit and the banks, there is no way to know the situation without being there.
  • traindrivertraindriver Member Posts: 328
    What kind of car is it?
  • shawbegshawbeg Member Posts: 11
    It is a Mazda 5 sport

    Here's a OTD "purchase order" from the dealer, received just tonight. So, now we get to the "real" price. Ugh.

    + $670 Destination

    + $1,000 Owner Loyalty Rebate (if you currently own a Mazda)

    + $2,000 Customer Cash Incentive
    ----------
    $17,900 Sale Price plus (6% Sales Tax, $99 Dealer Proc. Fee and $222 Total MVA Fees) then minus the applicable manufacturer rebates.

    I will provide you an additional Discount for your time and miles driven of $350.

    If you own a Mazda your price "On the Road" will be $15,869.94
    If you do not own a Mazda your price "On the Road" will be $16,929.94
    If you would like the Special Financing Option your price "On the Road" will be $18,429.94
  • jchan2jchan2 Member Posts: 4,956
    So I've been surfing Cars.com a lot lately, and noticed a lot of 2008 (and the occasional 2009) Saabs that are being advertised as "GM Company Cars" with anywhere from 70-1,000 miles; the discounts are ridiculously huge (I'd estimate anywhere from $5,000-$12,000 off of original MSRP; I know Saabs never sell for anywhere near MSRP, but $12K off on a $42K car with under 1,000 miles seems pretty steep)

    I'm wondering... where did these mysterious Saabs come from? And they're all equipped somewhat differently; some have XWD, others are convertibles, others are manuals, and others are the limited-edition Turbo X models.

    They're being advertised as used cars, but with only a few hundred miles on the clock, how used could they be?

    Any GM/Saab dealers out there know where all these "GM Company Cars" came from?
  • traindrivertraindriver Member Posts: 328
    Shawbeg,

    I don't know how much negotiating room there is on Mazdas and I am not a dealer, so I can't give you any solid advice about your specific deal.

    You may want to get a few quotes from other dealers just to reassure yourself. Also, you might want to look at fitzmall.com and carsdirect.com just as another information source. Compare their price to what you have been given. Sams club, costco, and some credit unions have auto buying services if you are a member of any of those. I see you found the "price paid" forum and assume you've dug way back looking at what others have reported. Other than this, I am afraid I am out of advice. Good luck.

    Edit:
    Be absolutely certain they have what you want in stock before you travel 2 hrs and get into a "bait & switch" situation.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    It was always my impression that a true "company car" (and not some bogus name for an old rental unit) was a car used at corporate level of that company by somebody who rated one--that is, high enough up the GM ladder to get a company car for a small monthly fee.

    also I think cars used for testing by magazines, etc. might qualify.

    No reason why the dealer can't pull the history on the car for you.
  • boomchekboomchek Member Posts: 5,516
    I agree with Shifty. Many "company cars" are ones used by executives, managers, and employees at local co. headquarters. Some may also have been used for salesperson training, and some could have been lent out to journalists.

    2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX

  • oldfarmer50oldfarmer50 Member Posts: 24,237
    "...and some could have been lent out to journalists..."

    I don't know if I would ever feel comfortable driving a car after the Edmunds team got through with it. Just the thought of a bunch of wild Edmunds hosts flying around town committing unspeakable acts in my car would keep me awake at night. :cry:

    2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible

  • boomchekboomchek Member Posts: 5,516
    That's why you save the big bucks. :surprise: For some people it won't bother them, for others it will.

    2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX

  • fezofezo Member Posts: 10,386
    You mean the ones that get those great review? "We found that you can set those airbags off right quick.".....
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    It wouldn't bother me, as long as I could drive the car beforehand. It's hard to hurt a modern car. You have to be really nuts.
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 20,766
    also 'real world trade in values'.
    2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 20,766
    one thing you need to understand is how large corporations work.
    someone could get allocated a vehicle based on their job class, then their job gets eliminated shortly after that.
    it is just a strange situation that happens with large organizations.
    12k off a top of the line saab sounds like there is some room for more.
    2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
  • au1994au1994 Member Posts: 3,714
    Sorry if this is in the wrong place. Here's my question:

    I have a truck I just purchased and owe about 12k on, I'm figuring the trade is about 18k. I'm going through a divorce and need to get some cash. My question is: can I trade the truck and, assuming the numbers above come through take 1 or 2 k out of the truck as a downpayment on a lease of an Accord or Civic and get a check for the balance?

    thanks in advance!

