By accessing this website, you acknowledge that Edmunds and its third party business partners may use cookies, pixels, and similar technologies to collect information about you and your interactions with the website as described in our
Privacy Statement, and you agree that your use of the website is subject to our
Visitor Agreement.
Comments
Several other boards on Edmund's like the extremely active 300M forum have owners who post the links to pictures of their new rides--just about everyone has photos of their new M's posted somewhere. Why no owners showing off the pictures of their great new GM SUV's here? This simple addition would make this board much more helpful and informative. Post pictures people!!
Give it time...when they get their vehicles back...on the road...and runnin smoothly...maybe some pictures will come your way!
mmateyak
P.S. I got stuck in the woods today...had to call a tow to get me out of some muck/mud...wish I had 4wd...cost me $100!!! GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR I want MY Trailblazer!!!!!!!!
I went to the Autoshow in Motion here in Stone Mountain Georgia on April 19. At this event GM brings all of it's vehicles for potential customers to test drive...as well as providing some competitors vehicles. Much to my surprise there was a TB, Envoy and Bravada there for all to test drive through GM's "slalom" course. I commented to the GM rep at the course that GM sure did get those SUV's control arm fixed quickly. He said that that the recal was "cancelled" and that GM had overreacted, that there really wasn't a problem. Sooo....I went home to check the validity of this...certainly can't confirm his statement...was he lying to the customers at this event to save face? Obviously, there would be much irony in inviting 1000's of people to test drive GM vehicles to prove that they are high quality...and then not have them available because of a recall... Sooo...is the vehicle safe without the fix...or not? Can't get a straight answer from the General, that's for sure. WHAT IS UP WITH THIS?
I will be purchasing the TB. I just received a $1000 certificate because of the class action lawsuit against GM's saddle mounted gas tanks in their 73-91 pickup trucks. I can get the GM employee price, and I have the GM card. Sooo...I really HAVE to purchase GM with all those discounts.
I'm still trying to get someone at GM to tell me why I have to buy OnStar with the sunroof on the TB LS model...it makes no sense...of course that's the GM-way sometimes.
It appears to me it may be an option that is truly cosmetic.
Also, why doesn't the 2002 Envoy have Xenon HID headlights? The older models do, seems like a step backwards. Anyone have any comments on the ability of the halogen headlights to light up the road and beyond? The claim is that they are "high power halogens" whatever that means. How do they compare to other cars, trucks, etc...
I realize that not many have had much experience with either of these items, but any comments would be appreciated.
Why? This will make a pretty big difference in your 6 month rate, Also any little finder binder costing less than 500 you wouldn't want to report to your ins. company anyway because it would just cause your rates to go up.
Steve
Host
Vans, SUVs and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards
They also said that the bulletin calls for the cast metal bracket attached to the frame AND the lower control arm to be replaced; both these components in less than an hour and a half. They must be designed to be readily serviced, and I think that they don't dissasemble the front wheel assembly (which would be very involved with CV joint and front drive shaft, brake caliper, brake disc, front wheel bearings, steering linkage, front coil spring, and front shocks), and then have to do wheel alignment.
I do believe they will need to do a front end alignment because the lower control arm gets changed as do the mounting bracket. These would cause variations in the camber, caster and the front/rear wheel position relative to the original alignment.
They also stated that phase I is recall work, get cars back on the road, ship existing vehicles to dealers, and fire up manufacturing again. During Phase II, they will evaluate various compensation plans such as extension of warrantees, On-star, lease payments, and financing terms. They haven't made any decisions at this point.
I'm sure I am missing something obvious here, but the factory has been back in production (priority three according to GM) since 4/19. Yet only 2 current owners (priority one according to GM) have come on this board stating their vehicles had been repaired. My dealer called last Wednesday saying they would let me know "the minute" they received parts, and I haven't heard a peep from them yet.
Are there any more current owners out there that have been fortunate enough to get their vehicles back?
p.s. I'm just trying to get things stirred up a bit, because I'm the same one who has been saying all along I hope they keep the thing another week so I can have some "lemon law leverage". Wow, that was pretty alliterative, wasn't it?
Steve
Host
Vans, SUVs and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards
They are going to try the fix on one of the Envoys in the lot prior to replying the ones on the trucks that were sold, just to make sure all goes well.
By the way, I passed by on Sunday to check on the truck in the lot (they are closed) and noticed that they had parked all the extra Envoys they had for sale in the back of the building, It seems like they aren't pushing it. It is located in central NJ.
My guess would be that some states are serviced first...just as some states receive cars before others. The three main states as far as I know are Florida, Texas and California...simply because they are the three biggest and most populated...thus the most demand. If you live somewhere in outback Montana (beautiful state btw)...dont expect to be serviced first...I just dont think it works that way.
Again, this is all my guess...not fact...could be the reason why some are getting cars back before others...
mmateyak
mmateyak. Regarding where the parts are going first. When the SUV's were first coming out I had read that the Chicago area was receving the first batch of Trailblazers because Chicago is such a dominant market for the Blazer. You would think we would get the parts first too, but who really knows.
