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Comments
I feel like a 2 year/24000 mile extended warranty is just compensation plus extend On Star another year. This compensation has it's benefits for both sides. First of all, there is no out of pocket cost for GM at this point, except some minor paperwork I suspect. Secondly, the long term cost could be minimal if these vehicles are as outstanding as they say. Thirdly it would be good publicity showing that GM is standing behind these early production models by supporting and compensating us early buyers after this unfortunate debacle. For us, it would help give us peace of mind over the quality of our trucks and give us some possible support down the road to make up for this unprecedented recall. Or is it unprecedented?
I have yet to hear from my dealer and I am to the point that I don't care that much. The longer it goes,
- the harder I drive my rental
- the more I will want out of GM
- the less likely I will ever buy GM again
(this was my 3rd)
- the more likely I will trade my TB sooner
and let all my friends know how I was
treated!
I too looked into the lemon law in Illinois but at 30 working days and some verbage that makes it a little unclear to me the exact specifics, I don't think it's going to help. On the other hand, I still have 11 more months of possible problems and additional recalls....
1. They must make us feel confident that the truck is sound by extending the warranty by 2 years. The Bravado is already 5 years why not TB and Envoy.
2. There must be some financial compensation. At least a first car payment. Or a better loan rate.
3. Last, something to encourage loyalty. Future rebates, free GM accessaries.
My concern is that GM will decide on the least expensive way and we will all feel slighted. They would be smart to over compensate us and ensure the romance never ends.
After talking with GM a few times, I have always come to fair compromises with a couple of situations I had. I think they generally want to keep you as a customer and if you are reasonable, they will give you decent compensation.
I have said to GM all along, in letter form, that an extended warranty, extended OnStar and some form of cash payment is in order. The lost time alone is worth something to me. I had to spend 3 hours when they took it and another hour to get it back. Why couldn't the tow truck bring me my car and take back the rental?
The lack of information is the biggest issue for me! Point number one in my first letter was that I expected to be treated with respect and not like an airline passenger! oops!
By the way, my first payment check cleared on April 5!
I own a '99 intrigue and they have not taken care of me they way they have you. I have owned my car for two years and have problems that are unfixable.
You have a problem that is fixable and have been given rental cars.
My dealer does not have parts yet for their 5 stock units ... one sold after the recall. They did receive invoicing for the unit on order "with my name on it" indicating that the repairs were done at the plant (it had a late March production date) and it is shipping.
Hopefully I'll be in a position to decide whether or not I want it soon!!
http://rroman8420.tripod.com/pictures/gm-bkt.jpg
The Service group at the dealer was very nice, actually understands our concerns, but he said he personally feels very confident about this fix and he has no reservations about putting his family in one of these SUV's.
When we arrived home last night we also received a call from the GM Assistance Center. This new lady was very nice. The first one we were getting calls from was, to say the least, very short with us and always explained that GM is doing everything possible to ensure that these cars are fixed properly. I did not like her. But the new one is very understanding and is supposed to be contacting us again today after speaking with the dealer. We had filed a claim with the Ohio BBB Auto line and also sent a letter to GM. The letter to GM is what prompted this last call!
debbin97, you are right!!!!!!!
Those people at GM do not either communicate together or have no clue as to what are they doing or both.
***** I wrote this message while on hold with GM, a 10 minute hold!, the rep came back to me telling me that there is nothing on my record indicating that an offer was made regarding the smart maintainance, she even claimed that I might be wrong and that that call was not from GM *****
-Alan
Remember the Business Week interview I did, well, maybe they should call me back and rewrite their article: "What is GM going to do with these unhappy owners?" or "Will GM loose its customers?" I don't know!
GM needs to figure out a fair compensation. We are the advertisers of these vehicles.
Just because we get them back, we should not stop posting. It's the only way that we know that we have all been treated equally. GM will not want us to know what the others have gotten as compensation. I still feel that the extended warranty is justified. The $3,500 rebate on the 2001 should be extended to 2002. The Onstar should be extended and upgraded.
