Real-World Trade-In Values

andres3

https://www.folsomlakevw.com/vehicle-details/2014-audi-s4--folsom-ca-id-25046987

Honestly want to know what you think the dealership paid for this in trade-in. I'm thinking $1,500 profit takes it.

28firefighter

@roadburner - learn something new every day. 

kyfdx

qbrozen said:

No turbo in a Rogue. :b

Okay... Mercedes Juke..

corvette

My friend used to work for the service department at the local M-B dealer. He said their current lineup is pretty solid except for the CLA and GLA. I think they’re the modern day 190E. 

qbrozen

corvette said:

My friend used to work for the service department at the local M-B dealer. He said their current lineup is pretty solid except for the CLA and GLA. I think they’re the modern day 190E. 

Hey hey, don't go insulting the 190E. That was a solid little car and at least RWD like the rest of the lineup.

qbrozen

andres3 said:

https://www.folsomlakevw.com/vehicle-details/2014-audi-s4--folsom-ca-id-25046987 Honestly want to know what you think the dealership paid for this in trade-in. I'm thinking $1,500 profit takes it.

92k miles?!?

$22.5k might get it, but would you really want it?

andres3

qbrozen said:

andres3 said:

https://www.folsomlakevw.com/vehicle-details/2014-audi-s4--folsom-ca-id-25046987

Honestly want to know what you think the dealership paid for this in trade-in. I'm thinking $1,500 profit takes it.

92k miles?!?

$22.5k might get it, but would you really want it?

Not at that price knowing the history .... though maybe crashing the rear and front AGAIN did the car a lot of favors, as a better body shop could have improved upon the previous work. Could just be good photography though.

Mr_Shiftright

qbrozen said:

corvette said:

My friend used to work for the service department at the local M-B dealer. He said their current lineup is pretty solid except for the CLA and GLA. I think they’re the modern day 190E. 

Hey hey, don't go insulting the 190E. That was a solid little car and at least RWD like the rest of the lineup.

The 2.3? Egad, the Mercedes Toyota Corolla.

qbrozen

Never drove the 2.3, but I know a Corolla, even one 20 years newer, does not feel as tank-like. 

qbrozen

andres3 said:

andres3 said:

https://www.folsomlakevw.com/vehicle-details/2014-audi-s4--folsom-ca-id-25046987 Honestly want to know what you think the dealership paid for this in trade-in. I'm thinking $1,500 profit takes it.

92k miles?!?

$22.5k might get it, but would you really want it?

Not at that price knowing the history .... though maybe crashing the rear and front AGAIN did the car a lot of favors, as a better body shop could have improved upon the previous work. Could just be good photography though.

andres3 said:

andres3 said:

https://www.folsomlakevw.com/vehicle-details/2014-audi-s4--folsom-ca-id-25046987 Honestly want to know what you think the dealership paid for this in trade-in. I'm thinking $1,500 profit takes it.

92k miles?!?

$22.5k might get it, but would you really want it?

Not at that price knowing the history .... though maybe crashing the rear and front AGAIN did the car a lot of favors, as a better body shop could have improved upon the previous work. Could just be good photography though.

No accidents but previous damage? Hell, forget what I said. Make it $18k.

kyfdx

qbrozen said:

Never drove the 2.3, but I know a Corolla, even one 20 years newer, does not feel as tank-like. 

Nothing wrong with the 190E. We almost bought a 190E 2.6 used, once. But, it was red, and came with the plastic panel along the bottom, that made it look two-toned. Couldn't get over that.

qbrozen

I had two 2.6 190Es. Nice little cars. PITA to work on, though, and overly complicated for no apparent benefit.

corvette

qbrozen said:

PITA to work on, though, and overly complicated for no apparent benefit.

That describes pretty much every European car I’ve ever worked on. 

fushigi

Speaking of European cars, I'll be interested to see what one of the guys who reports to me at work finds out about his. He has an BMW M5 V10, not sure the year, that just stopped the other night. Probably something in the clutch assembly. The OBD code did indicate transmission but was otherwise not helpful. He was taking it to the dealer yesterday.

henryn

Back many years ago, one of my friends / co-workers bought a 190E. He was very excited, his first Mercedes. But the bloom wore off the rose very quickly. He spent a lot of time at the dealership, there were many, many problems. He got rid of it in less than a year. Anytime you wanted to get a rise out of him all you had to do was mention his Mercedes experience.