I have such a weird feeling over this whole thing. My mother just happened to take a picture of me and my TB on one of the 5 days I actually had it. She gave me the picture this last weekend and I said, "Oh yeah, that's what it looks like! I wondered where my $31,000+ went!"
I will probaby feeler even weirder when I get it back. My new car enthusiasm is long gone, probably to be replaced by concern and trepidation as I drive it down the highway at any kind of speed, like over 40mph.
Someone asked earlier if the rear windows of the TB went all the way down. I don't know since I didn't have it long enough to notice or try.
I was interested in checking out the new Avalanche (before I saw the TB)...and they said sometime in May...only those three states would have them...because they always get shipped to them first. After that...the rest of the states would start to get some here and there...with mass production to all states sometime in the Fall.
So that was my reasoning...really guessing..as to why some people were getting theirs back while others havent heard a thing from their dealers.
I havent purchased a TB yet...Im gonna sit and wait until everyone gets theirs back and see how the feel about them...or if other probs come up. I sure dont want to be in the position you all are in...I feel for all of ya!
mmateyak
Then, yesterday at work I get a call from someone from the dealership (not a service person). The first thing he asks me is "How do you like driving your new Envoy?" I couldn't believe it. He proceeded to tell me that on the day I took possession of the vehicle I should have paid state tax. Didn't seem clear on what kind of tax (sales, gift, etc) but said he's being pressured by "them" to settle the tax and that this is holding up my registration and title. All I was asked to pay on the day I picked it up was Registration/Title Fee and Documentary Fee. I knew I would have to pay tax at some point but when I told the guy that when they fixed the Envoy, I would give them their tax money. He proceeded to blow up at me over the phone and say that it wasn't acceptable. Tax had nothing to do with the recall and that it couldn't wait. I was so fired up I told him I would call him in a few days.
I live in NJ and don't have any idea on how I should proceed from here. From what I can tell, they shouldn't have let the car off the lot without taxes paid. I'm not trying to get out of paying the taxes but not before I can drive the car again. Am I being unreasonable?
I was just on the phone with the NJ, Division Of Consumer Affairs, Lemon Law unit. According to them, I do have a "case" - based on NJ law, there are few conditions, one of them is "The vehicle is out of operation for 20 or more calendar day, and the nonconformity still exists".
I love the car, I have no intention of getting rid of it. But, I just want to leverage the situation. Not because I am a "user" or whatever, but simply, I am mad as hell, not because of the recall but because of the length of time and not knowing exactly when I will get it back. Others in NJ got their's back.
Any ideas. Thanks
-Alan
My dealer called me yesterday. He told me he had parts for one side in, but would not start on the Envoy until all the parts were in. So I'm still waiting. He also said that it would take approximately 4 hours to repair.
I was just on the phone with the NJ, Division Of Consumer Affairs, Lemon Law unit. According to them, I do have a "case" - based on NJ law, there are few conditions, one of them is "The vehicle is out of operation for 20 or more calendar day, and the nonconformity still exists".
I love the car, I have no intention of getting rid of it. But, I just want to leverage the situation. Not because I am a "user" or whatever, but simply, I am mad as hell, not because of the recall but because of the length of time and not knowing exactly when I will get it back. Others in NJ got their's back.
Any ideas. Thanks
-Alan
We, the poor owners of these vehicles, MUST unite somehow in order to put any pressure at all on GM to compensate us for the horrible inconvenience. I had mine for 35 days, and had really grown accustomed to its amenities! I am paying car insurance as if I was driving it, etc. Not to mention the three hours time lost from work the day they took it. If there's an incentive offered to new purchasers, we damn well BETTER be given the same treatment, at the very least!
I wonder if I'm going to miss out on some sort of post-recall incentive designed to draw buyers back into the showrooms?
Luckily, my old Ford Explorer is working just fine for now, even with 122K miles. Anybody want to rent it from me while you're waiting for yours to return from GM Quarantine?
I only had mine for 4 days when they took it back, but in the short time it was great. It was fun watching other drivers stare at it. In fact, while sitting at a stop sign a car and truck ran into each other while trying to figure out what it was. At least they didn't hit me. When I was driving my Envoy, I was always getting stopped or finding people looking it over in parking lots, so I handed out business cards for the dealership. Maybe that's why their so cooperative. Needless to say, no business cards have been handed out since they took it back.
mmateyak...I can unequivocably put to rest any speculation that Florida will be one of the first 3 states to get replacement parts!!
alani...I think you and I are of the same mind. I have filed my initial lemon law notice with GM & the Florida AG's office, but I don't want to get rid of my truck. I loved it for the week and a half I had it, but we have to get GM's attention somehow. It confounds me as to why they think they can keep us in the dark, and essentially ignore us, and think we will just accept it.
I have never felt anyone owes me something for nothing, but GM has managed to really tick me off over this debacle. I am convinced if we do not all stay on their butts, they will let us walk away with a carwash, and a tank of gas. The interesting thing is I would never even have gotten excited about this if they had not outright lied to us. I have said this in several posts, and am probably boring a lot of folks with it, but.....
