See Consumer Reports, July 2003 issue. Lots of nice things to say. 5-car comparison: LS, CTS, Maxima, G35, & 9-3 (rated in that order). They list the LS6 as their 3rd favorite upscale sedan, after the 330i and IS300. CTS in 7th and G35 in 11th (out of 15).
I just purchased a 2003 LS V8. Traded in a G35 which I had for nearly a year. My partner has the CTS 5 speed so I feel confident to give some insights into all 3 as a comparision.
G35- Bar none, the quickest of the group, goes like crazy, stops on a dime looks decent. Bad stuff, seat is absolutely terrible (switch controls cause discomfort on right thigh). Paint on the aluminum hood chips like crazy. Brake pads wear out in about 18K miles. Somewhat small but very good handling, excellent engine which pulls like a tiger all the way to the 7K red line. The seat problem grows worse as you drive longer to the point my hip was giving me trouble and I am not huge or a mile wide.
CTS- Good ride, a little short on power with the current V6 which is being updated as we speak. The 5 speed does help. Ride and handling good, a little tight on the front passenger side (dash comes close to your knees). With the stick, decent acceleration. Fair amount of road noise comes up thru the rear suspension area.
LS-V8 I had so much trouble with the G35 seat (I travel 25K miles per year) that I finally gave up and traded on the LS. The LS is the best compromise of acceleration, handling, space, good seats and a great sound system. The 2003 LS is night and day better than the earlier LS's. I drove several 2002 LS's before purchasing the G35, and they just did not have the pull. The 2003 LS is a totally different animal. Excellent ride, good handling with the ZF rack and pinion. Brakes are good, but I would like a slightly firmer pedal feel. The DVD sound system is amazing. The seat is good especially with the heat and cool capability. Not the quickest of the three, but best overall when all things are considered. I really like it. Hopefully, the quality will prove to be good and the the re-sale value will be acceptable.
If any of you are considering the G35, send me a note. I know the car quite well (the good, the bad and the ugly)
You mean the Murano? And it has a "sister" with a V-6 instead of a V-8. Of course, you'd want the V-8 with 315 hp, 329 lbs torque. It's the "Q" engine.
Ah, my emergency brake problem just changed characteristics and is behaving like yours. Previously, I could not clear the error message. Now, the brake does not go on when the car is running and the error message comes up right away. The tech disconnected the battery last time to clear the continuous error message. Now the message clears itself when turning off the car. Also the brake works when I turn off the car and switch on the ignition and pull the brake lever. Car is right now at dealership for second time for this problem. I'll get back with any additional info after picking up car.
Interesting. You say the brake does not actuate with the car running and this causes an error message? What is the message exactly? Then, restarting clears the message and the brake will actuate? I get the message upon start-up when the brake has been previously applied before shutdown. Again, the error appears at random, once every few days or so, not every start. Just trying to establish if we are experiencing the same pattern of error encounters. Thanks for posting and please continue to update with any info your dealer may provide.
It's an FX45 with Tech Package.The "Bionic Cheetah". The SUV that's not an SUV. Or the fastest, best cornering SUV ever tested by C&D (Feb 03 issue). By the way, the new issue of Consumer Reports compared the V-6 LS with a bunch of cars including the G35. I don't know where they get this "unreliable" rating on the LS. I don't know anyone in the club that's had any big problems. And we try to break them.
Hi, I have a 00 V8 LS Bought a month ago for a few weeks MY DREAM CAR I love it. BUT the last few times I tried to start car it would not even try to turn over. Everything else activates, memory seats steering adjustment etc. but not the starter or something. Then after a few more take the key out and try again it will start. But now it starts up every time no problem. How is the service people going to find problem if it starts for them since it only happens off and on. Also I notice a lot of suspension noise going over bumpy roads Great suspension but not very quiet. Why do I have to start in second gear with the sst? Thanks to all that can reply!
Can't say for sure that any of these are the cure, but they're worth checking. Poor ground. With the battery in the trunk it takes excellent connections to draw the power all the way up to the starter. It'll fail when lesser items that don't draw as much amps (seats, steering etc.)work. Very early on as Rene can attest to, a poor connection on the module (receiver) in the steering column kept 00's from starting. They would turn over but had no ignition. I know this isn't your case but it is also worth considering. My 00 went through this once the day we drove it home from the dealer and it never happened again. My money is on all power connections such as the ground. Good luck.
The Speed Channel LS review today had me salivating. Refreshing to see people that know cars and aren't politically afraid to speak their minds state outright that the LS blew the BMW 540 away in 4 tests. Also enjoyed the spirited driving around the race course . Beats the antiseptic number tallying of consumer reports that like the car but can't recommend it. If you want to meet Jonathan Crocker the LS project manager live and maybe have him teach you a few pointers on driving, join us in Detroit for Mania 4.
