Older Acura TLs

billyperks

Get your facts together before you start writing.
How can you say a G35 competes with a TSX.
In what way? Please tell me, I might be missing some automotive facts here.

The I35/G35 is the TL'S competitor, and for your information Nissan did away with the I35.

I bet you are one of those salesperson who knows nothing about the product you sell.

mredaa

OK, maybe the Accord isn't "ugly" when compared to the outrageous styling of the Maxima, but but it's a contradiction on wheels: aggressive front end with a Buick back end. BTW, my TL-S is black with a mirror finish thanks to applications of Klasse and Platinum. See myself? I can see the whole neighborhood! And the blue specs in the Nighthawk pearl simply shimmer. Gorgeous!
Regarding the G35/I35, The G35 is built on the Maxima frame but has the Z engine which is why it's so fast. Given that, it would seem more fair to compare the TL with the G35 than with the Maxima. And paying $30K+ for a Nissan is just plain silly. One last thing, a co-worker bought a Maxima (for $33K) but the hood was crooked. After weeks of aggravation including a replacement that also had a crooked hood, he returned the car and bought a TL-S. He's very happy.

bodble2

They replaced the car back because of a crooked hood? Must have been REALLY crooked. Wonder how it passed pre-delivery inspection?!

ruski

no you are wrong. It is the other way around. The Z has Maxima's engine.

sailoverfuel

I guess its a waste of time to get into a typical price discussion regarding the New TL but I just hope some of youn guys are right.

I can't see how the New TL will be around 35K with Nav leather and loaded....but it would be nice. On the other hand we can have a BMW 325 with Premium P (Leather, Wood trim, Sunroof... more) and Nav for about 33K...HELLO! yes I know...it is slower...so what its german and drives awesome.

This is the War of the 30something thousand dollar cars...and ther is no right answer...there are MANY options and thats great. I am torn between G35/BMW3's/New TL and others.

I look forward to seing the TL in person

kyfdx

As varmint said earlier, I think prices on the TL are going to be just under $32K, so maybe just under $34 with Navi... As for the BMW, 325i's with leather, premium pkg, auto, and heated seats are $34,895... and thats for a 2003.. Add navi and price increase for 2004, and you are looking at $37K minimum, and a car which historically sells closer to sticker than an Acura. Not saying which is better, but I think the Acura will definitely be cheaper.

regards,
kyfdx

ahm_torrance

I don't think that the TL and the BMW 3 series can really be compared. The 3 is smaller than a Civic! The TL would be much better compared to a 5 series, which the TL is MUCH less expensive than. The TSX would be a better comarison to a 3 series.

sailoverfuel

But BMW has 3K manufacturer rebate for 03 models and are willing to negotiate big time allowing it to compete with the TL (even though its smaller).

04 will change things and it is around the corner so you guys are right. nevertheless, I am not suret the 04 model will go up to 37K...thats a big jump. It should stay in the upper 35K area and that should include premium p. nd Nav.

sailoverfuel

If the price of a TL with goodies and Nav is just under 34K....we have a winner (in my humble opinion).

How many horsepower does it have?

Are u sure it will be in the ubder 34K? Is that MSRP or waiting for it to go down? The TSX is holding up nice and tight...I would not be counting on the TL to go down as fast as some have commented

kyfdx

There is no rebate on 2003 325i sedans, just the coupes and convertibles... and almost none of them left.... They don't compare the 5-series with the TL, because over $10K difference in price..most people shop price.

kyfdx

varmint

Personally, I think the 3 series slots between the TSX and TL. It's the same size as a TSX, but it provides more of the feature content found in the TL.

Sailoverfuel - The most reliable source we've seen thus far claims 270 horsepower.

I think you're correct on wait times and discounting. The first gen TL went for MSRP (or close to it) for quite a while. Now, you can get one for a relative bargain, but, in the first few years, prices were pretty firm.

automophile

Yes, the 3-series BMW is a comparison with the TSX, not the new TL. We had looked at all the cars in this area, and found the TSX to be the "Best Buy" overall. In our opinions, the TSX is superior in almost every way to the 3, and nearly $10K cheaper. No contest.

