Real-World Trade-In Values

roadburner

@qbrozen: Any idea what I might be able to snag this 2017 Clubman for?
Thanks- it's a potential car for my wife.

henryn

roadburner said:

@qbrozen: Any idea what I might be able to snag this 2017 Clubman for?
Thanks- it's a potential car for my wife.

Why don't you just hit yourself in the head a few times with a baseball bat? Same end result, quicker and cheaper. (smile)

qbrozen

That is shockingly overpriced. About $16,000 auction value. Is that not certified? I would say 19,000 without certification

corvette

I think they are a one price dealer, too. 

roadburner

qbrozen said:

That is shockingly overpriced. About $16,000 auction value. Is that not certified? I would say 19,000 without certification

That's what I suspected; they've had it for a long time...

bluemkn57cars

@qbrozen

Hoping you can help. Looking to trade in my 2013 Honda Accord sedan EX-L. It has close to 45k miles on it and it is in very good condition. It has all the standard features that came with that model (no navigation). It has a clean carfax with no accidents. 

KBB listed a trade-in value between 12k and 13.6k. What should I expect for a real world number?

Let me know if you need any additiinal info. I can PM you the VIN. 

qbrozen

bluemkn57cars said:

@qbrozen

Hoping you can help. Looking to trade in my 2013 Honda Accord sedan EX-L. It has close to 45k miles on it and it is in very good condition. It has all the standard features that came with that model (no navigation). It has a clean carfax with no accidents. 

KBB listed a trade-in value between 12k and 13.6k. What should I expect for a real world number?

Let me know if you need any additiinal info. I can PM you the VIN. 

Which engine and transmission? What color combo? What area of the country?

bluemkn57cars

qbrozen said:

bluemkn57cars said:

@qbrozen

Hoping you can help. Looking to trade in my 2013 Honda Accord sedan EX-L. It has close to 45k miles on it and it is in very good condition. It has all the standard features that came with that model (no navigation). It has a clean carfax with no accidents. 

KBB listed a trade-in value between 12k and 13.6k. What should I expect for a real world number?

Let me know if you need any additiinal info. I can PM you the VIN. 

Which engine and transmission? What color combo? What area of the country?

2.4L 4-cylinder engine. Automatic transmission.
Silver exterior/grey interior.
I am in the Northeast. 

qbrozen

bluemkn57cars said:

2.4L 4-cylinder engine. Automatic transmission.
Silver exterior/grey interior.
I am in the Northeast. 

$12k-12.5k is about right. Might get more at a carmax or carvana type place.

bluemkn57cars

qbrozen said:

2.4L 4-cylinder engine. Automatic transmission.
Silver exterior/grey interior.
I am in the Northeast. 

$12k-12.5k is about right. Might get more at a carmax or carvana type place.

Thank you. I appreciate the quick response.

breld

roadburner said:

qbrozen said:

That is shockingly overpriced. About $16,000 auction value. Is that not certified? I would say 19,000 without certification

That's what I suspected; they've had it for a long time...

Those Clubmans do seem like good values on the used market though (just not this particular one). There was a nice one a few months back that caught our eye - an S All4 model well equipped, listed at about $22k. So yeah, $25k for a base model All4 is high.

We liked ours quite a bit - really thought it drove more like a BMW than previous iterations.

roadburner

@qbrozen:
Round 2- 2017 Wrangler
Thanks!

Mr_Shiftright

@qbrozen:

Q, you got anything on a 2002 Ford Thunderbird, black on black, California, 106,000 miles, average condition.

tifighter

Mr_Shiftright said:

@qbrozen:

Q, you got anything on a 2002 Ford Thunderbird, black on black, California, 106,000 miles, average condition.

Getting some popcorn for this one...

xwesx

roadburner said:

@qbrozen:
Round 2- 2017 Wrangler
Thanks!

Roadburner; I think they put the wrong transmission in that thing. What a bummer!

qbrozen

roadburner said:

@qbrozen:
Round 2- 2017 Wrangler
Thanks!

Right about $24k-$24.5k, so figure $27k-$28k should get it done.

qbrozen

Mr_Shiftright said:

@qbrozen:

Q, you got anything on a 2002 Ford Thunderbird, black on black, California, 106,000 miles, average condition.

convertible, right? (i have a listing for a coupe for some reason)
About $6500/$7500/$10k trade/auction/retail

kyfdx

Aren’t they all convertibles?

jpp75

@qbrozen Do you have any data on a 2016 Touareg TDI Lux? 5k miles, brown and in CO. I'm not looking to trade (most likely) but am looking to refinance.

qbrozen

5k miles? Wild guess... $36k.

jpp75

qbrozen said:

5k miles? Wild guess... $36k.