Thanks chartrand, Brought it to the dealer today and of course,,,, started every time. They checked a few things found nothing and sent me on my way. I just love the car so I hope this problem does not spoil it for me.
If it does it again, I'd swap out the battery. Sometimes they go up and down, short out, and recover, and they'll have enough power to work accessories, but not enough to crank the engine. I had this happen to me once. New battery, never did it again.
The dealership in my area has an unsold brand-new '02 V6 LSE (automatic transmission) with sport package which is heavily discounted. It's a beautiful car. I think, however, it's a tad underpowered. Am wondering if anyone has this exact model on this board and if so, what have the experiences been particularly in bad weather (heavy rain and/or snow)? Thanks.
The following is the official information direct from Lincoln and Speed Channel:
Great News! We are very excited about final edits being completed on the "Speed Channel Test Drive: Lincoln LS" program! The Speed Channel selectively produces 30-minute TV programs during which credible guests with impressive automotive credentials put selected performance vehicles through their paces and then provide their evaluations. The Lincoln LS Test Drive program includes test drives, evaluations and commentary filmed on location at the California Speedway along with other southern California locations.
Speed Channel Test Drive: Lincoln LS guests evaluators include: * Tommy Kendall (Host), 4-Time Trans Am Champion race car driver * Brian Herta, Indy Car race car driver * Kim Wolfkill, 'Road & Track' Editor * Gordon Wangers, President of AMCI (performed comparative road tests comparing Lincoln LS to BMW 540i) * Jonathan Crocker, Lincoln Engineer It should come as no surprise the Lincoln LS performed extremely well in its Test Drive and the premiere broadcast and scheduled re-broadcasts will provide extremely positive visibility for the 2003 Lincoln LS.
Broadcast Dates/Times include: > Saturday, June 7 @ 5:00 - 5:30 pm > Sunday, June 8 @ 9:30 - 10:00 am > Tuesday, June 10 @ 10:00 - 10:30 am > Sunday, June 15 @ 11:30 am - Noon > Monday, June 16 @ 9:30 - 10:00 pm > Tuesday, June 17 @ 2:30 - 3:00 am > Wednesday, June 18 @ 11:30 am - Noon > Friday, June 27 @ 3:30 - 4:00 am > Friday, June 27 @ 10:30 - 11:00 pm > Thursday, July 3 @ 5:00 - 5:30 pm
I can't take the credit for the detailed posting. Credit goes to a fellow Dallas club member by the name of Dennis. If you want to see an LS stay on the tail of a Porsche through the twisties, take a ride with Dennis:>)
I have my car now for 3 yrs and haven't had a problem with it until now.
When the car sits for 3 days and it rains the night before I have a hard time starting the car. The funny thing is the brake pedal is stiff can't even press it a little bit down, yet when I shift it into Neutral the car starts. The security light continues to flash and the car starts. When I move the gear selector into reverse there is a loud bang, like the brakes releasing and the security light then stops flashing.
I know there were some issues with the security module is this a sign of it or something else, any input would be appreciated. Don't want to take it to the dealer and leave it there for them to diagnose without some sort of idea as what it could be.
I've had my 2000 LS8 Sport for 36 months and 21K miles. The original tires (Firehawks) look like they've got about 5 or 6K left. I keep about 31 lbs/in in them.
For some the reason, the car's ride has become really firm in the last 4 or 5 months. I had the LM Dealer look at the shocks/struts but they said that they are OK. I like a firm ride but my LS is getting too stiff - rattles are starting to appear over small pavement imperfections.
Has anyone else had this problem. Would different tires help?
>>Why do I have to start in second gear with the sst?
All '00-'02 SSTs start in SST2 by default. The reason, IIRC was related to CAFE. Changes to the '03 LS including VCT allowed Lincoln to revise the SST to start in SST1. The good news is (in case you didn't realize it) if you switch your '00 to SST and mash the throttle (greater than 60%), you'll note that the indicator changes to SST1 and you'll have a first gear start off the line. Hope this answers your question.
While it's somewhat unusual for tires to contribute to a harsh ride when worn, it's possible, and certain that changing them to another brand or type will change the ride and handling characteristics of the car. It's a little early for shock/strut failure, but ride will deteriorate over time as they wear and bumps do become more noticeable.