I hope that it will be the same way with the new TL vs. the 5-series. Can't wait!

radocha

TSX...Best buy? yes, perhaps when value is the main factor
"superior in almost every way to the 3?" which parallel universe are you logging on from?
It should be the same story with TL...compelling bland of value and performance

automophile

Have you driven a TSX? Drive 'em both, look at the long term reliability, features, and interior details and ergonomics, and THEN make that statement. The final insult is the price gouging for an extremely over-rated car. No - the final insult is the attitude of the sales and service staff.

The Japanese are getting close, very close.

THEN look at the "NEW" stying from BMW, and when you're through heaving, you'll welcome smooth and sleek. The new 5 is worse than the 7s.

tsxfan19

agreed about the new 5 series being worse than the 7 series

jchan2

The TSX competes with the G35 because it is smaller and more sportier than the TL. Yes, the TL type S is sporty, but the TSX is even sportier, therefore competing with the G35. The TL is more of a ES300/I35/LS competitor rather than a G35 competitor- that's the TSX's job and not the TL's.

amazon

I saw one in Dublin, OH today. It's not as good looking car as the one it replaces (and I have, i might add 8^)). Really sharp and boxy design in my opinion. THe wife likes the design, though. The only good thing is that it's supposed to be available with a 6 sp. manual.

carguy58

I have seen the interior pictures and it looks great. The front looks good. The back end from side looks an 02-03 Mitsubishi Galant from the side. I haven't seen a clear back end view of the tailights though so its too soon for me judge its looks. I think the picture I did see them in once had foil wrapped around the tailights. I like the 02-03 TL exterior styling alot even though some people think it looks bland. The thing is in pictures the 04 TL looks very "Compact" on the outside. Thats amazing to me how the 04 TL looks "compact" compared to the previous 2 generations of TL.

s852

The TL is competing with the G35 because it is priced in the same range and has engine power in the same range.
The only way the price of a TSX is even close to a G35 is if you decide to compare a TSX selling at full MSRP to a base G35 discounted and with zero options (cloth seats, no moonroof, no Premium Package etc.).
As soon as you option up a G35 to match the TSX's features, it jumps into the TL's price range or even higher.
The same goes for the BMW 3 series. It may be in the TSX's size range, but not price. Even the 189HP 325 outprices even the TL once you add common options, much less the TSX some compare it to. The 330 even more so.
Some people with $27-$28K to spend on a car will buy stripped 325's and G35's instead of a TSX if they can find those without options and they are free to go buy them if that's what they want.

merc1

Whats going on in here, the TSX does NOT compete with the G35 in any way. They are two very different cars to say the least.

M

billyperks

For the second time, get your facts together, we are all telling you that the "G" competes with the TL, NOT THE TSX.

mredaa

Let's get it straight
The TL competes with the G35.
Remember the TL is effectively a very nicely redone Accord while the G35 is a very nicely redone Altima, and the Accord competes directly with the Altima.

The BMW is an anomaly. A fully loaded 330i is considerably smaller than the TL while the TSX's 200 HP 4 banger FWD doesn't compare with BMW's 225 HP in-line 6 with RWD. BMW's closest competitors are actually the Audi A4,the Jaguar X-type, and the Mercedes C-class none of which has been mentioned. Fully loaded, all three of these cars are mid to upper 30's and similar in size (read smaller). The TL is much larger and so actaully competes with the G35, and ES300 but is a better value than either. BTW, The BMW 5, is $45K which puts it in a totally different price range. It really competes with the 3.5 RL, Audi A6, the Mercedes E class, and the Lexus GS430.

2003tls

Acura has always maintained that the TL competes against the BMW 5 series. Maybe a stretch, but that's what they claim. The TSX is for the 3 series. Pricing wise, though, the TL does price out close to the 3 series.

2003tls

Hate to beat a dead horse, but the Maxima styling almost makes me forget how bad the Accord's is. Where is Nissan going with their styling? Have you seen the new Quest? Yuk! The new TL is down right gorgeous compared to the Maxima.

kfhmail

OK guys. What competes with what is REALLY up to the person doing the buying.

In my opinion: I am looking at the G35 sedan and waiting on the 2004 TL, therefore as far as I am concerned the TL and G35 are competing for my money. Also, I like the IS 300 but it is too small, but still it competes with the G35 and 2004 TL. I also like the 3 series BMW and think it competes with my other choices better than the 5 series, based on what I am considering to be important to me. Also, if Mitsubishi had a good styled DIAMANTE (like the 1992 model) it might also compete for my money. The 1992 Diamante is a great car...but I do not like the current style.