Thanks @qbrozen, it's obviously one I'd probably sell privately to a diesel enthusiast when the time comes but this helps with figuring out the refinancing!

tifighter

jpp5862 said:

@qbrozen Do you have any data on a 2016 Touareg TDI Lux? 5k miles, brown and in CO. I'm not looking to trade (most likely) but am looking to refinance.

Being within a 50 mile radius of breld can be dangerous for your checking account. Tread carefully this weekend, @jpp5862

roadburner

qbrozen said:

roadburner said:

@qbrozen:
Round 2- 2017 Wrangler
Thanks!

Right about $24k-$24.5k, so figure $27k-$28k should get it done.

Thanks!

jpp75

tifighter said:

jpp5862 said:

@qbrozen Do you have any data on a 2016 Touareg TDI Lux? 5k miles, brown and in CO. I'm not looking to trade (most likely) but am looking to refinance.

Being within a 50 mile radius of breld can be dangerous for your checking account. Tread carefully this weekend, @jpp5862

Very true. It's nice to have enablers friends so close by.

breld

If you all think I'm an enabler, you should meet my wife. @jpp5862 and @michaell can vouch for that.

Just wait 'til this Saturday when we're all going around together "browsing."

Mr_Shiftright

qbrozen said:

Mr_Shiftright said:

@qbrozen:

Q, you got anything on a 2002 Ford Thunderbird, black on black, California, 106,000 miles, average condition.

convertible, right? (i have a listing for a coupe for some reason)
About $6500/$7500/$10k trade/auction/retail

That's about what I was thinking. This one has a so-so repaint so I'm more inclined to drop it off your $10K retail number.

Michaell

breld said:

If you all think I'm an enabler, you should meet my wife. @jpp5862 and @michaell can vouch for that.

Just wait 'til this Saturday when we're all going around together "browsing."

We keep telling her to get her own account here at Edmunds.

Every conversation we have turns into one about cars within 5 minutes. She's incorrigible; if she had her way I'd have bought 5 cars since I leased the Jetta.

She's also a darn nice lady.

28firefighter

Can we introduce Mrs @breld to Mrs. 28FF? I would like my wife to become an enabler.

andres3

I really want out of my 3 year lease with the '16 Kia Optima LX 1.6T Eco model. I should have done the 2-year lease. So as of labor day, it'll be 2 years old.

It currently has 23,500 miles, is in good condition, and is in San Diego, CA. It is metallic white with a beige interior.

The residual is 54% of MSRP, which if I'm remembering right puts it at $13,500.

How big of a pill do I have to swallow to unload this contraption that gets way less than the EPA mileage promised?

Blue pill, or red pill.

breld

@andres3 - so...I'm sure you don't want to get ahead of yourself in case it's too difficult to get out of the Optima, but what are the candidates for replacement?

andres3

breld said:

@andres3 - so...I'm sure you don't want to get ahead of yourself in case it's too difficult to get out of the Optima, but what are the candidates for replacement?

A very wide variety of cars right now.

A CPO S6 or 3.0A6 would replace an Optima nicely. A CPO S4 would work too probably.

A Golf R, though I'd prefer a new one to get 7-speed transmission, but not sure VW is ready to deal on a Golf R yet.

That's the high end. On the low end, I doubt it, but maybe a top of the line Optima would do a lot better than mine. I don't think I like the Stinger partly due to visibility.

I'm not sure I like the Accord, but would have to look. Same with a GTI. If I got a GTI; I'd probably long for the Golf R, but maybe not. I hate the color selection on the R, at least the GTI has some more options. A almost non-existant 2-Series with no moonroof might work.

I need power, but I also want good gas mileage. I want quality, but I also want it to be cheaper. Those are opposing forces.

qbrozen

andres3 said:

I really want out of my 3 year lease with the '16 Kia Optima LX 1.6T Eco model. I should have done the 2-year lease. So as of labor day, it'll be 2 years old. It currently has 23,500 miles, is in good condition, and is in San Diego, CA. It is metallic white with a beige interior. The residual is 54% of MSRP, which if I'm remembering right puts it at $13,500. How big of a pill do I have to swallow to unload this contraption that gets way less than the EPA mileage promised? Blue pill, or red pill.