Just for giggles, I filed a case yesterday with the Illinois BBB Autoline. I figure I have nothing to lose and probably nothing to gain either (knowing GM)!! Oh well.
Other than a little bit of my time I haven't been inconvenienced very much. I had to to some driving for my company this month. It was nice not to have to put all that mileage on my new truck
Allen
Allenr - I didn't purchase a Ford because of all the problems that family and friends have had with them in the past not just the 2002. I purchased a 91 GMC Mini van the same week as my cousin purchased a Ford Aerostar. Needless to say hers was in the shop all the time and fell apart in five years. Mine is still running great and my 16 year old now drives it.
I've been a faithful GM purchaser of over 10 new vehicles and have never had my vehicles taken back in the manner that this was done. It still seems as if they are trying to hide and cover up things. Being open and honest would have went alot further with most of us.
1. GM Customer Assistance
2. The individual Divisions, in my case Oldsmobile.
When I talk to the GM customer Assistance person, they know nothing that the Oldsmobile customer assistance person was told and visa versa.
The GM person is not offering anything. They fixed (or are fixing) and we should all be happy!
The Oldsmobile person is offering (to me) the 2 year "Smart Care" package, covers oil changes, tire rotations, inspections, and so on. If I can use this at any Olds dealer this might be good, but my dealer is almost 50 miles away.
Oldsmobile is also offering 3 additional months of On-Star.
That is pretty much the offer. We are all supposed to be receiving a letter from the respectice divisions (not GM) about this in 5 to 7 days.
By the way, we made them re-wash our car because it looked like crap, and they said they had washed it 1 day earlier.
Allen
I have asked for one car payment and 2 years extended warranty. If they grant me my request, it shows me that they value me as a customer. I think GM did the right thing in pulling the SUV's off the road. Now they again need to do the right thing.
But wait, the voicemail light is blinking on my phone at work! What's that? My long lost baby is fixed, and ready to be picked up! Imagine my surprise when I finally got this call.
Just got home after picking up my TB, and I may be able confirm a lot of the talk about "compensation". I have a copy of the GM Service bulletin in front of me that was sent to dealers at 2:36 PM (EST) today. As noted in several posts, GM is offering a 3 month extension for OnStar, and 2/24 Smart Care Coverage. It also tells the dealers all remaining brackets will ship within 1-2 days. My dealer had only received 5 sets for the previously delivered vehicles. She was pretty peeved, because there were not enough to get her Demo back on the road. Also, the letter GM is sending out to owners is very clear in stating there is no welding required.
My thoughts on compensation: I would much rather have seen a warranty extension, or a loyalty coupon of $1500-$2000 on next purchase. Hate to start a war, but either of those seem very fair to me (and I will probably continue to lean on GM for one of the two). Either of these options would be $0 cost upfront to GM, and probably not that big a deal on the back end either, as it would be pretty spread out. They would both, however, go a long way toward rebuilding the all-important customer satisfaction.
I just don't understand all the talk of cash payments & class action suits. How do you put a $$ value on inconvenience and frustration that would amount to anything? Besides, how much inconvenience have we suffered? I suppose lawyers probably have some mysterious algorithm that can calculate that value, but I wouldn't want to try to do it under oath.
When I picked up my TB it had a very minor knick in the door from another vehicle. I know it wasn't there when I brought it in, as like most owners of new vehicles, I hadn't parked it within a 100 yards of another vehicle for the week I had it. They did fall all over themselves assuring me they would fix it when I told them for $32K I would prefer to put my own knicks in it.
True story: When the service picker-upper asked me what color the truck was, I was momentarily stumped. I guess it really had been quite a while!
If you do not mind, would you please post the customer service # at Old. Thanks
-Alan
Oh yeah, I forgot to mention I live in Central Florida (double ouch!!).