Yes, I know, every car manufacturer has a lemon now and then. But my friend didn’t think the dealer was very helpful with his problems, he expected more for what he paid.

Mr_Shiftright

qbrozen said:

Never drove the 2.3, but I know a Corolla, even one 20 years newer, does not feel as tank-like. 

The 2.3 is a cheaped-out Benz. It was meant to be entry-level, Mercedes first "compact", and it feels like it. Also problem-ridden. A huge flop in the U.S, for obvious reasons--like timing chains snapping in half and a whopping 113HP to push it around.

kyfdx

I think in the mid to late '80s, when the 190E came out, that was the dealership experience for almost every Euro import. Service intervals were every 90 days, and they were expensive!!

Mr_Shiftright

I think the 190E was the first Benz for many Americans, and it was such a letdown that I wonder how many ever came back to the brand, or just switched to Lexus. It really was an awful car--but it did get better as time went on. They made 'em I think for at least a decade. The 2.5 version at least was able to keep a timing chain in the engine.

andres3

qbrozen said:

andres3 said:

qbrozen said:

andres3 said:

https://www.folsomlakevw.com/vehicle-details/2014-audi-s4--folsom-ca-id-25046987

Honestly want to know what you think the dealership paid for this in trade-in. I'm thinking $1,500 profit takes it.

92k miles?!?

$22.5k might get it, but would you really want it?

Not at that price knowing the history .... though maybe crashing the rear and front AGAIN did the car a lot of favors, as a better body shop could have improved upon the previous work. Could just be good photography though.

andres3 said:

qbrozen said:

andres3 said:

https://www.folsomlakevw.com/vehicle-details/2014-audi-s4--folsom-ca-id-25046987

Honestly want to know what you think the dealership paid for this in trade-in. I'm thinking $1,500 profit takes it.

92k miles?!?

$22.5k might get it, but would you really want it?

Not at that price knowing the history .... though maybe crashing the rear and front AGAIN did the car a lot of favors, as a better body shop could have improved upon the previous work. Could just be good photography though.

No accidents but previous damage? Hell, forget what I said. Make it $18k.

Now your talking. I figured you'd deduct 20% for the DV. I'd be a buyer at $18K if it still had no rattles and drove tight. I'd also expect they just did the timing belt, thermostat, water pump service being so close to 100K.

g8orgrant

What do you guys make of this car and its carfax?

https://www.mbofsouthampton.com/certified/Mercedes-Benz/2015-Mercedes-Benz-C-Class-1196bb520a0e0ae844812eb11e4c06bb.htm

https://www.carfax.com/VehicleHistory/p/Report.cfx?partner=DLR_3&vin=55SWF4KB3FU011503

So on one hand it's showing as a 2 owner car, w/ one of them being "rental", even though the car was used 3200 miles over 8 months, doesn't feel like a car optioned for rental use, and was sold by a NJ dealer to whoever titled it as a "Rental". Then we see a 10 month lease, whatever that may have been (perhaps someone did a CPO lease and/or turned it in early). The final oddity is that we see it listed for sale 3/25/16 w/ 9K miles and again on 1/19/18 w/ 31K miles, with no activity between those dates showing in the carfax. Even today, nearly 7 months later than the 1/19 date, the car has added 2K miles, which would be an AWFUL lot of test driving.

stickguy

My guess it was a service loaner of some type, then leased out to a retail customer. The large gap is probably because the little that happened (1 or 2 services) were done somewhere that did not report.

stickguy

Just looked at it. Wonder if the dealer drove it the last 2 years.? Interesting, but it’s CPO and if you like it and price is right, would not worry. Can certainly ask the dealer.

qbrozen

Fair enough price for CPO

g8orgrant

One other interesting observation from the Carfax - it says Warranty Expired (or basic warranty is estimated to have expired). It's only a few months, but it looks like the car was sold originally in 10/14, so it should be good for at least another few months. Not sure how reliable Carfax would be here, or if something about it being listed as a "rental" would have altered the warranty terms.

Re: price. Do all cars from the same model year price out roughly the same? IE; this card would appear to be on the older end (sold 10/14), whereas I'm sure people were still buying 2015 model year cars a year later.

Thanks!

stickguy

only MY matters.