1. GM said that the 6000 owners would get the first replacement parts. Very few have them!!!
2. GM said that second priority was dealers with unsold cars. Numerous sitings of vehicles for sale at dealerships!!!
3. GM said start up of Moraine, OH plant was third priority. Plant went back into production 4/19!!!
I am sorry if I keep repeating this, but I feel it is their most egregious offense. If they hadn't so blatantly lied, I would never be honing my two-fingered typing skills so frequently.
You know the story from the dealer. They try and convience you that's how it is made, then he said it might be a design defect. I'm still not satisfied with it and GM will hear from me.
I just got a call from GM (8:12 pm) - the guy was sooooo nice, kept apologizing and saying sorry so many times that I felt sorry for him - stupid me!-. any way, here is the deal:
1- for 2 years / 24000 mile I will get a free maintainance (oil, filter, tire rotation, etc...)
2- the Onstar on the Bravada will be extended for additional 3 month
3- my dealer should get the part by this Fri (when I asked if that date is for my dealer or just a fail safe date, he did not know, he was just given that date by the general)
He explained exactly what the problem is, what are the replacement pieces will be -bracket- and that no welding is involved, and when done, a wheel alignment will be performed.
I am happy with the deal - unless I am very modest guy and that the free maintenance/Onstar thing is just a lollypop that pleases me. Hay, that is not a bad deal, I'll take it.
-Alan
I am making payments too (may be not right away) but at least I am paying for insurance.
My only option is not to pick up the car, then what, the dealer and GM will stop paying for the rental, I can't afford the cost or being without a car.
I wanted to use the law as a leverage, I like the car a lot and indeed want to keep it. The fight will not be easy at least on the level of one individual.
I think we all should get our cars back to avoid paying for rentals off our own money, then we should get together and file a class action suit or something.
OK, please offer an advice as what to do - yes, I am modest, total maintainance cost over 2 years is just $200 and $25 for Onstar - that is nothing comparing the inconvenience, the frustration, etc...
All, offer ideas or thoughts on the subject please.
glock40: you and I knew what we were getting into as far as a 1st year model, it is not an excuse for GM but this is fact
-Alan
The question to ask is: what wrongdoing has the General done? (Define wrongdoing as intentionally harming the plaintiff). In otherwords, did the General intentionally harm the plaintiff or knowingly place the plaintiff in harms way and not take actions to prevent such. Was the recall a direct result of actions by the General or circumstances underwhich the General had the ability to prevent? Did the General have knowledge or believe in anyway that harm was going to occur to the plaintiffs and fail to take action to mitigate the harm? The notion of intent is very important in the legal concept of wrongdoing. Accidents or accidental events are not something that a person or organization can control and therefore difficult find liability.
The second question: if intentional wrongdoing is demonstrable, what is the harm to the plaintiff(s). Loss of use of a vehicle, loss of income due to lack of transportation? Inconvenience and mental distress resulting from traumatic experiences, loss of limbs, loss of health, loss of life?
Finally, the third question: what is fair restitution for the harm to the plaintiffs? If the harm is 1 months loss of vehicle use, fair compensation would be some amount equal to up to triple (in some states) the harm incurred to the plaintiffs (after the lawyers take 30% of that amount for their contigencies). This would be at most, 3 months of interest on car loans, 3 months of lease payments, etc. minus the cost to the General of the auto rental. Note: insurance costs wouldn't be considered part of the harm to the plaintiffs because these are costs that would have been incurred as a normal routine of being a driver (whether or not the recall occured). What might be included is the insurance premium differential between what these vehicles cost to insure (for one month) vs. what the rental we ended up with would cost to insure.
REMEMBER: It doesn't matter how many plaintiffs there are, how many lawyers either side has, when it comes to meeting the legal standards for each of the 3 phases. Increasing the number of plaintiffs in a class action lawsuit only increases the total liability payout if the defendant is found guilty. It does not increase the likelyhood of a judgement in favor of one side or the other. And, at most, there are 6000 plaintiffs (2400 of which are not in the U.S).
Weigh in the actions of the General in conducting the recall, and it becomes very apparent that the legal team was involved in making sure that the General would stand up well in court (though their primary concern was the publicity and marketing side of things).
GM has not been open with us. They are keeping us in the dark and seem to be hiding things from us. When I called on April 5 and was told about the recall, I called GM Customer Service, they told me that their was no recall on the 2002. They did not have any information. How can that be if they closed the plant on April 2.
I think we deserve more compensation than was offer to Alani. We should at least get the following:
1. I purchased the extended warranty on my Envoy. I think that GM should extend the warranty for free. I should be reimbursed the almost $1,400 I paid.
2. The Onstar should be upgraded to 2 years of premium. Who know what breakdowns we may have.
3. I want GM to pay for the deductible for the hail damage to the rental vehicle. I was told that GM would not pay for the extra insurance on the rental.
4. Since they are offering a $3,500 rebate on the 2001, we should get the rebate for the inconvenience we been through.
We deserve more, they said they were going to repair the 6,000 vehicle already sold before they re-opened the plant. Looks like the joke is on us!!! Do you think that they will be delivering new ones from the plant before we get ours back???
Anymore suggestions??