    2024 Jeep Grand Cherokee L Limited Velvet Red over Wicker Beige
    2024 Audi Q5 Premium Plus Daytona Gray over Beige
    2017 BMW X1 Jet Black over Mocha

  • tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    Have you thought about selling the truck yourself? I doubt that a dealer is going to cut you a check for your trade. But then the salepeople here may have a different view.

    tidester, host
    SUVs and Smart Shopper
  • grandtotalgrandtotal Member Posts: 1,207
    I'm not trade, but I can't see why a dealer would not cut a cheque for au1994 if his truck is worth $18k to the dealer.
  • tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    I think that is sensible but I don't think business works quite like that. Perhaps a dealer will step in to set us straight. Anyone?

    tidester, host
    SUVs and Smart Shopper
  • volvomaxvolvomax Member Posts: 5,238
    Yes you can. Assuming that the truck is worth what you think it is.

    Is the truck in your name only?
  • golicgolic Member Posts: 714
    I had a car i owned a few years ago and then went into a lease. The dealer took my old car and gave me a check for the trade-in value. (About 5k)

    At first they tried to talk me into putting in as a down payment on the lease, but I didn't want to.

    The only thing was, I had to wait about 3 weeks for the check as they would not release the funds until the title was received.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    That would have been really dumb, putting $5K down on a lease. Good thinking on that one! ;)
  • au1994au1994 Member Posts: 3,714
    yes, it is in my name only. Thank goodness!!

    2024 Jeep Grand Cherokee L Limited Velvet Red over Wicker Beige
    2024 Audi Q5 Premium Plus Daytona Gray over Beige
    2017 BMW X1 Jet Black over Mocha

  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Administrator Posts: 11,242
    As others have mentioned, this would be a good one to try to sell privately if your goal is to get the most cash possible out of the deal.

    MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR
    Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
    2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h)
    Review your vehicle

  • maennjmaennj Member Posts: 20
    Hello

    I found a special offer that says total due at sign = $2,453 + tax,tags + MV fees.
    My question is how much would be that total, can someone explain how much is everyone of those, I live in new york.

    Thanks
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Administrator Posts: 11,242
    This is not something that we can really help you with. Your best bet is to call the dealership and ask.

    It's not possible for us to know the tax rate or the DMV fees in every location across the US, plus we'd have to know the purchase price.

    You can also call the DMV in your area, give them the purchase price, and ask what taxes, tags & fees are.

    MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR
    Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
    2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h)
    Review your vehicle

  • oldfarmer50oldfarmer50 Member Posts: 24,237
    "...+ tax, tags + MV fee..."

    Since I live in NY I'll give it a try.

    First, I'll assume by NY you mean NY state not NY city. If you're in the city I can't help you because the city has it's own set of rules and because any body who would buy a car for the city is insane.

    TAX--This means NY state sales tax which is 4% plus your local county tax which can be 3% or more depending on where you live. Look at any receipt for things you buy and it will tell you the tax rate for your county. Some cities like Buffalo have additional city tax as well. So if your tax totals 8% and your car is $25K expect to pay $2000 tax.

    Tags--This means your registration fee which in NY is determined by the weight of your car. If I recall, a 3000 pound car costs about 50$ a year more or less.

    MV fees--This is probably the dreaded "Doc" fee dealers charge. In NY it is limited to $45. NY occasionally does something right.

    Tire fee--You didn't mention this but expect to pay about $12 to keep the enviromentalist quiet.

    Hope that helps. You can also get this information from any DMV office in NY.

