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Comments
2021 VW Arteon SEL 4-motion, 2018 VW Passat SE w/tech, 2016 Audi Q5 Premium Plus w/tech
I'd go for the LS, it's a lot more car than a 325i. Plus with a 2003 you get 36mo / 36K mile free maintainance (in addition to the 50K/48mo warranty).
The 2003 is nicely improved over the 2000 LS I had, more power, more luxury. The 3.9L V8 with VCT is truely a WONDERFUL engine! The NAV system isn't perfect, but now that I have one, I wouldn't want to do without it. The THX audio is one of the best sounding stock OEM audio system I've heard too.
The LS is one of the most directionally stable cars on the road. What you describe it totally uncharacteristic. There has to be something wrong.
The interest rate varies by market. At the time I got my '03 LS some markets were as low as 0.5% and others as high as 3%, so it depends where you live.
If you are putting down $10K, DO NOT use the 0% APR or other special finance rate. If you put down any substantial amount of money taking ALL the rebates and using the normal APR (or looking for a 3rd party loan) will usually work out to be the lowest cost. The breakover point will depend on the actual price of the car and the availble APR, but I found that it usually worked out if you put down more than $4K the 0% APR came out more expensive.
Your dealer HAS to disclose the total amount of all finance charges so ask their finance person to calculate the finance charges for the different forms of financing (that is if you can't calculate the finance charges yourself) and then compare the real total price of the car, that is car, rebates, taxes and finance charges among the different finance options.
I called the dealer today to ask about the $45.8k sticker car that I saw in the showroom that was being sold for $35.8 and the salesman told me it was dropped another 2 grand today. That's $33.8 for a black/black V8 SPORT with THX/NAV, moonroof, Advance Trac and backup alarm !! Edmunds TMV says $38.8k for this car and that number included the incentives. I started asking if it had been a demo, a loaner to the owner's daughter or some other story car. No, it's a zero miles, never been driven, showroom car. Hell, I paid $36k ($41.5 MSRP)for our 2002 V8 Sport. At the time that was over five grand under MSRP and more than a thousand under invoice. I thought that was a great deal. I asked the salesman what it would take to hold the thing until I could get out there. I gave him my credit card number. I have first rights of refusal. I'm excited. Once again the BMW guy looses out.
IIRC, LS sales peaked with the first model year 00 (calendar 99-00). I imagine there's less than 200K total in the US. I purchased one for my wife b/c it's a good car, marginally exclusive, and reasonably priced. But the original '00 is on the Consumer Report watch list for cars to avoid. I'm not sure about the revised '00, '01, or '02.
It's seems amazing, but I paid less for my 2003 V8 Sport with NAV/THX & Advance Track than I did for my 2000 V8 Base with only heated seats and tri-coat paint. (of course the 03 Sport comes with heated AND cooled seats).
The '03 V8 is a definate improvement over the '00, significantly more engine power, especially at low RPM's. On back roads I used to put my '00 in 4th most of the time, especially going up hills. Between the '03 engine and 3.58 rear end, I almost always just leave my '03 in 5th. The '03 is also noticably quiter, transmission shifts better, the seat leather looks & feels better, the seatbelts retract right all the time (was one of the few aggravations with my '00), the extra console space and cup holders are wonderful, the rain sensing wipers work much better, the steering precision is better, the auto up and down front windows are great, the cam chain whine is gone, THX sounds great, the auto headlamps come on more appropriately, etc. I can go on a lot more, but I think you get the idea.
Don't you love attorneys?
>>>>>>
Yes, and what I also appreciate is this particular dealer, who we also bought our 2002 V8 Sport from, only adds taxes, tags and freight. Every other dealer I've been to this time around shopping for a 325i wanted to add on all kinds of crap. $200 advertising, $200 fee for tag paperwork, etc.
Some would say that, with discounts of this magnitude, the sales must be going nuts.
Others wouldn't.
Front wheels need traction to steer you and keep you from that deep ditch on the side of the road.
Rear wheels need traction to get you moving.
All four need traction to help you stop.
I have AWD on my BMW 325xi and have All Seasons with a very 'snow friendly' tread. They will give you grip in the snow, but have the tread pattern to squirt it out. I have Michelin Pilot Sport A/S tires. They already have a narrower track than the standard 325.
I'd imagine for the LS you could go with a narrower snow tire and go with your standard wheels, though dedicated snow wheels with snow tires (read - steel) may be an easier and cheaper way to go (consider mounting/balancing costs).