Mr_Shiftright

Exactly. If I bought my 2018 car in Dec. 2017, and "you" bought your identical 2018 in December 2018, and if the mileage and condition between our two cars is the same, then the value is the same. What would be different is our warranty length---which I suppose you could argue *might* cause a value difference between our two cars when my warranty runs out a year sooner than yours.

explorerx4

CPO can really help you out.
I bought my prior truck, a 2014, in November 2015(2 model years old).
Traded it in March 2018 still under the 3/36 B to B.
As a CPO, another year and 12k are added, so B to B is extended to November 2019.
Not sure if that helped me with the traded in, but I did point that out during negotiations.

stickguy

just covering bases, but what would realistic trade in value be on a 2018 Elantra sport? AT, white, smells like new, 6,000 miles on it.

qbrozen

$17k

Didn't you only pay like 18? Wonder what carvana/vroom/carmax would pay for it.

stickguy

I may be finding out what they will pay very soon.

I paid (before tax and tags) just about $18,900, 10 months ago. OTD was just a tick under $21. so even without a sales tax credit on a trade in, would effectively be like if I had leased for $250ish a month and then handed off the lease.

which is why I bought it in the first place, figuring I did not have much exposure. At this point, my payoff (I did not put much down) is probably just over $15K

stickguy

damn, you are good. Just ran through Carvana (turns out I am in local market too). $16,965. If I knew I wanted to buy something new to get sales tax credit would certainly help!

qbrozen

ha! Interesting since that is EXACTLY $1k below the Manheim number. I rounded up to $17k figuring a dealer wouldn't have a problem doing that.

I am surprised carvana is no better than any other dealer, though.

kyfdx

qbrozen said:

ha! Interesting since that is EXACTLY $1k below the Manheim number. I rounded up to $17k figuring a dealer wouldn't have a problem doing that.

I am surprised carvana is no better than any other dealer, though.

The bid on a car, without buying one. That's hard to do with a regular dealer, though. That's the attraction.

Plus, even though dealers buy cars at auction, they also get trade-ins on new cars. Since Carvana isn't selling new cars, they miss out on that part. They may get trades on their used cars, but that makes the trade even older, and I'm guessing they have a cutoff point, where they won't take an older car.

henryn

Carvana seems to be more-or-less, kinda-sorta like CarMax. Except that you can't actually see / sit in / test drive your potential new car. If you are trying to decide what used automobile you would like to own next, Carvana is useless and CarMax is very helpful (huge selection in one spot, and non-pushy salespeople.)

I have used CarMax for exactly that purpose. Walk around, kick the tires, bug the friendly salesguy to open up various cars so that I can see how I fit. You are never going to be able to do that at Carvana. On the other hand, I've never actually bought at CarMax, and probably never will.

Obviously a lot of people do though.

au1994

We may step up our timeline on the X6 replacement. Both of us have become enamoured with the Subaru Ascent. So...what say you on:

2016 X6 35i Xdrive
28k miles
Premium pkg
Driver Assistance Plus pkg
Soft close doors
Space Gray over Ivory with black trim
Very good shape, maybe a stone chip or 2 on the front but you would have to look for imperfections
Atalanta area

qbrozen

au1994 said:

We may step up our timeline on the X6 replacement. Both of us have become enamoured with the Subaru Ascent. So...what say you on:

2016 X6 35i Xdrive
28k miles
Premium pkg
Driver Assistance Plus pkg
Soft close doors
Space Gray over Ivory with black trim
Very good shape, maybe a stone chip or 2 on the front but you would have to look for imperfections
Atalanta area

$38k-$39k.

isellhondas

andres3 said:

https://www.folsomlakevw.com/vehicle-details/2014-audi-s4--folsom-ca-id-25046987

Honestly want to know what you think the dealership paid for this in trade-in. I'm thinking $1,500 profit takes it.

Why do you care?

And, why do you think you should be the one who determines how much profit they should be happy with.

You also need to consider what they may have had to spend in reconditioning and overhead.

If you are REALLY serious, offer them what you think it's worth to you. Very simple!

You will either be a new owner or you will be walking!

steine13

If andres3 knows what they have in it, he'll have an idea what they'll need to get out of it. It's always easier to get a deal when they stole it.

On the other hand, if the used-car manager screwed up and overpaid, it's going to be like pulling teeth getting a deal on this thing, and personally I wouldn't bother trying. It's got nothing to do with trying to limit the dealer's profit. That's strictly an amateur attitiude, if a popular one. It's certainly not what this board is about.