    2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible

  • verdugoverdugo Member Posts: 2,288
    If you're in the city I can't help you because the city has it's own set of rules and because any body who would buy a car for the city is insane.

    haha. That was really funny old farmer.
  • maennjmaennj Member Posts: 20
    Thank you.I'll call the dealer to check
  • maennjmaennj Member Posts: 20
    Hi, Thanks for your detail :)

    " If you're in the city I can't help you because the city has it's own set of rules and because any body who would buy a car for the city is insane. "
    lol, you're right but I actually live in New York City, in Staten Island where car is actually necessary
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    to say nothing of a ferry being necessary! :P
  • oldfarmer50oldfarmer50 Member Posts: 24,237
    When dealers say this in their ads, exactly what do they mean? You can take that two ways. :confuse:

    2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    I always liked the double meaning of that statement. :P

    Presumably, the dealer thinks he's got a hot item, some desirable model, or some model with desirable options. It's just sales hype more often than not, to increase your sense of urgency to buy.

    Nobody wants the greasy little mini-franks at the banquet table until they see someone else loading up on them.
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Administrator Posts: 11,242
    It's also one of my least favorite ad strategies. If the product sells itself and is just going to FLY off the shelves, why waste $ advertising it. And heck, it lasted long enough to put an ad in the paper.

    MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR
    Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
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    Review your vehicle

  • boomchekboomchek Member Posts: 5,516
    Haha, good question farmer. It does work both ways.

    They say that in the ads because it might be a one of a kind optioned car, or one basic car that we don't order many of that indeed might sell fast. But then again that statement can be said about any car.

    However the funny thing is, sometimes we have units, new and used, sitting on the lot for months. Nobody looks at them, nobody calls about them, and nobody is interested at all.

    But all of a sudden when one person inquires about it, there are two or three other buyers wanting that same car typically that same day. I've seen it over and over again. I don't understand why there's a sudden interest in an unwanted car by many people at the same time, but it does happen.

    I lost deals on cars that we had for months that my buyer said he'll "think about" only to have someone else sell itto another customer. That's why I always encourage my customers to at least put a refundable deposit on a car if they want to "think about it."

    2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX

  • kec3kec3 Member Posts: 1
    I have an event/advertising service that would bring people into a dealership. I need a new van. Has anyone ever heard of a dealer bartering for a new vehicle? I just wondered if that was something I should check into.
  • boomchekboomchek Member Posts: 5,516
    I haven't heard of that happening. However I heard quite a few offers like yours before. The problem is, there's rarely any track record provided on the success of these marketing schemes and the credibility usually goers out the window if you want a free car in exchange.

    It's unlikely they'll give you a new $20k van in exchange for your services. If you think your marketing plan is worth $20k then you would be one of the top companies in the country. And if that would be the case then you wouldn't need to barter for a vehicle. If you think that over time, like a year or two, your services would add up to $20k with monthly support and all, then you also have a challenge ahead as dealers don't want to tie up their money for a long time into something that is unproven, and maybe without a track record.

    You will have to put your service into monetary value and pitch it seperately.
    The dealer will sell you a van at a retail price, maybe give you a special deal if you enter into a business relationship with them.

    2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX

  • demstillersdemstillers Member Posts: 5
    I know the saying about the early bird getting the worm, but I have to admit I'm hoping for some encouragement that I just happened to come across a lousy sales manager and that they're not all like this. What is common practice in this situation? The situation is this. We were down one vehicle due to a car accident and was in the market for a new one unexpectedly. We stayed up through the night doing all the research and number crunching that would have taken us months had we planned on having to buy a car. We found a deal on a used suburban at a reputable dealership that seemed almost too good to be true. Of course we were skeptical, so we did our homework and checked the carfax report they gave us, test drove it, negotiated an awesome price, and we were at the point of negotiating interest rates. The morning we were negotiating rates, I was quoted one, and I requested the finance manager try to lower it a little. He said he would try while I was at work. I called him an hour later to follow up, left messages, called the general manager, left him messages, and did this cycle a few hours later. That evening, another used car manager I never met or dealt with called to tell me the vehicle was sold. :cry: They weren't calling me back because they were trying to sell it to someone else!!! I was quite upset that I was in the middle of a negotiation and the rug was pulled up from under me. I couldn't believe I never received a phone call after several attempts to follow up on a negotiation. It was unbelievable. I've never had this happen to me, and I hope this is not the norm and that I was just lucky in the past. Wouldn't a courtesy call or the recommendation to leave a deposit have been the more appropriate steps? Why do dealerships do this to people? :mad:
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