-Paul
Still in the market for a LS V8 Sport with everything. Rented a Cadillac Seville SLS over a weekend trip to St. Louis. Did NOT like the acceleration, but the ride was great. Gimme that V8 power in the LS. Still impressed with it, but I'm still learning about the new 5. (LS is in the lead).
Isn't the SLS a front wheel drive? I find it strange that if you were considering a 5 series BMW and an LS you would even entertain a front wheel drive car. The new 5 with a V8 will cost you at least twenty grand more than the LS. Twenty grand would buy a nice used sailboat that you could have fun with on the weekends.
I believe, depending on year, that 5w20 is too light an oil, my owners manual says 10W30. I've heard of other dealers doing this as well.
I test drove a 2001 today with 28K on it...nice car. I've found myself turning the traction control off, due to the retarding of the engine when slipping. I dig the slip, personally. Better on or off in the snow?
Yes, better in the snow with traction control or, if the car has it, Advance Trac ON. Occasionally you can turn it off and spin your way out of deep snow, but in three years I've only done it once.
BTW, if you're spinning the tires so often that you want to turn the TC off, I'd take a good look at the tires. Between good traction, tall gearing, and only fair low-end torque, it's not that easy to break the rear tires loose on an LS.
V8lincolnguy, you need a less lazy dealer. My 89k mile V8 idles smooth as glass. It was just as smooth right before I changed the original spark plugs at 80k miles. And you should use 5W30. And you should keep using 91 octane gas.
And your dealer should read the LS owner's manual.
THX started out as a set of parameters and specs. for movie theaters. Lucas Films came up with the stuff. It involved carpets, theater seating materials, drapery materials etc. This evolved into certain specs for home theater electronics. The important thing to remember about this scam from George Lucas is that these specs are MINIMUM specs. I've heard lousy THX home theater systems and great systems that were not THX certified and the manufacture couldn't care less. In home audio one of the specs Lucas requires for example is a very low vertical dispersion of the high frequences from the speaker system In my opinion I would think that this would only cause any THX certified speaker to sound boxy instead of open sounding which causes the speaker to disapear which is what you would want. Any of Lucas' amplifier specs are already surpassed by any quality company with a brand name. All this has nothing to do with music reproduction which is why I can't understand why Lincoln would want to pay Lucas Films royalty money to put the silly thing in a car.
There are many things that could cause a rough idle, coil pack, mis-firing injector, spark plug, dirt on the MAF(mass air flow sensor). A common problem with Ford engines is the IAC (Idle Air Control valve) gets gunked up with residue causing rough idle. I know that on the 4.6L V8 the IAC has been updated at least 2 times. However I don't believe that the 3.9L V8 uses the same sort of IAC that most other Ford engines do. I think the V6 LS does use that sort of IAC.
As far as LS auto transmissions go. The trannie was updated just after the start of the 2002 model year to change the OD ratio from .75 to .71 (overdrive or 5th gear). The new OD ratio also changed 2nd gear ratio giving more equal gear ratio spacing between 1-2 and 2-3.
For 2003 the transmission was updated again to what is called "synchronous shift" In the LS trannie 2nd gear is created by 1st X OD. The 2nd to 3rd shift requires both the main gear set to shift AND the OD to shift back out of OD. The trannie change for '03 is designed to make the 2 gear changes happen at the same time thus reducing the total shift time for the 2-3 shift.
From my experience, both the ratio change and the synchronous shift change are nice improvments. But I wouldn't consider them deal breakers if you're looking at a 2001 vs. 2002 LS.
Thanks to all who responded! A special thanks to luas who nailed the problem.
roi4
The jury is out on the new 5. But does anybody have the link to the new STS pics? The LS is still in the running (even though I want a Wrangler for playtime
-Paul
-Paul
Go check out the 5 Series pricing on Edmunds. You can option out a new 530 to around $63K and a 545 to over $70K.
If you can get by the styling, the new 5 series looks like a great car the 545 performance looks great. It has many new luxury items not available on a LS, like heads up display, heated steering wheel, rear seat DVD entertainment system, 20 position front seats. But at a price differential of $15K to $30K, I'll stick with my LS.
The LS seat cushion tilts independent of the seat back, which allows locating the lumbar support higher or lower on the back. I don't know if the Continental is constructed this way
I've done two 11-hour days in my LS, and found the seats to be excellent.
Regarding ride comfort:
In my opinion, the LS Sport is too harsh with the standard 17" tires/wheels. I'm in the process of replacing mine with 16"
Thanks,
- Ray
Who does still enjoy many things about the LS . . .