Size and horsepower and cost and image REALLY only have a "little" to do with what competes for a buyers money.

What competes for a buyers money is what the buyer likes. The cars may be quite different in performance or cost. I may like one thing about one car and something else about another car.

Rarely is one car PERFECT.

Therefore I compare several cars and pick the one I like best overall. Which may mean quite different cars are competing for my money.

As far as advertising, yes certain cars compete better with others, but in the real world it is really up to the buyer to determine which cars are competing for his money. My ego is not that big...I do not like something because I am suppose to. What competes with what, is what I like, not what someone tells me I should like.

That's my two cents worth...Looking forward to actually seeing and touching a 2004 TL.

merc1

Acura is on something if they think the TL competes with the 5-Series would be my first thought. However I guess the TL-S could compete with the 525i in some people's minds, how I'm not sure. It surely doesn't compete with the 530i or the 540i, although the TL-S has the hp on the 530i there is way too much $$$ difference there. The TL-S competes with the 3-Series, the 330i to be specific. The TSX? It competes with the 325i and nothing else in BMW lineup. Now people comare Escapes to Sequioas, but that doesn't mean they actually "compete".

mredaa,

The G35 has nothing in common with the Altima, they are based on two totally different platforms. The only thing they share is their V6, in different states of tune. The FFL(?) platform underpins the Maxima, Altima, Qwest, and Murano. The FM platform underpins the G35 Sedan/Coupe, 350Z and my favorite, the FX 35/45. Isn't platform, or as some (GM) call it "architecture" sharing grand!

M

robertsmx

Spy pictures have been out for a while:
Exterior: Side 1
Exterior: Side 2
Exterior: Front
Interior

Looks sharp! Appears smaller than the current TL, and may be it is couple of inches shorter (which will make it about as long as the Accord, and seven inches longer than TSX), but I can bet it is larger the the 1999-2003 TL on the inside.

The cut near the door sill is reminiscent of the same from S2000, the fenders from early 90s Legend is back, as is low front overhang.

It will have 270 HP, and the interesting news...
Optional: Performance tires (not all-season anymore, P235/45/R17), Upgraded brakes (Brembo) with 6-speed manual transmission as a package.

robertsmx

Honda/Acura chooses not to add an aggressive tip-in effect when you depress the gas pedal, this is probably what you mean by "acceleration shock". It is used in a lot of GM and Ford vehicles as well.

And if you have a base TL, also consider that it doesn't have much advantage in power over your Maxima, given that the TL weighs 200-300 lb. more. With TL-S, you should not have the issue.

And if you do have the TL-S, give some time for the engine to break in. And the TL-S engine is also tuned to produce a deeper exhaust note.

amazon

Took a road trip for the last coule of days with my '03TL-p. I got 33 MPG in speeds varying between 45-90 MPH. Most of the tome was spent at 70-75MPH, though.

kennyg5

33 mpg, that is very impressive! I drive an 03 Maxima, and the best I have gotten was only 27, and that is assuming that the trip computer was not exaggerating. The Max can get very thirsty, especially if you press hard on the gas pedal, which, however, gives you an enormous thrill of spirited acceleration. I also like the TL -- in fact, I almost bought one but for my concerns about its transmission (after reading the posts here by some TL owners).

courtney11

As for the pictures I have seen I am bit dissappointed. It is much shorter and does not really appeal to me, will have to see it in person. As for the price, considering I paid $27200 new, for a 2001, I think the 04' will have to cost at least $34k to separate it from the TSX. The big question for me is the engine and transmission. Is the 04' going to have basically the same engine as the 03' type S tweeked to give it a few more horses or is it a totally new engine. I hope it is new. And the transmission, so far mine has been fine but I only have 22000 miles. Is it the same type and have they finally gotton it together. Have they learned how to make a transmission that shifts like a luxury car should, smoothly or are we to be dissappointed again. There are quite a few problems out there, at least they extended the warranty on the transmission. Where are the fog lights? By adding the TSX the TL should become more of a luxury car but i feel it looks a bit cheaper, hope I am wrong. I will be looking at it the moment it arrives.

ash213

I felt the same way when I looked at the pictures, bit too small, just like an Accord. Therefore I picked-up a 2003 TL yesterday. Type S it too noisy and stiff riding for me.