Plug it into carvana and vroom and see what comes back. What is your monthly? What is current buyout?

auction value is only $12.5k right now.

andres3

qbrozen said:

andres3 said:

I really want out of my 3 year lease with the '16 Kia Optima LX 1.6T Eco model. I should have done the 2-year lease. So as of labor day, it'll be 2 years old.

It currently has 23,500 miles, is in good condition, and is in San Diego, CA. It is metallic white with a beige interior.

The residual is 54% of MSRP, which if I'm remembering right puts it at $13,500.

How big of a pill do I have to swallow to unload this contraption that gets way less than the EPA mileage promised?

Blue pill, or red pill.

Plug it into carvana and vroom and see what comes back. What is your monthly? What is current buyout?

auction value is only $12.5k right now.

I'm going to round for easy math, but I assume my buyout would be:

12x200 = $2,400
Residual = 13,500
Kia Disposition penalty if I don't buy or lease another Kia = $500

Sounds like I"m 3,000 under water then.

Michaell

andres3 said:

qbrozen said:

andres3 said:

I really want out of my 3 year lease with the '16 Kia Optima LX 1.6T Eco model. I should have done the 2-year lease. So as of labor day, it'll be 2 years old.

It currently has 23,500 miles, is in good condition, and is in San Diego, CA. It is metallic white with a beige interior.

The residual is 54% of MSRP, which if I'm remembering right puts it at $13,500.

How big of a pill do I have to swallow to unload this contraption that gets way less than the EPA mileage promised?

Blue pill, or red pill.

Plug it into carvana and vroom and see what comes back. What is your monthly? What is current buyout?

auction value is only $12.5k right now.

I'm going to round for easy math, but I assume my buyout would be:

12x200 = $2,400
Residual = 13,500
Kia Disposition penalty if I don't buy or lease another Kia = $500

Sounds like I"m 3,000 under water then.

Um, I hate to break it to you, but 2400+13500+500=16400

So, almost $4K under

andres3

Michaell said:

andres3 said:

qbrozen said:

andres3 said:

I really want out of my 3 year lease with the '16 Kia Optima LX 1.6T Eco model. I should have done the 2-year lease. So as of labor day, it'll be 2 years old.

It currently has 23,500 miles, is in good condition, and is in San Diego, CA. It is metallic white with a beige interior.

The residual is 54% of MSRP, which if I'm remembering right puts it at $13,500.

How big of a pill do I have to swallow to unload this contraption that gets way less than the EPA mileage promised?

Blue pill, or red pill.

Plug it into carvana and vroom and see what comes back. What is your monthly? What is current buyout?

auction value is only $12.5k right now.

I'm going to round for easy math, but I assume my buyout would be:

12x200 = $2,400
Residual = 13,500
Kia Disposition penalty if I don't buy or lease another Kia = $500

Sounds like I"m 3,000 under water then.

Um, I hate to break it to you, but 2400+13500+500=16400

So, almost $4K under

Guess I was automatically optimistically assuming someone might pay over auction value on a 2-year old car trade-in with low miles.

andres3

So my brain has been churning..... just park the Kia, make the registration "non-operational" (cheaper) lower my insurance due to no mileage, and give it back a year from now.

That way I get $13,500 for it basically, which is the best I can hope for now anyway.

qbrozen

andres3 said:

So my brain has been churning..... just park the Kia, make the registration "non-operational" (cheaper) lower my insurance due to no mileage, and give it back a year from now. That way I get $13,500 for it basically, which is the best I can hope for now anyway.

The leasing company requires you carry a certain level of insurance. What they can do about it or how they find out if you lowered it, I have no idea. 

kyfdx

qbrozen said:

andres3 said:

So my brain has been churning..... just park the Kia, make the registration "non-operational" (cheaper) lower my insurance due to no mileage, and give it back a year from now.

That way I get $13,500 for it basically, which is the best I can hope for now anyway.

The leasing company requires you carry a certain level of insurance. What they can do about it or how they find out if you lowered it, I have no idea. 

Since they are registered as the payee, in the event of total loss, I'll guess the insurance company will notify them.

Then, they take out their own insurance policy, and bill you for $400/mo. (just guessing on this part).

Seems like the worst idea, ever.

tjc78

They will know.. I changed insurance companies once and about three days later had a letter wanting to know why I took the coverage off.  Told them the new company and all was fine.   I guess the insurance companies report to the leasing companies.  

stickguy

Just drive it. One more year won’t kill ya. Put the underwater into the bank to apply to the next car.

breld

One other thought - naturally, you're looking at the current value of the Optima versus the lease obligation. But what you really owe is the remainder of the payments, which sounds like roughly 12 months x $200, or $2,400. Lease experts can chime in if I'm wrong, but can't you prepay the remainder of the payments and hand the keys over and turn it in?

