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http://www.lincolnvehicles.com/other/interior.asp?sSection=owners&sSubSection=602
"SOME VEHICLES MAY EXHIBIT AN IDLE DIP AFTER MODERATE TO HARD BRAKING. THIS MAY BE DUE TO A MOMENTARY DROP IN AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION LINE PRESSURE. LOW FLUID LEVEL OR AN IMPROPERLY SEATED TRANSMISSION FILTER MAY CAUSE THIS MOMENTARY DROP IN AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION LINE PRESSURE."
I would never have suspected that it could be trans fluid level-related, but the description sounds very much like what happened to me. After relatively hard braking, the revs dropped, and kept dropping until the engine died. It immediately restarted with no further incident.
This TSB is ONLY listed under the 2000 cars, and mine's a 2001 model, so I don't know if it applies to the later cars or not. At any rate, if you're having this problem with some level of regularity & are taking the car in for diagnosis, you might ask your service department to check the tranny fluid level. There are other TSBs related to trans fluid level checks, so the service tech should have the correct info. (For LLSOC members, Mark gave us a writeup on checking the fluid; it's number 5 in the FAQ section.)
At any rate, this is the first TSB description I've seen that seems to have any relevance to the situation that I experienced, and sounds quite similar to what other owners have described. Maybe this is the answer--or maybe not...
JLinc, LLSOC charter member
You may have read on LLSOC that a number of cars exhibited the stalling condition for the first time (including the one I was driving) upon completion of the autocross course. Each car stalled in the same place and under the same conditions-stopping to pick the time slip.
Lets all look forward to a speedy resolution.
I have passed on a few of your Posts from here, and also directed him to the LLSOC Stalling Thread so he can get more insight.
They are working on the issue.
Best Regards,
Victor
I've had the RR replaced twice and the LR once, since Feb 2000. So, I've been there and done that!
Before I parked the LS for the winter I remember hearing a familiar "I'm gonna break (or is it brake) sound" from the RR again. I haven't opened it since, because of the rainy/cold spring weather. I will once the weather breaks (or brakes??) and have them BOTH replaced. I also got the old "we only fix the broken one" story everytime mine broke - even when I mentioned the TSB.
Stalling:
Has anyone documented this happening on the V6 models, auto or manual? My V6 has never stalled (that I can remember.)
BTW My original Dealership did this Bankston, not my current one Village (Past 1.5 years).
I checked at Lunch and Actually I think I have quite a bit of Pad left Dealer said below 3mm and has to be replaced. I think I have about 1/4 of an inch.. Guess that is about 6 mm.. Will take the wheel off and do a more thorough check this weekend.
For those of you Curious my Dealer Charges $169.00 to replace front brakes. I think I will go with the porterfields and do it myself when the time comes...
The service people at my dealership did not seem too familiar with this problem. The dealer did not have the new regulators in stock on Monday, but got them for Tuesday and replaced both that day without any hassle or question. (I had taken a copy of the TSB with me)
Bruno
re the above posts, a shameless plug for LLSOC and Lincoln: This is icing on the cake of owning and driving a great car. Lincoln doesn't just cooperate with LLSOC, they participate! Their commitment to this car has made me skeptical of my own natural skepticism.
Scott
LLSOC Member
I would like to add that I recently replaced the firehawks with the Kumho Supra 712 series tire, 245/45/17, and have noticed a great reduction in road noise and a great increase in traction... a great tire at 100 ea.. Also, I have a very irritating squeaky sounds, almost like crickets, coming from the passengers side behind the driver when riding down semi-bumpy to really bumpy roads and was hoping someone may know what it is coming from. This isnt coming from rolling the window up and down though it is some metal to metal sound that only comes from light to heavy vibration.
Thanks in advance.
-glazing (shininess of the rotor surface). After a while the open-pore structure of the cast iron surface gets "smeared" over by the pad, and the pores get closed up, and the rotor looses its "just turned" matte finish. This reduces braking efficiency. While turning the rotor restores this efficiency loss, the reduction of rotor thickness that results from the turning down causes some loss of braking efficiency as well. I have been told that long, light braking contributes to glazing.