Yup, this will happen as tires wear, less rubber means less shock absorption and the Firehawks will definitly tighten up. Also rubber starts vulcanizing so it gets hard, definitely towards the end of its service life. I liked it though, made the car more responsive my new AVS ES100's sort of feel mushier in some respects and less responsive to my firehawks, even though they are wide 245 vs. 235, lower profile 45 vs. 50 and Gumballs(280 Treadwear) vs. the Firehawks (500). The firehawks are great tire up until the end (Except in water, they really lose ground quickly (pun intended), at the end of their useful life)
I am leaning toward a low mileage 2000 528 sport. A friend then suggested that I look at a 2002 LS8 sport because I could pick one up with lower mileage (10k-15k) and for a lower cost. I have not driven the LS but loved the 528i sport. A 530i/540i is out of $$ range. Looking at 28k or less in price.
What is your take between those two exact models given they are in my budget? Factor annual maintenance, performance, quality, etc as I plan to keep for awhile- at least to 75k. I am concerned about the quality of Ford/Lincoln past 60k miles and resale since they drop in value like rocks after only one year. Also from seeing all the raddle noise and interior quality issues on the board. I had a SHO that fell apart at 60k.
Be honest? I'm hurt!!! (Just kidding). IMO, the Lincoln will cost less to keep running than the BMW and will run as long. BMW has a great following, and I do not deny they're a wonderful driving machine, but nobody (who is honest) will claim they are trouble free.
The LS is probably the one domestic car that will match the handling and driving characteristics of the BMW. It's an amazing car to drive. You may get a little more mileage out of the interior parts on the Beemer, but a well maintained LS is a great vehicle. The 2000 first year models were a little more trouble prone than the rest. Since then, they're great.
There are several years here and there of BMW's you want to avoid. The boards will help you with that.
LS model years '00-'02 are all equipped with halogen headlights. Quite a few owners that I know have opted to install Sylvania SilverStars. I did too in my '00 before I got my '03. For '03, the LS V8 Premium Sport has standard HID lamps, and HID is optional on the Sport. IIRC, for '04, HID will be optional on both the Ultimate (the renamed Premium Sport)and the Sport. In case you're wondering if you can install HID units from an '03 in older LSes, the answer is pretty much no unless you want to internally modify the front bumper to accomodate the tabs, ballasts etc..
What is the track record for the LS8 once it has more than 50-60k in mileage? Is it like the typical Ford that you better bail by 75k or does it hang in there with the Acura's, Lexus's, Infiniti's, Mercedes' and BMW's.
2002 model if anyone has that many miles on one if not than 2001.
I know someone with over 100k on an 00 model with minimal problems as well as others with over 60K without problems. I have an 02 with 18K withouty problems. Love the car. Overall, I think your cost of ownership will be much less than a 5 series. If you are concerned about reliability, buy an extended warranty. They are availavle and I found them to be resonably priced. I have also found lost of people available to answer technical questions on the LS. You may be able to find a new 02 V8 for the upper 20s now. Remember, the 03 model year did not start until late December for the LS. By the way, a V8 LS will definitely be much faster than a 528. An 03 V6 should be faster as well.
I can get a 2002 LS8 Sport with 12-18k miles for the same or a little less than a 2000 maybe 2001 Audi 2.7 turbo quatro with 20-25k miles? Anyone compared the two? Is the maintenance horrible on the Audi ie Rotors, turbo, etc? Performance was impressive in the Audi but I still haven't driven the 02 Sport LS8 yet. Air conditioning seemed weak too in the Audi.
Do the hd sway bars on the sport model really make a difference, I've got a base V/8 that I put the 17" chromeys and pilot sport A/S. And do those sport tuned shock absorbers work that much to tell a difference. I own a 2001 LS8 Premium and have xenon, mud flaps,K&N Filter, Black, Mobil 1. and Advance Track
how long do rear pads usually last on this car? i replaced mine at 40,000. is this about the average? also does turning the advance trac off help these rear pads last longer? any advice would be appreciated. thanks
First the Shocks, Why would lincoln make sport shocks if they were not any different? Sorry, but the answer is a definite yes which I know you did not want to hear. If you want the performance which it sounds like you do get em.. If you already have 50K + Miles you need them anyways wouldn't hurt to replace them. A few members have done this upgrade so I don't know if you require extra parts. I have the Sport! But I am also at 50K So I will be changing them soon.
Brakes, Yup reasonable thats when I changed my REARS. Which went out first. Replaced them with Porterfield Brake Pads, Stop like hell, and reduce dust. Actually I replaced Both front and Rears right around 40K+ Miles. Not hard at all just MAKE SURE you get the NAPA Tool for the Rear Calipers. Not the Autozone on or Pep Boys, NAPA Tool.. If you need instructions for changing brakes, let me know.