A classic example of the type of mystery that has enveloped this recall happened to me yesterday. I was talking to my "service advisor" yesterday, and he actually said (and I quote) "I'm not supposed to tell you this, but your parts have been shipped, and should be here today or tomorrow". It got really entertaining when I asked him why he wasn't supposed to tell me this little fact. This conversation happened at 4:00 PM yesterday. They called at 11:33AM today to tell me my truck was ready for pickup.
I bought my Envoy (had to stop and think of the name, it's been so long since I've seen it) over the internet. The dealer I bought it from is over 100 miles away. My Envoy was realled and hauled to the nearest GMC agency that doesn't seem to really care about my wishes or the welfare of my vehicle since I didn't buy it from them. The dealership is Don Mackey Oldsmobile, Pontiac, GMC in Tucson, AZ. I would have had my Envoy taken back to Phoenix where I bought it but my wife was quite ill
and I couldn't do that. Obviously the dealership is more interested in, I don't have a remote idea what they're interested in, so since GM has seen fit to give me a bunch of BS and I've gotten nothing but the straight arm from Don Mackey it seems that we're at their mercy. Has anyone else had that experience? And oh yes, I might add that I tried to buy my vehicle from the local dealer. I called and asked if they had any 2002 Envoys I could look at. I was told, "No we don't have any." then the guy hung up before I could ask any more. Quite frankly I think I made one hell of a mistake by buying this vehicle. Now I'm stuck with it and those who think GM is going to do anything to promote good will are sadly mistaken. Hopefully I'm wrong but I've been screwed before and we're now dealing with experts in that field.
My dealer has handled his end very professionally. I have made my request for compensation(refer to post #698) and he is willing to go to bat for me. He has already added running boards to my Envoy at no charge. If in the beginning we were all reasonable and understanding, then you will receive the same respect. That doesn't mean that I wasn't frustrated with the fact they recalled my Envoy less than a week after I bought it. But these things can happen on a new design. I think the proper way to handle this is with patience and respect.
Steve
Host
Vans, SUVs and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards
If we want to be heard, we have to scream a chorus in unison. Over the next few days, if we deluge the customer service number and go on record that we expect some "good will" compensation. Also state on record that if the compensation GM comes up with is not satisfactory, we will go out of our way to discourage would be buyers to avoid these vehicles and GM in general at any cost because they don't know what "customer care" means, that GM is too much profit oriented. Also state that we will go onto every post we know of and share our dissatisfaction on the Internet.
This is sure to get their attention. If all 6000 initial purchasers do this, GM will have much more of a marketing uphill climb with that much "bad publicity" going against them. If 6000 people scream in the forest and GM is deaf, is a sound made?
Also, why doesn't the 2002 Envoy have Xenon HID headlights? The older models do, seems like a step backwards. Anyone have any comments on the ability of the halogen headlights to light up the road and beyond? The claim is that they are "high power halogens" whatever that means. How do they compare to other cars, trucks, etc...
I realize that not many have had much experience with either of these items, but any comments would be appreciated.
As for compensation, I don't see GM making the first payment, how would that be fair since everyone's will be different. Mine is fairly low since I plunked down a lot of hard earned cash.
Can anyone tell me what the 2/24 Smart Care coverage is? How can some people be aware of this offer and the GM customer service reps don't know anything about it! It's simply unbelievable if you ask me. Whoever is coordinating this does not what they are doing. It shouldn't be rocket science to keep your customers reliably and frequently informed. All it should take is a little common sense for whoever is running this thing and put themselves in our shoes to know what to do and how to handle it.
I agree we should all post everywhere if we are not satisfied over the end result. However there is probably less than 50 different people here out of 6000, probably not enough for GM to sweat about unless we can get the word out. Where else can we post? How about starting AOL chat rooms for those of you on AOL and titling them GM SUV RECALL to bring more of us together.