I'm not saying that necessarily makes sense, 'cause if you're making the payments, you may as well drive it. But if it's a matter of moving on to something you enjoy more, seems this may be cheaper than trading it since you're just paying it down to the stated residual instead of eating the difference between obligation and market value (which is lower than the residual).

kyfdx

breld said:

One other thought - naturally, you're looking at the current value of the Optima versus the lease obligation. But what you really owe is the remainder of the payments, which sounds like roughly 12 months x $200, or $2,400. Lease experts can chime in if I'm wrong, but can't you prepay the remainder of the payments and hand the keys over and turn it in?

I'm not saying that necessarily makes sense, 'cause if you're making the payments, you may as well drive it. But if it's a matter of moving on to something you enjoy more, seems this may be cheaper than trading it since you're just paying it down to the stated residual instead of eating the difference between obligation and market value (which is lower than the residual).

No.. if you turn in a lease early, you are responsible for the current wholesale market value, and the difference between that and the payoff. Your actual lease payments mean nothing.

breld

I have a question for myself.

My stepdaughter's lease on the Jetta is nearing its end and so we'll be looking for a replacement. What are the values on her Jetta at this point?

2016 VW Jetta - Sport trim
Black exterior
32k miles
Automatic transmission
Good condition

henryn

kyfdx said:

No.. if you turn in a lease early, you are responsible for the current wholesale market value, and the difference between that and the payoff. Your actual lease payments mean nothing.

I was about to ask the same question, but I finished reading before posting the question. Shaking my head, unbelievable.

That does leave the possibility of trying to get someone to take over the lease, yes? Which would save you the $2,400 in lease payments and the cost of one year's full coverage insurance ( +/- $1,000 ?)

So guessing at $3,400 out of your pocket, you could offer up half of that ( $1,700) as an incentive for someone to take over the lease?

28firefighter

breld said:

I have a question for myself.

My stepdaughter's lease on the Jetta is nearing its end and so we'll be looking for a replacement. What are the values on her Jetta at this point?

2016 VW Jetta - Sport trim
Black exterior
32k miles
Automatic transmission
Good condition

I'd guess 11-12k...

kyfdx

Depends on the bank... and, if they absolve you of financial responsibility. Some don't.

Mr_Shiftright

kyfdx said:

Depends on the bank... and, if they absolve you of financial responsibility. Some don't.

Which means what---that you're actually sort of a co-signer for the person who took over your lease?

steine13

kyfdx said:

[I]f you turn in a lease early, you are responsible for the current wholesale market value, and the difference between that and the payoff. Your actual lease payments mean nothing.

What is owed on a lease is spelled out in the contract: The payments, and he car. That's it.

Is there an obligation to hold on to a car for a certain period of time? Why? Who would benefit?

I have twice turned in a GM lease early; once by a couple months and once by half a year, both on 2-year leases. The remaining payments were made beforehand and my obligation was over.

If they had started talking about 'market value' I would have been dumbfounded. I had fulfilled my obligation to make the payments and return the car with the specified miles in the specified condition. What would be the argument? It's now worth less because I didn't age it enough?

Anything is possible in contract law, I guess, but that makes no sense.

28firefighter

Correct. Some of the captives will allow a lease transfer but require you remain on the lease effectively as a co-signer. The most recent case we've heard about is an Infiniti lease transfer, the person who took over the lease died, and Infiniti is holding the original lessee responsible for payments, insurance, and condition of the vehicle.

kyfdx

steine13 said:

kyfdx said:

[I]f you turn in a lease early, you are responsible for the current wholesale market value, and the difference between that and the payoff. Your actual lease payments mean nothing.

What is owed on a lease is spelled out in the contract: The payments, and he car. That's it.

Is there an obligation to hold on to a car for a certain period of time? Why? Who would benefit?

I have twice turned in a GM lease early; once by a couple months and once by half a year, both on 2-year leases. The remaining payments were made beforehand and my obligation was over.

If they had started talking about 'market value' I would have been dumbfounded. I had fulfilled my obligation to make the payments and return the car with the specified miles in the specified condition. What would be the argument? It's now worth less because I didn't age it enough?

Anything is possible in contract law, I guess, but that makes no sense.

Because they can....