For what it's worth, it's ALWAYS the customers who determine how much profit the dealer makes. They are the ones providing said profit

"Customers -- where the goodness comes from!"

qbrozen

To isell's point, it is worth what its worth. If you don't pay it, someone else likely will. And, by that same token, I don't care if they overpaid. I'm not going to be the one to save them from their mistake (and, believe me, I have had that discussion with GMs/SMs before. 

andres3

qbrozen said:

To isell's point, it is worth what its worth. If you don't pay it, someone else likely will. And, by that same token, I don't care if they overpaid. I'm not going to be the one to save them from their mistake (and, believe me, I have had that discussion with GMs/SMs before. 

Same with private sellers that think you care how much they owe on it. I couldn't care less!

henryn

andres3 said:

qbrozen said:

To isell's point, it is worth what its worth. If you don't pay it, someone else likely will. And, by that same token, I don't care if they overpaid. I'm not going to be the one to save them from their mistake (and, believe me, I have had that discussion with GMs/SMs before. 

Same with private sellers that think you care how much they owe on it. I couldn't care less!

Unfortunately, yes, I DO care how much they owe on it. If they are seriously upside down, it's very unlikely they're going to kick in the money necessary to pay down the loan so that you can buy it for a reasonable, fair price. So yes, I do care if they are upside down, not much point in even talking to them or going to look at the car or ...

andres3

qbrozen said:

To isell's point, it is worth what its worth. If you don't pay it, someone else likely will. And, by that same token, I don't care if they overpaid. I'm not going to be the one to save them from their mistake (and, believe me, I have had that discussion with GMs/SMs before. 

Same with private sellers that think you care how much they owe on it.

henryn said:

andres3 said:

qbrozen said:

To isell's point, it is worth what its worth. If you don't pay it, someone else likely will. And, by that same token, I don't care if they overpaid. I'm not going to be the one to save them from their mistake (and, believe me, I have had that discussion with GMs/SMs before. 

Same with private sellers that think you care how much they owe on it. I couldn't care less!

Unfortunately, yes, I DO care how much they owe on it. If they are seriously upside down, it's very unlikely they're going to kick in the money necessary to pay down the loan so that you can buy it for a reasonable, fair price. So yes, I do care if they are upside down, not much point in even talking to them or going to look at the car or ...

Point taken. Usually these ads have special emphasis on the amount owed, and that they don't want to be lowballed.

steine13

"I don't want to make a profit."

I've heard that more than once from guys who want me to pay off their ride.
How the idea of 'profit' even enters into this situation blows my mind.

But I'm with henryn on this one; it's exactly analogous to knowing what someone paid for a car -- if the number isn't righteous, the deal won't happen. Best not to waste one's time.

stickguy

hey Guru, what is this worth CPO?

https://www.eliteacura.com/inventory/certified-used-2017-acura-tlx-3-5-v-6-9-at-p-aws-with-technology-package-fwd-4dr-car-19uub2f58ha003147

I actually found another one like it, but my favorite color (black cherry over espresso), a few hundred cheaper with only 7K miles. But at a little mom and pop used place (well, I think they sell Isuzus too), so not CPO. Probably not a huge deal on one of these though.

stickguy

same car, 4 cyl version.

https://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/detail/732860874/overview/

qbrozen

stickguy said:

hey Guru, what is this worth CPO? https://www.eliteacura.com/inventory/certified-used-2017-acura-tlx-3-5-v-6-9-at-p-aws-with-technology-package-fwd-4dr-car-19uub2f58ha003147 I actually found another one like it, but my favorite color (black cherry over espresso), a few hundred cheaper with only 7K miles. But at a little mom and pop used place (well, I think they sell Isuzus too), so not CPO. Probably not a huge deal on one of these though.

That's a really good price. Auction value is $26k-$27k.

stickguy

thanks. Cars.com flagged it as a "great deal" so I figured it must be strong. Hope the wife likes red! As a bonus, only in service since 8/2017.

qbrozen

stickguy said:

same car, 4 cyl version. https://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/detail/732860874/overview/

Uhhhh... that's exactly the same car but with cheaper price.

stickguy

Oh yeah. Different dealer, and cars.com listed it as 4 cyl I think. Or thought. Wonder if same people own both dealers? Something is odd there. But at the cheaper price, even better!

qbrozen

VIN matches v6. Carfax shows it was serviced by Boardwalk but for sale in Maple Shade.