I got my Envoy back from the dealer today after only 17 days?!?! The dealer was very professional and up front with me (after I contacted the dealer's General Manager with my concerns). I was told that the fix took only one hour, but that the wheel alignment on the first truck (not mine) took over three hours to perform. When they got to my truck, (#4 in the dealer's order), the fix and alignment took a little over two hours. Granted, my truck also needed the driver's outside mirror and right side air conditioner vent needed to be fixed, the truck was ready by 6pm as promised by the dealer. I only wish that GM was as courteous and forthcoming with info as was the dealer. In my case, I even had to call GM's Executive offices in the RenCen in Detroit to express my displeasure with the way this whole situation has been handled. I have been dealing with an Exec Asst. to the Chairman of the Board who has been most helpful. But, the jury is still out if that will make any difference with the eventual outcome.
From the get-go, GM was not forthcoming with info, gave conflicting info, or just did not know what was going on. On top of that, the rudeness of some of the Customer Service Reps made for some "heated exchanges". I feel that we are due some combination of compensation. I think that an additional 3 years and 36000 mile extended warranty; one year OnStar extension, and a 3 year 36000 Smart Care Coverage is fair. From GM's viewpoint the extended warranty will only cost them if a vehicle breaks down (are they that confident that the vehicles will not?? I am not). The OnStar extension is minimal costwise, and 3 years of oil changes should not cost that much.
I don't think that there has been any inordinate amount of whining. When you spend $30k+ for a vehicle, only to have it taken away by the manufacturer, people have a right to get upset.
I think that GM needs to placate the 6000 (??) customers and show some "Good Will". They need to show that they do care about their customers after the sale, not like the Firestone/Ford fiasco.
in a nutshell, i told him that it doesn't seem as though gm is standing behind the safety of this vehicle, and probably wont put its money where its mouth is until we, the unhappy customer, lean on them. we should all be giving it to them when they call, don't make it easy on them, make them squirm. i know that i will be uneasy driving this vehicle unless gm takes a bonafide stand and states that they will extend the bumper to bumper warranty to 6/60. they should also extend the onstar to at least a full three years, i know i'd feel better knowing on star will call for help when the axle breaks and i've run into a tree.
the dealer should also assume some responsibility for pissing me off, they should pay for the smart care and pick up the cost of state safety and emission inspections for the life of car.
finally to all of you who think gm did the right thing. this vehicle had a major part of the suspension break just while shipping. i guarantee that had 6000+ people and their families been out driving around for the past 6 weeks, there would have been injuries, and when the lawyers found out the gm "knew" there were breakages, gms' response would have been "how many millions of dollars would you like" . this was not a great and magnanimous gesture on the part of a giant multinational company, it was "somebody screwed up and if we don't do something quick we are going to have to pay... a lot."
WELL MAKE THEM PAY!!!
stick the state lemon statute in their face!!
RANT AND RAVE!!!
don't make it easy for them
http://edmunds.yellowbrix.com/pages/edmunds/Story.nsp?story_id=20220316&ID=edmunds&scategory=Auto
I've been watching this board closely, since i would like to buy an Envoy (or MDX) around November. Good luck to all of you owners. Looking forward to reading your REVIEWS.
1-800-442-6537.
Hope this helps!
Putting aside GM's historic inability to communicate with customers and the huge variance in dealer service, I think GM has handled this one reasonably well. Consider:
• waved daily limit on U-drives
• getting the vehicles off the street BEFORE someone gets hurt
• Smartcare and Onstar "goody bag"
• "free" wash and gas fill
NO, those things won' t make everthing better, but that's life sometimes. Good luck to all of you as you pursue maximum compensation for the inconvenience you have endured.
Now that many of you have your vehicles back, and others are available for test driving, I'd like to know things like:
• Why choose the the Traillblazer/Envoy/Bravada?
• What vehicle did you replace?
• What other vehicles were you considering:
• Does the I6 really have the power of a V8 (anyone line up beside a Grand Cherokee V8 or get dynoed)?
• Any particular "niggles" to look out for?
• Any options that are must have, or must avoid?
• What else your drive? (This provides some idea as to what part of the driving experience you value).
Thanks in advance!!
Art
I