As I recall, using the spellcheck or review feature somehow generates a duplicate post. While I note that many in other boards endure this, we probably ought to seek a higher standard. It's fairly easy to edit or delete ones own post for the first half-hour. After that, it's apparently cast in stone. I don't remember how long the "delete" function continues to work, but it may be forever, in which case it's pretty simple to pull out the duplicates.
Pat -- This is one of the few things that the "new" software (since well-engaged) caused that hasn't been fixed. Are you aware of: 1) the issue? or, better yet, 2) the solution?
Comments
If you'd like to start a comparison discussion on them, feel free to do so. Here is a link to the place to do that: Comparisons - Sedans vs. Sedans.
Do keep us updated, good luck and have fun! :-)
G35- Bar none, the quickest of the group, goes like crazy, stops on a dime looks decent. Bad stuff, seat is absolutely terrible (switch controls cause discomfort on right thigh). Paint on the aluminum hood chips like crazy. Brake pads wear out in about 18K miles. Somewhat small but very good handling, excellent engine which pulls like a tiger all the way to the 7K red line. The seat problem grows worse as you drive longer to the point my hip was giving me trouble and I am not huge or a mile wide.
CTS- Good ride, a little short on power with the current V6 which is being updated as we speak. The 5 speed does help. Ride and handling good, a little tight on the front passenger side (dash comes close to your knees). With the stick, decent acceleration. Fair amount of road noise comes up thru the rear suspension area.
LS-V8 I had so much trouble with the G35 seat (I travel 25K miles per year) that I finally gave up and traded on the LS. The LS is the best compromise of acceleration, handling, space, good seats and a great sound system. The 2003 LS is night and day better than the earlier LS's. I drove several 2002 LS's before purchasing the G35, and they just did not have the pull. The 2003 LS is a totally different animal. Excellent ride, good handling with the ZF rack and pinion. Brakes are good, but I would like a slightly firmer pedal feel. The DVD sound system is amazing. The seat is good especially with the heat and cool capability. Not the quickest of the three, but best overall when all things are considered. I really like it. Hopefully, the quality will prove to be good and the the re-sale value will be acceptable.
If any of you are considering the G35, send me a note. I know the car quite well (the good, the bad and the ugly)
It has a meeker brother by another name.
The brother, to me, looks much like the AMC Gremlin in a side view.
I get the message upon start-up when the brake has been previously applied before shutdown. Again, the error appears at random, once every few days or so, not every start. Just trying to establish if we are experiencing the same pattern of error encounters.
Thanks for posting and please continue to update with any info your dealer may provide.
Or the fastest, best cornering SUV ever tested by C&D (Feb 03 issue).
By the way, the new issue of Consumer Reports compared the V-6 LS with a bunch of cars including the G35.
I don't know where they get this "unreliable" rating on the LS. I don't know anyone in the club that's had any big problems. And we try to break them.
I have a 00 V8 LS Bought a month ago for a few weeks MY DREAM CAR I love it. BUT the last few times I tried to start car it would not even try to turn over. Everything else activates, memory seats steering adjustment etc. but not the starter or something. Then after a few more take the key out and try again it will start. But now it starts up every time no problem. How is the service people going to find problem if it starts for them since it only happens off and on.
Also I notice a lot of suspension noise going over bumpy roads Great suspension but not very quiet.
Why do I have to start in second gear with the sst?
Thanks to all that can reply!
Poor ground. With the battery in the trunk it takes excellent connections to draw the power all the way up to the starter. It'll fail when lesser items that don't draw as much amps (seats, steering etc.)work.
Very early on as Rene can attest to, a poor connection on the module (receiver) in the steering column kept 00's from starting. They would turn over but had no ignition. I know this isn't your case but it is also worth considering. My 00 went through this once the day we drove it home from the dealer and it never happened again.
My money is on all power connections such as the ground.
Good luck.
If you want to meet Jonathan Crocker the LS project manager live and maybe have him teach you a few pointers on driving, join us in Detroit for Mania 4.
Brought it to the dealer today and of course,,,, started every time. They checked a few things found nothing and sent me on my way. I just love the car so I hope this problem does not spoil it for me.
Great News! We are very excited about final edits being completed on the "Speed Channel Test Drive: Lincoln LS" program! The Speed Channel selectively produces 30-minute TV programs during which credible guests with impressive automotive credentials put selected performance vehicles through their paces and then provide their evaluations. The Lincoln LS Test Drive program includes test drives, evaluations and commentary filmed on location at the California Speedway along with other southern California locations.