-corrosion (rust) outside of the swept area of the rotor; More prominent in northern climes where salting of roads takes place. Rust at the margin of the swept area actually will intrude and get under the edges of the pad, causing chamfering at its edges. Not a real bad thing per se, but as I mentioned earlier this can be a source of pedal pulse, and is easy to cure.
When you change the pads and don't turn the rotor, or take time to remove the rust from the rotor, the new pads may be slightly larger than the old ones and ride over these rusty, rough high areas. This might wear a mating ridge into the new pad and not cause a problem, but then again, it might not. Also, your braking distance increases until the pads have had time to "set in".
lsismore - was there a reason that your rotors were'nt turnable (ie. their thickness would be under tolerance) or are they damaged?
Same deal, the car would lose revs and died after coming out of a corner and braking.
I was kind of embarassed for Lincoln at the time.
Ray
Charter member LLSOC
Same deal, the car would lose revs and died after coming out of a corner and braking.
I was kind of embarrassed for Lincoln at the time.
I'd be reluctant to have my rotors turned unless they absolutely need it. The surface finish of the newer rotors is almost mirror like compared to the finish of olde. An improper surface finish would decrease braking efficiency.
Ray
Charter member LLSOC
As markls8 asks: are your rotors damaged? otherwise, your suspicions are confirmed; they're handing you a steaming pile of you-know-what. You can machine the rotors on the LS. If you have a Lincoln dealer you trust, check out their price for a brake job. Most are pretty competitive with the independent shops these days on these kinds of services. You might be surprised.
What's the treadwear rating on the Kumhos? I'm under the impression they're relatively soft, but that might come from seeing them advertised for autocross as well as actually seeing them on so many cars at the autocross we attended at LS Mania III.
Jond-I'd suspect you have a problem with the purge canister. Have your dealer check it. Do you pump your own gas? If so, don't top it off, as this can force liquid gasoline into the canister and it's only designed to handle fumes.
I don't know if leaky injectors would cause a smell outside the car before you started it.
Artie
Charter Member-LLSOC
But thats not the issue. Even after emailing the initial service advisor the link to the TSB (he claims he got the email, although he never replied) on Sunday night, they only replaced the ONE defective regulator. That Service advisor was off when I went to pick up the car last evening, and another helped me. He showed me the invoice which did list two regulator part #'s, left and right, and he assumed both had been replaced. After I got home I carefully looked over the invoice, and it only made reference to labor for replacing the broken one. Went back this am, and the original service advisor and the second service advisor were there. Second one apologized and didnt know why the second regulator part # was listed on the invoice. Both confirmed that only the defective regulator was replaced. First service advisor stated that "we checked Ford's computer and there are NO open TSB's for the LS". I physically showed them the TSB on LLSOC's site (had my laptop with me) and service advisor B wrote down the info, and said he would check with their "warranty administrator" when he/she arrived in this morning. But both seemed to state that they checked their Ford computer, and they could find no TSB for Lincoln LS regulators, and nothing for 01-1-2 (The actual TSB number for the regulators).
Seems like IM not alone in this. Anyone with connections to Lincoln (Brian?) know whats up? How is it that the LLSOC club can have the actual TSB, but the dealerships seem to know nothing of it, and seem to NOT have any reference to it in their "Ford Computers"?
What can be done if they call me back and still totally refute the TSB I showed them?
I'm checking with FCSD to get an official answer.
Brian
Update: The first service advisor called me back and stated that "the warranty administrator was able to locate the TSB in the computer." Set me up for an appt tommorow am to replace the other, non-failed regulator. Great.
BUT. Why do we have to go through this? The service guys I dealt with at this dealership *seemed* genuinely upfront and honest, and didnt *appear* to be giving me any B.S. lines. Having me come back only costs Lincoln more money, at least from the cost of the rental Im going to get (again) standpoint. I would think that if ANY LS comes into the shop, and its uder warranty, and it has a failed rear window regulator, Lincoln's dealers should be automatically replacing both. ESPECIALLY if we present them with the TSB# addressing the issue.
It will be interesting to hear what you find out as far as why there *seems* to be some sort of communication gap between Lincoln and their dealerships.
AP599 Rear Pads $79.99
(20% off I believe if LLSOC Member). Savings would Pay for the Membership!
Regards,
Airwolf1000
The random chime appeared to go away after Jim Rodgers replaced my transmission.