richtheslick

If the 2003 TL type s does 0-60 in about 6.5 seconds, and 2004 TL looks to be a better performance car, what are the estimates for 0-60 based on the HP boost? Maybe an extra .2 shaved off? So 6.3 seconds reasonable?

richtheslick

Does anyone know if there will be a kit for the wing-rear spoiler, underbody rear spoiler, side spoiler, front under body spoiler. I think they would really dress this car up and make it look great. The added styling would really help.
Just look at at TSX with and without a rear spoiler/wing. Huge difference in sportiness.
Thoughts?

scott31

I got 34-35 on my trip to Long Island. With the AC on.

mhuang100

Just saw a couple of pics from a japanese car magazine. Head lights are much bigger than US version. The rear is almost same. More luxury look from the front.

amazon

The bottom line is that you can get very good gas milage on the highway. That tall gearing in the 5th gear does pay off.

varmint

Mhuang100 - Do you mean the Inspire? That's a gilded copy of the NA Accord. It shares zero sheetmetal with the 2004 TL. Or did you see something else?

ruski

I drive 50-50 highway/streets and usually get 250 miles per tank. The worst was once when I got only 200 miles per tank. The best - close to 300 miles per tank.

scott31

I drive about the same mix. I routinely get over 350 miles a tank. Are you in a lot of stop and go traffic?

ruski

not really too much stop and go

also when I was commuting to my previous job it was 80% highway. I still got only 250 miles per tank.

Maybe it has something to do with how fast I drive - 80/90mph?

For some reason my tires only last 10K miles too, and I do NOT peel or smoke them. But I do take corners a bit more aggressively than normal people.

hclll

It happend again so sooon! Nasty Philly.
FIrst ding @600 miles and now this one. I trie every my best to park away from other cars, but just couldn't avoid it!!!

A red Civic coupe parked next to me after I left the parking lot and dinged my front passenger door. I thought Princeton is a nice area therefore people there must be nice, but I was wrong! This country got jerks everywhere!!

I headed straight to Home Depot and got a hammer. Im going to keep it in the trunk, in case some jerk ding my door again,.....

THank god I leased this car instead of buying, but now when I pay the bill every month, I am feeling paying for a piece of crap, and still got 36 months to go!!

swsms

You can almost bet there will be a full spoiler kit for the '04 TL!!!

mhuang100

varmint- Nothing like the NA Accord. It looks just like the 2004 Acura TL except the front. The head light has a similar shape of Lexus ES 300. The grille is bigger than 2004 NA TL and looks more upright. There are two engines: 260HP and 300 HP.

richtheslick

Check this out, and enjoy. I can't wait to see this ride with a full spolier package, it will look tight. I saw this on another forum, somone photoshopped the rims and added a tint.

http://mywebpages.comcast.net/directplus/NiceBlack04TL.jpg

billyperks

Relax- call Dent Wizard, they will take care of it for a reasonable price.

I am just like you, I park my car miles away from other cars just to avoid the purpose and non purpose dings.

I take my wife's Camry to the Malls.

king_george

mhuang100: you said there will be two engine options on the new TL? 260hp & 300hp...are you sure, and what makes you say so? Mostly what i've read on this forum states 270-280hp. Also does anyone know if they're gonna be using a new tranny for the 04 TL because people have been complaining about the current one? Lastly...the horsepower is increasing but does anyone know if there will be any torque increase?
thanx...

1violinist

tedescm1: I actually like the seats -- the bolstered sides hold you snuggly in place. They remind me of the BMW sports seats (an option that costs $1200 in BMW).

Anyone seen the interior in "camel"? It looks like a cool color!

varmint

Mhuang100 - Thanks. I haven't seen the pic you are referencing, but I'm guessing it probably looks more the RL photo-chop that has been circulating in Japanese mags.

http://www.imakenews.com/autospies/e_article000151480.cfm

(Thanks to Swsms for the link.)

King George - No one knows any of that for certain.

bodble2

I would be happy to give up a bit of peak HP in exchange for improved driveability. I find the current Type-S motor not always as smooth as should be, especially on initial throttle tip-in. By comparison, the 3.0 V6 in our '02 Accord is much more even-keeled, and therefore, under most driving conditions, is actually more pleasant to drive.