Speed Channel Test Drive: Lincoln LS guests evaluators include:
* Tommy Kendall (Host), 4-Time Trans Am Champion race car driver
* Brian Herta, Indy Car race car driver
* Kim Wolfkill, 'Road & Track' Editor
* Gordon Wangers, President of AMCI (performed comparative road tests comparing Lincoln LS to BMW 540i)
* Jonathan Crocker, Lincoln Engineer
It should come as no surprise the Lincoln LS performed extremely well in its Test Drive and the premiere broadcast and scheduled re-broadcasts will provide extremely positive visibility for the 2003 Lincoln LS.
Broadcast Dates/Times include:
> Saturday, June 7 @ 5:00 - 5:30 pm
> Sunday, June 8 @ 9:30 - 10:00 am
> Tuesday, June 10 @ 10:00 - 10:30 am
> Sunday, June 15 @ 11:30 am - Noon
> Monday, June 16 @ 9:30 - 10:00 pm
> Tuesday, June 17 @ 2:30 - 3:00 am
> Wednesday, June 18 @ 11:30 am - Noon
> Friday, June 27 @ 3:30 - 4:00 am
> Friday, June 27 @ 10:30 - 11:00 pm
> Thursday, July 3 @ 5:00 - 5:30 pm
Any idea if this is true and how hard is it to install?
When the car sits for 3 days and it rains the night before I have a hard time starting the car. The funny thing is the brake pedal is stiff can't even press it a little bit down, yet when I shift it into Neutral the car starts. The security light continues to flash and the car starts. When I move the gear selector into reverse there is a loud bang, like the brakes releasing and the security light then stops flashing.
I know there were some issues with the security module is this a sign of it or something else, any input would be appreciated. Don't want to take it to the dealer and leave it there for them to diagnose without some sort of idea as what it could be.
Thanks
just a thought... didn't see it in your description as something that you tried...
For some the reason, the car's ride has become really firm in the last 4 or 5 months. I had the LM Dealer look at the shocks/struts but they said that they are OK. I like a firm ride but my LS is getting too stiff - rattles are starting to appear over small pavement imperfections.
Has anyone else had this problem. Would different tires help?
All '00-'02 SSTs start in SST2 by default. The reason, IIRC was related to CAFE. Changes to the '03 LS including VCT allowed Lincoln to revise the SST to start in SST1. The good news is (in case you didn't realize it) if you switch your '00 to SST and mash the throttle (greater than 60%), you'll note that the indicator changes to SST1 and you'll have a first gear start off the line. Hope this answers your question.
Best Regards,
Victor
Are Xenons an option in the LS8
What is your take between those two exact models given they are in my budget? Factor annual maintenance, performance, quality, etc as I plan to keep for awhile- at least to 75k. I am concerned about the quality of Ford/Lincoln past 60k miles and resale since they drop in value like rocks after only one year. Also from seeing all the raddle noise and interior quality issues on the board. I had a SHO that fell apart at 60k.
Be honest please.
The LS is probably the one domestic car that will match the handling and driving characteristics of the BMW. It's an amazing car to drive. You may get a little more mileage out of the interior parts on the Beemer, but a well maintained LS is a great vehicle. The 2000 first year models were a little more trouble prone than the rest. Since then, they're great.
There are several years here and there of BMW's you want to avoid. The boards will help you with that.
I will give it a try
congarobert
2002 model if anyone has that many miles on one if not than 2001.
Thanks.
To summarize;
At 90k engine runs strong and fast like new, body tight and squeak free,
Some niggling problems w sound system and auto lock system.
Some clunking when putting in gear.
I highly recommend new shocks at this point,you don't realize how much handling has detriorated.
All in all, holding up well.
I noticed on the Ford Parts Network site that there are "European Ride" shocks and struts listed along the the Sport and Base styles.
Would these European ride shocks be somewhere between the base and sport?
Anyone compared the two? Is the maintenance horrible on the Audi ie Rotors, turbo, etc? Performance was impressive in the Audi but I still haven't driven the 02 Sport LS8 yet. Air conditioning seemed weak too in the Audi.
Any thoughts.
circlea
Brakes, Yup reasonable thats when I changed my REARS. Which went out first. Replaced them with Porterfield Brake Pads, Stop like hell, and reduce dust. Actually I replaced Both front and Rears right around 40K+ Miles. Not hard at all just MAKE SURE you get the NAPA Tool for the Rear Calipers. Not the Autozone on or Pep Boys, NAPA Tool.. If you need instructions for changing brakes, let me know.
Regards,
Victor
Pat -- This is one of the few things that the "new" software (since well-engaged) caused that hasn't been fixed. Are you aware of: 1) the issue? or, better yet, 2) the solution?