Seems not to be a problem.........
Once I got the Mystery Beep and I caught the Message on the display... Said "Lost Communications with Transmission" or something to that extent sounds Scary and Funny at the same Time. I can hear it now with some static in the background " PCM Module calling 55RN do you Copy?" What's your 10-20 there little buddy?. Luckily the Tranny was still there and not on I-635!
Regards,
Victor
"HELLO" "HELLO" "Reality to Lincoln management." Do you really think you can just build it and they will keep coming? If you keep jerkin them around, they're gonna go somewhere else. You darn well better maintain it too.
Course that just went into dead air because apparently NO ONE at Lincoln cept Mark is listening to us anymore.
How long is Lincoln going to let this window regulator thing drag out like this? Is their service information flow so pathetically bad that dealers can't get the proper information? Or is the level of incompetence at the dealer service departments simply unlimited? (That one was rhetorical) Or does Lincoln simply NOT GIVE A HOOT.
And I haven't even been a victim of this yet, but it really gets my goat to hear the hoops people are having to jump thru to get 2 sorry little 50 cent parts replaced. And they may not even get the correct newest part as there apparently was 1 fix that didn't before the newer fix was put out. According to my understanding, my Feb 01 build car has the 2nd design, not the latest and so my turn will probably come. I can hardly wait.
Even though my car is a 2001, my headlamps fogged up while parked outside during real wet weather a while back. So the story that that ailment is completely cured is apparently not true. I experienced total dealer incompetence in getting mine replaced - it took almost 2 months from the first time I reported it as they:
-said they needed to order the parts. Would call when they came in.
-2 weeks, no call. I call them. No parts had been ordered.
-said they needed to order the parts. Would call when they came in.
-2 weeks, no call. I call them. No parts have come in.
- few days later, they CALLED ME! My parts are in. Wonderful.
- I drop car off. It'll be done today they say.
-Pick up at 5PM. BUT they only replaced one because the OTHER ONE WAS DAMAGED IN SHIPPING AND I GUESS THEIR INCOMING INSPECTION IS NONEXISTENT UNTIL THEY CAN INCONVENIENCE THE CUSTOMER.
-said they needed to order the part. Would call when it came in.
-Wait another week for the other one, drop off the car for another day - yeah, they needed it all day to replace the HEADLAMP.
- Finally done.
Is this any way to run an airline?
I rather doubt service can be this bad at competitors shops. If anyone can dispute that, or point me to a discussion board that will, I would like that.
Appreciate your experience. Pray I don't have the same.
I have noticed that the window trim along that back passengers door is what is causing the noise. It seems to be right at the point where the back passenger window, that rolls down, and the piece of glass that doesn't roll down meet at the trim. Just the slightest touch and it squeaks.
If this sounds familiar to you or anyone else please let me know if you have attempted to mute it and whether or not it was successful.
Even on the smoothest of roads it makes the noise. It really sounds like a metal on metal sound.
It is almost painful to drive the bloody thing now. Heck at this point i would sell it for a dollar and buy bus passes just to not have to hear that noise again. These little nuisances are seriously making me consider buying a Japanese or German car in '03 when I replace this LS.
You've all heard my concerns about my wife being the primary driver of the car, and where she has to go with this car due to her job, and also how we travel with this car, therefore the security issues as well as the inconvenience.........
Thanks!!!!
I wish the recall had been for the regulators! I haven't had that problem either but the warranty will expire soon. Like others have mentioned, if they fail outside of the warranty period, I feel pretty secure that there would be a goodwill adjustment.
John
LLSOC Charter member
He offered a few very interesting comments. First of all the Fuel Tank has two sides, It also has a fuel transer pump to transfer fuel from one side to the other. There is some concern here though it didn't sound like they were sure what the issue was yet... They are working on it. I told him most of us experienced it during turns. He said this would coincide with the above issue.
Regarding the TSB about Automatic Transmission Fluid level to high. He said he does not believe this is the issue. The reason is this would happen more sporadically, going straight or at a stop (Something to that extent). It kills the Car because it puts pressure on the Torque Converter and thus kills the engine.
He will be following the LLSOC Thread on Stalling. Please Post your experiences or read it as I hope he will ask for everyones input.
Regards,
Victor